MAFS Social Media, Spoilers & Speculation

[BBDi]

Just watched the preview.

So Ashley is a day shift stripper now?

[Nffftshewasgone]

Vanessa bursting into tears:

http://www.aetv.com/shows/married-at-first-sight/season-3/episode-15/preview-six-months-later

It is 6 months since decision day and I'm really curious as to WHY Sam insists on having us look up her nostrils every chance she gets.

[ctbabe]

Just watched the preview.

So Ashley is a day shift stripper now?

I think she was trying to show David what he is missing bUT emmmm... she went about it the wrong way.. Didnt I say she needs new advisers/friends?

[Liberty]

Just watched the preview.

So Ashley is a day shift stripper now?

 

Weren't there rumors more towards the escort side than the stripper side?

[Evil Queen]

I wouldn't call someone's natural reaction and true feelings "mistakes". Just because you don't agree with the way Ashley acted towards David, that doesn't mean that she made mistakes. He is just gross to me, behavior and looks. I understand how some people are put off by Ashley. It seems like some people take her dislike of David personally.

 

The problem with Ashley is her behavior. She made a mistake by signing up for this show and not doing what she was suppose to by going on it. She decided she didn't like him at all on the wedding day and it was caught on her mic for all to hear. She didn't even know him yet. From there all she did was not do a damn thing but be cold and rude. When all she had to really do is tell David from the get go that she wasn't feel any romantic connection at this time and wasn't sure she would ever but could they be friends? Then if she had acted in a friendly manner and just had conversations and fun we all might have looked at her differently. BUT she didn't do any of that at all so in my eyes she was a rude selfish superficial person and nothing more. 

 

Weren't there rumors more towards the escort side than the stripper side?

 

Hmm never heard those rumors but that would end up being a whole other whirlwind of a story to all this IF it was found out to be she was. 

[allthelight]

To be honest, David was so pushy with an unwilling Ashley that I dread to think what level "my wife" would have reached had she tried to be friendlier. The only flack Ashley gets from me is for her behavior after the grill party and texting gate.

[ctbabe]

To be honest, David was so pushy with an unwilling Ashley that I dread to think what level "my wife" would have reached had she tried to be friendlier. The only flack Ashley gets from me is for her behavior after the grill party and texting gate.

I agree with Evil Queen. If Ashley had set the right expectation, he wouldn't have been pushy. If she had told him earlier on that she didn't find him attractive and she is not sure it would ever happen, I am sure he would back off. I think he just assumed that she is just slow to warm up.

[still hoping]

Ashley an escort? where did you see that...link please?

 

IMHO that is simply a horrible thing to say with out backing it up

 

Oh....halfway thru Ashley did let David know she had zero chance of wanting him thanks to Colona (who I thought was the best of the experts on this season)

 

I am not sure that I recall a season of bachelor where people were so invested in the contestants actually getting down with the "lead"?

Maybe we need real escorts - or bar girls - on next season's show - after all they are used to "putting out" for a guy they have no attraction to

Look at the little bar girl on 90 day fiancée that so many felt sympathy for - I could see how she could go to bed with an old crazy guy - probably just anther day at work for her

 

I don't know Ashely and I really don't even like her but I am amazed at the venom towards her

[allthelight]

She has turned very unlikeable after the grill party and the texting gate mess, but people were hating on her before that.

 

I agree with you, she made it very clear from early on that she wasn't interested. David in his 'I'd even marry a monkey'-marriage mania didn't let this stop him from pursuing her further and further. Dude, stop it. You signed up for this show, yes, but it's not an Amazon deal. There's no guarantee and no duty for your bride to like you. I understand why she didn't even try to have nice converstions with him, because that would have enhanced David's beliefs and people would have accused her of leading him on.

 

Also, people should stop making this a purely physical thing. He might not be her type, but he's not Quasimodo. What makes him unattractrive is that he's oozing fakeness and pushiness.

 

Ashley should have stood to her beliefs instead of hiding behind his texting. She was in the right. I wouldn't have stayed married to this creepy dude either and they really shouldn't have paired her with someone with a criminal record without disclosing it to her ahead of time.

Edited March 5, 2016 by allthelight

[Evil Queen]

I agree with Evil Queen. If Ashley had set the right expectation, he wouldn't have been pushy. If she had told him earlier on that she didn't find him attractive and she is not sure it would ever happen, I am sure he would back off. I think he just assumed that she is just slow to warm up.

 

As well as the fact that the stupid experts kept telling him to do this and that to get her to open up to him. He was, sadly, putting his faith in them finding him his match and was listening to their advice. Which in turn made him look pushy/needy. Which if they told Ashley anything about being more open we never saw it so we have to assume either A) they never did and laid it on him or B) they did and she didn't care what they had to say since she didn't like him from day one. The only way Ashley finally told him was because Dr. C told her to. I doubt she would have otherwise. There was a tasteful way she could have been honest from day one about things and she wasn't. I still do not understand why she went on this show and claimed she wanted different from her usual picks in looks. 

[allthelight]

Because it was never just about looks. He isn't that ugly.

 

With some people, you see them and your gut tells you that you don't like them. Not liking someone/finding them pushy and fake obviously impacts your perception of their attractiveness.

[ctbabe]

So if the roles were reversed and David was the woman and Ashley was the man, would we still be calling David creepy and desperate? Would we still assume David is whiney and acting like the victim? I can bet it we would never say those things. We would make excuses And say David is trying to make things work. We would yell, beat our chest and start #menignoringwomen movement. We would scream about how David is the victim and not just pity party. #Doublestandard

BTW I don't think David is a saint, I just think he is human. I was a fan of Ashley until Ashley's crew started the full blown attack on David. Even if you don't like the person, show some respect. unfortunately the respect in this case was not reciprocated.

Because it was never just about looks. He isn't that ugly.

With some people, you see them and your gut tells you that you don't like them. Not liking someone/finding them pushy and fake obviously impacts your perception of their attractiveness.

It was definitely about looks. How could you figure out someone's character by just looking at them? I am confused..

[tinypeanut]

So if the roles were reversed and David was the woman and Ashley was the man, would we still be calling David creepy and desperate? Would we still assume David is whiney and acting like the victim? I can bet it we would never say those things. We would make excuses And say David is trying to make things work. We would yell, beat our chest and start #menignoringwomen movement. We would scream about how David is the victim and not just pity party. #Doublestandard

BTW I don't think David is a saint, I just think he is human. I was a fan of Ashley until Ashley's crew started the full blown attack on David. Even if you don't like the person, show some respect. unfortunately the respect in this case was not reciprocated.

It was definitely about looks. How could you figure out someone's character by just looking at them? I am confused..

If David was a woman and came across the same way I would have the same opinion.  He just seemed very desperate for marriage and I believe he wanted to be married.  to. anyone.   I never saw him as creepy just fake and desperate.

Edited March 6, 2016 by tinypeanut

[Snarklepuss]

If David was a woman and came across the same way I would have the same opinion.  He just seemed very desperate for marriage and I believe he wanted to be married.  to. anyone.   I never saw him as creepy just fake and desperate.

 

I think anyone who goes on this show can arguably be called "desperate for marriage to anyone" or else they wouldn't sign up to marry a complete stranger.  David said he didn't sign up for an experiment but to be married and he has a point.  A person who pursues marriage with a stranger should like they're married in all the external ways even if the relationship isn't fully grown into a marriage on the inside yet.  On this show it's like they put the external commitment first and then with any luck the relationship grows from the inside out to catch up to it.  Usually it's the other way around - The relationship grows from the inside out and then the couple pursues the external manifestation of marriage to cement their commitment.  Perhaps David was rushing the relationship to match the external commitment but they did only have 6 weeks to see where it would go.  I think he wanted to see how far they could get in 6 weeks to have a better idea of whether it could work out for the long haul.  But she just wouldn't give him anything to work with so he just kept trying to get it out of her.  I can't blame him for that especially if the experts were encouraging him to find ways to get her to open up.  That wasn't desperation, it was someone who took the process seriously. 

[Lola16]

I agree with Evil Queen. If Ashley had set the right expectation, he wouldn't have been pushy. If she had told him earlier on that she didn't find him attractive and she is not sure it would ever happen, I am sure he would back off. I think he just assumed that she is just slow to warm up.

Every time Ashley looked at David and recoiled when he came near her, was telling him that she wasn't attracted to him. David didn't want to see it.

 

Because it was never just about looks. He isn't that ugly.

 

With some people, you see them and your gut tells you that you don't like them. Not liking someone/finding them pushy and fake obviously impacts your perception of their attractiveness.

He's pasty, pudgy, got jacked up teeth and he's not her type. Maybe she thought she'd be open to a different look and then saw him and was all "nope".

 

So if the roles were reversed and David was the woman and Ashley was the man, would we still be calling David creepy and desperate? Would we still assume David is whiney and acting like the victim? I can bet it we would never say those things. We would make excuses And say David is trying to make things work. We would yell, beat our chest and start #menignoringwomen movement. We would scream about how David is the victim and not just pity party. #Doublestandard

 

David = Sam. Ashley = Neil.  Sam was the aggressor with any affection and physical contact.  Neil barely reciprocated.  Sam was constantly talking at Neil as David was always talking at Ashley.  Both Sam and David complained about their respective spouses' poor communication.  Neil never outright rejected Sam for her looks but occasionally made passive aggressive snide comments about her less than charming personality.  But that's OK because it was to Sam.  Ashley just stammered and was stand-offish.  YET... Ashley is vile, evil, etc etc.  Poor Neil, rescue Neil.  How dare Ashley treat David that way?  Again, poor Neil.  That's your #doublestandard.

[hoosiermom]

I was joking about Ashley working for an escort service. I was just trying to figure out why all of a sudden she was wearing that awful makeup. Sorry.

[JaggedLilPill]

I think the reason people are more sympathetic to Neil is because the behavior that we saw from Sam to Neil was abusive. Whereas David was not exhibiting those same behaviors towards Ashley.

 

I know abuse is a heavy handed word, but I don't think Sam's behavior towards Neil should be taken lightly or just as excused as her being mean. If we're really talking double standards, if Neil had been hurling insults at Sam the way she hurled insults at him, there would be no question that people would think Sam was the victim, but since Neil is a man and because he has thrown a few jabs back at Sam, his situation is not as seen as in the same light it would be if it were a woman being treated that way.

 

I've seen a lot of people comment about Neil being passive aggressive, but at the end of the day, I don't think it would have mattered one iota if he had told Sam from the get go every time she said something belittling or hurtful to him. People like Sam don't like to be called on their shit. Just look at how she reacted when she was out to lunch with her mom. That dismissive "yeah, I don't want to talk about it anymore." She would have found a way to make it his fault anyway. 

 

Obviously the show is edited, but I can't, given what we have seen on screen, really compare Ashley's situation with David to Neil's situation with Sam. Maybe Ashley did feel very uncomfortable around David and she thought he was too pushy with her. We saw why Neil was uncomfortable with Sam.

 

I don't know. I guess I think there's a good chance people realize they might not be 100% attracted to the spouse they get paired with going into this. I don't think people realize they might get matched with someone who is literally going to put them down and make them feel like shit every chance they get. 

[cardigirl]

Interesting that the age range listed was 25-40. Adding some old goats to the mix! More knowledge, more experience? More baggage! What fun!

Old goats? Hmmmm. Not sure why love is only for 20-somethings? Edited March 6, 2016 by cardigirl

[Kareem]

Old goats? Hmmmm. Not sure why love is only for 20-somethings?

It's not. The concept seems new to them since their previous seasons consisted of younger people.

[HumblePi]

There's a very old song called "A Man Chases a Girl Until She Catches Him". The song means that when a clever woman wants a man that doesn't seem to be interested in her, she uses her 'wily womanly skills' to make him notice her and pursue her instead of the other way around. She puts herself in his line of view, but more reticent than aggressive. If she's attractive and congenial he'll notice her. If he likes what he finds in her, he will definitely pursue her. In the end, the smart woman gets exactly what she wanted in the first place. The man will feel like the victor by winning her over. Psychologically he feels good about himself for being able to win over her love. They both win in the end.

 

David may have been more successful with Ashley if he tried a different approach. His robust attempts at getting Ashley to 'like him' failed because she's the type of woman that doesn't like an aggressive approach and it turned her off. Rather than being pushy and trying to pull her into developing an attraction to him, David may have been better to hold back and not be so 'balls in' so to speak. The pushy and assertive tactics that David used only made Ashley retract and step back. If David had allowed Ashley to take the lead more, he may have been more successful in getting her to come out of her shell.

 

But as I said before, it's the moment of the wedding day when they first meet, if they have absolutely zero attraction to each other physically then it's probably not going to work. It worked for Jamie and Doug so far only because I believe that Jamie just didn't want to relinquish the attention and career possibilities she felt she had by continuing their marriage. I don't think that Jamie and Doug's marriage will survive for long once they actually both lose social media attention and television exposure..

Edited March 6, 2016 by HumblePi

[Snarklepuss]

David may have been more successful with Ashley if he tried a different approach. His robust attempts at getting Ashley to 'like him' failed because she's the type of woman that doesn't like an aggressive approach and it turned her off. Rather than being pushy and trying to pull her into developing an attraction to him, David may have been better to hold back and not be so 'balls in' so to speak. The pushy and assertive tactics that David used only made Ashley retract and step back. If David had allowed Ashley to take the lead more, he may have been more successful in getting her to come out of her shell.

 

But as I said before, it's the moment of the wedding day when they first meet, if they have absolutely zero attraction to each other physically then it's probably not going to work. It worked for Jamie and Doug so far only because I believe that Jamie just didn't want to relinquish the attention and career possibilities she felt she had by continuing their marriage. I don't think that Jamie and Doug's marriage will survive for long once they actually both lose social media attention and television exposure..

 

I've always said that the person in pursuit of a partner who seems uninterested should pull the opposite approach and distance from them.  If there's ever any chance that the relationship will work they'll find out soon enough when the uninterested partner suddenly becomes more interested.  But I think you know already as many of us do that this approach likely would not have worked for David because Ashley was just dead set against him from the start and it really looked like nothing he could change about his approach would ever change her mind and heart about him.  I personally don't understand someone like Ashley.  When I was young I gave guys who were into me more of a chance than she gave David even if they initially repulsed me and came on a little too strong.  And I actually changed my mind about some of those guys.  She just really needs to get over herself in a big way.  When I was young we used to say that someone like her thought she was God's gift to men.  She acts like a guy should be so lucky that she would lower herself enough to give him a chance.  Oh no.....no guys who make fools of themselves to get her attention, Queen Ashley finds that desperate and repulsive.  She is much better than to have to settle for a guy who is really into her.  And God forbid a guy should really want a relationship, that's just so needy and oppressive.  She thinks she can win over a guy who seriously doesn't give a shit about her or a relationship because she thinks she's so perfect that she could get a guy like that.  I have news for her.....

[still hoping]

I agree with you HumblePi....Jamie was able to get down cause of her desire for reality fame and future opportunities.

 

Last season Jaqualine was not attracted to her Ryan - but "came around" and then Ryan apparently didn't feel the earth move and wanted to back off - which was met with much anger on the part of "fans". I didn't feel that way - the chemistry factor can't be denied.

 

Once again IMHO the "experts" or the process fails most of the time - putting introverts with extroverts.....matching people for their similar baggage (ie, bullied, or abandoned by parent/s) is not working. I do point out the 2 times this "worked"...both times with younger couples more equally matched in looks...and all with less "baggage". 

 

To Snarklepuss - sometimes we can read too much into things we see on tv. You nor I do not know Ashley or how she acts or thinks all the time.

One problem I can see is that the experts took a woman who had a long term "deep" relationship for 9 years...and seems to have had another relationship for at least a few years....and they put her on this show. I don't think she has "been with" or even dated many guys.

Now..I am not advocating they cast swingers but I do think they do better if the people are ones who have "dated" a fair amount of people, vs those who were only in one or two long term serious relationships.

Edited March 6, 2016 by still hoping

[tvwatcher104]

It's not. The concept seems new to them since their previous seasons consisted of younger people.

davina and sean were both 35, monet was like 34, and most of them have been very close to 30. it makes sense the show picks mid-30s/low-40s people, not for experience necessarily, but b/c they are more likely to have been looking for a partner for longer and more willing to marry as their pool of potential dates begins to dwindle. 

Edited March 6, 2016 by tvwatcher104

[Waterlilly]

Ashley applied for the show didn't she? She should have known her own self better. I agree that David should have just backed off.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Waterlilly

[WichitaStateShock]

At the end of the day, Ashley won't just own that she made a decision from the beginning she didn't like him. If she would own it, I think all of us will understand.

I also wouldn't underestimate the productions role in how David acted. If he acted as aloof as Ashley they literally wouldn't have anything to show so they keep hounding him to be the good participant.

[BunnySlippers]

While I agree that David should have backed off and let Ashley get to know him and maybe even appreciate him without all that pressure, if the rumors are true and Ashley only signed up for the money and to make her ex jealous, then nothing David could have done would have made her change her behavior. Maybe if he looked like her ex, then he might have had a chance. But she rejected him from the very beginning and she was not going to change her mind.

[queen.lines]

I don't think there's anything David can do to make Ashley like him. Ashley has her own agenda, either as rumours said that she wanted to make her ex jealous, or she just changed her mind after her first look at David. Either way, she was not going to change her agenda according to the interactions she had with David, because she is not that kind of person, period. 

 

David did what he believed was the right thing at the time being, that's good enough. Now some people think he might have stood better chance if he backed down a bit, just remember this is after we saw David's strategy didn't work, so we think maybe the other strategy might work. Same thing if he did backed down, and still it didn't work, then people would think that David should have tried harder, and persist his pursuit. I am sure there are cases in real life to prove both strategies.

 

Ashley showed no quality that she deserves any man to put this much thought in pursuing her. And no healthy relationship requires either side to change who they are. David is lucky that Ashley didn't work out for him, he can find someone else that costs him half of the effort, but make him twice as happy. 

[Evil Queen]

I know abuse is a heavy handed word, but I don't think Sam's behavior towards Neil should be taken lightly or just as excused as her being mean. If we're really talking double standards, if Neil had been hurling insults at Sam the way she hurled insults at him, there would be no question that people would think Sam was the victim, but since Neil is a man and because he has thrown a few jabs back at Sam, his situation is not as seen as in the same light it would be if it were a woman being treated that way.

 

I don't know. I guess I think there's a good chance people realize they might not be 100% attracted to the spouse they get paired with going into this. I don't think people realize they might get matched with someone who is literally going to put them down and make them feel like shit every chance they get. 

 

Exactly!! If it had been reversed there would have been such outrage and to hurry and get her out of there but because it is a man it must be something else and how he should stand up for himself, get some balls, and so on. This is why men that do get abused rarely speak up about it. That is a whole other story but the fact is with this show the same people saying excuses for Sam's behavior would more then likely have a massive freak out if Neil had behaved that way to her instead. I can't even imagine the comments if David had been behaving like Ashley too. Which I find funny some have freaked out on people saying things over the women's looks and then go off about David's looks. In the end none of them were real lookers but just average people. No biggie there IMO and I could care less how they all really look myself because in the end if you act like a bully or cold or happy go lucky that will also bring out how you look as well. Whether its good or bad. You can't hide the ugly on the inside for long for most people. Those kind can be hot as heck and end up ugly because of how they behave. 

[Raganlb]

At the end of the day, Ashley won't just own that she made a decision from the beginning she didn't like him. If she would own it, I think all of us will understand.

I also wouldn't underestimate the productions role in how David acted. If he acted as aloof as Ashley they literally wouldn't have anything to show so they keep hounding him to be the good participant.

I think Ashley didn't like his looks, but she gave him a chance to see if he had an attractive personality. She wasn't attracted. He was firing with no cylinders.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Raganlb

[WichitaStateShock]

I think Ashley didn't like his looks, but she gave him a chance to see if he had an attractive personality. She wasn't attracted. He was firing with no cylinders.

Lol when exactly did she give his personality a chance? The honeymoon when she wouldn't even go on a slide? Please show evidence of trying

[Kareem]

Lol when exactly did she give his personality a chance? The honeymoon when she wouldn't even go on a slide? Please show evidence of trying

Well, she tried to look sad on decision day. We all know how that went.

[Evil Queen]

Lol when exactly did she give his personality a chance? The honeymoon when she wouldn't even go on a slide? Please show evidence of trying

 

I'd like to know that too. All we know is she day on the wedding day that she didn't like him and that was the end of things there. IF she was to give his personality a chance she would have communicated with him in some way and she didn't do that ever.

[cardigirl]

It's not. The concept seems new to them since their previous seasons consisted of younger people.

I should have been clearer, I was objecting to the classification of people as 'old goats.' Ageism is real.

[allthelight]

There is no proof that she NEVER gave him any chance and that it just came down to looks with her. She saw him, didn't like him much and what she saw during the six weeks further confirmed her opinion. There arme people who like him. And there are others like me who find him pushy, fake and phony and who would never open up with him for fear it would encourage him. She's well rid and they should have matched her with someone with a criminal record anyway.

[tvwatcher104]

There is no proof that she NEVER gave him any chance and that it just came down to looks with her. She saw him, didn't like him much and what she saw during the six weeks further confirmed her opinion. There arme people who like him. And there are others like me who find him pushy, fake and phony and who would never open up with him for fear it would encourage him. She's well rid and they should have matched her with someone with a criminal record anyway.

ITA with all of this. i see it this way as well. at least you cannot fault her for giving mixed signals. i also think the slightest encouragement would have made him think she was interested, so it was best for her to show zero interest to make it clear it wouldn't go anywhere. a guy like david, from how he was presented, doesn't need much encouragement to go for it. even with no interest he was still claiming to love her and want a chance, so imagine what would have happened if she demonstrated any affection, yikes, i could see him pouncing on 'my beautiful wife.'

[Kareem]

I should have been clearer, I was objecting to the classification of people as 'old goats.' Ageism is real.

I was joking. 40 is not an old goat. I am dangerously close to 60. I've seen how difficult this is for the 26 and up crowd. No offense meant to you.

[ctbabe]

Let me play the devil's advocate *smiles*.

Since we are to doubt what we saw, why not also doubt what we didn't see. I have seen a couple of people say David was pushy. When exactly was he pushy? Was it when he tried to get her to DO THE EXERCISES? Not the extra exercise.. the one that comes as a perquisite for signing up for the show.

I remember him pinning her down and forcing her to answer the fishbowl question or when he held her head and forced her to kiss him in the ferry wheel (sorry can't help being sarcastic). I remember when he was trying to get her have a discussion after Dr Pepper visited. He excused himself after a lil argument when she said she wasn't ready to discuss it. When you SIGN UP for something, you should Never have to be PUSHED to do the basic minimum.

The bottom line is maybe David shouldn't have been chosen (because of his past) but Ashley should never have applied. She is too shallow for this experiment.

Edited March 7, 2016 by ctbabe

[Evil Queen]

ITA with all of this. i see it this way as well. at least you cannot fault her for giving mixed signals. i also think the slightest encouragement would have made him think she was interested, so it was best for her to show zero interest to make it clear it wouldn't go anywhere. a guy like david, from how he was presented, doesn't need much encouragement to go for it. even with no interest he was still claiming to love her and want a chance, so imagine what would have happened if she demonstrated any affection, yikes, i could see him pouncing on 'my beautiful wife.'

 

Where is proof that is how he would have acted if she acted like a normal human? Sorry but the way she behaved was NOT ok. As I said before she could have tastefully said right from day one that she wasn't into him and didn't think she would ever be into him in a romantic way but since they are in this could they be friends and nothing more....IF she had done that no one would have thought she was a cold dead fish or trying to lead him on. I don't see how saying something like that would have lead him on either but it would have made it clear how it would be. She was rude and childish during this when she should have sucked it up and put her big girl panties on and been an adult through it all. 

 

Let me play the devil's advocate *smiles*.

Since we are to doubt what we saw, why not also doubt what we didn't see. I have seen a couple of people say David was pushy. When exactly was he pushy? Was it when he tried to get her to DO THE EXERCISES? Not the extra exercise.. the one that comes as a perquisite for signing up for the show.

I remember him pinning her down and forcing her to answer the fishbowl question or when he held her head and forced her to kiss him during in the ferry wheel (sorry can't help being sarcastic). I remember when he was trying to get her have a discussion after Dr Pepper visited. He excused himself after a lil argument when she said she wasn't ready to discuss it. When you SIGN UP for something, you should Never have to be PUSHED to do the basic minimum.

The bottom line is maybe David shouldn't have been chosen (because of his past) but Ashley should never have applied. She is too shallow for this experiment.

 

Well said!!! 

[queen.lines]

ITA with all of this. i see it this way as well. at least you cannot fault her for giving mixed signals. i also think the slightest encouragement would have made him think she was interested, so it was best for her to show zero interest to make it clear it wouldn't go anywhere. a guy like david, from how he was presented, doesn't need much encouragement to go for it. even with no interest he was still claiming to love her and want a chance, so imagine what would have happened if she demonstrated any affection, yikes, i could see him pouncing on 'my beautiful wife.'

So you are team Ashley, are you helping the team or not? Team Ashley is arguing there is no proof Ashley never gave David a chance. You are saying as same kind of person as Ashley you believe for person like David you wouldn't give a little bit encouragement. Can we use that to argue against team Ashley that she didn't give David a fair chance? I am getting mix signals here ;-), please don't get frustrated and blaim everything on me.

[tvwatcher104]

So you are team Ashley, are you helping the team or not? Team Ashley is arguing there is no proof Ashley never gave David a chance. You are saying as same kind of person as Ashley you believe for person like David you wouldn't give a little bit encouragement. Can we use that to argue against team Ashley that she didn't give David a fair chance? I am getting mix signals here ;-), please don't get frustrated and blaim everything on me.

 

Where is proof that is how he would have acted if she acted like a normal human? Sorry but the way she behaved was NOT ok. As I said before she could have tastefully said right from day one that she wasn't into him and didn't think she would ever be into him in a romantic way but since they are in this could they be friends and nothing more....IF she had done that no one would have thought she was a cold dead fish or trying to lead him on. I don't see how saying something like that would have lead him on either but it would have made it clear how it would be. She was rude and childish during this when she should have sucked it up and put her big girl panties on and been an adult through it all. 

 

 

Well said!!! 

why would she need to tell him tastefully on day one that there was no hope? if she'd told him that day 1, then she could easily be accused of checking out before it even started. but i don't think she - at any point - needed to say how she was feeling. a guy would need to a total blockhead not to get that she wasn't attracted. like how was that a shock to him?!

 

i'll assume you're female... if you've ever gone on a blind date and seriously not liked a guy from the start, do you get all excited and interested and talkative or do you retreat from the conversation and show disinterest? she was just showing what a lot of women do when they meet a guy they don't like - they retreat completely and the more you try to draw them out, the worse it gets. i don't care a smidge about any of these people tbh, but she shouldn't be faulted for just not liking someone. vaughn and monet in season 1 were done w/the marriage halfway through and so was davina. lots of people check out early and have to continue on b/c of the contract.

[Evil Queen]

why would she need to tell him tastefully on day one that there was no hope? if she'd told him that day 1, then she could easily be accused of checking out before it even started. but i don't think she - at any point - needed to say how she was feeling. a guy would need to a total blockhead not to get that she wasn't attracted. like how was that a shock to him?!

 

i'll assume you're female... if you've ever gone on a blind date and seriously not liked a guy from the start, do you get all excited and interested and talkative or do you retreat from the conversation and show disinterest? she was just showing what a lot of women do when they meet a guy they don't like - they retreat completely and the more you try to draw them out, the worse it gets. i don't care a smidge about any of these people tbh, but she shouldn't be faulted for just not liking someone. vaughn and monet in season 1 were done w/the marriage halfway through and so was davina. lots of people check out early and have to continue on b/c of the contract.

 

No one would have said she was checked out if she had been up front with him in a honest, tasteful way and said let's be friends. She was checked out as it was from the time she saw him though. Which was just because she didn't like how he looked. She didn't know a thing about him other than his name at that point and what he looked like. I think the worse she would have been accused of from day one if she had been honest was that she was superficial. Which she obviously is but even worse is she is rude and uptight about it all. 

  Have you ever been friends with the opposite sex? Attracted to them or not? I can say I have. I can also say that I had gone on dates with guys that I knew I wouldn't want to go out with past the first date BUT I didn't check out and act like a rude bitch to them either. I stayed polite and talked. What if that was a missed chance at having a good friend that came along even though there was no chemistry? If someone's mind is that closed off and the manners aren't there in how to behave in these situations then there is an issue with that person. BTW, most women I know would never behave how Ashley did. And why? Because its rude and they weren't raised to be that way to be no matter what. If someone like Ashley couldn't use some manners and been respectful during this because of someone's looks then she shouldn't have EVER signed up for this and lied that she was open to something different when she obviously wasn't. 

Edited March 7, 2016 by Evil Queen

[tvwatcher104]

No one would have said she was checked out if she had been up front with him in a honest, tasteful way and said let's be friends. She was checked out as it was from the time she saw him though. Which was just because she didn't like how he looked. She didn't know a thing about him other than his name at that point and what he looked like. I think the worse she would have been accused of from day one if she had been honest was that she was superficial. Which she obviously is but even worse is she is rude and uptight about it all. 

  Have you ever been friends with the opposite sex? Attracted to them or not? I can say I have. I can also say that I had gone on dates with guys that I knew I wouldn't want to go out with past the first date BUT I didn't check out and act like a rude bitch to them either. I stayed polite and talked. What if that was a missed chance at having a good friend that came along even though there was no chemistry? If someone's mind is that closed off and the manners aren't there in how to behave in these situations then there is an issue with that person. BTW, most women I know would never behave how Ashley did. And why? Because its rude and they weren't raised to be that way to be no matter what. If someone like Ashley couldn't use some manners and been respectful during this because of someone's looks then she shouldn't have EVER signed up for this and lied that she was open to something different when she obviously wasn't. 

she signed up, but she didn't pick herself. the 'experts' went w/her and it'd be a hard thing to prove she wasn't like that in their presence. remember that first and foremost these are entertainment shows and people are cast as characters so we can become invested. they need a villain, a good girl, a socialite, etc. she had a role that she was cast for and they edited it to enhance that. it's all fake, and any couple who can actually navigate and find one another is darn lucky!

[Lola16]

 

Let me play the devil's advocate *smiles*.

I don't think that means what you think that means.

 

I'm not on team anyone. I don't think Ashley's motives were less pure than David's.  Both were doing it for the money.  (according to David's mom at least he was and pretty much all the Ashley detractors accuse her of it.)  David was on Tinder according to his mom, makes out with random girls at bars according to his friends, sucks at dating according to him --- none of that screams looking for marriage but he did act like he wanted to be married to a pretty girl.  Ashley had 2 ltrs, no time to find the one (due to school and work), maybe was hoping to find a guy, maybe was hoping to make an ex jealous.  Not seeing how one motive is better than another.

 

Ashley saw David and wasn't into him.  She did warm up a little when he didn't force a kiss on her at the reception.  She had a moment on the honeymoon where she also seemed to warm up to him.  Then it looked like she shut down.  Why?  Well, maybe David was coming on too strong.  Maybe something else was going on.  They were not a good match.  Ashley is very measured, very slow to respond, period.  Not just with David but in every interaction we saw.  David would be better with someone more outgoing. 

 

I don't agree with the experts that they need to match people to improve the other person.  Ashley needs to work on her communication and openness.  David needs to work on his tempo and maybe delve into why he wants to skip over the getting to know you stage.  Sam needs to work on her aggression and childish behavior.  Neil needs to work on his communication and passive aggressive snipes.  Vanessa and Tres need to work on their abandonment issues; Vanessa also needs to learn not to sabotage herself.

[ctbabe]

I am thinking playing the devil's advocate means taking the unpopular stance (in some instance). I believe a lot of people (even people that like him) believe he was pushy.

[Snarklepuss]

i'll assume you're female... if you've ever gone on a blind date and seriously not liked a guy from the start, do you get all excited and interested and talkative or do you retreat from the conversation and show disinterest? she was just showing what a lot of women do when they meet a guy they don't like - they retreat completely and the more you try to draw them out, the worse it gets. i don't care a smidge about any of these people tbh, but she shouldn't be faulted for just not liking someone. vaughn and monet in season 1 were done w/the marriage halfway through and so was davina. lots of people check out early and have to continue on b/c of the contract.

 

As someone who went on a lot of virtually "blind" internet dates about 12 years ago I have been in this situation many times and have reacted somewhere in-between.  There is a way to handle oneself with class and gracefully live through it without being downright rude, and Ashley was rude, IMHO.  Plus, if it were only one blind date her behavior might be excusable, but this went on for the better part of 6 weeks without end.  The fact that she had to continue because of a contract is even more reason why she should have bucked up and put in more of an effort even if it pained her to do so.  When someone is on one blind date they really don't owe anyone anything.  But when someone marries someone, voluntarily promises to enter into a 6 week process, and is under contract to stick with that process out to the end, they'd better put in more effort than that, IMHO.  At least look interested in him as only a friend for the sake of appearances - No, Ashley thinks she is God's gift to men and shouldn't have to do anything that she doesn't absolutely want to do 100%.  That BS about not wanting to hurt David's feelings was total garbage - It was about her and not wanting to honor the contract.   At least "friend zone" him like we have seen with a few couples so far, most notably Jaclyn and Ryan from Season 2.  I doubt that Ashley was so "offended" by David's personality that she couldn't manage to make an effort to befriend him while making it clear that he was not to go over that line until if and when things changed AND she gave him a clear signal.  I doubt that he would have acted so pushy if she had done that early on.  But noooo, she continued to give him mixed signals until Dr. C had to provide the necessary 2x4 that David needed to make things perfectly clear. 

 

What a self-serving, self centered BITCH, sorry, that's all I can say about it.  She lets him hang himself and then acts like he's a loser for still trying.  Oh, it should have been obvious to him, blah, blah blah.  NO, that is no excuse.  I don't care how obvious it was, David had a right to expect some clear communication from her otherwise still attempt to get somewhere with her because he took the contract and the process seriously enough to do so.  That is no poor reflection on him, but what she didn't do for him is a poor reflection on her in so many ways.  Her character is seriously impaired if you ask me.  She is a selfish, self-centered, self-serving bitch who wouldn't put herself out for anyone for any reason.  She sees a guy hanging himself to the point of going all pathetic and she can't even go out of her comfort zone to put him out of his misery.  TOTALLY inexcusable, IMHO.

Also, I have been on blind dates where the guy is pushy and acting like we were already planning our summer together and I couldn't let him go on with that very long without saying, "Hey, let's take things one step at a time, we don't even know if there's going to be a second date yet much less a whole summer".  Ashley could have said stuff like that but she acted more in a way to lead him on by not saying anything and providing mixed signals.  I think she did that because she knew she was hiding the fact that he had no chance with her whatsoever and wanted to look like she needed more time to "warm up to him".  Meanwhile that was a cover for her being totally checked out, which she didn't want to admit to publicly because she was under contract.  So it was all about her and her feelings and zero about David's.

Edited March 7, 2016 by Snarklepuss

[SaucyMommy]

http://starcasm.net/archives/344118

Logan and Dr C are out. Given how vocal they were last year and how absent they were this year - no surprise they quit. They can't even be attached to this garbage

[Liberty]

http://starcasm.net/archives/344118

Logan and Dr C are out. Given how vocal they were last year and how absent they were this year - no surprise they quit. They can't even be attached to this garbage

 

A quote from Poser Lefkoff, "It is time for me to pursue my next television adventure." defines her professional goal as television.

 

Hope her career does not collide with Jamie's!

[cardigirl]

I was joking. 40 is not an old goat. I am dangerously close to 60. I've seen how difficult this is for the 26 and up crowd. No offense meant to you.

My brother-in-law calls his mother (my M-i-L) 'goat' which I don't find endearing, but she seems to be okay with it.  I prefer to think of myself as increasing in value.  ;) 

[sniglet]

Not sure where to put this.  Sorry if it's in the wrong place. 

 

I thought this was interesting insight from someone who was selected for the Miami season. 

 

https://twitter.com/ZariBatista/status/706863350374928384 and https://twitter.com/ZariBatista/status/706863771348832256

[cardigirl]

sniglet, could you give the gist of what the twitter says?  I can't access twitter from work. (oopsie) 

 

Thanks!