Vienna Blood - General Discussion

[dargosmydaddy]

Quote

From PBS : A student of Sigmund Freud and an Austrian detective team up to solve some of the most mysterious and deadly cases in early 1900s Vienna.

Did anyone else catch the first episode on PBS? I stumbled upon it halfway in, had no idea what it was, but felt compelled to keep watching. The young doctor (medical student?) had a really electrifying screen presence (and brought the pretty). I'm hoping to watch the whole episode on the PBS website when I get the chance, but just wondered what everyone else thought.

[Epeolatrix]

I liked them (watched on BBC) and I am considering reading the books now. I was somewhat reminded of The Alienist, but they are only set a few years apart.

[Tardislass]

There are three 90 minute episodes that PBS cuts in two. Hated the abrupt cut and thought that they should have aired the whole episode at once. That said, it seemed very Sherlock-especially the music. Not a bad thing but noted that one of the BBC writers wrote this. I did enjoy it and think the two leads have chemistry. 

Sad that PBS didn't even promote this especially as it's an Anglo/Austrian mystery.  Personally, I'd enjoy this more as a Masterpiece show than the horrible Austin adaptation or Howard's End.

[dargosmydaddy]

I finally got to watch the first episode in its entirety. I'm wondering about a lot...

-How long have the Liebermanns been in Vienna? They're from London... why did they leave? It seems like it's a fairly recent move by the way the father was being introduced to all the important people of the city, but why did they move if they were successful already in London? 

-I want to learn more about the detective guy (Reinhardt?) and what his deal is. We got lots of background on Max in the first 45 minutes, and nothing on him.

-It was the younger detective (Hausmann?) who leaked the news to the press and allowed them to take pictures, right?

[Tardislass]

2 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

I finally got to watch the first episode in its entirety. I'm wondering about a lot...

-How long have the Liebermanns been in Vienna? They're from London... why did they leave? It seems like it's a fairly recent move by the way the father was being introduced to all the important people of the city, but why did they move if they were successful already in London? 

-I want to learn more about the detective guy (Reinhardt?) and what his deal is. We got lots of background on Max in the first 45 minutes, and nothing on him.

-It was the younger detective (Hausmann?) who leaked the news to the press and allowed them to take pictures, right?

From what I recall about the book, Max & Oscar had been friends for a while and consequently in Vienna for a long time. However, the TV writers wanted an "origins" story. Also the Inspector in the book is a happily married or married family man, hardly the "lone detective". That said, I'm still enjoying it and I noticed "Rose" from Ripper Street as Max's sister. 

I do love the BTS short takes after the episodes on PBS. Pretty interesting and having know many Germans/Austrians, they do think their English is impeccable. It's interesting that they had to have coaches to make it more natural. Finally, I'm loving the scenery-like the rooftop chase and finding out that that awful painting was real as was the artist at the party. I'm with his date, I wouldn't want that hung in my living room.

[HoodlumSheep]

On 1/22/2020 at 7:02 PM, Tardislass said:

That said, it seemed very Sherlock-especially the music.

The moment the music started i thought the same thing. I'd be shocked if it wasn't done by the same person.

I've been enjoying the show so far. It's at the end of the 3 hr programming block (howard's end, sanditon, and this), but it's probably my favorite out of the 3 right now.  

[Tardislass]

4 hours ago, HoodlumSheep said:

The moment the music started i thought the same thing. I'd be shocked if it wasn't done by the same person.

I've been enjoying the show so far. It's at the end of the 3 hr programming block (howard's end, sanditon, and this), but it's probably my favorite out of the 3 right now.  

Actually they are two different composers for the two shows. Perhaps the fact the show is written by the less popular Sherlock writer meant that some liberties could be taken on the music. Otherwise, if I was Michael Price, the Sherlock composer, I'd sue for copyright infringement.

[izabella]

On 1/26/2020 at 1:18 PM, Tardislass said:

From what I recall about the book, Max & Oscar had been friends for a while and consequently in Vienna for a long time. However, the TV writers wanted an "origins" story. Also the Inspector in the book is a happily married or married family man, hardly the "lone detective". That said, I'm still enjoying it and I noticed "Rose" from Ripper Street as Max's sister. 

I'm mostly enjoying it, too, but this pisses me off.  I'd enjoy it a lot more if the Inspector were a happily married family man and they weren't strangers bitching at each other about their respective professions.  The lonely detective and the difficult doctor profiler are such common tropes that I'm sick of them. 

I also hate that the doctor is using his gf/fiance to get ahead socially and is leading her on even more with a proposal.  He comes across as detached and emotionally deadened, but very selfish.  I can't like him because of that. 

The mental health hospital, aka, the torture hospital, and all that goes on there is also grim although probably accurate of the time.

[dargosmydaddy]

So... what exactly was the plan to get the killer to confess, and how did either Max or Oskar think that doing it in a Ferris wheel type thing was going to end well?

The dark-haired second-in-command young detective is kind of cute, but I can't decide if he's evil and trying to purposely torpedo Oskar, or if he's just really inept/ downright stupid.

1 hour ago, izabella said:

I also hate that the doctor is using his gf/fiance to get ahead socially and is leading her on even more with a proposal.  He comes across as detached and emotionally deadened, but very selfish.  I can't like him because of that. 

Are we sure that's what he's doing? He seems to sneer at his father's attempts to get ahead. I got the sense that he just thinks it's for the best (to try to be normal) and what he ought to do to make the girlfriend happy, not that he's deliberately leading her on for his own gain/ to be mean. Though he certainly does have his jerky moments.

[izabella]

5 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

Are we sure that's what he's doing? He seems to sneer at his father's attempts to get ahead. I got the sense that he just thinks it's for the best (to try to be normal) and what he ought to do to make the girlfriend happy, not that he's deliberately leading her on for his own gain/ to be mean. Though he certainly does have his jerky moments.

I don't think we can be 100% sure, but when his sister accused him of using her for social connections and standing and invitations, he didn't deny it or look upset at the idea.  When she asked, repeatedly, if he loved her, he wouldn't say anything, much less that he did.  And when he proposed, it was only becasue she was essentially breaking up with him and he also didn't tell her he loved her or anything.  He just blurted it out after she made it clear she was about to dump him and walk away.

He may be thinking it's what he's supposed to do and to try to be normal, but the result is he's leading her on because she's been clear that she wants his attention and love.

[dargosmydaddy]

Oh, I agree it's definitely not a healthy relationship! They don't seem well-suited for one another at all, and I don't see why the gf seems so eager to be with him (other than that he is easy on the eyes).

[izabella]

I don't get it, either.   She seems like a catch who should have more than a few guys who would be interested in her.  Maybe he seems like the tall, dark, mysterious type to her and she's into it, lol.  She'd better hope he doesn't bring home hideous, creepy paintings!

[Broderbits]

24 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

and how did either Max or Oskar think that doing it in a Ferris wheel type thing was going to end well?

Maybe the writer had recently watched "The Third Man"? Ferris wheels in Vienna are apparently conducive to confessions.

[Rickster]

11 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

So... what exactly was the plan to get the killer to confess, and how did either Max or Oskar think that doing it in a Ferris wheel type thing was going to end well?

While I like the characters and unique setting for this show, and I found the initial set-up of the crime (dead body, no bullet, in a locked room) intriguing, I found the rest of the plotting around the crime investigation sort of superficial and disappointing. The confession plan is one  example. I don’t think splitting the episode in two helped. Also, my watching it late at night might have caused me to miss some details.

[12catcrazy]

I've been enjoying the show so-far.  I don't know if I like the soap opera aspect of the Dr and the Blond girlfriend (now fiance).   He seems very "dark" and she appears to be a happy, social butterfly young woman who is in love and wants to be loved in return - in other words - "normal", which I don't think our Dr is.   

Frankly, he seems much more interested in the scientist woman who had the breakdown at the art exhibit - SHE intrigues him - his girlfriend does not.   I'm just hoping for the blond's sake that they don't get married.  

[Tardislass]

I'm betting they get together in the end-Max and the art restorer. 

I do like seeing the aspects of Judaism like the Seder dinner, I don't think I've ever seen that in most series and it's a nice touch. 

[statsgirl]

I'm still trying to find my way around this. I like how it is true to the time and to the early beginnings of the study of neurology. I cringe every tie someone gets electro-convulsive shock.

It's too bad that there are so many detective shows these days because it's hard to avoid repetition of shows that have gone before.  In a way it's like Watson and Holmes, which lead to all the other male detective buddy stories.  (Thank goodness for Miss Fisher.) I also hate romantic triangles which is where I see this heading between the blond fiance and the dark-haired scientist.

The title is brilliant, a riff on Strauss' Weiner Blut waltz.

On 1/22/2020 at 7:02 PM, Tardislass said:

Sad that PBS didn't even promote this especially as it's an Anglo/Austrian mystery.  Personally, I'd enjoy this more as a Masterpiece show than the horrible Austin adaptation or Howard's End.

It's vastly superior to both Howard's End and Sanditon.

[Driad]

The inspector and his skeptical colleagues have probably encountered all sorts of off-the-wall ideas.  Wasn't there a theory that a murder victim's eyes somehow retained an image of the killer?

[HoodlumSheep]

Oskar's crime fighting posse seems to be growing...maybe...it'd be cool to see Ms. ...Lidgate (??? I'll admit i don't know most of their names yet) unofficially kinda join the team so to speak, but i know it's not a certainty by any means. 

Max's sister doesn't hold back when it comes to verbally sparring with him. She lets him have it. Good for her. Max's dad though...he's trying so hard to turn a blind eye to certain things bc he wants to stay afloat in society...but he can't keep doing it forever. Reality's gotta hit him at some point and i feel like there's a good chance it'll involve his business.

[AuntiePam]

17 hours ago, statsgirl said:

It's vastly superior to both Howard's End and Sanditon.

I didn't stick with Sanditon so I can't speak to that, but I really liked Howard's End.  I'm liking Vienna Blood too, but I'm finding some of the dialogue a bit pedestrian and expository, especially from the minor characters. 

The problem is (as others have stated) we've seen all this before, so the dialogue will tend to be cliched as well as the plots.  The psychologist points out what everyone else has missed, the obvious perp is never the perp, etc.  One nice difference here is that the person in charge seems open to new ideas, new procedures. 

[sinycalone]

I don't think Max is trying to lead his fiance on....so much as feels he is doing the accepted thing.  He is expected to marry, take on family responsibilities, etc...and she is an attractive, good-natured woman who obviously cares for him.  Hopefully, both of them will realize it is not a healthy relationship ... soon.

 

I've enjoyed the show (up to episode 3)....and find the leads are appealing and smart.

Edited February 5, 2020 by sinycalone

[statsgirl]

Clara broke off the engagement! Nooooo!   I really liked her, more than the obvious love interest.

I'm amused/offended by tht fect that just like Clara is the least important person in the attempted rape story, the mother, who was raped, is the least character in the murder story.

I think one of the things I love most about this show is the Vienna location shots. And Clara's opera dress. And the glimpse of The Magic Flute.

On 2/3/2020 at 4:27 PM, AuntiePam said:

The psychologist

Max is a medical student, as Freud was a medical doctor. There were psychologists at the time but they were experimental psychologists like Stanley Hall, William James and Wilhelm Wundt. The kind of clinical psychology we think about now came around in the 1950s. [/pedantic]

It amuses me when Max comes up with his sexual angst explanations.  True to the Freudian theories of the time but feels so convoluted today.

[sinycalone]

Clara was growing into a deeper, more empathetic character.  Did not want the engagement broken.

The inspector was right about not charging the soldier for the assault....for those times.

[Tardislass]

Well, I liked that mystery better than the first, though the problem I'm having is I identify the killer about 30 minutes into the story. Not many red herrings. I liked the fact that the storyline mirrored problems that Europe and the US still have today, the demonizing of immigrants. Though being of Czech blood, I was surprised that they were considered immigrants in the Austrian Empire. I did wish we saw more of the Jewish engagement party. What was broken in the beginning-dishes?

So glad Clara dumped Max as he was simply awful with her and as a presumably rich beautiful and compliant young woman probably won't be single for very long. Oddly enough I believe Freud talked about falling in love with one's patient and that's what Max has done. To quote Seinfeld, this art restorer is "dark and disturbed".  If this was RL, he'd date and marry her then find out they have nothing in common. But I'm sure, they will eventually live happily ever after-at least until 1930. 

I have just order the first book from the library as I think I might like the book series better. Both Max and Oskar have different personalities.

[jrlr]

I liked Clara's character, and it's a pity that she won't hve a bigger role (if any) going forward.  But what really puzzled me is her living status.  She's rich, young, beautiful. . . and has no servants or parents around to come to her rescue when she's fighting off a rapist?  Max has a key to her house, like they are already living together?  Maybe I missed something that would explain this, but it all seems very wrong for the time period.  

[12catcrazy]

So the bad guy in eps 3 & 4 was the painter?  I got so confused - I figured it was going to be the cop who killed that poor Autistic guy in jail.  

We know that Max's father breaking off the business deal with the rich guy (a Baron?) is going to come back and bite him.   And was the rich guy actually one of the members of that anti-immigrant society?  He kept denying it and he was the one who actually handed the flyer to Max's father, who he presumably knows is Jewish and who he wanted to do business with.  

And is Clara, the now ex fiancee, Jewish?   Intermarriage was not a common thing in those days and anti-Semitism wasn't hidden.  

[12catcrazy]

7 minutes ago, jrlr said:

I liked Clara's character, and it's a pity that she won't hve a bigger role (if any) going forward.  But what really puzzled me is her living status.  She's rich, young, beautiful. . . and has no servants or parents around to come to her rescue when she's fighting off a rapist?  Max has a key to her house, like they are already living together?  Maybe I missed something that would explain this, but it all seems very wrong for the time period.  

I thought the same thing - at least about the lack of parents and servants, or even other relatives.    It was easy to see why the soldier thought she was "easy" as in that time, a respectable young woman didn't have men come and call without anybody else being there.   It looked bad and reputation was everything, especially in that type of social circle.  

[HoodlumSheep]

Enjoyed the episode. I'm glad Clara broke off the engagement (and so soon!). I was expecting the poor gal to get strung along for a bit longer while max pines for lydgate. Better sooner than later. 

Here's to hoping that the soldier dude someday makes his way into jail.

I'm also awaiting the day when max decides to throw down with his medical superior-teacher-advisor dude over the shock 'therapy.' 

[Irlandesa]

On 2/9/2020 at 10:56 PM, statsgirl said:

Clara broke off the engagement! Nooooo!   I really liked her, more than the obvious love interest.

Same here. I mean I'm happy, for her, that she broke it off but by episode four, she had turned into my favorite character so I don't want her gone. So not so happy for me.

And Max might be doing his "duty" but he had been called out for his shitty behavior by both his sister and his fiancee after he had become obsessed with a woman he didn't even know. He can't plead ignorance and he's absolutely responsible for being an ass.

But I might be overly passionate about it because the mysteries are pretty predictable and the apparent love story is just so fantasy driven. It doesn't make for an interesting story even if I did like the actress on Underground.

 

[statsgirl]

Interesting mystery. I like that they boys school has boys from all over the empire. Zelenka, for example, is a Czech name.

I miss Clara already. Miss Lydgate may have a job more useful in helping Max to solve the mystery but I don't see chemistry between the characters other than the tortured variety.

Way to bring in an anachronism, show.

Quote

After studying 300 mental patients and 100 control subjects, in 1921 Rorschach wrote his book Psychodiagnostik, which was to form the basis of the inkblot test (after experimenting with several hundred inkblots, he selected a set of ten for their diagnostic value), but he died the following year.

 

[wellread]

Another mystery!  Why were candles burning in the empty crypt at the military school, where the torture took place, when Max and Oskar investigated?

[HoodlumSheep]

Thought the opening scene was well done. 

Poor daniel. 😞

there's always a secret, evil school clique/club, isn't there? 

Let's hope Oskar gets the job instead of the incompetent dude.

[HoodlumSheep]

Immediately googled on whether there'd be a season 2. Seems unconfirmed for now but i have my fingers crossed. 

They definitely set it up for the possibility of another season.

[statsgirl]

I thought that the point of a season finale was to get people eager to see the next season. This one failed three ways:

• Oscar's rival got the promotion, and now Oscar is in an even worse position because he's even more biased against him. This part is realistic, that advancement came from connections not competence, but it's still depressing for Oscar. However, that might have been okay if not for:
• Max is suspended and it started because he was such an idiot as to read a book during his professor's tutorial.  Of course the professor is going to be angry at him.
• Clara is gone and Miss Lydgate is the new love interest. Unfortunately, for all that she is more compatible in terms of their minds, on screen she and Max are an energy black hole.  Far from looking forward to the path of them finding love with each other, I'm dreading it.

In addition, the story of the boys in the military school was very depressing.

I want someone to do a televised series of Baroness Orczy's Lady Molly stories. I"m tired of these mopey men.

[HoodlumSheep]

11 hours ago, statsgirl said:

I thought that the point of a season finale was to get people eager to see the next season. This one failed three ways:

• Oscar's rival got the promotion, and now Oscar is in an even worse position because he's even more biased against him. This part is realistic, that advancement came from connections not competence, but it's still depressing for Oscar. 
• Clara is gone and Miss Lydgate is the new love interest. Unfortunately, for all that she is more compatible in terms of their minds, on screen she and Max are an energy black hole.  Far from looking forward to the path of them finding love with each other, I'm dreading it.

In addition, the story of the boys in the military school was very depressing.

I'm rather eager to see how oskar rises back to the top tho. 😛

I'll agree that max and lydgate are a better match in terms of their minds, but their chemistry lacks. I've seen worse though. And now that max and clara are separated i'd much rather have them stay seperated and move on. If anything, maybe max will will eventually move on from lydgate some day. 

[sinycalone]

14 hours ago, statsgirl said:

I thought that the point of a season finale was to get people eager to see the next season. This one failed three ways:

• Oscar's rival got the promotion, and now Oscar is in an even worse position because he's even more biased against him. This part is realistic, that advancement came from connections not competence, but it's still depressing for Oscar. However, that might have been okay if not for:
• Max is suspended and it started because he was such an idiot as to read a book during his professor's tutorial.  Of course the professor is going to be angry at him.
• Clara is gone and Miss Lydgate is the new love interest. Unfortunately, for all that she is more compatible in terms of their minds, on screen she and Max are an energy black hole.  Far from looking forward to the path of them finding love with each other, I'm dreading it.

In addition, the story of the boys in the military school was very depressing.

I want someone to do a televised series of Baroness Orczy's Lady Molly stories. I"m tired of these mopey men.

I had the opposite reaction....I'm anxious to see if Max and Oscar can overcome their respective obstacles.  As far as Clara vs Lydgate.....Clara has more warmth and charm; Lydgate has a more logical and analytical mind.  I am curious to see if Clara is truly out of the picture...and if Lydgate can eventually begin to open up personally.

Regarding the girl's father committing suicide:  he maintained that she was everything to him, yet chose suicide....leaving her totally alone.  I never have understood decisions of that kind.

That school was depressing, though....I agree with you.

 

 

 

[swissair100]

https://tellyvisions.org/2020/07/06/period-mystery-vienna-blood-renewed-season-2?fbclid=IwAR1CsqXDdPrtnsQ-Uz3xPWMV4r-Okt46CIG3NFqzGuGBNquXqK74U1EtG4U
 

Season 2 Confirmed!

[statsgirl]

Quote

There also won't be much of a delay in starting. With COVID-19 mostly under control in Austria, filming for the new season will be able to begin later this month, with an eye on an early 2021 premiere.

Good for them.  (sigh)

[ComeWhatMay]

I just watched the finale on WETA UK. Glad the show will return. 

Max and Oscar make a great team and I enjoyed the tea debacle with Clara. Brilliant and bathed in love, Max is immature and deserved to be embarrassed. He was positively fuming with his parents. 

Oscar and his wife represent an all too common scenario when a child dies. 

I think the actor played it as Max could not take his eyes off Clara and Amelia saw that… Max has a fascination with Amelia that would wear thin. Light vs. darkness. She’s a case, of which there will be more. Many an immature person (no age limit) has blown up a good thing over something else with a spark. Also, would Amelia want to be with someone who she met at her lowest moment? Papa met mama when she had a breakdown? Her reticence is a credit to her. Hope we get to see more of Clara’s fire. Love the actress and that wardrobe. 

[ComeWhatMay]

Vienna Blood series 2 airs on PBS beginning January 9. https://www.pbs.org/show/vienna-blood/ 

[HoodlumSheep]

Found out this show got renewed for second season only a week ago. I had checked a good handful of times over the past two years to see if it got renewed but i must have stopped checking right before they announced it. Lol.

Golly. Two years. Pbs didn't offer a lil refresher for the previous season before the episode either so if my memory is super foggy I apologize in advance. Haha

So...a timeskip? Of about a year-ish? Can't remember. Clara's got a new man, Max has his own practice, he an amelia stayed in touch until about two months before the present (?)...time has passed.

Amelia...is that a different actress playing her? I wonder why if so.

The archivist is a total keeper. She's rad. 

[Driad]

21 hours ago, HoodlumSheep said:

Pbs didn't offer a lil refresher for the previous season before the episode either

I really could have used one.  This episode was season 2, ep. 1: The Melancholy Countess, Part 1.  I did a lot of "who is this person?"

At the beginning when the woman found the body, I was gratified that she did not scream.  Characters on TV and movies who find bodies usually scream, but I suspect that a smaller percentage of real people would.

[mjc570]

I'm glad it's back, although I don't really remember all that much of Season 1.  I did remember Clara was Max's former fiancée, but not what disgrace happened to Max or why he was no longer consulting with the police.  Didn't matter, I enjoyed the episode and found it pretty easy to follow.  My favorite character continues to be Conleith Hill, I am waiting for some Varys spillover (Game of Throne reference)

[bluestocking]

On 1/9/2022 at 10:55 PM, HoodlumSheep said:

 

Amelia...is that a different actress playing her? I wonder why if so.

The archivist is a total keeper. She's rad. 

Yes, Amelia is played by a new actress.  This interview doesn't explain why Jessica de Gouw was replaced.

https://www.pressparty.com/pg/newsdesk/BBC2/view/273845/?isworld=y

OTOH they are keeping Clara around, and she is clearly not over Max.  Are they aiming at a love triangle?

The new archivist is a great addition.  Would be interested in her back story.  

Hoping for a Season 3--lots of loose ends to tie up.  

 

 

[HoodlumSheep]

You could figure out something went down with the countess involving a child in the first episode, but for him to be used as a red herring? Wasn't expecting it to be the lady in waiting/maid/??? Good twist imo.

[izabella]

Herr Huber's visit to Max was interesting once we found out he was the husband of Max's patient.  I was surprised Max didn't tell him anything about the sessions with his wife as he demanded.  I was under the impression it was common for men to be told about their wives' therapy sessions because women were thought to belong to them, like children, and that doctor/patient confidentiality wasn't a thing until later or didn't apply to women.

[dargosmydaddy]

10 minutes ago, izabella said:

I was surprised Max didn't tell him anything about the sessions with his wife as he demanded.  I was under the impression it was common for men to be told about their wives' therapy sessions because women were thought to belong to them, like children, and that doctor/patient confidentiality wasn't a thing until later or didn't apply to women.

Max seems rather forward-thinking. I could see him withholding that information despite it not being the norm back then,

I did think it was ridiculous that he didn't put together that the dead woman had a child, considering her dreams.

[bluestocking]

25 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

Max seems rather forward-thinking. I could see him withholding that information despite it not being the norm back then,

I did think it was ridiculous that he didn't put together that the dead woman had a child, considering her dreams.

You do have Max and Oskar both saying something along the lines of "How could I be so stupid and not notice....X"    Every mystery involves people with a lot of secrets--but then we find out that having secrets doesn't necessarily lead to the killer.  

How many Libermann mysteries are there?  Are there any left to film after Series 2?  

[sugarbaker design]

15 hours ago, bluestocking said:

How many Libermann mysteries are there?  Are there any left to film after Series 2?  

According to this website Tallis wrote 7 novels.

[bluestocking]

5 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

According to this website Tallis wrote 7 novels.

Hmm...so that means one more (two-part) episode, not enough for a "season."  They could always go off-book I guess.