Designing Women - General Discussion

[annzeepark914]

Initially, the tirades were fun. After a while, though, they got to be a bit too much.  I stopped watching after Delta left. She and "Anthony" made that show for me. There was quite a bit of preachiness in DW but when it happened during *their* crazy antics, it wasn't so very bad (I'm thinking of their getting stuck in a blizzard & having to share a room). I just need to buy some of the dvd's featuring my favorite episodes. "My name? Helen Patton Van Patterson" (or was it Van Patton Patterson, or Patterson Van Patton?)

[Giuseppe]

30 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

"My name? Helen Patton Van Patterson" (or was it Van Patton Patterson, or Patterson Van Patton?)

"My name is Helen Van Patterson Patten."

"And I'm her sister, Debbie."

[Kohola3]

Suzanne was a hoot.

Edited June 26, 2020 by Kohola3

[Bastet]

On 4/24/2020 at 5:02 PM, Queena said:

I bought Dixie Carter's book and I was so disappointed to find lessons on dieting and other things. She came off judgemental. 

Boy howdy.  I remember a friend complaining about this back when it came out.  I downloaded an electronic copy to finally read it, and just the chapter titles!  Seriously, this is what she chose to write about:

Part One: There's Nothing Wrong With Wanting To Be Beautiful

1. The Cultivation of Natural Beauty
2. My Childhood as a Health Nut
3. Good Habits - Results and Roses
4. Aesthetic Surgery
5. Please Don't Wear Black to Weddings, You-all

Part Two: Beauty All Around

6. The Spirit of the Home

Part Three: The Essence of Beauty

7. Trailing Clouds of Glory

Coda: Prayers For My Daughters

Yikes.  I'm still going to read it, since it's free, but, yes, I'm sure I'll have the same reaction as you and my friend did.

On 6/25/2020 at 7:15 PM, Giuseppe said:

"My name is Helen Van Patterson Patten."

"And I'm her sister, Debbie."

You beat me to answering the question about the name, and I was also going to include "And I'm her sister, Debbie", because it cracks me up to a disproportionate degree.  It is not that funny of a line, but something about the way she says it turns it into a hoot.

Edited June 30, 2020 by Bastet

[Giuseppe]

11 minutes ago, Bastet said:

It is not that funny of a line, but something about the way she says it turns it into a hoot.

I don't know why, but I always thought it weird that Julia picked a name like Debbie instead of something more formal, like Deborah. I just don't imagine Julia seeing herself as a "Debbie", lol. Maybe the 'real' Helen VPP did have a sister named Debbie. Definitely file this one under Things I've thought about way too hard.

[Bastet]

14 minutes ago, Giuseppe said:

I don't know why, but I always thought it weird that Julia picked a name like Debbie instead of something more formal, like Deborah. I just don't imagine Julia seeing herself as a "Debbie", lol.

I think that looking at Julia and somehow having trouble seeing her as a Debbie (the reporter even says she doesn't look like a Debbie) is part of why I like it.  The context is that Julia has been dragged along on this Elvis trip, so she's not among "her people", but hates the condescending reporter who's going to present them as even more ridiculous than reality. 

Not in any way wanting to be publicly associated with any of this, Suzanne as usual pretends to be Helen Van Pattenson Patton, and Julia comes up with "Debbie" - either because there's a real Debbie to go with the real Helen, and Julia doesn't like her any more than Suzanne likes Helen, so she's joining her in maligning the Van Pattenson sisters, or because Julia is using a name that springs to mind when thinking of someone unlike her, the kind of woman who'd come to something like this. 

 

[Giuseppe]

1 hour ago, Bastet said:

Not in any way wanting to be publicly associated with any of this, Suzanne as usual pretends to be Helen Van Pattenson Patton, and Julia comes up with "Debbie" - either because there's a real Debbie to go with the real Helen, and Julia doesn't like her any more than Suzanne likes Helen, so she's joining her in maligning the Van Pattenson sisters, or because Julia is using a name that springs to mind when thinking of someone unlike her, the kind of woman who'd come to something like this

I like that idea. I can see Julia coming up with Debbie because of that.

I know Suzanne invoked Helen's name in another episode, but can't remember which...was it The Junies? Were there others?

[Bastet]

18 minutes ago, Giuseppe said:

I know Suzanne invoked Helen's name in another episode, but can't remember which...was it The Junies? Were there others?

I think "Stranded" in season two was the first time Suzanne used Helen's name when doing something she didn't want to be associated with (in that case, checking into a motel with Anthony), and I know she did it again in season three's "E.P. Phone Home" (the "And I'm her sister Debbie" scene) and "The Junies" (pretending to know Libby and lure her away so the "Hell's Belles" could rescue Charlene), but I may very well be missing some.

[Bastet]

Oh my gods, y'all - Dixie Carter spent 18 pages of her book lecturing in meticulous detail how people should groom and dress themselves:  two paragraphs for men, two pages for babies (yes, babies) and children, and the rest for women.  Yep, 15 pages of specific instructions on how to bathe, brush our teeth, and dress.

I'll give her points for self awareness: after she spent two paragraphs declaring babies should be dressed only in white, she wrote:  "Yes, a pterodactyl flew through the centuries into my window and pecked out these last paragraphs".

But then I'll deduct a few, because, I shit you not, on the next page she criticized the do and don't type of articles on celebrity fashion, asking, "Why do we need the catty comments?" 

I'm not even halfway through the book, but I'm going to have to just start skimming for tidbits about the show.  Because, rest her soul, this woman was batshit crazy. 

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, Bastet said:

I'm not even halfway through the book, but I'm going to have to just start skimming for tidbits about the show.  Because, rest her soul, this woman was batshit crazy. 

Geez. I had no idea.  What the heck did Hal Holbrooke see in her? Or, is he a bit wacky himself? Sounds like the batshit crazy goes along with her frightening singing voice. 

[Bastet]

She was also intelligent and passionate, and seems to have been a great friend and mother.  She strikes me as someone with extremely narrow and ass-backwards world views - seriously, if you wrote this shit for a fictional character, you would hear howls of protest that you'd written an offensive caricature of southern Christian women, yet when fame handed Carter a book deal, 250 pages of antiquated lecturing is what she chose to offer the world - who, because of her profession, was surrounded by people who don't subscribe to her philosophies, and cared dearly for many of those people -- yet never realized hey, these are good people living good lives, so this narrow box I think the world should squeeze itself into clearly leaves a whole lot of people out; I should rethink what I was taught.

I can't tell from the book whether she never examined or just denied the rampant sexism at the root of her thoughts. 

Interestingly, the part where I disagreed with her least was the chapter on her decision to get plastic surgery.  That was frank discussion about how difficult it was to get accurate information from cosmetic surgeons, her fear when surgery day came, her desire to freeze time rather than wind it back ten years, the physical brutality of recovery, her “that’s not me” disconnect upon looking in the mirror post-op even after the swelling and bruising had subsided, and even a little - surprising for her - on the bullshit nature of “needing” it in the first place at only 45 years of age. 

I think the work she had done (a face lift between pilot and series, and then brow lift during season one’s hiatus) was subtle.  But I think it's sad how she, upon watching the first screening of the pilot, felt she looked compared to her costars -- the fact she looked older than the rest of them, because she WAS more than ten years older than them, made her so uncomfortable about the prospect of being known as "the old one", she went under the knife.  (This, of course, is heavily influenced by working in an industry that practically told women they should go out and shoot themselves, but at the very least not offend cameras with their person, somewhere between 35 and 40.)

She did say, “It makes me feel sorry for myself in an odd way that I was so amazed by my appearance.  What must I have been willing to settle for?  I wonder as I’m writing this.  Aren’t we pitiful sometimes.”  And a lot of her advice about choosing a plastic surgeon, if one is going to go that route, was sound, and she encouraged women to own what they had done rather than be embarrassed about it.

[mmecorday]

Sounds like she leaned a little on the Wilson Brickett side.

[Hiyo]

Happy Pride y'all!

[Queena]

On 6/26/2020 at 6:06 PM, Bastet said:

Oh my gods, y'all - Dixie Carter spent 18 pages of her book lecturing in meticulous detail how people should groom and dress themselves:  two paragraphs for men, two pages for babies (yes, babies) and children, and the rest for women.  Yep, 15 pages of specific instructions on how to bathe, brush our teeth, and dress.

I'll give her points for self awareness: after she spent two paragraphs declaring babies should be dressed only in white, she wrote:  "Yes, a pterodactyl flew through the centuries into my window and pecked out these last paragraphs".

But then I'll deduct a few, because, I shit you not, on the next page she criticized the do and don't type of articles on celebrity fashion, asking, "Why do we need the catty comments?" 

I'm not even halfway through the book, but I'm going to have to just start skimming for tidbits about the show.  Because, rest her soul, this woman was batshit crazy. 

😂 I didn't finish the book. I didn't want to ruin DW, I would have never been able to look at her the way. 

 

One of the best Julia Sugarbaker rants is this one. 

 

Quote

...........in general it has been the men who have done the raping and the robbing and the killing and the war-mongering for the last two thousand years.... and it's been the men who have done the pillaging and the beheading and the subjecating of whole races into slavery. It has been the men who have done the law making and the money making and the most of the mischief making! So if the world isn't quite what you had in mind you have only yourselves to thank!! 

Linda Thomason-Bloodworth was good 

Edited June 30, 2020 by Queena

[annzeepark914]

I loved those couples vacation trips. My favorite was watching Julia dancin' with "Daddy" and hearing him sing to her, "and when she gets behiiiiind closed doors".

[Bastet]

59 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I loved those couples vacation trips. My favorite was watching Julia dancin' with "Daddy" and hearing him sing to her, "and when she gets behiiiiind closed doors".

I'm partial to Mary Jo imitating Daddy Jones back at the cabin.

Also, that episode saved the song for me.  I love Charlie Rich's voice, and the piano intro is great, but the lyrics suck.  It's a "hate to love" song.  Along came "Nightmare From Hee Haw" and I could just, if nothing else, enjoy the song for reminding me of that episode.

Also, I don't think I've ever remembered to ask until now something that finally hit me a few re-watches ago:  Am I the last fan in the world to realize Junior is played by the same actor who played T. Tommy Reed?

[annzeepark914]

29 minutes ago, Bastet said:

I'm partial to Mary Jo imitating Daddy Jones back at the cabin.

Also, that episode saved the song for me.  I love Charlie Rich's voice, and the piano intro is great, but the lyrics suck.  It's a "hate to love" song.  Along came "Nightmare From Hee Haw" and I could just, if nothing else, enjoy the song for reminding me of that episode.

Also, I don't think I've ever remembered to ask until now something that finally hit me a few re-watches ago:  Am I the last fan in the world to realize Junior is played by the same actor who played T. Tommy Reed?

Mary Jo imitating Daddy was hilarious.

I never realized the same actor portrayed two characters in DW. The only son (from the Hee Haw episode) I remember was Nub, the family's gynecologist. I think he was Charlene's dancing partner. Just remembering all these funny stories, characters, lines, etc makes me realize how talented Linda B-T was. And how much I miss writers like her.

[Kohola3]

My favorite scene in a vacation episode was Suzanne calling out the au pair.

Ursula:  Well, I guess there's only room for one queen bee around here.
Suzanne: That's right. And I'm afraid I'm it.

[FormerMod-a1]

Oh man, "Big Haas and Little Falsie" is on TV right now.  One of the best episodes ever!  "These things are power!"

[libgirl2]

22 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

Oh man, "Big Haas and Little Falsie" is on TV right now.  One of the best episodes ever!  "These things are power!"

That is one of my favorites! 

[chessiegal]

I forgot Delta Burke and Jean Smart left after Season 5. The dynamic seems off, so I've started deleting later seasons.

[Kohola3]

1 hour ago, chessiegal said:

The dynamic seems off, so I've started deleting later seasons.

Ditto.  It was a totally different show, just awful.

[ljenkins782]

On 7/23/2020 at 7:34 PM, Kohola3 said:

Ditto.  It was a totally different show, just awful.

I actually think Carlene could have been a decent character, but it was an untenable situation with the departure of Delta and Jean. On a fresh show or as an add-on to the originals, she might have worked, but as a replacement? No. 

The Allison character was a non-starter, you can't have a character with no redeeming qualities. Suzanne had her negative qualities and was probably not someone Mary Jo and Charlene would have CHOSEN to be friends with if not for Julia and the business, but she certainly had her redeeming qualities. And most of all, the character was funny, even when being obnoxious. They failed to write comedy into the Allison character.

I've only seen a few episodes with BJ so I can't judge the character, but I don't care for the actress so that was another no for me. Add in the weird choice to make Mary Jo a mini-Julia (a complete departure from the original character) and those last seasons are unwatchable.

[Kohola3]

26 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

They failed to write comedy into the Allison character.

That Obnoxious Personality BS was just such a cheap shortcut, it allowed her to be horrible and that was supposed to be the reason.  As you said, he had no redeeming features and that's just lazy writing.

Charlene was naive but sweet.  Carlene came across as just plain stupid.  Big difference.

[chessiegal]

Watching a Season 3 episode. Shoulder pads x 4 = yikes!

Edited July 28, 2020 by chessiegal

[Taryn74]

10 hours ago, chessiegal said:

Watching a Season 3 episode. Shoulder pads x 4 = yikes!

Watching anything from the 80s - early 90s is SO hilarious to me. I really don't know what we were thinking sometimes.

I do miss my big hair though, not gonna lie.

[annzeepark914]

2 hours ago, Taryn74 said:

Watching anything from the 80s - early 90s is SO hilarious to me. I really don't know what we were thinking sometimes.

I do miss my big hair though, not gonna lie.

I liked the shoulder pads...made me feel taller (only 5'4").

[Kohola3]

2 hours ago, Taryn74 said:

Watching anything from the 80s - early 90s is SO hilarious to me. I really don't know what we were thinking sometimes.

I do miss my big hair though, not gonna lie.

 I think of brides who spend thousands of dollars on gowns that will look absolutely ridiculous in a few years. Looking back at wedding pictures from the eighties, it makes me laugh.

[chessiegal]

5 minutes ago, Kohola3 said:

Looking back at wedding pictures from the eighties, it makes me laugh.

I got married in 1971, and my gown had big puffy sleeves - absolutely hideous. After I ditched the husband and moved into my own place, I took the gown with me thinking I'd try and sell it. One day when I got tired of seeing it in my closet, I took it out and threw it in a dumpster. Very therapeutic.

[chessiegal]

Woohoo! FETV is back to season 1. Just watched the pilot. They did a good job of establishing the characters.

[annzeepark914]

4 minutes ago, chessiegal said:

Woohoo! FETV is back to season 1. Just watched the pilot. They did a good job of establishing the characters.

So it's on at 2:30? I just put it on and The Lone Ranger is on 🙄  I don't think I've ever seen the first episode of DW.

[chessiegal]

I record it. It's on at 3:00 am and 3:30 am.

[Bastet]

14 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I don't think I've ever seen the first episode of DW.

Oh my, then you've never seen the initial encounter with Ray Don?  That must be rectified:

 

[annzeepark914]

Heh heh...I didn't realize this was the first episode. I remember watching it and nodding my head as I'd done the same thing Julia did to one of those "Ray Don" characters. My friends were so impressed (this was back in the 80's).

[chessiegal]

I was watching a Season 1 episode that aired in 1987. Charlene has a lump in her breast. When she goes for the biopsy they have her admitted to the hospital and put under general anesthesia for the procedure. Did they really do that in 1987? I had a biopsy 10 years ago. They told me I might want to have someone drive me, but it wasn't necessary. I drove myself, they numbed my breast, stuck a needle in and took samples, and I drove myself home.

[blondiec0332]

1 hour ago, chessiegal said:

I was watching a Season 1 episode that aired in 1987. Charlene has a lump in her breast. When she goes for the biopsy they have her admitted to the hospital and put under general anesthesia for the procedure. Did they really do that in 1987? I had a biopsy 10 years ago. They told me I might want to have someone drive me, but it wasn't necessary. I drove myself, they numbed my breast, stuck a needle in and took samples, and I drove myself home.

In 2013 I had a breast biopsy and they did it with me under anesthesia.   But it wasn't a needle biopsy.  

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, chessiegal said:

I was watching a Season 1 episode that aired in 1987. Charlene has a lump in her breast. When she goes for the biopsy they have her admitted to the hospital and put under general anesthesia for the procedure.

Not only that, they admitted her the night before.  Even under anesthesia, that's an outpatient procedure.

I've had three benign lumps removed, but only the first one was preceded by a biopsy, which was a stereotactic needle biopsy (no anesthesia, just a local); the next two were assumed to be the same as the first (or cancer, so either way, they needed to come out!), so I just had them removed and then biopsied.

[chessiegal]

I was watching an episode today where Julia was taking cooking classes, something she had always wanted to do. She folds up a cookbook that was clearly the Better Homes & Gardens cookbook. Good solid run of the mill recipes, but not something I would associate with cooking lessons. Maybe her course was Home Cooking 101. 😉

[latincoffee]

So DW is on Pluto TV's OnDemand. I am currently watching Season 1.

 

YAY!

 

[Bastet]

Pluto hasn't been working for me lately (it keeps saying there's no connection, but since nothing has changed and Prime, Netflix, Tubi, etc. have no problems connecting, it's not the stick, it's the app), which is annoying me as I have one episode left to go of Women of the House (the short-lived series about Suzanne taking over her husband's congressional seat after he dies).  It is not at all a good show, but it has its moments, and I want to finish it.

[latincoffee]

3 minutes ago, Bastet said:

Pluto hasn't been working for me lately (it keeps saying there's no connection, but since nothing has changed and Prime, Netflix, Tubi, etc. have no problems connecting, it's not the stick, it's the app), which is annoying me as I have one episode left to go of Women of the House (the short-lived series about Suzanne taking over her husband's congressional seat after he dies).  It is not at all a good show, but it has its moments, and I want to finish it.

Sorry to hear that, @Bastet I did see Women of the House is also on Pluto. I have never watched the show but may check it out soon. 

[latincoffee]

That classic moment when Julia told Marjorie off defending Suzanne!

 

[Taryn74]

1 hour ago, latincoffee said:

That classic moment when Julia told Marjorie off defending Suzanne!

 

That was the one with the baton twirling story, wasn't it? I loved that so much. And especially that Suzanne heard part of it.

 

[Bastet]

23 minutes ago, Taryn74 said:

That was the one with the baton twirling story, wasn't it?

Yep, the night the lights went out in Georgia:

 

[Taryn74]

"...except Congeniality." Bahahahahaha oh that is just the best. Thanks for the clip!

[ifionlyknew]

16 hours ago, Bastet said:

Pluto hasn't been working for me lately (it keeps saying there's no connection, but since nothing has changed and Prime, Netflix, Tubi, etc. have no problems connecting, it's not the stick, it's the app), which is annoying me as I have one episode left to go of Women of the House (the short-lived series about Suzanne taking over her husband's congressional seat after he dies).  It is not at all a good show, but it has its moments, and I want to finish it.

If I'm not mistaken Women of the House is also on Prime.

[Bastet]

4 hours ago, ifionlyknew said:

If I'm not mistaken Women of the House is also on Prime.

Oh, thanks - I just looked it up, and, yes it is, with IMDbTV.  I've switched to watching my Twin Peaks blu-rays each night, but when I'm done, if the Pluto app is still being an asshole, I'll see about downloading IMDbTV.

It has some funny lines and a couple of good episodes, but is on the whole not a very good show and Suzanne doesn't really feel like Suzanne (it also annoys me that Julia exists [mentioned but not seen] but there's a different brother), but I've sat through all but one already - I think I gave up halfway through when it originally aired - so I might as well see the remaining episode.

[Bastet]

I've been falling asleep to my season four DVDs lately, and last night watched an episode with Olivia's nanny, Mrs. Philpott (or, as Suzanne would claim, fugitive Roberta Harwood from Unsolved Mysteries).  After all this time, it finally dawned on me that it's the same actor who played the older Marla in A League of Their Own.  I saw and heard it plain as day this time, but had never recognized her before.

Speaking of that stretch of episodes, they never address that Anthony is really quite an ass to Vanessa in the beginning; their New Year's Eve date (when Charlene goes into labor) is a set-up, it turns out she's a disaster, he doesn't want to date her.  No problem.  But he keeps stringing her along for a month, having sex with her, knowing she's into him, without ever telling her that (and then, of course, he decides he'll date her if he can fix her - if she gets a job, goes to school, etc.).

[GHScorpiosRule]

On 11/17/2020 at 10:06 PM, Bastet said:

Yep, the night the lights went out in Georgia:

 

I ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY LOVE this scene! And am bummed that I missed it, as the show is on Season 4 just now.

[ButterQueen]

On 8/28/2019 at 10:04 AM, TaraS1 said:

Now that we've been blessed with the show on Hulu, I watched the one last night where they go on vacation and hire Ursula to watch the kids.  God, Suzanne is extra fabulous in that one.  "Take your big knockers and hit the road."

Suzanne was my favorite.  She and Anthony were awesome together.  Antenna TV is showing it now.  I watched some of my faves yesterday.