BooBear

Here is the basic question for me.. why did he have to kill her? Other than the obvious they were running out of time for the story and wanted shock value. Though I love Drogon to me it makes more sense to kill the Dragon, which can do far more damage even without Dany. Just one shot from one of those left over scorpions and the Dany threat would largely be reduced. Dany could be imprisoned and tried. But more logic errors here why was killing Dany any guarantee that (1) the dragon wouldn't kill them all, (2) the unsullied wouldn't kill them all, (3) the dothraki wouldn't kill them all and (4) the second sons wouldn't come over from Essos and kill them all. I know this slap shod show made everything work out for this plot twist by why did Jon think killing Dany would really solve anything?

And apparently now we have to add a water bottle being caught in the scene.

I didn't watch the final episode but watched the live stream. I think people who liked it are being confused by the good acting because from here I was sitting the logic was out the window. Why did Jon kill Dany when, really, the better choice would have been Drogon? What if after killing Dany, Drogon just went on a rampage? Why did Drogon not kill Jon? Why did Drogon burn the iron throne? Why did Gray Worm do nothing? Why would anyone pick Brann to run the seven (oops 6) kingdoms? He is a teenager with a weird power no one understands? Why would anyone pick Tyrion to do anything... he was a traitor to his last queen and also an idiot. Does anyone have any faith that this group of chuckle heads will run the show any better? So the lord of light brought Jon back to take out Dany? But Jon -- your too late. You let her kill millions. Lord of light should have revoked his life.

I am going with episode 10 of season 6. Honestly she was not really believable since she met Jon Snow. I am angry at how they treated Dany and Jon but I feel they played into long held trope plots for her and for me, that is unforgivable. Dany spent 8 years working to get something and when she got it... lost her mind? No, just no. Dany was an inspiration for many people watching this show. And for them to choose her to be the fall baddie, complete with codependent urges for love from her nephew, was a choice that was not earned. All the people who died because they believed in her. Yet the person who is most directly responsible for her madness.. Tyrion, all works out for. Disgusting.

Ok the elephants were one thing but there were several others that seemed like they were trying to save money? That strikes me as bizarre as it would seem this season would have a large budget. Ironically, looking back I would have been happy to give up some of the battle episodes for more character development.

Yes, everything that happened seemed rushed and stupid.

The most people can hope for is when another beloved series comes to an end and the executives are reading over the ending they say... lets be careful here. I am up for that. Also, I want D&D not to have quite the reception they might have otherwise.

I really don't see why. Once Dany had the job of rebuilding and ruling the 7 kingdoms -- a hard job -- she might be like "ok Sansa, run this for me for 5 years and if you do a good job, I will give you independence. Happy to be free of one of the kingdoms. But even so, why do they need independence with a just ruler as the queen? At this point as I understand it they don't really have independence, they just haven't been smacked back by Cersie yet. Surely they can be reasonable. I can't see Dany in any position to grant independence before she gets on the iron throne. Only after, as she sees all the variables can she reasonably make that decision. IMHO anyone with a lick of sense should know that and not be like "hi I am Sansa Stark, I demand northern independence!!" Yeh that is how you make friends.

This one was particularly good.

Does anyone else hope tonight at 9 PM EST everyone turns into watch GOT and Veep airs. HBO has decided not to air the final episode so they can try to fix the problems in further GOT season 8b.

As an aside, is anyone else annoyed and wondering why it seemed like this season had no money? I expected HBO to have thrown money at it but it seems to me every single corner was cut that could be. There is this.. no elephants. Coffee cups not removed. Episode three, very dark, IMHO very dark to hide CGI. We can't get Ghost because of cost / CGI? A very small core cast in like 3 locations? (why was Kings Landing the Sahara now?) I mean they seemingly didn't care at all about using CGI to cover that up. The night kings dragon doing hardly anything. I suspect even some of these plot points were cost decisions.

And the next person Dany would go after - after Jon - would have been Sansa. Here is what I don't under stand... why is the discussion about Northern Independence being done right now? I mean is this the time? Sansa put it out there and now if she was playing the game, she should show loyalty to Dany. Get Dany on the throne and then, when the time is right, ask again. Perhaps take less than full independence with the goal of moving toward that if things go well. How is it a game to demand northern independence and then be upset when it isn't immediately given up? That is a child's behavior. No different than Sansa taking a hiss fit when Ned wanted her to go home in season one.

What I find heartening is that so many of these you tube commentaries are just laughing at the episode turns. Just laughing at it. That says so much.

I cannot wait for the reaction. What kept me going for way too long was the idea that the next episode would fix things... once I got to the finale spoilers I was furious and realized this was it. So I feel like 1/2 the fan base will explode.

Not to mention that it spits in the face of reason to have them fighting after the battle. You are facing millions of the undead at your door about to kill you and someone comes along with a dragon and kills 700+ at a wack... first, awe and amazement at the dragon existing and taking out the dead and then deep gratitude that the person with the dragons is willing to assist you. Just irrational that Sansa or anyone at Winterfell wouldn't be happy with Dany. More irrational that in the immediate aftermath everyone would be giving Jon the credit. Frankly a more rational story would be they would all flock to Dany and Jon would be jealous... but can't have that cause he is a man.

I am just going to go with what they wrote. I am not sure increasing episodes would have done anything because most of season 7, imho, was a stall and a waste of time. It seems that D&D didn't know how to get to a satisfying ending and only knew how to continue plot arcs that GRRM started. But, Dany would not smile when her dragons scared the northerners. Dany would not make any scary threats when Sansa seemed cold to her. I would have cut the Jon rides a dragon scene from the first episode and had Jon do that in desperation in episode 3 - maybe to get to Bran. The entire thing with Sam would have been done differently. Jon would have run into him in the court yard early on. Sam would tell Jon about his background. Jon would tell Sam about his dad. Sansa and Arya would have more to do with Dany and Jon. The night king battle would have had the army behind the walls of winterfell. One dragon would have guarded the other taking out the army fo the dead either for the air or on the ground. People watching from the inside would be overwhelmed and thrilled with Dany and her Dragons. Jon would make it to protect Bran against the night king but would look to be losing. Arya would come out of no place and take out the night king. Jon would be amazed at what Arya can now do. Jamie, Brianne, and many more would die during the battle. Dany would be a big hero. Sansa would apologize for not trusting her. Time would pass before going after Cersie. Yara would take out Euron. The army would take out or start to take out the golden company. Dany will take out Cersie and the red keep. Cersei will escape and lose her baby. Dany will take the iron throne. John chooses to go north and restart the nights watch --but for some good reason like in case the walkers come back. He will never tell anyone about his Targaryen background. Sansa is Warden in the north. Last scene. Cersie with her minions smugly drinking her wine thinking she escaped and Jamie finds her... strangles her, the look on her face is shock and horror, once done Arya is the killer and crosses Cerise's name off her list. This might not be shock and horror but to me it would have been satisfying.

A fan should be entitled. Was this show just made for art purposes? No it was made to attract fans. That is kind of a contract. A quid pro quo. We make this art so people will like it... if people like it, HBO, the creators and actors will benefit. In return they make a good show. Now, however, at the end, when they got what they wanted... the turn in a crap product and try to shame the fans who point out the bait and switch. No different that any other product. Consumers have ever right to complain when the product is defective.

I disagree as well. The petition is up to a million signatures now... that is a lot of people. I don't like having this season put down to "rushing" the problems were apparent in season 7 but we gave them a pass because we assumed that season 8 would be good. But imho the show runners had ideas in their head for each story line but didn't know how to get there and they just slap dashed it together. Remember there was a TON of filler in seasons 7 and 8 that was just useless. People say "it took 2 years to do this?" well of course, the two years wasn't to do GOT, it was so that the cast and crew could work on other things! This was likely the way they would all agree to come back for the 8th season. I also suspect that *something* happened with the writing staff. Perhaps some people left early and didn't return for season 8. Season 7 wasn't great but it still had some of the magic. This season did not.

On the lost boards on TWOP there was a "deep bitterness" thread. I think we need one of those. That is laughable because Jon has half Targ blood and he is as calm as a simpleton. But for me the issue is that it just makes no logical sense for her too choose NOT to go after Cersi, Tyrion, Jon, Sansa, or anyone else... but rather kill thousands of innocents and by that I mean people she doesn't even know. And I refuse to accept illogical actions of a character under an "insanity" claim. These show runners are either stupid or arrogant or both and feel the viewing audience should just sit back and take their ruining the show because... reasons. Nope.

Woof.. I just read the latest spoilers... omg, bad. I am not going to be watching because I cancelled HBO last weekend. 300K have already signed the change.org petition to refilm season 8. People are angry.

One point a co worker made today was that you get a sense that the show never really intended for Dany to be the bad guy to this extent simply because of the music. Almost every theme they used for Dany suggests a hero.

I love those crybabies. If you are fine with writers of shows bating and switching fine but some of us don't like to be tricked. However, it just wouldn't be the same for me anymore. I am just done with the show and the characters. You can't unsee this pathetic writing.

Personally I always loved TV Cersei. I never saw her as evil as much as a product of her environment and a life time of having terrible disappointments. That being said, she was the villain of this show and deserved that someone fitting would have ended her life. But the show didn't seem to want that and that puzzles me. I mean I like Cersei but I still think she had death coming to her worthy of her crimes. She should not have gotten to die in the arms of the person she loved. I know some people might say this is how real life is but the real life story for Cersei was more realistically that she would have died alone, badly.

I am so ruthless the truth is, I would be ok with Dany taking out the people of Kings Landing. Honestly they were not exactly "innocent" and probably were a good reason for the continuation of the wheel. Most of the people probably would have tried to undermine her. Though I was also hoping the night king would win. However, I suspect that is not where it will end. I suspect that next episode Dany won't want to stop. It is also tragic that I believe that she had been held back so much - when taking Kings Landing was so stunningly easy.. she realized what she could do if she put her mind to it. What really bothers me though is that she should have wanted personal revenge against Cersie (same with Gray Worm) and yet, she didn't even seem to try. I thought when she took off after the bells ringing she would head straight up to the red keep. But no... it was like she actively avoided it. It is just so unnatural that it takes the viewer out of it. GOT usually allows its characters to get personal revenge, Arya getting the Frays, Sansa getting Ramsy, but Dany didn't get personal revenge or even try.

Going back over this episode via you tube (I have cancelled my HBO subscription) I just can't believe how bad it was. Every scene had WTF? moments. - Why wasn't Varys gone already? If you are going to betray your queen, you might want to do it from afar. Not to mention, he is trying to poison her? Seriously? Proposition Jon right there? Are you mad? - Jon seems perfectly ok with Varys being burned alive. - Davos commits treason for Tyrion... the guy who killed his son? - Jamie, just stunning, is actually returning to Kings Landing to save Cersie. Wow, just wow. - Tyrion commits treason to release Jamie to do something, Jamie doesn't end up doing. Some rando ends up ringing the bells. - The golden company, wow... they literally get beat in one blow from Drogon. Hysterical. - Why was Dany unable to anything about Euron's fleet last week but this week she destroys double the number of ships almost immediately. - Why does Dany just completely ignore the red keep? I mean it is the largest target in kings landing and Cersie is in there but no... don't attack that until the end and apparently don't attack it with fire. - Why kill everyone in Kings Landing and destroy the city? How much is rebuilding going to cost? -Why was the hound aware that if Arya went any further into the city she would die but he was willing to die for NO REASON. HIs brother would have died protecting Cersie. That was totally obvious. - It almost seemed like Gray Worm looked at Jon with contempt for not joining him in killing the Lannister army. Is Jon going to be on the firing block next week? - What was going on with Arya. As many pointed out her "you must leave" got people killed. Plus frankly Arya should be dead too. ETA: Jamie and Euron fighting for the love of Cersie. Who wanted to see that plot line? Who? I wanted to see Dany burn Euron but the shows writers act like someone should care about Jamie fighting Euron? I can't watch this episode without having like 10 why's pop into my head. It gives me a headache.