ohjoy

MTE. It'll be fun to see how it all shakes out though.

I have a weirdly obsessive love for this episode. Much of that has to Jensen's performance -- apparently Dean's raw determination and unadulterated snark cover a multitude of sins Adam as Plan B. And I really see where you're coming from DittyDotDot -- I agree with just anout everything you said. This episode was very much the beginning of the end of the excitement for this season's story for me as well. I came into this show under the vague notion that there was a "five-year plan" for its story (foolish, I know), and I was excited to actually see it through to fruition. So I was disappointed, not because I wanted Dean to say Yes to Michael (although I was excited to see what Jensen would do with the role), but because I thought I was watching something with a specific narrative end point, and I wanted to see what that end point was. But even though this episode had a definite shift away from the path that the season had been following, I don't fault it for where the season ended up -- I still had hope, even after they showed us Adam as the obvious alternative, that they would do something less obvious than a convenient half-brother who was never supposed to more than a one-off character in the first place. (Again, foolish, I know.) So that hope made the turn less of a disaster at the time, and the things that made the episode more tolerable for you are what made it into a favorite for me. As I mentioned, I loved Jensen's all out performance (it kept me wondering if Dean really would keep his word), but I also loved Sam as the consistent one, who everything spiraling out of control and instead of trying to physically fight back, he decides to use his faith in Dean as a more powerful tool. For some reason it worked for me here, even when it didn't elsewhere. And Sam being the calm, mature one allowed Cas to delve into the sense of betrayal, which really worked as well. Plus, Dean killing his first angel in Zachariah will never not be a thing of beauty.

+ Point of No Return -- Changing Channels -- Hammer of the Gods 43 - Dark Side of the Moon 42- The End 39 - Changing Channels 33 - Point of No Return 24 - Hammer of the Gods 25 - The Song Remains the Same 19 - The Real Ghostbusters 17 - Good God, Y'All 16 - Sam, Interrupted 11 - Abandon All Hope Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid The Curious Case of Dean Winchester Two Minutes to Midnight My Bloody Valentine

Well, at least they aren't overestimating themselves in that regard, because based on the show's patterns, I'm not confident in their abilities in that area either. ETA: But I really wish they hadn't pulled the gun on the kiss so soon then. We didn't really need to have Oliver and Felicity first date, first kiss, and first breakup all in the first episode of the second season. I didn't really need that to happen at the beginning of the season at all. That pendulum from emotionally close to very distant and back again could have swung much slower of the course of the season, rather than than kicking it all the way over in the premiere, and then having it be stuck there for the better part of the next 22 episodes.

+ Point of No Return -- The Real Ghostbusters -- My Bloody Valentine 46 - Changing Channels 45 - Dark Side of the Moon 45 - The End 33 - Point of No Return 29 - The Song Remains the Same 29 - Hammer of the Gods 20 - Good God, Y'All 18 - The Real Ghostbusters 17 - Sam, Interrupted 15 - Abandon All Hope 05 - My Bloody Valentine Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid The Curious Case of Dean Winchester Two Minutes to Midnight

Who stole the fern? Why is this fern posing as the one from the premiere? #ArrowS3Mystery

Point of No Return + Hammer of the Gods -- The Real Ghostbusters -- 44 - Changing Channels 44 - Dark Side of the Moon 43 - The End 33 - Point of No Return 32 - Hammer of the Gods 29 - The Song Remains the Same 24 - Good God, Y'All 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 17 - The Real Ghostbusters 13 - My Bloody Valentine Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid The Curious Case of Dean Winchester Two Minutes to Midnight

Hee -- catrox14, I don't necessarily mean that I want Tommy , I just wouldn't necessarily mind if it turned out that Malcom tried to use the Lazarus Pits on him as well . And also, I too want THAT Tommy back. But at this point, I'll take just about any Tommy. Or really anyone that might be "crazy" enough to blame Laurel for his/her death and deal with her accordingly.

Best episode yet! I'm enjoying the ways that even though Henry and Eliza are polar opposites on so many things, they can always meet in the middle (where Charmonique is to save the day). Cho and Gillan are both adorable and endearing, even in the most awkward situations. And since there are so few of us watching the show, I'm gonna take that trash can with Big Ben and a police box on it as a Doctor Who shout-out just for me. :-)

From the 3.02 episode thread: I saw this and suddenly had a vision of Tommy , thus setting up Colin Donnell's return as a season regular for the 4th season as an antihero. And now I want that. Desperately.

Ugh, forgot to vote yesterday. -- Hammer of the Gods -- The Real Ghostbusters -- Two Minutes to Midnight 41 - The End 41 - Dark Side of the Moon 41 - Changing Channels 33 - Point of No Return 31 - Hammer of the Gods 31 - The Song Remains the Same 25 - Good God, Y'All 19 - The Real Ghostbusters 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 15 - My Bloody Valentine 03 - Two Minutes to Midnight Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid The Curious Case of Dean Winchester

Total left-field speculation: What if the characters to which "Reichenbach" refers are Sam and Crowley, rather than Dean and Cole?

Point of No Return ++ Good God, Y'All ++ The Curious Case of Dean Winchester -- 41 - The End 41 - Dark Side of the Moon 41- Changing Channels 31 - The Song Remains the Same 31 - Hammer of the Gods 31 - Point of No Return 27 - Good God, Y'All 21 - The Real Ghostbusters 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 11 - My Bloody Valentine 05 - The Curious Case of Dean Winchester 05 - Two Minutes to Midnight Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid

I thought this was referring to Donnie. Shield was trying to get to Donnie before Hydra, because they understood that if Hydra couldn't bring him in, they would kill him to avoid the threat of him not being on Hydra's side. But Shield (Skye) actually did kill him (or she thinks she did), to avoid the threat of him not being on Shield's side.

They didn't bother giving her a middle name. She wasn't a character to them - just a plot device, a long con to get us to care about Dinah Laurel Lance's journey to becoming BC. (Mission: NOT Accomplished.) At this point I'm completely torn - I don't want this show to tank, and put SA, DR, EBR, and the other actors I really respect and whose characters I care about out of a job. I want to be able to tune in and enjoy Oliver's journey and his developing relationship with Felicity. But I do not in any way want to reward the EPs for their despicable handling of Sara Lance. Every bit of her death and "funeral" just screams "WE HAVE NO RESPECT FOR THIS CHARACTER OR HER FANS." I don't want to put up with the obvious bait-and-switch they're doing in regards to Olicity vs. Laurel as BC. I don't care if they are ever impacted by my reticence or not - I do not to continue watching a show when I know that their intention is to force me to sit through the storyline they're hell-bent on showing off while stringing me along for the developments I actually want to see. Arrow is one of my favorite shows, but I'm seriously contemplating whether the promise of the stories I actually want to see is worth the aggravating pile with which I'm currently being presented. If the EPs are determined to prove that the audience is not the boss of them, fine, but it just makes me want to prove that they're not the boss of me either.

I don't believe the Doctor with the straw is younger than the one who just "died" in the Tessalecta. The Tessalecta!Doctor brings everybody (including older River, who knows what's coming) together on the beach (inadvertently mentioning that's aged 200 years since Amy last saw him), the space suit containing younger River shows up, and Tessalecta!Doctor "dies". His friends set a funeral pyre with the help of Canton Everett Delaware III, then return to the diner, where they encounter SpecialStraw!Doctor, who claims an age that is not much older than the last Amy saw him. River slaps him, because (1) she was just forced to watch her younger self "kill" the Doctor, but also (2) she needs Amy and Rory, and even this younger SpecialStraw!Doctor, to believe that she's just as much in the dark about what's going on as they are. Having done that, they proceed to solve the 1969 mystery, which is the goal Tessalecta!Doctor had in mind by gathering them all together (in addition to giving Amy the memory she would need to know when time went wrong (ocurring in the season finale for the audience) and giving younger River proof that he didn't hold her actions against her). Once they had defeated the Silence (or so they thought), SpecialStraw!Doctor returns River to her cell, she lays one on him, and he's completely taken aback -- which continues with the seasonal theme of the Doctor and River not quite being on the same page about each other. I think SpecialStraw!Doctor is so goofy, and then so surly, because for all the secrets the Doctor keeps, he really does not like people keeping secrets from him. (And since he has not yet learned who River is, it's easier for him to turn his irritation on her than anyone else in the group.)

Point of No Return ++ The Real Ghostbusters -- Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid -- 41 - The End 39 - Dark Side of the Moon 39 - Changing Channels 31 - The Song Remains the Same 31 - Point of No Return 29- Hammer of the Gods 27 - Good God, Y'All 19 - The Real Ghostbusters 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 11 - Two Minutes to Midnight 11 - My Bloody Valentine 09 - The Curious Case of Dean Winchester 01 - Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song

Point of No Return ++ The Song Remains the Same ++ The Curious Case of Dean Winchester -- 41 - The End 39 - Dark Side of the Moon 39 - Changing Channels 29 - Point of No Return 29 - The Song Remains the Same 27- Hammer of the Gods 25 - Good God, Y'All 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 19 - The Real Ghostbusters 11 - The Curious Case of Dean Winchester 11 - Two Minutes to Midnight 11 - My Bloody Valentine 07 - Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song

Barry's mom will always be Psych!Dean to me from the Supernatural epidode where Sam and Dean got themselves comitted to a psych ward for a case.

The opening scene from the Season 3 premiere. Loved every bit of it: Oliver's leap onto the moving truck, "So it is 'roger'," the teamwork -- and of course, "You Have Failed. This. City." Hee.

-- The Real Ghostbusters -- The Curious Case of Dean Winchester -- Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid 39 - The End 39 - Dark Side of the Moon 39 - Changing Channels 29 - Good God, Y'All 29 - Point of No Return 27 - The Song Remains the Same 25 - Hammer of the Gods 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 17 - The Real Ghostbusters 17 - Two Minutes to Midnight 13 - My Bloody Valentine 11 - The Curious Case of Dean Winchester 09 - Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future Swan Song

I didn't get that from my viewing either. But in the one Guggenheim interview I didn't stop myself from reading after the episode aired he said that Diggle's "you were right" to Oliver meant that Diggle was leaving the team (although that's not at all obvious onscreen).edited to delete because I forgot which thread I was in.

From the 3.01 Episode Thread: Hmm. Between this idea and Sara's unexpected fall, suddenly that first Season 3 poster makes so much more sense...

I don't know about non-issue, but it's pretty much the same issue: instead of the symbolism of the mask falling off Sarah and landing at Laurel's feet, we have the symbolism of the only thing between Laurel and the mask being Sarah's prone body. Neither one of those is really appropriate. Should have just left the mask alone, guys.

Got it. -- Swan Song -- The Real Ghostbusters -- Hammer of the Gods 39 - The End 39 - Dark Side of the Moon 39 - Changing Channels 31 - Good God, Y'All 31 - Point of No Return 27 - The Song Remains the Same 23 - Hammer of the Gods 19 - The Real Ghostbusters 19 - Sam, Interrupted 19 - Abandon All Hope 19 - Two Minutes to Midnight 15 - My Bloody Valentine 15 - The Curious Case of Dean Winchester 13 - Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid 03 - Swan Song Trapped in the box with Lucifer and Michael Fallen Idols Swap Meat The Devil You Know Sympathy for the Devil Free to Be You and Me 99 Problems I Believe the Children Are Our Future