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Batwoman Spoilers and Speculation


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So I'm guessing they're done with the Alice in Wonderland quotes as the episode naming scheme? Aw, I'll miss that. But it seems like Alice isn't going to be the main threat this season, so I guess it makes sense.

I really hope the writers have thought out what happened to Kate and how someone could just "stumble upon" the Batsuit. Because if she got kidnapped, why leave the suit behind? Or if Kate herself had to ditch it (why??), I'm sure she would have a least tried to make sure it was secure, or tried to get it back to someone she trusts.

Edited by Trini
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Media outlets were given the first two episodes of the new season to screen in advance...

‘Batwoman’ season 2 premiere screener secrets: Gotham’s new hero rises
BY JAY SNOW   JANUARY 4, 2021
https://www.hypable.com/batwoman-season-2-premiere-screener/ 

‘Batwoman’ Finds a New Identity — and Purpose — in Season 2
By Alex Zalben   Jan 4, 2021
https://decider.com/2021/01/04/batwoman-season-2-review/ 

SPOILER FREE REVIEW OF BATWOMAN SEASON 2 PREMIERE
Melissa K    1/4/2021
https://batwoman.tv/spoiler-free-review-of-batwoman-season-2-premiere 

Edited by tv echo
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2.02 synopsis:

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"Prior Criminal History" - ...

DOWNRIGHT BATTY - After her quick spin in the Batgear, Ryan Wilder (Javicia Leslie) is back to facing the daily challenges of life as herself. Meanwhile, Alice (Rachel Skarsten) has a new, devious plan to get the attention of both Gotham and Safiyah (guest star Shivaani Ghai). With Kate still missing and the city in an uprising, Luke (Camrus Johnson) and Mary (Nicole Kang) are desperate to find a stand in. In a pinch, Ryan dons the suit again and comes face-to-face with Alice for the first time. Back at Crows Headquarters, Sophie and Commander Kane try to uncover who may have had a vendetta against Kate.

Carl Seaton directed the episode written by James Stoteraux and Chad Fiveash (#202).

Original airdate 1/24/2021.

 

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https://ew.com/tv/batwoman-season-2-safiyah-first-look/

 

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"She's not what we expected from season 1," Ghai tells EW. "She does come across as someone who is quite charming and kind. She has a definite soft spot for Alice. You will learn as we go on that there's definitely a much deeper relationship there."

...

"In season 2, Alice starts the season with nothing left to lose, so her perspective of Safiyah shifts a little bit," says Batwoman showrunner Caroline Dries. "She's less afraid because she's got [Safiyah] in her sights, and what does she have to lose? Her whole plan for killing her sister went down the drain."

Dries is particularly excited for audiences to see Ghai and Skarsten's first scene together. "Their dynamic is amazing, because Alice is [normally] the strongest, most manipulative person in the room. And when she's with Safiyah, she's a little differential to Safiyah," says the producer. "It's a new dynamic and it's very intriguing to watch."

 

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Main villain #2:

https://ew.com/tv/batwoman-season-2-black-mask-big-bad/

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EW has learned that Black Mask — the notoriously ruthless Gotham City crime boss who recently appeared in Birds of Prey — will be a major villain in season 2. His menacing presence was first teased in the superhero drama's official season 2 synopsis, which revealed that the False Face Society, Black Mask's gang in the pages of DC Comics, "tightens its grip on Gotham distributing a perilous new drug known as Snakebite" in the new episodes.

"We have a couple big bads this season," Batwoman showrunner Caroline Dries tells EW. "One, [who] we teed up midway through last season, is this woman Safiyah, and she's sort of Alice's Achilles' Heel. And ultimately yes with the False Face Society, we will see the leader of this gang as Black Mask later on in the season."

While we don't know who will play the sadistic crime lord, we do know that new Batwoman Ryan Wilder (Javicia Leslie) — who takes on the Crimson Knight's mantle following Kate Kane's disappearance — will have a major problem to pick with him because of her experience with drugs.

"While Ryan never used drugs, she was in a relationship where somebody was using drugs and it's ultimately what got Ryan put away in jail. So, it's this idea that Ryan is this innocent woman and if she were white, per se, she might not have had the same punishment [that] she, as an innocent Black woman, had to go through. That's a huge piece of her backstory, so that's something we're exploring this year," says Dries. "Batwoman has this particular vendetta against the False Face Society because the idea of drugs permeating the city and nobody taking any responsibility for it strikes at her core."

 

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2.03 synopsis:

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"Bat Girl Magic!" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-14, LV) (HDTV)

NEW HERO, NEW SUIT - As Ryan Wilder (Javicia Leslie) continues to prove herself as Batwoman, she encounters the challenge of every superhero - living a double life. Mary (Nicole Kang) is still Team Ryan, while Luke (Camrus Johnson) continues to have reservations - especially when Ryan makes some alterations and unveils a new Batsuit!

Meanwhile, Victor Szasz (guest star Alex Morf) is slashing his way through the city streets, and Commander Kane (Dougray Scott) has The Crows trying to stop the flow of Snakebite through Gotham. Safiyah (guest star Shivaani Ghai) takes notice of Alice's (Rachel Skarsten) antics and Sophie (Meagan Tandy) finds herself in unexpected circumstances.

Holly Dale directed the episode written by Nancy Kiu (#203). Original airdate 1/31/2021.

 

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Luke/Ryan will butt heads over leadership

According to Dries, Luke will be reluctant to accept Wilder as the new Batwoman since it would also mean accepting that Kate is dead. “He really struggles with that,” Dries adds. “Nothing against Ryan, it’s that he doesn’t want to say goodbye to Kate. As Ryan and Luke’s dynamic starts off with some friction, it will evolve into a real brother-sister dynamic. But ultimately, Ryan has to put her foot down to be like, ‘Look, I’m the one who wears the symbol. I’m the one who takes the bullets. I’m the one who’s putting herself literally in harm’s way, so I’m the leader here. I’m Batwoman.’ They become deferential to her, but there’s always that push and pull. Everyone has opinions in that batcave.”

https://tvline.com/2021/01/17/batwoman-recap-season-2-premiere-javicia-leslie-kate-ryan/

Which....yeah, I wouldnt take orders from someone whose been doing it for a hot minute, even if they are in the field.

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Batwoman to tackle BLM though Ryan/Sophie: https://tvline.com/2021/01/20/batwoman-season-2-javicia-leslie-black-lives-matter/

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As we saw in the Season 1 finale when Jacob Kane, caught on camera, ordered his Crows to open fire on Kate Kane’s Batwoman, there’s nothing really standing in their way. Ryan will take issue with the organization, which possess an uncomfortable stronghold over Gotham, and those who are a part of it.

“I think at the end of the day, if you’re part of an institution that you know is not being held accountable for what’s wrong, are you a part of the problem? And that’s something that Ryan forces Sophie to really look at,” Leslie tells TVLine. “Yeah, you say that you’re different, but are you really different when you know that there are people that you work with killing people and not being held accountable for those acts just because they’re considered police?”

Ryan and Sophie share a few commonalities: They’re both Black and lesbian, and they seek to protect the innocent. But with Sophie working for the Crows and Ryan firmly against what they currently stand for, these two won’t be working together so much as they’ll be butting heads this season. 

“It’s not about Sophie being Black, it’s not about Sophie being a woman… It’s not about Sophie being a lesbian. They could have a million things in common [but] at the end of the day, [she] works for The Man, and Ryan can’t get with that.”

Ryan will likely cause Sophie to have more deeper storylines, though why it took Ryan to be born for the writers to give Sophie these types of storylines is sad.

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Erasing Kate Kane was a mistake. If the ratings for S2 prove anything, it’s that more people were interested in watching when the real Batwoman was on the show.

Replacing her with some random OC was not the right way to go. Hopefully the producers realise this and can recast the Kate Kane role mid season and give the character back her mantle.

Edited by rogvortex58
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26 minutes ago, rogvortex58 said:

If the ratings for S2 prove anything, it’s that more people were interested in watching when the real Batwoman was on the show.

Maybe? Pretty much all of the Arrowverse shows saw a steady decline in ratings/live viewers from season to season. The one exception was the third season of Arrow, where the live views got a bit of a boost thanks largely to guest appearances from The Flash's Barry Allen, before starting to decline again in season four and later, and the ratings (as distinct from live viewers) on Arrow which, as Marc Guggenheim kept telling us, remained steady for five seasons before collapsing.

But otherwise, Flash, Supergirl, and Legends of Tomorrow continued to bleed viewers and ratings every season, and Arrow bled viewers in season 2, and then started losing them again in seasons 4 through 8.  And that's with Flash mostly keeping the same cast, Supergirl keeping the same lead and two main supporting cast members, Arrow keeping the same lead, and Legends of Tomorrow keeping two of the original ensemble cast.  Recasting didn't improve Batwoman's numbers, sure, but I'm not sure that's the entire reason for the decline, either?

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Its hard to blame the shows sharp decline on one thing. It premiered against nfl games. The s1 finale had roughly 730k in viewers. S1 isn't on Netflix where it could gain that audience. All American rose to season highs in s3 premiere so its possible.  But then you also have people who may not have watched because it isn't Kate and then others because it isn't Kate and the new lead is black. 

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2.04 synopsis:

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"Fair Skin, Blue Eyes" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-14, LV) (HDTV)

NOT EASILY FORGOTTEN - As Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) attempts to fight the proliferation of Snake Bite through Gotham, a random encounter forces her to revisit her painful past. Empowered by her new role, Ryan Wilder is determined to ensure others like her don't go unnoticed. Meanwhile, those closest to Kate are given a good reason to believe she is still alive, forcing unexpected alliances and betrayals. Also starring Dougray Scott, Rachel Skarsten, Meagan Tandy, Nicole Kang and Camrus Johnson.

Menhaj Huda directed the episode written by Ebony Gilbert (#204). Original airdate 2/14/2021.

 

Alliances, yes! Betrayals, noooo.

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From EW's interview with Shivaani Ghai:

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But I think it's quite interesting when you do meet Safiyah. She's not Alice's big enemy. I think we also begin to see why Alice is the way she is, how she's come to be, how she transitioned from Beth to Alice. We'll start to see that through what unravels on Coryana [in episode 3].

...

Up until reading episode 8, I wasn't sure if my character was gonna have many dealings with other characters on the show. But episode 8, which is set up, you do see I have a little meeting with Batwoman [Javicia Leslie]. Also, there's a meeting with Sophie. I was just joking to my husband about this before actually: Safiyah loves a beautiful strong woman, and I think she loves the women from Gotham. She's getting to meet them all, and I think she's very taken with them. I think that's quite, quite interesting.

 

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2.05 synopsis:

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"Gore on Canvas" -

THE SECRETS UNDERNEATH - Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) is approached by Commander Kane (Dougray Scott) and Agent Moore (Meagan Tandy) to boost an infamous work of art that reveals the way to Coryana - and Kate. Despite her reservations, Luke (Camrus Johnson) and Mary (Nicole Kang) convince Ryan to take the assignment, causing tensions within the Bat-team to escalate.

Meanwhile, as Alice (Rachel Skarsten) attempts to fulfill Safiyah's (guest star Shivaani Ghai) insidious request, she slowly discovers that she may not remember everything about her time on Coryana.

Norma Bailey directed the episode written by Daniel Thomsen (#205). Original airdate 2/21/2021.

 

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2.06 synopsis:

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"Do Not Resuscitate" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-14, LV) (HDTV)

IT ALL COMES BACK AROUND - As Ryan Wilder's (Javicia Leslie) Kryptonite wound grows more severe, it hinders Batwoman's ability to protect Gotham. Growing interest in reproducing the serum from the Desert Rose puts Mary's (Nicole Kang) and Commander Kane's (Dougray Scott) lives in danger.

Meanwhile, Alice's (Rachel Skarsten) reunion with a fellow Coryana inhabitant presents unexpected complications. Also starring Meagan Tandy and Camrus Johnson.

Holly Dale directed the episode written by Caroline Dries and Daphne Miles (#206). Original airdate 2/28/2021.

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It sucks that there isn't going to be a Batwoman/Supergirl crossover this year(/ever?). I assume this kryptonite poisoning subplot was something planned before they had to replace Ruby Rose and before Covid messed up the filming schedule; they probably wanted a mini crossover early in the season.

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2.07 synopsis:

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"It's Best You Stop Digging" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-14, V) (HDTV)

CROSSING THE LINE - As Ryan's (Javicia Leslie) condition worsens, she questions Batwoman's "no killing" code when she realizes the opportunity to avenge her mother is slipping away. Tatiana (guest star Leah Gibson) fills in the gaps for Alice (Rachel Skarsten) about her time on Coryana and her history with Ocean (guest star Nathan Owens). Also starring Dougray Scott, Meagan Tandy, Nicole Kang and Camrus Johnson.

Avi Youabian directed the episode written by Jerry Shandy (#207). Original airdate 3/14/2021.

 

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(edited)

2.08 synopsis:

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"Survived Much Worse" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-PG, V) (HDTV)

A SURPRISE AT EVERY TURN - Batwoman's (Javicia Leslie) abilities are tested like never before, while Alice's (Rachel Skarsten) search for Kate continues. Sophie (Meagan Tandy) and Jacob (Dougray Scott) set their sights on Coryana, and Luke (Camrus Johnson) and Mary (Nicole Kang) contend with an unexpected guest.

Holly Dale directed the episode written by Natalie Abrams (#208). Original airdate 3/21/2021.

 

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Hmm - vague. Maybe it's one of those key episodes where all the plot twists happen. In a normal season this would have been the mid-season 'finale'.

Edited by Trini
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2.09 synopsis:
 

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"Rule #1" -

THE CHOICES WE MAKE - Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) confronts Gotham's biggest foe, while new information forces those closest to Kate to make some difficult decisions. Ryan's feelings for Angelique (guest star Bevin Bru) puts her partnership with Luke (Camrus Johnson) and Mary (Nicole Kang) at risk, while Alice (Rachel Skarsten) goes on a warped walk down memory lane. Also starring Dougray Scott and Meagan Tandy.

Michael Blundell directed the episode written by Nancy Kiu and Maya Houston (#209). Original airdate 3/28/2021.

 

 

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"Gotham's biggest foe"? Alice? Joker?? Probably not either of those. Will it be Black Mask and this is the episode introducing him?

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On 3/12/2021 at 3:43 PM, Trini said:

THE CHOICES WE MAKE - Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) confronts Gotham's biggest foe, while new information forces those closest to Kate to make some difficult decisions. Ryan's feelings for Angelique (guest star Bevin Bru) puts her partnership with Luke (Camrus Johnson) and Mary (Nicole Kang) at risk, while Alice (Rachel Skarsten) goes on a warped walk down memory lane. Also starring Dougray Scott and Meagan Tandy.

Angelique is STILL around. You would think after this past episode that Ryan would get a clue that this relationship isn't meant to last. If Ryan's relationship with Luke and Mary gets strained, it is her fault.  Ryan has to let her go.

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Well, I guess this new casting explains why Gracyn Shinyei (young Kate) and Ava Sleeth (young Beth) were on set filming together again. Most likely for flashbacks.

I thought I would be pleased. But to bring Kate back now, only to deny her the Batwoman mantle, is really just more insults by the writers towards her character. Because they already made their choice to replace her with the OC.
 

I don’t know why they hate her so much.

Edited by rogvortex58
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Black Mask cast:

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Batwoman has cast the man under Black Mask: Peter Outerbridge (Nikita, The Expanse) will recur as the villainous character throughout the rest of Season 2, TVLine has confirmed.

Outerbridge will play Roman Sionis, the head of Janus Cosmetics, who plays the white knight role against Gotham’s corrupt systems by day. But as his Black Mask alter ego, Roman is an evil mastermind with a deep hatred of The Crows and masked vigilantes, willing to destroy the city to get his revenge.

“His philosophy is all institutions, all systems can be corrupted, and it’s ironic because that’s kind of Batwoman’s philosophy, too. They just go about dealing with it in very different ways,” showrunner Caroline Dries told TVLine. “He leans into the sadistic, so everything with him is a little darker, a little scarier, and he’s definitely a force to be reckoned with.”

https://tvline.com/2021/03/25/batwoman-peter-outerbridge-black-mask-season-2/

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After a week off, the show is back with episode 2.10:

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"Time Off For Good Behavior" -

CAN'T GET YOU OUT OF MY HEAD - As Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) focuses even more effort on taking down Black Mask (guest star Peter Outerbridge), a new foe emerges, diverting the Bat team's attention to a distressing issue in Gotham. Continually haunted by the mistakes of his past, Jacob (Dougray Scott) travels down a dangerous path in an attempt to eradicate them. Alice (Rachel Skarsten) and Julia (guest star Christina Wolfe) discover they have an enemy in common.

Also starring Meagan Tandy, Nicole Kang and Camrus Johnson.

Eric Dean Seaton directed the episode written by James Stoteraux and Chad Fiveash (#210). Original airdate 4/11/21.

 

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4 hours ago, quarks said:

Are the mistakes of his past whatever choices Dougray Scott made that landed him in this role that he visibly has no interest in whatsoever?

 

He should call up Quentin and Joe West and start a "my family is involved in vigilantism/superheroics" cop dad support group

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Nope. Don't like this one bit.

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“He does have big plans for Kate Kane, and what they are is pretty horrifying,” Peter Outerbridge (V-Wars, Nikita), who plays Black Mask, teases. “When you take a beloved character like that and then you put her in a basement, you torture her, you burn off her face…. It’s just awful. I think the fans are going to be going, ‘Oh, my God.’

“Imagine taking James Bond and just torturing James Bond for hours and hours,” he adds. “Audiences aren’t gonna like Black Mask very much at all. It only gets worse.”

Black Mask’s treatment of Kate may have something to do with his daughter, who he believes was killed by Kate as Batwoman. Outerbridge confirms that revenge might be a factor in Black Mask’s plans for her, “but not in the way you might think. It’s complicated.” While we don’t yet know what he exactly has in store, it’s clear that Enigma (who is the Riddler’s daughter in the comics) will be involved in that.

“Enigma is certainly a big part of the plan,” Outerbridge adds. “But you’re going to have to wait and see.”

https://tvline.com/2021/03/28/batwoman-recap-season-2-episode-9-peter-outerbridge-black-mask-kate-kane/

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2.11 synopsis:

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"Arrive Alive" - (8:00-9:00 p.m. ET) (TV-PG, LV) (HDTV)

FAST AND FURIOUS - With Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) and The Crows each hot on the trail of the False Face Society, their efforts collide, and tension escalates. Alice (Rachel Skarsten) seeks out Enigma (guest star Laura Mennell), and Sophie (Meagan Tandy) and Ryan find some common ground. Also starring Dougray Scott, Nicole Kang and Camrus Johnson.

Mairzee Almas directed the episode written by Daniel Thomsen and Daphne Miles (episode #211). Original airdate 4/18/2021.

 

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The first episode with Wallis Day?

2.12 synopsis:

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"Initiate Self-Destruct" - (9:00-10:00 p.m. ET) (TV-PG, LV) (HDTV)

WE ALL WEAR MASKS - Ryan (Javicia Leslie) is faced with a difficult decision that could expose her as Batwoman, creating a rift in the Bat Team.

Meanwhile, Black Mask's (guest star Peter Outerbridge) plans for Kate Kane (Wallis Day) begin to unfold. Alice (Rachel Skarsten) is reunited with someone from her past, and Sophie (Meagan Tandy) must decide where her loyalty lies. Also starring Dougray Scott, Nicole Kang and Camrus Johnson.

Glen Winter directed the episode with a story by Zack Siddiqui and teleplay by Jerry Shandy (#212). Original airdate 5/2/21.

 

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On 4/15/2021 at 11:54 PM, Trini said:

Also this is apparently a comics character; from Superherohype's reporting:

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The CW has debuted a new set of promotional photos for the upcoming eleventh episode of Batwoman season 2. The next installment will see the live-action debut of Russell Tavaroff, as portrayed by Jesse Hutch. In the comics, Russell was close to Lucas Fox before getting exposed to Snakebite — an offshoot of Bane’s Venom serum. He went on to become the villain known as Menace. Russell is also obsessed with ruining the life of his old friend.

In the live-action adaptation, it appears that he is one of Jacob Kane’s Crows, which may give him a different origin story. ...

 

2.md.jpg

Edited by Trini
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2.13 synopsis:

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"I'll Give You A Clue" - (9:00-10:00 p.m. ET) (TV-PG, V) (HDTV)

GAME NIGHT - When Sophie (Meagan Tandy) must face a foe from her rookie days with The Crows, Ryan (Javicia Leslie), Mary (Nicole Kang) and Luke (Camrus Johnson) are also pulled into the villain's game.

Meanwhile, the tables turn on Alice (Rachel Skarsten) when she finds herself in dire circumstances, and Jacob (Dougray Scott) continues to revisit the past.

Marshall Virtue directed the episode written by Caroline Dries and Natalie Abrams (#213). Original airdate 5/9/21.

 

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2.14 synopsis:

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"Within the Limitations" - (9:00-10:00 p.m. ET) (TV-14, LV) (HDTV)

HUNGRY FOR MORE - Batwoman (Javicia Leslie) is faced with a new challenge when Gotham's Snakebite addicts become ravenous for more than the next fix. Also starring Dougray Scott, Rachel Skarsten, Meagan Tandy, Nicole Kang and Camrus Johnson.

Rob Duncan directed the episode written by Ebony Gilbert and Maya Houston (#214). Original airdate 5/16/2021.

 

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So... they've already done a (psuedo-) vampire, is it zombies? Although it sounds like vampires.

Edited by Trini
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1 minute ago, Primal Slayer said:

Has she? I know Oracle was name dropped on Arrow I think? 

That's what I was referring to,  yeah,  of course since this Stephanie is a red head maybe she's Oracle. 

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