Felicity Smoak: Bitch With Wifi

[Guest]

I think Felicity is definitely less morally conflicted on the team. She is very means to an end oriented. Except in her refusal to fire people.

As for codenames, I'd be okay with Firewall. Or something similarly techy. Not Proxy.

 

Exactly. Once she had her eyes opened to the nature of their work on the team, she didn't even mind the body count but only when it was necessary. I don't think this means she wanted Oliver to keep killing people but it was less of a big deal to her than when she first started on the team. I think she'd always prefer to find another way first but there won't always be another way. Case in point: when she asked him to kill Ra's. She knew that was the only solution.

 

Also, I like the idea of her codename being something tech based. But I'm pretty down with Watchtower.

[Delphi]

I don't mind Watchtower, but I think people will freak and the Chloe Sullivan clone comments will begin all over again and I am way to old to be yelling at annoying people on the world wide web.

[dtissagirl]

I'm not opposed to Watchtower either, but I would really like to keep Chloe and Felicity separated if I can.

[calliope1975]

I don't know if Codebreaker really works, but I like it because Felicity herself has used it. OR, I want to know what her hacker name was because you know she had one in college.

[kismet]

Delphi works. :DDD

I like Delphi... too. Its a nice play on Oracle, since they probably will never be able to use Oracle. However, with our luck one of OQ's exes will be named Delphi or Delphine. I can just see the writers making that season's villain abduct and torture her d/t wrong identity causing TA to spiral into guilt.

 

You give these writers an inch and they steamroll a mile into the overdramatics :)

I'm not opposed to Watchtower either, but I would really like to keep Chloe and Felicity separated if I can.

I feel like Watchtower was Chloe's name/thing and I think it should remain special to her. We don't need to copy Smallville, we already have the sleeveless costume. Although it is a cool name.

[dtissagirl]

The one thing I love about "Watchtower" as a codename is that it can be shortened to "Tower" if need be [like, say, on emergency comms and you have 2 seconds to say "TOWER, ABORT!"], and it still works.

[tarotx]

LOL Chloe already (kind of?) having the name watchtower is one of the reasons I like it for Felicity. Watchtower was endgame for Oliver and it kind of solidifies the argument that Oliver has other options than Black Canary.

Edited October 16, 2015 by tarotx

[Guest]

I never watched Smallville so I didn't know Chloe was called Watchtower. Hmm. I understand the need to keep the two separate. Back to the drawing board then? LOL.

[statsgirl]

I like Dephi (nod to Oracle which we'll never get) or Hacker.  Oliver already assigns Overwatch to one of the team (e.g. Roy in Guilty) and I don't want her mistaken for Chloe with Watchtower.  I don't understand Lighthouse since a lighthouse is on the dangerous rocks and Felicity is Home Safe.

Okay, I don't like the new set-up where I can't see when a character thread has been updated. This is weird. How are we supposed to track conversations and threads when we can't see them?!

Same here.  It means clicking to another page and I miss stuff.

Edited October 17, 2015 by statsgirl

[BkWurm1]

Okay, I don't like the new set-up where I can't see when a character thread has been updated. This is weird. How are we supposed to track conversations and threads when we can't see them?!

 

The little conversation bubble to the right of the Characters Sub Forum on the main page is only yellow when there are unread updates.  So, that's a pretty good way to know there's new stuff to read. 

[kismet]

It kinda does stink to have to click into a different page. But I have noticed two positives. 1. You can actually see all the characters on one page, likewise the other Arrow section is also only 1 page now. So that's good. And 2. It's kind of a fun guessing game as to which character got the magic updates.

 

It will be an adjustment. But so far it hasn't been too bad to navigate both on the mobile or desktop theme. :)

[statsgirl]

The little conversation bubble to the right of the Characters Sub Forum on the main page is only yellow when there are unread updates.  So, that's a pretty good way to know there's new stuff to read. 

But you have to read through all the conversations before it goes back to normal colour.  So if you're only interested in some of the characters (e.g. Diggle etc) and not others (e.g. Quentin or Roy) you still have to click on those threads every time there is a new post in them otherwise the bubble stays yellow.

[Starfish35]

If you follow threads, it will show in your notifications that there are new posts in those threads.

[Guest]

The little conversation bubble to the right of the Characters Sub Forum on the main page is only yellow when there are unread updates.  So, that's a pretty good way to know there's new stuff to read. 

 

Thank you! I had no idea. Still not sure I like it though but I'm sure I'll adapt! :)

[tarotx]

Oh cool I didn't know-Thanks :) I personally like having the Arrow characters in their own mini folder but then again I read all the threads so It's just easier to keep everything neat as I read and go in and out of the threads. But this will be healthful for other forums where I only read news and/or spoilers. 

If you follow threads, it will show in your notifications that there are new posts in those threads.

[Morrigan2575]

Felicity talking about an "outside" straight in the episode.

 

Can someone give me a run down of what they were saying exactly?  I know that Curtis said there's no such thing as an Outside Straight in Poker but IIRC there are both Inside and Outside Straight Draws.  Unless she was talking about a specific Game of Poker (Texas Hold Em, vs 5/7 Card Draw vs 5/7 Card Stud)?

 

Going back to generalities, I could see Felicity growing up in Vegas and not knowing Poker...just because you gamble doesn't mean you know every game (I have no idea how to play Pai Gow or Baccarat). and I've probably forgotten everything I ever learned about Craps.  I can see Felicity knowing/playing Black Jack since she was busted for Counting Cards.  That's straight up numbers, 6 deck shoe, you know how many cards of each type in the shoe, and you see every card so you can do the math to figure out what's left and calculate your percentages.  However, with Poker it's about reading people as well as calculating percentages.  I could see Felicity learning/playing Black Jack while avoiding Poker.

Edited October 22, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[kismet]

Most gamblers and Casino regulars have their games. So I can understand why FS may be better at one more so than the other. The poker exchange didn't bother me. EBR delivery of "its my jam" was adorable. I also personally have no idea how to really play poker, so I figured she might be getting the references wrong - which only increased the funny for me. Plus, I just assumed it was put in to make CH seem more like a know-it-all. And unlike s3, the humor was not lost on the exchange.

 

I also love how FS is both a great lie detector & a horrible liar all at the same time. It's been a consistent character trait from s1 until now. She can keep secrets or more specifically information secret, but she can't lie about it when confronted. It's sorta perfect for humorous exchanges.

[Guest]

When I first watched the episode I thought they messed up when Felicity said she couldn't play poker, especially since it's canon that she can count cards and grew up in Vegas. But I suppose it's not exactly that much of a stretch that she only learned a couple of things. Maybe she was more interested in her computers anyway.

 

I did really love that she was doing to Curtis what Oliver used to do to her in early s1 though. They're both bad at thinking up excuses and should probably work on them. LOL.

[tv echo]

From MG's tumblr at http://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/post/131726289849/im-really-loving-the-scenes-with-felicity-and

elizajanelewisgirl asked:
I'm really loving the scenes with Felicity and Curtis Holt, they are so much fun!! One question though, Felicity knows how to play poker clearly, why did she get tripped up on her cover story? (It's pretty funny watching her give just as awful excuses to Curtis as Oliver did to her in season 1 though)

She was flustered.  She doesn’t lie often.

Edited October 23, 2015 by tv echo

[statsgirl]

MG's response sounds a bit defensive, especially to someone who liked that Felicity had as much trouble lying as Oliver did. Surely they didn't forget?

 

Now that OTA is back, so is Felicity's ponytail. Nice.

[Guest]

From MG's tumblr at http://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/post/131726289849/im-really-loving-the-scenes-with-felicity-and

 

Hmm. She didn't actually come across all that flustered tbh but I'll accept this explanation. I really did enjoy the parallel between her lying to Curtis and Oliver lying to her in s1. It was cute. 

[kismet]

So I'm watching s3 on DVD, don't know why I am torturing myself but that's another question for another day. Anyway, was watching one of the deleted scenes and FS's roommate told her to be the "Ninja Hacker Goddess" we all know she is. And I thought, that is a spot-on wonderful description of her. I know that "Bitch with Wifi" holds a special place in the FS/Arrow fandom, but sometimes I wish she had a better character thread title that was a little more positive and not as negative with the word Bitch. That being said, it's not a horrible title, I kinda like the snark of it just like I liked it in the actual show :)

[Guest]

I like that. 'Ninja Hacker Goddess.' Sounds about right. I also love 'Bitch with WiFi' though because she took the negative way the guy called her a bitch and spun into something else. 

[Morrigan2575]

That's cool but I really loved the Bitch with WiFi line so I'd prefer to keep that as the thread title. Felicity is an HBIC, I see nothing wrong or negative about the title, personally.

Edited October 28, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[tv echo]

CWFanTalk (on CWSeed - recording not yet posted) for last night's episode of The Flash had as its special guest, DC Comics Creative Director Dan Evans, who said:

 

"Felicity Smoak was just a minor character and now she's just - EVERYBODY loves her."

 

Source: https://twitter.com/CammienRay/status/659150943481700352

Edited October 28, 2015 by tv echo

[Guest]

CWFanTalk (on CWSeed - recording not yet posted) for last night's episode of The Flash had as its special guest, DC Comics Creative Director Dan Evans, who said:

 

"Felicity Smoak was just a minor character and now she's just - EVERYBODY loves her."

 

Source: https://twitter.com/CammienRay/status/659150943481700352

 

I LOVE THIS. And yeah, before anyone jumps on this, we know not EVERYONE loves Felicity but it's super cool to hear the DC Comics Creative Director say this. I'm really pleased she's being recognized because she deserves it.

[Chaser]

What I like about it, is the DC Comics Creative Director would have access to behind the scenes data. It says something if they say this character is popular.

[dtissagirl]

Also: people at the parent companies [DC, CW, WB] having the perception that everyone loves Felicity is actually more important than everyone actively loving her.

[Chaser]

Can you expland on that?

Edited October 28, 2015 by 10Eleven12

[dtissagirl]

Let's see if I can do this without referring to other fans.

 

There was talk after S3 about how Felicity's popularity took a hit. Not too much talk about it, mind you, but definitely some talk about it. Except... from everything I see from DC Comics, from the WB, and from the CW... that notion has never reached them.

 

And from doing some rudimentary social media tracking on Arrow because I like stats? I can see why they don't see it.  Whatever negative buzz there is about Felicity? It doesn't reach the parent companies to a point where it affects their view that the character is massively beloved, because the positive buzz is overwhelmingly larger. So TPTB are still operating under the impression that everyone loves Felicity. Because what "everyone" truly means here is trackable data on social media.

[Guest]

I remember seeing a graph someone had made of the name tags on Twitter over a week period and Felicity Smoak gets mentioned more than Oliver Queen and it's mostly positive tweets too. I know social media is only a small part of the larger picture but that's the kind of thing they like to see.

[dtissagirl]

Here, Topsy lets everyone see the previous 30 days of Twitter activity:

 

3 different searches:

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=Laurel%20Lance&via=Topsy

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23Arrow%20Felicity&q2=%23Arrow%20Oliver&q3=%23Arrow%20Laurel&via=Topsy

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23FelicitySmoak&q2=%23OliverQueen&q3=%23LaurelLance&via=Topsy

 

Those spikes are the days Arrow aired. If you hover over the points, you can see the most popular tweet of that day.

[Chaser]

I never knew you could see the top tweet. This is fun.

[Guest]

Here, Topsy lets everyone see the previous 30 days of Twitter activity:

 

3 different searches:

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=Laurel%20Lance&via=Topsy

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23Arrow%20Felicity&q2=%23Arrow%20Oliver&q3=%23Arrow%20Laurel&via=Topsy

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23FelicitySmoak&q2=%23OliverQueen&q3=%23LaurelLance&via=Topsy

 

Those spikes are the days Arrow aired. If you hover over the points, you can see the most popular tweet of that day.

 

Yeah, that's the graph I saw! Couldn't remember the name of it though. Pretty interesting, right? :)

[dtissagirl]

Twitter is TV's BFF right now. So much so that Twitter is launching a whole new feature solely for livetweeting + discussing TV shows: http://variety.com/2015/digital/news/twitter-adds-new-tv-discovery-features-starts-opening-the-gates-for-tv-timelines-1201603329/

 

So this is not "just social media". This is relevant data to anyone creating/promoting TV right now. Felicity being the most popular character of Arrow on Twitter is important.

[BkWurm1]

Twitter is TV's BFF right now. So much so that Twitter is launching a whole new feature solely for livetweeting + discussing TV shows: http://variety.com/2015/digital/news/twitter-adds-new-tv-discovery-features-starts-opening-the-gates-for-tv-timelines-1201603329/

 

So this is not "just social media". This is relevant data to anyone creating/promoting TV right now. Felicity being the most popular character of Arrow on Twitter is important.

Rather conclusive reassurance when one has the occasional fear of the grave induced moment.  :)

[wingster55]

Twitter is TV's BFF right now. So much so that Twitter is launching a whole new feature solely for livetweeting + discussing TV shows: http://variety.com/2015/digital/news/twitter-adds-new-tv-discovery-features-starts-opening-the-gates-for-tv-timelines-1201603329/

So this is not "just social media". This is relevant data to anyone creating/promoting TV right now. Felicity being the most popular character of Arrow on Twitter is important.

Seems the search #Arrow Oliver got more hits /nitpick.

But don't see how that makes her safe. Especially if they choose to go the Whedon route.

[dtissagirl]

Seems the search #Arrow Oliver got more hits /nitpick.

 

It didn't 5 days ago when I posted, but the numbers change every day.

Edited November 1, 2015 by dtissagirl

[lemotomato]

Seems the search #Arrow Oliver got more hits /nitpick.

But don't see how that makes her safe. Especially if they choose to go the Whedon route.

I don't care if it makes her safe or not. I just don't want to see speculation of her death in every thread, thanks.

[foreverevolving]

Here, Topsy lets everyone see the previous 30 days of Twitter activity:

 

3 different searches:

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=Laurel%20Lance&via=Topsy

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23Arrow%20Felicity&q2=%23Arrow%20Oliver&q3=%23Arrow%20Laurel&via=Topsy

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23FelicitySmoak&q2=%23OliverQueen&q3=%23LaurelLance&via=Topsy

 

Those spikes are the days Arrow aired. If you hover over the points, you can see the most popular tweet of that day.

I replaced Laurel Lance with Black Canary in the first search:

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=Black%20Canary&via=Topsy

Not much change, she's still at the bottom.

 

replaced Laurel with Diggle's name:

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=Diggle&via=Topsy

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=John%20Diggle&via=Topsy

 

 

Also: Olicity vs. Lauliver

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Olicity&q2=Lauliver&via=Topsy

[Guest]

I don't care if it makes her safe or not. I just don't want to see speculation of her death in every thread, thanks.

 

THIS. I'm not gonna make it to April at this rate. Anyone can die. Let's leave it at that. FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING!

 

 

I replaced Laurel Lance with Black Canary in the first search:

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Felicity%20Smoak&q2=Oliver%20Queen&q3=Black%20Canary&via=Topsy

Not much change, she's still at the bottom.

 

Also: Olicity vs. Lauliver

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Olicity&q2=Lauliver&via=Topsy

 

I know this doesn't make much difference but some people might be talking about comic Black Canary rather than Arrow BC, especially as they're two very different characters. It doesn't mean anything but it's something to consider if anyone cares about that sort of thing.

 

Also, do people call them Lauliver? I've never heard of that. I thought it was Lauriver. Those shippers need to make up their minds and pick one! LOL.

Edited November 1, 2015 by Guest

[Chaser]

I replaced it with Lauriver. 

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Olicity&q2=Lauriver&via=Topsy

 

So there's that.

[Guest]

I replaced it with Lauriver. 

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Olicity&q2=Lauriver&via=Topsy

 

So there's that.

 

Oh. LOL. So not much difference then...

[foreverevolving]

I replaced it with Lauriver. 

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=Olicity&q2=Lauriver&via=Topsy

 

So there's that.

 

 

Oh. LOL. So not much difference then...

 

Not even close, lol.

1831 - total of both the loliver names

53,365 = 100% - total of Olicity and both loliver names

the O/l ship is only 3.44% of the total (for the above dates).

and that's only if you are not using a "#"

 

http://topsy.com/analytics?q1=%23Olicity&q2=%23Lauliver&q3=%23Lauriver&via=Topsy

if we add the # than:

#Olicity has 92,054

 

#Lauliver has 63

#Lauriver has 913

which is: 1006

 

total is 93,060 = 100%

so O/L make: 1.08% of that total..

 

So the L/O ship only make up about 4.5% of the overall twitter trending numbers between the two ships.

It be interesting to see if that number will change simnifically come Wednesday once the episode airs.

Edited November 1, 2015 by foreverevolving

[kismet]

We were talking about the s3 O/F relationship in the relationship thread and it got me thinking EBR makes some rather interesting acting choices regarding her romantic relationships. I totally got from SA that OQ was absolutely in love with FS. But EBR was so nebulous in how she played FS for most of s3, that I questioned at times whether she was in Love with OQ or if she just loved him as she loves Dig or any other close friend. 

 

I find it interesting because she spent a lot s3 in a relationship that I did not understand for her character on a character level. I get the love the one your with trope. The getting over someone by getting under someone & rebound trope. But that was not how the writers wrote it in some episodes and definitely not how EBR always acted it. EBR played it full throttle with so much gusto. She seemed really invested in Raylicity. Its probably the same reason I was put off by her crying so intensely over him in 404. Because I never got from the actual relationship that the feelings went that deep. For me there is a disconnect in how I see FS and how EBR sees her. I loved the couple moments in 401, but I truly questioned FS's real intentions behind keeping her involvement with Team Arrowless from OQ because of how FS played it. She plays a lot of the romantic moments as if she has one foot out the door.

 

I don't know if it because she is playing it intentionally because FS is unsure of her role in OQ's life or if it is her abandonment issues from her father surfacing. She seems to trust OQ with her life, but not her heart even though after their 5 months away it should be pretty obvious that FS's heart is a higher priority to OQ, than I think his own heart is. I just don't understand EBR's take on FS in a relationship. She makes me doubt a lot of if FS is really as invested in OQ as OQ is in FS. I never doubted that she was attracted to him or that she cares for him. But at times, I do doubt her commitment to OQ based on EBR's performance. The FS I have in my head does not doubt that FS is in love with OQ. However, the FS the writers & EBR are delivering do genuinely make me question what is really going on in FS's mind about OQ. And I'm not sure if that is always a good thing. I don't doubt her importance to OQ's journey or her spot in the narrative. But I just wish I could believe without a doubt that FS was as invested in the relationship as OQ is.

[Genki]

Interesting...

 

I agree with your preposition @kismet that EBR's portrayal of FS with RP was a big disconnect for me as a viewer. So far I believe FS is in love with OQ but I can also see  how it could be perceived that she is not as all in, as OQ is.

 

I think the writing has a lot to do with it, the writers do give a lot of insights into Oliver's mindset, like the ring and the absolute happiness that Oliver exuded all over suburbia, vs Felicity's discontentment with domesticity. I hope future episodes cement her point of view and that the

upcoming RP storyline *bleh*

will ease doubts by giving a stronger voice for Felicity, rather than bringing more questions to the foreground. 

 

Having said that they are also writing a lot of thing right for Felicity in her relationship with Oliver, such as her support and belief in his mayoral campaign, they fact that she discusses her day and feeling about day with him, also that he can inspire her as much as she has been shown to inspire him. But most important of all, they haven't diminished her, her point of view, or made her OOC to fit in with being Oliver's LI, like they did in S3 to be a prop for RP.

[Cerulean Blue]

I don't know if it because she is playing it intentionally because FS is unsure of her role in OQ's life or if it is her abandonment issues from her father surfacing. She seems to trust OQ with her life, but not her heart even though after their 5 months away it should be pretty obvious that FS's heart is a higher priority to OQ, than I think his own heart is. I just don't understand EBR's take on FS in a relationship. She makes me doubt a lot of if FS is really as invested in OQ as OQ is in FS. I never doubted that she was attracted to him or that she cares for him. But at times, I do doubt her commitment to OQ based on EBR's performance. The FS I have in my head does not doubt that FS is in love with OQ. However, the FS the writers & EBR are delivering do genuinely make me question what is really going on in FS's mind about OQ. And I'm not sure if that is always a good thing. I don't doubt her importance to OQ's journey or her spot in the narrative. But I just wish I could believe without a doubt that FS was as invested in the relationship as OQ is.

I agree that EBR plays Felicity as though she's not as "all in" as Oliver at this point (and in season 3), but I actually really like it and it makes total sense to me.

 

On the one hand, yeah, Oliver has spent 5 months being totally about Felicity. But prior to that, he spent 2.5 years keeping her at arm's length in a very real, very overt way; I mean, he explicitly said to her more than once that he wouldn't be with her -- that he chose not to be with her -- because something else mattered more. And it seemed pretty consistent (from Felicity's POV, I think) throughout seasons 2 and 3 that Oliver would always put his mission above everything else, including a romantic relationship with her. 

 

Add to that the background info we know about her--her father left, her first love died tragically (sort of)--and I totally get why EBR might play Felicity as not just totally and completely trusting of her heart with Oliver. It actually kind of made sense for her to trust her heart with Ray since, based on his history, he doesn't have issues with commitment or romance. Oliver on the other hand...

 

As the audience, we got to see all of his Ray/Felicity-related angst and his last thought being of her and all of that. Felicity as a character got to see Oliver sleeping with Isabel and Sara, saying "I love you" to her as a ploy to catch Slade, breaking off their relationship after 1/8th of a date, telling her "I love you" and then sacrificing himself to Ra's, finally having one night together and then letting her walk away, and then going on a suicide mission. It's a smart and understandable move for Felicity to be a little cautious of being "all in" when in comes to a relationship with Oliver, so I totally get why EBR plays her that way. I think she's just as invested as Oliver is, but I also think she's been burned a lot more in their relationship than he has and so EBR plays her as more hesitant and wary.

[kismet]

Interesting...

 

I agree with your preposition @kismet that EBR's portrayal of FS with RP was a big disconnect for me as a viewer. So far I believe FS is in love with OQ but I can also see  how it could be perceived that she is not as all in, as OQ is.

 

I think the writing has a lot to do with it, the writers do give a lot of insights into Oliver's mindset, like the ring and the absolute happiness that Oliver exuded all over suburbia, vs Felicity's discontentment with domesticity. I hope future episodes cement her point of view and that the

upcoming RP storyline *bleh*

will ease doubts by giving a stronger voice for Felicity, rather than bringing more questions to the foreground. 

 

Having said that they are also writing a lot of thing right for Felicity in her relationship with Oliver, such as her support and belief in his mayoral campaign, they fact that she discusses her day and feeling about day with him, also that he can inspire her as much as she has been shown to inspire him. But most important of all, they haven't diminished her, her point of view, or made her OOC to fit in with being Oliver's LI, like they did in S3 to be a prop for RP.

Agree I like that part about not diminishing FS to become OQ's LI. She is still very much FS. I just wish we got more of FS's POV. Because so much of what we understand about her is a lot of speculation or piecing together of tidbits here & there. She's had a few moments where we get to hear what she is feeling. But a lot of that was in s2 when the stakes were different. We know that she didn't want to keep knowing about TQ's paternity because she didn't want to lose OQ. However, since that time I can't really say we've gotten a lot of insight into FS's POV. I really feel like that is what is missing. And after s3, I really feel like a lost a lot of who I thought FS was. I've had to fill in the blanks which is fine except for when it might differ from how EBR fills in the blanks. We really need to hear a definitive FS POV in-script.

 

I get FS wanting to protect her heart because OQ has been not great about relationships in the past. But now when EBR plays FS as cautious it makes me think FS is hiding something. EBR threw FS into two other onscreen relationships with gusto despite the men she loved despite being kinda shady & jerky to her. Now we have this supposed true love relationship and EBR onscreen seems a little less gung ho. I can't fight this feeling that we will find out that FS is not as much in love w/ OQ. I guess her performance in 401 keeping from OQ about not being happy in suburbia just shook my confidence in her love for OQ a little too much. And then the crying over RP brought that back. If she couldn't trust OQ enough to tell him that she was not really happy. How can I trust that she is going to be honest in the future when they fall off the same page, which will inevitably happen because that happens in life & on TV shows all the time. The writers put that hesitancy in the script and EBR's performance delivers a performance that at time makes me not fully trust FS & her emotions at times.

[EmeraldArcher]

Whew, I'm relieved that I'm not the only one who wonders what's going on in her heart regarding Oliver. My reaction to Olicity in 401 wasn't very popular here because I thought Oliver put the ring away because he was no longer certain about Felicity, given her lying about helping Team Arrow-less and her heart being in Starling City instead of in the suburbs with him. Since then, I've realized that I was projecting my uncertainty onto Oliver. A lot of this can be explained by acting choices, I guess.

However, I read a fic recently that articulated some of my doubts. In the fic, Felicity's words to Oliver in S3 come back to haunt her: "What I deserve is to be with someone who isn't afraid to be happy." Oliver was happy, happier and more at peace than he's ever been, when they were traveling and building a life together away from Star(ling) City. But, it wasn't enough for Felicity, and she wanted him to return to a city that held nothing but painful memories and a bleak future--where he was unlikely to ever be as happy as he'd been with her in Ivy Town. Sure, they were needed, and he is a hero, but he was choosing her and happiness.

Maybe we can't divorce any action from the context that this is Oliver's hero journey and he needed to return, but if we could, Felicity's being all-in or completely protective of Oliver's mental health seem a little uncertain.

(Backs away very slowly and carefully, arms up, palms facing forward to avoid provoking an attack)

[Cerulean Blue]

I guess I don't really understand why her crying over Ray is such a big deal. He's her ex-boyfriend and she clearly cared about him and liked him (even if a lot of the audience didn't) and he died in a really tragic way right after she broke his heart and skipped away on a (probably super-sex-filled) vacation with the love of her life.

 

Was Ray a bit of a creeper? He was indeed. But he wasn't a terrible guy. He was actually a pretty good guy (minus a couple of scenes where he was a dick), and he and Felicity seemed to connect on some level. They weren't soulmates or madly in love, but they were friends and then more than friends and Felicity cared about him. So she cried when she heard his last words. People can care about more than one person at once; people can also love more than one person at once (not that I think she loved Ray, but still). Felicity also cried when Sara died, but that doesn't mean she doesn't love Oliver.

 

I like that EBR shows that Felicity has feelings outside of Oliver, that her whole emotional life isn't about him. Regardless of how crappily Ray was written (and he was written pretty terribly), he was someone who mattered to Felicity, so thinking about his tragic demise makes her sad. Plus,

she tells Oliver right away about how she felt listening to Ray's final words, so she's not hiding stuff from him. 

And I actually felt like EBR played her relationships with both Cooper and Ray pretty hesitantly too.   

 

This is a show where people keep secrets from each other. Probably this is because the writers aren't super-great and secrets are an easy way to create drama, so they take the easy way out and so everyone has a secret. In the grand scheme of things, Felicity's secret (being bored by slow-cooker talk with the neighbors) is so low on the drama scale that I think it's barely even supposed to register. I mean, we've got secret deals with super-villains, middle-of-the-night grave-robbing, and murderous zombie-sisters-chained-up-in-the-basement. Felicity not telling Oliver that she doesn't like the suburbs is barely a blip on the secrets-keeping radar.