Surviving R. Kelly

[Dorne2.0]

10 hours ago, Queena said:

So much misinformation. I know a few people, in particular the earlier victims that weren't mentioned. 

I'm sure that mandated reporting wasn't a thing in 90-92 when he was trolling Kenwood. Did she and the other staff know? Of course, the music room would fill up when he came to the school. 

Sparkle's niece is very close to Kelly's family and even him. She still comes around him. 

There's no way that I would take my child to a R. Kelly concert or sign a guardianship letter so that someone in his camp can watch her. Especially in exchange for money. Both the Clarys and Savages did. When the daughters were trying to set up a meeting Avenatti told them not to because it puts public opinion on their side and makes Kelly look bad. Is he sick yes. Is he guilty hell yeah, I know that 100% certainty. However, at least one of the girls was an adult. An adult who Kelly flew out to see their daughter often. She cut off contact after they grilled her on video about her and his sex life. 

Sadly, I think that Avenatti has tainted this case. Hopefully it can be savaged, because while I don't think that he's held anyone hostage (there are videos with some of those ladies and parents talking about how they were lying but Lifetime couldn't cut it out because of cost) he deserves jail for Aaliyah and someone I knew. 

Can you tell me about what was missinformation? Was it something I said in my yearlier post? I have been reading because it disturbed me so if you can clarify that I would be so thankfull =). I really want to know what it's missinformation about what I read and have been told by the docuseries. 

[Quilt Fairy]

Just saw that Lifetime is airing a follow-up special on May 4th. 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/surviving-r-kelly-follow-up-set-at-lifetime-1205032

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

A year after the Lifetime docuseries "Surviving R Kelly" aired, the R&B singer has faced a huge legal reckoning resulting in jailtime and new allegations of bribery. The second part of the docuseries follows the fallout of the first series and premieres January 2, 2020.

Trailer:

[Queena]

On 4/2/2019 at 9:12 PM, Dorne2.0 said:

Can you tell me about what was missinformation? Was it something I said in my yearlier post? I have been reading because it disturbed me so if you can clarify that I would be so thankfull =). I really want to know what it's missinformation about what I read and have been told by the docuseries. 

Go to Lipstick Alley there's long a thread with a lot of info. 

Kelly has been in jail for months and those girls aren't going home. Someone made a fake Paetron account using one of the girls names. You can find them on Instagram still in love. 😑 It's just all so tragic. 

R. Kelly was molested as a child by his sister and other adult men and women. Part of it included recording. It's all a tragedy, but jail he deserves. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

FYI - the schedule for Surviving R. Kelly, Part 2: The Reckoning:

1/2/20
S2.E1: It Hasn't Stopped
S2.E2: The Settlement Factory

1/3/20
S2.E3: Please Come Forward
S2.E4: After the Rescue

1/4/20
S2.E5: Bring Our Girls Home

Promo:

First look:

 

[KeeperOfTheIce]

Is there supposed to be new info?  Watching this now it just seems to be an enhanced version of the first documentary from last year.

[Robert Lynch]

1991! I was 8 playing NES, SNES, and arcades games at that time. This guy had a system more complex than MJ. He was doing it half my lifetime for years. It wasn't like it was a secret or anything, but the longevity of it shocked me.

It was there.

Edited January 3, 2020 by Robert Lynch

[ElectricBoogaloo]

S2.E1: It Hasn't Stopped

Quote

A gun threat wreaks havoc at the premiere as the world reels from the release of "Surviving R. Kelly."

S2.E2: The Settlement Factory

Quote

Tiffany Hawkins, the first person to attempt to hold R. Kelly legally responsible for his actions, breaks her silence and tells her story on camera after more than two decades.

Original air date: 1/2/20

Edited January 3, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

It was horrible to hear that these women who were brave enough to come forward were being threatened by stans and RK's team. Can you imagine being such a stan that you would threaten to beat someone up when you see them at the mall with their children?

Ugh and watching Lindsey and her sister Jen defending him, just BLECH.

I'm glad that Faith is in therapy now. The fact that she still feels guilty shows the absurd double standards that exist. She shouldn't feel guilty that she was manipulated and taken advantage of.

Does R. Kelly's brother not see the irony in saying that he will support his brother no matter what and also saying that if someone abused his kid, he would do anything to make sure that they paid for it?

[Neurochick]

5 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

It was horrible to hear that these women who were brave enough to come forward were being threatened by stans and RK's team. Can you imagine being such a stan that you would threaten to beat someone up when you see them at the mall with their children?

Ugh and watching Lindsey and her sister Jen defending him, just BLECH.

I'm glad that Faith is in therapy now. The fact that she still feels guilty shows the absurd double standards that exist. She shouldn't feel guilty that she was manipulated and taken advantage of.

The best part of the documentary, to me, were the psychologists, who said that our brains aren't developed fully until we're in our mid twenties.   People like Lindsey, Jen and others don't get that when someone is VERY young, they're easy prey for someone like R. Kelly.  These young girls thought they knew it all, they thought R. Kelly loved them.  It's not until they got older that they realized, "what healthy grown man would want a relationship with a teenager, especially a celebrity?"  That's why these girls beat themselves up, they hate themselves that they fell for R. Kelly's shit.

 

15 hours ago, KeeperOfTheIce said:

Is there supposed to be new info?  Watching this now it just seems to be an enhanced version of the first documentary from last year.

I don't remember seeing Tiffany last year, her segment was interesting, but a lot of it did seem enhanced from the first documentary.  

[Robert Lynch]

I feel pity for R. Kelly because of the abusive childhood he endured for so long at such a young age, but if that same person lays the abuse on other young girls, he doesn't deserve sympathy at all. Not from me. He knew what he did was wrong and all the people involved just turned a blind eye to the almighty dollar. He and his inner circle  should be held accountable for that.

Edited January 4, 2020 by Robert Lynch

[Rlb8031]

Am I the only one who felt a way about the two sisters that worked as his managers? Both of them are pretty evil if they are going to sit there and say that those children deserved what happened to them. 

[Quilt Fairy]

34 minutes ago, Rlb8031 said:

Am I the only one who felt a way about the two sisters that worked as his managers? Both of them are pretty evil if they are going to sit there and say that those children deserved what happened to them. 

Wasn't it one of those women who said "Yes, there was a young girl in the backyard and yes, she did stay over some nights, but her father was there so it was OK"?  This reminds me of the people who were around Michael Jackson saying "Well, yes he slept in the same bed with young boys, but Michael said it was innocent."  

The mind boggles. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

1 hour ago, Quilt Fairy said:

Wasn't it one of those women who said "Yes, there was a young girl in the backyard and yes, she did stay over some nights, but her father was there so it was OK"?  This reminds me of the people who were around Michael Jackson saying "Well, yes he slept in the same bed with young boys, but Michael said it was innocent."  

The mind boggles. 

Yup. And it was the same woman who said with dead eyes that if you are raped you need to call the police and get a lawyer. It’s also the same woman who said that yes, she recognized the girl on the tape and that yes, it was R. Kelly having sex with her but that it was consensual so it wasn’t rape (immediately followed by someone else with an understanding of THE LAW saying that when you have sex with someone who is underage, the minor can’t give consent and therefore it is statutory rape).

[ElectricBoogaloo]

On 1/2/2020 at 8:07 PM, KeeperOfTheIce said:

Is there supposed to be new info?  Watching this now it just seems to be an enhanced version of the first documentary from last year.

All the info about Tiffany was new. She wasn’t interviewed in the original series so everything about her relationship with him, her pregnancy, her lawsuit, her NDA, and her settlement were new. 

Everything about the fallout from the first season was new too: the evacuation at the premiere, the nude photos of Faith and the other girls posted online due to their participation in S1, Faith’s family being threatened and having to move, the new charges filed against R. Kelly, etc. 

I don’t recall Carey (Robert’s brother) talking about the Stephen King tape during S1 nor do I recall seeing the blonde sisters who worked for Robert interviewed during S1. I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry when the sound engineer said they were watching Dave Chappelle with Robert when the R. Kelly skit came on. Talk about awkward. 

Edited January 4, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Spartan Girl]

Fuck R Kelly, his stans, trolls, enablers, and those twat managers who probably ARE smearing the survivors on the internet. 

That's all.

[SimonSeymour]

10 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 

Does R. Kelly's brother not see the irony in saying that he will support his brother no matter what and also saying that if someone abused his kid, he would do anything to make sure that they paid for it?

Or the irony of saying that the girls knew they were being videotaped (not that that matters; he sexually assaulted them regardless), yet R. Kelly videotaped his own brother having sex with two women without his knowledge?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

3 hours ago, SimonSeymour said:

Or the irony of saying that the girls knew they were being videotaped (not that that matters; he sexually assaulted them regardless), yet R. Kelly videotaped his own brother having sex with two women without his knowledge?

But that was just a fun brotherly joke! “Dumb faces!” It never ceases to amaze me how the brother in prison keeps defending Robert yet answers questions like that honestly. 

[Quilt Fairy]

17 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

But that was just a fun brotherly joke! “Dumb faces!” It never ceases to amaze me how the brother in prison keeps defending Robert yet answers questions like that honestly. 

I see that brother Bruce has graduated from the Cook County jail to a prison in Vienna, Illinois. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

S2.E3: Please Come Forward

Quote

Singer R. Kelly faces his first round of criminal charges after the airing of "Surviving R. Kelly;" survivor Jerhonda Pace reveals a shocking pact she made.

S2.E4: After the Rescue

Quote

Singer-songwriter R. Kelly is released from jail and does a controversial interview with journalist Gayle King; accuser Dominique Gardner speaks on camera.

Original air date: 1/3/20

[Robert Lynch]

Greenberg.....😤what a.....I have no words at all. So glad he was called out because of that journalist. That dude is a hero.

That hairstylist's story was so unsettling. Boy, talk about graphic. Wow.

Edited January 4, 2020 by Robert Lynch

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Lanita's story just underlined what a predator R. Kelly is. He chooses vulnerable girls with low self esteem, a history of abuse, and a strong need for validation because they are easy prey. In the first few minutes of her interview, she said that she was molested, she was raped, she was a nobody, she had no friends, she was depressed, her family never listened to her, her husband was abusive, and that Robert was the first person who took the time to listen to her. In other words, she was exactly the type of person he liked to choose to victimize. As Lizzette said, Robert can smell a wounded woman a mile away.

When she said he didn't gain anything by telling her she was smart and talented, I was like GURL, he gained your trust and that's the first step in grooming you for abuse. If he truly thought she was talented, he would have paid her more than $100 for eight hours of waiting for him to show up so she could do his hair.

And then OF COURSE he guilt tripped her because she didn't tell him that someone in his entourage wanted to make out with her. That's another classic technique of abusers - blame the victim for something that wasn't their fault, blow it out of proportion, and then emotionally punish them by withholding attention. As if it's somehow HER fault that this rando propositioned her.

His abrupt turn into demanding a blow job and "suck it for daddy" while spitting on her was not a surprise. This is what some abusers do. They pull you in, make you feel safe, and then blindside you. The cherry on top of that shit sundae was him getting mad at her for having the gall to cry about it and yelling at her to clean herself up.

What's with the longer disclaimer after each commercial break?

Ugh, I can't with the blonde manager lady blaming the victims' parents and asking what the parents' motives were and why they didn't help their daughters. How about blaming Robert's mother for raising a pedophile rapist? Or blaming his mother for letting him and his brother get molested by a family friend and letting him be around a neighbor who exposed himself to her children? Or asking what his mother's motives were when she let her sons be molested at the age of six? Oh, that's not fair? Sorry, I forgot that we're only blaming Robert's victims and their parents. Apparently Robert bears no responsibility for having sex with underage girls.

And for the record, no matter how negligent someone's parents are or how oblivious they are about where their kids are, that STILL doesn't give abusers like R. Kelly the right to manipulate and abuse these kids or have sex with them, especially when he knows they're underage. Stop blaming the parents and start blaming the perp.

Good for Jim DeRogatis for calling out R. Kelly's lawyer on his blatant lie and telling him to keep the facts straight about the victims. Not surprising that a defense attorney tried to twist the facts to discredit the victim. His client knew how old these girls were. He knew that his victims were underage and he chose to have sex with them.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

It never ceases to amaze me what denial will do to a person. That blonde lady interpreted Robert's hysterical freakout during the Gayle King interview as "a man truly fighting for his freedom." The rest of us saw an angry out of control man having a temper tantrum.

I'm glad that Dominique was able to get away (even though I was horrified that she went back voluntarily before leaving again). It's clear that she's still traumatized by her experience. Which, you know, makes sense since he was beating her, starving her, and punishing her by leaving her alone for days at a time, not giving her permission to go to the bathroom, etc.

[Robert Lynch]

It's interesting as to how the SNL spoof with Keenan is what brought to light about R. Kelly when they were so many other skits before that. Aries Spears played R. Kelly in a music video spoof of his music with underage undertones on Mad TV. Jordan Peele played him on the show as well, but more of a scary predator than Chapelle or Spiers.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

THR interview with the show's executive producers Jesse Daniels and Brie Miranda Bryant about S2

 

Edited January 4, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Neurochick]

7 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Lanita's story just underlined what a predator R. Kelly is. He chooses vulnerable girls with low self esteem, a history of abuse, and a strong need for validation because they are easy prey. In the first few minutes of her interview, she said that she was molested, she was raped, she was a nobody, she had no friends, she was depressed, her family never listened to her, her husband was abusive, and that Robert was the first person who took the time to listen to her. In other words, she was exactly the type of person he liked to choose to victimize. As Lizzette said, Robert can smell a wounded woman a mile away.

I felt for her.  She wasn't underage but, because Kelly had been wounded himself, he could smell the wounded.  That is what makes him so terrible, because he had been wounded, he could tell who else had been wounded and then abuse them.

I don't know if they have brought up the issue of class.  Many of these women came from poverty and because of that were even more vulnerable.  I mean for a girl from a poor background to attract a wealthy celebrity, that's a fairytale, that's Pretty Woman.  I mean that was Lanita's story, "I was nobody and now I'm doing hair for a celebrity....I'm somebody." 

I loved what Tarana Burke said about what little black girls don't hear, that if they are molested it's NOT their fault. 

[Rlb8031]

15 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

What's with the longer disclaimer after each commercial break?

Its a technique that networks and production companies use to protect themselves from libel/slander charges. They provide the subject of the documentary with a copy of the movie/show in advance and give them an opportunity to rebut any of the claims. Usually, that takes the form of a long letter from the accused attorney with rebuttals, disclaimers, etc. Those statements are then included in the final version, usually as bumpers at the beginning and end of each segment (before and after commercial breaks) so that there isn't a possibility of the accused saying that incorrect information was aired without any attempt to correct. The first time I saw this technique was in the Leah Rimini Scientology show. In that case, they would use specific disclaimers (i.e. "The Church says that Joe Blow is a big, fat, stinky liar who is only doing this to get attention.") for each episode. They did that for every episode all three seasons the show aired. Clearly, R. Kelly money is not as long as the Co$ since it appears that his attorney simply wrote one blanket disclaimer for all five hours.

[Quilt Fairy]

I wish they had focused more on his finances.  He was settling lawsuits for years in the hundred thousand - million dollar range but he didn't have $100K to bail himself out last February?  Yet he's still able to maintain a unit at Trump Tower for his remaining cult member(s)?  He's still got his high-priced lawyers?  What are his estimated future residuals from his songs? Can that money be attached?  Stuff like that. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

S2.E5: Bring Our Girls Home

As R. Kelly is taken into federal custody without bail, the families of Joycelyn Savage and Azriel Clary wonder if they'll ever return home.

Original air date: 1/4/20

[Robert Lynch]

R. Kelly was one 90s artist I was always meh about in terms of music and performance. I was just not connected to his music at all and I actually preferred other 90s artists besides him. He was not something that must be on my playlist. He was talented, I give you that. But his music was too samey and repetitive for me to become a fan. I like some of his songs, but I could never get into his music at all. He was not something to make me a stan. 

And this is from a kid that grew up in the 90s. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Bruce: When I get out of [prison next year], I'm going to go to Carey and I'm going to tell him, "Look, whether [Robert]'s found guilty or whether he's found innocent, he's gonna still be our brother. Are we going to stop loving him because of a verdict?"

No, Bruce, you don't stop loving someone because of a verdict. But you can stop enabling and emotionally supporting someone who you know has abused young girls for three decades. And you definitely don't need to pressure your younger brother to support an abuser after said abuser has publicly accused the younger brother of being the perpetrator. I still can't believe that Robert expected Carey to take the fall for that video tape, as if the record contract he offered him would make up for being a convicted sex offender.

I need what Brittany said to be put on billboards: if you are only talking to your daughters about consent and MeToo but not your sons, then you're still not doing it right. EVERY female I know has at least one MeToo story. Yes, there's definitely a range but every female I know has been sexually harassed at the very least on one end of the spectrum and many of the females I know have been sexually assaulted or raped. It's THAT common and THAT pervasive.

In a previous episode Tarana Burke said that we tell our girls all the things that they're not supposed to let men do to them, but we don't tell them that if it does happen, it's not their fault. I'd add to that we also don't tell them that if it happens, we will believe them and support them and help them. Many women do not report sexual assault because they see what happens to women who report it (like R. Kelly's victims, like Chanel Miller, like countless other women) - they're publicly slut shamed, they're blamed because of what they wore or how much they had to drink, they're accused of being liars, etc. But they also don't report it or talk to their loved ones about it because there's so much shame. If watching this series convinces just one person to share their story, whether it's with a friend or whether they report it to the police, then it means this show helped someone (in addition to all of R. Kelly's victims who finally got to speak out and have people listen).

1 hour ago, Robert Lynch said:

R. Kelly was one 90s artist I was always meh about in terms of music and performance. I was just not connected to his music at all and I actually preferred other 90s artists besides him. He was not something that must be on my playlist. He was talented, I give you that. But his music was too samey and repetitive for me to become a fan. I like some of his songs, but I could never get into his music at all. He was not something to make me a stan. 

And this is from a kid that grew up in the 90s. 

I might have mentioned this last season but I never liked his music (for the same reason - it all sounded too similar/repetitive to me) so #muterkelly didn't exactly change my listening or spending habits (I totally support what they were doing but realistically my boycott didn't take any money out of his bank account). The only song of his that I even remotely liked was "You Are Not Alone" which Michael Jackson recorded so obviously that song is doubly problematic.

I can't remember who said this in the last episode but I get having nostalgia for a song because you remember it from [insert life moment]. The question you have to ask is whether that warm fuzzy feeling is enough for you to ignore the fact that the person who sang this song abused dozens of girls over the course of thirty years.

8 hours ago, Rlb8031 said:

Its a technique that networks and production companies use to protect themselves from libel/slander charges. They provide the subject of the documentary with a copy of the movie/show in advance and give them an opportunity to rebut any of the claims.

I understand why they have the disclaimer. I just thought it was noticeable that the one they had for S2 was considerably longer than the one for S1 (which was basically "R. Kelly says he didn't do it").

[Neurochick]

I never liked R. Kelly's music because I always thought him to be "nasty and crusty."

This documentary is sad to me.  Everybody is saying, "NOW he will be brought to justice, etc."  And it's good that it's finally happening.  But no one had the guts to say that the reason this is happening NOW is because he's not as famous as he once was, he's no longer making money for the record companies the way he did in the 90's.

I mean he married Aailyah in the 1990's, she was 15 and nothing was done to him.  I am sure that if he's married a 15 year old white girl, he would have been muted for sure.

The man who wrote the Buzzfeed article said he didn't like the comedy bits made about Kelly, but the one that was true was the one from Aziz Ansari, he said that the outrage came after all of this was on a bingable documentary.  Had this been in a newspaper, the outrage would not have been as much as it was by being on Lifetime. 

I guess I would have been more impressed if this had happened 25 years ago.  The fact that he has seriously fucked up SO many women and girls over the years sickens me.

[Quilt Fairy]

3 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

No, Bruce, you don't stop loving someone because of a verdict. But you can stop enabling and emotionally supporting someone who you know has abused young girls for three decades. And you definitely don't need to pressure your younger brother to support an abuser after said abuser has publicly accused the younger brother of being the perpetrator. I still can't believe that Robert expected Carey to take the fall for that video tape, as if the record contract he offered him would make up for being a convicted sex offender.

There was one scene right at this point that I though was strangely edited.  Bruce says, "Robert, I love you."  Switch to Carey saying "Robert, I love you..." with an IMMEDIATE CUT to an old picture of them.  The timing of that cut was so jarring to me I can't help but feel there was something more to Carey's statement.  

[Queena]

What R. Kelly did at Kenwood wasn't a secret. Hell, I met him in music class. I remember when Tia (Tiffany) told me about her man R. Kelly. You do the crime you do the time. Just leave Aaliyah out of this. She's gone. There should be enough to lock him up without. 

 

R. Kelly was wrong, but there should never be a price on protecting your children. Never! 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

8 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

There was one scene right at this point that I though was strangely edited.  Bruce says, "Robert, I love you."  Switch to Carey saying "Robert, I love you..." with an IMMEDIATE CUT to an old picture of them.  The timing of that cut was so jarring to me I can't help but feel there was something more to Carey's statement.  

I really thought Carey was going to follow that up with "BUT..." and say that he couldn't support his choices or something to that effect so I thought it was a weird cut too.

7 hours ago, Queena said:

Just leave Aaliyah out of this. She's gone. There should be enough to lock him up without. 

I think it was important to include Aaliyah in the documentary for the same reason it was important that A-list actresses came forward about Harvey Weinstein. As shitty as it sounds, people are willing to dismiss allegations from non-celebrities with excuses like "they're just lying because they want money/fame." But when Oscar winning actresses come forward and say, "I have no reason to lie about this and he preyed on me too," people are (slightly) less skeptical.

In the case of Aaliyah, she isn't here to confirm or deny the abuse, but she serves as an example that R. Kelly did many of the same things with her as he did with some of the other victims (chose a young girl, paraded her around in front of everyone, claimed that she was like a little sister). Did they have sex and did she get pregnant? I guess we'll never know for sure but I'm more likely to believe ANYONE than I am to believe anything Robert says at this point. The fact that he asked someone to fake a birth certificate so that they could get married doesn't exactly scream "we were just friends and we never had sex."

Of course, there are the hardcore stans who will never believe that R. Kelly did anything wrong, despite the fact that so many women have come forward. They will choose to believe the BS spouted by his lawyer about how they're all liars who just want 15 minutes of fame and some money because they'd rather believe that than accept that the gy who sang" I Believe I Can Fly" has been abusing women for 30 years.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

23 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I wish they had focused more on his finances.  He was settling lawsuits for years in the hundred thousand - million dollar range but he didn't have $100K to bail himself out last February?  Yet he's still able to maintain a unit at Trump Tower for his remaining cult member(s)?  He's still got his high-priced lawyers?  What are his estimated future residuals from his songs? Can that money be attached?  Stuff like that. 

I'd be interested in his finances too, especially after he said he couldn't afford bail while two of his victims were still living there (and really, how did that other girl who runs a daycare get $100K for his $1 million bail?*). I'm willing to believe his lawyers are still around because it's a high profile case and there are definitely lawyers who would stick around because they're convinced they're going to win.

* sidenote: Valencia Love posted his $100K bond back in February when charges were brought against him in Cook County. When federal charges were brought against him in July, the judge said he would be held without bail. Valencia then hired a lawyer to get her $100K back. A judge denied her request.

Quote

[Judge] Flood said there was no basis for [Valencia Love's attorney] Collins’ request, noting the woman who posted Kelly’s bail signed a bond slip warning she could lose that money even if Kelly met the conditions of his bond, because a judge might order that money used to pay his attorney’s fees, court costs, fines, or other expenses.

According to this article from February, at the time of his arrest he owed $161,000 in unpaid child support. The same article also lists the charges filed in Cook County:

Quote

The charges identify the victims only by initials, and the dates of the alleged abuse:

H.W. (13-16 years of age), victim of four counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse between May 26, 1998, and May 25, 1999;

J.P. (13-16 years of age), victim of three counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse between May 1, 2009, and Jan. 31, 2010;

R.L. (13-16 years of age), victim of two counts of aggravated criminal sexual abuse between Sept. 26, 1998, and Sept. 25, 2001;

L.C. (no age given), victim of one count of aggravated criminal sexual abuse on Feb. 18, 2003.

Prosecutors have said the first victim, HW, was celebrating her 16th birthday when she met Kelly, who told his manager to give HW a business card.  HW’s mother saw the encounter, and told Kelly’s manager her daughter was 16 years old.

HW later took the business card from her mom’s purse. She called Kelly, who told her to take a cab to his Chicago studio. During that first sexual encounter on May 26, 1998, Kelly had difficulty maintaining an erection and penetrated the victim orally and vaginally. HW was then given a large sum of money, much more than the cost of the cab fare.

Prosecutors said the encounters continued until May, 1999.

The second victim, JP, met Kelly after a court hearing for Kelly’s 2008 child pornography trial and asked for his autograph. She was later invited to his house in Olympia Fields and Kelly had sex with the victim from May 2009 through Jan. 31, 2010. During those encounters, Kelly would spit, slap and choke her. She was also under the age of 16.

The victim provided a shirt with semen to police, and a test found the DNA was a match for Kelly.

A third victim, RL, had sex when she was 14 at Kelly’s house in Olympia Fields. A witness was asked to take sex tapes of the victim and Kelly. The witness watched the tapes and turned them over to the state’s attorney’s office. Kelly and the victim had sexual encounters between Sept. 26, 1998 and Sept. 25, 2001. The video was not the same as the one at the center of Kelly’s 2008 child pornography trial, prosecutors said.

The fourth victim, LC, was an adult who worked for Kelly as a hair dresser.  On Feb. 18, 2008, Kelly walked into a room in his Chicago studio and said he “wanted his head massaged.” His pants were down and he pointed to his penis.  When the woman resisted, Kelly masturbated, ejaculated and spit on her.  A semen sample tested was a DNA match to Kelly, prosecutors said.

 

[suzeecat]

A very well done, eye-opening documentary for sure!  However, am I the only one who thinks the black legal disclaimer screens were way overdone?  It seemed like they put them up after every single segment and again right after a commercial break.  The series could have been probably at least an hour shorter if they had shown it once at the beginning and the end of each episode.

[Neurochick]

13 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Of course, there are the hardcore stans who will never believe that R. Kelly did anything wrong, despite the fact that so many women have come forward. They will choose to believe the BS spouted by his lawyer about how they're all liars who just want 15 minutes of fame and some money because they'd rather believe that than accept that the gy who sang" I Believe I Can Fly" has been abusing women for 30 years.

It's not just stans.  I know a lot of people, who feel this is just "the white man trying to bring a black man down."  Even when I remind them that Kelly abused mainly black women and girls, they won't listen.  

[Pearson80]

9 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

It's not just stans.  I know a lot of people, who feel this is just "the white man trying to bring a black man down."  Even when I remind them that Kelly abused mainly black women and girls, they won't listen.  

 R Kelly is a predator who targeted Black girls because he knew nobody would care.. The Black community should not be rallying around a disgusting vile pig like him.  We have enough issues to deal with..

[Neurochick]

16 minutes ago, Pearson80 said:

 R Kelly is a predator who targeted Black girls because he knew nobody would care.. The Black community should not be rallying around a disgusting vile pig like him.  We have enough issues to deal with..

You are correct.  However, some people will, no matter what you say, believe what they believe.  One of the therapists, I believe said something about how people will rally around someone like Kelly because he's a black celebrity.

Edited January 6, 2020 by Neurochick

[Robert Lynch]

1 hour ago, Neurochick said:

You are correct.  However, some people will, no matter what you say, believe what they believe.  One of the therapists, I believe said something about how people will rally around someone like Kelly because he's a black celebrity.

Hence, the Michael Jackson syndrome.

[RealHousewife]

2 hours ago, suzeecat said:

A very well done, eye-opening documentary for sure!  However, am I the only one who thinks the black legal disclaimer screens were way overdone?  It seemed like they put them up after every single segment and again right after a commercial break.  The series could have been probably at least an hour shorter if they had shown it once at the beginning and the end of each episode.

For sure. It took up way too much time. 

Regarding the racial component...

I had a black female coworker who hated all that was said about Bill Cosby. She didn’t like how it affected his family and career. I didn’t want to argue because she seemed to think people were trying to bring down a black icon. I wish people wouldn’t focus so much on who’s been an icon, whose shows or music you love, and more on their actions and victims. 

I was a huge Michael Jackson fan. I still think he was brilliantly talented, and I watched the documentary on him not thinking I’d be convinced he was a pedophile. After watching it with an open mind despite my skepticism, I came to the same conclusion so many others did-that he was guilty. 

Are there a lot of racists out there? Yes, sadly. But a lot of us just call it as we see it. As long as these same folks are just as outraged by people like Harvey Weinstein, I don’t think it has to do with race. And for people who do want to make it about race, I too wish they’d focus on all these young black girls who were abused. Way too many turned a blind eye. It is heartbreaking. 

I am an Aaliyah fan, and I always wondered what the truth was. I found it interesting she didn’t wish R. Kelly anything bad but was so hurt she couldn’t talk about it. 

[Robert Lynch]

21 hours ago, RealHousewife said:

For sure. It took up way too much time. 

Regarding the racial component...

I had a black female coworker who hated all that was said about Bill Cosby. She didn’t like how it affected his family and career. I didn’t want to argue because she seemed to think people were trying to bring down a black icon. I wish people wouldn’t focus so much on who’s been an icon, whose shows or music you love, and more on their actions and victims. 

I was a huge Michael Jackson fan. I still think he was brilliantly talented, and I watched the documentary on him not thinking I’d be convinced he was a pedophile. After watching it with an open mind despite my skepticism, I came to the same conclusion so many others did-that he was guilty. 

Are there a lot of racists out there? Yes, sadly. But a lot of us just call it as we see it. As long as these same folks are just as outraged by people like Harvey Weinstein, I don’t think it has to do with race. And for people who do want to make it about race, I too wish they’d focus on all these young black girls who were abused. Way too many turned a blind eye. It is heartbreaking. 

I am an Aaliyah fan, and I always wondered what the truth was. I found it interesting she didn’t wish R. Kelly anything bad but was so hurt she couldn’t talk about it. 

That is reminiscent of the stans for MJ or those that were not fans of his. I could attest that MJ was abused and probably pimped by Joe Jackson to various shady businessmen at a relatively young age. However, MJ was an adult and lived his childhood three times. He had all resources to get him diagnosed from therapy, but the family did nothing about it. Hell, I could not blame Janet for doing things on her own and being self-made without the family's involvement. I would have done the same thing in her shoes. There is so much drama you can handle that all you could say that's enough. MJ unfortunately did not have those resources. He was doomed from the start.

[lovinbob]

Lanita Carter. I am watching her and my heart is broken for her, and I am also simultaneously so proud of her! To come from a family who didn't seem to value her, an abusive husband, and the way she was treated by a man she admired and depended upon ... to be able to speak her truth with so much insight and strength--I am so inspired by her. I hope all the good things in the world happen for her.

One of the things I appreciate most about this series is the presence of so many people of color who are the talking heads and the experts. It's about time we hear these voices as the experts and not just the victims or the witnesses.

Lindsey Perryman-Dunn and her equally hideous sister can go the hell away and take their R Kelly excuses with them. 

[Neurochick]

13 hours ago, lovinbob said:

One of the things I appreciate most about this series is the presence of so many people of color who are the talking heads and the experts. It's about time we hear these voices as the experts and not just the victims or the witnesses.

They were my favorite part of the show.  I loved their insights.

[Robert Lynch]

R. Jelly girlfriend returns home to parents

[Rlb8031]

Glad to see that Azriel has started to acknowledge that she was a victim. It also seems like maybe Mom is healing some? I was sad to hear the implications in Part II that the marriage was dissolving. Hopefully, this will bring Mom and Dad back together.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Azriel Clary interview - it's long but she discusses a lot of things like the daily routine for the girls, Robert forcing the girls to write letters accusing family members of molesting them, videotaping the girls doing things like molesting younger family members so he can blackmail them later if necessary, etc.

Edited January 31, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[SDVegas]

On 1/6/2020 at 10:25 AM, RealHousewife said:

was a huge Michael Jackson fan. I still think he was brilliantly talented, and I watched the documentary on him not thinking I’d be convinced he was a pedophile. After watching it with an open mind despite my skepticism, I came to the same conclusion so many others did-that he was,

What documentary are you talking about?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

R. Kelly is facing new allegation of sexual abuse of a minor in revised federal indictment

Quote

An updated federal indictment against R. Kelly was made public Friday, revealing a new allegation of sexual abuse of a minor against the singer.

Kelly, who is facing charges of sexual abuse in multiple jurisdictions, was charged Friday in a 13-count superseding indictment with multiple counts of child pornography and other crimes.

In the new filing in US District Court in Illinois, which is largely similar to his original indictment filed last year, Kelly is accused for the first time of sexually abusing a teenage girl identified as "Minor 6."

Kelly met the girl around 1997 or 1998 when she was 14 or 15 and the abuse lasted for up to four years, the indictment states.

Another girl, who had been identified as Minor 2 in the original document, was removed from the victims listed in the indictment.

The revised indictment also says that prosecutors are now seeking the forfeiture of all assets from Kelly's production company known as Bass Productions and a separate company owned by his former business manager, Derrel McDavid, who is a co-defendant in the case.

Kelly, whose full name is Robert Sylvester Kelly, faces a separate five-count indictment in US District Court in New York. The indictment accuses Kelly of sexual exploitation of a child, kidnapping, forced labor and violations of the Mann Act involving the coercion and transportation of women and girls in interstate commerce to engage in illegal sexual activity from 1999 to the present.