Friends - General Discussion

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 1/23/2021 at 1:34 AM, Ms Blue Jay said:

I totally understand your points.  Joey was always a good friend to Rachel.  Joey slept around a lot, but he didn't exhibit the same 'fragile masculinity' or homophobia that Ross and Chandler showed sometimes.

I just remembered, because I'm watching the later seasons now, that they totally had Chandler do a 180 with this after getting with Monica.  Suddenly it's all sorts of jokes/remarks about Chandler reading relationship books, watching Oprah, loving the Annie soundtrack, and Miss Congeniality 😄  And he opened Monica's secret closet using her tools 😄

There's also the remark when Chandler says "I'm not macho."  And Monica says, "Yeah you're right.  I don't know what I was thinking."  😄

[Kawaiiko]

6 hours ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

I bought the blu-ray of the series when quarantine first started last year and I've been watching the whole series again. I think if your definition of "homophobic" is making jokes about someone being "too girly"  or "too gay" all the characters have done it. Monica might be the biggest offender in that area. Joey might have been slightly better about it than Ross or Chandler but he certainly wasn't above basically calling Ross or Chandler too gay if they weren't doing something butch enough.

To be honest, yeah. All of the friends were guilty of gay jokes. "If homo sapiens, were in fact, homo sapiens, is that why they're extinct?" "So, how goes the dancing? Gay yet?" There are also those gags where Chandler and Joey realize that they've been hugging too long (for them, anyway) and break apart as fast as they can.

Edited January 26, 2021 by YoukaiMoe

[ifionlyknew]

When I rewatch shows from anytime before basically now I hear a lot of things that make me cringe. At the time those things would make me groan but I didn't think of them as homophobic/racist/sexist.   I think those things weren't considered offensive if they were meant to be funny.  They were still offensive but people laughed.  

Frasier had lots of jokes about being gay but the writers did it so much better than the Friends writers. Even Seinfeld did it better with the whole "not that there is anything wrong with that" episode.

[Kawaiiko]

I really do wonder why there were so many gay jokes when one of the creators of the freakin' show was gay himself!

[Crs97]

Joey also told Ross’ date that Ross is the reason his ex-wife “turned” gay so they all made offensive comments.  I chalk it up to the times and the “when you know better, you do better” trend of comedy.  For as many bad jokes, Carol and Susan’s wedding was beautiful, and one of my favorite scenes was Carol and Ross’s conversation that she loved him but couldn’t deny who she was.

[princelina]

14 hours ago, ifionlyknew said:

Frasier had lots of jokes about being gay but the writers did it so much better than the Friends writers. Even Seinfeld did it better with the whole "not that there is anything wrong with that" episode.

 

13 hours ago, YoukaiMoe said:

I really do wonder why there were so many gay jokes when one of the creators of the freakin' show was gay himself!

Haha good question - I was going to say maybe it was because all the men on Frasier (except Frasier) were gay themselves 😄 

Some of the funniest episodes are what I call the "gay Frasiers" - when he fixes Daphne up with the station manager, his dad at the opera, and the one where he "dates" the opera director.  But I still laugh at some of the friends' jokes - sometimes they're just funny.  I guess the show's creator thought so too at the time 😄 

[Mr. Meatball Man]

On 1/26/2021 at 10:28 AM, YoukaiMoe said:

I really do wonder why there were so many gay jokes when one of the creators of the freakin' show was gay himself!

That makes a lot of sense to me. He probably wasn't offended by the gay jokes because he made those same jokes about himself, and had gay friends that joked like that, too. It's like how there are a lot of stereotypical jokes about Jewish people on Family Guy, but the majority of the writing staff is Jewish.

When I think about the comedy on Friends, I don't see it as problematic or offensive for the most part. At the end of the day, Friends is one of the safest sitcoms in history. The writers weren't trying to be edgy or offend people, it was more of a reflection of the times. I'm sure you can go back and find jokes in Full House that wouldn't be around today, but that's because it ran from the late 1980s to the mid 1990s. It's more of a reflection of what the world was at the time rather than being edgy.

Granted, there are jokes that just aren't funny regardless of the era. Like when Jill accused Ross of being gay for not wanting to sleep with her, or Phoebe making fun of Joey for wanting to get his eyebrows waxed, then saying that she can dye her hair because she's a woman. This is the same Phoebe who once said that a guy comfortable in his masculinity can wear women's underwear, and said Joey wasn't a real man because he thought her boyfriend wearing women's underwear was weird. But a lot of that is due to different writers and showrunners so characters' personalities change by the episode, or by the scene.

[Kawaiiko]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Meatball Man said:

That makes a lot of sense to me. He probably wasn't offended by the gay jokes because he made those same jokes about himself, and had gay friends that joked like that, too. 

When I think about the comedy on Friends, I don't see it as problematic or offensive for the most part. At the end of the day, Friends is one of the safest sitcoms in history.

Granted, there are jokes that just aren't funny regardless of the era. Like when Jill accused Ross of being gay for not wanting to sleep with her, or Phoebe making fun of Joey for wanting to get his eyebrows waxed, then saying that she can dye her hair because she's a woman. This is the same Phoebe who once said that a guy comfortable in his masculinity can wear women's underwear, and said Joey wasn't a real man because he thought her boyfriend wearing women's underwear was weird. But a lot of that is due to different writers and showrunners so characters' personalities change by the episode, or by the scene.

Well said.

[Ms Blue Jay]

33 minutes ago, Mr. Meatball Man said:

Granted, there are jokes that just aren't funny regardless of the era. Like when Jill accused Ross of being gay for not wanting to sleep with her, 

I thought that was about Jill being highly conceited.  If a man doesn't want me, he's gay.  But, I get your point of view because if a man said that about a woman I'd probably be more offended.  LOL.

And Joey asking about homo sapiens, he was legitimately asking.  He didn't know what homo sapiens means. I didn't take it as a homophobic thing.

But there are other things that are just weird. Ross not understanding the concept of a male caregiver or nanny is extremely fucked up.  Joey didn't understand the concept at first either, but he adored Sandy after he met him.  

[ifionlyknew]

I think if Friends was made today they would probably have a gay character.  And probably a person of color.  I am not one of those people who criticizes Friends for being about six straight white people.  The show was about that particular group of friends and they were what they were.  But today shows are intended to be more diverse.  

[Ms Blue Jay]

31 minutes ago, ifionlyknew said:

I think if Friends was made today they would probably have a gay character.  And probably a person of color.  I am not one of those people who criticizes Friends for being about six straight white people.  The show was about that particular group of friends and they were what they were.  But today shows are intended to be more diverse.  

It's called "Happy Endings" (2011-2013.) 😄

It's the exact same thing except there is a straight Black character and a gay white character.  And the Black character is also in an interracial relationship with one of the other 6.

And that show referenced "Friends" and acknowledged that it was basically a new school copy.

I wish there was a clip online, but I'm not seeing anything.

Quote

Brad (Damon Wayans Jr.), loopy and slurring from a megadose of laughing gas at a dentist’s appointment, perks up when he sees his friends — but he calls them by the names of another set of friends. Pointing in turn to Dave (Zachary Knighton), Alex (Elisha Cuthbert), Penny (Casey Wilson) and Max (Adam Pally), Brad exclaims: “Hey, Ross! Rachel! Phoebe! Fat Joey!” A few beats later, he turns to his wife, Jane (Eliza Coupe), and pouts, “Don’t patronize me, Monica.”

A lot of people say "How I Met Your Mother" was another tribute to "Friends" but I'd say that that cast was actually LESS diverse.  Even the cast of "Friends" had Jewish characters.  Neil Patrick Harris is gay but his character was straight and I don't think being Canadian counts for diversity especially when Matthew Perry already is! 😄

Edited January 27, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[ifionlyknew]

9 minutes ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

It's called "Happy Endings" (2011-2013.) 

I loved that show.  Whereas I found Friends humorous I thought Happy Endings was hilarious laugh out loud funny. It streams on Prime.

[Madding crowd]

The scene where Phoebe ‘s boyfriend wore her bikini underwear bugged me because women ( especially thin ones like Phoebe) are built different than men and have small waists and bigger hips. Joey in particular has a bigger waist and wouldn’t be able to wear a tiny sized woman’s underwear. There are if course men who wear women ‘s underwear but unless they are tiny themselves, they need bigger sizes.

[princelina]

7 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

The scene where Phoebe ‘s boyfriend wore her bikini underwear bugged me because women ( especially thin ones like Phoebe) are built different than men and have small waists and bigger hips. Joey in particular has a bigger waist and wouldn’t be able to wear a tiny sized woman’s underwear. There are if course men who wear women ‘s underwear but unless they are tiny themselves, they need bigger sizes.

I always found it laughable that we were supposed to believe he fit in Rachel's underwear 😄 

[Danny Franks]

On 1/22/2021 at 9:07 PM, Llywela said:

Joey and Rachel actually made a lot of sense, for a little while there. While they were living together and getting on so well, and Joey was being so supportive of Rachel's pregnancy, I could see it. But it was never going to be a real thing, so was never written to be a serious prospect. The show was too set on Ross/Rachel.

I agree. I thought they had a nice little relationship, while they lived together  - there were lots of little nods to their closeness and how well they knew one another. Like Rachel immediately knowing that taking Joey's food was a no-no when Phoebe didn't see the big deal, or when Joey knew what foods made Rachel sick during her pregnancy.

The frustrating thing about it is, the show played Joey's crush with a lot of sincerity and took it seriously. His feelings weren't dismissed as a joke, or something to easily get over, and it resulted in that really lovely scene of them both in the restaurant together.

Rachel being into him was initially played quite broadly, with Rachel regressing to a very ditzy, early season version of herself, but the season nine finale really leaned into the romance of it and presented them as a viable couple. Then Joey has that talk with Ross in TOW Ross is Fine, about his feelings for Rachel and that she seems to feel the same, where they both take it very seriously and Ross realises he needs to get over himself.

Then... in the next episode it's all tossed away with slapstick dumbassery, and never mentioned again.

On 1/27/2021 at 7:09 PM, Mr. Meatball Man said:

When I think about the comedy on Friends, I don't see it as problematic or offensive for the most part. At the end of the day, Friends is one of the safest sitcoms in history. The writers weren't trying to be edgy or offend people, it was more of a reflection of the times. I'm sure you can go back and find jokes in Full House that wouldn't be around today, but that's because it ran from the late 1980s to the mid 1990s. It's more of a reflection of what the world was at the time rather than being edgy.

This is why I get annoyed about all the revisionist takes on Friends. Is it lacking in diversity? Yes. Was that at all unusual for 90s sitcoms? No.

Seinfeld was a bunch of straight, white characters, so were Frasier, Roseanne, Mad About You and Sex in the City. Married With Children and Grace Under Fire were about white families. On the other hand Fresh Prince of Bel Air and Martin had black casts.

That's just what the landscape of television was in the 90s. None of it was with malicious intent, or consciously exclusionary. That was just the accepted reality of programming at the time. Should there have been more black and Hispanic people in 90s Manhattan? Sure. Would a group of six friends, half of whom grew up together on Long Island, have a black or Hispanic person in their group? That doesn't seem as likely. Yes, if the show was made today Joey might be black and Phoebe might be lesbian, but it isn't being made today, it was made over twenty five years ago.

I seem to remember Will & Grace being presented as a groundbreaking show simply for having multiple gay characters in significant roles, and that premiered four years after Friends put a lesbian couple on the screen in a positive (apart from Susan being nasty to Ross) light.

Edited January 30, 2021 by Danny Franks

[readster]

1 hour ago, Danny Franks said:

 

I seem to remember Will & Grace being presented as a groundbreaking show simply for having multiple gay characters in significant roles, and that premiered four years after Friends put a lesbian couple on the screen in a positive (apart from Susan being nasty to Ross) light.

Exactly and that I think made them both refreshing. Susan was nasty, but it did reflect  the classic "post-divorce" relationship that the show either handled well or with a: "umm... why would they do that?" I agree problems with revisit its want to throw out diversity when I'm sorry, the shows were made in the early to mid 90s. People just want to go with: "Well, that's now how things are now." Right. We are judging past ideologies, commonalities, ect that happened in a different time. Let's face it, people view All in the Family or Webster a lot different than they did in the mid 70s-early 80s. Culture change, the world moves on and things do become products of their times and some just remain classic because the message ring true and were ground breaking then and even now. Sadly, people just need to accept things happened, both good and bad and stop trying change them or "go back to when things were normal". 

[Ms Blue Jay]

Personally I don't think there's anything to defend in intentionally putting out a prime time show of all 6 white people in Manhattan.  It says something pretty dark about television, that producers only want to watch white people, that they think only white people represent New York, and America at large, and they think that America would only want to watch white people on their screen.  That's a weird way of thinking.  You can do whatever you want on television.  Look at "Star Trek".  How old is that show and how diverse are those shows?  Were any non-white people even allowed to audition for "Friends"?  I have a bunch of books about the show so I guess eventually I'll find out.  

Television can represent an ultimate fantasy.  Look at Monica's apartment.  Everyone complains that Monica's apartment isn't realistic.  That it's just a fantasy.  So just because only well to do white people lived in Greenwich Village in the 90s (I don't know, I have no idea) doesn't mean you HAVE to reflect that and be closed to other possibilities.  For example, having Ross's ex-wife be in a lesbian couple, getting married, and raising a child on television in the 90s was pretty revolutionary.  So it's not like the writers were scared of revolutionary ideas.

"Fresh Prince" was about Benny Medina's life I believe, but it was also sort of a fantasy.  The show could do whatever it wanted, and it did.  If Joey can be on "Days of our Lives" it's kind of weird to believe that it's too out of the realm of thinking that a prime time show in 1994 could have some non-white people on it.  Almost everyone on "Friends" was white.  Gunther, the people in Monica's building (until season 8), etc.  Is it realistic?  I didn't go to university in New York but when I went to university I met mostly non-white people.  So Ross's best friend from college didn't have to be white and that guy's roommate didn't have to be white.  Calling it "realistic" is extremely subjective.  And Phoebe was ex-homeless, and Rachel came from money, so they had no problem covering different classes.  Chandler was white collar, Phoebe was blue collar, etc. etc. 

The writers had no idea the influence they'd have on pop culture and the world at large, but now writers know better.  There will never be another "Friends" because nobody watches cable the way we used to, but writers know they have some responsibility now.  Look at "Bridgerton".  It's a period romance that's incredibly diverse and Netflix claims it's its most watched show of all time.

Edited January 30, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Nellise]

14 hours ago, Ms Blue Jay said:

So just because only well to do white people lived in Greenwich Village in the 90s (I don't know, I have no idea) 

Greenwich Village in the 90s was extremely white, like over 95% white. Manhattan wasn't some grand mix of people all living together wonderfully, it was heavily segregated like most northern cities.

If it makes people feel better to have whatever types of people in their shows that's fine, but I don't like the argument that Friends wasn't representing reality. That's ignoring that neighborhoods in big cities were, and often still are, dominated by one group. Like Chicago is essentially equally divided between white, black and hispanic, yet almost every single neighborhood is mostly made up of only one of those.

Edited January 31, 2021 by Nellise

[Ms Blue Jay]

Yeah I went to Manhattan in 1998.  There were definitely a lot of Black people, often working class.  So Black people 100% did exist in Manhattan in the 90s and could have easily been far more visible on the show.  The show was mostly white faces all of the time, and I think that's why this show gets more attacked for this than "Seinfeld".  

On "Seinfeld", the crew went to a diner almost daily where the manager was Black, Elaine and George had Black coworkers and bosses, Sid the parking guy was Black, Kramer's lawyer was Black, Kramer's best friend was Mickey, who is a little person.  And "Seinfeld" started 5 years before "Friends" did in 1989.

Black people finally started to "exist" in the "Friends" world around Season 8, I would say.  

Edited January 31, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Kawaiiko]

Before Season 8, the only time they really had black people on the show were background extras (and there weren't even that many of those) and bit parts. 

[Ms Blue Jay]

11 hours ago, YoukaiMoe said:

Before Season 8, the only time they really had black people on the show were background extras (and there weren't even that many of those) and bit parts. 

Yup!  

[Hiyo]

“The character was utterly unsympathetic and if she'd been a man, her actions would have made the entirety of the audience hate her.”

I’d say I hated her quite a few times. Disliked her quite a bit most of the other time too.

“He comes over hours before they need to be ready and yells at them”

Didn’t he only come over a half hour before? Was’t that the conceit of the episode?

Edited February 6, 2021 by Hiyo

[Hiyo]

“Chandler and Ross are both portrayed as the intellectual book-smart people on the show.  Ross is an intellectual, a professor, and Chandler is the only white-collar worker besides him.  Chandler is smart, he's sarcastic, he's cutting, sardonic, he makes fun of people for making dumb mistakes, he works with numbers, he's highly paid and successful.”

I never saw Chandler as intellectual at all. Lots of people working white collar jobs aren’t, they were just good at studying whatever degree they needed to in college to get that type of job.

[Hiyo]

“If it makes people feel better to have whatever types of people in their shows that's fine, but I don't like the argument that Friends wasn't representing reality. That's ignoring that neighborhoods in big cities were, and often still are, dominated by one group. Like Chicago is essentially equally divided between white, black and hispanic, yet almost every single neighborhood is mostly made up of only one of those.”

Exactly.

[Ms Blue Jay]

On 2/6/2021 at 1:45 PM, Hiyo said:

I never saw Chandler as intellectual at all. Lots of people working white collar jobs aren’t, they were just good at studying whatever degree they needed to in college to get that type of job.

That's what a capitalistic society considers intellectual.  White collar work is given more respect than other work, and is paid more accordingly.  Anyways, I think Chandler is very smart.  Not emotionally, but in other ways for sure.  He's clever and quick witted in my opinion.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[ButterQueen]

On 1/20/2021 at 5:34 PM, Crs97 said:

I am totally Team Ross on the No One is Ready episode.  First, they go to Joey's horrid plays and try to say something nice.  They listen to Phoebe sing and try to say something nice.  It wasn't going to kill them to attend Ross' big night.  My dad, who was amazing in so many ways, was always late.  If the wedding started at 7 pm and was 30 minutes away, you could almost guarantee that at 6:20 he'd start looking around at all of us standing there ready to go and announce that he should probably go get a shower.  The number of times the procession was the bridesmaids, the maid of honor, our family, and then the bride - I am shuddering just remembering it.  Did we make it in time?  Technically, yes, and the friends who knew us thought it was hilarious, but I hated it.  Husband knows I just about panic at the thought of being late, even if it turns out to be no big deal.  It's a big deal to me, which counts for something.

Also, I never bought that Rachel didn't know what she wanted to wear beforehand and was slow just because she was trying to look pretty for Ross.  Now if they wanted to make it that Rachel had picked a dress, but it was the only thing Phoebe could fit into after her dress was ruined and that is why Rachel is now at a loss - I could have bought that.  But finding out Rachel hadn't put a thought into what would be appropriate for her boyfriend's big evening?  Nope. 

My rant is over.

I’m sorry....this made me cry with laughter.  😂😂

“The number of times the procession was the bridesmaids, the maid of honor, our family, and then the bride - I am shuddering just remembering it. “

 

[Hiyo]

Quote

That's what a capitalistic society considers intellectual.  White collar work is given more respect than other work, and is paid more accordingly. 

I disagree. As someone who is also from a capitalistic society, being white collar and being paid more doesn't equal being intellectual per se. Was Chandler smart? Yes. Was he creative? Yes. Is every smart and creative white collar type necessarily intellectual? No, not really.

But I guess mileage varies and all that.

[Ms Blue Jay]

21 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

As someone who is also from a capitalistic society, being white collar and being paid more doesn't equal being intellectual per se.  Is every smart and creative white collar type necessarily intellectual? No, not really.

I don't agree with any of those statements either.   Personally I am speaking about Chandler.

Edited February 8, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[Hiyo]

As am I. And I think by most people's definition of what constitutes intellectual, Chandler doesn't really fit the bill.

[princelina]

12 minutes ago, Hiyo said:

As am I. And I think by most people's definition of what constitutes intellectual, Chandler doesn't really fit the bill.

Agreed - I too would call him clever and witty and quick vs. intellectual, which to me implies into books, learning, academia, etc. as Ross was.  But if people are thinking intellectual = smart - he and Ross were definitely the two smartest of the characters.

[Kawaiiko]

On 2/6/2021 at 1:32 PM, Hiyo said:

“The character was utterly unsympathetic and if she'd been a man, her actions would have made the entirety of the audience hate her.”

I’d say I hated her quite a few times. Disliked her quite a bit most of the other time too.

 

I have forgotten what character this quote was about. Phoebe? Rachel?

[Hiyo]

Susan.

[Kawaiiko]

1 hour ago, Hiyo said:

Susan.

Ok, good to know. Sorry again!

[Kawaiiko]

On 2/6/2021 at 1:32 PM, Hiyo said:

Didn’t he only come over a half hour before? Was’t that the conceit of the episode?

Pretty much, @Hiyo. I'm on Ross's side for TOW No One's Ready. No I don't think he should've thrown Rachel's shoes at her, but it always pissed me off that no one has any respect for Ross (even though I hate Ross). Especially Chandler and Joey, they were just dicking around with that chair thing. Of course Joey wearing Chandler's clothes was very funny but it just feels so... I guess sitcom has to sitcom.

Edited February 12, 2021 by YoukaiMoe
mention

[ifionlyknew]

1 hour ago, YoukaiMoe said:

Pretty much, @Hiyo. I'm on Ross's side for TOW No One's Ready. No I don't think he should've thrown Rachel's shoes at her, but it always pissed me off that no one has any respect for Ross (even though I hate Ross). Especially Chandler and Joey, they were just dicking around with that chair thing. Of course Joey wearing Chandler's clothes was very funny but it just feels so... I guess sitcom has to sitcom.

I like Ross and I do agree his friends do enjoy mocking him and making fun of his job.  For the life of me I don't understand why sitcoms think being very smart is something to be made fun of.  You could argue the show evened it out by making fun of Joey but I didn't always find that funny either.  When they had Joey do a dumb thing like getting in the entertainment center and was robbed I thought that was funny.  But with Ross they were making fun of him and not a smart thing he did.

[Mr. Meatball Man]

8 hours ago, ifionlyknew said:

I like Ross and I do agree his friends do enjoy mocking him and making fun of his job.  For the life of me I don't understand why sitcoms think being very smart is something to be made fun of.  You could argue the show evened it out by making fun of Joey but I didn't always find that funny either.  When they had Joey do a dumb thing like getting in the entertainment center and was robbed I thought that was funny.  But with Ross they were making fun of him and not a smart thing he did.

To me, they didn't make fun of Ross because he was smart. They made fun of him mostly because of his character flaws, like flaunting his intelligence or his obsessive behavior or being divorced multiple times. True, they did make fun of his job, but that's mostly because they didn't understand it and Ross constantly talked about it. Personally, if I knew my friends had no interest in my job, I wouldn't talk about it that much. They probably would have made fun of Chandler if they knew what his job was, but they didn't.

I think all of the characters were made fun of at some point. Even Rachel called Phoebe a stupid hippie in season nine. How much the characters were made fun of is an interesting question.

[Bort]

Yeah, I think they made fun of Ross because he was such a huge geek about it. I mean, the man wore dinosaur ties, dinosaur watches, had them on his checks... We get it, you like dinosaurs. I’ve never personally known any paleontologists but in general, nobody over the age of 12 talks about dinosaurs as much as Ross did.

[WinnieWinkle]

16 hours ago, kariyaki said:

Yeah, I think they made fun of Ross because he was such a huge geek about it. I mean, the man wore dinosaur ties, dinosaur watches, had them on his checks... We get it, you like dinosaurs. I’ve never personally known any paleontologists but in general, nobody over the age of 12 talks about dinosaurs as much as Ross did.

Also the writers I feel showed Ross as being someone who was over the top proud of his knowledge (or as we would have called it back in grade school - being a smarty pants) and unable to "read the room" in terms of who wants to hear about his field of interest.  Ok for Ross it was paleontology a field a lot of us have at least some interest in but it could easily have been something like engineering or maths or nuclear chemisty where most of us would have our eyes glazing over if someone were to talk endless about their field. 

In some of the episodes I had to wonder if at least one of the writers had had negative experiences at college.  Ross was definitely not written as poster boy for the benefits of higher education IMO.

[princelina]

But he's never funnier than when he realizes that he's being a smarty pants and everyone is judging him - so he abruptly stops and turns away 😄😄 😄 

[Danny Franks]

23 hours ago, WinnieWinkle said:

Also the writers I feel showed Ross as being someone who was over the top proud of his knowledge (or as we would have called it back in grade school - being a smarty pants) and unable to "read the room" in terms of who wants to hear about his field of interest.  Ok for Ross it was paleontology a field a lot of us have at least some interest in but it could easily have been something like engineering or maths or nuclear chemisty where most of us would have our eyes glazing over if someone were to talk endless about their field. 

In some of the episodes I had to wonder if at least one of the writers had had negative experiences at college.  Ross was definitely not written as poster boy for the benefits of higher education IMO.

Hey, at least all his friends at least remembered what his job was.

I didn't mind the anti-intellectual tones now and again, because it was clear that none of the others were people who would be interested in Ross's anecdotes and work talk. There were plenty of other smart people who appeared on the show - Pete, Richard, Julie, David, Mike etc - who weren't mocked for their intelligence. It was really just Ross.

[ljenkins782]

On 2/12/2021 at 5:33 PM, kariyaki said:

Yeah, I think they made fun of Ross because he was such a huge geek about it. I mean, the man wore dinosaur ties, dinosaur watches, had them on his checks... We get it, you like dinosaurs. I’ve never personally known any paleontologists but in general, nobody over the age of 12 talks about dinosaurs as much as Ross did.

The other day, I watched the one where he wears the all white suit and tells Rachel that he had to stop wearing it while they were dating and her response was "Now that we're no longer together, you're free to look at stupid as you'd like." LOL

I've been watching this again on HBO Max after a period where I had no interest in rewatching it and am watching season 3 now. What a difference 20 years makes in my view of the Ross/Rachel relationship. His behavior in the episode where they take their infamous break is especially infuriating. Him continuing to be all showy and insisting on celebrating their anniversary in her office despite her saying roughly a million times that she was busy...gah. Just obnoxious. Nothing irritates me more than people who refuse to hear what you're saying and decide that they know better or that what they want to do trumps what you want/are doing.

[Kawaiiko]

Ross was a prick who had no respect for his girlfriend as a person and he treated her like something he owned. (i.e. "Rachel who's carrying my baby")

[Mr. Meatball Man]

The only times Ross pissed me off were, unsurprisingly, when it was about Rachel. The way he reacted when he found out Joey was in love with her, the way he treated Joey after the accidental proposal, not giving Rachel the message from that guy at the bar, acting like a little kid when he saw Rachel kiss Gavin, yelling at Rachel because she didn't say goodbye to him.............and these were all in the later seasons.

There was also the time he didn't get the annulment, but that was creepy more than infuriating. Although, it did give us classic scenes like "You want to know a secret? I didn't get the annulment. We're still married. Don't tell Rachel, bye." And also when he went to his divorce lawyer and said, "Yes. Second in two years. Third overall." 😂

Edited February 17, 2021 by Mr. Meatball Man

[Ms Blue Jay]

Ross is actually my third favourite friend, so it's always funny to see how much people really seem to despise him as the worst thing about the show on social media.  It seems to be the same reaction to Ted from How I Met your Mother, whom I also really enjoy.  

But yes, sometimes he really pissed me off.  The worst was when he slept with someone else after a fight with Rachel, "Break" or "not".

The point was never whether Ross and Rachel were on a break.  The point (for me) was that Ross slept with someone else like, minutes after their fight.

Also, couples take "breaks".  From my understanding, Rachel seemed to want a time out from Ross.  Not some kind of free pass to sleep with other men.  That was so not her concern (in my opinion.)  A break to Rachel meant like, leave me alone for a bit.  Not, "I don't love you", or "Please go ahead and sleep around".  Ross is such a classic deflector.

Edited February 17, 2021 by Ms Blue Jay

[mojoween]

Watching Erica give birth makes me feel ooky in a pandemic world.  Why is no one wearing a mask?!?

One thing I do like in that episode is Phoebe’s “that is the rule” when Joey laments that he cannot visit the chick and the duck on the farm.  She thought quickly and said something nice that wouldn’t make Joey feel badly.

[Katy M]

53 minutes ago, mojoween said:

One thing I do like in that episode is Phoebe’s “that is the rule” when Joey laments that he cannot visit the chick and the duck on the farm.  She thought quickly and said something nice that wouldn’t make Joey feel badly.

I feel like Joey's old enough to find out that pets die.

[supposebly]

He knew that dogs don't really go on a farm when Ross thought so in an early episode: My God, Chichi!

I know this show better than the writers did.

[mojoween]

About Chichi, Ross got all upset when he realized about the farm, but then a few years later didn’t he not know who Chichi was?  I know their dad didn’t remember him, at least.

[Kawaiiko]

This show was really not good at continuity. I know it has been said before but it deserves to be said again.

[Bort]

I get annoyed on Monica’s behalf that Ross kept bringing that stupid monkey with him over to her apartment. She clearly doesn’t like it being there, why is he so rude?