The Starling City Times: News and Media about Arrow

[apinknightmare]

22 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I don't understand the Wild Dog love.

I think it's because he's the one they've chosen to stick around. 

[Chaser]

Yeah I get that. I just don't understand the why. I wanted to smack him more than once.

[lemotomato]

Also because Wild Dog is the best fit for the "gritty! Street level! Fighting!" message they've been pushing this season. 

[tarotx]

8 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I think it's because he's the one they've chosen to stick around. 

I'm thinking it's the other way around. I think he will get killed and they want us to love him so that when Prometheus kills him we will have feels.

Spoiler

I'm thinking Tina is going to be both Wild Dog's ex and the new Canary they'll test as a Oliver love interest. 

Edited October 13, 2016 by tarotx

[popgoesculture]

24 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

 

I didn't think it's that Oliver is incompetent but I think he doesn't really at heart want to be the Mayor. I think Thea was accurate when she said, "Vigilante by day, Mayor by night". I think she knows he might not be 100% in to being the Mayor. At least that was my take on it.

But he ran for Mayor... he, at one point, wanted to be Mayor (or the show wanted him to be). If he changed his mind and is still upset about the dissolution of his team, that's fine, but I'd rather the show tell us that directly, rather than continual scenes of Thea getting the brunt of his work and Oliver making truly ridiculous decisions. Have him step down as interim Mayor (particularly if they're going to push Quentin as the deputy Mayor). 

The Mayor storyline adds absolutely nothing to the show for me... It seems more like they're trying to recapture elements of Seasons 1 and 2, and trying to figure out how to recreate it, rather than showing how all the characters have developed/changed. 

I think I'm just irked that storylines of both the female regular characters in the show are dependent on Oliver; Thea's work for him as Mayor, Felicity's work for him as the Green Arrow. Work that is by its very nature invisible -- it isn't really recognized by others within the show.  I want both women to have lives of their own, storylines that don't revolve around him, and aren't necessarily just "here's a boyfriend of the week/until we find out he's evil/dead/potential hero of a spinoff/a DJ/all of the above." (I'll never forget you, DJ Assassin.)

But I think this is all delving too closely into another thread... basically, to bring it back to the Media, I find it disquieting that this is how they're advertising the show and the storylines of the two female regulars. For a show that continues to have Bamford with his nostril close ups/shaky cam style direct so many episodes... it's bizarre to me that with the continual discussions of much needed diversity behind scenes, the show is failing to do this either on the screen or behind it.

[tv echo]

I really like this new EW reviewer (and bonus point for the Firefly reference)...

Arrow recap: 'The Recruits'
BY SARA NETZLEY  Posted October 13 2016 
http://www.ew.com/recap/arrow-season-5-episode-2?xid=entertainment-weekly_socialflow_twitter

Quote

“It’s really hot. I mean not,” says Felicity, speaking for those of us in the audience inclined to agree with her.
*  *  *
Felicity chucks him on the chest and says, “Some could say the same about you.” Then she chuckles and says, “I’ve been waiting five years to make that joke!” WORTH IT! And seriously, that Olicity chemistry? Still there. Let’s get this fixed, writers. By November sweeps, if possible.
*  *  *
At the clinic, Oliver’s trainees are decked out in AmerTeks volunteer T-shirts and wicked face bruises, and Ramirez sneers when Oliver enters with his entourage. “Pretty boy Queen here thinks he’s actually saving the city.” Gotta say, this clinic has truly enormous windows. Mayor Queen, you have failed patient confidentiality.
*  *  *
Then Felicity pulls Oliver aside to yell at him for being physically and emotionally abusive. Oliver spits back that he had five years of training. Laurel didn’t, and look where she is now. I’m starting to think we could make a decent drinking game out of Laurel mentions this season. Any time they show the statue, it’s a social.
*  *  *
Oliver wants to go the tough love route, minus the love, while Felicity advocates for not doing that. I dunno. I’m mostly Team Oliver here. Arrow has taught us that the most effective training happens through harsh methods. Thea and Malcolm. Sara and the League of Assassins. Oliver and, well, everybody. Training isn’t about hand holding and sharing jokes. Still, Oliver’s intense here. Intense. Fi may have a point, too.

Another challenge: Because the Arrowcave’s gas chromatograph was destroyed, Felicity has no way to analyze the scrap of cloak that Ramirez secured, so she shows up at the police station to lie her cute butt off to her boyfriend. His full name is Billy Malone, which I only learned because it popped up on Felicity’s phone. Barnacle Bill has a nice ring to it, doesn’t it?

Anyway, Felicity makes up an insane story about a friend’s cleaning woman going missing and that rag being the only clue. Barnacle Bill buys it, then drops the fact that he’d like to actually meet her friends someday. So that’ll be fun, whenever that happens. Then they kiss, and the Olicity portions of the internet explode into hellfire.
*  *  *
“When I was in Bratva—” he starts, and Felicity makes a soft surprised sound because he never talks about his time in Russia. This got me, for some reason, this reminder of the intimacies they shared. She immediately knows how hard this information is for him to divulge.
*  *  *
“Without personal attachment, there can be no loss,” he says.

Woof. What a great reminder of the person Oliver was when he returned to Starling City five years ago, and how much he grew because of those personal connections. With his old team scattered, it’s no wonder he’s grieving now, and pushing everyone away with two hands.

Felicity brings him back to the present and reminds him that the reason his old team worked so well was because they trusted him, Oliver Queen, not the Green Arrow. “He’s the one that I choose to stand by, and I continue to choose to stand by,” she says. Because say what you will, these two still love each other, even if those feelings are expressed in a different fashion than a year ago.
*  *  *
Now, my favorite scene of the week: Thea casually parkours to the top of a building in her dress clothes to eavesdrop on AmerTek CEO Janet agreeing to sell gangster Tobias Church enough weapons to level the city. Zoinks!
*  *  *
His unit’s tasked with retrieving triggers from the nukes that fell on Genesis day so Chechen rebels can’t seize them. But his corrupt CO wants them for himself, kills the men not in on the plan and sets Diggle up to take the fall. Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!

Edited October 13, 2016 by tv echo

[Sakura12]

Is Wild dog the stupid looking one with the hockey mask? 

[Chaser]

Yes.

[catrox14]

12 minutes ago, popgoesculture said:

But he ran for Mayor... he, at one point, wanted to be Mayor (or the show wanted him to be). If he changed his mind and is still upset about the dissolution of his team, that's fine, but I'd rather the show tell us that directly, rather than continual scenes of Thea getting the brunt of his work and Oliver making truly ridiculous decisions. Have him step down as interim Mayor (particularly if they're going to push Quentin as the deputy Mayor).

 Yes I know he ran for Mayor but maybe now he's seeing it's gonna be a lot harder to pull of than he though.   It may very well end up that Oliver steps down or loses a re-election mostly because I don't think they can sustain him being the Mayor and not eventually be outed as the Green Arrow for much longer. JMHO. 

[dtissagirl]

I think incompetent Oliver is part the fault of the abject square-ness of the showrunners and the writers room. It's like they write the show from the mid aughts. To an audience who never watched Shondaland. While most newer procedurals and power soaps are rooted in competency porn, Arrow still goes the opposite route of using incompetence as the starting point of a narrative -- Oliver needs to be bad at something so he can learn how to be good at it. It's both the macro theme of the entire show, and the micro theme of every episode -- terrible awful leader/trainer to the new recruits hears a couple of speeches, and learns to be a good leader/trainer by the end of the episode.

Edited October 13, 2016 by dtissagirl

[apinknightmare]

Oliver's main motivating factor for running for mayor was that it would be difficult to kill him, so I don't think he really put all that much thought into what the job would actually entail. 

Although what he's doing during the daytime hours as the Arrow that keeps him away from City Hall, I don't quite understand, but whatever show. 

[Lily-n11]

1 minute ago, apinknightmare said:

Although what he's doing during the daytime hours as the Arrow that keeps him away from City Hall, I don't quite understand, but whatever show. 

Sleeping?

[tv echo]

Arrow sows the seeds for a potential bounce-back season
By Alasdair Wilkins Oct 13, 2016  12:30 AM
http://www.avclub.com/tvclub/arrow-sows-seeds-potential-bounce-back-season-244146

Quote

It’s a little hard to judge episodes like “Recruits,” because so much of their appeal lies in their potential, not their reality. This is a quintessential setup episode, and what we get tonight could end up looking really good, really bad, or just sort of forgettable depending on where the show goes next. But for now, there’s plenty of reason to think Arrow is onto something worthwhile here. The addition of Ragman is especially intriguing, as at long last we might get some follow-up on, you know, that time Arrow dropped a nuclear bomb and then just sort of moved on to other things. Positioning the character as the sole survivor of Havenrock gives him all sorts of credibility as an equal to Oliver in the painful backstory department, and he figures to serve as a walking reminder to Felicity of her own role in the town’s destruction.
*  *  *
Oh hey, Felicity has a boyfriend in the police department! That’s… that’s fine. No objections here.

[tv echo]

Arrow Review: Ollie Learns Secrets and Teamwork Don’t Mix … Again
BY CRAIG WACK · OCTOBER 13, 2016
http://oohlo.com/2016/10/13/arrow-review-ollie-learns-secrets-and-teamwork-dont-mix-again/

Quote

For someone so extraordinary, Oliver Queen can be really slow on the uptake sometimes.

It may trace back to his ability to only remember his past in 90 second chronological bursts or his deep seeded desire to be Batman Green Arrow all by himself, but one thing is sure, you don’t want Ollie organizing your next team building exercise at the company retreat.

Dating back to his first days on the island, Ollie has been unsuccessfully trying — for almost a decade — to pair secrets with teamwork like it’s red wine with steak. His latest attempt was asking Curtis, Wild Dog and Imitation Canary to trust Ollie without Ollie really trusting any of them. The results were predictably disastrous.
*  *  *
Thankfully, Felicity was there to crack wise and call Ollie out on his crap. It was her 489th talk about secrets being bad and the man behind the mask being more inspirational than the Green Arrow could ever be, that brought Ollie to his senses....
*  *  *  
“Recruits” felt like an Arrow episode you’ve seen a dozen times before, but after a couple of seasons’ spinoff setup and the principal characters generally angry with one another – this was more like comfort food than a bitter pill.
*  *  *
This season, Arrow has successfully used a lighter touch and much to the fear of Olicity fans, it has everything to do with Ollie and Felicity not dating. Without Felicity being required to bear the emotional weight of their romantic partnership, they are more carefree with each other and there’s more light banter, now that their relationship isn’t sucking all the air out of the room. It seems inevitable that the good ship Olicity will sail once again; we can only hope the writers preserve enough of the platonic relationship the next time things get romantic.

Edited October 13, 2016 by tv echo

[Lily-n11]

1 hour ago, Lily-n11 said:

Sleeping?

This is actually something I wondered about in season 2. Team Arrow was at QC during daytime and in the lair at night. When did they sleep in season 2?

[lemotomato]

53 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Arrow Review: Ollie Learns Secrets and Teamwork Don’t Mix … Again
BY CRAIG WACK · OCTOBER 13, 2016
http://oohlo.com/2016/10/13/arrow-review-ollie-learns-secrets-and-teamwork-dont-mix-again/

This season, Arrow has successfully used a lighter touch and much to the fear of Olicity fans, it has everything to do with Ollie and Felicity not dating. Without Felicity being required to bear the emotional weight of their romantic partnership, they are more carefree with each other and there’s more light banter, now that their relationship isn’t sucking all the air out of the room. It seems inevitable that the good ship Olicity will sail once again; we can only hope the writers preserve enough of the platonic relationship the next time things get romantic.

Every time I read stuff like this I wonder if the reviewers have goldfish brains because they can't seem to remember Oliver and Felicity's interactions from 4.01-4.14 (minus parts of 4.08) when they were getting along perfectly while in a relationship and working together. Is there just a massive, collective case of amnesia among the reviewers or have they just decided that this is the narrative they're going to peddle to get the most people riled up?

[tangerine95]

Yeah I don't get where they got all this angst and Oliver and Felicity not having fun scenes and banter in season 4 when that was mostly their relationship apart from like the 3 episodes that focused on the break up drama. The way they were in 5.01 and 5.02 is basically what they were in 4a except now they don't kiss and we don't see them living together. 

[BkWurm1]

I've asked people about this since except for the Ray shrinking episode and 4-8, Olicity were pretty drama free until 4-15 and I was told that just the looming drama that was coming turned everything from 4-8 onward into Olicity angst and drama.  Fair or not. 

[lemotomato]

34 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

I've asked people about this since except for the Ray shrinking episode and 4-8, Olicity were pretty drama free until 4-15 and I was told that just the looming drama that was coming turned everything from 4-8 onward into Olicity angst and drama.  Fair or not. 

Of course. Because just like Felicity gets blamed for everything happening around her, Olicity gets blamed for potential drama even when it's not happening onscreen. WTF. (Not directed at you, @BkWurm1. I'm just beyond exasperated at seeing the same sentiment being repeated by professional reviewers-- people paid to watch a show-- when it isn't supported by what actually happened on the show.)

Edited October 13, 2016 by lemotomato

[Morrigan2575]

1 hour ago, BkWurm1 said:

I've asked people about this since except for the Ray shrinking episode and 4-8, Olicity were pretty drama free until 4-15 and I was told that just the looming drama that was coming turned everything from 4-8 onward into Olicity angst and drama.  Fair or not. 

I'd say 401-407 and 409, 411 were good episodes that showed drama free Olicity. I personally thought 410 was a shitty version of Oliver, one i can not support and have a hard time forgiving/accepting. That, plus 408 had me cheering on the breakup and NOT wanting Olicity back together in S4.

I can understand why people dreaded the pending fallout from 408. Thus souring everything after that episode making Olicity ALL angst and melodrama from the end of 408 until 419. It'snot what happened but, it's easy to see why they perceived it as such.

[BkWurm1]

4-10 had drama and even a touch of angst, but when Oliver and Felicity were together onscreen, they were so incredibly wonderful and gentle together.

[Morrigan2575]

8 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

4-10 had drama and even a touch of angst, but when Oliver and Felicity were together onscreen, they were so incredibly wonderful and gentle together.

Replying in relationship thread

Edited October 13, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[Guest]

Olicity had plenty of great moments in s4. The only problem is 408 was so bad and so contrived that it was like the sword of Damocles hanging over their whole relationship. You just knew that they were eventually going to break up and it sort of tainted everything from that point forward. Even though I enjoyed their scenes right up until 415, the whole time I was just waiting for the fallout of the baby mama crap. 

But then from 417 onwards they barely had any scenes together so I think it's unfair to say they were terrible all throughout s4. No. Just the contrived bullshit lie and how they chose to handle it.

[lemotomato]

19 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I'd say 401-407 and 409, 411 were good episodes that showed drama free Olicity. I personally thought 410 was a shitty version of Oliver, one i can not support and have a hard time forgiving/accepting. That, plus 408 had me cheering on the breakup and NOT wanting Olicity back together in S4.

I can understand why people dreaded the pending fallout from 408. Thus souring everything after that episode making Olicity ALL angst and melodrama from the end of 408 until 419. It'snot what happened but, it's easy to see why they perceived it as such.

But the show itself ignored the kid reveal from 4.09-4.12. Not a single mention or hint was made. I know the BM drama weighed heavily on the minds of many of us on this board, but I find it hard to understand why anyone not invested in Olicity staying together should care to the point where it created drama when there was none.

Edited October 13, 2016 by lemotomato

[Morrigan2575]

I don't think you have to be invested in Olicity to feel that hanging over the story. I think most people knew what was going to happen.  As i recall many reviewers commented about it a few times between 408 and 415. It was, IIRC, universally recognized and panned for exactly what it was (bullshit reason to cause relationship angst/drama).

So yes i can easily believe that people who had no vested interest Olicity as a ship saw the melodrama and relationship angst just waiting to erupt. I can see how that could easily make people view the relationship as dramatic even when there wasn't much angst/drama actually happening on screen.

[Carrie Ann]

I think people also found the paralysis story to be grim, and they tacked that onto Olicity too, in their minds. 

[Morrigan2575]

That's a good point.

[SmallScreenDiva]

"The real story" behind MG's Tumblr response over people trying to get him fired. I believe we'd already determined on this board that there was a missing word, "been," in his post mentioning Geoff Johns.

[tv echo]

Did The Flash Go Too Far With Its First Big Change To Arrow?
BY LAURA HURLEY Oct. 13, 2016
http://www.cinemablend.com/television/1565870/did-the-flash-go-too-far-with-its-first-big-change-to-arrow

Quote

...  The second episode of The Flash Season 3 gave us our first glimpse at a change to Arrow, and it's a big one. John Diggle's baby daughter Sara has been replaced with a son named John.
*  *  *
There was no reason why John, Jr. couldn't have a big sister named Sara in his life. Flashpoint didn't need to wipe Sara from existence in order for John to be born. It's not like Oliver's first move as mayor was to decree a one-kid maximum in Star City. He was far too busy erecting statues and playing hooky to even think about anything like that.
*  *  *
Personally, I'm puzzled by the decision to remove a young girl who is an original character from Arrow and replace her with a young boy who has a superhero destiny on another show. None of the series in the Flarrow-verse have a great track record when it comes to treatment of female characters, ranging from Iris and Caitlin's lives revolving around men on The Flash to Hawkgirl's primary role on Legends of Tomorrow as a love interest to Thea's forced interactions with a man who drugged her into doing his bidding on Arrow. Honestly, I'm still offended that one of Laurel's final acts before her death was to tell Oliver that he's totally the love of her life but it's totally cool that she's not the love of his, and I didn't even like Laurel. The last thing any of the shows in The CW's DC universe needed was to literally delete a female character from existence for no good reason. Little Sara can't even be mourned by her parents. She never existed.

Admittedly, Sara was never a huge character on Arrow. She was barely even two years old, and her biggest contributions to the series were fantastic reaction shots and adorable outfits. The point of her was never that another superhero had been born. The point of Sara was that wonderful things can still happen despite the doom and gloom of Star City. She was a happy accident and a normalizing element to keep the show grounded. Even if she wasn't a huge character, she was a character that helped the show feel like it was filled with people rather than comic caricatures.
*  *  *
Finally, there are practical reasons why the removal of Sara Diggle from The CW's DC universe was a bad idea. Pivotal moments of Arrow history actually stem from the fact that Digg and Lyla were having a baby girl. Arrow fans may recall this scene from Season 3:
*  *  *
If Oliver and Digg hadn't had their heart-to-heart over the necklace for Sara, Oliver might not have made a move on Felicity. They might not have gone on their date, which means that an Italian restaurant wouldn't have blown up, and Oliver wouldn't have crossed the line from friendship to romance by kissing Felicity at the hospital. Oliver and Felicity might not have slept together, and Felicity might not have given him the "Fight to live!" pep talk in the Season 3 finale, which means that he might have died at the hands of Ra's al Ghul. If he survived, Oliver might have left Star City by himself, which means he wouldn't have had Felicity to persuade him to return in Season 4. Damien Darhk might have killed a lot more people without the Green Arrow around.

Alternately, if Digg and Oliver didn't have their chat and Oliver didn't make his move on Felicity, Felicity might not have been so conflicted in her bizarro relationship with Ray. They might not have broken up, which means that Ray might not have kinda sorta blown himself up and become the amazing shrinking Atom. Vandal Savage might have successfully taken over the world because Ray never became a legend on Legends of Tomorrow. Who knows? Maybe Oliver never getting his date with Felicity blown up means that his showdown with Count Vertigo would have happened differently, Sara Lance may not have ended up at the wrong place at the wrong time to be killed, and the League of Assassins plot in Season 3 might never happened. Huge changes could happen to Arrow based simply on the switch from Baby Sara to John, Jr.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Season 5 Episode 2 Review: “The Recruits” 
Chris King+  October 12, 2016
http://www.tvovermind.com/the-cw/arrow/arrow-season-5-episode-2-review-the-recruits

Quote

The problem is that Oliver Queen is a broken man, a person so dismantled by all the heartbreak he has experienced over the past year that he retreats behind the symbol of the Green Arrow. However, thanks to people like Felicity and Curtis and even Star City’s newest vigilante, Ragman, Oliver is beginning to piece himself back together. He’s starting to believe again that he can fulfill the legacy of his father, the man who took his own life so that Oliver could survive. And when and if that belief comes back fully in Oliver, it won’t matter how “green” the team surrounding the Green Arrow is, because Oliver Queen will be their leader, and when Oliver Queen is at his best, he can inspire anyone.
*  *  *
I can’t state enough just how great that scene between Oliver and Felicity talking about the “real Oliver” was. Moments like that are why their relationship, romantic or not, remains one of the best parts of Arrow for me, and I hope that any potential drama involving her new boyfriend doesn’t ruin that connection at all.

[tv echo]

Arrow 5x02 Review: "The Recruits" (Let's Get Down to Business)
JustAboutWrite  Oct. 13, 2016
http://www.itsjustaboutwrite.com/2016/10/arrow-5x02-review-recruits-lets-get.html

Quote

You know what's more fun than watching Oliver Queen train a bunch of new recruits in the lair? Imagining the entire thing as if it was "I'll Make A Man Out of You" from Mulan. Stick with me here for a moment, won't you? The whole premise of that song was that Li Shang was training ill-equipped soldiers to prepare for battle. Mulan is essentially told that she doesn't have what it takes to fight, and is sent home. But she returns, because the ferocity of sheer will is an incredible thing. And she proves that she deserves to stay.
*  *  *
I liked this episode a lot more than the premiere, and I'm loving the integration of the new recruits so far, too. Also there has been quite a stir made in the Arrow fandom recently regarding Oliver and Felicity's relationship and some interviews conducted. But honestly? This kind of Oliver/Felicity episode is one that I want and one that I enjoyed. Felicity spoke truth into Oliver — with love. It wasn't necessarily romantic love (in the sense of "they're about to jump one another in the lair because of the UST"), but it was deep, genuine love that cannot be easily buried. And Oliver eventually listened to Felicity and realized she was right. Hopefully Oliver's character development will help set him back on a path toward reconciliation with Felicity; as long as complete and utter transparency and trust are the foundational elements of their new working relationship, it can be the foundation of their new romantic relationship — whenever that may occur.

MINUTE AND FAR AWAY: ARROW 5X02 REVIEW (THE RECRUITS) 
jbuffyangel OCTOBER 13, 2016 @ 15:25
http://jbuffyangel.tumblr.com/post/151762828873/minute-and-far-away-arrow-5x02-review-the

[tv echo]

Interesting perspective on the team concept...

Arrow 5.2 Review – “The Recruits”
October 13, 2016 | Posted by Michael Haigis
http://411mania.com/movies/arrow-5-2-review-the-recruits/

Quote

Oliver, stunned by the results of the test, is lectured by Anatoly, who says the others were shot because they hadn’t rung the bell and he had. Oliver contests, noting that they all helped ring it together. Anatoly’s retort is the earliest condemnation of Oliver’s motivation for leadership: He was the only one smart enough to find a way to ring the bell, and Bratva only wants the smartest – furthermore, Oliver had realized that he needed the others to help him achieve a goal and used them accordingly.

The idea that by leading a team which suits his purposes, Oliver is nakedly using his “followers” is one that deserves a deeper investigation. It’s not new for superheroes to struggle with accepting help – the primary foundation of heroism in their case is courage, and nothing in stories like this is more courageous than risking oneself to prevent harm to others.

But that’s the way it’s always framed – the heroes are either brave enough to fight their nemeses alone, or smart and well-adjusted enough to accept help. Rarely is it considered that using a team is exactly that – using a team. And that may come with a degree of passive manipulation. What Arrow is doing here is a smart investigation of that idea, and my hope is that this particular emotional framework being setup by the flashbacks isn’t glossed over.
*  *  *
It’s understandable – shows have to serve many masters, and they can’t be everything to everyone. But for me, this show is at its best when it’s using the luxury afforded to it by its medium – movies have only two or three hours to dig into this stuff, but TV shows have far more screen time. Arrow should use some of that time to sit with its characters, beloved by such a large chunk of the audience, for a little while. The Tobias Churches and Prometheuses (Promethei?) of the world are great; but the show is called Arrow – episodes like “The Recruits” don’t tell us anything more about the character with his name on the show, and that’s a shame.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Recap: Ragman Becomes Oliver's First Recruit
Robert Chan  October 13, 2016
https://www.yahoo.com/tv/arrow-recap-ragman-becomes-olivers-first-recruit-120015879.html

Quote

Ragman
Like we learned in that last Batman/Superman movie, any two heroes can get along if their parents are similar enough. Rory Regan is also an interesting character because, even when actual religious mysticism appears in comic properties, it’s usually Christian — angels, demons, and other Biblical entities. Rory’s father tells him his mystical rags are “from the time of Devarim” (part of the Torah) and the comic book version is similarly tied to Jewish traditions. It will be interesting to see how far they delve both into his cultural roots as well as the magical nature of his suit.

Felicity’s New Guy
So, the guy’s name is Billy Malone and he has access to the SCPD’s gas chromatograph? Yep, still hate him.
*  *  *
Quiverful of Thoughts
Helpful salmon ladder (that crazy pull-up exercise) tip for Curtis: Don’t try to give exposition while you’re doing it. Also, be Stephen Amell.

It is really difficult to emphasize just how wrong-headed it was to train the new Team Arrow with a Bratva exercise that resembles group MMA – a “sport” that combines the brutality of mixed martial arts with the idiocy of barroom brawls. It really is the dumbest thing imaginable. Yes, even dumber than the golf club you pee into.

So, Felicity continues to be haunted by her inability to save Havenrock, and the first guy to shake Oliver’s hand is the last survivor of Havenrock? Okay, well at least he doesn’t have any more nightmare inducing — what’s that? Ancient mystic fabrics that move all dark and tentacle-like? Now taking bets on how long before Felicity goes crazy from sleep deprivation.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow “The Recruits” Review (Season 5, Episode 2)
Jessica Breaux  October 13, 2016
http://www.tvequals.com/2016/10/13/arrow-the-recruits-review-season-5-episode-2/

Quote

I enjoy movie training sequences. In the beginning you have the protagonist who may or may not have some natural abilities, and they’re eager to use what abilities and training they have to save lives or be the champ or whatever. They’re eager, usually a bit cocky, and impatient. They want to get right to the good stuff without having to do what they consider mundane or inconsequential to them becoming a badass. Of course, there’s always the seemingly unreasonable coach/master/senior agent/etc. that’s holding the protagonist back by making them do all this stupid stuff. But in the end, the student finally realizes the wisdom in the teacher’s methods and is able to bring what he previously believed to be inconsequential nonsense to the fore and save the day. We love those kinds of movies. Think Rocky or The Karate Kid. I believe Arrow was attempting to achieve that same vibe with this episode, but they were only sort of successful.
*  *  *
All in all, this was a pretty good episode. We met Ragman, and he’s really just a kid who, like Oliver, feels tasked with a mission of vengeance. That’s an odd bonding point, but it worked. Speaking of the nuclear bomb that destroyed Ragman’s home and killed his family, I sincerely hope this means the show is going to actually address the repercussions of a nuclear strike. I said last season I was pretty disappointed that no one really dealt with the fact that a nuclear bomb killed tens of thousands of people. Ragman showing up and ostensibly joining Team Arrow might mean that we’re actually going to deal with that particular elephant in the room....

[tv echo]

Arrow S5: E2 – 'New Recruits'
By Robert Dougherty October 13, 2016 03:52PM EDT
http://www.themovienetwork.com/review/arrow-s5-e2-new-recruits

Quote

Arrow is already in midseason form when it can putter around and test patience for an act or two, then round back into form with one really good scene to wash it out. Usually it does this with an Olicity scene, although that comes as well after Curtis drops the figurative mike.

It is almost like old times as a shaken and easier to reach Oliver actually opens up to Felicity, and she gets through to him further without quite needing Curtis’s approach. The Olicity faithful were in real need of this bone right about now, in addition to bringing back the “Felicity drooling over Oliver on the salmon ladder” running gag. Of course, it only further reinforces the idiocy of keeping Olicity apart in other ways for no good reason besides filling time, as scenes like this did in Season 3.

Hiding behind Amell and Emily Bett Rickards, and trying to prove they can have their Olicity cake and eat it too for one reason or another, can only work so long to disguise the less than promising Olicity signs about this season in the long run, and that doesn’t just include Felicity’s new beau. But it is almost a sign of restraint that when Felicity says she still chooses to stand by Oliver and then gets a phone call, they don’t immediately confirm that it is Detective Malone. Of course, it is most likely implied either way.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Review: The Recruits (Season 5 Episode 2)
October 13, 2016  Lissete Lanuza Sáenz
http://telltaletv.com/2016/10/arrow-review-the-recruits-season-5-episode-2/

Quote

Well, okay. I actually enjoyed “The Recruits,” Arrow. Color me surprised.
*  *  *
In other words, next episode needs to be about bringing Diggle home. Because you can get a new family without abandoning the old one. You can adapt.

(That is, of course, unless Barry Allen decides to mess with time and erases your daughter. But that’s a story for The Flash review)

Arrow isn’t just about the action – though that’s been great in the first two episode of season 5. It’s not just about the superheroes. It’s about the people behind the masks.

It’s about Oliver Queen and his family. Whether that expands or contracts remains to be seen. But family?

That’s forever.
*  *  *
Other things to note:
- DCTV shows in general are failing their female characters left and right, but erasing Sara Diggle from existence? That’s low. That’s low.
- I’m confused – Oliver’s words about Laurel are supposed to be praise or is he referencing how bad she was at fighting when she started?
*  *  *
- Felicity pulling a S1 Oliver was hilarious. She’s as bad a liar as he is.
*   *  *
- Are these new versions of Oliver and Felicity the result of Flashpoint? Say yes, Arrow writers. Say yes. Because, at least then, it would make sense. Their banter is great, the chemistry is still on point, but they don’t come off as two people who were engaged a few months ago and who had a very bad breakup. They’re just …friends. And that’s fine, that’s great. Or it WOULD BE, for two people without their history.
- Going back to how the show was in Season 1 doesn’t mean erase everything that happened the last two seasons.
- No one can possibly change as quickly as Oliver did during the clinic. Just not possible. I understand this show expects us to suspend disbelief, but there are limits. THERE ARE LIMITS.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow 5×02 Review: Oliver Can’t Do This Alone
Oct. 13, 2016 by ALYSSA BARBIERI
http://fangirlish.com/arrow-5x02-review-oliver-cant-do-this-alone/

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While Oliver and Felicity aren’t exactly where we’d like them to be at present, that doesn’t mean that their final destination isn’t each other. I’m aware of the discouraging interviews and the over-stayed welcome of a temporary, generic-looking boyfriend, but it’s all just part of the journey.

Something that Arrow is managing to do under the watchful eyes of fans is rebuild Oliver and Felicity’s relationship for the better. While I agree there was no need to tear them apart in the first place, the thing is we can’t ignore that the baby mama drama and the breakup happened. It happened. We’ve got to move past it.

So that brings us to the present where Oliver and Felicity are just partners who consistently get in each other’s personal space and flirt like teenagers. It’s almost like the beginning of their story.
*  *  *
It was this kind of scene between Oliver and Felicity, where Oliver was trusting her with his emotions and where Felicity was open and accepting to them, that reminded me that this couple will always pull through in the end. They might not be together right now, but it’s reminders like this where two characters can make each other so remarkably better that you just know things will work out in the end.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Arrow Season 5 Episode 2: The Recruits Review
Arrow strikes a balance between realistic superheroics and superhero realism.
Tyler McCarthy Oct 12, 2016
http://www.denofgeek.com/us/tv/arrow/259192/arrow-season-5-episode-2-the-recruits-review

Quote

Frankly, after the lackluster flashbacks of Season 4, I’m not at all convinced that the man traipsing around Eastern Europe could hold his own in a bout with Season 1 Ollie. So how has the show decided to finally explain how the Star City vigilante got his mojo? By allowing the character to pay it forward.
*  *  *
This did crack the door open for a strange parental relationship between Oliver and Felicity, as she tried to be the voice of reason while he did what it takes to create crime-fighting superheroes. With her apparently dating the hot shot new detective in the SCPD, how much mileage are we going to get out of the will-they-won’t-they dynamic between these two characters? We’re in an episode that’s essentially introducing three new key characters, that’s enough to hold my interest. The frustration of watching these two Ross and Rachel each other just feels like unnecessary filler.
*  *  *
The show did a beautiful thing in creating the springboard for the larger DC TV Universe. However, in a world where The Flash is punching through metahumans in parallel dimensions, the Legends of Tomorrow crew is messing with time travel and Supergirl even exists, this street-level character was starting to feel a bit overshadowed.

The new team scenario sets Arrow up to both ground itself while giving it some much-needed pacing and substance within this ever-growing cavalcade of madness. The first two episodes of this season have been easily comparable to Marvel and Netflix’s Daredevil, which does a tremendous job of balancing realistic stakes against a very unrealistic universe. The only question that remains is whether it will stick with that pace and remain the high-stakes, low-impact series it should be, or if it’ll get drunk on itself and go too big once again. Frankly, if the fight scenes remain as good and frequent as we've seen so far, fans will be pretty much good either way.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

‘Arrow’ Recap: “The Recruits” — Maybe That Guy in Rags Isn’t So Bad
BY KAYTI BURT  October 13, 2016
http://collider.com/arrow-recap-the-recruits/

Quote

Arrow has always been the best version of itself when it demonstrates a healthy amount of self-awareness of Oliver’s shortcomings. It’s why the show only started clicking when Diggle and Felicity were first brought onto the team in season one. The show needed in-universe characters to call Oliver out on his weaknesses, on his blind spots. To let the viewers at home know that show was aware that, yes, Oliver was a hero, but he was also kind of a mess.

Oliver is less of a mess in Season Five, but that doesn’t mean he doesn’t still have his issues. This show wouldn’t be half as interesting if he didn’t. In addition to the serious trauma he suffered over those five years and since, he is stubborn and a bad communicator and tends to want to do things all on his own. Trust doesn’t come easily to him and he has a tendency to demand too much of the people around him whom he does trust.
*  *  *
As is often the case (especially when John Diggle isn’t around), Felicity is the person who spells it all out for Oliver. (Seriously, Oliver would be back in Season Two mentality without all of the emotional labor handholding Felicity does.) Felicity tells him: “The reason the original team worked so well is because of the trust and respect we had for Oliver Queen. He’s the one I chose to stand by.” One of the bravest choices you can make, both in the real world and in the superhero drama, is to be vulnerable. When Oliver takes off that mask and reveals to his new team who he really is, it’s the bravest thing he’s done in awhile.
*  *  *
So far, I love what season five is doing with Olicity. This romance might be understated and firmly in the friend zone right now, but it also feels real. The support also works both ways. Oliver notices when Felicity is thoroughly freaked out by Ragman’s monologue about Havenrock, but he also respects that she doesn’t want to talk about. And she doesn’t want to wear a mask, either.
*  *  *
“How would that make things easier for them? “ “For me. Make things easier for me.” — Funny, self-aware Oliver is my favorite kind of Oliver, but this moment is also incredibly poignant and insightful. Oliver is too worried about losing anyone else to let them in. That’s real.

It’s been awhile since we’ve seen Oliver directly tell someone a new story about his five years away. It’s just as effective as it’s always been. To let someone in, to be vulnerable about those five years, is still a huge step for Oliver. (Seriously, though, someone needs to get this guy into therapy.)

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Oliver recruits a new team and the Ragman arrives in latest episode of Arrow
Trent Moore  Wed, Oct 12, 2016 11:29pm
http://www.blastr.com/2016-10-12/oliver-recruits-new-team-and-ragman-arrives-latest-episode-arrow

Quote

The New-Look Team Arrow also beefed up its ranks with Ragman (Joe Dinicol), with a nice throwback to the nuclear explosion in Havenrock due to Damien Darhk’s attack. It turns out he’s the only survivor of the city’s destruction (which was indirectly caused by Felicity, who rerouted the nuke from a larger target) thanks to a mystical pile of rags his father wrapped him in when the bomb fell (it’s not quite as cheesy as it sounds, and the effects work was surprisingly solid for his rag-powers). But considering Oliver ends up recruiting this guy into the team, he could’ve been in the episode a bit more. Also, it'll be interesting to see how he meshes with Felicity ... considering her role in kinda nuking his city (to save lives, but still).
*  *  *
Despite their break-up last season, Oliver and Felicity look to be in a great place now. They crack jokes, they’re getting along well, and that piece of Team Arrow is firing on all cylinders. Which makes it all the more bizarre that Felicity apparently has a new boyfriend, Central City Det. Billy Malone. They’re obviously sprinkling in the details of how this came about during the offseason, but they really need to offer up some answers. There’s been no real indication as to why this relationship is a thing (other than a narrative device to keep Olicity on the back burner a while longer), or how they got together. All we see is Felicity use his CPD connections to run some labs on a piece of evidence for her. If they want this guy to be more than Generic, Kinda Smarmy Boyfriend We All Hate, something needs to change pronto.

Edited October 14, 2016 by tv echo

[EmilyBettFan]

In that one review where they think Oliver is talking about how bad Laurel was at fighting because she died. LOL that's I thought to. 

But, then why would you want to idolize that into a statue? So stupid.

[bijoux]

3 hours ago, EmilyBettFan said:

In that one review where they think Oliver is talking about how bad Laurel was at fighting because she died. LOL that's I thought to. 

But, then why would you want to idolize that into a statue? So stupid.

Maybe there's fine print on the plaque under the Black Canary inscription? Cautionary tale for all who tread recklessly. It could be you one day, six feet under with an ugly statue drunks piss on.

[lemotomato]

"This is LL. She hit the streets without training first. Don't be like LL."

Edited October 14, 2016 by lemotomato

[apinknightmare]

Talking about Laurel's lack of training now is so stupid considering it wasn't even remotely a factor in how she died? Like, what is the cautionary tale there? 

Anti getting frozen by magic campaign, I would get. This? Nah. 

[bethy]

Maybe if she hasn't been out on the streets because she hasn't been trained, then she wouldn't've been in a place where she could get magically frozen?

I have no idea. I was just so glad it wasn't, "I can't train newbies because THAT'S NOT WHAT LAUREL WOULD WANT."

[bijoux]

She still could have been in jail in her capacity as lawyer. I think she actually was earlier in the same episode.

[apinknightmare]

4 minutes ago, bethy said:

Maybe if she hasn't been out on the streets because she hasn't been trained, then she wouldn't've been in a place where she could get magically frozen?

When was her training ever an issue in S4 though? Legit asking, because I don't recall it coming into question after the S3 finale. If the show didn't make it one after she became a full member of the team, it's a really dumb talking point now IMO. 

[ComicFan777]

S4 emphasized that Laurel was a full-fledged member - I think Oliver acknowledged several times throughout the season that he believed Laurel was fully capable of taking care of herself in the streets.  If they wanted her to become a cautionary tale, they should have made her die recklessly, but being frozen by magic and stabbed could have easily happened to any one of the team members regardless of fighting skill. 

Edited October 14, 2016 by ComicFan777

[GirlvsTV]

This show reinvents its past every episode. Next week Oliver will admonish the newbies to not go running off on their own because, "look what happened to Laurel!" 

[ComicFan777]

Yeah, I think the only thing the writers are consistent with is being inconsistent.