Bethenny & Jason: The Divorce Showdown

[motorcitymom65]

1 minute ago, Happy Camper said:

I have had people say both to me. I never, ever perceived any ill intent from the latter.

Well, I am a big believer in intent. That is what it all comes down to in the end.

[Happy Camper]

1 minute ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Well, I am a big believer in intent. That is what it all comes down to in the end.

I don't' think that anyone is in any position to judge intent unless they were intimately involved in the situation.  It is entirely possible that there was honestly kind intent. 

[Martinigirl]

Bahahahahahah!!!!!!!!!!!

[motorcitymom65]

2 minutes ago, Happy Camper said:

I don't' think that anyone is in any position to judge intent unless they were intimately involved in the situation.  It is entirely possible that there was honestly kind intent. 

Of course, but we are here giving our opinions about what is posted here. Someone asked why a person would be hurt by the comment, and several of us explained why it can often be taken as hurtful or insulting. You don't have to take it that way, but the reality is, some folks do. 

When I was really young, and my MIL said that to my mother after a horrible argument, my mother told her it would have been kinder to tell her to just kiss her ass. It made me laugh because I had never heard my mom use any profanity and "ass" was a really bad word in our house. It was just insulting in the context of what was happening. 

Edited June 24, 2017 by motorcitymom65

[Jel]

Hey man, speak for yourself, I'm here to judge.

;)

[Happy Camper]

2 minutes ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Of course, but we are here giving our opinions about what is posted here. Someone asked why a person would be hurt by the comment, and several of us explained why it can often be taken as hurtful or insulting. 

I guess my perception is that we can't say for sure that is was meant with ill intent.

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 minute ago, Happy Camper said:

Who said that it cancels out everything else? It just equals.

 

I don't understand why there is a need to reference something Bethenny has said at all when discussing what someone else has said. It doesn't matter whether it is being done to cancel out everything else or just to equal it. 

It just feels like mentioning how she has also said something bad is an attempt to rationalize unkind behavior of some other person, as if Beth's evilness  is some kind of offset. It doesn't make sense to me.

[motorcitymom65]

1 minute ago, Jel said:

Hey man, speak for yourself, I'm here to judge.

;)

Which is why I love you! 

[Martinigirl]

You're right....I will pray for you

Edited June 24, 2017 by Martinigirl

[Jel]

2 minutes ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Which is why I love you! 

Right back atcha, MCM :)

[Happy Camper]

2 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

 

I don't understand why there is a need to reference something Bethenny has said at all when discussing what someone else has said. It doesn't matter whether it is being done to cancel out everything else or just to equal it. 

It just feels like mentioning how she has also said something bad is an attempt to rationalize unkind behavior of some other person, as if Beth's evilness  is some kind of offset. It doesn't make sense to me.

Housewives say mean things. Housewives include Bethenny.

[Martinigirl]

7 minutes ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Of course, but we are here giving our opinions about what is posted here. Someone asked why a person would be hurt by the comment, and several of us explained why it can often be taken as hurtful or insulting. You don't have to take it that way, but the reality is, some folks do. 

When I was really young, and my MIL said that to my mother after a horrible argument, my mother told her it would have been kinder to tell her to just kiss her ass. It made me laugh because I had never heard my mom use any profanity and "ass" was a really bad word in our house. It was just insulting in the context of what was happening. 

That is hilarious!!!!!!!!!!!! Too funny!!!!!!

[motorcitymom65]

3 minutes ago, Happy Camper said:

Housewives say mean things. Housewives include Bethenny.

But that is the point. We weren't talking about HW's. We were talking about Jason. 

I could never say it as well as Celia, but I think the point is that we were discussing something Jason had done. And in this case, as in most others, whenever there is discussion about something that Jason has done or said, there always seems to be the need to bring up things that Beth has done, even if it has nothing to do with the particular topic. It is just hard to understand. Most of us are very well versed in Beth's flaws. I have typed pages about them. She has a whole host of issues and sometimes she drives me nuts. Her faults are real and they exist.  But any mention of Jason and his faults will generally be greeted with reminders of Beth and her flaws. Whether it is the intent, it seems like often times this is done to minimize whatever Jason has done. It's OK if he does this, because Beth did that. Why can't his behavior just stand on its own? He is not a special snowflake. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

1 minute ago, motorcitymom65 said:

But that is the point. We weren't talking about HW's. We were talking about Jason. 

I could never say it as well as Celia, but I think the point is that we were discussing something Jason had done. And in this case, as in most others, whenever there is discussion about something that Jason has done or said, there always seems to be the need to bring up things that Beth has done, even if it has nothing to do with the particular topic. It is just hard to understand. Most of us are very well versed in Beth's flaws. I have typed pages about them. She has a whole host of issues and sometimes she drives me nuts. Her faults are real and they exist.  But any mention of Jason and his faults will generally be greeted with reminders of Beth and her flaws. Whether it is the intent, it seems like often times this is done to minimize whatever Jason has done. It's OK if he does this, because Beth did that. Why can't his behavior just stand on its own? He is not a special snowflake. 

You said that PERFECTLY. And thank you for doing it so I didn't have to! 

[zoeysmom]

In the case of Bethenny she makes enough statements on her own I don't fell the need to indulge "sources close to".  Jason it is harder to weigh in because he is not one to make public statements.  So the tenor of his e-mails and or conversations as reported by someone else are pretty tough to gauge the context in which they were made.   When he was on the show I always found him trying to keep up with the rapier wit that is Bethenny.  It was like watching Kyle with Bethenny-Kyle laughs at comments such as "I didn't go down on her (Tinsley) when meeting her." Bethenny's treatment of Erika Jayne.  Once Bethenny   was asked to divulge about Kyle-she stopped for maybe the first time ever when Kyle said she would kick her ass. 

[Celia Rubenstein]

Just now, zoeysmom said:

Jason it is harder to weigh in because he is not one to make public statements.  So the tenor of his e-mails and or conversations as reported by someone else are pretty tough to gauge the context in which they were made.  

Maybe thinking about their relationship could put it into context for you ...

Four year long acrimonious divorce battle, custody fight ... the few quotes from his emails that have been leaked out that suggest that he loathes her ...

I don't think it's completely unreasonable to suspect that Jason saying he would pray for Bethenny was not meant in a sincerely kind way.

[Martinigirl]

It's just like when Mindy told Harry she didn't want to get involved. Come on! That bitch wants to so get involved!  She's not fooling anyone. Neither is Jason.

Edited June 24, 2017 by Martinigirl

[film noire]

59 minutes ago, motorcitymom65 said:

Folks post stories about Beth with random quotes and sources all every day and twice on Sundays. Often there is little mention of how these outlets get it wrong.

Eh, in this very thread, I didn't post the quotes (about Bethenny) b/c they seemed one sided to me -- and I don't think the quote attributed to her camp in the same story ("Perhaps unsurprisingly, Frankel turned the multi-million-dollar offer down. “She thinks it’s outrageous that Jason is demanding so much money,” the source explained.") is any more valid or invalid than Hoppy's  -- could be made up, could be bullshit (eta could be a bullshit source).

Edited June 24, 2017 by film noire

[zoeysmom]

1 minute ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Maybe thinking about their relationship could put it into context for you ...

Four year long acrimonious divorce battle, custody fight ... the few quotes from his emails that have been leaked out that suggest that he loathes her ...

I don't think it's completely unreasonable to suspect that Jason saying he would pray for Bethenny was not meant in a sincerely kind way.

Well Bethenny has flat out stated her hatred of Jason calling him a thief.  SO I don't know why anyone would expect for him to feel any different about her.

I kind of have a problem with people saying they will pray for someone.  Years ago I had a Jewish neighbor with the last name Smith.  New neighbors, Mr. & Mrs. P moved in.  Kind nice  people, he had been blind since childhood and had a Christian  ministry.  They constantly were what I would call proselytizing little pamphlets, handshakes with "our prayers are with you", it annoyed me as well as Ms. Smith.  We had a chat and settled on the idea it is their First Amendment right to speak as they do-they are still annoying.  At one point I mentioned to the Ps Ms. Smith Jewish and committed to her faith-they didn't stop.  I feel the same way about people who try and sway me to their political beliefs.  As long as they don't insult me or call me names I will listen to their view.  I have given up expressing my view.  That being said, I never know what is behind someone saying they will pray for me or our prayers are with you.  I never say it so maybe that irritates those who do.  I do express compassion for those who encounter a tough time but I just never think to say, "I will pray for you". 

[film noire]

Are we sure he didn't say "I will prey on you?"

 

~that was my "happy weekend!" gift to all the bethenny fans  ; )

[Happy Camper]

29 minutes ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Maybe thinking about their relationship could put it into context for you ...

Four year long acrimonious divorce battle, custody fight ... the few quotes from his emails that have been leaked out that suggest that he loathes her ...

I don't think it's completely unreasonable to suspect that Jason saying he would pray for Bethenny was not meant in a sincerely kind way.

You may suspect,, but you cannot be sure.

[breezy424]

Sorry, I just looked this up.  Stalking does not fall under Domestic Violence.  Stalking in the Fourth Degree falls under article 120.45.  Article 120.45 falls under Article 120 - Assault and Related Offenses.  Article 120 falls under Title P - Offenses Against Public Safety.  Offenses Against Public Safety falls under Part 3 -Specific Offenses which falls under NY Penal Code. 

https://www.lawserver.com/law/state/new-york/ny-laws/ny_penal_law_120-45

You can work your way back to see where the penal codes come from.  You don't have to be in a current or former domestic relationship to be stalked.  Ask any of a number of celebrities that have been stalked by strangers.

[zoeysmom]

5 minutes ago, breezy424 said:

Sorry, I just looked this up.  Stalking does not fall under Domestic Violence.  Stalking in the Fourth Degree falls under article 120.45.  Article 120.45 falls under Article 120 - Assault and Related Offenses.  Article 120 falls under Title P - Offenses Against Public Safety.  Offenses Against Public Safety falls under Part 3 -Specific Offenses which falls under NY Penal Code. 

https://www.lawserver.com/law/state/new-york/ny-laws/ny_penal_law_120-45

You can work your way back to see where the penal codes come from.  You don't have to be in a current or former domestic relationship to be stalked.  Ask any of a number of celebrities that have been stalked by strangers.

It is kind of an uphill battle-I posted it several times but it falls flat. 

Having said that this is why I find Bethenny appalling disingenuous when it comes to Domestic Violence.  From her blog:

Inviting Tom's ex as yet another "gotcha" ambush certainly lacked class.

I give it to Luann as hard as anyone, but for god's sake, the woman is married .  Let the couple live.

Let's be clear about Bethenny at the reception, Bethenny though it appropriate to say after Dorinda's toast," And to the friends who fucked my husband."  Drawing a laugh from Tinsley. I don't understand why Bethenny keeps pretending to take this high road in respecting Tom and Luan's marriage. There are words that come to mind c&ntsicle, tw*twaffle that should be reserved for Bethenny.  Calling Ramona out is fairly lame from a woman who was making gay slurs about Tom.

It wasn't enough for Bethenny

 

"Tinsley seems to be a bit emotionally constipated and kind of needs to take a page out of Elsa's book and let it go.  Being a roommate at 40 in a room full of stuffed animals isn't a cute look, nor is it a path to reviving a retired socialite career, time to pack it up and pack it in.  I do think Tinsley should wear her hair and lashes however she sees fit.  She talks about this "abusive" relationship she had and it seems to quite frankly make everyone a bit uncomfortable, because we really don't know her.  Her mom seems sweet and Southern-two Southern BFF peas in a pod."

The very idea this whining entitled bitch even thinks it is the least bit appropriate to call Tinsley's abusive relationship into question is beneath contempt.  The woman had documented physical injuries,  Bethenny finding it uncomfortable to talk about is beyond absurd,  When Bethenny returned to the show she would cry at the drop of hat over her "homelessness" and custody arrangements to three people who did not know her, Carole, Heather and Kristen.  How Bethenny can pretend she has a charity that claims to help women B-strong and then cite others being uncomfortable all the while droning on and on about e-mails from her ex is just so totally Bethenny and her self centered attitude.

When Tinsley Mortimer was the "it" girl she made a lot of money off her brand.  Claiming Tinsley needs to let it go and comparing her situation to a Disney movie repulsive. 

These shows idle at the petty level and when someone, and it was no secret when she was hired, is a victim of DV, it is not cute or clever or cutting edge to try and shut down her voice.  So black eyes, bleeding head wounds and  significant damage  to personal property are uncomfortable for others to talk about.  No they are uncomfortable. Bethenny needs to acknowledge that these things happen even when you have advantages in life.  When it is all about her being rich and having to deal with it should be a national day of mourning.  Let another person be in a position where they are powerless and they are the bad one, that needs to move on and get over it.  Life doesn't work that way people are not fungible. 

After reading Bethenny's comments I just find her putrid.   

[ZoloftBlob]

Quote

Wait, so saying "i will pray for you is unkind and hurtful?

It can be. I recently was told this by a customer of my company who was upset about how I was constrained by the law from disputing his 9 month old 3000 dollar charge for a custom order. He said and I quote "I will pray for you that you learn what a hateful bitch you are, and that you realize what an awful person you are for being such a Nazi about policy."

I ask you - was I being treated kindly?

I have also seen "I will pray for you" used as a passive aggressive slap to end an argument. Typically it's in a similar vein to the charming prick above - they say it to end the argument and to imply they are above you - you're so wrong, they'll need to pray to Jesus in hopes one day you'll understand how you're the fuck up.

Edited June 24, 2017 by ZoloftBlob

[diadochokinesis]

10 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

My guess is that Jason kept emailing Bethenny, her assistants, and Dennis because Bethenny not responding back to him via email. I'm sure Bryn was always where she was supposed to be, but Jason was worrying because he was getting nothing back from Bethenny and her people. I'm sure it was along these lines "Bryn's friend is having a party after school. Instead of picking Bryn up at school, pick her up at XYZ." And then just nothing. Bethenny picked Bryn up. Nothing is amiss, but Jason doesn't know what the fuck is going on because Bethenny won't communicate with him. So Jason is just getting angrier and angrier. And his emails and communication with Bethenny gets nastier and nastier. The only person you can control is yourself. Jason is running around being a dumb angry asshole in the hopes that he can get Bethenny to communicate with him. He's frankly too petty and dumb to realize that he needed to drop it.

The first time Bethenny fails to pick Bryn up or misses whatever he is emailing about, then Jason can go to his lawyer and the court. But at this point, he's got to rely on the fact that Bethenny loves her daughter enough that she's not going to intentionally hurt her. This emailing and ignoring the emails is only nominally about Bryn. It's basically a bunch of dumb petty games between the two them to exert control and measure their dicks.

From my understanding, they had a designated person to contact for questions re: Bryn. So, they shouldn't have been contacting each other directly anyways. 

9 hours ago, Ellee said:

I'm trying to keep an open mind about this Jason/Bethenny fiasco. 

I work with a guy that has the philosophy 'you repeat a lie long enough, it becomes the truth.'  Oh, and he is one helluva liar too. 

Maybe that's why I'm still leaning toward Jason being innocent.  He doesn't talk.  And everything that is out there has originated with Bethenny. 

But I'm fair enough to also say by keeping quiet lies don't come back to haunt you.  

I guess we will find out what really happened or some of it anyway. 

I'm going to play Devil's Advocate for a second...  What if he is not talking because his lawyer put the fear of God into him?  What if the lawyer told Hoppy that he was already skating on thin ice and had extra attention on him post-charges and basically put a muzzle on him?  

Also, you have to consider the difference in professions. Just by virtue of her career, Bethenny is out there doing publicity and being interviewed on a fairly consistent basis. Her personal life is a huge part of her career. She is going to get questions and attention for that. However, Hoppy doesn't have a career that puts him in the public's eye. He isn't getting interviewed. 

All that said, I do believe he leaks. I think a lot of the "anonymous" leaks that put out negative info about Bethenny are coming from Hoppy or his camp.  Just like how the negative stories about Amber Heard came from Johnny Depp's camp.  

2 hours ago, motorcitymom65 said:

To some of my crazier, very judgmental and evangelical kin, "I will pray for you" means you have done something horrible and are unfortunately going to burn in hell. And they aren't really going to be praying for you. 

So, I'm Southern and 9 times out of 10, "I will pray for you" isn't a good thing. Pretty much the only time you can assume that it is sincere is if someone in your family just died or you were just in the hospital. It is a straight up insult the majority of the time. Just like "Bless your heart." There are tons of articles online about this.  Bravo even has one (http://www.bravotv.com/southern-charm/blogs/7-sweet-sounding-southern-sayings-that-are-actually-insults).

2 hours ago, Happy Camper said:

Yes exactly.  What's so wrong with that?

Oh, bless your heart. 

2 hours ago, Jel said:

Hey man, speak for yourself, I'm here to judge.

;)

Hi, come on over and pull up a chair. 

1 hour ago, motorcitymom65 said:

But that is the point. We weren't talking about HW's. We were talking about Jason. 

I could never say it as well as Celia, but I think the point is that we were discussing something Jason had done. And in this case, as in most others, whenever there is discussion about something that Jason has done or said, there always seems to be the need to bring up things that Beth has done, even if it has nothing to do with the particular topic. It is just hard to understand. Most of us are very well versed in Beth's flaws. I have typed pages about them. She has a whole host of issues and sometimes she drives me nuts. Her faults are real and they exist.  But any mention of Jason and his faults will generally be greeted with reminders of Beth and her flaws. Whether it is the intent, it seems like often times this is done to minimize whatever Jason has done. It's OK if he does this, because Beth did that. Why can't his behavior just stand on its own? He is not a special snowflake. 

Exactly. 

Is Bethenny perfect?  No. I doubt anyone here is saying she is perfect. However, Jason is choosing how he reacts and it is appears that he is making poor choices. When I work with kids who are fighting, one kid will always go, "Well, he did it first!"  My response is always, "I don't care who did it first. You are responsible for yourself. You didn't have to react but you chose to." 

I don't care what Bethenny did. Hoppy chose to make poor decisions. There are consequences for that. On Tuesday, we will find out what those consequences are.

[WireWrap]

2 hours ago, motorcitymom65 said:

But that is the point. We weren't talking about HW's. We were talking about Jason. 

I could never say it as well as Celia, but I think the point is that we were discussing something Jason had done. And in this case, as in most others, whenever there is discussion about something that Jason has done or said, there always seems to be the need to bring up things that Beth has done, even if it has nothing to do with the particular topic. It is just hard to understand. Most of us are very well versed in Beth's flaws. I have typed pages about them. She has a whole host of issues and sometimes she drives me nuts. Her faults are real and they exist.  But any mention of Jason and his faults will generally be greeted with reminders of Beth and her flaws. Whether it is the intent, it seems like often times this is done to minimize whatever Jason has done. It's OK if he does this, because Beth did that. Why can't his behavior just stand on its own? He is not a special snowflake. 

Allegedly done, he hasn't been convicted of anything, that is yet to be determined. 

2 hours ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Maybe thinking about their relationship could put it into context for you ...

Four year long acrimonious divorce battle, custody fight ... the few quotes from his emails that have been leaked out that suggest that he loathes her ...

I don't think it's completely unreasonable to suspect that Jason saying he would pray for Bethenny was not meant in a sincerely kind way.

And who do you think "leaked" portions of those emails and why not the entire email, what is Bethenny afraid of if they are all so bad? Or is it that she is taking things out of context to sway the publics opinion of her ex?

47 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

It is kind of an uphill battle-I posted it several times but it falls flat. 

Having said that this is why I find Bethenny appalling disingenuous when it comes to Domestic Violence.  From her blog:

Inviting Tom's ex as yet another "gotcha" ambush certainly lacked class.

I give it to Luann as hard as anyone, but for god's sake, the woman is married .  Let the couple live.

Let's be clear about Bethenny at the reception, Bethenny though it appropriate to say after Dorinda's toast," And to the friends who fucked my husband."  Drawing a laugh from Tinsley. I don't understand why Bethenny keeps pretending to take this high road in respecting Tom and Luan's marriage. There are words that come to mind c&ntsicle, tw*twaffle that should be reserved for Bethenny.  Calling Ramona out is fairly lame from a woman who was making gay slurs about Tom.

It wasn't enough for Bethenny

 

"Tinsley seems to be a bit emotionally constipated and kind of needs to take a page out of Elsa's book and let it go.  Being a roommate at 40 in a room full of stuffed animals isn't a cute look, nor is it a path to reviving a retired socialite career, time to pack it up and pack it in.  I do think Tinsley should wear her hair and lashes however she sees fit.  She talks about this "abusive" relationship she had and it seems to quite frankly make everyone a bit uncomfortable, because we really don't know her.  Her mom seems sweet and Southern-two Southern BFF peas in a pod."

The very idea this whining entitled bitch even thinks it is the least bit appropriate to call Tinsley's abusive relationship into question is beneath contempt.  The woman had documented physical injuries,  Bethenny finding it uncomfortable to talk about is beyond absurd,  When Bethenny returned to the show she would cry at the drop of hat over her "homelessness" and custody arrangements to three people who did not know her, Carole, Heather and Kristen.  How Bethenny can pretend she has a charity that claims to help women B-strong and then cite others being uncomfortable all the while droning on and on about e-mails from her ex is just so totally Bethenny and her self centered attitude.

When Tinsley Mortimer was the "it" girl she made a lot of money off her brand.  Claiming Tinsley needs to let it go and comparing her situation to a Disney movie repulsive. 

These shows idle at the petty level and when someone, and it was no secret when she was hired, is a victim of DV, it is not cute or clever or cutting edge to try and shut down her voice.  So black eyes, bleeding head wounds and  significant damage  to personal property are uncomfortable for others to talk about.  No they are uncomfortable. Bethenny needs to acknowledge that these things happen even when you have advantages in life.  When it is all about her being rich and having to deal with it should be a national day of mourning.  Let another person be in a position where they are powerless and they are the bad one, that needs to move on and get over it.  Life doesn't work that way people are not fungible. 

After reading Bethenny's comments I just find her putrid.   

Bethenny seemed to put the blame of her mothers beatings on her mom and not on her ex step father. It seems that Bethenny tends to blame the women that get physically beat by the men in their lives, like her mom and Tinsley. IMO, her B Strong charity is nothing more than a PR move and not something that comes from her heart.  

[zoeysmom]

2 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

Allegedly done, he hasn't been convicted of anything, that is yet to be determined. 

And who do you think "leaked" portions of those emails and why not the entire email, what is Bethenny afraid of if they are all so bad? Or is it that she is taking things out of context to sway the publics opinion of her ex?

Bethenny seemed to put the blame of her mothers beatings on her mom and not on her ex step father. It seems that Bethenny tends to blame the women that get physically beat by the men in their lives, like her mom and Tinsley. IMO, her B Strong charity is nothing more than a PR move and not something that comes from her heart.  

Yep it is very unnerving physical abuse is abuse.  What made it worse is Tinsley is a woman who "branded" herself as a socialite with rich contracts with designer purses, clothing lines and still has a line in Bed Bath and Beyond and Bethenny mocks her.  She was the "it" girl and a master at branding when Bethenny was chasing around with one unsuccessful business after another.  As to Dale Mercer, even after she and Tinsley's dad divorced she managed the Mercer family fortune.  These are bright women.  I don't get the derogatory Southern women reference.  Maybe it is the fact that Tinsley is close with her mother? 

[film noire]

3 hours ago, breezy424 said:

Sorry, I just looked this up.  Stalking does not fall under Domestic Violence.  Stalking in the Fourth Degree falls under article 120.45.  Article 120.45 falls under Article 120 - Assault and Related Offenses.  Article 120 falls under Title P - Offenses Against Public Safety.  Offenses Against Public Safety falls under Part 3 -Specific Offenses which falls under NY Penal Code. 

https://www.lawserver.com/law/state/new-york/ny-laws/ny_penal_law_120-45

You can work your way back to see where the penal codes come from.  You don't have to be in a current or former domestic relationship to be stalked.  Ask any of a number of celebrities that have been stalked by strangers.

Thanks for posting this, Breezy -- I thought it didn't make sense that it would be classified as domestic violence (as you say, too many  instances of stalking would be left out). 

2 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

She talks about this "abusive" relationship she had and it seems to quite frankly make everyone a bit uncomfortable, because we really don't know her.  Her mom seems sweet and Southern-two Southern BFF peas in a pod."

The very idea this whining entitled bitch even thinks it is the least bit appropriate to call Tinsley's abusive relationship into question is beneath contempt.  The woman had documented physical injuries,  Bethenny finding it uncomfortable to talk about is beyond absurd,  When Bethenny returned to the show she would cry at the drop of hat over her "homelessness" and custody arrangements to three people who did not know her, Carole, Heather and Kristen.  How Bethenny can pretend she has a charity that claims to help women B-strong and then cite others being uncomfortable all the while droning on and on about e-mails from her ex is just so totally Bethenny and her self centered attitude.

Yes, yes yes.

I can't believe I ever liked this woman.  The lack of empathy is astonishing. To so casually dismiss another woman's body being battered, reducing all that horror and pain and brutality to wacky scare quotes -- with your biggest emotional reaction  being how uncomfortable it all makes YOU feel? While heading up a crisis intervention group for women that you founded? Just repugnant.

Edited June 24, 2017 by film noire

[film noire]

3 hours ago, diadochokinesis said:

It is a straight up insult the majority of the time. Just like "Bless your heart." 

Oh, bless your heart. 

Ha!  (If @Happy Camper is a Catholic, she'll double down with an "Offer it up" ; )

Edited June 24, 2017 by film noire

[BBHN]

Quote

I don't think anyone is suggesting that the statement "I will pray for you" always means something nasty. Just that, on occasion,  it can.

Yeah, most probably.

Quote

It can be. I recently was told this by a customer of my company who was upset about how I was constrained by the law from disputing his 9 month old 3000 dollar charge for a custom order. He said and I quote "I will pray for you that you learn what a hateful bitch you are, and that you realize what an awful person you are for being such a Nazi about policy."

I ask you - was I being treated kindly?

Well, OBVIOUSLY, you must have misinterpreted what the customer was saying to you, so no, the customer was treating you kindly by offering to pray for you ;)

Quote

It's just like when Mindy told Harry she didn't want to get involved. Come on! That bitch wants to so get involved!  She's not fooling anyone. Neither is Jason.

As others have pointed out...unless that person lost a family member, is in the hospital, is experiencing a tragedy, etc, it does come across as suspect.

Oh, Jason. Bless his heart.

Quote

Bethenny seemed to put the blame of her mothers beatings on her mom and not on her ex step father. It seems that Bethenny tends to blame the women that get physically beat by the men in their lives, like her mom and Tinsley.

How the eff is Tinsley even relevant to the discussion? She isn't. It seems like we're trying to steer the discussion away from Jason and the divorce.

Edited June 24, 2017 by BBHN

[LIMOM]

5 hours ago, WireWrap said:

Allegedly done, he hasn't been convicted of anything, that is yet to be determined. 

And who do you think "leaked" portions of those emails and why not the entire email, what is Bethenny afraid of if they are all so bad? Or is it that she is taking things out of context to sway the publics opinion of her ex?

Bethenny seemed to put the blame of her mothers beatings on her mom and not on her ex step father. It seems that Bethenny tends to blame the women that get physically beat by the men in their lives, like her mom and Tinsley. IMO, her B Strong charity is nothing more than a PR move and not something that comes from her heart.  

I will say in defense of Bethaney that it is not unusual for children who witnessed abuse toward their mothers to strongly  identify with the abuser and in return become abuser themselves.

B strong is a tax shelter imo however If it helps some women, I applaud Beth.

[WireWrap]

4 hours ago, BBHN said:

 

How the eff is Tinsley even relevant to the discussion? She isn't. It seems like we're trying to steer the discussion away from Jason and the divorce.

Tinsley is germane to my answer to another members post, especially because of Bethenny's blog this week.

2 hours ago, LIMOM said:

I will say in defense of Bethaney that it is not unusual for children who witnessed abuse toward their mothers to strongly  identify with the abuser and in return become abuser themselves.

B strong is a tax shelter imo however If it helps some women, I applaud Beth.

Yes, "children" can identify with the abuser but Bethenny is an adult and she still blames her mom and she blames or shames other DV victims like Tinsley or Jules about her ED. IMO, Bethenny really does not like anyone that would/could elicit more sympathy/support than she would. 

[Jel]

9 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

It is kind of an uphill battle-I posted it several times but it falls flat. 

Having said that this is why I find Bethenny appalling disingenuous when it comes to Domestic Violence.  From her blog:

Inviting Tom's ex as yet another "gotcha" ambush certainly lacked class.

I give it to Luann as hard as anyone, but for god's sake, the woman is married .  Let the couple live.

Let's be clear about Bethenny at the reception, Bethenny though it appropriate to say after Dorinda's toast," And to the friends who fucked my husband."  Drawing a laugh from Tinsley. I don't understand why Bethenny keeps pretending to take this high road in respecting Tom and Luan's marriage. There are words that come to mind c&ntsicle, tw*twaffle that should be reserved for Bethenny.  Calling Ramona out is fairly lame from a woman who was making gay slurs about Tom.

It wasn't enough for Bethenny

 

"Tinsley seems to be a bit emotionally constipated and kind of needs to take a page out of Elsa's book and let it go.  Being a roommate at 40 in a room full of stuffed animals isn't a cute look, nor is it a path to reviving a retired socialite career, time to pack it up and pack it in.  I do think Tinsley should wear her hair and lashes however she sees fit.  She talks about this "abusive" relationship she had and it seems to quite frankly make everyone a bit uncomfortable, because we really don't know her.  Her mom seems sweet and Southern-two Southern BFF peas in a pod."

The very idea this whining entitled bitch even thinks it is the least bit appropriate to call Tinsley's abusive relationship into question is beneath contempt.  The woman had documented physical injuries,  Bethenny finding it uncomfortable to talk about is beyond absurd,  When Bethenny returned to the show she would cry at the drop of hat over her "homelessness" and custody arrangements to three people who did not know her, Carole, Heather and Kristen.  How Bethenny can pretend she has a charity that claims to help women B-strong and then cite others being uncomfortable all the while droning on and on about e-mails from her ex is just so totally Bethenny and her self centered attitude.

When Tinsley Mortimer was the "it" girl she made a lot of money off her brand.  Claiming Tinsley needs to let it go and comparing her situation to a Disney movie repulsive. 

These shows idle at the petty level and when someone, and it was no secret when she was hired, is a victim of DV, it is not cute or clever or cutting edge to try and shut down her voice.  So black eyes, bleeding head wounds and  significant damage  to personal property are uncomfortable for others to talk about.  No they are uncomfortable. Bethenny needs to acknowledge that these things happen even when you have advantages in life.  When it is all about her being rich and having to deal with it should be a national day of mourning.  Let another person be in a position where they are powerless and they are the bad one, that needs to move on and get over it.  Life doesn't work that way people are not fungible. 

After reading Bethenny's comments I just find her putrid.   

Bethenny has a cheeky, irreverent sense of humor that is off-putting to some people, no question about that. It can come off as mean-spirited, sometimes it may actually be.  Her joke "and to the friends who fucked my husband" is a perfect example. When you add that with her often abrasive personality it can be off-putting. I get that.   But, in fairness, she does make similar jokes at her own expense.   I think one either appreciates this style of humor or doesn't.  

On the other hand, Ramona's invitation to those women was not a joke, it was an act of hostility; and I do see a big difference between the two.  There's a whole lot of difference between hearing a one-liner and having to stand in a room with your new husband's exes, when you know the woman who arranged the party had an agenda. Bethenny's point, I think, is that they are married now, there's no point in trying anymore.  Now it's just tacky, and pointless and humiliation for humiliation's sake. Ramona, to me, is the real mean-spirited person of the group.

I also agree with Bethenny that Tinsely should move out if she doesn't like where she's living, instead of complaining about it. In some ways, Tinsely seems perpetually 17, which, for me, is extremely off-putting in a 40 year old woman.  I would take 100 of Bethenny's irreverent jokes over one of Tinsely's complain-about-what-a-buzzkill Sonja is sessions.  Take your 9,000 a month for rent and move out.  You do have options, Tinsely. And you're making the baby Sartre cry with your bad faith. 

I side-eyed the quotation marks around the word "abusive" (relationship).  I just don't know what to make of that. I guess Bethenny thinks there's more to the story, (rather ironic that) but as you say, Zoeysmom, the woman was photographed with bruises, so how much more of a story is there?   We can't even wait to hear more from the trial though because apparently Tinsely wouldn't press charges.  I wish she had.  

Edited June 24, 2017 by Jel

[Jel]

9 hours ago, ZoloftBlob said:

It can be. I recently was told this by a customer of my company who was upset about how I was constrained by the law from disputing his 9 month old 3000 dollar charge for a custom order. He said and I quote "I will pray for you that you learn what a hateful bitch you are, and that you realize what an awful person you are for being such a Nazi about policy."

I ask you - was I being treated kindly?

I have also seen "I will pray for you" used as a passive aggressive slap to end an argument. Typically it's in a similar vein to the charming prick above - they say it to end the argument and to imply they are above you - you're so wrong, they'll need to pray to Jesus in hopes one day you'll understand how you're the fuck up.

Geez, because it's not at all hateful to call someone a hateful bitch or a Nazi.  Do these people actually hear themselves talking?

[KungFuBunny]

Ooh he even has a Super Douche Cape

Guess he can't pay for laundry let alone dry cleaning anymore

[BBHN]

Quote

Tinsley is germane to my answer to another members post, especially because of Bethenny's blog this week.

I meant Tinsley in general being discussed on this thread, even if Beth mentioned her in her blog. Beth has her own thread, and so does Tinsley. Unless Tinsley was a side piece of Jason's and that was one of the reasons for the divorce...

Quote

Guess he can't pay for laundry let alone dry cleaning anymore

Maybe he can see John about a discount?

[ZoloftBlob]

Quote

Geez, because it's not at all hateful to call someone a hateful bitch or a Nazi.  Do these people actually hear themselves talking?

Unfortunately no. To be fair, most of them are genuinely frustrated by their situation so I don't let it bother me (Ever see the movie Roadhouse? The three rules of customer service are very valid) but at the end of the day "I will pray for you" is not always a blessing and saying "I will pray for you" is not an automatic pat on the back you win at being decent and awesome remark. It's used that way - It's said first so the person saying the ugly shit gets to pat themselves on the back with "I called that bitch out but I WILL PRAY FOR HER SO I WIN!", and I am actually surprised at the googly eyed wonder over the very idea that the phrase can't be interpreted any way but as someone wishing well. This phrase can definitely be wielded in a hateful way.

And in a nice way, don't get me wrong! But I somehow doubt in this divorce relationship that anyone was using it in the nice way.

[KungFuBunny]

3 minutes ago, BBHN said:

I meant Tinsley in general being discussed on this thread, even if Beth mentioned her in her blog. Beth has her own thread, and so does Tinsley. Unless Tinsley was a side piece of Jason's and that was one of the reasons for the divorce...

Maybe he can see John about a discount?

All his money needs to go towards paying high profile criminal attorneys. I wouldn't be surprised if Grifter Grandma & Grandpa get mortgages on their home - Carole Hoppy is next

Maybe John can give him some services for Free99

[BBHN]

Any customers ever throw both at you, ZoloftBlob?

"Aw, bless your heart. I will pray for you." ;)

[ZoloftBlob]

Yes, BBHN, but when I hear that, it's usually being used the nice way. ;)

[zoeysmom]

51 minutes ago, Jel said:

Bethenny has a cheeky, irreverent sense of humor that is off-putting to some people, no question about that. It can come off as mean-spirited, sometimes it may actually be.  Her joke "and to the friends who fucked my husband" is a perfect example. When you add that with her often abrasive personality it can be off-putting. I get that.   But, in fairness, she does make similar jokes at her own expense.   I think one either appreciates this style of humor or doesn't.  

On the other hand, Ramona's invitation to those women was not a joke, it was an act of hostility; and I do see a big difference between the two.  There's a whole lot of difference between hearing a one-liner and having to stand in a room with your new husband's exes, when you know the woman who arranged the party had an agenda. Bethenny's point, I think, is that they are married now, there's no point in trying anymore.  Now it's just tacky, and pointless and humiliation for humiliation's sake. Ramona, to me, is the real mean-spirited person of the group.

I also agree with Bethenny that Tinsely should move out if she doesn't like where she's living, instead of complaining about it. In some ways, Tinsely seems perpetually 17, which, for me, is extremely off-putting in a 40 year old woman.  I would take 100 of Bethenny's irreverent jokes over one of Tinsely's complain-about-what-a-buzzkill Sonja is sessions.  Take your 9,000 a month for rent and move out.  You do have options, Tinsely. And you're making the baby Sartre cry with your bad faith. 

I side-eyed the quotation marks around the word "abusive" (relationship).  I just don't know what to make of that. I guess Bethenny thinks there's more to the story, (rather ironic that) but as you say, Zoeysmom, the woman was photographed with bruises, so how much more of a story is there?   We can't even wait to hear more from the trial though because apparently Tinsely wouldn't press charges.  I wish she had.  

Bethenny isn't cheeky she is brash and bitchy and she can't in one breath say-lever them alone they are married and in their presence continue to talk about Tom's past sex partners.  It isn't cheeky to say, "and the women my husband fucked," even at a second rate reception-it is base and crude.  We all know Sonja had sex with Tom.  They can't change it.  I can appreciate a sense of humor what I can't appreciate is a hypocrite and Bethenny is a flat out hypocrite.  She is worse than a hypocrite because she screams at others about them being hypocrites and she is the biggest hypocrite of all. Ramona and Bethenny can both have bitch moves. ANd they both did and continue to keep talking about Tom and Luann's marriage.

Tinsely does have the little girl quality about her but there is also the more socially astute Tinsley.  I found the hat delivery scene entertaining because it goes to show the absurdity of these women from time to time. 

Bethenny uses terms like brutal and tortured to describe her divorce.  So when a woman presents with physical injuries from a significant other she decides it makes others uncomfortable to talk about it,  Bethenny of fibroid fame-talk about an unnecessary and totally crass conversation about how much discharge and "blood" -the woman who hands her drive a menses soaked pillow and tells him to clean it.  So Bethenny is pretty much the Queen of uncomfortable conversations.  Bethenny even went to berate Luann for not asking more than-are you going to the doctor?  No one wanted to hear about it.  Motor mouth going on and on about vagina this and vagina that-they are called uterine fibroids for a reason because they are in the uterus or surrounding the uterus.  When one puts something in quotes it is indicative the writer is questioning the use of the term to describe someone or something.  Just because someone doesn't press charges doesn't mean the abuse didn't happen. The more important conversation would be why Tinsley felt so powerless to prosecute her abuser.  Maybe the show will give her power to pursue a prosecution.

[Martinigirl]

57 minutes ago, KungFuBunny said:

Ooh he even has a Super Douche Cape

Guess he can't pay for laundry let alone dry cleaning anymore

Is he hiding his pink pussy hat? 

[ZoloftBlob]

I read this in one of the articles BBHN posted.

Quote

'Indeed, Mr. Hoppy has sent hundreds of escalating texts and emails to Ms. Frankel, her assistants and her boyfriend, demanding that she meet with Mr. Hoppy unnecessarily, stating that 'I'll never go away' and that '[y]ou left me no choice but to go to extremes', claiming that her 'definition of harassment is comical' and that he will 'continue to communicate with [her] as [he] see fit', requesting copies of her life insurance policy, and telling her that 'I'll pray for you.'

 

If this is the context in which Jason is using "I'll pray for you" - part of a hostile rant about how he's going to extremes, he's going to do as he pleases, and he'll never go away.... Does anyone really think slapping "I'll pray for you" was Jason honestly meaning he was gonna get down on his knees and gently pray to Christ for Betheny's soul, with the milk of human kindness flowing?

I say if because I accept the trial hasn't happened and MAYBE Jason does have these moments where he drops to his knees and prays to Christ for the safety and health of his despised ex wife. But I admit, if this is the context, I somehow doubt that his heart was pure and innocent and he *really meant* that he was intending to head to church and pray for Bethenny.

 

Edited June 24, 2017 by ZoloftBlob
i tried to remove the strikethru and i cn't figure it out :(

[Jel]

36 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Bethenny isn't cheeky she is brash and bitchy and she can't in one breath say-lever them alone they are married and in their presence continue to talk about Tom's past sex partners.  It isn't cheeky to say, "and the women my husband fucked," even at a second rate reception-it is base and crude.  We all know Sonja had sex with Tom.  They can't change it.  I can appreciate a sense of humor what I can't appreciate is a hypocrite and Bethenny is a flat out hypocrite.  She is worse than a hypocrite because she screams at others about them being hypocrites and she is the biggest hypocrite of all. Ramona and Bethenny can both have bitch moves. ANd they both did and continue to keep talking about Tom and Luann's marriage.

Tinsely does have the little girl quality about her but there is also the more socially astute Tinsley.  I found the hat delivery scene entertaining because it goes to show the absurdity of these women from time to time. 

Bethenny uses terms like brutal and tortured to describe her divorce.  So when a woman presents with physical injuries from a significant other she decides it makes others uncomfortable to talk about it,  Bethenny of fibroid fame-talk about an unnecessary and totally crass conversation about how much discharge and "blood" -the woman who hands her drive a menses soaked pillow and tells him to clean it.  So Bethenny is pretty much the Queen of uncomfortable conversations.  Bethenny even went to berate Luann for not asking more than-are you going to the doctor?  No one wanted to hear about it.  Motor mouth going on and on about vagina this and vagina that-they are called uterine fibroids for a reason because they are in the uterus or surrounding the uterus.  When one puts something in quotes it is indicative the writer is questioning the use of the term to describe someone or something.  Just because someone doesn't press charges doesn't mean the abuse didn't happen. The more important conversation would be why Tinsley felt so powerless to prosecute her abuser.  Maybe the show will give her power to pursue a prosecution.

Growing up, in my house anyway, "cheekiness" was a serious offense; it was an all-encompassing word that meant both "impudent" and "impertinent", which I think sums up Bethenny's sense of humor (using my definition anyway).   It's not everyone's cup of tea, nor should it be expected to be. (I sincerely did not mean to imply that you are humorless, Zoeysmom--far from it--I have laughed at many of your posts!)

I think Bethenny can be hypocritical at times, also dramatic, brash and bitchy, but how do we relate that to Jason's (alleged!) crimes?  Even the brash and bitchy can be violated. Even the most awful people can be the victims of a crime.  And even if it's poetic justice, or turnabout or something,  if he did what he's accused of, he broke the law.  That's the unavoidable bottom line that I see.  

[Jel]

40 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

I read this in one of the articles BBHN posted.

If this is the context in which Jason is using "I'll pray for you" - part of a hostile rant about how he's going to extremes, he's going to do as he pleases, and he'll never go away.... Does anyone really think slapping "I'll pray for you" was Jason honestly meaning he was gonna get down on his knees and gently pray to Christ for Betheny's soul, with the milk of human kindness flowing?

I say if because I accept the trial hasn't happened and MAYBE Jason does have these moments where he drops to his knees and prays to Christ for the safety and health of his despised ex wife. But I admit, if this is the context, I somehow doubt that his heart was pure and innocent and he *really meant* that he was intending to head to church and pray for Bethenny.

 

Milk of human kindness! Love it!

No, I do not think there was any milk flowing when he said, "I'll pray for you". Not for one second because context, life experience, tv "experience" with Jason, excellent arguments (Celia Rubenstein!), personal BS detectors, people-being-people, etc., etc. lead me to that conclusion.  Like many times in life, there's not always absolute proof, so you have to use what you have to draw a conclusion. In the great scheme of things, this one seems pretty easy.

[BBHN]

Asking about someone's life insurance policy, then saying you'll pray for them? Yeah, pray they die a quick a death lol

Sketchy and shady as fuck.

[film noire]

Quote

Tinsley is germane to my answer to another members post, especially because of Bethenny's blog this week.

And Bethenny's reaction to Tinsley's abuse is very germane to the divorce, imo -- if Frankel was  stalked, and then treated a battered woman like this, she's beyond horrible -- and her use of scare quotes now has me wondering if the "stalking" claims are, after all, just a bullshit game on Frankel's part, and not a sincere "fear" for her "safety". (See how nasty those quotation marks are? Exactly.) If you were genuinely terrified (as Frankel "claims") how could you refer to another woman's battery like that? Tinsley ended up with staples in her head. There's no "disputing" that.  And still, Frankel shames her for talking about being abused because it's uncomfortable, as if Tinsley had crossed a line etiquette-wise - all while running (the icing on Frankel's shit cake) a CRISIS INTERVENTION group.  Women of the world: B Wise and stay away from B Strong.

Edited June 24, 2017 by film noire

[ZoloftBlob]

Quote

 Even the brash and bitchy can be violated. Even the most awful people can be the victims of a crime.

And I will give a non Bethenny example. No matter how much I don't like our current president, I think he has every right to feel violated and upset about Kathy Griffin holding up a a fake bloody head of him. He's an awful person, and that still wasn't ok.

[BBHN]

Bethenney's opinion of Tinsley isn't relevant to the divorce at all. Unless Jason's lawyers plan on bringing it up in court, which, lol

[LIMOM]

5 minutes ago, film noire said:

And Bethenny's reaction to Tinsley's abuse is very germane to the divorce, imo -- if Frankel was  stalked, and then treated a battered woman like this, she's beyond horrible -- and her use of scare quotes now has me wondering if the "stalking" claims are, after all, just a bullshit game on Frankel's part, and not a sincere "fear" for her "safety". (See how nasty those quotation marks are? Exactly.) If you were genuinely terrified (as Frankel "claims") how could you refer to another woman's battery like that? Tinsley ended up with staples in her head. There's no "disputing" that.  And still, Frankel shames her for talking about being abused because it's uncomfortable, as if Tinsley had crossed a line etiquette-wise - all while running (the icing on Frankel's shit cake) a CRISIS INTERVENTION group.  Women of the world: B Wise and stay away from B Strong.

IMo,  she has to be best at everything including at being a victim.

You know that she is not doing any of the day to day work, her foundation is a way to network, brand and save taxes.

However, it is very possible that she will end up helping someone and that is all that matters.