S07.E14: First Easter Together

[alegtostandon]

Lola16, omigod no, my name is a nod to my Cousin Amy

 

That is so funny, I always assumed it was a reference to 'Cousin Amy Duggar' too!

 

I recall in the Q&A episode, Bill making mention of comments being made about Zoey's clothing changing on the day they picked her up...I know on TWoP there was much discussion on that.  I, too, figured either they read some boards or someone else reads them & reports on the questions/comments.   I do recall, also, on another reality show, an episode which was very controversial, the person involved in the episode defending themselves on TWoP.

[MrMattyMatt]

This esposide and the Q&A episode definitely seemed to address a lot of the comments made on the internet about the show.  Boards like these and other sites and social media are not one-way streets. 

[4leafclover]

While I can't profess to know what is in Bill's and Jen's hearts or say definitively if they love the "fame,"  I don't think they are doing the show for the money.  I say that because Jen is the medical director of the simulation center at TCH which (and I know this from working in hospitals) provides her with a sizable annual stipend, she is assistant professor of pediatrics at Baylor College of Medicine--another source of income and she is a staff physician at TCH--that is at least 3 sources of (probable) lucrative income.  Adding to that Bill's New York business and their pet store makes me think they have a 50-50 chance of doing the show for altruistic reasons (giving the other 50% chance to love of fame).  As busy as they are, I think it is commendable that they both took their family obligations seriously enough to put aside their busy work schedules to share a nice Easter with their children and with each other.  

[BitterApple]

True, but millions of other working moms and dads do the same with a lot less outside help. I don't see Bill or Jen as special or unique in that regard. I think they're great parents but I don't give them a medal for spending time with their children on a day one of them had to work. It's called Life.

[Phoenix]

It was so precious when Zoey said, " More Egg, Yeah, Papa More Egg" and then nodded her head in the affirmative.  She is darling.  I really liked the way Bill set the whole dye the Easter Eggs activity up for those kids.  And watching closely it's clear these parents know what they are doing and then some.  They set forth many opportunities for Zoey & Will to employ decision making skills, which will carry them far in life.  Bill did this while letting them choose their egg colors and even let them decide if their eggs were a deep enough color. 

 

Bill and Jen seem to never miss an opportunity for teachable moments...like negotiating with Will on getting the pictures taken before getting the ice cream sherbet treat.  And what child wouldn't want an ice cream treat?  It was a natural reaction when he recognized the truck and what they did as parents was very appropriate.  Will has a zest for life...he is a precious little boy.

[4leafclover]

 

True, but millions of other working moms and dads do the same with a lot less outside help.

 

My point exactly--they could have just had some of their "help" take the children for the day.  

[ZoloftBlob]

While I can't profess to know what is in Bill's and Jen's hearts or say definitively if they love the "fame,"  I don't think they are doing the show for the money.

 

Well, I don't see them donating their salaries from the show to charity. :)

 

More seriously, I don't see this show as such a beacon of hope for others that Bill and Jen would continue to do it if it was something they didn't enjoy. I also think that its unfair to dismiss the money factor out of hand. Yes, Jen and Bill made a nice living before the show - but more money is tempting and TLC does pay pretty and Bill and Jen have added two kids to a lifestyle that was already on the low end of upper class.

 

I also agree with BitterApple, spending time with your kids on a holiday is expected.

[4leafclover]

 

I also agree with BitterApple, spending time with your kids on a holiday is expected.

 

Expected perhaps, but not always feasible--doctors, police officers, firefighters, ambulance drivers and nurses don't always have a choice.

 

TLC does pay pretty

How much does it pay?  I've never been able to find that information. 

[JustAlison]

 

Damned that TLC editing out those cackles!!!!

Is there evidence they actually edited out the sound of Jen's laughter? 

Also, I find the endless referencing to Jen's laughter, which sounds as it does because of her dwarfism, really offensive. Unless of course, folks don't realize she can't control that aspect of her physicality any more than she can control her height. If one understands that simple principle, categorizing her laughter as a 'cackle' is preposterously insensitive.

 

 

While I can't profess to know what is in Bill's and Jen's hearts or say definitively if they love the "fame,"  I don't think they are doing the show for the money.

 

Well, I don't see them donating their salaries from the show to charity. :)

 

I don't really see the two as mutually exclusive. 

Edited June 6, 2014 by JustAlison

[jodo]

 

Is there evidence they actually edited out the sound of Jen's laughter?

Also, I find the endless referencing to Jen's laughter,which sounds as it does because of her dwarfism, really offensive. Unless of course, folks don't realize she can't control that aspect of her physicality any more than she can control her height. If one understands that simple principle, categorizing her laughter as a 'cackle' is preposterously insensitive.

Hmmmm evidence might be we aren't hearing it...endless?  I have missed a lot of posts!  And my quoted post above was to agree with the original poster who coined it cackly.  I believe her cackly laugh is a nervous habit and habits can be broken.  It has nothing to do with being a dwarf.   It was another poster who commented Jen's "helium" type voice (not cackly laugh) was linked to her dwarfism.    

[Jellybeans]

well folks! i am not going to laugh on tee-vee because i have a very annoying laugh too but i LAUGH. gosh!

laughter is the sound of music, however it sounds.

[ZoloftBlob]

Expected perhaps, but not always feasible--doctors, police officers, firefighters, ambulance drivers and nurses don't always have a choice.

 

Bill's job doesn't fall under such a restrictive catagory. Also, TLC is notorious for filming "holidays" when its convienant for filming, and not on the actual holiday. (If you need an example, please see the LPBW Thanksgiving special that was clearly filmed in September and how do we know? Because Jake was injured by the trebuchet at Halloween but had no injury in the Thanksgiving special. Also its been admitted). Doing things with your kids on the holidays isn't praiseworthy when its my parents, its just expected.

How much does it pay?  I've never been able to find that information.

 

 

The only exact amounts published were for Gosselins, 22k per episode. I doubt Jen and Bill are getting that, but the specifics of the Gosselins contract indicated that each year the show renewed they were earning more per episode. Also per the Gosselins and the Roloffs, any filmed trip or activity was paid for TLC, and any special treat almost always had TLC picking up the tab. Considering that The Little Couple is made by TLC as well, while its possible they aren't compensated in the same way as other TLC show participants, it seems pretty unlikely. That means that custom trikes, and parties at the zoo and special Easter outings are perks.

 

I don't really see the two as mutually exclusive.

 

I agree, JustAlison, but I don't see any indication that Bill and Jen don't like the money and would do the show without it. I am probably cynical from seeing too many of these TLC families prat about how its all about making people aware when with rare exception, they all have to be dragged off reality tv kicking and screaming. The reality is probably somewhere between "Bill and Jen are total famewhores" and "Bill and Jen don't need the money, and don't like the fame, but are compelled by their saintly natures to continue the show for dwarfism awareness!".

[MrMattyMatt]

 

Also, I find the endless referencing to Jen's laughter, which sounds as it does because of her dwarfism, really offensive.

I don't really see the two as mutually exclusive. 

That laugh is like nails on a chalkboard for me.  How can that endless cackle be because of her dwarfism?  She would probably have it even if she was as big as the Jolly Green Giant.  Anyway, it may or may not be edited out, but at least we're not hearing it too much anymore, because I really do love watching this show!

[jodo]

 

I think they are doing it for the money, which is fine as long as they keep the kids out of it.

Agree, they are capitalizing on this opportunity as much as anyone else who gets a shot at a show bringing them stardom and $$.  And LPBW did give us that education first, Jen and Bill just moved it off the farm and and more upscale.  Bill is an entrepreneur and seized an opportunity to go Hollywood!  He is even dressing a bit better and commented on it during the last episode I think about how Jen didn't like his clothes/shoes.  He looked the same to me, like an unmade bed going out to cut the grass!  

Unfortunately they will NOT be keeping the kids out of it because it is the kid's who make me tune in.  Without those meal tickets the show will come to a close.   

[mbutterfly]

Well, I don't see them donating their salaries from the show to charity. :)

 

More seriously, I don't see this show as such a beacon of hope for others that Bill and Jen would continue to do it if it was something they didn't enjoy. I also think that its unfair to dismiss the money factor out of hand. Yes, Jen and Bill made a nice living before the show - but more money is tempting and TLC does pay pretty and Bill and Jen have added two kids to a lifestyle that was already on the low end of upper class.

 

I also agree with BitterApple, spending time with your kids on a holiday is expected.

If they altruistically donated their TLC salaries to charity, we probably wouldn't know it unless we were involved directly in that charity. 

That laugh is like nails on a chalkboard for me.  How can that endless cackle be because of her dwarfism?  She would probably have it even if she was as big as the Jolly Green Giant.  Anyway, it may or may not be edited out, but at least we're not hearing it too much anymore, because I really do love watching this show!

It was interesting to read about the affect of "helium" voice. I didn't actually know that related to dwarfism, though I have observed it a bit in real life. 

[JustAlison]

 

How can that endless cackle be because of her dwarfism?

 

"“Physique and height are probably judged accurately because of the good correlation that seems to exist between these factors and the dimensions of the speaker’s vocal apparatus. A tall, well-built man will tend to have a long vocal tract and large vocal folds. His voice quality will reflect the length of his vocal tract by having correspondingly low ranges of formant frequencies, and his voice dynamic features will indicate the dimensions and mass of his vocal folds by a correspondingly low range of fundamental frequency. His large respiratory volume will be reflected in a powerful loudness range."  --  http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/~haroldfs/popcult/handouts/accents/VOCVAR3.txt

 

~taken from one quick google search. There is endless documentation if you really wish to understand the science behind it. Nevertheless, her  'cackle' like laugh is a result of her physical condition, and it's in really poor taste to snark on it. MMV.

Edited June 7, 2014 by JustAlison

[Honey]

When I hear the term "helium voice" I can clearly hear the Munchkins singing "Lollipop Guild" on the Wizard of Oz. 

[CPP83]

I really enjoyed this episode and I am not even a fan of the Easter holiday, it's the year long scrooge that is me, but those two kiddos just make my day and I enjoy watching Bill and Jen get outmatched by them. I got a good chuckle out of Will figuring out that a bigger basket meant he could pick up more eggs.

 

It would have been nice, I thought, if NeiNei and GrandBaba had joined the festivities, Will and Zoey might have ended up with half the treats on the truck between them. But it was also great to see Jen and Bill managing the kids themselves, I like that they don't want to rely on anyone average size tagging along whenever they're trying to go on outings, they're teaching the kids boundaries and proper behavior so they are able to wrangle and keep them in line with words and instructions.

 

Will's pouting face was beyond adorable to me, and I thought Bill handled things fairly well. I don't think Bill is a natural disciplinarian but he does correct and direct Will when it seems important, as far as I've seen on the show. I think if Bill wasn't a little strict when necessary Will would have the run of the house whenever Jen leaves.

 

I loved how Will ran to greet Jen when she got home from work, I have to think that helps to lift her spirits and energy level when you have this beaming little boy racing towards you as if he hasn't seen you in months.

 

Considering how long Jen and Bill have been with the kids and watching how they all interacted together at home and then the farm I just find it almost impossible to believe that they've just had Will for little over a year and Zoey not even that long. The levels of affection and love shown, flowing back and forth between them all, I feel like they all pretty much lucked out family wise.

[ZoloftBlob]

If they altruistically donated their TLC salaries to charity, we probably wouldn't know it unless we were involved directly in that charity.

 

Sure, that's possible. I certainly can't rule it out because I don't do their taxes but based on a number of things, I think it's extremely unlikely and not true. And I don't see anyone seriously entertaining it. If you think they are, that's your choice. I'm going with the reasonable assumption that Jen and Bill like the money. They have a taste for nice things, and from watching a co=worker do the fertility rounds, the lengthy time Jen spent trying to have her own baby via in vitro and surrogacy was pretty expensive. So was the adoption process and I am sure that TLC contributed financially to the trips to China and India that they filmed.

 

Unfortunately they will NOT be keeping the kids out of it because it is the kid's who make me tune in.  Without those meal tickets the show will come to a close.  

I will throw them a bone in this. I think they started to do the reality show to get the fundage for the in vitro stuff because its expensive. I don't think the kids are meal tickets.... but I also can't deny that this show was no where near as popular when there was just Bill and Jen.

[4leafclover]

 

If they altruistically donated their TLC salaries to charity, we probably wouldn't know it unless we were involved directly in that charity.

 

Absolutely, mbutterfly!

[EmmeRose]

I remember Jen mentioning on a previous season that she had high student loan debt from Medical School.  I know this can be very high as my cousin, who is going into his 3rd year of med school, estimates that after graduation, he will owe at least $500,000.  He says he has until age 70  to pay it all back, but that is heavy duty debt.  I know Jen just turned 40, but I am sure she probably owes at least $250,000, and their TLC salaries can help reduce that debt!  Also, I am sure they are saving for Will and Zoey's college funds.  I am sure they give to charity, but as Catholics (and I am one) are urged to do it in secret.

[leighroda]

I will say I personally don't like to say much about things like jenns laugh, because whether or not it's just her laugh or caused by her height, or habit... Regardless it's not necessarily easy to change or even possible to change. I am average height, but have a higher pitched voice and have been termed to have an "annoying" voice and it bothers me because there isn't much I can do to change my voice. My sister has a similar voice and talks in a slightly lower register, whether it's natural or she trained herself that way I don't know... But all of that to say even though I'm aware my voice can be annoying there isn't much I can do about it other than just not talk.

[ZoloftBlob]

Do you believe they are donating their salary? Are we supposed to grant them, unlike every other reality show family, special credit for the possibility? I mean, we can't prove any reality whore is actually paid or doesn't donate their salary to charity. I get why its a pleasant fantasy, it gets Jen and Bill off the hook for exploiting the kids but is there any credible evidence that Bill and Jen aren't financially profiting from their reality show?

[Fostersmom]

~taken from one quick google search. There is endless documentation if you really wish to understand the science behind it. Nevertheless, her  'cackle' like laugh is a result of her physical condition, and it's in really poor taste to snark on it. MMV.

 

I'm not sure it's so much the tone/sound of Jen's laugh that annoys people so much as it is the amount of it. It would be just as annoying no matter the tone, given she laughs after like every sentence she says. I don't know if it's a nervous tick or what, but when she laughs after the most mundane things she says, it is annoying and it's not related to her dwarfism. She's not that funny, what the hell is she laughing about all the time? If she would only laugh when things were actually funny, it wouldn't be anywhere near as noticeable. 

[Honey]

Do you believe they are donating their salary? Are we supposed to grant them, unlike every other reality show family, special credit for the possibility? I mean, we can't prove any reality whore is actually paid or doesn't donate their salary to charity. I get why its a pleasant fantasy, it gets Jen and Bill off the hook for exploiting the kids but is there any credible evidence that Bill and Jen aren't financially profiting from their reality show?

There isn't any evidence that they are donating it or banking it.  It's all speculation at this point.  We could drive ourselves (and each other) crazy gong back and forth about it.

I'm not sure it's so much the tone/sound of Jen's laugh that annoys people so much as it is the amount of it. It would be just as annoying no matter the tone, given she laughs after like every sentence she says. I don't know if it's a nervous tick or what, but when she laughs after the most mundane things she says, it is annoying and it's not related to her dwarfism. She's not that funny, what the hell is she laughing about all the time? If she would only laugh when things were actually funny, it wouldn't be anywhere near as noticeable. 

It's funny, I know what you're saying and she does tend to laugh a lot.  For some reason her laugh doesn't bother me, but don't get me started on Rick Harrison from Pawn Stars, who also laughs after everything he says.  His laugh gets on my last nerve.

[4leafclover]

I have no idea what or even if they get paid for their TV show, and I certainly don't know (or much care) what they do with their money.  Its none of my business.  But I don't think its out of the question (or a fantasy) to think it is a possibility that the Kleins donate their TV income.  Should they get "special credit for the possibility?"  Of course they should, after all they get plenty of criticism for receiving any money.  Credible evidence that they are not profiting financially from their show?  No, but also no credible evidence that they are. 

[BitterApple]

ZoloftBlob, I agree, but it's hard to sell any criticism of this couple. I think Bill and Jen could stab puppies and there'd be people who'd find some justification for it. "They've had a really tough year you know..."

I think they do the show because they like it and like the extra income to cushion their lifestyle. Perfectly okay, if the opportunity is there by all means take it. Their real test will come if the show starts hurting the kids and they have to make the decision to stop or continue.

[jodo]

Do you believe they are donating their salary? Are we supposed to grant them, unlike every other reality show family, special credit for the possibility? I mean, we can't prove any reality whore is actually paid or doesn't donate their salary to charity. I get why its a pleasant fantasy, it gets Jen and Bill off the hook for exploiting the kids but is there any credible evidence that Bill and Jen aren't financially profiting from their reality show?

I don't believe they are donating their salaries any more than the Roloffs or Duggars are...unless the Duggars are giving the money to the church?!  

 

And I think if anyone doing a reality show was solely doing this to educate us then might just back that up by going one step further and saying they are also donating their earnings to xyz cause to make that just a bit more palatable.  

 

Good point about the possible lifetime of medical expense debt Jen was left with and has to pay back.

[mbutterfly]

I remember Jen mentioning on a previous season that she had high student loan debt from Medical School.  I know this can be very high as my cousin, who is going into his 3rd year of med school, estimates that after graduation, he will owe at least $500,000.  He says he has until age 70  to pay it all back, but that is heavy duty debt.  I know Jen just turned 40, but I am sure she probably owes at least $250,000, and their TLC salaries can help reduce that debt!  Also, I am sure they are saving for Will and Zoey's college funds.  I am sure they give to charity, but as Catholics (and I am one) are urged to do it in secret.

You've made good points on all of this. I strongly suspect that Jen and Bill realized having a family, for them, would be extremely expensive. Their resources would be very stretched. However, by signing a contract for a few years (if the show were popular enough) they could put all the pieces into place. Then they could remove themselves from reality television, their family's future as secure as possible. Even John and Kate wouldn't have had the paparazzi firestorm if the marital problems hadn't come out (fueled by their on-camera feuding). Today's preschoolers are pretty used to being filmed with videos splashed on facebook, twitter, and youtube. As long as Will and Zoey are rather young, it shouldn't make a lot of difference with their half-hour format and short season. At least that is how it seems to me. 

[mbutterfly]

Bill & Jen can control their filming schedule to keep the impact on the children to a minimum. They can't control the public's comments regarding the children. At some point Will & Zoey and their peers will see things that were said about them. In my opinion, that will hurt.

Since the vast, vast majority of comments about Will and Zoey have been complimentary, I'd think they would be in more danger of having it go to their heads. 

[LazyToaster]

I find the frequency of Jen's laugh sometimes annoying, but criticizing the sound of it (helium voice or whatever) seems to me to be just plain mean. Clearly her stature and the subsequent affects are out of her control.

Maybe she could learn to dial back the nervous giggle, but really I hope she's happy with herself and doesn't really care.

[ZoloftBlob]

I think they do the show because they like it and like the extra income to cushion their lifestyle. Perfectly okay, if the opportunity is there by all means take it. Their real test will come if the show starts hurting the kids and they have to make the decision to stop or continue.

 

Oh I get you. And I think that's perfectly reasonable. I just don't care for the assumption that they're not profiting from the show and are martyring themselves, doing a reality show entirely "for awareness" and deserve special credit since they aren't profiting in any way at all - even though there's utterly no evidence  Jen and Bill are donating their time.

 

I mean, does the opposite work? There's no evidence Bill and Jen aren't using the money to fund a meth lab so until we know they aren't, its perfectly ok to give them the credit for doing so? More to the point, if they are anonymously donating their wages from the show - then they don't WANT credit, so why are we giving it to them? Oh right, because there's no evidence (despite the new house, the fancy toys, the expensive adoption trips, all of which is a pattern on TLC shows, where families of modest to reasonable means have a sudden huge uptick in their cashflow) that Bill and Jen aren't donating their show wages.

 

I'm sorry, until Bill and Jen say "we're donating all our profits from the show to charity", I have no reason to believe they are not being paid and I will continue to point out that they ARE being paid. Because they are. If they secretly are donating their pay checks, they obviously don't want credit for it, and they're not going to get it. Until they do say something, its unreasonable to put them on charitable pedestal when there's no evidence that they aren't taking the money, and plenty of evidence that they are, Bitter Apple, I think you have it exactly right - they're profiting from the show and the real test is coming.

[BitterApple]

Where I think the show could hurt the kids early on is if the producers encourage Will and Zoe to "act up" for the sake of drama. "Hey kids! Let's head into the store and go crazy! Start throwing stuff around!"

If a scenario emerges where the kids have one set of rules for filming and a different set off-camera, there's going to be a lot of confusion and mixed messages.

[Everh]

There is a huge difference between being filmed for fun by family and they stick it on Facebook or Youtube, versus being filmed on a tv show that millions of people watch.     I personally do not google or look for say..."The Johnson Family at the egg hunt" video.   

  There is a huge difference when your home is rigged with many special hot lights needed to film, along with booms, cameras, crew and producers versus a parent taking a video for memories.

 I am sure Will and Zoey know there is also a big difference in film days versus days off in how they can behave and what they can do.  I think Will especially has already learned that if he cries and carries on during filming, chances are a big sugary treat will be provided asap.     

  From what has already been filmed will hurt Zoey and Will when they get to school.  Young children can be just as mean as older ones and they already have plenty of material to tease and taunt these 2 little kids with.    

 If as another poster pointed out, the attention goes to their heads versus being teased or bullied, that will be a rude and difficult adjustment when they find out  are no different from any other student in class.

 As another poster said, time will tell what kind of people/parents Bill and Jen really are.

I find the frequency of Jen's laugh sometimes annoying, but criticizing the sound of it (helium voice or whatever) seems to me to be just plain mean. Clearly her stature and the subsequent affects are out of her control.

Maybe she could learn to dial back the nervous giggle, but really I hope she's happy with herself and doesn't really care.

I did not say helium voice to be mean.   I used it as a description of how she sounds and how many primordial dwarfs sound.   I was talking at the time about how Jen seems to have a lot of the primordial characteristics while not actually being primordial.   

[ZoloftBlob]

I was talking at the time about how Jen seems to have a lot of the primordial characteristics while not actually being primordial.

 

She is really on the small side, even for a dwarf, though, so I think its fair to say her voice is higher pitched due to her size. Look at Vern Troyer - he's about her size and isn't primordial either, and while his voice is deeper, its hardly the rolling bass of James Earl Jones. :)

[BitterApple]

ZoloftBlob and Everh, I agree 100%. Even though I don't think Will is working the logic in his head, he's quickly learning that pouting, crying and fussing gets him what he wants.

I want to see a scene where Bill and Jen say "No Will, no treats today" and see what happens. Not "no cake, but you can have cookies" or "take a picture and you can have ice cream." Just flat-out tell the kid no and let him deal with it.

[minx]

I doubt that preschoolers are watching The Little Couple. I don't see anything on the show that is so mortifying that Will or Zoey need to be ashamed of themselves when they go to preschool. My experience with nasty children--and, knock on wood, my kids weren't bullied--is that there's often no rhyme or reason as to why one kid is picked on and another isn't. My nephew, a good looking, smart, funny kid, was relentlessly bullied 25 years ago in middle school. When one kid has the misfortune to get in the crosshairs of a bully and they become "It", the bullying takes on a life of its own. Then I think of a boy in my son's grade school, junior high and high school--he was a red headed little person who got along fine. He was accepted and just treated like any other kid. My daughter is 15, and a fairly overweight girl has been on her basketball team since junior high--this girl has trouble sometimes moving around the court, but boy can she shoot! And nobody seems to notice or comment on it. She's just part of the team. But another teammate who is attractive and with what you would think would be every conceivable advantage, has tempestuous relationships with so many of the girls, for who knows what reasons.

My point is that, in my experience, it's not a good idea to have potential future bullies as a controlling factor in what kids do. Because the fault is ON THE BULLY and not the kid who is BEING bullied. As a parent you do your best, do what you want to do, love your kid the rest is, in a way, out of your hands.

Edited June 7, 2014 by minx

[MrMattyMatt]

I want to see a scene where Bill and Jen say "No Will, no treats today" and see what happens. Not "no cake, but you can have cookies" or "take a picture and you can have ice cream." Just flat-out tell the kid no and let him deal with it.

Exactly.  Take the "Cakegate" episode.  Will started out simply by asking for cake but then it ramped up to a meltdown due to Jen's snipping and arguing with a 2 year, I mean 4 year old.  In retrospect she should has just said "Sorry, no cake tonight" and whisked both kids off to the living room to play. 

[Veronique Bette]

Bill and Jen have said that a major reason they are doing their show is to educate the public about the normal lives of people with dwarfism, but to my knowledge, they’ve never said it is the only reason they are doing it.  In fact, I believe they equally enjoy the overall positive reaction they have received to their show and to them as individuals, as a couple, and now as a family.  Despite their remarkable individual successes and their seemingly strong senses of self esteem, they admit that throughout their lives it has been challenging for them to deal with the gaping stares, rude questions, comments and smirks they have had to encounter at times when out in public.  A big plus to their fame or celebrity is that now they are often recognized and greeted with smiles, encouraging words and admiration from strangers rather than just being stared at is if they are comical figures or freaks.  They owe that change to the exposure from the show and I think they are grateful for it. As for salary, they are relatively well off but not billionaires so I can’t imagine why there would be any thought of them donating their entire paychecks to charity in order to justify their purpose for doing the show. They have expenses like anyone else raising a family in an uncertain economy and I don’t think they’ve ever described themselves as saints or missionaries. I find Bill and Jen very likeable and I admire how much they’ve achieved in their lives against some tough odds, but I would have to draw the line at them stabbing puppies. I do have my limits after all :).

[Everh]

ZoloftBlob and Everh, I agree 100%. Even though I don't think Will is working the logic in his head, he's quickly learning that pouting, crying and fussing gets him what he wants.

I want to see a scene where Bill and Jen say "No Will, no treats today" and see what happens. Not "no cake, but you can have cookies" or "take a picture and you can have ice cream." Just flat-out tell the kid no and let him deal with it.

Well, I would like to see that too, but I would rather see them take their kids off tv and move to another home without a pool.

        But, for those two moments a firm no was in order.  

[Lola16]

I didn't notice Jen's laugh in this episode nor do I find it off putting.  Of course now that's it's been discussed here, I'll probably notice it a lot next episode!  It's probably a nervous laugh. 

 

The Duggars consider themselves to be a charity which is why they don't pay property taxes among other things.  I doubt Jen & Bill are employing any of those tactics or are engaging in some of the less than honorable practices as the Browns (of Sister Wives).  If anyone wants to discuss it, we probably should do that in the general thread and not episode specific.

 

I liked this episode.  There are some things that I would do different if I were Jen or Bill but then again, there's things that I would do different myself if I had the chance to do over a day. 

[ZoloftBlob]

Even though I don't think Will is working the logic in his head, he's quickly learning that pouting, crying and fussing gets him what he wants.

 

Of course he is. All kids do it. My niece totally knows that if she is whining in public, she's more likely to get a positive reaction - a treat, agreement to do what she wants, than if she is home and no one other than family is around.

 

Because I simply wasn't raised this way, I don't think treats need to be removed but why not replace cake with grapes? Or apple slices? And yes, its perfectly fine to hear "no treats" once in a while.

 

Minx - I think you're making a fair point. My only real disagreement is that unless one of us is a member of the Loud family, hardly any of us had our childhoods delivered to the public in this fashion. I consider any number of amusing photos in my childhood, me eating cat food from the dish while the cat looks on in irritation, me riding the dog naked, me on the potty holding up the "business" I have made...these photos are cute *in the family* but I would have been mortified if my middle school pals had ever gotten ahold of them. Will and Zoey will never have that privacy. As adorable as Will's sad panda face is, or his screaming "cake" - and as likely as it is that his friends in school had equally embarrassing and cute things occur in the childhood, Will won't have access to their embarrassing childhood moments and they *will* have access to his. We all have embarrassing things in our childhood that we prefer to keep private. Will and Zoey, like the Gosselin kids and the Duggar kids, and Jake Roloff, aren't getting any choice to have that privacy.

[Everh]

The education thing.  It seems to be spin phrase for reality folks.   Education would be a couple of specials, not a years long series of The Kleins going on vacation, parties, dinners and doing as many tv appearances and paparazzi opportunities as they can.

          I would of loved to learn how Jen got thru medical school.  I often wonder how she got thru all the rotations?  Now that would be educational and very interesting.

        What I have learned is that this couple seem to need more assistance and help than other dwarfs.   Not a criticism, just my observation.    While that is indeed educational, wouldn't it be more educational to showcase a family without the money and endless help the Kleins have?   Maybe the heartbreak of a couple who cannot fly off to Los Angeles all the time on a moments notice to try and have a baby?

        Now with the addition of two innocent children with no choices, at this time I have a hell of a lot more respect for Honey Boo Boos mother who doesn't use the education card, the creating memories card or any other card.   

[Rohirrim]

 

I think the show has already started to hurt the kids. Will especially - I think some of the negative things said about him on the internet are hurtful to him.

 

Unless Will is online searching , I don't think anything said on the internet is hurting him.  Unless his parents, grandparents, or little friends are relaying what people have said about him on the internet, nothing that has been said is hurting him. 

 

Harsh words are going to be said about him regardless of him being on a television show.  He has dwarfism -- others will stare, snicker, and whisper about him behind his back.  He is an Asian kid with Caucasian parents who both have dwarfism -- others will stare, snicker, and whisper about him behind his back.  He has a sister from India, and guess what?!  She has dwarfism, too!  Others will stare, snicker, and whisper about him behind his back. 

 

The point is, both Will and Zoey will have to get used to attention -- some of it unwanted and unkind.  That's just life.  The kids can't be protected from judgments and assumptions at all times. 

[MrMattyMatt]

The education thing. 

I'm still trying to find out the reason for the elevator in the house.  Has it ever been said exactly?  Bill made a comment that if they would have adopted children without dwarfism, they could carry him up and down the stairs.  Is he unable to climb stairs or is it painful for him?  (please don't tell me it's "unsafe", I don't want to re-hash Jen carelessly climbing on the counter when she had Kate an arm reach away to get the dishes for the take-out food)

[ZoloftBlob]

I think I read somewhere that he's got some serious hip or back issues that they *don't* talk about a lot

[minx]

ZoloftBlob, I agree. But so far Will and Zoey are not in the Gosselin or Loud territory, yet. They are only doing cute preschooler things. We'll see how long the show goes on. I'm willing to give Jen and Bill the benefit of the doubt on this for several reasons. One, the kids have been a part of the show for a relatively short time--Will since last year, Zoey only since March. So we don't have hours upon hours of footage of them doing embarrassing things (and btw, wasn't JK plus 8 an hour show? I can't remember. The LC is only 30 minutes except for a few specials). Second, Jen and Bill had visible means of support before the show, unlike the Gosselins who pushed (and Kate still is) the kids on TV as a moneymaking enterprise. Third, I simply feel that Jen and

Bill love their kids and want the best for them, and if they felt they were being harmed, they would pull the plug. So far I see very little about the show that seems intrusive--it's just mostly garden variety reality show excursions, holidays, day to day household stuff. No big deal.

*Addendum--I just checked and the Gosselins were a 30 minute show. It just FELT longer LOL.

Edited June 7, 2014 by minx

[BitterApple]

Veronique Bette, absolutely. If one of the results of doing the show is Bill and Jen feel more comfortable in their skin, then more power to them. It's never easy being different.

[Everh]

Unless Will is online searching , I don't think anything said on the internet is hurting him.  Unless his parents, grandparents, or little friends are relaying what people have said about him on the internet, nothing that has been said is hurting him. 

 

Harsh words are going to be said about him regardless of him being on a television show.  He has dwarfism -- others will stare, snicker, and whisper about him behind his back.  He is an Asian kid with Caucasian parents who both have dwarfism -- others will stare, snicker, and whisper about him behind his back.  He has a sister from India, and guess what?!  She has dwarfism, too!  Others will stare, snicker, and whisper about him behind his back. 

 

The point is, both Will and Zoey will have to get used to attention -- some of it unwanted and unkind.  That's just life.  The kids can't be protected from judgments and assumptions at all times. 

So, why make it worse with exposing their personal home lives?

[minx]

I just watched this episode again and I really give Bill props for the way he dealt with the kids when he was doing the egg dyeing. He asked them what dye colors they wanted, and repeated their answers (Zoey garbling "purple" into her sippy cup--TOO. CUTE.) When they started to try to drink the coloring (understandable, it looked like juice) he said firmly "No. You don't drink that. You drink from this."(pushing the sippy toward them) He presented one color at a time, then took it away, gave them a second color, then watched as they maneuvered the eggs. Clear, simple directions and corrections. He did not seem to say much what he and Jen (and every other parent on the planet, me included) often said: "We're doing (such and such). OKAY?" I found out too late that that OKAY? sounds harmless and inclusive, but it's a way to give kids wiggle room on issues where there shouldn't be wiggle room: "You're going to bed, OKAY?" Instead of "You're going to bed."

It's a lesson I learned, eventually LOL. Anyway, Bill did good.