S04.E07: Something Stupid

[LoneHaranguer]

37 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Because it seemed like a plane that seats 8 or 9 passengers would be inadequate? I have no idea whether it would be cheaper to charter two smaller planes.

Doesn't anyone make larger planes for regional use any more? The ones that would stop for refueling if an airline was using them for longer distances?

[Bannon]

4 minutes ago, LoneHaranguer said:

Doesn't anyone make larger planes for regional use any more? The ones that would stop for refueling if an airline was using them for longer distances?

Beats me. When you start getting to several dozen passengers, I think the choices get narrower.

[Bryce Lynch]

Just now, Bannon said:

I certainly heard a veiled threat from the cop, which to me is completely unethical,  coming from a police officer, speaking to a citizen who is not accused of committing any crime.

I don't think it rose to the level of a veiled threat.  The veiled threat might or might not have been coming next, but Jimmy preemptively threatened himself, on the cop's behalf.  The cop actually seemed a little stunned by Jimmy's words, which could mean, he wasn't thinking along those lines.

[Tikichick]

3 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I think Chuck was right about Jimmy.  I wouldn't even say he treated him like crap.  He wasn't perfect. He should have been honest about not wanting him as a lawyer at HHM, though that probably would have hurt Jimmy just as much.   

But, Jimmy started the tit for tat that ended up with Chuck tricking him into confessing on tape and later breaking into his house.  Both brothers kept escalating the situation.  Jimmy did the MV fraud, which was a horrible thing to do to his brother.  That made Chuck determined (rightfully) to get Jimmy disbarred, but he used some very underhanded tricks to to to accomplish it.  Then Jimmy fought dirty in return.  

The tit for tat between the brothers that led to the end of Chuck was merely the tip of the iceberg, IMO.  Jimmy is certainly no saint, but I wonder how differently his trajectory would have gone without who knows how many years of undermining by Chuck?  I strongly feel whatever triggered Chuck's attitude about Jimmy stems from envy loooong ago, probably right about the time Chuck left home for college (where he was a tremendous success).  I suspect around about the same time the little brother everyone always took a shine to for his personality suddenly grew to an age and capabilities where his intelligence started to get noticed.  

[Eulipian 5k]

6 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

The cop actually seemed a little stunned by Jimmy's words, which could mean, he wasn't thinking along those lines.

Heh. Considering the upstanding MENSA scholars we have seen in ABQ's criminal citizenry, (Spooge, Skank, Badger, Sneaky Pete, Jesse, Tuco), Jimmy would have stunned him with his articulate rebuttals.

[Tikichick]

30 minutes ago, PeterPirate said:

Yes, but we also never saw Chuck say or do anything subsequent to Kim's re-emergence from the Cornfield to call in a return favor.   Anything is possible, but I believe that Chuck could have simply been trying to help someone else who had been harmed by Jimmy's antics.    

But it's also true that the Chuck we were shown onscreen in the years immediately preceding his death showed absolutely no interest in helping anyone, simply expected(demanded) everyone defer to his superior rank, superior knowledge, greater experience.    

[Bannon]

12 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I don't think it rose to the level of a veiled threat.  The veiled threat might or might not have been coming next, but Jimmy preemptively threatened himself, on the cop's behalf.  The cop actually seemed a little stunned by Jimmy's words, which could mean, he wasn't thinking along those lines.

Well, anybody can ask anything of anyone,  but once a law abiding citizen declines a police officer's request, the ethical thing for a police officer to do is to leave the citizen alone.

[Bryce Lynch]

2 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Well, anybody can ask anything of anyone,  but once a law abiding citizen declines a police officer's request, the ethical thing for a police officer to do is to leave the citizen alone.

Meh.  Jimmy was not breaking the law at that moment, but he is far from a "law abiding citizen".   I don't have a problem with a cop trying to convince a scumbag, facilitator of criminals to move on, as long as he doesn't cross the line and take it too far.  He never crossed the line with Jimmy, and Huell gave him an Albuquerque Sandwich Whipping, before we could find out how the discussion between Jimmy and the cop would have ended.  

[Bryce Lynch]

8 minutes ago, Eulipian 5k said:

Heh. Considering the upstanding MENSA scholars we have seen in ABQ's criminal citizenry, (Spooge, Skank, Badger, Sneaky Pete, Jesse, Tuco), Jimmy would have stunned him with his articulate rebuttals.

And that's church, yo. For real!   

[Bannon]

13 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Meh.  Jimmy was not breaking the law at that moment, but he is far from a "law abiding citizen".   I don't have a problem with a cop trying to convince a scumbag, facilitator of criminals to move on, as long as he doesn't cross the line and take it too far.  He never crossed the line with Jimmy, and Huell gave him an Albuquerque Sandwich Whipping, before we could find out how the discussion between Jimmy and the cop would have ended.  

If a citizen isn't breaking the law, a police officer's ethical responsibility is to leave the citizen alone, period.

[Bannon]

59 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I think Chuck was right about Jimmy.  I wouldn't even say he treated him like crap.  He wasn't perfect. He should have been honest about not wanting him as a lawyer at HHM, though that probably would have hurt Jimmy just as much.   

But, Jimmy started the tit for tat that ended up with Chuck tricking him into confessing on tape and later breaking into his house.  Both brothers kept escalating the situation.  Jimmy did the MV fraud, which was a horrible thing to do to his brother.  That made Chuck determined (rightfully) to get Jimmy disbarred, but he used some very underhanded tricks to to to accomplish it.  Then Jimmy fought dirty in return.  

The irony lies that in that if Jimmy had taken the more direct route to sabotaging Chuck with Mesa Verde, by letting the insurance company know about Chuck's mental state right away, he would have been acting entirely ethically, both as a lawyer and a brother, even if his motives weren't pure. Frankly, Jimmy's decision to not take the hard, painful, path of having Chuck committed when the chance arose might be what cost Chuck his life. To be fair, it may have been difficult to make the order stick, as good a lawyer as Chuck was, but it is not unreasonable to suppose that if Chuck had been exposed to good therapy then, he may have made a substantial recovery.

Edited September 20, 2018 by Bannon

[Bryce Lynch]

8 minutes ago, Bannon said:

If a citizen isn't breaking the law, a police officer's ethical responsibility is to leave the citizen alone, period.

Meh.   If a scumbag is harming the community, while not actually committing a crime, at that moment, I'm not going to knock a cop for trying to appeal to his conscience and politely talk him into leaving.  

[LoneHaranguer]

29 minutes ago, Eulipian 5k said:

Heh. Considering the upstanding MENSA scholars we have seen in ABQ's criminal citizenry, (Spooge, Skank, Badger, Sneaky Pete, Jesse, Tuco), Jimmy would have stunned him with his articulate rebuttals.

And maybe made him think Jimmy had picked up a few things from his lawyers after doing similar things elsewhere?

[Tikichick]

9 minutes ago, Bannon said:

The irony lies that in that if Jimmy had taken the more direct route to sabotaging Chuck with Mesa Verde, by letting the insurance company know about Chuck's mental state right away, he would have been acting entirely ethically, both as a lawyer and a brother, even if his motives weren't pure. Frankly, Jimmy's decision to not take the hard, painful, path of having Chuck committed when the chance arose might be what cost Chuck his life. To be fair, it may have been difficult to make the order stick, as good a lawyer as Chuck was, but it is not unreasonable to suppose that if Chuck had been exposed to good therapy then, he may have made a substantial recovery.

Tragically true.

And it might have ultimately resulted in a true reconciliation of the brothers, with Chuck at the ready to lovingly steer Jimmy to an ethical and profitable law practice.

[Bannon]

13 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

Meh.   If a scumbag is harming the community, while not actually committing a crime, at that moment, I'm not going to knock a cop for trying to appeal to his conscience and politely talk him into leaving.  

Once you license agents of the state as moral scolds or arbiters, instead of merely as enforcers of duly passed legislation, you are harming self government, and opening a pandora's box of abuse. 

I'll avoid extended political debate and let you have the last word.

11 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

Tragically true.

And it might have ultimately resulted in a true reconciliation of the brothers, with Chuck at the ready to lovingly steer Jimmy to an ethical and profitable law practice.

These writers are just wonderful at having characters face the consequences of their decisions.

[Bryce Lynch]

13 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Once you license agents of the state as moral scolds or arbiters, instead of merely as enforcers of duly passed legislation, you are harming self government, and opening a pandora's box of abuse. 

I'll avoid extended political debate and let you have the last word.

I won't get political, but I think this is another example of a morals vs. ethics situation.  Jimmy is an officer of the court, sworn to uphold a code of ethics.  Yet, we tend to look past, or even delight in it, when we see him pull all sorts of unethical tricks for a good cause.  While, I don't think the cop actually crossed any ethical line, even if he did, barely do so, it would be in the same ballpark as some of Jimmy's milder antics.   

A lot of it has to do with the fact that Jimmy, as flawed as he is, is our protagonist.  If the same scene took place in a show where the cops were the protagonists, I think most people would support the cop.

Edited September 20, 2018 by Bryce Lynch

[SoMuchTV]

6 hours ago, Bannon said:

Again, you are correct, but being right can get you harmed,  hence the need to choose the place and time of your battles wisely.

LOL was that a veiled threat? Just kidding just kidding!

[Bryce Lynch]

4 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

Did we ever find out why Chuck had a fear of electricity?  Did he stick his tongue in a light socket or something?

That is one flashback episode I want to see.  At what point did he all of a sudden have a fear of electricity/batteries etc.  I assume he didn't have that problem in college.  That woman who went to his house to have dinner never knew he had that problem.  She had no idea he had those types of issues, and they did have a past together.

No, we haven't seen any specific origin of Chuck's phobia.   It started shortly after Rebecca left him, and after Jimmy told him he passed the bar, so one or both of those things might have been a factor.  

[Bannon]

14 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I won't get political, but I think this is another example of a morals vs. ethics situation.  Jimmy is an officer of the court, sworn to uphold a code of ethics.  Yet, we tend to look past, or even delight in it, when we see him pull all sorts of unethical tricks for a good cause.  While, I don't think the cop actually crossed any ethical line, even if he did, barely do so, it would be in the same ballpark as some of Jimmy's milder antics.   

A lot of it has to do with the fact that Jimmy, as flawed as he is, is our protagonist.  If the same scene took place in a show where the cops were the protagonists, I think most people would support the cop.

I wouldn't. I've always hated the t.v. trope of the  cop portrayed sympathetically, as he crosses ethical boundaries, because he's going after bad guys.

[Bryce Lynch]

1 minute ago, Bannon said:

I wouldn't. I've always hated the t.v. trope of the  cop portrayed sympathetically, as he crosses ethical boundaries, because he's going after bad guys.

How do you feel about criminals who crossed ethical and legal boundaries?  Have you sympathized with Jimmy, Mike, Fring, Nacho or Kim when they committed crimes or ethics violations?

[Bannon]

27 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

How do you feel about criminals who crossed ethical and legal boundaries?  Have you sympathized with Jimmy, Mike, Fring, Nacho or Kim when they committed crimes or ethics violations?

I really don't sympathize with fictional characters of any kind. Their behavior is either interesting, or it isn't, and certainly unethical behavior, by any character, can be interesting. Where most television drama fails is when the writing or direction too obviously attempts to paint what should be complex characters sympathetically or unsympathetically. I appreciate that these writers don't usually do that. For instance, Hank in BB may be the most nuanced character I've seen in television, and he wasn't even the central character! Really brilliant stuff.

[Ellaria]

21 minutes ago, Bannon said:

I really don't sympathize with fictional characters of any kind. Their behavior is either interesting, or it isn't, and certainly unethical behavior, by any character, can be interesting. Where most television drama fails is when the writing or direction too obviously attempts to paint what should be complex characters sympathetically or unsympathetically. I appreciate that these writers don't usually do that. For instance, Hank in BB may be the most nuanced character I've seen in television, and he wasn't even the central character! Really brilliant stuff.

That's the beauty of enjoying shows like BB, BCS, The Wire, The Sopranos, etc. Unethical behavior can be interesting. You can choose which drug dealer to root for. And yes, it is possible to sympathize with them. It is fiction - it is escapism. It doesn't make me a bad person to say that I am completely charmed by Jimmy McGill. I understand the difference between reality and what I am watching on TV.

Hank is by far my favorite character in BB. It is the absolute perfect combination of actor and writing.

[shapeshifter]

11 hours ago, qtpye said:

It is too bad that he did not keep in touch with that paralegal from Davis and Main...the one who helped him move his cocobolo desk

I'd forgotten about the cocobolo desk. It's sad to think how Jimmy has fallen to basically having the trunk of his car for his office. It reminds me of the line "Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose" from the song "Me and Bobby McGee," except Jimmy seems anything but carefree, but then neither was Janis Joplin when she sang it.

 

5 hours ago, Tikichick said:

Chuck invented an entire illness in order to escape into a lifestyle where he could shut himself away from what he couldn't deal with without acknowledging he was avoiding what he couldn't deal with.  Jimmy's employing a different strategy to achieve the same ends -- including the ultimate exit strategy of taking the life of James McGill.

Pretty profound, @Tikichick. Walter White and Skyler were pretty much builders of they're own destruction too. I guess it's a common literary theme. Does this mean we're looking at the dark side of Vince Gilligan?

[Eulipian 5k]

The difference with Jimmy or any citizen acting unlawfully and or unethically is that a cop is armed, licensed, and has the power of the State behind him to take someone's liberty or life. Our Constitution, (see Saul's office, so on topic) ,is specifically written, to protect people from the power of an unruly state.

[Eulipian 5k]

Bryce L: I wondered how that show could steal the name Sneaky Pete from BB. Thx for the clarification, Yo.

[Bannon]

1 hour ago, Ellaria Sand said:

That's the beauty of enjoying shows like BB, BCS, The Wire, The Sopranos, etc. Unethical behavior can be interesting. You can choose which drug dealer to root for. And yes, it is possible to sympathize with them. It is fiction - it is escapism. It doesn't make me a bad person to say that I am completely charmed by Jimmy McGill. I understand the difference between reality and what I am watching on TV.

Hank is by far my favorite character in BB. It is the absolute perfect combination of actor and writing.

I've watched BB three times now, and with each viewing I appreciate more how Hank is the best written character I've ever seen on a television show. It's probably one of the reasons I was so hard on "The Americans"; Stan was such a similar character, in terms of his relationship to the story and other characters, but in comparison to Hank, he was written entirely flatly, without any inner voice which evolved in response to his life experiences. Hank was a real human being, which is the highest achievement for a writer of fiction. BCS hasn't quite scaled that height yet, but they might get there with Jimmy.

[Tikichick]

11 hours ago, Eulipian 5k said:

The difference with Jimmy or any citizen acting unlawfully and or unethically is that a cop is armed, licensed, and has the power of the State behind him to take someone's liberty or life. Our Constitution, (see Saul's office, so on topic) ,is specifically written, to protect people from the power of an unruly state.

Absolutely correct!

It also bears remembering that, while the cop may have had good intentions, we overlook any stepping over the line on their part at our own peril.  Considering they are an armed force with the power to bring that to bear against the people, it must be an absolute that they operate entirely within the strictures of their authority and not one iota more.

[benteen]

15 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I think he wanted to help Kim, by getting her to dump Jimmy, who he believed would drag her down.  I think he also didn't want Jimmy associated with HHM, through Kim. 

I don't think Chuck ever had truly "bad" motives regarding Jimmy, at least not from his point of view.  He wasn't trying to hurt Jimmy.  In his mind, he was always trying to protect Jimmy from himself; and protect HHM and the Law from Jimmy.   

According to Jimmy, there are 56 lawyers at S&C.  It would require either a VERY expensive larger jet (I found  quotes at over $100,000 for a round trip between ABQ and and Aspen, for a plane that large) or multiple, smaller jets.  

I think that's true about Chuck in regards to Jimmy.  Though I don't view Chuck in a positive light.  He treats people he believes are beneath him like crap and I think his rigidness prevented him from truly trying to appeal to Jimmy's better side.  I also won't condone him not mentioning to Jimmy what his mother's last words were though I am sympathetic that he was hurt that his mother didn't seem to know he was in the room.

[Tikichick]

5 minutes ago, benteen said:

I think that's true about Chuck in regards to Jimmy.  Though I don't view Chuck in a positive light.  He treats people he believes are beneath him like crap and I think his rigidness prevented him from truly trying to appeal to Jimmy's better side.  I also won't condone him not mentioning to Jimmy what his mother's last words were though I am sympathetic that he was hurt that his mother didn't seem to know he was in the room.

The way Chuck treated those he had power over bothers me tremendously.  How someone treats others they're not obligated to be nice to is one of the ways I judge what someone is really like.

I've come to the realization that the Charles McGill I met is largely equivalent to meeting Saul Goodman in Breaking Bad -- not necessarily a full picture of the man, more the wasted hull after the poison did it's work.  Jimmy doesn't tend to appreciate those he comes across who are imperious, pompous or needlessly cruel. Yet he still loved and idolized Chuck -- and accepted the treatment Chuck dished out to him.  Just like the unexpected kind heart of Jimmy McGill was revealed under the loathsome facade of Saul Goodman, I suspect if we got a long enough look back we'd start to find the lovable side of Chuck as well.

I mourn Chuck and the wasted potential the two brothers could have had as a functional team.     

[Bryce Lynch]

29 minutes ago, benteen said:

I think that's true about Chuck in regards to Jimmy.  Though I don't view Chuck in a positive light.  He treats people he believes are beneath him like crap and I think his rigidness prevented him from truly trying to appeal to Jimmy's better side.  I also won't condone him not mentioning to Jimmy what his mother's last words were though I am sympathetic that he was hurt that his mother didn't seem to know he was in the room.

I thought that Chuck not telling Jimmy his mother had cried out for him on her deathbed was an act of kindness, though partly motivated by jealousy.  He didn't want to burden Jimmy with the guilt of knowing he was out getting and sandwich, while his mother died, calling out his name.  Of course, he also didn't want Jimmy to know that "Mom loved him best."   

If Chuck really wanted to hurt Jimmy, when Jimmy asked if she said anything, he would have said, "Yes.  She kept calling "Jimmy", but you were out getting a sandwich, because you were a bad son, who didn't give a damn about his Mother."   

Also, keep in mind, that at the time of their mother's death, Jimmy and Chuck were probably on pretty good terms.  This would have been during the period where Jimmy was working in the mail room and Chuck was proud of him, as described in the letter he left for Jimmy.   

BTW, with Huell's arrest, we now have 2 incidents where going out for sandwiches led to bad outcomes.  

Edited September 21, 2018 by Bryce Lynch

[Bryce Lynch]

8 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

The way Chuck treated those he had power over bothers me tremendously.  How someone treats others they're not obligated to be nice to is one of the ways I judge what someone is really like.

I've come to the realization that the Charles McGill I met is largely equivalent to meeting Saul Goodman in Breaking Bad -- not necessarily a full picture of the man, more the wasted hull after the poison did it's work.  Jimmy doesn't tend to appreciate those he comes across who are imperious, pompous or needlessly cruel. Yet he still loved and idolized Chuck -- and accepted the treatment Chuck dished out to him.  Just like the unexpected kind heart of Jimmy McGill was revealed under the loathsome facade of Saul Goodman, I suspect if we got a long enough look back we'd start to find the lovable side of Chuck as well.

I mourn Chuck and the wasted potential the two brothers could have had as a functional team.     

I never saw any evidence that Chuck made a general practice of mistreating those he had power over.  

Most or all of the bad behavior we saw from Chuck was directly related to his feud with Jimmy, or which Jimmy was (at least) equally at fault.  He sort of gently pushed Howard around and manipulated Ernie,  but that was only after the Mesa Verde fraud and the result of his obsession to get Jimmy disbarred (which Jimmy totally deserved) , though not at the cost of Ernie's job and putting HHM at risk.   

[Tikichick]

13 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I thought that Chuck not telling Jimmy his mother had cried out for him on her deathbed was an act of kindness, though partly motivated by jealousy.  He didn't want to burden Jimmy with the guilt of knowing he was out getting and sandwich, while his mother died, calling out his name.  Of course, he also didn't want Jimmy to know that "Mom loved him best."   

If Chuck really wanted to hurt Jimmy, when Jimmy asked if she said anything, he would have said, "Yes.  She kept calling "Jimmy", but you were out getting a sandwich, because you were a bad son, who didn't give a damn about his Mother."   

Also, keep in mind, that at the time of their mother's death, Jimmy and Chuck were probably on pretty good terms.  This would have been during the period where Jimmy was working in the mail room and Chuck was proud of him, as described in the letter he left for Jimmy.   

BTW, with Huell's arrest, we now have 2 incidents where going out for sandwiches led to bad outcomes.  

IMO in that letter Chuck said something which would appear to everyone to be completely benign.  ,That is to everyone except Jimmy, for whom it was the revelation that the anger and resentment he spewed at him during their fight wasn't merely the result of Jimmy's actions and exacerbated by Chuck's illness.  Reading Chuck's message in the letter was the first time that Jimmy understood his brother had actually been boiling with hatred for him for many, many years.      

[Bryce Lynch]

15 minutes ago, Tikichick said:

IMO in that letter Chuck said something which would appear to everyone to be completely benign.  ,That is to everyone except Jimmy, for whom it was the revelation that the anger and resentment he spewed at him during their fight wasn't merely the result of Jimmy's actions and exacerbated by Chuck's illness.  Reading Chuck's message in the letter was the first time that Jimmy understood his brother had actually been boiling with hatred for him for many, many years.      

I think the letter was the complete opposite of that.  The comment about how their Mom beamed when she looked at Jimmy was Chuck's way of sharing the good part of her crying out for him on her deathbed, without the laying the guilt on Jimmy.

The rest showed that, before their recent problems and Chuck's mental illness, Chuck was proud of Jimmy and loved him.  

[Shriekingeel]

On 9/18/2018 at 3:36 AM, PeterPirate said:

The housing bubble got its start in 2002 when the government relaxed restrictions on mortgages.  It makes sense that Mesa Verde is cashing in on the boom.  

Mesa Verde = “green table”. The idea of MV playing pool with their assets isn’t too much of a stretch, I hope. 

[PeterPirate]

21 hours ago, Tikichick said:

That's just it, was Chuck actually right -- or did Jimmy's blind faith in what Chuck said make him truly believe going down that path was inevitable, almost unconsciously setting himself on a course to embody what Chuck predicted?

As for what Chuck said in the letter, I haven't accepted we know the truth yet.  I question the reliability of our narrator -- particularly on the grounds of his determined and pronounced avoidance of any acknowledgement of his grief at the loss of his brother.   IMO he's also shutting himself off from the acceptance that Wexler McGill is no more.   It all points to just how similar the McGill brothers were down deep.  Chuck invented an entire illness in order to escape into a lifestyle where he could shut himself away from what he couldn't deal with without acknowledging he was avoiding what he couldn't deal with.  Jimmy's employing a different strategy to achieve the same ends -- including the ultimate exit strategy of taking the life of James McGill.

This this and this again.  Chuck and Jimmy are two sides of the same coin.  

My best guess is that Chuck's illness was a psychosomatic or subconscious response to Jimmy getting his law degree and passing the bar, coupled with his guilt over telling Howard not to hire him.  

Edited September 21, 2018 by PeterPirate

[Eulipian 5k]

28 minutes ago, PeterPirate said:

My best guess is that Chuck's illness was a psychosomatic or subconscious response to Jimmy getting his law degree and passing the bar, coupled with his guilt over telling Howard not to hire him.  

We also got hints that it may have started when Rebecca was  advancing in her career. (She got a phone call during his dinner and she didn't ignore the call) IIRC. He also hated that Jimmy was interesting to Rebecca - another "version" of "Mom liked you best".

[dsteele]

Just an FYI Sarah, but that wasn't Nancy and Frank's version of Something Stupid. It was by an indie band named Lola Marsh.
Think I prefer the original. ;-)

[PeterPirate]

35 minutes ago, Eulipian 5k said:

We also got hints that it may have started when Rebecca was  advancing in her career. (She got a phone call during his dinner and she didn't ignore the call) IIRC. He also hated that Jimmy was interesting to Rebecca - another "version" of "Mom liked you best".

I agree Jimmy's ability to make Rebecca laugh probably rankled Chuck.  But Chuck was already aware that Rebecca was a high-profile artist, since Yo-Yo Ma played at their wedding.  And, well, Yo-Yo Ma rules.  

[Tikichick]

Chuck's illness definitely was a defense mechanism that allowed him to avoid whatever it is that he couldn't face or deal with.  Whatever it was, it ran deep and rattled him to his core.  I think his little brother is also putting into practice his own avoidance maneuvers in his attempt to outrun his demons.   

[Eulipian 5k]

1 hour ago, PeterPirate said:

But Chuck was already aware that Rebecca was a high-profile artist, since Yo-Yo Ma played at their wedding.  And, well, Yo-Yo Ma rules.  

This fits my earlier suspicion that the problem in Chuck's marriage was"irreconcilable similarities". Chuck saw she was his equal in her field and could not stand that she wouldn't defer to him as everyone else had to. Neither Howard, nor anyone at HHM was his equal, and Jimmy wasn't going to ever be allowed to. A wife who would not defer will be a problem no matter that he genuinely loved her. He started reacting to her phone (electrical device) as a surrogate to his discomfort with the relationship. That all seemed to be what was packed into the dinner scene with him, Rebecca, and Jimmy.

[Bannon]

1 hour ago, dsteele said:

Just an FYI Sarah, but that wasn't Nancy and Frank's version of Something Stupid. It was by an indie band named Lola Marsh.
Think I prefer the original. ;-)

Yeah, I thought so. It costs a lot more money to use the Nancy and Frank version, I suspect.

[Bryce Lynch]

20 hours ago, Eulipian 5k said:

The difference with Jimmy or any citizen acting unlawfully and or unethically is that a cop is armed, licensed, and has the power of the State behind him to take someone's liberty or life. Our Constitution, (see Saul's office, so on topic) ,is specifically written, to protect people from the power of an unruly state.

I agree that police acting unlawfully is a serious thing.  But, even if we assume the cop crossed a line (I don't really think he did), he barely crossed it, didn't harm anyone and was doing it to try to reduce crime.  Jimmy, on the other hand, has gone way over the line, committed numerous felonies and has caused harm to people.

Funny, how Jimmy accused the cop of planning to plant something in his glove compartment, when Jimmy hired a felon to plant something on his brother and a murderer (though they were "good" murders) to get into his brother's house under false pretenses and invade his privacy.

I was also thinking that the if the cop was going to make a "threat" it could have been a totally legal one.  He could have told Jimmy he would park across the street from his truck and take down license plates and photos of Jimmy's customers, and stop and frisk any parolees or probationers.  He might also try to make it appear that Jimmy was working with the cops, which would be a little more ethically questionable, but probably not illegal.   

[Clanstarling]

4 hours ago, dsteele said:

Just an FYI Sarah, but that wasn't Nancy and Frank's version of Something Stupid. It was by an indie band named Lola Marsh.
Think I prefer the original. ;-)

I always found that one a little creepy - given it was a father and daughter singing a love song. Kind of like Afternoon Delight in Arrested Development ;).

[shapeshifter]

8 hours ago, dsteele said:

Just an FYI Sarah, but that wasn't Nancy and Frank's version of Something Stupid. It was by an indie band named Lola Marsh.
Think I prefer the original. ;-)

It didn't matter to me that it wasn't the original. What's bugging me is that every time I see the episode title in this thread, the song starts playing in my head. Wikipedia says it was number 1 on the Billboard charts for a month, but I am sure it was even longer that I heard it every morning during breakfast before school as a kid. 
By the way--have we ever heard Kim or Jimmy say "I love you"?

[Clanstarling]

18 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

It didn't matter to me that it wasn't the original. What's bugging me is that every time I see the episode title in this thread, the song starts playing in my head. Wikipedia says it was number 1 on the Billboard charts for a month, but I am sure it was even longer that I heard it every morning during breakfast before school as a kid. 
By the way--have we ever heard Kim or Jimmy say "I love you"?

I don't think so. They're a remarkably undemonstrative couple, in my opinion.

[preeya]

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

It didn't matter to me that it wasn't the original. What's bugging me is that every time I see the episode title in this thread, the song starts playing in my head. Wikipedia says it was number 1 on the Billboard charts for a month, but I am sure it was even longer that I heard it every morning during breakfast before school as a kid. 
By the way--have we ever heard Kim or Jimmy say "I love you"?

1

They are more like best friends than lovers.

[thuganomics85]

Late for this episode and this ended up being kind of a depressing one.  Jimmy is just spiraling out of control now, and I'm flipping back and forth between wherever this is going to destroy him and Kim, or possibly worse: drag her down with him.  While I don't think there is anything necessarily wrong with her taking Huell's case (despite Jimmy's motives), that final scene seems to be hinting she might be doing something shady herself to help.  And what's crazy is that there were several moments throughout the episode where it seemed clear that Kim knows Jimmy is going down this path, and yet she can't help but to still support him.  I have a bad feeling about this!

Jimmy's antics at the office party was some perfect "avert the eyes" cringe.  They've always been good with that stuff (see: Walt at the school assembly in Breaking Bad.)

Gus might be a stone-cold sociopath, but the man can cook!  But his face when he realized that Hector hasn't completely lost his mind was chilling.

Oh, Mike!  It's never easy being the manager, and that likely goes double when you're managing a team doing criminal activity, all while living underground and cut off from the rest of the world!  Werner is probably right about them needing some air and getting some "R&R", but I have a bad feeling that it is going to be a disaster if Mike ends up agreeing to do it.

So, we have now jumped forward by eight months, right?  I wonder if they're planning on ending this in five seasons like they did with BB, because we're getting close to Jimmy finally becoming Saul, I imagine.

[Eulipian 5k]

On 9/21/2018 at 5:11 PM, Bryce Lynch said:

I was also thinking that the if the cop was going to make a "threat" it could have been a totally legal one.  He could have told Jimmy he would park across the street from his truck and take down license plates and photos of Jimmy's customers, and stop and frisk any parolees or probationers.  He might also try to make it appear that Jimmy was working with the cops, which would be a little more ethically questionable, but probably not illegal.   

Great idea, but that show was called: "The Wire". Just to say that these writers and creators have done a masterful job of writing this scene.

[aemom]

On 2018-09-18 at 10:02 AM, JudyObscure said:

That wasn't the first time we've seen them brushing their teeth together, it must be some writer's idea of solid couple-hood. Ewwww.  I don't think I've ever seen my husband brush his teeth.

I am truly fascinated by how many people are disgusted by the tooth brushing. It doesn't bother me in the slightest, but I could go the rest of my life without seeing someone vomit onscreen again.

[preeya]

14 minutes ago, AEMom said:

I am truly fascinated by how many people are disgusted by the tooth brushing. It doesn't bother me in the slightest, but I could go the rest of my life without seeing someone vomit onscreen again.

It's not so much as being disgusted by it, it's more like a stupid/dumb kind of interlude between scenes, thoughts, or whatever. MHO, is that it is more dumb than disgusting.