S04.E09: One Minute More

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

The beginning of the end approaches as Cole and Cassie embark on their final mission.

[Chaos Theory]

Hey a scene from the movie!!!

Of course it was Cassie and Cole that end up releasing the plague.

Cole is one big time travel Paradox isn’t he?

[Bort]

This show really knows how to play the long game. This whole time, Hannah was Cole’s erstwhile mother.

[thuganomics85]

Really should have saw Hannah being Cole's mother coming, but it only occurred to me right after she got shot and died in his arms.  Time-travel sure is insane, huh?  And this means Jones is his grandmother!

And, of course, the irony that the plague was actually started by Cassie (and Cole) this entire time, because they needed it for the time-traveling machine to get invented, because that would be the only way to stop Olivia now.  Crazy!

Get to see the Pallid Man for one last (?) time.

Don't know how long Jennifer will have wait to put her drawling skills to use again, because her fingers looked rough!

[Chaos Theory]

Soon as Jones sent Hannah back I clocked her as Cole’s mother.  I was also kinda intrigued by the idea of Olivia’s daughter being his mom.  But ultimately Hannah just works so much better long game wise.  It’s the whole chicken and egg thing that makes Cole such a big ass paradox.  He saved her life so she can live long enough to give him life.

And doesn’t Cassie die from the plague?

[Bort]

3 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

And doesn’t Cassie die from the plague?

But not for several years, yet Cassie was the one who dropped the vial and should be exposed. Hmmm...

This also explains why Cassie so fiercely spearheaded the CDC effort to fight the plague. Guilt.

[Evie]

Lesson of this entire series: Always use birth control, folks. Or butt stuff only.

I thought Olivia's daughter was Cole's mom after Episode 3 just because with eight episodes left who else could it be, you know. I never considered Hannah until Jones sent her back, and then I suspected the twist. I knew for sure when Hannah told Cole about "Marian." I admit I was teary-eyed from then on. Well-played, show. Jones decided to keep Hannah after saving the Coles. Cole saved young Hannah. Hannah gave life to Cole and sacrificed herself for him. Totally fits the themes of the show

So Cole is the demon and Cole and Cassie caused the plague.

Cassie should be exposed, but white-streak Cassie was at the CDC so guess not?

Edited June 30, 2018 by Evie

[cynic]

This was my least favorite of the nights so far. As soon as I saw that the first episode was juxtaposing Hannah and Emma, I realized what the twist would be. I was impatient for it to actually be revealed, so the three hours felt a bit draggy. When it did finally happen, I was moved though. 

One thing, as much as I like the actor who plays Cole's dad (And his great head of hair), the big age difference between him and Hannah kinda seemed a bit squicky to me,  especially since Hannah comes off so naive in a lot of ways. It just pulled me out of the scene.

As for the airport scene, I liked that a lot, but yeah, couldn't help wondering about Cassie being exposed too early in her timeline to make it to the cdc.

Edited June 30, 2018 by cynic

[Cthulhudrew]

1 hour ago, cynic said:

This was my least favorite of the nights so far. As soon as I saw that the first episode was juxtaposing Hannah and Emma, I realized what the twist would be. I was impatient for it to actually be revealed, so the three hours felt a bit draggy. When it did finally happen, I was moved though. 

 

I suspected it was going to be the twist with the Emma/Hannah episode too, but I actually really liked the reveal and the way they handled it this episode. It makes me want to go back and watch the (sadly, few) James/Hannah scenes that the show has had prior to this.

In fact, the reveal really turned the episode around for me, as I was initially very skeptical of the whole "going back to the beginning" with the airport plague. It seemed too simplistic (although I did appreciate the callback to the end of the movie), and a really convoluted way for the show to finish things after 5 seasons. Fortunately, they managed to make it very un-straightforward after all.

Way back in season one, I had a feeling the "patient zero" corpse would end up being Cole's, but now I'm thinking it will turn out to be Olivia (especially with the way they replayed the line about the eyes looking weird). Either her body, or else they end up sending her consciousness back in time to possess the body and trap her there.

The last two seasons were kind of hit or miss for me (especially after the great 1st season), but this season has been firing on all cylinders. Really looking forward to the ending.

Edited June 30, 2018 by Cthulhudrew

[Ray Adverb]

DISLIKE

 

Cassie and Cole release the virus and cause this whole mess.  There goes the happy ending I hoped for.

 

Well there's 2 more episodes.  They seem to imply that the solution is to erase Cole from existence.  So what are the implications of that?  He never releases the killer virus?

[justmehere]

5 hours ago, Evie said:

Jones decided to keep Hannah after saving the Coles. Cole saved young Hannah. Hannah gave life to Cole and sacrificed herself for him.

These loops are quite lovely to consider when time travel seems otherwise to have caused so much trouble.

----

Right now, deliberately starting the plague to stop Olivia isn't making much sense to me. I guess Katerina wouldn't have finished the machine w/o the plague, but w/o the plague, would the Witness have had any power or even have come to be? (The Tall Man ultimately not starting it was interesting.) Doesn't releasing the plague just keep everything as it already was in the endless loop?

Another confusing point: Jones said that the primaries built the machine to erase James Cole. Jennifer said James can't be the Djinn because "this" (the whole cycle?) has to be born of time travel. Jones is then horrified to realize that Hannah is James' mother, so Hannah's the one who needs to be erased. She did die, but it had no bearing on James traveling through time. I thought it meant needing to stop him being born, which would unravel everything (including that Hannah would never have been born because Jones wouldn't have saved the Coles, leading to her decision to keep her baby). Or did I misinterpret that whole conversation?

Looking forward to next week's finale and very glad they got to tell their whole story. They do seem to have planned it out in fine detail (down to the white streak in Cassie's hair), so I'm hoping for a satisfying end. It's all pretty twisty still.

[Bort]

In the end, I guess Emma just ended up being a red herring character so that most people (me) wouldn’t instantly figure out that Hannah was Marion the second Jones sent her back. I did figure out that it was Hannah before the reveal but not until sometime during this episode. The Daughters episode totally fooled me, I thought it really was Emma. 

Most of the mothers on this show never got to raise their children, though. Jones was misled into thinking hers died in the plague so that she would invent a time machine, Cassie’s was stolen from her at birth, Olivia left hers by a tree for her future self to retrieve and Hannah had to leave hers to complete the timeline.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

What was with the sudden white streak in Cassie's hair? Is the stress of trying to save the world finally getting to her? And as someone who put colored streaks in my hair and then let them grow out, I can tell you that it took about two years for my hair to grow out the color and get below my shoulders so if Cassie's hair started going white, it wouldn't happen overnight like that.

Poor Cole. All these years, he thought his mother had just abandoned him. Now he knows that she had to stay away in order to let the timeline play out, no matter how much she wanted to do otherwise. On top of that, after all the time he's spent trying to save the world, now he finds out that he's the demon, not Olivia. He's having a pretty terrible day.

I knew something was up when she started telling him about his mother and that she died protecting him. From what we knew before this episode, Cole never saw his mother after she left him with his father so what she said raised a red flag. But when she simply told him that there was more to the story and he told her to go home, I was like okay, WTF? Cole finally has someone to tell him about his mother and answer his questions and instead he tells Hannah to splinter off to the facility? At that point, I knew there was a lot more that she wasn't telling him.

I love that short scene at the beginning when Jennifer said she missed Deacon and Cassie said she missed him too. Awwwww, Deacon.

[Bort]

5 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

What was with the sudden white streak in Cassie's hair?

She and the medieval primary got the white streak in the previous episode when they tried to grab the weapon as it was paradoxing. Of course, Cole shot him dead, so now it's just her with the streak.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

29 minutes ago, kariyaki said:

She and the medieval primary got the white streak in the previous episode when they tried to grab the weapon as it was paradoxing. Of course, Cole shot him dead, so now it's just her with the streak.

Thanks! I totally missed that (heh, maybe it was all the blue light distracting me).

[Chaos Theory]

I am thinking that Cassie didn't die of the original strain of the virus but of a mutated strain.  Years go by and a deadly virus like this mutates and then mutates again.   You might be immune to the original strain but not to the mutated strain.  

38 minutes ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Poor Cole. All these years, he thought his mother had just abandoned him. Now he knows that she had to stay away in order to let the timeline play out, no matter how much she wanted to do otherwise. On top of that, after all the time he's spent trying to save the world, now he finds out that he's the demon, not Olivia. He's having a pretty terrible day.

I knew something was up when she started telling him about his mother and that she died protecting him. From what we knew before this episode, Cole never saw his mother after she left him with his father so what she said raised a red flag. But when she simply told him that there was more to the story and he told her to go home, I was like okay, WTF? Cole finally has someone to tell him about his mother and answer his questions and instead he tells Hannah to splinter off to the facility? At that point, I knew there was a lot more that she wasn't telling him.

Everything revolves around Cole in the end.  And it was sad that Hannah eventually came to at least care for Cole's father and maybe even love him.  I loved the line "Every day I thought about leaving and every day he gave me a reason to stay."  But eventually time just caught up with her.  

 

1 hour ago, kariyaki said:

In the end, I guess Emma just ended up being a red herring character so that most people (me) wouldn’t instantly figure out that Hannah was Marion the second Jones sent her back. I did figure out that it was Hannah before the reveal but not until sometime during this episode. The Daughters episode totally fooled me, I thought it really was Emma. 

There was a brief moment where I considered the idea that Emma was Cole's mother and I kind of liked the idea.  Olivia having the daughter that would ultimate have the son that was destined to destroy her.  The irony appealed to me.   But ulimately the story is about the Splinter Crew.   And as Deacon said (paraphrasing) what ultimately makes Cole special is he has Cassie.  

Poor Deacon in the end he died for his friends.  

[Bort]

19 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

I am thinking that Cassie didn't die of the original strain of the virus but of a mutated strain.  Years go by and a deadly virus like this mutates and then mutates again.   You might be immune to the original strain but not to the mutated strain.  

That's a good point. In fact, now I remember that Jones once said they had a cure for the original form of the virus but it had either mutated into a form that they couldn't cure or that it kept mutating and they couldn't keep up with it (I can't remember which).

[Evie]

6 hours ago, justmehere said:

Another confusing point: Jones said that the primaries built the machine to erase James Cole. Jennifer said James can't be the Djinn because "this" (the whole cycle?) has to be born of time travel. Jones is then horrified to realize that Hannah is James' mother, so Hannah's the one who needs to be erased. She did die, but it had no bearing on James traveling through time. I thought it meant needing to stop him being born, which would unravel everything (including that Hannah would never have been born because Jones wouldn't have saved the Coles, leading to her decision to keep her baby). Or did I misinterpret that whole conversation?

 

I don't know if I'm making any sense, but I think Jones was just horrified to realize that Hannah was Cole's mother (and Jones is the one that sent her back) and thus Cole was born of time travel. Cole is still the one that needs to be erased from what I understood. He's the demon. I suppose they could try to stop him from being born but not sure time would allow that; I have a feeling if they tried, they might be stuck in a loop like when Cassie tried to kill Jones.  So Cole must erase himself to break the cycle and unravel everything. That may or may not mean Hannah would have never been born; Jones could change her mind for another reason. 

Edited June 30, 2018 by Evie

[CrystalMoon]

I'm frustrated that we found the medieval splinter chair/weapon and it was destroyed before it could be used. I wonder if Cole will have to travel back to the chair and sneakily use it while the Army of the 12 Monkeys takes over the church. And isn't it interesting that Cole said the only thing worse than, what was it, dying or never being born? Was to not ever existed at all. And that's what has to happen to him. That's kind of depressing. Because once he's completely erased, what then? Assuming the show does that, I'm really curious and a little bit sad to see how his absence affects everyone else.

As for the big reveal about Cole's mom, I was totally fooled. In general, I like to be fooled, so I don't try to figure out twists, but I was certain Cole's mom was Emma. Then when Matthew Cole told Hannah that Emma was dead, I actually got weepy, and I stayed that way until the end. It just fit the story so perfectly. And the way all of the events at the end of the ep were revealed was, imo, really well done. It reminded me a lot of Lullaby from Season 2, which makes sense since that's where Cole and Cassie saved Hannah's life in the first place. Cole really is born of time travel. Only in fiction would this ever be possible!

[Bort]

4 minutes ago, CrystalMoon said:

It reminded me a lot of Lullaby from Season 2, which makes sense since that's where Cole and Cassie saved Hannah's life in the first place. Cole really is born of time travel. Only in fiction would this ever be possible!

It’s been awhile since I’ve seen the Groundhog Day episode but I remember how none of the scenarios would work.

• Hannah lives and Jones is ecstatic? Reset.
• Hannah dies? Reset.

The only scenario that worked was Hannah living but Jones not knowing about it. Not even her dying worked, and now we know why.

As for why the plague still needs to be started, it’s the same reason as why the Hannah scenario had to be the way it was: Jones has to invent the machine. Olivia destroying the world isn’t dependent on that because the other Jones is the one who builds Titan. Either way, Elliott builds Titan for Olivia.

[Cthulhudrew]

7 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

I am thinking that Cassie didn't die of the original strain of the virus but of a mutated strain.  Years go by and a deadly virus like this mutates and then mutates again.   You might be immune to the original strain but not to the mutated strain.  

If my theory about Patient Zero being Olivia is right, then someone needs to infect her. I could see it being Cassie, using the shards of the glass vial they initially retrieved from the Airport that had the virus on it. She stabs Olivia with it, infecting her, and gets infected herself. That said...

There is still the matter of Cole's vision of himself at the Florida Keys that has not yet come to pass. Cassie wrote it off as a near-death hallucination, but I think it is clearly going to be more than that. Cole also said he felt like Cassie was there with him, so maybe she won't end up dying after all. All she really needs to do is record the message for Jones to find and leave her watch behind on a random corpse.

3 hours ago, CrystalMoon said:

I'm frustrated that we found the medieval splinter chair/weapon and it was destroyed before it could be used. I wonder if Cole will have to travel back to the chair and sneakily use it while the Army of the 12 Monkeys takes over the church.

I don't think they can, now that it's been paradoxed out of existence. And if they had used it, it sounds to me like it would have splintered Cole out of every point that he had ever touched the timeline, erasing his existence and restoring the normal progression. It was basically a deathtrap for him set up by the Primaries.

[Aliferously]

Yeah, still no good for my blood pressure.

Oh, Hannah. I wasn't prepared to lose two members of Team Splinter (and likely a third one next week) like that. 

Aww, BabyCole. 

I would think that (and this is far fetched) that Cassie does indeed not die of the plague. Remember in the pilot when Cole told her that backstory nobody ever talks about? He said she survived a bout of meningitis as a child. Hannah survived meningitis, so maybe that's where the clue lies?

Seeing the "to be concluded" kind of stabbed me in the gut. No, don't go, show.

I am still arranging my thoughts because I'm sure this episode warped my brain.

Edited June 30, 2018 by Aliferously
added more thoughts.

[Chaos Theory]

Wild Speculation of my part.

IF Cole is the demon what happens if Team Splinter uses Titan to create the ultimate Paradox and go to the Red Forest instead of making it something bad turn it into Cole's Vision of the Florida Keys and a place of everyone....everyone everyone to survive until the plague burns itself out.  Instead of using it to destroy the world use it to remake it.    

Again wild speculation.  

[Cardie]

If Olivia gets Titan from Elliot Jones, independent of any actions by Cole or the rest of the team, then why do the Primaries believe that erasing Cole will solve the end of time problem? Time is the serpent that only goes in one direction until it encounters the Demon born of time travel. It seems to me that if Cassie hadn't dropped the vial and had then destroyed it, Cole would vanish and Olivia would never finish Titan.

I'm interested to see any way they seize a positive ending out of all of this.

[Evie]

6 hours ago, CrystalMoon said:

I'm frustrated that we found the medieval splinter chair/weapon and it was destroyed before it could be used. I wonder if Cole will have to travel back to the chair and sneakily use it while the Army of the 12 Monkeys takes over the church. And isn't it interesting that Cole said the only thing worse than, what was it, dying or never being born? Was to not ever existed at all. And that's what has to happen to him. That's kind of depressing. Because once he's completely erased, what then? Assuming the show does that, I'm really curious and a little bit sad to see how his absence affects everyone else.

It is depressing. I think Cole is going to try to erase himself (Perhaps what Future Asshole and Cassie were talking about in Season 3 when Cassie was trying to convince Cole there was another way) but the fact that the show said Cole must be erased to save time makes me think there will be a twist. 

Edited July 1, 2018 by Evie

[Aliferously]

On 30-6-2018 at 8:21 AM, cynic said:

 

One thing, as much as I like the actor who plays Cole's dad (And his great head of hair), the big age difference between him and Hannah kinda seemed a bit squicky to me,  especially since Hannah comes off so naive in a lot of ways. It just pulled me out of the scene.

 

This. For some reason I couldn't word that properly yesterday.

[Bort]

I’ve lost track of how old Hannah is supposed to be at this point but the actress who plays her is 34, it’s not really that much of an age difference.

[Evie]

17 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Wild Speculation of my part.

IF Cole is the demon what happens if Team Splinter uses Titan to create the ultimate Paradox and go to the Red Forest instead of making it something bad turn it into Cole's Vision of the Florida Keys and a place of everyone....everyone everyone to survive until the plague burns itself out.  Instead of using it to destroy the world use it to remake it.    

Again wild speculation.  

Hmm, that would be interesting. It would be a good twist if the Red Forest could be used for something good. Or I wonder if there is a way Cole could somehow use Titan to erase himself from the timestream while also creating the Red Forest Florida Keys for himself and Cassie. 

4 hours ago, kariyaki said:

I’ve lost track of how old Hannah is supposed to be at this point but the actress who plays her is 34, it’s not really that much of an age difference.

Hannah should be around that age too. Per Cole's birth certificate Cole's dad was supposed to be late 30's, I think. I don't know how old the actor is but he looks older and the actress looks younger so it was a little huh but since there wasn't supposed to be a big age difference between the characters it didn't bother me too much. 

[CrystalMoon]

18 minutes ago, Evie said:

Hannah should be around that age too. Per Cole's birth certificate Cole's dad was supposed to be late 30's, I think. I don't know how old the actor is but he looks older and the actress looks younger so it was a little huh but since there wasn't supposed to be a big age difference between the characters it didn't bother me too much. 

I thought back in Season 1 that father Cole looked old enough to be adult Cole's dad, so he does look quite a bit older than Hannah, imo. However, they had a nice chemistry and I could see Hannah being attracted to him, especially as they were kind of isolated in the woods. Plus, knowing this is Cole's dad might make him more attractive to her or at least make her feel like it's her fate to become Cole's mother. Long way of saying, I noticed tha age difference but it didn't really bother me.

[Bort]

34 minutes ago, Evie said:

Hannah should be around that age too. Per Cole's birth certificate Cole's dad was supposed to be late 30's, I think. I don't know how old the actor is but he looks older and the actress looks younger so it was a little huh but since there wasn't supposed to be a big age difference between the characters it didn't bother me too much. 

Yeah, I was surprised to see that the actress who plays Hannah is 34. I'd have thought 25, she looks really young.
 

19 minutes ago, CrystalMoon said:

Plus, knowing this is Cole's dad might make him more attractive to her or at least make her feel like it's her fate to become Cole's mother.

I imagine that the whole time, she thought Emma was to be Cole's mother and it wasn't until Matthew returned with the news of her death (and thinking that Emma calling out Marion was referring to Hannah) that Hannah was hit with the realization that it was herself.

[Aliferously]

I think Hannah would have been born 2015ish, so mid twenties in 2043 I guess.

Listening the the podcast, and there were clues and we missed them. Gah.

[cynic]

Wow, I'm surprised she is 34. I totally would have pegged that actress as being around 25 as well. 

I don't know how old Cole's dad's actor is in real life, but looks-wise, I felt like he was old enough to be her father. Plus, her lack of experience with so many things in our world just makes her read so young, so when he took her chin and pull her back for a kiss, the dynamic didn't work for me.   

[Aliferously]

re watched Paradox from season 1.

Whole new light, I tell you. Because Hannah/Marion is indeed right there the whole time.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

1 hour ago, cynic said:

Wow, I'm surprised she is 34. I totally would have pegged that actress as being around 25 as well. 

I don't know how old Cole's dad's actor is in real life, but looks-wise, I felt like he was old enough to be her father. Plus, her lack of experience with so many things in our world just makes her read so young, so when he took her chin and pull her back for a kiss, the dynamic didn't work for me.   

 

3 hours ago, CrystalMoon said:

I thought back in Season 1 that father Cole looked old enough to be adult Cole's dad, so he does look quite a bit older than Hannah, imo. However, they had a nice chemistry and I could see Hannah being attracted to him, especially as they were kind of isolated in the woods. Plus, knowing this is Cole's dad might make him more attractive to her or at least make her feel like it's her fate to become Cole's mother. Long way of saying, I noticed tha age difference but it didn't really bother me.

 

3 hours ago, Evie said:

Hannah should be around that age too. Per Cole's birth certificate Cole's dad was supposed to be late 30's, I think. I don't know how old the actor is but he looks older and the actress looks younger so it was a little huh but since there wasn't supposed to be a big age difference between the characters it didn't bother me too much. 

According to the internet, Patrick Garrow was born in 1970 so he’s 48 in real life. Katarina was pregnant in late 2015 so Hannah was born in 2016. After Cassie saves Hannah from dying of bacterial meningitis in 2020, they take Hannah to Jennifer. Jones is reunited with Hannah in 2044 when she is 28. It’s now 2046 on the show so Hannah is 30 when S4 begins. Jones sends her back to 2007 to live for two years so Hannah is 32 when she meets Cole’s father (the actress is 34 in real life). 

[bethy]

2 hours ago, Aliferously said:

re watched Paradox from season 1.

Whole new light, I tell you. Because Hannah/Marion is indeed right there the whole time.

Rewatching this right now because I had to see for myself and the whole episode is fascinating knowing what we know now. For instance, in essence, interacting with James is what changes Katarina’s mind about having an abortion. Of his mother.

ETA: I also miss Cassie’s hair back in a ponytail. So much more efficient than her current flowing locks.

Edited July 1, 2018 by bethy

[Daltrey]

On ‎2018‎-‎06‎-‎29 at 8:18 PM, kariyaki said:

This show really knows how to play the long game. This whole time, Hannah was Cole’s erstwhile mother.

Yep. Fantastically brilliant. I feel like such a fool for my comments in the episode 7 thread, lol! 

[Daltrey]

On ‎2018‎-‎06‎-‎29 at 8:29 PM, Chaos Theory said:

Soon as Jones sent Hannah back I clocked her as Cole’s mother.  I was also kinda intrigued by the idea of Olivia’s daughter being his mom.  But ultimately Hannah just works so much better long game wise

Totally agree, 100 %  but I bought into it completely that Emma was Cole's mom and therefore, he was grandson to the witness. I'm so glad I was wrong, it made this episode just that much better for me. The only thing I'm a bit confused about is the very end of the episode when Hannah, Jones and Cole were sharing a drink in front of the fire and Hannah was talking about seeing both of them from a distance while she was out of her time; when did that take place, because it seemed to be before they splintered to New York to release the virus, meaning Cole already knew Hannah was his mother before she got shot. Did I get that right or …. did they have that conversation just before Jones sent Hannah back to 2009?....therefore meaning Cole still would have known she was his mom when she was shot? That's the only thing I am struggling with....otherwise, brilliant episode and I can't believe there's only two left. I know it would start to suck if it went much longer but I still don't want it to end.

[Whimsy]

2 hours ago, Daltrey said:

Totally agree, 100 %  but I bought into it completely that Emma was Cole's mom and therefore, he was grandson to the witness. I'm so glad I was wrong, it made this episode just that much better for me. The only thing I'm a bit confused about is the very end of the episode when Hannah, Jones and Cole were sharing a drink in front of the fire and Hannah was talking about seeing both of them from a distance while she was out of her time; when did that take place, because it seemed to be before they splintered to New York to release the virus, meaning Cole already knew Hannah was his mother before she got shot. Did I get that right or …. did they have that conversation just before Jones sent Hannah back to 2009?....therefore meaning Cole still would have known she was his mom when she was shot? That's the only thing I am struggling with....otherwise, brilliant episode and I can't believe there's only two left. I know it would start to suck if it went much longer but I still don't want it to end.

I was a little slow on picking up Hannah was Cole's mom, but I did figure it out before Emma died, so yay for me I guess.  lol. 

What I gathered from the conversation was that Cole and Katarina went back to talk to Hannah after Hannah was shot the first time.  I'm really glad they got to have that conversation because Hannah got to admit that, even though she had to keep her distance, she was able to see Cole grow up and she was able to see her relationship with her mother before the virus.  I'm glad Hannah got to experience some happiness in her life.  

I was also a little squicked out by the visual appearance of the age difference between Hannah and Cole's dad.  Sure, the actress is 34 but she looks WAY younger and the actor playing Cole's dad looks every minute of his age.  But, I let it go quickly because it was such a sweet story.  

This whole past week I rewatched all of the past seasons and then caught up with the latest episodes and I just have such a feeling of loss.  I know that there's a two hour finale, but I just don't feel ready to let it go.  I am so afraid it's going to end bleak and sad.  I just want Cole and Cassie to make it to the Keys!  I almost don't care how it happens, I just want it to happen!!

[snarktini]

7 hours ago, Daltrey said:

Totally agree, 100 %  but I bought into it completely that Emma was Cole's mom and therefore, he was grandson to the witness. I'm so glad I was wrong, it made this episode just that much better for me. The only thing I'm a bit confused about is the very end of the episode when Hannah, Jones and Cole were sharing a drink in front of the fire and Hannah was talking about seeing both of them from a distance while she was out of her time; when did that take place, because it seemed to be before they splintered to New York to release the virus, meaning Cole already knew Hannah was his mother before she got shot. Did I get that right or …. did they have that conversation just before Jones sent Hannah back to 2009?....therefore meaning Cole still would have known she was his mom when she was shot? That's the only thing I am struggling with....otherwise, brilliant episode and I can't believe there's only two left. I know it would start to suck if it went much longer but I still don't want it to end.

I assume that conversation happens just before they go back to release the virus, but I can't be sure. What gets me: How does Hannah know she'll be there at the airport, that she'll die protecting Cole? She tells him both of those things. How does she know her future? 

[Bort]

2 minutes ago, snarktini said:

I assume that conversation happens just before they go back to release the virus, but I can't be sure. What gets me: How does Hannah know she'll be there at the airport, that she'll die protecting Cole? She tells him both of those things. How does she know her future? 

The title card was for 2017, so Cole and Jones went back and talked to Hannah a year before she dies at the airport. I was assuming they flat out told her what was going to happen.

[cynic]

12 hours ago, Daltrey said:

Yep. Fantastically brilliant. I feel like such a fool for my comments in the episode 7 thread, lol! 

I watched all three episodes before I came here and I got the impression that most of the posters had as well, so it made me smile when I read your post in Daughters. You said something like you were surprised that people weren't talking about Emma being Cole's mom and I just pictured everyone being like doo do doo do doooo :)

[ElectricBoogaloo]

5 hours ago, snarktini said:

I assume that conversation happens just before they go back to release the virus, but I can't be sure. What gets me: How does Hannah know she'll be there at the airport, that she'll die protecting Cole? She tells him both of those things. How does she know her future? 

 

5 hours ago, kariyaki said:

The title card was for 2017, so Cole and Jones went back and talked to Hannah a year before she dies at the airport. I was assuming they flat out told her what was going to happen.

Yes, that’s exactly what happens. Jones and Cole tell her in 2017: “We had to tell you. That should be your choice.” In 2018 when she takes a bullet at the airport, Hannah tells Cole: “It's okay. This was my choice. This was all I could do: be here to protect you one last time.“

[Bort]

1 hour ago, cynic said:

I watched all three episodes before I came here and I got the impression that most of the posters had as well, so it made me smile when I read your post in Daughters. You said something like you were surprised that people weren't talking about Emma being Cole's mom and I just pictured everyone being like doo do doo do doooo :)

Yes, if I hadn't watched all three episodes at once, my post in the Daughters thread would have been similar squeeing about Cole being Olivia's grandson. As it was, once this episode came around, it pretty much negated all that. In fact, @Daltrey, I had totally been waiting for you to watch this episode.

[bethy]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 

Yes, that’s exactly what happens. Jones and Cole tell her in 2017: “We had to tell you. That should be your choice.” In 2018 when she takes a bullet at the airport, Hannah tells Cole: “It's okay. This was my choice. This was all I could do: be here to protect you one last time.“

And now you’ve made me cry again.

[Chaos Theory]

8 hours ago, kariyaki said:

The title card was for 2017, so Cole and Jones went back and talked to Hannah a year before she dies at the airport. I was assuming they flat out told her what was going to happen.

Its already happened for Cole.   Cassie and Cole have released the virus and Hannah has saved his life.  He goes back with Jones to before it happens and flat out tells Hannah what she does.  Her response is the response she gives Cole and Cassie at the hotel.  A mother dies for her child.    Their entire life is the Chicken or the egg loop which is why Cole is the Demon.    One big ass paradox.    If you remove him from the picture...oh the havoc.  

Edited July 3, 2018 by Chaos Theory

[fireangel]

3 hours ago, Chaos Theory said:

Its already happened for Cole.   Cassie and Cole have released the virus and Hannah has saved his life.  He goes back with Jones to before it happens and flat out tells Hannah what she does.  Her response is the response she gives Cole and Cassie at the hotel.  A mother dies for her child.    Their entire life is the Chicken or the egg loop which is why Cole is the Demon.    One big ass paradox.    If you remove him from the picture...oh the havoc.  

But why do they need to tell Hannah what will happen in a year?  Why not let events unfold,  it would still be Hannah's choice if she decides to go to the airport without Cole or Jones telling her a year earlier.  Guess I'm still a bit confused about this scene. Is it that if they don't tell Hannah she wouldn't know to come to the airport to save Cole?  

[Daltrey]

14 hours ago, kariyaki said:

The title card was for 2017, so Cole and Jones went back and talked to Hannah a year before she dies at the airport. I was assuming they flat out told her what was going to happen.

 

9 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Yes, that’s exactly what happens. Jones and Cole tell her in 2017

Ah, ok, I must've missed the title card. I'm sure a second watch would've cleared it up. Thanks.

 

9 hours ago, kariyaki said:

9 hours ago, cynic said:

I watched all three episodes before I came here and I got the impression that most of the posters had as well, so it made me smile when I read your post in Daughters. You said something like you were surprised that people weren't talking about Emma being Cole's mom and I just pictured everyone being like doo do doo do doooo :)

Yes, if I hadn't watched all three episodes at once, my post in the Daughters thread would have been similar squeeing about Cole being Olivia's grandson. As it was, once this episode came around, it pretty much negated all that. In fact, @Daltrey, I had totally been waiting for you to watch this episode.

 

 

@cynic that's too funny! After watching all three I figured that's what most people had done and I can picture everyone having that reaction as well. Apparently, @kariyaki was one of those people, lol!

 

4 hours ago, fireangel said:

Is it that if they don't tell Hannah she wouldn't know to come to the airport to save Cole?  

Loops, loops and more loops, lol! Yes, I believe that's the wibbly wobbly, timey wimey-ness of it all. Otherwise, I would have the same question.

[jmonique]

8 hours ago, fireangel said:

But why do they need to tell Hannah what will happen in a year?  Why not let events unfold,  it would still be Hannah's choice if she decides to go to the airport without Cole or Jones telling her a year earlier.  Guess I'm still a bit confused about this scene. Is it that if they don't tell Hannah she wouldn't know to come to the airport to save Cole?  

Exactly. At this point, Olivia’s gone full Witness, as far as they know, and Cole needs to stop her. He can’t if he gets shot at the airport, and Hannah wouldn’t have known where and when to be in 2018 if she hadn’t been told by Cole and Katarina in 2017.

And to be honest, I’m guessing them splintering. back to tell her was 97% about Cole and Katarina wanting to see Hannah one last time now that they knew, 3% about letting her know what happened.

I think what fascinates me most about the reveal, and what I’d love to know more about, is Hannah’s shift in how she viewed James. She first knew this grown man as not just a man, but a man who helped save her from dying as a child. What was it like to realize that’s her son and to go from thinking of him as a fellow warrior to as her child?

[Bort]

24 minutes ago, jmonique said:

I’m guessing them splintering. back to tell her was 97% about Cole and Katarina wanting to see Hannah one last time now that they knew, 3% about letting her know what happened.

I think what fascinates me most about the reveal, and what I’d love to know more about, is Hannah’s shift in how she viewed James. She first knew this grown man as not just a man, but a man who helped save her from dying as a child. What was it like to realize that’s her son and to go from thinking of him as a fellow warrior to as her child?

Oh absolutely. The last any of them saw each other, none of them knew. That was as good a use of a time machine as any, for Cole to talk to Hannah as his mother, for all of them to be able to connect on a whole different level. And yeah, I was also thinking about how Hannah's perspective of Cole had to have changed, from "colleague" to being his mother.

I've got to say, I'm not a huge rewatcher of shows. Usually, once I've watched a series, I don't ever go back and watch it again, but this one? Once it's done, I'm totally watching the whole thing again, because it'll be in a whole new light. Fringe was like that, too.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Trading places: