S02.E23: Unthinkable

[Zalyn]

Ways to make you fall in love with a character 101, as demonstrated by Nyssa:

- immediately knock Laurel unconscious at first sight (last time she was even more efficient, and had Laurel poisoned before even arriving in town!)

- killer fashion sense

- realize who the most awesome person in the room is, and immediately introduce yourself ("heir to the demon." "MIT, class of 2009")

- make flirty eyes at Felicity, and just ignore everyone else in the room

- have a solid amount of warrior respect for Detective Lance

- have zero patience for villain monologues and kill it dead

- express disdain for Oliver's questionable decision making skills

- (also, I realize that she's gay, but I could seriously ship Nyssa/Deadshot. Anytime he irritated her, she'd just knock him unconscious, and he'd just find her all the more attractive for it)

 

When Sara handed Laurel her jacket and told her that Oliver needed her like she was just passing a baton, it just made me laugh so much before I became super grossed out and irritated that this storyline won't just die in a fire.  Because the baton is clearly Oliver's penis. (TM Captain Hammer.)  Other issues I had with that scene: ladies, your dad is still standing right there, are we not even going to pretend that Oliver/Arrow are not the same person? Also, there's no way that Sara's jacket is a perfect fit on Laurel.

[clipped b/c cleaning up snorted tea]

- WHY DOES EVERYONE SUDDENLY HAVE A SECRET BABY? I AM UNINTERESTED IN NURSERY ARROW. I mean, Deadshot, Oliver, and now Diggle? If there's ever a kidnapped baby, we'll know that Laurel is also secretly a parent.

- OLICITY. So many feelings. Love them.

You are hilarious!  Bolded parts were serious spit-take risks.  Well done!

[Pyramid]

 

Do you think the producers kick themselves for not casting Caity Lotz as Laurel from the beginning

Probably they are, but while typing this I just had a thought, wouldn't Alona Tal have been perfect. She did kick serious ass on Supernatural.

[ohjoy]

I seriously wanted Alona Tal to show up as Sarah before CL was cast, but now I'm so relieved she wasn't put through the crap of being awesome in a role the producers are determined to give to someone else.

Plus, her being Laurel's sister wouldn't allow for the Jo/Ruby beat down I just realized I would LOVE to see.

[Carrie Ann]

- When exactly did Oliver get Roy a mask? Until I hear differently, I'm just going to assume it's the birthday present he always meant to give Roy. That's why it was in a fancy box.  Also, Roy only likes three things, as far as Oliver knows: Thea, the color red, and vigilante justice.  So this was a very thoughtful present!

OMG, your entire post was brill, but this part has had me laughing for the last five minutes and I had to come back just to tell you that. And also to harp on the Roy/Thea thing for a minute. What did Thea think when she saw the archery stuff? They had just addressed the fact that he was sort of doing Baby Vigilante stuff for awhile, and that he was leaving all that behind to be with her after he did this One Last Thing. So I mean, when she found that, why was that such a dealbreaker? 

[Alibelle]

I didn't understand Thea's freak out either. She was totally aware he was completely Arrow obsessed. The fact that she found some of his arrows shouldn't have been a dealbreaker when she forgave him for trying to kill her.

 

That said, I can't be mad at Thea Merlyn. Apparently in the hopes that she would agree to go with him, her dad had already bought her a pair of shiny black leather leggings to wear, and you know she's going to rock the hell out of evil eyeliner.  I also think it's kind of hilarious that she rather deliberately bankrupted herself and Oliver, had one bad experience with coach, and immediately hopped into the back of Merlyn's limo. Also, this pretty much means that she will get some additional fight training, thus fulfilling the promise of those archery trophies in her bedroom, and taking her one step closer to hanging out in the Arrow lair and making fun of Oliver.  Because I can pretty much never get enough of Oliver's loved ones making fun of him.  And also, I'm desperate for Thea and Felicity to become friends.  So there's that!

[Jack Kerouac]

 

Because the baton is clearly Oliver's penis. (TM Captain Hammer.)

 

Just awesome. You win one internet.

 

[somewhereother]

Also, there's no way that Sara's jacket is a perfect fit on Laurel.

 

I really didn't understand the passing of the jacket at all. In the previous episode I thought they were setting it up so we could see that Sara made a sacrifice - she gave up her opportunity to be (and be seen as) a hero. For half a season she has been struggling with her morality and didn't want to return to the LOA but gave up the most obvious pathway for her own redemption - for her family and the city. She even references this as her 'unthinkable' to Oliver.

 

But the whole jacket scene has the opposite tone, which seems to undercut the importance of whatever is being handed over. Maybe that was deliberate on the part of the writers. Contrasting the (supposed) literal fit of the jacket with the complete misfit of character and motivation?

 

If Laurel had any clue about being a hero that jacket should have been heavy with obligation, sacrifice and commitment. Instead she was grinning like a loon and all like 'ooh i love the way this jacket accentuates my waist'.

[icandigit]

So this is one of the best finales I've seen in a long time.Nyssa made me question my sexuality. Diggle has really high standards for wife material. Diggle going up against Waller and Felicity against Slade their such badasses, I love them. Team arrow banter on the beach. Memorable fight scenes. Crying when Oliver told Felicity he loved her while simultaneous yelling wtf at my computer screen. because I thought they going to ruin my ship by taking it too far too fast. Later, the relief that the writers aren't going there yet, but used the scene as a really interesting plot point. Deadshot. Laurel being kidnapped being  irrelevant to anything ever. Oliver rebounding after weeks of hell.

Edited May 18, 2014 by icandigit

[quarks]

Like so many scenes involving Laurel, I think the Sara gets on the boat scene would have worked better with a little tweaking:

 

Quentin: I can't believe you are doing this. This is a terrible idea.

 

Nyssa: I swear I will die before I let her be harmed.

 

Quentin looks at his daughters.

 

Quentin: I'll give you two a moment.

 

Laurel: I don't want you to do this.

 

Sara: I promised.

 

Laurel:  Sara - whatever you promised - these are the same assassins who kidnapped Mom.

 

Sara: They kidnapped Mom because I broke my promise to them.  And I broke my promise to them because I didn't understand what they were doing. They - they do what has to be done, Laurel, and this is what I have to do.  And maybe with them, I can even do some good.

 

Laurel nods.

 

Laurel: Promise me one thing.

 

Sara: What?

 

Laurel: You'll stay in touch. I'm not losing my sister again.

 

Sara: You'll see me again, Look, just to prove it --

 

Sara hands over the jacket.

 

Sara: I'll need to see that you're taking care of this.

 

Laurel puts the jacket on with swelling music.

 

Laurel: It fits!

 

Big hug.  

 

#

 

Leaves Oliver out of this entirely, because, honestly, this should be about Sara and Laurel and the fact that they are sisters again and not about Oliver. Who cares about Oliver? Oliver was just, well, Laurel's been kidnapped, great, I have other issues at the moment, and Sara, you want to go join a group of assassins, whatever.  Also establishes that Sara has thought about this, that she hasn't given up on heroism, and that Laurel isn't just worried that they won't be able to play Farmville together on Facebook.

 

After all, Laurel tells us earlier in the episode that these are the same assassins who kidnapped her mother.  Sure, they may have helped rescue the city, but, still. I think there should have been more concern there.

[Danny Franks]

Honestly, I think the best way to do it would have been for Laurel to put the jacket on and frown and say, "oh, it's a bit too big", then they hug. A fun little meta-comment that acknowledges what most people must see is true, regarding the characters.

 

Meanwhile, I hope they make Nyssa knocking Laurel unconscious a thing, on the show. Like, the next time Nyssa turns up, she accidentally scratches Laurel with a sedative tipped fingernail or something. Cue Laurel collapsing in a heap and Nyssa pulling a regretful face, while Sara admonishes her. The time after, Laurel's standing too close to the door when Nyssa opens it, and gets clonked on the head. Seriously, it would be funnier than the run of Roy getting beaten up gags they had at the beginning of season 2.

[ohjoy]

Like so many scenes involving Laurel, I think the Sara gets on the boat scene would have worked better with a little tweaking:

 

Quentin: I can't believe you are doing this. This is a terrible idea.

 

Nyssa: I swear I will die before I let her be harmed.

 

Quentin looks at his daughters.

 

Quentin: I'll give you two a moment.

 

Laurel: I don't want you to do this.

 

Sara: I promised.

 

Laurel:  Sara - whatever you promised - these are the same assassins who kidnapped Mom.

 

Sara: They kidnapped Mom because I broke my promise to them.  And I broke my promise to them because I didn't understand what they were doing. They - they do what has to be done, Laurel, and this is what I have to do.  And maybe with them, I can even do some good.

 

Laurel nods.

 

Laurel: Promise me one thing.

 

Sara: What?

 

Laurel: You'll stay in touch. I'm not losing my sister again.

 

Sara: You'll see me again, Look, just to prove it --

 

Sara hands over the jacket.

 

Sara: I'll need to see that you're taking care of this.

 

Laurel puts the jacket on with swelling music.

 

Laurel: It fits!

 

Big hug.  

 

#

Thank you so much -- this is my new head canon.

[KirkB]

I love the idea that every time Sara/Nyssa come to visit (or maybe even call on the phone) Laurel gets knocked unconscious.

[slayer2]

Like so many scenes involving Laurel, I think the Sara gets on the boat scene would have worked better with a little tweaking:

Quentin: I can't believe you are doing this. This is a terrible idea.

Nyssa: I swear I will die before I let her be harmed.

Quentin looks at his daughters.

Quentin: I'll give you two a moment.

Laurel: I don't want you to do this.

Sara: I promised.

Laurel: Sara - whatever you promised - these are the same assassins who kidnapped Mom.

Sara: They kidnapped Mom because I broke my promise to them. And I broke my promise to them because I didn't understand what they were doing. They - they do what has to be done, Laurel, and this is what I have to do. And maybe with them, I can even do some good.

Laurel nods.

Laurel: Promise me one thing.

Sara: What?

Laurel: You'll stay in touch. I'm not losing my sister again.

Sara: You'll see me again, Look, just to prove it --

Sara hands over the jacket.

Sara: I'll need to see that you're taking care of this.

Laurel puts the jacket on with swelling music.

Laurel: It fits!

Big hug.

#

Leaves Oliver out of this entirely, because, honestly, this should be about Sara and Laurel and the fact that they are sisters again and not about Oliver. Who cares about Oliver? Oliver was just, well, Laurel's been kidnapped, great, I have other issues at the moment, and Sara, you want to go join a group of assassins, whatever. Also establishes that Sara has thought about this, that she hasn't given up on heroism, and that Laurel isn't just worried that they won't be able to play Farmville together on Facebook.

After all, Laurel tells us earlier in the episode that these are the same assassins who kidnapped her mother. Sure, they may have helped rescue the city, but, still. I think there should have been more concern there.

I love it! I'm totally down like Chinatown! Well-played quarks! Edited May 17, 2014 by slayer2

[Carrie Ann]

I love both that slight tweak to the scene, and Danny Franks's suggestion that Laurel could have said the jacket didn't quite fit. Sigh. We could have had it all.

 

I think they wanted the Lance family scene to end on a happy note, so that it was more of a kick to the stomach when Det Lance collapses, but it's just really incongruous with what's actually happening. And it's not a fair ending to Sara's arc this season. I'm perfectly fine with her accepting that she's not ready to let go of her anger at the world, and that the LOA is the place for her right now, but that's not a happy decision. Laurel and her father should have been sad and wistful about sending her off, even as they accepted her decision.

[GirlWednesday]

Looking back at the last two episodes, maybe it explains Sarah being down and those "she's a hero" bits in that the second last episode. Sarah seemed dejected like she had no hope. She couldn't very well tell everyone that she went to Nyssa/LOA and got turned down. Sarah felt like a failure and then she had her "sister chat" and had her baby saving moment and realized, I'm a hero and I can do this. In the finale, she seemed more at peace with all of it rather than angst about LOA. They came to her when she needed them the most. They seemed okay with Sarah not killing even if they still killed. My conclusion, Sarah trusts Nyssa to let her be a hero and not make her kill. Nyssa knows it almost destroyed her soul. And Nyssa does love her. She's not happy but is at peace with what is becoming. That's my take on this. Jacket thing ... Whateves.

[KirkB]

You can't work for Ra's al Ghul in the League of Assassins and refuse to kill, not if you want to continue living yourself. Now, Nyssa might be able to convince her father to only send Sara on non-kill missions, though I'm not sure a group with Assassins in the title has any of those.

[GirlWednesday]

League of assassins that don't assassinate. Lol, suddenly they don't sound as badass.

[statsgirl]

Maybe Sara can only kill people who deserve to be killed. There are a few on my list right now, like the leader of Boko Haram.

[KirkB]

Yes, you got there ahead of me. Since Tommy's death, Oliver has been resigned to not killing except under extreme circumstances (Felicity's life being threatened for example). When he first came back from the island he was killing damn near everybody, which made him such a hypocrite with Helena. Sara, having spent so much time with the LoA, saw killing as a quick and easy solution to the messy problems they were dealing with. Nyssa will probably point out that in a world full of ever more dangerous people sometimes killing is the only way to stop other people from being hurt. Sara isn't likely to go as semi-pacifistic as Oliver, just resigned to killing 'deserving' individuals.

Edited May 17, 2014 by KirkB

[Sakura12]

Sara wasn't as kill crazy as Oliver when she arrived in town though. She was putting rapists in the hospital not killing them. Sara only went into kill mode when someone threatened her family or Roy when he lost his mind like Slade did. She was fine working with mirkarued Roy before that. So Sara was never to shown to be all about the kill. The kill was the last resort kind of thing. 

 

The League are killers, if she went back to them she's going to kill people and she won't get to choose who. If they want Ra's al Ghul to be the badass he's always is, I would expect him to make Sara go back and kill someone in her home town to test her loyalty. He knows Oliver will try to stop her and he'll expect her to finish the job or she'll be killed. 

[Danny Franks]

The League are killers, if she went back to them she's going to kill people and she won't get to choose who. If they want Ra's al Ghul to be the badass he's always is, I would expect him to make Sara go back and kill someone in her home town to test her loyalty. He knows Oliver will try to stop her and he'll expect her to finish the job or she'll be killed.

 

 

This is why I think that entire scene at the docks was misjudged. This was not a happy, victorious parting for Sara and her family. This was her leaving to rejoin an organisation that kills people. This was her accepting that she's a killer and giving up on hopes of being better. Lance and Laurel were acting like she was going off to college, or to a job in another city, and it felt completely wrong. Smiles and hugs and the handing over of jackets as affectionate mementos. Wrong.

 

Of course, there's the upside of getting back together with Nyssa, and it might be worth killing a few (dozen) people for a shot with her, but still....

[KirkB]

The League are killers, if she went back to them she's going to kill people and she won't get to choose who. If they want Ra's al Ghul to be the badass he's always is, I would expect him to make Sara go back and kill someone in her home town to test her loyalty. He knows Oliver will try to stop her and he'll expect her to finish the job or she'll be killed.

 

 

   You're right, that's exactly the kind of thing Ra's would do if an assassins loyalty is in question. But Nyssa will no doubt vouch for Sara and it's reasonable to think she will at least be loyal to Nyssa. As ruthless as he is he's always had a soft spot for his daughters, and if Nyssa asks him to accept her back (assuming she even got the chance to tell him she had let Sara go) he probably will.

 

This is why I think that entire scene at the docks was misjudged. This was not a happy, victorious parting for Sara and her family. This was her leaving to rejoin an organisation that kills people. This was her accepting that she's a killer and giving up on hopes of being better. Lance and Laurel were acting like she was going off to college, or to a job in another city, and it felt completely wrong. Smiles and hugs and the handing over of jackets as affectionate mementos. Wrong.

 

 

   Overall I agree with you. I'm not sure Laurel really knows who Nyssa is, but I think the showrunners wanted the scene to come off a little lighter and didn't want the the audience to think too hard about just what Sara is giving up. Or maybe they do. I don't know for sure. But Quentin and Laurel weren't really in a position to argue since Sara had already made up her mind to sacrifice her freedom for the good of the city, and the assassins wouldn't have responded too well to them trying to stop her from going.

[Sakura12]

That whole scene at the docks was beyond WTF? They acted like Sara was going on vacation, not to go kill people.

 

I'm going to have to assume that Quentin and Laurel don't know what the word assassin means, it's like Oliver and the word dead. If they did they should've been horrified that Sara was getting on that boat (although I also think Sara should be wary of getting on boats, but that's another story). They should've been horrified that she was choosing to do that. They should've put more of a fight, "Killing people isn't the answer" "You are better than that, I've seen you. You are a hero not a killer". Anything along those lines would've worked for me even if Sara ultimately did leave with the League. 

 

Or they at least could've made it clear that Sara was going back to Nyssa, because for that I would not blame her.

 

I hated what they did Sara's character growth in the later half of this season, especially since she didn't actually kill anyone since that assassin guy that trained Malcolm. She didn't even kill anyone in the finale. A better scenario for me would've been Sara went to them and they turned her down since she refused to rejoin. Nyssa showed up having disobeyed her father to help the woman she loves (showing me that she truly loves Sara), they save the city and Nyssa has to leave before her father comes looking for her and Sara chooses to go with Nyssa to help her. That way Sara still chooses to leave but she doesn't choose to be just a killer. 

 

You're right, that's exactly the kind of thing Ra's would do if an assassins loyalty is in question. But Nyssa will no doubt vouch for Sara and it's reasonable to think she will at least be loyal to Nyssa. As ruthless as he is he's always had a soft spot for his daughters, and if Nyssa asks him to accept her back (assuming she even got the chance to tell him she had let Sara go) he probably will.

 

I think Nyssa's sway should help in Sara not suffering the punishment of a deserter, but not in who she has to kill. Ra's has a soft spot for his daughters, Sara is not his daughter. And I want Ra's to be a badass. And if they want to convince me that Sara's nothing but a killer then I need to see it, because like I posted above, she hasn't killed anyone since Malcolm's teacher. 

Edited May 17, 2014 by Sakura12

[bluebonnet]

I think I was a little too focused on my annoyance with the jacket and Oliver thing at the docks to really pay attention to what was happening.  In hindsight, it definitely seems pretty outrageous.  At least Quentin had an excuse with pulverized innards and imminent passing out.  

[pootlus]

The whole scene on the dock was definitely a giant piece of WTFery, and it makes me more angry every time I think about it.

 

The show always seem to do this - put a scene in that makes no sense and drags down the rest of the episode.  Guess which character is always the focus...

 

I just don't get why Laurel and Quentin would be remotely happy (or Sara either, for that point, but she at least would be putting on a brave face), but I wonder if the director completely screwed up.  Cassidy can't do more than one emotion at once but Paul Blackthorne certainly can and I didn't see much else from him either.

 

Cassidy's shit-eating grin when she got the jacket was bordering on the unpleasant.  I have no idea why I'm supposed to like this character - perhaps they're setting us up for a giant fakeout bigger than the Olicity one.

[KirkB]

I hated what they did Sara's character growth in the later half of this season, especially since she didn't actually kill anyone since that assassin guy that trained Malcolm. She didn't even kill anyone in the finale. A better scenario for me would've been Sara went to them and they turned her down since she refused to rejoin. Nyssa showed up having disobeyed her father to help the woman she loves (showing me that she truly loves Sara), they save the city and Nyssa has to leave before her father comes looking for her and Sara chooses to go with Nyssa to help her. That way Sara still chooses to leave but she doesn't choose to be just a killer.

 

 

   That would have been a much better way to go. Quentin and Laurel, even if they were inclined to argue or to try and stop her, would have less reason to speak up if she was doing it for love. For that matter we don't even know if Nyssa had permission to do what she did. They could easily have said Sara was going back to help Nyssa clear things up with her father, since the whole thing was her idea.

[MsSchadenfreude]

So I finally got to watch the finale and for the most part I enjoyed it.  

 

Like most people, I have a serious girl crush on Katrina Law regardless of the role, but I adore the character of Nyssa too because she doesn't need to say a word for everyone to know, you do not mess with her.  She's a badass who does what needs to be done and does not put up with fools.  Sara says one line about Laurel not being involved and immediately Laurel gets tranquilized.  Situation handled, next.  Isabel mouths off, snaps neck.  I may have a girl crush on Nyssa, but I'm a total Felicity fangirl, so seeing Nyssa give her the respect she deserves was fantastic. That little "heir to the demon" "MIT class of 2009" exchange was golden, so much so I'm going to need a Nyssa/Felicity road trip next season just because.  Make it happen show!

 

Speaking of Felicity, I loved every one of her scenes from finale.  She was the only person that stood her ground about Oliver killing Slade.  She told him to find another way and he listened because he knows he can trust her implicitly.  If she says there is another way, then theres another way.  I know some viewers were upset by the mansion scenes.  Did Felicity know about the plan behind?  It wasn't very clear in the show, but I liked the scene either way.  If she was in on the plan from the beginning, it shows how smart she is as well as demonstrating the connection between her and Oliver.  If she didn't know until the syringe was given, it still shows how smart she is that she immediately got the plan as well as the connection between her and Oliver that he didn't have to explain for her get it.  Now just imagine that scene with any other character and Oliver (like say a woman who know him like her own name), it would have been an epic fail.  There is a distinct possibility I may have shouted at my television when she stabbed Slade with the needle.  I'm starting to think Felicity is the biggest badass on the show.  She didn't have guns or arrows, and she still took down this season's big bad.  

 

As for the final scene at the beach, I was okay with her questioning Oliver about the "i love you" stuff.  Oliver changed the rules of this little game they're playing when he said that and she wouldn't be Felicity, if she didn't ask him about it. And because Oliver is an emotional coward, he smiled and deflected.  Are Oliver/Felicity endgame?  I have no idea and to be honest I'm not sure it matters that much to me.  If Oliver ends up with Felicity, he's damn lucky because she is way too good for him.  If he ends up with Laurel, it just proves he has rocks for brains and who needs that.  Felicity will be fine either way.  When you're awesome you're awesome regardless of your romantic status.  When you're not, all the superhero, sister swapping soul mates in the world, won't change that.

 

The dock scenes…my question wasn't why Sara was following Nyssa, but why everyone else in town wasn't? LOL.  I think one of my favorites things, is the recurring theme that Nyssa just cannot be bothered with Laurel in any way.  She's poisoned Laurel, she tranquilized her, but she's never spoken one word to her.  Nyssa spoke to Lance at the docks because she respects him.  Laurel not so much.  And you know Nyssa has to be wondering how in the hell Sara and Laurel could actually be sisters? 

 

The only reason, I got for Thea going with Malcolm is because he's John Barrowman (which I totally get) but story wise, it makes no sense.  When you are pissed at your family and your boyfriend, you get a tattoo or dye your hair, you don't take a long trip with your pyscho dad through crazy town.

 

Diggle's going to be a daddy…awww!  Quentin cannot die because I refuse to be stuck with Laurel as the only Lance on this show.

[Carrie Ann]

I think Thea thinks she's just going to use Malcolm to get "strong" in whatever way. She thinks she's finally taking back control of her life and has no idea she's just given it over to a dangerous crazy person. I buy that she would do this; I just don't get why the impetus was finding Roy's arrows.

[ohjoy]

I think finding Roy's arrows just hit home for her that she didn't truly trust Roy, as much as she wanted to ignore everything and just run away with him. Every other time Roy has said, "It's you and me babe; I just gotta take care of this one thing," that one thing has been trying to be like the Arrow and putting his life in danger against her wishes. She had come to the realization that Oliver had known she was in danger and was keeping from her knowledge she needed to have; I think she saw those arrows, remembered him saying just a few minutes before that he didn't "know anything about the Arrow," and realized that she loved Roy, but she didn't trust him not to keep the truth from her as her other loved ones had.

[bluebonnet]

She thinks she's finally taking back control of her life and has no idea she's just given it over to a dangerous crazy person. 

She definitely knows she's getting involved with a dangerous crazy person.  She knows he's a murderer, she knows he's a madman.  She shot him twice and then told him that he's a madman.  She also knew him as a father so she even has some idea what to expect from him in the parental department.  Bad choice or no, she's fully aware of what he is.  

[Carrie Ann]

No, I agree that she knows who he is. I think she believes she's in control of the situation, when she's not. She's just given him control and she doesn't realize it.

[pootlus]

The only reason, I got for Thea going with Malcolm is because he's John Barrowman (which I totally get) but story wise, it makes no sense.  When you are pissed at your family and your boyfriend, you get a tattoo or dye your hair, you don't take a long trip with your pyscho dad through crazy town.

 

I dunno - this is a comic book show.  Sure, in real life you'd do that.  But in a show where everything is writ large?  I think it's ridiculous, but I don't think it's necessarily out of place for the tone of the show.

 

And I'm sure as hell that Willa Holland can sell Thea's reasoning a damn sight more than Katie Cassidy could Laurel's 'crucible' last year.  I'm just happy that Willa has something to get her teeth into.  And yeah, the eye-fucking competition with Barrowman is going to be HILARIOUS.

[statsgirl]

Malcolm told her "everyone is lying to you, including Roy."  She already knew that Oliver and Moira had, and when she found the arrows that confirmed that Roy was too.

 

She probably thought, what the hell, he's a mass murderer but at least he hasn't lied to me or taken advantage of me while everyone else has.  I know who he is and I can handle him (famous last words).  Let's see what he can do for me, I've got nothing else planned.

 

Oh, if only Nyssa not being bothered with Laurel were a meta-statement for the show!

Edited May 18, 2014 by statsgirl

[pootlus]

Oh, if only Nyssa not being bothered with Laurel were a meta-statement for the show!

 

That moment was so hilarious - someone has to have GIFed it, surely.

[Danny Franks]

Did Felicity know about the plan behind?  It wasn't very clear in the show, but I liked the scene either way.  If she was in on the plan from the beginning, it shows how smart she is as well as demonstrating the connection between her and Oliver.  If she didn't know until the syringe was given, it still shows how smart she is that she immediately got the plan as well as the connection between her and Oliver that he didn't have to explain for her get it.  Now just imagine that scene with any other character and Oliver (like say a woman who know him like her own name), it would have been an epic fail.  There is a distinct possibility I may have shouted at my television when she stabbed Slade with the needle.  I'm starting to think Felicity is the biggest badass on the show.  She didn't have guns or arrows, and she still took down this season's big bad.

 

 

I thought they made it pretty clear that Felicity had no idea what the plan was.

 

First, Oliver hands her the syringe and asks "do you understand?" If he'd already explained the plan, she'd already have the syringe and not risk Slade seeing it on any camera feeds he had. Second, She seemed genuinely confused and not playing the part of 'girl who Oliver Queen loves', when he said he was leaving her at the mansion. Her exact words were, "you're not making any sense", which I don't think would be the natural response to Oliver's actions if she 'knew' he was in love with her. And then the stunned reaction when he did say it. I think that if Felicity was in on the plan, she'd actually have played along.

 

It also makes sense to me that Oliver wouldn't want to risk Slade somehow having a bug on them, and overhearing their plotting. So he just kept quiet and figured out a way to turn the tables.

 

So instead we saw, as you say, Felicity instantly getting what Oliver was doing, and that rush of confusion and excitement over his words being doused quite thoroughly when she realised what he intended. Cruel? Yes, but Oliver didn't really have a choice. And Felicity clearly didn't hold it against him. Because she's awesome and she understood. But also because I do think she has an inkling now that there might just be some truth in what he was saying.

[icandigit]

 

I'm starting to think Felicity is the biggest badass on the show.  She didn't have guns or arrows, and she still took down this season's big bad.

I thought that was the bravest thing I've seen any character do on the show.

[statsgirl]

That's what Andrew Kreisburg said in one of the (many) interviews before the finale aired, that Felicity does the bravest thing that any character on the show has done.  So, yay, producers.  Now just mean it, please.

 

I've been venturing around the web and looking at various comments on the episode and I'm beginning to think that it was one big Rorschack test.  So many people believe that Laurel is Oliver's once and future true love because she is the Black Canary.  Not yet, because Sara is right now but they're willing to take Sara as Oliver's OTP in a pinch.  With Felicity it's all platonic or ego-boosting..

 

I was thinking of Laurel's last scene on the docks when Quentin collapses and she calls 911.  First, I wondered how long it was going to take the paramedics to get there because they had to have their hands full with all the havoc Slade's army had caused.  Then I wondered who she could call to be with her while she waited to find out about Quentin because with Dinah in Central City and Sara gone, who is left?  Did she still keep up her contacts with Joanna from CNRI?  Usually we think about Felicity being isolated but if it had happened to her, she could have called Diggle or even Oliver.

 

Speaking of Oliver, if they still intend to put Oliver and Laurel together, there should have been some contact between them at the end of this episode, Oliver apologizing to Laurel for putting her in danger, or Laurel phoning Oliver for help after she called 911.  But instead it's like they're on different shows and Oliver got that nice scene with Felicity and Diggle on the island to set up next season.. Even if they wanted to leave Quentin as a cliff-hanger, they could have had Oliver say something about checking up on Laurel to see how she's doing.

 

So I'm thoroughly confused now, and probably will be for the next five months.  Probably more, given that this show gives with one hand and takes with the other.

[GirlWednesday]

Yeah that last scene was weird and probably added to add some urgency/agency to laurel's story. I do feel like all the KC interviews was a big test. She did all the press for the finale and she was barely in it. Funny when you compare Barry's introduction press run, EBR/SA went on and on about Barry/ Felicity, chemistry, etc. honestly if the network wanted me to buy into Laurel as black canary, then team arrow should have done the press (EBR,SA,DR,CL). If it was a united front, I'd be more supportive of the shows direction. Call it psychology or whatever. No one but producers/KC and then at the end SA did press.

At least those were the ones I saw.

[quarks]

The producers also said that the last ten minutes of the episode would give us a good idea of where the show was going next.

 

So, in those last ten minutes, we had:

 

1. Oliver confirming the no-kill/heroism thing. I think that's a given in the present day timeline, although it will be tested.

 

2. Oliver heading to Hong Kong. I don't know if the rest of the season will be in China or not, but Oliver and Argus is probably at least one direction for the flashback timeline.

 

3. Thea getting into Malcolm Merlyn's car - Thea goes evil, at least temporarily, in the third season.

 

4. Quentin falling over and nearly dying. I really am hoping that this is not foreshadowing The Year of Quentin's Health Problems.

 

5. Laurel getting the jacket and grinning. Well.

 

6. Not a single final scene/moment between Laurel/Oliver.

 

7. Felicity and Oliver staring into each other's eyes on a brightly lit beach.

 

That last seems pretty clear to me. But apparently not everyone, including Cassidy.

[writersblock51]

We were also told that the future of Black Canary would be clear. Their definition of "clear" is very different from mine...

I'm not excited whatsoever about seeing more of this Waller next season.

I still find more Oliver/Felicity interest online than Oliver/Laurel, including on SA's FB page. But maybe that's just me.

Edited May 19, 2014 by writersblock51

[statsgirl]

Not just on-online. I have three friends who watch the show, one I talked into it and two who found it on their own, professional women all of us, and no one likes Laurel. My best friend keeps asking me why they haven't got rid of her yet.  Another friend, someone who was at IBM when it was a man's world and now teaches comp sci at a college, has objected to every representation of a woman in IT till she saw Felicity.

 

Every interview with either SA, EBR or a producer has lead off with a question about the fake-out, and it's figured prominently in every review I've read whether by a man or a woman.  In terms of creating buzz for the show, this is a big deal, much bigger than any Laurel storyline has been.

 

I'm hoping Waller will be minimized and that it will be more about what Oliver has to do for her (early Suicide Squad?  has to earn his way out?) sort of like the labours of Hercules, than about him interacting with Waller herself. I've sort of resigned myself that they didn't cast someone like CCH Pounder in the role because Oliver is going to end up sleeping with her.

 

They just showed Unthinkable again on TV (thank you, M3) and I noticed a couple of things that I hadn't before.  Willa Holland, doing a frustrated Thea rolling her eyes at the psycho who is her birth father as he pursues her telling her how proud he is of her that she shot him, is a hoot.  There's a lot of room for some really funny stuff between her and John Barrowman if they want to play some of it for laughs.

 

And when Oliver is standing on a car in the tunnel talking to Slade (does he get better reception on the car?), all "Do what you have to do, I'm done playing your games", and Slade tells him that it's Felicity that he's got, Oliver looks genuinely scared. I don't know how Amell does it wearing a mask and hood, but Oliver swallows and it looks like he's thinking "Oh crap, it worked but what's going to happen to her now?"

 

Maybe it's just where the show wants me to be right now and Oliver is going to try again with Laurel in the next season, but right now I get the impression that Oliver cares a lot more about Felicity than he does about Laurel.  As with Slade, the picture gazing in s1 was a misdirection.

[catrox14]

Heh. I was rewatching this episode today, because I just can't let go of Arrow for the summer yet. 

 

I had a good laugh that I missed the first time with Thea and Malcolm when she threatened to shoot him again, and he just laughed to himself as though "That's my girl!".

 

Also, rewatching the fake 'I love you' scene even knowing it was a fake out, I still cried.  Ollie is a good actor but he's not THAT good. There was truth in Ollie's performance.  That was outstanding work by Amell and EBR.

Edited May 19, 2014 by catrox14

[slayer2]

Oliver's an emotional coward

Ha! It's true, he's so brave in every other aspect of his life but when it comes to feelings, good luck. But that's fair I should think, everyone he loves keeps dying, there's a guy on earth who's sole mission is to kill everyone Oliver loves and Felicity came pretty close so it stands to reason he's not ready to admit it to her yet. (Shipper hopes). I still would have just out and out killed Slade but Oliver's clearly a better person than me.

ETA Yes!! Thank you M3! The finale came on while I was in the gym, very motivational.

Edited May 19, 2014 by slayer2

[icandigit]

 

I still would have just out and out killed Slade but Oliver's clearly a better person than me.

I thought with all of Ollie's guilt about not curing Slade back in the day, that when they showed the scene I would blame him too. Watching both scenes I would totally have killed that dude and then killed him again when he came back from the grave. Different strokes  for different folks I guess.

[slayer2]

Right?! Different stokes indeed, 'cause that dude deserved an arrow through the eye like a breakup deserves ice cream.

[KirkB]

Normally I'm not one for heroes killing their defeated foes, but in Slade's case I might consider making an exception. Even without the Mirakuru Slade is still an incredibly dangerous man. If he gets out of that prison (and since it didn't appear to be guarded, chances are he will) he's still going to be pissed at Oliver. Granted he won't be so hard to stop next time but he might just kill them one by one from afar or something.

[slayer2]

Exactly! Innocent lives are at risk as long as Slade lives. One life doesn't outweigh the lives of many. How many people died in that riot never mind Oliver's nearest and dearest. In this case ending his reign of terror IS doing the right thing.

[catrox14]

I think that would be awesome if Oliver just lets him rot there.  Ollie could just push it off onto ARGUS if he dies, like,"Well I thought someone from Argus was going to give him 3 squares a day.  Not my problem anymore. "

 

Ollie keeps his no kill rule and Slade dies a miserable tortuous death :)

[Sakura12]

I got it when Oliver thought it was the Mirakuru that was making Slade act like that, but then they showed it wasn't just that, Slade still wanted his revenge against Oliver after being cured. I know a hero doesn't kill, but for me I'd rather have a hero kill if saves everyone in the long run. He shouldn't go around killing random street thugs or thieves or anything. But a crazy psychopath hellbent on destroying an entire city and killing everyone in it, they need to be put down.

 

Slade will definitely escape and wreck more havoc, probably kill more people just to get back at Oliver. So he saved people's lives only to put them in more danger later. That is what always happens, the villain escapes again and again and more people die. How many times is he going to let that happen?

Edited May 19, 2014 by Sakura12

[slayer2]

Ha! I love that line "they need to be put down" so true. Slade is the Old Yeller of Arrow. He's frothing and rabid and needs to be taken out back and shot.

Edited May 19, 2014 by slayer2