Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

[Shanna]

For any Legend of the Seeker fans...

BRIDGET REGAN JOINS MARVEL'S AGENT CARTER

Marc Strom @Strommy Published Nov 6, 2014 Updated Nov 6, 2014

http://marvel.com/news/tv/23620/bridget_regan_joins_marvels_agent_carter?utm_campaign=rss_feeds&utm_source=headline_news&utm_medium=rss&utm_content=story-23620&

Awesome. I dropped agents of sheild, but I'm looking forward to agent carter. Although now that I started watching the flash and Gotham, neither of which I was planning on, that might be an overload of super hero shows - although I think she's more of a spyish person?

[KirkB]

Someone elsewhere suggested that this episode teased Felicity's father being Dr. Fate.  I have no idea who that is.

 

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Kent_Nelson_%28New_Earth%29

[Danny Franks]

That's not the Dinah I know. She's more of a warm, loving strong friend/leader/parter. She's got a bit of a wild streak and can totally kickass but she's also Roy's "big sister" and Sin's adopted mother and, kind of fun.

Sara is more Dinah than Laurel (IMO). There are times I'm reading the comics and think yeah that's Sara. Or on the show Sara will do/say something and I'll think yeah I can totally see Dinah doing/saying that.

Danny Franks, Writersblock and Mars (if she/he is still around) are huge BoP fans and could give you better insight to the character.

 

Yeah, bitter she ain't. Before Birds of Prey, she had gone through some stuff and quit the superhero business, and so the first BoP issues (think they were a miniseries to begin with) had an element of Oracle coaxing her back into action and getting her back into the swing of things. But she was usually written as idealistic and lively, and Babs was the more bitter, cynical one (especially when written by Devin Grayson. Yeesh).

 

There was a storyline later in the first BoP ongoing where Huntress accused Babs of running some sort of 'burned out superheroine rehab' programme, and it struck a raw nerve with Dinah, but I don't think there was ever much strife in the relationship between the two, or between them and Huntress once she settled into the team.

 

And there were one or two occasions where Dinah got badly hurt and struggled to find her belief in herself, but I'd never say she resorted to bitterness for extended periods of time. The book ran for a good decade or so, and obviously lots of stuff happened, but my general memory of Dinah Lance throughout was of a morally strong, tough, resourceful and witty woman (even when Chuck Dixon was writing her).

 

Of the two characters Arrow has used, Sara was about a million times more Dinah Lance than Laurel ever has been. Hell, even Huntress was more open and warm in the comic books than Laurel has been on the show.

[Morrigan2575]

Cool, I haven't read anywhere near the amount of BoP that you have but, that's the impression I've gotten as well.

Edited November 7, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[statsgirl]

Thanks for the info on Dinah and Dr. Fate.  I don't know what those people were thinking of.

 

I'm beginning to think I missed a lot with not going with the comic book Dinah Lance.

 

Of the two characters Arrow has used, Sara was about a million times more Dinah Lance than Laurel ever has been. Hell, even Huntress was more open and warm in the comic books than Laurel has been on the show.

It's bizarre then, to give Sara the personality of Dinah Lance, but expect to make Laurel into the Black Canary.

[Danny Franks]

There were downsides, now that I think of it. In Chuck Dixon's run, there seemed to be a few too many plotlines driven either by Dinah hooking up with a guy, or with a guy being interested in her. But the funny side of it was, Chuck Dixon (that avowed anti-gay, conservative homophobe) apparently unconsciously wrote the slashiest relationship ever between Dinah and Babs.

 

I mean, come on:

 

 

Sure, the artist was obviously having some fun there, but the subtext was quite consistent. And it was a pretty nice relationship to see develop over the years, especially when Gail Simone took over the title.

[tv echo]

The first few episodes of The Flash did significantly better in the ratings than the first few episodes of Arrow back in Season 1.  Yes, The Flash is more light-hearted and fun, and features a more well-known superhero, but here's my take on the reason for the difference in ratings -- Virtually every character on Arrow was unlikeable, while virtually every character on The Flash is likeable (just comparing early Season 1 of both shows)

 

On Arrow (early Season 1), we had two leads who were both unappealing.  Oliver was dour and closed off, his backstory included being a rich playboy who cheated on his girlfriend with her sister, and his present self was a straight-up killer working blindly off a list.  Laurel was hostile, bitter, angry and nasty.  The two of them, supposedly the main romance, had zero chemistry.  Moira was morally ambiguous.  Detective Lance was a blinders-wearing cop who just wanted to hunt down the vigilante.  Thea was more sympathetic but her story was the poor little rich girl who took drugs.  Diggle was just the bodyguard who kept losing Oliver.  Malcolm was the bad guy.  Tommy was probably the most sympathetic character.  So who or what was there to root for?

 

On The Flash (early Season 1), we have an easygoing and smiling Barry who everyone likes.  He's relatable because he's a bit awkward and isn't a billionaire playboy.  There's also the likeable Iris and the very likeable Detective West, who's already on the hero's side and in on his secret.  Barry also already has a team in place to support him, with the mysterious Dr. Wells, plus the inoffensive Cisco and the sympathetic Caitlin.  There's no repugnant back story (like sister-swapping), and Barry doesn't kill (at least, not yet). 

 

Even though SA is a more compelling actor than GG (although I'm sure others will disagree), even his natural charisma couldn't overcome his character's unappealing character traits and back story in Season 1.  It took the emergence of Team Arrow, specifically Diggle and Felicity as more than background characters, to make Oliver likeable and a hero that I could root for.

[Genki]

That is probably a fair call to make. But I have a slightly different experience.

 

I my preference leans towards more darker superhero stories (The fact that they make Oliver a killer was a plus for me)…but not everything has to be batman

 

I know I tuned out around Episode 1.03, in fact when I saw Felicity, my thought were "and now here is the mandatory "Chloe" for the show…" (Do even I need to state that Chloe was my favourite and I hated the way she was treated? And seriously the disliked everything to do with both LLs on Smallville ) and although I didn't watch to the bitter end, Smallville had burned me out, seriously cannot even watch Superman movies. 

 

I caught up on a binge watch when I heard that direction for LI was going toward Felicity and Sara's Black Canary reappearance was going well. And friends who stuck with the show were enjoying it.

 

1st Episode I liked Shady Moira, and Sally, The Abs, and the Queen family interaction. I really wanted to like KC's Laurel since I had been fond of her since Supernatural, also she really was the best thing about the Melrose Place remake (but not enough to make me keep watching).

 

As for the Flash, the lightness is a little close to cheesy, for myself, and there are characters that I don't have a handle on yet, but I'm giving it more of a chance because I think there are some potentially interesting thing coming up, (Firestorm) and of course the crossovers.

 

In summary tuned out of Arrow (in spite of the Abs) because of Smallville and I'm giving Flash longer because of Arrow.

 

Side-ish Note: Agents of Shield I was watching to the bitter end because of Whedon, and I let a few bank up until I caught up on Thor 2 and the Winter Soldier, they really turned it around, so I'm giving Gotham a bigger change, even though not loving it.

[BkWurm1]

So I keep hearing Agent Carter referred to as an eight part event...so does that mean it didn't get picked up for a full season or that they only ever planned to do a mini series?

[Genki]

I think it was only ever planned as a small 8-part Season, but I thought it was mean to be released on Netflix, like the idea of a hiatus stopgap. 

[KirkB]

I think ABC is doing the eight part thing with Agent Carter to be one of the only networks airing something new during the in-between period, and as a test. If Agent Carter does well it will probably be picked up later.

[Morrigan2575]

I'm actually interested in Agent Carter, I gave up on AoS pretty early and every attempt I made (last season) to get back into it didn't pan out. I don't know about this season but I didn't think it improved last season. However, I'm interested in this "limited" series.

Edited November 9, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[KirkB]

I'm curious about it myself, because I kind of wondered what happened to Peggy and the other members of Cap's unit after he disappeared.

Edited November 9, 2014 by KirkB

[tv echo]

Good points, Genki.  I like Arrow much better now than in Season 1, despite the disappointing trend of this season so far.  But I am concerned about its ratings.

 

If you look at the shows that have lasted a long time (8+ years), they have at least one or two likeable characters that people get invested in and want to follow.  So I guess my point was that unlikeable characters equals low ratings.

[Danny Franks]

I'm actually interested in Agent Carter, I gave up on AoS pretty early and every attempt I made (last season) to get back into it didn't pan out. I don't know about this season but I didn't think it improved last season. However, I'm interested in this "limited" series.

 

Me too. Agents of SHIELD was a car crash for me, once I realised that Clark Gregg has no charisma or presence whatsoever, yet was still the lead because lots of people inexplicably latched onto him in the Marvel movies. Can't watch him. Just can't do it, whenever he's on screen I feel the life being drained out of me. I liked most of the rest of them, but Coulson was so central that I just couldn't be bothered. I also was completely turned off by the two main 'ships they seemed to be pushing, and had no interest in seeing either play out.

 

Not even Tyra Collette is dragging me back.

But Peggy? She's awesome. She was awesome in the The First Avenger, and in the one shot Marvel released with Iron Man 3, and she should be awesome as the lead of her own show. And it does look like it will be her show, too. No other big names slated as anything other than guest appearances, but the surrounding cast does look solid. And, I've just discovered, features Kyle Bornheimer, Amy's doofy boyfriend from Brooklyn Nine-Nine. He's fun, from what I've seen.

 

I think most of the other Howling Commandos will appear, as guest parts, which should be fun. And I have some fainter hopes that a certain Soviet assassin will pop up now and again, to "shape the events of the 20th century".

 

I just hope that there isn't a negative reaction when they inevitably start teasing the idea of who Peggy's husband will turn out to be. They mentioned him in The Winter Soldier, so I guess it's a lock that he'll appear in this show, at some point. But hopefully fans don't rebel over the idea of her being with someone who's not Steve.

[KirkB]

But we don't know how long after Steve disappeared she met the guy she married. She and the Howling Commandos were busy mopping up in the war then starting the organization that would eventually become SHIELD. It could be years before the guy shows up, which means he wouldn't have to be present on the show at all, especially with its limited run.

Edited November 10, 2014 by KirkB

[Morrigan2575]

Didn't the video in Capt 2 mention when she met her husband?

I mean, I don't care, I liked Peggy so I'd like to see her find happiness and success in the past. The biggest problem for me is the sadness in knowing her future. Hopefully a full/happy life will make it easier?

[tv echo]

Avengers: Age of Ultron and Ant-Man Behind the Scenes Sneak Peek
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=879990035374807&set=vb.610847212289092&type=2&theater
http://au.ibtimes.com/articles/572226/20141110/avengers-age-ultron-video-spoilers.htm#.VGDOxPnF8uQ

[tv echo]

Here's my ranking of current superhero TV shows that I like right now  - I'm sure others will disagree ; )

 

1.  Arrow (but slipping downwards)

2.  Gotham

3.  The Flash

4.  Agents of SHIELD

 

I tried Constantine but couldn't get into it.  I'm looking forward to Agent Carter, so I hope it doesn't disappoint.

Edited November 11, 2014 by tv echo

[manbearpig]

Mine would be pretty different. Agents of Shield is having a really good season and is definitely my favourite at the moment by far. Loving Bobbi. Arrow feels a little off to me this season, but I'm still enjoying it. The Flash is pleasant but mediocre. I'm behind on Gotham; just watched episode four last week, and to me it's worse than Arrow or Agents of Shield have ever been. I still like them all at the minute though.

 

So excited for Agent Carter!

[Morrigan2575]

The Flash - it's fun, I'm not heavily invested or attached to the characters but that will come in time. Right now, I am heavily entertained.

Constantine - I like the subject the lead actor and the lead character. It's fun and interesting I don't know if it will have the time to grow/develop into a great show but it's a good fit with Grimm on Friday night

Gotham - I've grown bored with the show and it's fallen into the trap I feared when they started announcing all those Batman characters. It's a want to be Batman show when I'd prefer a cop show about Jim Gordan. I'm 3 episodes behind and no real desire to catch up.

I stopped watching AoS in S1 and no desire to give it another shot. I stopped watching Arrow after 301. I only watched 305 because I've been waiting for a Felicity centric episode since S2

I will watch the crossover because I'm watching Flash but that's pretty much it unless something drastic occurs to get me watching again.

I'm really looking forward to Agent Carter, I hope it's entertaining. I'm also interested in Teen Titans if it ever happens (on TNT) bit I have no interest in Supergirl.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[Sunshine]

Flash is entertaining but I am not invested in any characters.

Constantine-Friday at 10 isn't a great time for TV for me.

Gotham: I couldn't get into at all. I watched about 3 episodes and was pretty bored.

AoS: I was entertained with the couple of episodes I saw in S1 but it wasn't must see TV. Haven't seen any since.

Arrow: Was hard to get into because Diggle was the only character I liked from the moment he showed up on screen. I knew I was supposed to root for Oliver so I hung in there. I think I was supposed to root for Laurel but I hated her from the moment she stepped on my screen. She wasn't anything like I expected and not in a good way. It wasn't until Felicity joined the Team in Odyssey that I began to enjoy it. Now I am trying to hold on until 3.09 to see if I should continue. Not sure I am going to manage it.

Agent Carter & Super Girl: I refuse to try and watch anything else. I think I'll stick to 2 hour movies every couple of years!

[SmallScreenDiva]

1. "Arrow" — Still too attached to the show and Oliver/Felicity/Diggle to drop it or even just move it down the list.

2. "Agents of Shield" — Like the new additions to the team, like the changes in the dynamics, and actually interested in finding out more about those damn drawings.

3. "The Flash" — Surprised at how much I'm enjoying it, but not quite invested in the characters yet, not even Barry.

4. "Constantine" — I finally checked out this series on On Demand and found myself marathoning it. Hasn't quite made the leap to DVR yet, but I really like the lead actor and I've always enjoyed supernatural stories.

5. "Gotham" — Got bored with pilot. Tried to marathon it but ended up not actually watching. Picked it up again in Episode 4. I'm liking it better but still not really into it. It's one of those shows right now I have on while I'm puttering around the house.

Edited November 11, 2014 by SmallScreenDiva

[NumberCruncher]

My rankings:

1. Arrow - Still loyal to it, but it's skating on thin ice this season. Get your shit together, show!

2. The Flash - It's a breath of fresh air because it's the opposite of the doom and gloom Arrow loves to wallow in. I'm not in love with the characters themselves (yet), but I'm still enjoying it a lot.

3. Constantine - I wasn't dazzled by the pilot but it has gradually improved. I think Constantine and Zed are both interesting and I really loved this last episode.

People really seem to love Gotham but frankly I got really bored watching the pilot. The other episodes are sitting on my DVR. I'll eventually watch them, but I can't form an opinion at the moment.

I tried Agents of SHIELD during S1 and I couldn't get into it. I know that it hit its stride towards the end of the first season but I'm leery of getting invested because I would constantly be worried that it would fall into the same trap of having to stretch out storylines waiting for the next big revelation to happen in the Marvel Cinematic Universe and we'd be stuck with long stretches of filler episodes. This is where I think DC is being smarter by not tying the two worlds together.

I'm really excited for Agent Carter. I'm not too worried that it's a Marvel-based show because it's happening 70 years in the past, so it's looking more to be an origins story. And of course I love Hayley Atwell so that's a huge plus for me.

Edited November 11, 2014 by NumberCruncher

[Lokiberry]

1. Gotham. I love this series. I'm a huge Batman, and Batman-related fan, so this show is right up my alley. The relationship between Jim Gordon and Harvey Bullock is just amazing. Little Selina Kyle is a dead ringer for Michelle Pfeiffer, and she really moves like a cat. Tween Bruce Wayne is suitably angry, obsessive, vulnerable, and just plain weird. Sean Pertwee (and, my God, does he look like his father!) is a wonderful Alfred, who's trying to raise L'il Bruce as best he can, while slowly realizing that this kid isn't, shall we say, quite normal. But, the absolute best thing about this show is, Robin Lord Taylor as Oswald  Cobblepot, aka The Penguin. I could watch a whole show with just him conniving, weaseling, stealing, and murdering his way in and out of the good graces of Gotham's crime families. RLT deserve an emmy nomination.

 

2. Flash. It's the polar opposite of Arrow. It's fun, and engaging. I like all the characters, even Iris. Barry Allen is an adorkable guy, who just wants to use his powers to do good and help people, and clear his father of the murder he didn't commit. Cisco is fun, and Caitlin has a sympathetic backstory. Dr Wells is intriguing and creepy; and Barry and Joe West have a surrogate father and son relationship that has quickly become the heart of the show. I'm almost sorry that Felicity can't move over full time. She fits in well, and if they had been serious about exploring Barlicity they might have been able to something with it. Mostly though, I'm not watching Arrow any more, and I'd still like to see her every week.

 

That's pretty much it for me and superhero shows. I don't watch AoS, and I checked out the pilot of Constantine, and didn't like it. I've watched 3 episodes of Arrow so far this season, and plan to watch the crossover, but then that's it for me unless they have some kind of huge sea change in the second half of the season. I'm looking forward to Agent Carter, but Supergirl is more wait and see. I don't really trust these showrunners

[Sakura12]

My rankings are

 

AoS: I'm really enjoying this season. Like most I gave up after a few eps of season 1. Then people kept telling me it got better when it introduced the Hydra fallout from Cap 2. They were right. This season I'm loving the intro of amazon woman Mockingbird. 

 

The Flash: This show is fun and entertaining which sometimes all I need to keep watching. It took me awhile to get into the Arrow characters so I'm giving these actors some time to grow into their characters. 

 

Arrow: Dropped after 3x01. I watch the Felicity scenes on Youtube.

 

Gotham: Pretty much dropped. I kept trying to get into it, but ended up missing a few eps and don't really have a desire to watch them. 

 

Constantine: Never watched.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Sakura12

[KirkB]

I'm in.

 

1) Flash  Right now, it's fun. It's entertaining, which is kind of the point. And I actually look forward to it.

2) AoS/Gotham  It's a tie. The former has gotten better though that's not saying much, and while I am a huge Batman fan I am not a comics purist so I like seeing different takes on the stories and characters.

3) Arrow   I still watch, I just don't find myself caring as much anymore.

4) Constantine  Haven't watched, probably won't.

[JayKay]

Okay, this is neat and I like reading everybody else's rankings and reasonings.

 

1. Agents of Shield: Never thought it would happen, but I started really enjoying this show this season. Honestly, even after the big gamechange last season I still didn't feel like there was a vast increase in quality. But this season has improved drastically from little character beats and interactions, imo. The artifical camaraderie of last season shifted into something real this year and now I don't miss an episode.

 

2. I guess Constantine? I've seen two episodes and enjoyed both. Urban fantasy is my favorite genre so that plays into it, too. There's still a few kinks to be worked out but the cast is solid and the creepy scenes and effects are worth watching for.

 

3. Gotham: It's not exactly my cup of tea but I'll watch if there's nothing better going on. Last night's was pretty good.

 

4. The Flash: I don't watch it but I'm glad it brings some levity to the superhero tv genre.

 

5. Arrow: I don't watch anymore so I can't really say. I'm still a little burnt. If I hear Thea's storyline picks up I'll probably have to start Youtubing her scenes though.

 

I expect for Agent Carter to rocket to the top of the list and I hope that Teen Titans lives up to its potential. Excited for all of the Netflix Marvel series. Not sure about Supergirl.

[Morrigan2575]

Hah! The Flash just referenced Felicity, it was really cute.

[Velocity23]

Ratings for Flash & other Tuesdays shows.

[BkWurm1]

Ranking superhero shows-

1) Arrow is still number one on my list but it's there on the merits of the past, not what has been on this season, still, it's the show I spend most time thinking about.

2) Gotham- I'm really enjoying this show and it's not my usual cup of tea. There is not a couple for me to root for (which is usually my entry into a show) but I find all the characters and their interactions fascinating. My favorite character is probably the corrupt city of Gotham. It changes the way everyone thinks and acts and honestly at this point it's a miracle the city and anyone in it survive until Batman shows up. I didn't think I'd be a fan of Cobblepot and his journey but is just so twisty and awful and awesome. In contrast we have the very straight arrow Jim Gordon. He right now is so full of anger and frustration and his influence on those around him is subtle but huge. The relationship between Bruce and Alfred is different than anything I've seen before - again, very compelling. I love Cattween even though she hasn't had much screen time, but again, wonderful casting.

I'd say the show is less a Wannabe Batman show than a Cops vs Mobs show. It's backed by comic history but it's the characters themselves in their little details and choices that are drawing me in. I was excited to watch it this week.

3) The Flash - I still need to develop more of an emotional attachment to the characters but it's always fun once I watch it.

4) Agents of SHEILD - I like it when I'm watching it, but every week I have to push myself to watch. Not sure why.

I tried Constantine but it's not my kind of show. If you like Supernatural, you might like this, but it's too hard core for me. I think it also underwent some changes after the Pilot episode, but I don't know if that was for better or worse.

I know Grimm isn't really part if this list but it's still a fun show for me. There's a character in it that I'm constantly calling Sin in my head. She looks and acts a lot like her, oh and goes by the name of Truble. (Insert eye roll)

Edited November 12, 2014 by BkWurm1

[Danny Franks]

Sadly I'm not watching any of the comic book TV shows at the moment. Well, except for Comic Book Men, but that's gotten pretty bad too.

 

Gotham, I'm technically still watching but I'm about four episodes behind, and don't feel that bothered about catching up at the moment.

 

The Flash, I kind of watch when the mood takes me, but generally skip through the episode in about ten minutes. I still think Gustin makes a lousy 'leading man', and I have no interest in his creepy love life.

 

Agents of SHIELD? I might watch it again if they kill Coulson for good. Otherwise, that show can fuck off.

 

Arrow? Nah. Done with it. I already decided I wasn't going to watch week to week, back in the summer, but now I'm just not going to watch at all. Nothing there that I'm missing, as far as I can tell.

 

I think the main actor on Constantine sucks, and the only thing I really liked about it was the hotness of the girl in the pilot episode. They wrote her out in a lazy, hamfisted way, so now I'm not going to bother. It'll probably be cancelled by about episode 12 anyway.

Edited November 12, 2014 by Danny Franks

[kdm07]

Ooo I'll join this too.

 

1- AoS. This season is much, much better and the new characters (hi Mockingbird!) have added to the show for the better. @DannyFranks start watching AoS again! Tyra Collette IS worth it! (pours one out for FNL)

2- The Flash. It's light-hearted fun on a Tuesday night.

3- Gotham. Still 50/50 for me but it does seem to be finding it's feet now.

4- Arrow. 3x01 was my breaking point. Not even Felicity can bring me back to this show.

 

I don't watch Constantine so I can't rank it.

Edited November 13, 2014 by kdm07

[apinknightmare]

I only watch Arrow and The Flash. So, Arrow is #1 for me, only because the level of investment I have in the characters far surpasses that of those on The Flash. I do find The Flash to be a much more entertaining show, and I enjoy it a lot more because I'm not really worried about them ruining anything because at this point I don't care that much.

[FurryFury]

1. AoS, although I'm liking the Flash almost as much, but the latter has a big problem with female characters, which AoS surely doesn't. And yes, it's quite good this season. Not awesome or anything, but watchable and consistently fun. And kudos for them for finally treating stalking and murder of innocent people the way they should be treated (I'm looking at you, Ward).

2. Flash - the characters are all so damn likable, even Iris. Hell, even I'm rooting for the resident possible Big Bad! (although I do hope he's not) The only thing I truly hate is the "hero's love interest not knowing his identity" cliché, ugh, been there, seen this. 

3. Arrow - higher than Gotham and Constantine because they are basically unwatchable (I only managed to get through the pilots). But I don't watch it anymore, even on Youtube.

4. Constantine - I guess I could see myself going back to it if it stopped being a generic 90s supernatural show, but the pilot didn't compel me to even check out the next episode. I'm still reading the reviews from time to time, though, but I don't even see it surviving past season 1.

5. Gotham - horrible, absolutely horrible. 

Edited November 13, 2014 by FurryFury

[tv echo]

I'm glad that everyone has different rankings because I generally like all of these shows and the more people who like each of these shows the best, the more likely their chances of success.

 

AVENGERS 2: AGE OF ULTRON - Official Extended Trailer #2 (2015) [HD]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk24PuBUUkQ

[tv echo]

Regarding The Flash comparisons to Arrow and Smallville...

 

How The Flash Is a Good Show Despite a Gaping Hole Where the Plot Should Be
By Paul on Nov 13, 2014
http://www.tvovermind.com/the-flash/flash-good-show-despite-gaping-hole-plot-244612

[Starfish35]

I'm only watching two comic book TV shows at the moment, AoS and The Flash. I'm really enjoying both, but I think AoS has the edge right now for the reason that FurryFury said, better treatment of female characters.

I'm glad to know that I'm not the only one who has issues with Clark Gregg. I've long thought that one of the main issues with AoS is that he just doesn't have the charisma to be a leading man. I know he became a huge fan favorite, but someone somewhere should have seen that this wasn't going to work very well. I like Coulson, but....I just don't think he's leading man material.

That said, this season has been leaps and bounds better than last, and I hope it survives because I actually am really enjoying it now. I love all the new characters.

The Flash is just fun, and it reminds me of Smallville actually a bit, not in a bad way (there was a time I really enjoyed Smallville). I don't like Cisco much, but other than that, I don't really have many complaints, other than "tell Iris soon!"

[Shanna]

Coulson clearly should have remained a background guy who popped out now and then to give orders. I had to drop that show last season for various reasons, Coulson wasn't he only problem. God help me I actually liked ward and Jemma, so I can't really see any reason to go back.

Gotham I am really enoying. They do the best job with sets and the look of the show by far.

I am watching arrow and am invested but getting frustrated. I am watching flash but so far it's fluff.

I watched Constantine a week or two ago and was completely uninterested.

[dtissagirl]

Edward Raymond? Dude Felicity married in the comics.

Wouldn't THAT throw a spanner in the works...

But now Ronnie is an actual character on The Flash, and this is the CW and no way Felicity is gonna be dating his father, what do they do then? Make Ed his older brother instead? Do the Amells have a third cousin in the biz? I would probably pay monies to watch THAT soap opera. :)

[NumberCruncher]

I guess it's not impossible that they could shake up comic canon a bit make Ed Raymond Felicity's dad and Ronnie her half-brother. It would tie the two shows together even more and we all know how much the EPs love that. It would also give them the perfect excuse to shuffle Felicity off to The Flash. Not saying it will happen that way, but the opportunity would be there.

[Starfish35]

That's occurred to me, that Ronnie may be a half or step brother, if they wanted to connect them somehow. But as far as Ed/Felicity, like dancingnancy said, no way is CW going to pair Felicity up with someone old enough to be her own father, since Ronnie is at least as old if not older than Felicity in this universe. The only way I could see them doing Felicity/Ed is if they made Ed Ronnie's brother instead of father.

As far as the Ward situation on AoS, I am not sure what to think. I found Ward to be as dull as dirt until we found out he was Hydra. But I'm still a bit nervous that they're going to try to redeem him somehow. He's fine like this - a creepy amoral wild card that you don't know exactly what to expect from. But I don't want him back on the team, or *shudder* together with Skye. Besides, I'm more interested in the new characters at this point. I love Bobbi immensely, and I'm also enjoying Lance, Mac, and Tripp, though Tripp doesn't get enough screen time IMO. Of the old characters, Simmons is my favorite, and I'm glad she's back with the team.

[tv echo]

I never explained the reasons for my superhero tv show rankings, so here goes:

 

1.  Arrow (but slipping downwards) - Maybe it's because I've watched this show the longest, but I've gotten emotionally invested in the characters.  I care about what happens to Oliver, Felicity, Diggle and even Thea.  Yes, it's got a ton of flaws (and I've been bitching about it quite a lot this season), but the show still has heart.  Part of what puts this show first for me - at least for now - is that it doesn't have superpowers and therefore seems more grounded in reality, so the people seem more like real people.  Overall, I think the acting and production are quite good (I'm not going to get into exceptions here).  It mostly fails in its story consistency, pacing and editing.  It's also getting too unrelentingly dark, and needs to lighten up.  But compared to a lot of other shows on TV (esp. on the CW), this show is still a cut above.  That's why it breaks my heart to see what's happening to it.

 

2.  Gotham - I didn't expect to like this show that much because it was so dark and seemed so villain-heavy, but now I really enjoy it. The acting is really quite good all around (with one glaring exception) from heroes like Jim Gordon (Ben Mackenzie) to villains like Oswald Cobblepot (Robin Lord Taylor).  There's a bizarrely beautiful visual style to the production that's unlike the other superhero shows, and the villains' quirks somehow fit that setting.  Although I enjoy the Bruce & Alfred scenes, this isn't really a Batman prequel story to me.  It's mainly a story about Jim Gordon, a decent cop in a city filled with corruption, and how he manages to stay a decent human being despite everything being against him.  I can root for him.  But he's not a goody two-shoes (that would be annoying), he's got depths and layers - maybe it's just good casting.

 

3.  The Flash - I enjoy this show because it's fun to watch.  The characters are all very likeable, and the episodes go by quickly (which is good).  But the existence of superpowers does make the show more like a comic book fantasy, so that makes the dangers less real to me (it's hard to defeat someone that fast) and I can't get as invested in the characters - at least not yet (it's only been a few episodes).  The biggest drawback for me is that sometimes everyone is just so likeable that it's hard to take seriously.  It has the opposite problem of Arrow; this show is too light.  What keeps it from drifting into marshmallow fluff is the presence of Dr. Harrison Wells, who injects the needed element of mystery and dark ruthlessness.  I also hope it doesn't become Smallville 2.0.

 

4.  Agents of SHIELD - I really, really wanted to love this show because I'm a Joss Whedon fan and because I've generally preferred the Marvel superhero movies over the Warner Bros./DC superhero movies.  But Season 1 was a huge disappointment and, although Season 2 is a big improvement, I just can't get into storylines that revolve around Coulson and that treat Skye like a special snowflake.  I like Clark Gregg just fine as a supporting or recurring character, but he's just not a leading man or someone who a show can revolve around.  That said, I still enjoy watching this show.  I also appreciate the fact that this show has the difficult task of having to be cognizant of what's happening in the Marvel movies on the big screen and timing its episodes accordingly.

 

TBD - Agent Carter has the advantage of taking place in the past, so it doesn't have the burden of fitting its stories into the Marvel movie-verse's modern timeline.  It also stars the compelling Hayley Atwell.  This show could be great.  It features a strong woman during a period in American history when women were not treated equally.  We'll get to see the origin and beginnings of SHIELD.  And we'll get to see what happened to Peggy Carter.

 

(FYI, I've never read any comic books.  What I know about the comic book history of any of these characters, I've learned from reading fan forums and, on occasion, Googling a character's name.)

Edited November 15, 2014 by tv echo

[Starfish35]

I'm really looking forward to Agent Carter. I loved Peggy, and I really hope the show isn't a disappointment.

[KirkB]

Agent Carter seems like it could be a lot of fun. It's probably the show I am currently most looking forward to.

[Morrigan2575]

Constantine was freaking awesome last night, hands down best episode they've done (to date).

I also watched the Marvel Phase 3 aannouncement video, I geeked out a bit at Captain Marvel, Inhumans, Infinity War and even Civil War announcements. I know a few people here said they didn't like the Civil War storyline, I didn't read it but I came in during the aftermath when they relaunched The New Warriors (with Jubilee and Stark as her favorite target). Because of The New Warriors title I'm quite interested/excited for CA3.

Edited November 15, 2014 by Morrigan2575

[NumberCruncher]

Constantine was freaking awesome last night, hands down best episode they've done (to date).

Oh yay! I haven't had a chance to watch it yet since I've been in L.A. for work this week, but it's waiting at home on the DVR. I hope the show continues to improve--that is, if it can survive cancellation.

[wingster55]

Because of The New Warriors title I'm quite interested/excited for CA3

 

Problem is, is that CA3 already had a storyline st up...Steve and Bucky. Now with Iron Man in it...it gets lost in the shuffle 

[Morrigan2575]

I don't know why they dropped the Bucky storyline for CA3 but I'm still curious to see how Civil War plays out.

[tv echo]

So why wasn't this the Felicity cross-over episode?

The Flash Promotional Pictures Tease The Clock King; Arrow Star Stephen Amell Slams Warner Bros For Flash Casting
By Ruchinka Upadhyaya  November 15, 2014 08:13 GMT
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/flash-promotional-pictures-tease-clock-king-arrow-star-stephen-amell-slams-warner-bros-flash-1474949

 

Stephen Amell Talks About DC Cinematic Movie And TV Universes
By Andrew Steinbeiser  11/14/2014
http://comicbook.com/2014/11/14/stephen-amell-talks-about-dc-cinematic-movie-and-tv-universes/