Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

[Primal Slayer]

1 hour ago, tofutan said:

So Ken on twitter claims: 

Is that a standard contract thing? Could he in theory block them from using the characters he created like Alex and Diggle if he was feeling petty? 

No. The characters belong to WB but he will get royalties for the characters. 

[Morrigan2575]

The problem with that is AJK was show runner for both Flash and Supergirl. Why would Supergirl be the only one that has to stop production?

[Primal Slayer]

4 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

The problem with that is AJK was show runner for both Flash and Supergirl. Why would Supergirl be the only one that has to stop production?

According to Ken...AK was much more involved in SG then TF and I guess they may be trying to rewrite AK specific episodes? Though I don't really believe that he wasn't all over TF. And SG production isn't being halted so....idk.

[Morrigan2575]

25 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

According to Ken...AK was much more involved in SG then TF and I guess they may be trying to rewrite AK specific episodes? Though I don't really believe that he wasn't all over TF. And SG production isn't being halted so....idk.

If Supergirl production isn't being halted (which I didn't think it was) then nothing he's saying makes sense. 

I really don't think the Supergirl hiatus had anything to do with AJK.

[tv echo]

10 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

@tv echo, do you remember anything about a quote from MG saying they'd been trying to work something out about getting Mari McCabe on Legends this season, but so far it hadn't worked out? I could have sworn that was on TVLine, like in their Ask Ausiello or Matt's Inside Line columns, but I've been looking, and I can't find it there.  So I thought maybe it was something that had been posted here in this thread from another site and I'm just misremembering it.

@apinknightmare posted the Nov. 16th EW blurb about Mari being on LoT upthread (page 451). I have not seen anything more recent on that front.

Edited December 10, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

FYI, superhero panels at ACE Comic Con that are scheduled for today (Sunday)...

12:00 PM - Daredevil panel (with Charlie Cox)
3:00 PM - Justice League panel (with Henry Cavill, Gal Gadot, Ray Fisher, Jason Momoa and Ciaran Hinds)

(Jon Bernthal was originally scheduled for a Punisher panel yesterday, but had to cancel due to the wildfires in Southern California.)

Videos will probably be streamed/posted by ACE Universe at:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCv8Iyv10PKy7lq-JECCeGA

Edited December 10, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

After interviewing Ariela Barer, Kyle and Natalie discussed the mid-season finales of Supergirl, LoT, Flash and Arrow...

Entertainment Weekly's Superhero Insider talks with Ariela Barer from Marvel's "Runaways"
December 9, 2017   Kyle Anderson and Natalie Abrams

-- Arrow: Natalie loved that Iris threw shade at the double wedding in the Flash episode (no surprise there). Kyle and Natalie noted that Oliver & Felicity got a wedding reception, unlike Barry & Iris, although Natalie mentioned the deleted Flash scene of Barry & Iris' honeymoon. Kyle said it was "nice" seeing everyone on Arrow "in daylight" for a change and wearing good clothes. Kyle said that this mid-season finale saw the break-up of Team Arrow. Natalie "totally sees Oliver's side of it," although it's "not great" that he surveilled his team. Kyle thought that S2 Oliver would not have "processed this the same way." Kyle loved the two exchanges between Quentin and "Evil Laurel." Natalie agreed, but she also loved the scene where Quentin gave his watch to Oliver. Natalie said that we saw "for the first time" some "vulnerability" in this Laurel, but then we saw that she was still part of the cabal of villains. Kyle thought that Black Siren has been "criminally underused" in the first half of the season. They both liked seeing Thea again and expect to see more of her in the back half of the season.

-- Kyle announced that next week they will announce their Superhero Insider Fall Season Awards "for stuff like Best Fight and Best Villain and Best Couple, and we will name the Best Episodes of each of the Arrowverse shows in this fall season."

Edited December 10, 2017 by tv echo

[tofutan]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

According to Ken...AK was much more involved in SG then TF and I guess they may be trying to rewrite AK specific episodes? Though I don't really believe that he wasn't all over TF. And SG production isn't being halted so....idk.

Ken seems to interpret it stopping one week earlier than the others as halting. But they were definitely still shooting after AK was fired. 

It still seems nuts to me that there would really be such a contract that forbids them from shooting episodes he created the outlines for. And we are not even talking concrete "idea by" or "teleplay by" but vague structure like "Okay there is Sam and she's a nice person and by episode 4 there is a mysterious cult and by episode 7 Sam transforms and by episode 9 she beats Kara to a pulp so in episode 12 they go to Fort Rozz to talk to the person behind Reign and by episode X Reign murders the Legion of Superheroes and by episode Y they find this macguffin and in episode Z something happens to Ruby and in episode A Reign tries to murder Morgan Edge and in episode B Kara defeats Reign using the Macguffin" and suddenly they can't use the MacGuffin they set up in previous episodes to defeat Reign because he came up with it? 

They are shooting 13 now. I don't think that he personally wrote any more episodes for Supergirl other than the crossover, where he was involved in all 4 crossover episodes. I'm pretty sure 14, 15 and such must be written already because they already cast Winn's mother for 15. And now they supposedly can't shoot 15 even if the actual episode was written by somebody else? Doesn't somebody own that script? 

I also have a hard time buying that he wasn't that involved in Flash season 4. He definitely did a lot of promotion for it at the beginning of the season and talked a lot about his hopes for the season, creating Breacher, many people have commented on Ralph feeling like a very Kreisberg style character. Maybe they mean he wasn't as involved in plotting out the DeVoe arc compared to plotting out the Reign arc? But wouldn't all of that be a cooperative effort? 

Quote

Other than not being a speedster, what makes The Thinker a different villain than what we’ve seen on the show before? Can you talk about his motivations?
It’s been interesting because none of us are geniuses, so it’s been interesting putting all of our writer brains together to come up with something that is worthy of somebody who is supposed to be the world’s fastest mind. Last season, by the back half of the season, we really zeroed in on Savitar and his motivations and whatnot, but I think early on in the season, it wasn’t as clear to us, and I think that showed on screen. This season, we worked really, really hard to really understand what the Thinker wants, and why he’s doing it, and how he’s going about it. As you’re watching these first episodes you really see that there’s a chess match going on. In the beginning, our guys don’t even realize that they’re playing against him, but then you watch as they’re realizing that somebody is manipulating events and pulling the strings, watching them move and countermove in episodes as it’s all building to a big confrontation.

http://ew.com/tv/2017/10/03/flash-season-4-premiere-spoilers/

Edited December 10, 2017 by tofutan

[tv echo]

[tv echo]

While I think that Wonder Woman is culturally significant and deserves to be on the AFI list, I don't think it is a great movie deserving of an Oscar Best Picture win (even though I loved it). Still, I would be happy if it won any Oscars...

AFI Top 10 Movies Of 2017: ‘Wonder Woman’, ‘Get Out’, ‘Shape Of Water’, ‘The Post’ & More
by Pete Hammond  December 7, 2017  
http://deadline.com/2017/12/2018-afi-movies-of-the-year-list-wonder-woman-get-out-1202222266/

Quote

The American Film Institute has announced its annual AFI Movies of the Year list and the most surprising thing about it is there are no real surprises on it — even to the point of including a so-called comic book movie with Warner Bros’ Wonder Woman making the cut.

In fact, in terms of the expected names, the AFI’s list matches almost film for film with yesterday’s Best Picture list from the Critics’ Choice Awards with the exception of Wonder Woman, which did not appear on CCA’s top 10 while Darkest Hour did (that British film is ineligible for AFI honors due to its UK origin).

Although indie films have dominated early critics awards, nearly half of the AFI list consists of films released by the major studios, with Dunkirk, The Post and Get Out joining Wonder Woman. The rest of the list includes two from Fox Searchlight, Three Billboards Outside Ebbing, Missouri and The Shape Of Water; plus two from A24, which has Lady Bird and The Florida Project. Sony Pictures Classics is represented by Call Me by Your Name, while Amazon scored with The Big Sick.

Warner Bros. Launches 'Wonder Woman' "For Your Consideration" Page For 2018 Oscars
By JENNA ANDERSON - October 17, 2017
http://comicbook.com/2017/10/18/wonder-woman-movie-oscars-2018-campaign-for-your-consideration/

Quote

After months of speculation, it looks like Warner Bros. has kicked off its Oscar campaign for Wonder Woman.

Warner Bros. recently debuted their 'For Your Consideration' page, which features four different films the company is submitting for Oscar nominations. Wonder Woman is one of the four films on their site so far, with possible consideration in fifteen different categories.
*  *  *
The film is up for consideration in the coveted Best Picture category, which would give producers Charles Roven, Richard Suckle, and Zack and Deborah Snyder a chance at a trophy. The film is also being submitted for Best Adapted Screenplay, while Patty Jenkins is being submitted for Best Director.

Wonder Woman is submitting nine of its cast members in the Academy Awards' various acting categories. Gal Gadot (Diana Prince/Wonder Woman) is up for consideration for Best Actress, while Connie Nielsen (Hippolyta), Robin Wright (Antiope) and Elena Anaya (Doctor Poison) are being submitted for Best Supporting Actress. In Best Supporting Actor, Wonder Woman is submitting Chris Pine (Steve Trevor), David Thewlis (Ares), Danny Huston (General Ludendorff), and Ewen Bremner (Charlie).

The film is also being submitted in a myriad of technical categories: Best Cinematography, Best Production Design, Best Film Editing, Best Costume Design, Best Visual Effects, Best Sound Mixing, Best Sound Editing, Best Original Score, and Best Makeup and Hairstyling. The last of those deserves an extra notation, as fellow DC Extended Universe film Suicide Squad famously took home that award last year.
*  *  *
Fans will have to wait until January 23rd, 2018 to see which Academy Award nominations Wonder Woman ends up scoring. If Wonder Woman does make comic book movie history at the Oscars, it will be on March 4th, 2018.

Edited December 10, 2017 by tv echo

[Featherhat]

36 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Natalie loved that Iris threw shade at the double wedding in the Flash episode (no surprise there). Kyle and Natalie noted that Oliver & Felicity got a wedding reception, unlike Barry & Iris, although Natalie mentioned the deleted Flash scene of Barry & Iris' honeymoon.

Shrug. If the Flash writers had wanted they could have had WestAllen have a reception or some sort of party/something else other than opening wedding gifts and being a Bridezilla about them (and not just about Olicity's gift either) and deleted the "interrupted honeymoon" scene they didn't. They preferred Bridezilla "jokes" and shade. I guess they think since they got a rehersal dinner and 90% of a wedding ceremony that's enough (as Barry and Iris actually mentioned in the Xover. 

31 minutes ago, tofutan said:

many people have commented on Ralph feeling like a very Kreisberg style character

Definitely, especially with what came out as the reason he was fired, I always thought he was more involved day to day in The Flash than SG. I do find it a bit hard to believe that they have to rework the season trajectory simply because of AK, although maybe if so its just tweaking rather than entirely reworking?

[tofutan]

It would certainly make more sense if it was more something like "They can't use the episodes where he suggested the arc without giving him his producer credit and they really, really want to remove his producer credit". But then again, I have no idea how entertainment contracts actually work. But that just seems more reasonable to me than "they can suddenly never use the plot twist he suggested during the planning phase and have to come up with something completely different for the season climax". 

Quote

Definitely, especially with what came out as the reason he was fired, I always thought he was more involved day to day in The Flash than SG. 

He definitely wrote a lot more for Flash. As for Ralph, consider this interview where Kreisberg compared Ralph to Faith from Buffy. So yeah, he was definitely involved with that aspect. So the only thing I can picture if he was less influential in the plotting of the DeVoe arc (who is DeVoe, what is his motivation, Barry in Jail Arc, how is DeVoe brought down).  

[Delphi]

29 minutes ago, tofutan said:

As for Ralph, consider this interview where Kreisberg compared Ralph to Faith from Buffy. 

How dare he?!  On his best day,  Ralph would still only be a Kennedy. 

[quarks]

3 hours ago, tofutan said:

Is that a standard contract thing? Could he in theory block them from using the characters he created like Alex and Diggle if he was feeling petty? 

Not without a major lawsuit, which he would almost certainly lose. These contracts are very clear - yes, writers/showrunners now get royalties for original characters later used by the studio in further episodes, but the characters belong to WB. (I'll just note that WGA-w had to fight to get that much.) Any pettiness would actually be in the opposite direction - that is, WB telling Arrow not to use Diggle because they don't want AK to receive more royalty payments for that character. Studios have occasionally done this - but the key word is occasionally. I don't see it happening here.

It is possible that AK script or coscripted some upcoming episodes of Supergirl and Flash, and that those episodes are getting rewritten, and it's also possible that any pitch he made for the finales is also getting reworked - but these shows have all previously rewritten script/dialogue on set before (that is, during filming), and/or reworked their finales. About the only finale that was pitched in the beginning of the season that apparently wasn't that reworked, according to various interviews, was the Arrow season four finale - one of the least popular Arrowverse finales, suggesting that, honestly, if Flash and Supergirl are reconsidering their finales, it's not a bad thing. 

From what I can see, however, Kreisberg hasn't scripted anything for Supergirl since episode 6 of season 2, and he hasn't scripted anything for Flash since episode 15 of season 13. So I find it unlikely that he scripted anything more than a single upcoming episode of either show.  That said, if he did, he should be receiving some sort of kill fee, in addition to royalty payments for any original characters he's credited for, and any residuals from Arrow, Flash and Supergirl. 

 

2 minutes ago, tofutan said:

It would certainly make more sense if it was more something like "They can't use the episodes where he suggested the arc without giving him his producer credit and they really, really want to remove his producer credit". But then again, I have no idea how entertainment contracts actually work. But that just seems more reasonable to me than "they can suddenly never use the plot twist he suggested during the planning phase and have to come up with something completely different for the season climax". 

He definitely wrote a lot more for Flash. As for Ralph, consider this interview where Kreisberg compared Ralph to Faith from Buffy. So yeah, he was definitely involved with that aspect. So the only thing I can picture if he was less influential in the plotting of the DeVoe arc (who is DeVoe, what is his motivation, Barry in Jail Arc, how is DeVoe brought down).  

 

These are really good examples of "it depends."

In your first example: a plot twist is considered story. AK would/should receive story credit for that (that's the "Story by") and should receive a fee for that episode/residuals. (I get some residuals on story concepts I pitched but did not script, for instance. Very tiny residuals.) That said....studios have often wiggled right out of this one - I've lost track of the number of people who haven't gotten paid for story pitches that made it into the script. And generally, the story concept has to suggest a full episode plot - not just be "wouldn't this be cool."

Character arcs? This gets more dicey. If there's a very, very specific character plot twist within the arc - for example, "Ralph is hit on the head by several asteroids, which renders him unable to speak for several episodes and unable to say anything misogynistic afterwards" [Flash, you can have this one for free!] that can be tied to a specific episode/moment during the season, then, sure, but generally speaking, an overall character arc, no, or even a specific major moment for a character, no.

For example, pretty much everyone seems to be agreeing that Berlanti came up with the idea of the double weddings during Crisis on Earth-X - a major part of the character arcs for Barry, Iris, Oliver and Felicity. And yet, he wasn't given story credit for that episode. Stephen Amell apparently pitched the concept of getting to meet his son by picking up a dropped action figure, and didn't get any story credit for that. So unless AK actually outlined the specifics of what he wanted to happen in the finale - something that these shows have specifically said they usually don't do until around January or February - he shouldn't be getting story credits for this.

[tofutan]

Quote

From what I can see, however, Kreisberg hasn't scripted anything for Supergirl since episode 6 of season 2, and he hasn't scripted anything for Flash since episode 15 of season 3

Yep, he does have various "story by" credits on both shows. Including both first episodes of the current season. 

Quote

In your first example: a plot twist is considered story. AK would/should receive story credit for that (that's the "Story by") and should receive a fee for that episode/residuals.

But that's the interesting thing, he hasn't received any "Story By" credits at all for Supergirl or Flash since the opener. So not the Legion showing up, not Reign finding a Fortress in the desert, not the various DeVoe deals. So whatever he was doing, it didn't rise to the level of Story By. So it's weird to me that Ken calls him the main idea guy for Supergirl when whatever he did doesn't rise to Story By. 

My theory is that he might have been really involved with the whole Crossover and hence no Story Bys anymore for either Flash or Supergirl. 

The question is: is that what Ken describes realistic, that they would be blocked from shooting episodes that he didn't even have "Story By" levels of involvement? 

I have no problem buying that he might have plotted the season finale, but they are very far from shooting those episodes. Ken suggests that they might be forbidden from shooting 14, 15 etc and that's why they have these weird schedule where after Supergirl episode 13 they will air Legends episodes. Because Supergirl might have to rewrite 14, 15 etc. To me this seems really unlikely, because again, Kreisberg overall doesn't have that many Story By credits. He didn't have any Story By credits for any of the major Reign episodes this season. I could maybe picture him considering the Legion stuff important enough to script himself, but the Legion episodes ARE not the ones affected, they are the ones that have already been shot. 

We know 15 is supposed to be the Winn backstory/Toyman episode and I have a hard time buying that Kreisberg cared enough about that subject matter to plot that one (he didn't plot the season 1 Toyman episode either). 

So basically what Ken describes sounds very weird to me, so I was wondering whether the setup he describes really is realistic. 

IMO it  would be one thing if the writers wanted to change some things now that Kreisberg is gone (but I doubt that they would ever let that affect the shooting schedule because as people have noted that is beyond costly and problematic to organize), but what they are describing is that they HAVE to because they are not allowed to use his material, to the extent that they can't shoot in January because they have to rewrite episodes that were already written and already have a shooting plan, which in turn requires Supergirl to go on hiatus in favor of Legends because their episodes won't be ready.

 

BTW, I have nightmares that with The Originals ending Supergirl might get some of their people as new/added showrunners. I hope that if they add somebody, it will be somebody with comic book sensibiliities. Because neither Queller nor Rovner really give me the vibe that they are strong on the nerd cred. I just worry that it's gonna be hard to find somebody who has comic book sensibilities AND cares about female characters and about Supers. Considering how widespread the whole "oh no, Superman is too nice and powerful, that makes him boring" mentality is. 

 

I don't think Berlanti cares about Supergirl at all. He seems like more of a Flash guy. And with Ali Adler's new show getting picked up, I doubt she would come back. 

Edited December 10, 2017 by tofutan

[Miss Dee]

12 hours ago, KenyaJ said:

All I got was Trump, LOL. 

I think it's because Oliver is so dry and deadpan and Curtis is so stream-of-consciousness in his delivery. I always felt like the show was intentionally making fun of how different they are, like Oliver is always wondering what planet Curtis is from.

Trump would work too! Any powerful figure who thinks s/he can run roughshod over others due to that power fits in there. Why limit it??

I think your take on Oliver and Curtis is a really good one. The solution should be to lock them together in a story plot and leave them to hash things out, coming to a better understanding afterwards.

But as others have pointed out, the writers seem more reluctant to mix and match the various Team Arrow members with one another. And you could make the same argument with Team Flash and Team Supergirl as well (although maybe TF less so than the others). Maybe it's because the leads have to have so much presence per episode, which makes it difficult to write credible B and C plots that shake up the others, not to mention A plots rotating these others with the leads.

Legends, in contrast, has no lead in terms of plot. Lotz and Routh are arguably the contracted leads in terms of pay, promotion, public presence, etc., but in terms of plot lines (not character arcs, mind) everyone's pretty much equal on the Waverider. They can showcase whatever characters they want to fit the plot, and others can take a back seat that episode. Mick was barely there in Episode 6 of this season, but had a major plot line with Nate in Episode 7. Sara, on the other hand, was in a coma in Ep 7 and barely showed up. Ray didn't have much presence in the crossover, but he was the focus in Ep 4 and a supporting presence in Ep 5. Jax was supporting in Ep 5, but in the A plot for Ep 6. So they have the freedom to toss their characters around like dice and see how they shake out in terms of dynamics and relationships.

Edited December 10, 2017 by Miss Dee

[quarks]

1 hour ago, tofutan said:

Yep, he does have various "story by" credits on both shows. Including both first episodes of the current season. 

 

"Story by" does not mean "script." "Story by" means he came up with the plot and other writers wrote the script.  Kreisberg hasn't scripted any episodes of either show this season.

1 hour ago, tofutan said:

The question is: is that what Ken describes realistic, that they would be blocked from shooting episodes that he didn't even have "Story By" levels of involvement? 

 

Nope.

They wouldn't even be blocked from shooting episodes that he fully scripted.  They might not want to shoot those episodes - that's different - but in this particular case, WB owns the scripts and the characters and can pretty much do what they want with them. Including "throw them in to a trash fire."

The situation would be slightly different if we were talking a fully original series/film. (And even then, WB could exercise an extension option and continue to tie up the rights.) But even with the multiple lawsuits over the Superman trademark, there's really no question that the main characters of Supergirl and Flash belong exclusively to DC/WB.  

[tofutan]

Yeah, I have trouble buying that the story is like Ken describes. I'm just confused why he seems to be so sure of it. 

Even if the situation was different and they don't want the episodes, as was described here it seems hard to buy that they would risk the shooting schedule for it. And if there are no legal problems in regards to "they can't use this legally because Kreisberg came up with it", then there's really no reason why they couldn't just try to rewrite stuff over the holidays if that's what they really want and just shoot whatever they can in January. 

However if that is the case, then we still don't have an explanation for why Supergirl is interrupted by Legends other than that's what the CW wants. 

Quote

Legends, in contrast, has no lead in terms of plot. Lotz and Routh are arguably the contracted leads in terms of pay, promotion, public presence, etc., but in terms of plot lines (not character arcs, mind) everyone's pretty much equal on the Waverider. They can showcase whatever characters they want to fit the plot, and others can take a back seat that episode. Mick was barely there in Episode 6 of this season, but had a major plot line with Nate in Episode 7. Sara, on the other hand, was in a coma in Ep 7 and barely showed up. Ray didn't have much presence in the crossover, but he was the focus in Ep 4 and a supporting presence in Ep 5. Jax was supporting in Ep 5, but in the A plot for Ep 6. So they have the freedom to toss their characters around like dice and see how they shake out in terms of dynamics and relationships.

I've always seen Rip and Sara as the defacto leads of Legends. It's just the leads on Legends doesn't necessarily translate to most screentime all the time. It's more like Captain Picard on Star Trek versus Riker and Data. Picard was the lead but Data in particularly still got a lot of episodes dedicated to him. 

I always find it a bit sad how often I run into people who suggest that Legends should be "improved" by focusing on fewer characters and few main storylines. Which to me would kind of ruin what makes Legends so unique, it would make it basically like all the other shows. 

Edited December 10, 2017 by tofutan

[tarotx]

I'm sure Ken is just wrong but perhaps in the wake of the AK sexual harassment trouble, they want to make sure Supergirl is treated much better than she was last year. They want to go in and clean up any perception of this issue in AK's female leading show. So far there doesn't seem to be much dealing with how Kara is treated by her love interest. But that seems to be something headed her way. I'm not remotely close to being up to date though so I could be wrong.

While Flash is guy leading so not as important to fix. Small changes here and there would do wonders for this issue there.

[Primal Slayer]

With how in love these EPs are with the buffyverse, I'm surprised they haven't tried (or at least succeedd) in trying to get any of them to write for any of the shows. 

[tofutan]

The thing is, who is going to do that? Queller and Rovner just don't strike me as strong/passionate enough about anything. And Berlanti to me doesn't come across like he has any emotional investment in Supergirl. So I doubt he would care. The upcoming Brainiac 5 episode, I doubt they are going to change much there, it's been written and finished for a while and still very much from a time where Kreisberg still had his position. 

To me Queller/Rovner seem at the most to care about Sam, so if something changes, I could picture it being that maybe originally she was supposed to die and maybe now she won't. Which might be good for Alex if they scrap the whole Alex getting a kid thing. Or not. Depending on where that plot comes from. I could see them de-emphasizing the whole triangle aspect this season, but then again, to me the triangle comes across as pretty de-emphasized already. 

Quote

With how in love these EPs are with the buffyverse, I'm surprised they haven't tried (or at least succeedd) in trying to get any of them to write for any of the shows. 

Marti Noxon and Julie Plec are like my two goto names when it comes to  "female show runners are not a ward against shitty misogynist writing"

Speaking of shitty showrunners ... I wonder if Shannara Chronicles will get a third season and if not, what Gough and Millar will do next. (add them as another bullet I hope will be dodged)

Edited December 10, 2017 by tofutan

[tv echo]

Warner Bros. Reveals DC Comics Movie Slate
By JAMIE LOVETT - December 10, 2017
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/12/10/dc-comics-movies-upcoming/

Quote

Today at Comic Con Experience 2017 in Sao Paulo, Brazil, Warner Bros. revealed its upcoming movies coming from DC Films.
*  *  *
Warner Bros. began by referencing its biggest DC Comics success so far, Wonder Woman, by showing a title card for the Wonder Woman sequel that showed the logo flanked by Roman columns. There was no “2” in the title, suggesting Wonder Woman 2 may not be the film’s official title.

Additionally, the title card for Aquaman was shown. Aquaman will be the next DC Extended Universe movie out of the gate, arriving in 2018.

The title card for Flashpoint was shown, indicating that DC Films is moving forward with plans to turn The Flash film into an event. That was followed by Justice League Dark, suggesting progress is still being made towards bringing the mystical side of the DC Universe to live-action.

Suicide Squad 2 was teased with a title card, as well as the upcoming Batgirl movie, Shazam, Green Lantern Corps, and The Batman.
*  *  *
Conspicuously absent from the list was the previously announced Cyborg movie, as well as the second Justice League movie. There was also no mention of any other of the Suicide Squad spinoff movies – Gotham City Sirens, the Harley Quinn solo movie, the Harley and Joker team-up movie, and the rumored Deadshot solo were all absent.

The villain-centric Black Adam and Deathstroke movies were also absent from the list, as was the solo Joker movie, though that film will not be a part of the DC Extended Universe, which may explain its absence.

Edited December 10, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Edited December 11, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Two Marvel spoilers for Infinity War and Spider-Man at Comic Con Experience 2017 in Sao Paolo this weekend...

Spoiler

Edited December 10, 2017 by tv echo

[scarynikki12]

33 minutes ago, tv echo said:

Conspicuously absent from the list was the previously announced Cyborg movie, as well as the second Justice League movie. There was also no mention of any other of the Suicide Squad spinoff movies – Gotham City Sirens

I was afraid of that.  A year ago they announced that they were fast tracking a Harley movie, then said it would be a Sirens movie, and then nothing.  I'm glad Batgirl is still on the schedule (more likely due to Whedon than anything else) but they need to embrace the one area where they've not only beaten Marvel but kicked ass while doing it: female superhero movies.  Whatever else happens, they should be making female centered movies and rubbing Marvel's nose in it.  But it looks like they're hesitating here too. 

[tv echo]

These two Vanity Fair articles are very lengthy and contain a lot of history (plus pics) - I only quoted a few portions, believe it or not (Avengers: Infinity War stars are gracing the 4 variant covers of the new Vanity Fair issue)...

Secrets of the Marvel Universe
by JOANNA ROBINSON  NOVEMBER 27, 2017 7:00 AM
https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/11/marvel-cover-story

Quote

On a sweltering October weekend, the largest-ever group of Marvel superheroes and friends gathered just outside of Atlanta for a top-secret assignment. Eighty-three of the famous faces who have brought Marvel’s comic-book characters to life over the past decade mixed and mingled—Mark Ruffalo, who plays the Hulk, bonded with Vin Diesel, the voice of Groot, the monosyllabic sapling from Guardians of the Galaxy. Angela Bassett, mother to Chadwick Boseman’s Black Panther, flew through hurricane-like conditions to report for duty alongside Robert Downey Jr., Scarlett Johansson, Gwyneth Paltrow, Brie Larson, Paul Rudd, Jeremy Renner, Laurence Fishburne, and Stan Lee, the celebrated comic-book writer and co-creator of Iron Man, Spider-Man, Doctor Strange, the Fantastic Four, and the X-Men.

Their mission: to strike a heroic pose to commemorate 10 years of unprecedented moviemaking success. Marvel Studios, which kicked things off with Iron Man in 2008, has released 17 films that collectively have grossed more than $13 billion at the global box office; 5 more movies are due out in the next two years. The sprawling franchise has resuscitated careers (Downey), has minted new stars (Tom Hiddleston), and increasingly attracts an impressive range of A-list talent, from art-house favorites (Benedict Cumberbatch and Tilda Swinton in Doctor Strange) to Hollywood icons (Anthony Hopkins and Robert Redford) to at least three handsome guys named Chris (Hemsworth, Evans, and Pratt). The wattage at the photo shoot was so high that Ant-Man star Michael Douglas—Michael Douglas!—was collecting autographs. (Photographer Jason Bell shot Vanity Fair’s own Marvel portfolio shortly afterward.)
*  *  *
But it wasn’t Samuel L. Jackson’s Nick Fury or even Chris Evans’s Captain America who assembled Earth’s mightiest heroes. They came for Kevin Feige, the unassuming man in a black baseball cap who took Marvel Studios from an underdog endeavor with a roster of B-list characters to a cinematic empire that is the envy of every other studio in town. Feige’s innovative, comic-book-based approach to blockbuster moviemaking—having heroes from one film bleed into the next—has changed not only the way movies are made but also pop culture at large. Fans can’t get enough of a world where space-hopping Guardians of the Galaxy might turn up alongside earthbound Avengers, or Doctor Strange and Black Panther could cross paths via a mind-bending rift in the space-time continuum. Other studios, most notably Warner Bros., with the Justice League, have tried to create their own web of interconnected characters. Why have so many failed to achieve Marvel’s heights? “Simple,” said Joe Russo, co-director of Avengers 3 and 4. “They don’t have a Kevin.”
*  *  *
Before Feige, Marvel Studios wasn’t even making its own films. Created in 1993 as Marvel Films, the movie arm of the comics company simply licensed its characters to other studios, earning most of its money from merchandise sales. (The popular 2002 Sam Raimi-directed Spider-Man movie, for example, was made by Sony’s Columbia Pictures.) Feige was part of the team that pushed for the studio to take full creative control of its library of beloved characters, a risky move at the time. “For us old-timers—me and Robert [Downey] and Gwyneth [Paltrow] and Kevin—it felt like we were the upper-classmen,” Jon Favreau, director of the first two Iron Man movies, told me shortly after the photo shoot. “We were emotional . . . thinking about how precarious it all felt in the beginning.”
*  *  *
After Avengers 4, an ambitious multi-franchise crossover movie slated for release in 2019, at least some of the original characters who sit at the center of the billion-dollar Avengers team will be hanging up their capes and shields. That’s partially because the Marvel contracts with the actors who play them—Evans (Captain America), Ruffalo (Hulk), Downey (Iron Man), Johansson (Black Widow), Hemsworth (Thor), and Renner (Hawkeye)—are coming to an end. Meanwhile, DC Comics’ Wonder Woman, one of the top-grossing films of 2017, proved that Marvel doesn’t have a monopoly on beloved superhero icons.
*  *  *
Feige said he had long believed in the storytelling potential of weaving together Marvel’s superheroes and plots—in essence bringing that Marvel-universe poster to life. His hunch was validated by the media coverage around the astonishing $ 98 million opening weekend of Iron Man. Samuel L. Jackson’s brief appearance in that movie as Nick Fury, director of a counterterrorism agency central to the Marvel universe, initially was meant as an Easter egg, a knowing wink, for die-hard fans. “We put it at the end so it wouldn’t be distracting,” Feige said of the post-credits stinger that launched a decade-long trend. But after he saw how audiences—not just devoted comics fans—responded to Fury’s appearance, Feige knew the idea of cross-pollinating characters and movies had legs.

One early challenge was getting actors to sign up for Marvel’s ambitious vision. A character might star in one film, be part of an ensemble in another, and just make a goofy guest appearance in yet another. Jackson signed an unheard-of nine-picture deal with Marvel shortly after Iron Man came out, ensuring his participation in the subsequent Avengers movies and other Marvel properties. Feige found it particularly challenging to secure Chris Evans as Captain America, a character who acts as leader of the Avengers. Evans, who’d previously tackled the comic-book genre as Johnny Storm in the Fantastic Four movies, was hesitant to sign a long-term deal that would prevent him from doing other projects. Evans asked for a weekend to make his decision—Feige cited those few days as among the most nerve-racking of his tenure—before committing to six movies. Once Hemsworth agreed to play Thor, another foundational Avenger, Feige’s grand plan was under way. (It doesn’t hurt that Marvel contracts can be supremely lucrative. Robert Downey Jr. reportedly made $ 80 million in 2015, thanks largely to his work as Iron Man.)
*  *  *
One week before the Marvel 10th-anniversary photo shoot, on the set of Avengers 4, I watched Marvel’s biggest stars lounge on comfy couches under a canopy in the long stretches between takes. Mark Ruffalo scratched Scarlett Johansson’s back, while Johansson, Chris Evans, and several other Avengers hunched over their phones in a competitive game of Words with Friends. I reached for a camera to record the moment—some of the most famous faces in the world lit up by phone screens just like the rest of us—but the ever vigilant Marvel security team had wrapped my phone in layers of protective tape. Later, Chris Hemsworth mentioned that very moment to me. “I thought, Could somebody take a photo of this? We’re all aware that this is going to be the last time we get to hang out like this.”
*  *  *
While Feige refused to reveal any details about the characters and stories Marvel has yet to introduce, he did promise a definitive end to the franchise that built Marvel. Avengers 4, he said, will “bring things you’ve never seen in superhero films: a finale.” This may mean a lot of dead Avengers at the hands of the villain Thanos, who has appeared sporadically and tantalizingly since the first Avengers movie back in 2012. But the Marvel Cinematic Universe will live on. “There will be two distinct periods. Everything before Avengers 4 and everything after. I know it will not be in ways people are expecting,” Feige teased.

   

What RoboCop Has to Do with the Future of the Marvel Cinematic Universe
by JOANNA ROBINSON  NOVEMBER 28, 2017 
https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2017/11/the-future-of-the-marvel-cinematic-universe-robocop

Quote

Kevin Feige on literally what’s next, in case you need a refresher on the upcoming Marvel roster:
Nothing is more important than finishing what we started. Nothing is more important than completing the task. Thor: Ragnarok is done, thankfully. Black Panther [February 2018] is well on its way. Doing some additional photography soon for that. Captain Marvel story is coming together very well and is finding itself for its March [2019] release, and Joe and Anthony [Russo] are doing Avengers: Infinity War [May 2018] and Avengers 4 [May 2019], the two biggest movies of all time back-to-back. I don’t really know if they’re the biggest movies of all time, but two very big movies back-to-back at the same time. It all feels good, and then [Ant-Man and the] Wasp [July 2018] is going to complete filming. Black Panther has started and finished. Ant-Man and the Wasp will have started and finished in the period in which Avengers is still going. It started before both of those and will end after both of those. That’s the task at hand.
*  *  *
Avengers 3 and 4 co-director Joe Russo on just how many characters and story lines will be involved in the two-part crossover films:
We’ll take blame for the scale, because we were pushing for it. We were pushing to make it bigger, we were pushing it, saying, “Look, what you’ve done is an impressive narrative over 10 years, and why shouldn’t this involve every character?” It should be the culmination, so in some way, we have to touch on everyone in their story, or their theme. It has to be woven in, in some way. You can’t really look back and go, Hey, remember the last time that somebody took 12 franchises and blended them together and told the movie with 60 lead characters? So that’s the challenge, and you have to create your own structure for a story like that. You look at Lord of the Rings, or you can look at [Robert Altman’s] Nashville, but there is no real template for it.

Avengers 3 and 4 co-director Anthony Russo on his involvement with the future of the franchise:
We’re not participating in any thought whatsoever about what happens after these movies. So we know who we’re allowed to kill, and that’s about it. I don’t even think Marvel had any ideas about where they would go after [Avengers 3 and 4]. It’s not an end for all of these characters; it’s an end for some of these characters. So some of these characters will go on. So it’s more complicated, that’s why it’s not a clean ending.

Kevin Feige on the ending:
How can you have both an ongoing cinematic universe that continues to make films and, at the same time, occasionally bring things to a head? Something you’ve never really seen in superhero films is a conclusion. Is a finale. You’ve seen those in Lord of the Rings films. You’ve seen those in Harry Potter films, in Star Wars. Logan did it a little bit with that character. We thought it would be important to bring the current three-Phase, 22-movie current series to a conclusion. How do I say this? There will be two distinct periods between everything before Avengers 4 and everything after. I know it will not be in ways people are expecting.

Guardians of the Galaxy director James Gunn on the different directors and the potential body count in the Avengers films:
I think part of that is also the natural evolution of the series. You can’t keep making movies that are too similar. You can’t make the same movie over and over again. If Marvel is going to survive, they have to start making movies with characters who are a little different. They have to start allowing characters to die. They have to start having stakes really mean something if they want people to stay interested.

Was the death of Yondu in Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 getting us ready for a pile of dead Avengers?
It might be doing that in effect. It was not meant to do that in intent.
*  *  *
Kevin Feige on any concerns about Marvel being able to raise the bar after the high stakes and potentially high body count of Avengers 3 and 4.
I also think that was a concern that we had after the first Avengers. Are people going to be open to a single character once they’ve seen all of that? I think we’ve already proved it now, having gotten through all of Phase Two, and now midway through Phase Three, that they do. The way you do that is we went in on a full Tony Stark P.T.S.D. singular story line with [Iron Man 3]. That’s what we’ll continue to do post the next Avengers movies, is dig into different kinds of characters, different aspects of current characters, to keep things as fresh as they’ve ever been. And that’s what’s exciting about the next decade or so that we’ve planned out. Twenty-two movies in, and we’ve got another 20 movies on the docket that are completely different than anything that’s come before. Intentionally.
*  *  *
Ant-Man and the Wasp star Evangeline Lilly on the changing tone of the Marvel Cinematic Universe:
Frankly, if it wasn’t Kevin at the helm, I think I would be very, very nervous to be losing these pillars and the people who paved a way for characters like the Wasp. When he walked me through the general story arc of Infinity War, it dawned on me: oh, I understand now, we’re moving into this new Phase. The color of that new Phase can be clearly seen emerging through Ant-Man, Guardians of the Galaxy, and Thor: Ragnarok. It’s just a more colorful, more playful, heightened reality that we’re going to enter.

Robert Downey Jr. on which Avengers 4 actor has most embraced that tone:
I mean, I don’t even know how to express my joy at Chris’s vibe right now. Hemsworth. Dude, it’s just too great.
*  *  *
Kevin Feige on Joss Whedon, Gunn’s future role, and the relationships between the Marvel directors:
Anna [Boden] and Ryan [Fleck] are working on Captain Marvel and talking to Taika [Waititi], who’s just finished Ragnarok, talking with Ryan Coogler, who’s in the midst of post-production on Panther. So there is that back and forth, which I like. Peyton [Reed] going over and seeing Joe and Anthony [Russo] because they’re on the same lot at Pinewood. With Joss it was more unique. It was more of a sort of a contractual thing as part of his deal on Avengers 2 that he would help us oversee it. There’s not that with James. But what there is with James is that camaraderie and the notion that a lot of what’s been done in Guardians and a lot of the great characters that we’ve done in Guardians could have potential as their own things. Working with James to figure out where those could go and how that could work has certainly been part of our discussions.
*  *  *
Disney C.E.O. Bob Iger on where, physically, Marvel will go next and the Avengers/Guardians team up:
We’re looking for completely different realms within Marvel. The Guardians represented that initially, although they’re coming together with the Avengers in the Avengers film that’s coming up. But now we’re looking for worlds that are completely separate from the worlds we’ve already visited. They can be separate geographically, or separate in time—not just in place but in time. So there’s almost, it’s not quite infinite, but the directions we could go are extraordinary.
*  *  *
Mark Ruffalo:
Kevin brought me in and they’re like, “If you had a stand-alone Hulk movie, what would you like to do in it?” And I kinda laid out what I thought would be interesting to explore. And they said, “O.K., let’s do that starting at Thor 3 and carry that all the way to the end of Infinity War.” So you’ll have a character arc. It’ll be Banner’s story, it’ll be as if he had a stand-alone movie, but we’ll bury it in three different movies.

Edited December 11, 2017 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

Are they going to use Flashpoint to try and reset their movie universe?

[Primal Slayer]

52 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I was afraid of that.  A year ago they announced that they were fast tracking a Harley movie, then said it would be a Sirens movie, and then nothing.  I'm glad Batgirl is still on the schedule (more likely due to Whedon than anything else) but they need to embrace the one area where they've not only beaten Marvel but kicked ass while doing it: female superhero movies.  Whatever else happens, they should be making female centered movies and rubbing Marvel's nose in it.  But it looks like they're hesitating here too. 

Embracing female superhero movies is definitely a must but they need to get a team that understands the characters. If they had gotten Joss Whedon.....it probably would've been terrible since going by his OG WW script back in the day...he didn't get her. But I think he will get Batgirl so I'm not as worried. 

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

Are they going to use Flashpoint to try and reset their movie universe?

Almost positively, and they will probably use it to make Batman younger and phase Affleck out. I don't see him being part of The Batman.

[scarynikki12]

3 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Are they going to use Flashpoint to try and reset their movie universe?

If they don't they're complete idiots.  I'd normally follow up with a "so of course they won't" but, due to the Affleck wanting out rumors, I think there's a good chance that's why it was chosen.

[Morrigan2575]

Makes sense but, man that's totally sad that they have to reboot their universe already. 

Meanwhile I'm over here trying to figure out how Marvel can use Avengers 4 to reset the universe and bring in Fantastic Four/X-Men (please!).

[Primal Slayer]

I dont think there is any real way they can bring X-Men into the fold this late in the game unless Mutants are just exposed to the public. FF...I feel like that could be done fairly easily but I feel like Captain Marvel will take that idea with them having disappear for a decade before coming back to the present as if no time had gone by.

[scarynikki12]

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Makes sense but, man that's totally sad that they have to reboot their universe already.

Just Batman.  I doubt anyone/thing else would be affected. 

My guess is that Marvel will go with a parallel universe or have the mutant gene be newly discovered if they do get the rights to the X-verse.  I don't know anything about Fantastic Four so I can't comment on ways to bring them in.

[Featherhat]

Does Flashpoint work if we don't know the movie!Flash that well and it's his first solo story? I can see them wanting to reset things but there's a reason the TV series didn't do it in the 2nd episode. 

[catrox14]

I don't know why they would have to make him younger per se. I mean any actor between 35 and 50 can play Batman unless they want to go younger after The Batman. 

[scarynikki12]

6 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

Does Flashpoint work if we don't know the movie!Flash that well and it's his first solo story? I can see them wanting to reset things but there's a reason the TV series didn't do it in the 2nd episode. 

I don't think you'll need to be familiar with movie Barry.  He was funny and upbeat in Justice League but they didn't go into major character focus.  The question for me is if Flashpoint will work and I think it depends on how the movie is presented.  If they keep the focus on how Barry shouldn't be playing god, no matter how understandable his reasons are, then it could work really well.  If they use it for Shenanigans! and lampshade why Barry fixes his mistake, then it could be a disaster.

2 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I don't know why they would have to make him younger per se. I mean any actor between 35 and 50 can play Batman unless they want to go younger after The Batman. 

I think they'll go younger for two reasons: 1) they won't be using The Dark Knight Returns as inspiration anymore and, 2) they'll want their new actor long term.  I think they'll go for a late twenties/early thirties actor like when Bale was cast for Begins. 

[Sakura12]

I think doing a Flashpoint movie would be a mistake. The general audience has proven they don't care about these characters with the failure of Justice League. None of them are going to turn up to see a movie where the few characters they do know are completely different. If they want to do a reboot, then cut their losses and do a hard reboot. They can continue with their one success Wonder Woman since it takes place in the past. Just make no mention of the future and they should be okay. Obviously they have Aquaman in the can so they have to release that, afterward they should just start over and take their time this time. 

[Primal Slayer]

14 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

I was actually just thinking about that earlier today. Over on Legends of Tomorrow, the gang heads to a future where ARGUS is running the world as a fascist state where metahumans are hunted, imprisoned, and experimented on, and just being a metahuman is illegal, and you apparently lose all rights by being one. In fact, considering new team member Zari was trying to save her brother, who was jailed for using magic, and the creepy ARGUS drones of doom tried to arrest non metahumans Sara, Mick, and Ray under some kind of anti metahuman act that had them all on a "arrest, lock up, and throw away the key" list, I assume that all metahumans, aliens, heroes, magic users, or anyone associated with them were locked up as well. Now, what I am wondering, is if Oliver's FBI issues are somehow tied into this? We know that ARGUS is a shady government agency, but under Lyla, its become slightly less sketchy, but who knows how long Lyla will have it? What if there are already people in ARGUS who are hoping to get rid of all these superheroes/villains/whoever, or use them for their own goals? What if there are people in other agencies, like the FBI, who feel the same way? What if this angry FBI lady (who clearly has a MASSIVE hate on for vigilantes) is pushing this prosecution of vigilantes not because she wants to leave law enforcement to professionals, but because its the first step to get rid of all vigilantes and metas and everyone else, or using them for their own nefarious purposes? Maybe this is the start of the ARGUS world we saw in LoT? 

Of course, its fully possible that the future has already been changed, and none of that will even happen, or that these things are totally unconnected, but I feel like ARGUS is a concept that can be used better, and could become more of a threat. It could even be a decent subject for next years cross over. So, if by next season all our heroes are living their own personal Stranger Things Hell, I guess we can all thank Rene #thanksrene. 

Bringing this over here since it also has to do with Legends somewhat. This is a storyline that I want them to really explore and have someone replace Lyla at the top who is more hardcore. We know that the Arrowverse loves them some Marvel so doing their own version of the "Superhero Registration". Have some metahuman accidentally kill a whole bunch people over on The Flash and then it is something that can lead up to the annual crossover event with the heroes split down the middle. 

Argus has played a role in all 3 shows but as of late it has become a bit of a joke with everyone breaking in and taking whatever they want.

[tennisgurl]

@Primal Slayer I think that would be the start of a really cool story, although I dont know if they would go full Civil War on us. For one thing, even when the Arrowverse wants to copy Marvel, they at least try to be a little subtle about it, and for another thing, I cant see many of the characters getting behind an ARGUS that is hunting people down and arresting people for just having powers, evil or not. Maybe some would be alright with just a superhero registry, but if the Legends show up and say "hey, we saw where this goes, and its all kinds of not good" I think everyone will be on the same side, more or less. On the other hand, maybe if Argus sold it in a specific way, they could? 

I think making Argus a major threat, and building up a reoccurring story line throughout the three Earth 1 shows (where Argus is an established presence in all of them) that will culminate in the crossover event, could be a really interesting story, Civil War style, or them just declaring war on superheros, or something else. Argus has tons of potential, and it feels like its just scratching the surface. Plus, Supergirl has already done some "government types want to hurt aliens" stuff, so she could slip into this story easily as well. 

[Primal Slayer]

I think with anything, it always starts out small and slowly grows over time, so if this were a storyline they were to tackle, I would expect it to start out with Argus requesting all Meta's/Superheroes register or have The Flash be like Supergirl and be an employee of Argus and it all go down from there.

[tennisgurl]

Yeah, I could see it starting off small (I think Barry has already done a few favors for Argus in past episodes) and then by the time the heroes realize whats actually happening, its too late to stop it. Then when the Legends stop by for a beer run or something, they see that Argus is requesting registration of meta humans/magic users/costumes, or that Barry has let them know who he and the rest of his team are (and maybe everyone else as well), they tell them where this is going, but by then its too late. If they committed to this, it could be an awesome story. 

Edited December 11, 2017 by tennisgurl

[tv echo]

[tv echo]

Two scenes from the first 6 episodes...

Freedom Fighters: The Ray | The Ray vs. Flash | CW Seed
Published on Dec 9, 2017, by CW Seed

Freedom Fighters: The Ray | Tornado Hologram | CW Seed
Published on Dec 10, 2017, by CW Seed

[tv echo]

'Justice League' Cast Wants A Smackdown With The Avengers
By JAMIE LOVETT - December 11, 2017
http://comicbook.com/dc/2017/12/11/justice-league-vs-avengers/

Quote

Jason Momoa (Aquaman), Ray Fisher (Cyborg), Gal Gadot (Wonder Woman), and Henry Cavill (Superman) were in attendance at ACE Comic Con over the weekend and, during a panel, they were asked about the idea of a Justice League vs. the Avengers smackdown. The cast seemed up to the challenge.
*  *  *
“Aw, yeah man,” says Momoa. “Hell yeah. I absolutely want to get thrown around by the Hulk. And then I want to take his ass out the ocean and drown him. ‘Not so tough now, are ya, punk?!’ And then we’ll be friends.

“We’re all very much friends with those other actors from [Chris] Hemsworth to Robert Downey, I mean all of them, and so its just fun. I mean we’re superheroes. We’re having an awesome time playing great characters.”

“Smackdown? Yeah,” Fisher says. “I mean if there was a fight between the two groups, I’m fairly certain Superman and Wonder Woman would probably take maybe 90 percent of them out. [Cyborg and Aquaman would be] cheerleading on the side. Cyborg would play the foghorn.

“I mean, we all talk about it. Its the same argument about who’s faster, Superman or the Flash, you know? There’s any given circumstance where either team would be able to win. But its fun to just have that kind of fantasy.”

“For sure, I would love that,” Gadot says. “I think the more the merrier. All of these characters are great, you know, we’re not enemies. There’s DC and there’s Marvel and they’re all great and we can do DC-Marvel, starting with DC, and then everything would be super-awesome.”

Cavill decided to put the question to the fans in attendance. By a show of hands and volume of noise, he attempted to determine whether Marvel or DC would win in a smackdown. The crowd was decidedly behind DC, thought to be fair, that universe had a bit of a home turf advantage given that it was a Justice League panel.

Edited December 11, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Justice League panel at ACE Comic Con on Sunday (Dec. 10) - videos posted by Mike Brunn...

Justice League - Comic Con Panel Pt 1 Gadot Wonder Woman Cavill Superman Momoa Aquaman Fisher Cyborg

-- The panelists talked about their positive fan experiences. 

-- GGadot researched Wonder Woman when she got the part, but found it hard "to relate to a god... [however,] at the end of the day, she has the heart of a human."

-- JMomoa confirmed the mod's statement that Aquaman has "a very different look and a very different tone." He just wrapped up the movie with director James Wan.

-- Per RFisher, "things are in development" with the Cyborg movie, and he was looking forward "to grow his character."

-- Per HCavill, his character as seen in Justice League is the "essence of Superman which, I think, needs to be protected." He said that everything else around Superman can be changed, "but the essence of joy and hope and humane - aspirational character and inspirational character, those are the things that are most important to me."

-- GG was humble about the iconic status and popularity of her portrayal of Wonder Woman. She said that she viewed herself as a "vessel" for the character and that she's just an actress, she's not a doctor and not really saving people. However, she liked the message of love and inclusiveness.

-- When the mod asked the panel to describe the "family" that was formed by the cast while working on Justice League, GG said, "complicated," and HC said, "dysfunctional." But JM disagreed with the "dysfunctional" description. He and RF said some nice, positive stuff about working with the cast. Then HC added some nice stuff about working with the cast.

Justice League - Comic Con Panel Pt 2 Gadot Wonder Woman Cavill Superman Momoa Aquaman Fisher Cyborg

-- JM joked about the cast being mostly English and therefore very "professional." 

-- The panel then discussed a "smackdown" between Justice League and the Avengers (summarized in above-posted ComicBook.com article).

-- The panel would love to use Wonder Woman's magic lasso on some politicians. 

-- Per HC, the most important thing for him was, when Superman returned, that he found a "new lease on life, through death," so he returned as the Superman character "who we know and love from the comics... the guy who makes us believe in hope and that the world is going to be okay."

-- GG said that Amy Adams is "so funny" and has a "great sense of humor." GG was very excited to work with Robin Wright because she grew up watching Princess Bride.

-- RF did a lot of theater work before Justice League and thought that experience helped him play the "physicality" of Cyborg.

-- Mod said that, unlike Captain America and Iron Man, we know a lot about the parents of the panelists' characters and those parental relationships affect their characters.

-- HC said that playing Superman has changed him and how he views everything in the world. He now "tries a lot harder to bring out the absolutely best in everyone" and now "gives a lot more hugs than he used to." He said that Superman was an "aspirational character."

Edited December 11, 2017 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

They'll get their wish when Infinity War box office lays the smack down on JL. ?

[Primal Slayer]

36 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

They'll get their wish when Infinity War box office lays the smack down on JL. ?

 That part won't be hard lol.

It is really sad to see them together doing cons since this is most likely the last time they will ever be together again since JL ain't getting a sequel anytime soon and half of them will probably be leaving the DCEU. 

[tofutan]

Quote

At the recent ACE Comic Con, a fan asked Arrow Executive Producer Marc Guggenheim if we will be seeing a crossover… and here’s what he said:

“Great question, again, above my pay grade. I will say this, the one thing I’ve learned is ‘never say never.’ I could not begin to tell you how often we say to each other, ‘We never thought any of this was going to happen. We never thought we’d see all these characters. We never thought there’d be a universe.’ So, never say never, but in terms of which characters be on which shows, what’s part of the universe, above my pay grade and probably that’s a good thing.”

COULD TITANS CROSS OVER WITH THE ARROWVERSE?

[Morrigan2575]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

 That part won't be hard lol.

It is really sad to see them together doing cons since this is most likely the last time they will ever be together again since JL ain't getting a sequel anytime soon and half of them will probably be leaving the DCEU. 

That is kind of sad, it's really not their fault and they seem to have our effort into promoting the show. 

[tennisgurl]

I feel bad for most of the DCEU actors, especially the newbies in Justice League. You can tell they put real effort into their roles and into promoting the movie, and that they really enjoy being in this franchise, and they really did do a good job. Its not the actors fault that their franchise is a total mess. 

[Primal Slayer]

It really sucks that WB let Synder run this into the ground just because they wanted to get that bonus. He should've been replaced after MoS disappointed at the box office.