S11.E01: The Proposal Proposal

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

Seconding CleoCaesar. Not saying divorce is a great experience, but the freedom to leave a bad/unhealthy marriage is great for society. A real mark of a society that produces healthy, happy marriages is one with a low divorce rate PLUS little to no stigma attached to divorce. 

[AnnaRose]

12 hours ago, CherryAmes said:

Amy knows her Sheldon.  She thinks he's a catch.**  She's aware of his flaws but she loves him anyway.  I don't think that's a bad thing.

True.  I recently watched an episode from a few seasons back, and Amy told Sheldon that she thinks his personality quirks, which other people find rage-inducing, are adorable. 

[TeaTV]

On 9/30/2017 at 4:57 AM, dcc.fan.always said:

I think Amy is a fool for saying yes

I think the whole Shamy relationship teaches women to “stand by your man” no matter how narcissistic and misogynistic he is.

On 9/27/2017 at 7:17 AM, OtterMommy said:

Bernadette is from a strict typical Catholic family, so I think it goes unsaid.

Also, abortion isn't usually sit-com fodder.

Strict? Let’s not forget Bernadette engaged in coitus for years before she married plus many other “mortal” sins including using birth control and never attending Mass except for during the Baptism where non-Catholics were Godparents. IMO, they make a mockery of the faith.

[CherryAmes]

Does Bernadette ever state that she is living, or trying to live, a Catholic lifestyle (however that gets defined?) because if not I don't see any mocking going on.

[TeaTV]

8 minutes ago, CherryAmes said:

Does Bernadette ever state that she is living, or trying to live, a Catholic lifestyle (however that gets defined?) because if not I don't see any mocking going on.

She’s never stated it but she had her child Baptized so that would indicated she’s trying to live a Catholic lifestyle even though she wasn’t married by a Catholic priest—which is another moral sin since the marriage would not be recognized by the church making any children illegitimate in the eyes of the church.

[Katy M]

1 hour ago, TVwithTea said:

She’s never stated it but she had her child Baptized so that would indicated she’s trying to live a Catholic lifestyle even though she wasn’t married by a Catholic priest—which is another moral sin since the marriage would not be recognized by the church making any children illegitimate in the eyes of the church.

She's a non-practicing, or lapsed, Catholic, meaning she was raised in the faith, but doesn't follow or believe in in now.  she may have had her child baptized because her parents wanted her to and she didn't see the harm in it.  But, as you mentioned, she had premarital sex, she married someone of a different faith, we've never seen her in a church, we've never seen her pray, we've never seen her go to confession or mention it, we've never seen her with rosary beads.  OK, I'm not Catholic, so that's about as far as I can go with that.

[CherryAmes]

I raised my kids Catholic and they went to Catholic schools but my uber Catholic mother and I didn't manage to guilt either of them into getting married in a church or having their kids baptized.  Where did we fail?  Lol.   With regard to Hally and being baptized - do we ever actually see them getting her baptized?  All we know is they asked Raj to be a godfather.  You'd assume this would mean they actually had a church ceremony but since they didn't actually have a church wedding - unless there was a priest on the rooftop and I didn't see him! - I suspect they were honouring Raj with a title but didn't do anything more formal.

[Winston Wolfe]

On 9/28/2017 at 1:38 PM, NYCFree said:

Bronx Science Whoot Whoot!

Class of 1984, Jon Favreau was my class (as yet unseen at any reunions I've attended). 

Brooklyn Tech Man here, Class of 1980!  Seems like we always played second (or Third) Fiddle to you guys and the Stuyvesant crew back in the day.

But on the plus side, Lou Ferrigno is one of our alumni!

Jon Favreau doesn't seem like a reunion kind of guy, IMO

Edited October 1, 2017 by Winston Wolfe

[anna0852]

5 hours ago, TVwithTea said:

I think the whole Shamy relationship teaches women to “stand by your man” no matter how narcissistic and misogynistic he is.

I've always thought the show did a pretty good job of Amy drawing the line of what she will and will not tolerate from Sheldon. While she does put up with some of his quirks she certainly does not put up with all of them and she's very quick to make it clear when something is not okay. And she is about the only person other than Penny and his mother that can get away with doing that to Sheldon. I actually see his behavior is far worse to his guy friends.

[TeaTV]

TBH, I’m a fan of aborting...the entire misogynistic, hypocritical show. I suppose it’s time I stop watching. I’m turning into the token substance abuser of the show, Penny—rolling my eyes after every other scene and trying to put up with their idiocrasy. 

Edited October 1, 2017 by TVwithTea
...like Clair on Modern Family.

[Sarah 103]

7 hours ago, TVwithTea said:

Let’s not forget Bernadette engaged in coitus for years before she married plus many other “mortal” sins including using birth control and never attending Mass except for during the Baptism where non-Catholics were Godparents. IMO, they make a mockery of the faith.

Different things matter to different people. She may be totally fine with using birth control and not attending Mass on a regular basis, but has strong feels about abortion and believes it's wrong. 

7 hours ago, CherryAmes said:

Does Bernadette ever state that she is living, or trying to live, a Catholic lifestyle (however that gets defined?) because if not I don't see any mocking going on.

I agree. Maybe she rejected or does not follow most of the beliefs and teachings of the religion, but being pro-life is important to her, even if she views it as a personal decision and not what is best for all women everywhere.  

[calipiano81]

I agree with those who commented that it's always a pleasure when Mary Cooper shows up. One might expect a science-themed show to portray a Christian in a not-so-positive light, but Mary is warm, loving, open-minded, and when Sheldon or others mock her faith, I find her comebacks to be so witty and right on!

[PinkRibbons]

FWIW, many women identify as pro-choice and then state that their choice for themselves is to never even consider an abortion as an option (barring medical issues, usually). You can support other people's choices while making a different one for yourself. So whether Bernie is pro-choice or pro-life doesn't really matter to me. It seems that as far as she's concerned she pregnant and healthy and so she's having another baby, and that's her choice.

[taanja]

On 9/25/2017 at 8:43 PM, Katy M said:

The problem is that they've coupled everyone off and can't afford to bring in another full-time actress to couple RAj off with and they don't know what to do with him.  If possible they should have written him off and sent him back to India.  Because, no offense to the actor, but he's just dead weight at this point.  On a half hour (18 minute) show , they don't have time for 3 couples and a single guy.

The problem is Raj and Stewart should have been a couple years ago.

[ZuluQueenOfDwarves]

Bernadette may very well be pro-choice, but it's a hard sell that a late 20/early 30-something woman of Bernadette's income in a stable relationship with a plethora of secondary caregivers available would even consider terminating a pregnancy just because it came so close on the heels of her first. It is, at worst, a moderate inconvenience. Abortion is a serious decision with a lot of emotional weight behind it. I can see why it didn't even occur to Bernadette and Howard to discuss it. 

[CherryAmes]

If the episode had been all about a second pregnancy and its implications some sitcoms might have brought up abortion as an option.  Since this was the secondary plot and since the actress is actually pregnant it's not surprising that ending the pregnancy was never up for discussion.

[BlossomCulp]

On 10/1/2017 at 7:22 PM, anna0852 said:

While she does put up with some of his quirks she certainly does not put up with all of them and she's very quick to make it clear when something is not okay.

In this episode she makes it very clear to Sheldon that his behavior in front of her colleagues was completely out of line.  Sheldon may never really get it completely but he did realise in the end that he was going to have to change his ways.  

[rmontro]

On 9/30/2017 at 4:04 PM, CleoCaesar said:

A culture that traditional frowns on divorce, so the low divorce rate doesn't necessarily mean the marriages are happy.

Doesn't mean they're unhappy, either!

[buffynut]

I missed this episode last week, forgot it was on Mondays again, so only watched online last night after I watched the current episode. So my thoughts on the 2 episodes are muddled.   I'd read that the actress was pregnant in real life, but didn't consider they'd add it to the show.  Not surprised Amy said "yes". Wonder if the wedding / baby birth will be the season finale?

[BlossomCulp]

I wonder if Amy will use those dresses she offered Bernadette?

[CherryAmes]

Lol!  Well she does like a bargain - isn't she still wearing her dead grandmother's clothes?

[CoyoteBlue]

On 9/28/2017 at 4:28 PM, LaChavalina said:

I think it would be interesting if the show re-visited the arranged marriage issue and handled it in a culturally appropriate way.

You mean Raj disappears for the month of December and then just returns with a wedding ring (and, I assume, a wife) without saying a thing about it? :) Sorry, lots of Indian co-workers in the past and this literally happened often enough to be a stereotype. 

[Snarklepuss]

On 10/1/2017 at 1:41 PM, TVwithTea said:

Strict? Let’s not forget Bernadette engaged in coitus for years before she married plus many other “mortal” sins including using birth control and never attending Mass except for during the Baptism where non-Catholics were Godparents. IMO, they make a mockery of the faith.

A lot of modern day Roman Catholics "cherry pick" what they observe as far as their personal religious beliefs and moral values go.  They may not identify as practicing Catholics but they still carry over some or even all of the moral values they were raised with nonetheless.  I would say Bernadette falls into this category because she didn't get married in the Catholic church and practices birth control but it's believable that she may still adhere to abortion being wrong.  I'm not a Roman Catholic myself (I'm Episcopalian) but I went to a mostly Catholic university and worked there for 10 years after college.

[MaryMitch]

Regardless of whether Bernadette considers herself "practicing the faith", the actress is pregnant in real life, so I doubt she would want to have an "abortion discussion" on the show.

Edited October 4, 2017 by MaryMitch

[anna0852]

Especially since her previous pregnancy ended in a miscarriage.

[Tosia]

Bernadette is probably  like alot of us recocrring Catholics, in that we did the sacraments due to family  pressure, but have moved away from almost all of it.

I was raised Catholic, went to Mass every day except Saturday,   cuz of going to a Catholic school also. Got married in the church and baptized my son in church as well. 

Got disillusioned in my late teens due to feminism, thank God. Supported pro choice vehemently. Escorted patients to Planned Parenthood clinics. 

Still went to services occasionally for my dad, and to criticize the latest sermon, but it was mainly for social relationships--my neighborhood church,friends, and relatives were there, so we'd go out to brunch afterwards. 

Dropped out more and more as I got older and moved away from home town. Now I go to  Unity Church and LOVE it. Low key, kind of Buddhist, focusing on a loving God instead of punishing. Very into golden rule.