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Season 10: Spoilers and Spoiler Discussion

azshadowwalker

By azshadowwalker
in Doctor Who

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benteen

benteen

(edited)

Very surprising but very exciting news.  I never thought I'd see the day where we got a multi-Master story (the recent Big Finish multi-Master stories not included).

Edited by benteen
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darkestboy

darkestboy

It seems like it's in the finale though.

Multi Master and Cybermen. According to some spoilerhounds, they're doing some CGI of Delgado in the mix as well.

There's also rumours of David Bradley playing the 1st Doctor as well.

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hnygrl

hnygrl

I just hope it's good. That's all I want, for it to be GOOD, and not another season of Moffatt-ness we have to endure before the next guy comes along. I just want this last Moffatt season to be a love letter to the fandom, a thank you for putting up with his other less-than-stellar seasons/series.

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Llywela

Llywela

8 hours ago, hnygrl said:

I just hope it's good. That's all I want, for it to be GOOD, and not another season of Moffatt-ness we have to endure before the next guy comes along. I just want this last Moffatt season to be a love letter to the fandom, a thank you for putting up with his other less-than-stellar seasons/series.

Me too. The problem is, my idea of what's good and Moffat's idea of what's good are polar opposites, so I'm not optimistic.

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HauntedBathroom

HauntedBathroom

23 hours ago, hnygrl said:

I just hope it's good. That's all I want, for it to be GOOD, and not another season of Moffatt-ness we have to endure before the next guy comes along. I just want this last Moffatt season to be a love letter to the fandom, a thank you for putting up with his other less-than-stellar seasons/series.

So you're ignoring the fact that Moffat's seasons have been adored by a majority of fans? Check out the episode polls on GallifreyBase.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

3 hours ago, HauntedBathroom said:

So you're ignoring the fact that Moffat's seasons have been adored by a majority of fans? Check out the episode polls on GallifreyBase.

I think the last two series have been terrible. 7b was pretty sucky too, but it had Matt Smith and I love him, so I'll cut it some slack. I hope S10 is better now that they've dumped the dead weight.

S11 with Chibnall and the 13th Doctor is a chance to start new, and recapture some of the fun and magic that's been missing from the dark and obsessional stories of the last few series.

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hnygrl

hnygrl

The last time Doctor Who was GOOD was when the Ponds were here. And even that last half of that last season sucked like a black hole.  The first two episodes of the Clara show were outstanding. After that it was hit or miss...mostly miss. The Clara Christmas special was awesome, after that, we're back to hit or miss, mostly miss. We can go on pretending that all of the Moffatt era was awesomely awesome but the truth is,

It wasn't.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

There's a rumor going around that they've booked Eddie's Diner in Cardiff (Clara's Tardis, and the diner Eleven visited with Amy and Rory in Lake Silencio) for filming in the middle of July. If true, I guess that means Clara will be back for the Christmas special. I was expecting it, but it's still disappointing.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

This isn't a spoiler, just speculation: I know the most obvious theory of who's in the vault is John Simm's Master, but could it be the Valeyard? I haven't watched Trial of a Time Lord in over a decade (I didn't enjoy the Colin Baker era), but wasn't he supposed to be the Thirteen Doctor? Which is the next regeneration. Could Twelve have made an oath to keep him under lock and key because the only person who can really defeat the Doctor is the Doctor?

Is it possible that in the Christmas special Twelve will battle Thirteen, possibly with the help of the First Doctor, forcing him to regenerate into Fourteen, giving us a Doctor who only lasts for one episode?

Also, the Mirror says Phoebe Waller-Bridge is the new Doctor, but they said the same thing about Kris Marshall a few weeks back, so grain of salt and all.

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Llywela

Llywela

6 hours ago, Lokiberry said:

This isn't a spoiler, just speculation: I know the most obvious theory of who's in the vault is John Simm's Master, but could it be the Valeyard? I haven't watched Trial of a Time Lord in over a decade (I didn't enjoy the Colin Baker era), but wasn't he supposed to be the Thirteen Doctor? Which is the next regeneration. Could Twelve have made an oath to keep him under lock and key because the only person who can really defeat the Doctor is the Doctor?

No, the Valeyard isn't meant to be the 13th Doctor (which is technically already passed anyway, because the numbering system is up the creek since Moffat took over - 10 was both the 10th and 11th incarnation, the War Doctor was the 12th, Eleven the 13th). The Valeyard is described by the Master as an amalgamation of the Doctor's darker sides from 'between his twelfth and final incarnations', which is pretty vague, depending on what you consider to be his final incarnation - plus depends a lot on how much stock we place in the Master's word anyway. But basically, the Valeyard isn't a real person and isn't one of the Doctor's regenerations, it is something made from him, a bit like the Dream Lord in that 11th Doctor episode.

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Llywela

Llywela

3 hours ago, call me ishmael said:

although i don't think it is the Valeyard, Nardole's insisting that the occupant of the vault would know if the Doctor was injured or dead does suggest a fairly close psychic connection.

Not necessarily psychic - could just be someone intuitive enough to sense weakness in a guard they know well. Just listening to his gait or his breathing, the tone of his voice, could tip them off.

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foreverevolving

foreverevolving

15 hours ago, Llywela said:

No, the Valeyard isn't meant to be the 13th Doctor (which is technically already passed anyway, because the numbering system is up the creek since Moffat took over - 10 was both the 10th and 11th incarnation, the War Doctor was the 12th, Eleven the 13th). The Valeyard is described by the Master as an amalgamation of the Doctor's darker sides from 'between his twelfth and final incarnations', which is pretty vague, depending on what you consider to be his final incarnation - plus depends a lot on how much stock we place in the Master's word anyway. But basically, the Valeyard isn't a real person and isn't one of the Doctor's regenerations, it is something made from him, a bit like the Dream Lord in that 11th Doctor episode.

Not really, it's pretty straight forward if you go by regeneration timing. War doctor will technically be the 9th doctor, which makes 9-10, 10-11+12, and 11-13; while 12 will be 14 but also #1 in the new cycle.

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Llywela

Llywela

8 hours ago, foreverevolving said:

Not really, it's pretty straight forward if you go by regeneration timing. War doctor will technically be the 9th doctor, which makes 9-10, 10-11+12, and 11-13; while 12 will be 14 but also #1 in the new cycle.

Yes, sorry, I slotted War in the wrong place (it was very early on a Sunday morning!). But I stand by my point that a) what had been a simple numerical system is now up the spout, and b) the occupant of the vault is unlikely to be the Valeyard, who is not slated to be the Doctor's next regeneration, and in fact is not a 'real' incarnation of the Doctor at all.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

(edited)

Someone on Gallifrey Base is reporting that they've seen the 11th episode and it begins with the Doctor's regeneration, although we don't see who he regenerates into, and the rest of the story is "how did we get to this point". Another individual, who has some spoiler cred, says the BBC held back a scene from whatever this viewing was  until Saturday night. There's also going to be an event with Steven Moffat and Pearl Mackie, after the episode airs, parts of which will be live streamed.

If this is going where it seems, either this week or  next, I believe it would be the first time anybody's ever kept the identity of a new Doctor a secret until his (or her) first episode aired. It would be quite a coup for Moffat.

Edited by Lokiberry
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ae2

ae2

13 hours ago, Lokiberry said:

If this is going where it seems, either this week or  next, I believe it would be the first time anybody's ever kept the identity of a new Doctor a secret until his (or her) first episode aired. It would be quite a coup for Moffat.

Well, John Simms is supposed to appear in this season and he has yet to show........

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cardigirl

cardigirl

Isn't the Christmas episode supposed to be the end of Capaldi's doctor and Moffat's tenure as the show runner?  Or is it episode 12?  I don't think we'll find out until Christmas this year. 

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Llywela

Llywela

1 hour ago, cardigirl said:

Isn't the Christmas episode supposed to be the end of Capaldi's doctor and Moffat's tenure as the show runner?  Or is it episode 12?  I don't think we'll find out until Christmas this year. 

The Christmas special is definitely Moffat's last episode. I had assumed Capaldi would remain in place until then so that Chibnall had a completely clean slate for his tenure, rather than inheriting a new Doctor whose first episode was written by someone else - but thinking about it, I don't actually know that for sure. And it seems a bit premature to show the Doctor's regeneration as a tease to the two-part season finale if it isn't actually going to happen until the Christmas special, so I'm a little unsure now.

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Llywela

Llywela

9 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

Well, he's starting to regenerate in the snow, in the opening scene, so it could be because it's a Christmas episode.  

Possibly - it just seems really weird to have a scene from the Christmas episode used as a teaser to an episode this much earlier, which presumably has a completely different plotline. Or is this two-part finale going to end on a cliffhanger to be resolved at Christmas? With that episode following on from this? That would be a break with tradition - the Christmas specials are usually much more standalone than that. So yeah, it seems really weird. Keeps us guessing, I suppose.

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cardigirl

cardigirl

Just now, Llywela said:

Possibly - it just seems really weird to have a scene from the Christmas episode used as a teaser to an episode this much earlier, which presumably has a completely different plotline. Or is this two-part finale going to end on a cliffhanger to be resolved at Christmas? With that episode following on from this? That would be a break with tradition - the Christmas specials are usually much more standalone than that. So yeah, it seems really weird. Keeps us guessing, I suppose.

It does seem weird to carry it over.  When David Tennant became the Doctor, wasn't that a Christmas episode?  I seem to remember a spinning Christmas tree. 

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Ceindreadh

Ceindreadh

18 minutes ago, cardigirl said:

It does seem weird to carry it over.  When David Tennant became the Doctor, wasn't that a Christmas episode?  I seem to remember a spinning Christmas tree. 

Yes and no.  David Tennant first appeared in the final scene of season 1 of the reboot, but his first full post-regeneration episode was the Christmas special. 

IIRC, when they filmed Nine's regeneration scene, they hadn't actually cast Ten at that point, and his scene was only slotted in closer to the time of airing - which could be what they're planning here. 

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Mabinogia

Mabinogia

Dear God in Heaven WHY!!!???!! WHY!!?!?!! Her story is over. Let it die already. Let poor Peter Capaldi have his swan song without that albatross around his neck.

Quote

“It’s become a tradition now for the companions to reappear as the Doctor regenerates and Jenna isn’t letting the side down,” The Mirror‘s anonymous source said.

But she's no longer his companion! She has her own now. Bill should be by his side. OMG! (head bangs)

 

Sorry, overreacting, I know. But the finale was SO brilliant to me that it hurts my heart to go back.

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rur

rur

13 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

Dear God in Heaven WHY!!!???!! WHY!!?!?!! Her story is over. Let it die already. Let poor Peter Capaldi have his swan song without that albatross around his neck.

My thoughts exactly. I'd give you a million likes if it were possible. Maybe it will be a brief appearance like Amy Pond's when the last regeneration appeared.

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Llywela

Llywela

(edited)

It has happened twice in New Who and once in Classic Who (as flashbacks, that one, not new footage). Out of the number of regenerations the Doctor has had, that isn't a tradition, it's an optional extra. It isn't necessary, and having to find a reason to bring former companions back for a regeneration can distort the writing dangerously. The Tenth Doctor found time to go and visit everyone while he was dying. The Eleventh Doctor hallucinated Amy. What excuse would they find for Clara? Twelve has already hallucinated a bunch of former friends and companions - that's enough. Anything more would be overkill - it's already a bit belaboured, dragging the regeneration out over multiple episodes. I prefer it when it's sudden and shocking!

Edited by Llywela
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cardigirl

cardigirl

Well, I, for one, love call backs to previous companions and look forward to the Christmas show.  I knew as soon as I read the article there would be howling and gnashing of teeth on this forum, but I'm not sure whether there should be. All of the companions from the RTD era showed up when he wrote his finale.  I felt that David Tennant's final regeneration went on for AGES.  

And I would be particularly sad if Steven Moffat didn't get to write one more time for the companions of his era.  

I doubt that Rory and Amy will show up, but I bet there will be a memory or two of them, and of River.  And I hope more than a memory or two of Clara and Bill and Nardole.

The Day of the Doctor was such a perfect episode, I'm willing to hope for a fantastic sendoff for Capaldi and for the Moffat era.   

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Llywela

Llywela

I like callbacks to previous companions in theory, but the story has to justify it. A simple flashback is plausible enough, but we've already done that, and this sounds like new footage - tying that in with whatever the episode plot is, that's where it can easily become overblown. Sometimes less is more - I didn't like Ten's tour at the end of the RTD era either! I understand why he wanted to do it, but in-universe it felt indulgent. The story would have been better served without it. Nine's exit was much cleaner.

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Lokiberry

Lokiberry

Well, I think we all knew that Twelve wouldn't get away without Clara showing up one more time to look down her nose at him.

Anyway,  in case you haven't seen this already, here's a link to a video with a picture off the set of the Christmas special, with a a spoiler. It's not the regeneration, so don't get excited, but it does have something that might be interesting:

https://youtu.be/qt2Jhz7OhrE

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jhlipton

jhlipton

On 5/14/2017 at 11:55 AM, call me ishmael said:

although i don't think it is the Valeyard, Nardole's insisting that the occupant of the vault would know if the Doctor was injured or dead does suggest a fairly close psychic connection.

In retrospect, we could say it was a close psychotic connection!  LOL

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John Potts

John Potts

Not much of a spoiler, but having seen the trailer for the (2017) Christmas Special, the First Doctor says to the 12th (well, Peter Capaldi's), "I expected you'd be younger than me!" "I am younger!" - which made me think: is he? A quick check and - actually, at the time of William Hartnell's last story (The Tenth Planet, which its rumoured we're seeing) WH was 57 and PC is currently 58.  Of course, how the Doctor measures his age is a mystery and Peter Capaldi certainly LOOKS younger than William Hartnell did (and he's considerably younger than David Bradley - 75 at present), but he has no right to be outraged that One could make such a suggestion!

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cambridgeguy

cambridgeguy

New BBC trailer for the Christmas special

The Doctor really should make sure all future regenerations do NOT occur inside of the TARDIS.  It certainly looks like Moffat wants to leave the exact same way Davies did.  In fact 9 and 11 more or less treated regeneration the same way (I had a good run and was fantastic, it was great knowing you Rose/Clara, let's see what's next) and didn't trash the TARDIS.  10 and 12 have the same general feeling (I don't want to go) and it sure looks like there will have to be some redecorating.

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