Sell By Date Expiration: Old Shows That Don't Stand Up To The Test Of Time

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, jennifer6973 said:

Radar's was that his mom was dating after a long time.  He was upset because a 50 year old was too old to be dating anybody.   I would have thrown something at the TV, but didn't want to break it.

I could have accepted him being upset because his mom was dating, the idea of your parent dating can be weird, like thinking about your parents having sex lol, but her age shouldn't matter, unless she was dating someone her son's age, then I totally get his being upset. 

[Kel Varnsen]

3 hours ago, Blergh said:

One thing to keep in mind re women performers/characters past 40 seeming to look older than we'd expect through modern eyes: until recent decades, estrogen supplements were not available. Hence once menopause happened, there was little if anything a woman could do to prevent the body from having a post-menopausal appearance in a short time. It's not for nothing that the saying of  '40's the new 30' has come to be

It's not just famous women though is it? There was that meme floating around a few years ago about how Tom Cruise at the time was the same age as Wilford Bromley when he filmed Cocoon.

[Shannon L.]

6 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

I have the series and have been watching it recently. They do a really good job for a show from the 70's. I recently watched the episode where Venus dates Andy's sister and Andy gets upset. Venus calls him out and says it's because he is Black. And there is actually a scene where Andy says that he thought about it and even though he and Venus are friends some of his anger was because his sister went out with a Black guy, and he hates that he felt that. Seems like a fairly complicated look at racism for 1980.

Yeah, they did do a pretty good job with a lot of issues, considering the time period that it was filmed.  I guess it's Herb and his treatment of Jennifer that wasn't handled quite as well by today's standards.  Back then, I guess you could say that the way Jennifer was written and they way Loni Anderson played her was their way of addressing it and a big reason that it's still not as bothersome while watching it today.  I don't know that a new sitcom with those two kinds of characters interacting that way would do as well today, though.  I know that the main reason I didn't last more than a few episodes into season one of Abbott Elementary was the principal's treatment of the (substitute?) teacher.  But, imo, she came off a bit more sexual than Herb and the teacher didn't take the principal head on like Jennifer did.

[Kel Varnsen]

51 minutes ago, Shannon L. said:

Yeah, they did do a pretty good job with a lot of issues, considering the time period that it was filmed.  I guess it's Herb and his treatment of Jennifer that wasn't handled quite as well by today's standards.  Back then, I guess you could say that the way Jennifer was written and they way Loni Anderson played her was their way of addressing it and a big reason that it's still not as bothersome while watching it today

That is sort of how I see the Herb/Jennifer thing. I mean I am sure those types of guys were all over the business world at the time. But the show still made it clear that he was an inappropriate jackass. And even though they never really did anything about his behaviour people did tell him to knock it off. She also didn't hide herself or change her looks and wasn't afraid to tell him to get lost. So I guess overall it was kind of good. Plus the show at least implied that they couldn't fire Herb because no one else wanted to work there.

[Bastet]

7 hours ago, Anduin said:

there's an ageing on TV topic, isn't there?

Yep, here.

[DXD526]

Herb was always presented as kind of a clueless braggart, which also helped defuse the creepiness factor in his pursuit of Jennifer. It gave the impression of a dog chasing the car situation; he wouldn't know what to do with the car if he actually caught it.

Hormone treatments were already getting widespread by the time The Golden Girls debuted in '85. In fact, there was a joke about it in an early episode. The house was broken into, and Rose thinks it was probably someone looking for drugs. Dorothy answers, "We have Maalox and estrogen. How many junkies have gas and hot flashes?"

Echoing the Marion Mercer love! I first saw her at a young age, on Mary Hartman, Mary Hartman, and many times after, and she was always funny (MH, MH was also my first exposure to Martin Mull, Dabney Coleman, and Mary Kay Place. Quite a petri dish of young talent that show was). 

It's A Living was a solid show. Nothing spectacular, but always good for a few laughs. These days it's just as fun to watch for the absolutely ridiculous 80s clothes and hair, which are on prominent display!

[Kel Varnsen]

12 hours ago, DXD526 said:

Herb was always presented as kind of a clueless braggart, which also helped defuse the creepiness factor in his pursuit of Jennifer.

That is sort of what made it better I think. If Herb was presented as a cool guy who got lots of women but was constantly being shut down by Jennifer anytime he tried to ask her out or anything, it would have made it much worse. And I can see that another show from that time period might have done something like that.

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

That is sort of what made it better I think. If Herb was presented as a cool guy who got lots of women but was constantly being shut down by Jennifer anytime he tried to ask her out or anything, it would have made it much worse. And I can see that another show from that time period might have done something like that.

Yes, making him the butt of the joke made it acceptable. I can't imagine many men watching thought "oh, I want to be like Herb!". Not just because, well, he's Herb, but because he failed to "get the girl". I haven't watched the show in ages, but I don't think it ever went down the dangerous trope path of him finally wearing her down and her finally dating him. 

[Shannon L.]

31 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

I haven't watched the show in ages, but I don't think it ever went down the dangerous trope path of him finally wearing her down and her finally dating him. 

They kind of tackled that.  She was talking to, I think Bailey, about Herb's behavior and Bailey told her to call his bluff and say yes.  She did and Herb was thrilled, but when he went to pick her up, he got so nervous and started feeling so guilty, that he bungled the whole thing.  It was like @DXD526 said, the dog caught the car and didn't know what to do with it.

Edited June 18, 2023 by Shannon L.

[Haleth]

On 6/16/2023 at 7:41 PM, Mabinogia said:

And holy mother forking shirt balls, I just found out that I am currently the age Rue McClanahan was when the show started. I'm a forking Golden Girl!!!!!!!

Want to freak out even more?  Edith Bunker was supposed to be 52.

I loved how Loni Anderson played Jennifer. So not what you would expect from a sitcom. 

Edited June 18, 2023 by Haleth

[bmasters9]

On 5/6/2019 at 3:06 PM, Lugal said:

And I remember when Married With Children started out, there were "Good Christian Folk" who raised holy hell about how awful the show was before it ever even premiered.  Ed O'Neill even once said: (paraphrasing) thank you Christian nutjobs for promoting our show.

It was the same with Soap in 1977 on ABC-- Donald Wildmon's American Family Association had similar astroturfing with that 70s serial comedy that was a spoof of the daily serials of the time.

[DrSpaceman73]

The simpsons the same way. 

Which is ironic because the simpsons actually are shown  going to church more than any family on tv

[Laura Holt]

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

Want to freak out even more?  Edith Bunker was supposed to be 52.

And Jean Stapleton was only 48 when the show premiered!  Would any actress of 48 today play a character like Edith was meant to be?  Dowdy and very middle aged?  I don't think so.

[kathyk24]

3 hours ago, Laura Holt said:

And Jean Stapleton was only 48 when the show premiered!  Would any actress of 48 today play a character like Edith was meant to be?  Dowdy and very middle aged?  I don't think so.

I don't think Edith looked dowdy she looked like a housewife of that era. Lifespans were shorter then so people looked older than they do now. Women weren't as obsessed with looking younger as they are now. My grandma was born in 1920 I remember asking her if she ever thought she would be alive in 2000. She said no and she died in 2014. I think people expect to live to old age and it's shocking when it doesn't happen.

[Mabinogia]

4 hours ago, bmasters9 said:

It was the same with Soap in 1977 on ABC-- Donald Wildmon's American Family Association had similar astroturfing with that 70s serial comedy that was a spoof of the daily serials of the time.

I LOVED Soap. One of my favorite shows of all time. I think it holds up because it was just totally insane. I wanted to be a Jessica Tate but I was always more of a Mary Campbell. 

[Laura Holt]

55 minutes ago, kathyk24 said:

I don't think Edith looked dowdy she looked like a housewife of that era. Lifespans were shorter then so people looked older than they do now. Women weren't as obsessed with looking younger as they are now. My grandma was born in 1920 I remember asking her if she ever thought she would be alive in 2000. She said no and she died in 2014. I think people expect to live to old age and it's shocking when it doesn't happen.

I don't think it's a case of being obsessed with looking younger so much as 48 is younger now than it was then.  All I meant was that if they were going to do a show about a middle aged couple today, even if they were meant to be working class like Edith and Archie were I don't see them having a couple in their late 40s dressing and acting like they are  verging on elderly and IMO that's how Edith and Archie were written.

[andromeda331]

8 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

I LOVED Soap. One of my favorite shows of all time. I think it holds up because it was just totally insane. I wanted to be a Jessica Tate but I was always more of a Mary Campbell. 

It's mine too. It's just so funny and insane. I loved Mary and Jessica but Burt was my favorite especially when he decides he can make himself invisable. Chuck and Bob were hilarious too.

[Annber03]

11 minutes ago, andromeda331 said:

It's mine too. It's just so funny and insane. I loved Mary and Jessica but Burt was my favorite especially when he decides he can make himself invisable. Chuck and Bob were hilarious too.

I like the bit in one episode where Chuck and Bob were doing this thing of Bob being blindfolded and able to guess what Chuck was holding up, and Burt and Danny were just agog at this ability.

Meanwhile, Mary's sitting there with the most perfect, "...dear god, I'm surrounded by idiots..." expression on her face XD. 

[andromeda331]

On 6/18/2023 at 11:50 PM, Annber03 said:

I like the bit in one episode where Chuck and Bob were doing this thing of Bob being blindfolded and able to guess what Chuck was holding up, and Burt and Danny were just agog at this ability.

Meanwhile, Mary's sitting there with the most perfect, "...dear god, I'm surrounded by idiots..." expression on her face XD. 

I love that episode. Another favorite is when Burt disappeared from the mental hospital. Mary, Danny, Chuck and Bob go to the mental hospital to try and find out what's going on. Bob's been an ass as usual and Danny has enough and attacks him. Just then the doctors come in and break up the fight, they assume their all patients of the hospital.