S34: Sandra Diaz-Twine

[Vyk]

On ‎3‎/‎10‎/‎2017 at 0:50 AM, azshadowwalker said:

As for influencing votes, if people had listened to her in HvV, Russell would have been out on his ass. That was lost because Rupert and JT had their heads up his ass.

Let's not forget the F9 of that season, where he was also as good as gone, thanks to Sandra, but that time, it was Candice who ended up putting her head up his ass.

Edited March 14, 2017 by Vyk

[NutMeg]

@azshadowwalker, In my comics version, she executes a perfect dive, looks at the reader, and the bubble read "What? You really thought I didn't have it in me? I HAD to downplay the physical threat to last. I'm actually a multiple gold medalist in swimming/diving." 

Edited March 10, 2017 by NutMeg

[azshadowwalker]

I also wonder if she lost out to the preferred edit in both of her seasons. I am actually one of the few (only?) Rupert fans here, but his edit was the story they wanted to tell, and that kind of screwed Sandra. Fairplay being bad was the other story. Sandra's win was just made a side plot in their stories. 

Then, she had to play with Russell, whose story as villain strategist got Jiffy and the editors worked up. Again, the story of the winner was secondary. 

[KimberStormer]

19 minutes ago, azshadowwalker said:

As for influencing votes, if people had listened to her in HvV, Russell would have been out on his ass.

In other words.....she did not influence their votes!

[NutMeg]

3 hours ago, azshadowwalker said:

I also wonder if she lost out to the preferred edit in both of her seasons. I am actually one of the few (only?) Rupert fans here, but his edit was the story they wanted to tell, and that kind of screwed Sandra. Fairplay being bad was the other story. Sandra's win was just made a side plot in their stories. 

Then, she had to play with Russell, whose story as villain strategist got Jiffy and the editors worked up. Again, the story of the winner was secondary. 

I fully believe that, not only because there were better stories to tell from TPTB' viewpoint (I also really like Rupert his first season, the first Survivor I watched, and while I disliked FairPlay at the time, in retrospect I think he was actually a good villain), but also because her game play depends more on soft skills that may not be camera ready, because they consist on a lot of small things to build up a big thing, rather that a number of big things that are easier to show. Also, if we saw the soft build (Sandra, Nathalie White, etc.) moves too often, there would be no surprise as to who would win.  

3 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

In other words.....she did not influence their votes!

Indeed, but the beauty of her game is that she takes setbacks and turns them into advantages. It's like she's invented some weird "judo-survivor".

Edited March 10, 2017 by NutMeg
I've very bad at self editing

[azshadowwalker]

17 minutes ago, NutMeg said:

 

Indeed, but the beauty of her game is that she takes setbacks and turns them into advantages. It's like she's invented some weird "judo-survivor".

Precisely. My point both here and in the episode thread is that she has a proactive game. Writing her off as nothing more than "anyone but me" is wrong. That's a slogan, but it wasn't her sole tactic.  People who portray her game as passive aren't paying attention. She has shown more than once that this is the case, and that even a failure today can be an advantage tomorrow. 

[NutMeg]

16 minutes ago, azshadowwalker said:

Precisely. My point both here and in the episode thread is that she has a proactive game. Writing her off as nothing more than "anyone but me" is wrong. That's a slogan, but it wasn't her sole tactic.  People who portray her game as passive aren't paying attention. She has shown more than once that this is the case, and that even a failure today can be an advantage tomorrow. 

I agree. I also think she's encouraged the view of her as a passive, "anyone but me" player because that perception has served her well. But of course there are more ingredients to her recipe. 

[KimberStormer]

For sure!  But I think this overt leadership is not something we've seen from Sandra before.  And that's great!  I love people who change their game up when they come back.  And she seems to be doing pretty well with it so far.

[Nashville]

12 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

Sandra definitely has skills that we don't always get to see. From everything I remember reading about her past seasons, apparently she has a really good social game. People just like her. We don't get to see a lot of that though because her "mouthy" moments are the most entertaining so that's what the editors focus on.

I'm positive a great deal of it must be Edit Effect, because I don't think a personality primarily focused on such things as shouting "I'm the QUEEN!" at an evictee's back as they trudge away from TC is one which will easily win friends and build relationships.  If I were sitting around the TC fire and watching that shitshow...?  My reaction would be roughly along the same lines as the "Dayum!" statement Michaela's body language was making.

 

3 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Being abrasive was always Sandra's game, though.  She's rude, she's confrontational, she's blunt, she's loud.  You love her, but you are sure everyone else hates her, nobody really gets Sandra but you.  You think she's hilarious.  So you'll take her along, a goat who makes you laugh.  Then you find out, whoops, everyone else loves her too.

*I* don't love Sandra, for one simple reason: taunting someone who's just been evicted - even a jerk like Tony - is NOT game, because that evictee is NO LONGER IN THE GAME. 

Now, don't get me wrong; while the game is in motion I'm perfectly okay with a player shitting in the other player's rice bowls every day of the week and twice on Sundays, if that's how they want to play.  The concept of 'fair' is relegated strictly to the realm of the Challenge rules; it has no application to player interactions.  All's fair in love and war and Survivor, while you're playing it - no harm, no foul.

Once a player has had their torch snuffed, though...?  That EX-player's game is over.  Their dream for this season has just been crushed, and they are walking away - so what part of trashing them is gameplay???  Answer: it's not.  It's the equivalent of seeing a kid get beat down on the playground during recess - and while they're laying there defeated in the dirt, running over to give them a kick in the ribs.  It's pure spiteful meanness, and cowardly, and most definitely not "gameplay".

Previously I didn't have much opinion of Sandra one way or the other, positive or negative, other than giving her props for the x2.  Now though...?  So far as I'm concerned, she can go piss up a rope.  YMMV

[Vyk]

8 minutes ago, Nashville said:

I'm positive a great deal of it must be Edit Effect, because I don't think a personality primarily focused on such things as shouting "I'm the QUEEN!" at an evictee's back as they trudge away from TC is one which will easily win friends and build relationships.  If I were sitting around the TC fire and watching that shitshow...?  My reaction would be roughly along the same lines as the "Dayum!" statement Michaela's body language was making.

Meh.  Given that several of the Manas were loving that, I don't think Sandra has to worry about a damn thing.  In fact, I think only Malcolm, Michaela, and possibly Caleb weren't.  But all of the others seemed more than fine with it.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Vyk

[Nashville]

8 minutes ago, Vyk said:

Meh.  Given that several of the Manas were loving that, I don't think Sandra has to worry about a damn thing.  In fact, I think only Malcolm, Michaela, and possibly Caleb weren't.  But all of the others seemed more than fine with it.

Why would the other players call Sandra out on her behavior?  Doing so would certainly not advance their game prospects - and unlike Tony, they're still IN the game.  :)

[Vyk]

32 minutes ago, Nashville said:

Why would the other players call Sandra out on her behavior?  Doing so would certainly not advance their game prospects - and unlike Tony, they're still IN the game.  :)

Why would they?  Because they clearly weren't bothered by it, and Sandra clearly only meant it in the spirit of the game, anyway.  I don't for a moment think she meant anything malicious by it.

[kikaha]

4 hours ago, azshadowwalker said:

As for influencing votes, if people had listened to her in HvV, Russell would have been out on his ass. That was lost because Rupert and JT had their heads up his ass. Of course, the fact that she tried and failed probably helped her in the end.

If Sandra had booted Russell when she wanted, she herself would have gotten booted shortly after.  i.e. failing at her major strategy was the key to keeping her in the game and winning. 

I can't comment about Pearl Island because I only saw part of the season.  But in HvV she was maybe the luckiest winner in Survivor history. 

If what Tony and she agreed earlier in the season is right -- that's it's impossible for a winner to win this season unless they sit next to each other -- she just made a near-fatal error in booting him.  Booting JT will turn 'near' into 'entirely.'  Again I feel she won the battle but in so doing lost the war -- if her goal is to win this season. 

[NutMeg]

28 minutes ago, kikaha said:

If Sandra had booted Russell when she wanted, she herself would have gotten booted shortly after. 

Ah, we don't know that. The only thing we know is that him not being booted helped her. That doesn't mean she couldn't have also benefitted for him being booted out.  

[fishcakes]

7 hours ago, NutMeg said:

It's funny how she's describing winning Survivor as how she wins her money, and still has never been a famewhore.

I think this is one of the reasons she's been so successful at the game. For her, it's just about that million dollar prize. She doesn't care about playing for the camera, being a memorable character, having an adventure, making friends, or any of the things that distract other players from the actual game. She's always laser-focused on what she has to do to get to the end and get the million, and when it's over, she goes back to her normal life and job.

7 hours ago, NutMeg said:

Would she dive clumsily, or would it be the perfect Ozzy dive though?

There's a hilarious shot of her diving into the water in one of the challenges from, I think, the Pearl Islands season, but I can't find it online; otherwise I'd turn it into a GIF. She starts to take a normal standing dive position, but then just falls sideways into the water. For a second there after she went in, I wasn't sure she was going to surface.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Nashville said:

so what part of trashing them is gameplay???  Answer: it's not.  It's the equivalent of seeing a kid get beat down on the playground during recess - and while they're laying there defeated in the dirt, running over to give them a kick in the ribs.  It's pure spiteful meanness, and cowardly, and most definitely not "gameplay".

I disagree.  Sandra's game is still in play and everyone around her heard those comments.  They can't say anything without it being part of the game.  

And I don't think seeing a former alliance member who turned on you based on paranoia get voted out is anything like seeing a kid getting beat up in the playground.  One of those things is dirty pool.  One is just how the game goes.  I'd say what Sandra did is more akin to a victory dance in the end zone after a TD.  It might not be your preferred way of playing football but it's entertaining and it does send a certain message to the other players.

[fishcakes]

Her parting words to Tony didn't bother me (and I like Tony) because she was responding to him telling the rest of the tribe that they were letting themselves get manipulated by Sandra. So she had to counter that by saying, essentially, that Tony was responsible for his own ouster, which is true. Her manner of saying it probably had more heat than necessary, but everyone knows how blunt Sandra is. In a way, that also works in her favor because people think she can't self-censor and therefore can't lie, but as Burton learned after, "I'm writing down Lill's name big as shit, don't even worry about it," she's a better liar than anyone.

[NodakFan]

I keep seeing comments that Sandra's behavior / statements towards Tony are poor game play / sportsmanship / etc.

However - I think it's actually really smart gameplay on Sandra's part.  She knows that she isn't going to play the under the radar / not a threat / anyone but me game - people are on to her, these people don't want to let her get close to the end again.  So she has to do the opposite - instead of being the weak older woman whose game people won't respect so you bring her to the end (when in reality they'll reward her) she has to be the obnoxious over the top jackass that no one will vote for, so you bring her for that reason.

She's playing the same game, but flipped the style / perception of her gameplay completely on its head, in an effort to stick around.

[fishcakes]

Sandra sent a nice tweet to Tony referring to him as "king."

Notable only because Richard Hatch had to immediately chime in to the replies that Tony is no king. Hatch will never get over the fact that people other than him, playing against more savvy players, also won the game.

[Rachel RSL]

10 hours ago, NutMeg said:

Still, her willingness to confront people who make others nervous in endearing, to me as a viewer and, I have no doubt, to the players witnessing it.

I always liked her but she earned my undying love way back in her first season when Johnny Assplay was all up in her face, shouting at her and, instead of being intimidated, she got right up in his face and said "LOOK! I CAN GET LOUD TOO!"  Combine that with "I'm against you, Russell." and I'm pretty sure she'd have to literally murder someone for me to stop loving her. And, even then, it would depend on who she murdered.

Also, good point mentioned above that Sandra's words to Tony as he left TC were in response to him telling the rest of the tribe that Sandra was manipulating them (or words to that effect). If he's trashing her and actively trying to get her tribemates to go against her even after he's been voted out, she has every right to respond to that.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Rachel RSL

[peachmangosteen]

7 hours ago, Rachel RSL said:

If he's trashing her and actively trying to get her tribemates to go against her even after he's been voted out, she has every right to respond to that.

RIGHT! I don't see how what Sandra did is being labeled unsportsmanlike, but what Tony did isn't. Honestly, Tony's is worse to me because he was out of the game while Sandra's still playing. Tony's outburst didn't really bother me though because I guarantee you if I was voted out I would be petty as fuck. I'm actually surprised more people don't say stuff after being voted out. There's supposedly a rule that you can't, but obviously that's not true because some people have.

[enlightenedbum]

Tony's an asshole, but smug rarely looks good on anyone.

[Superpole2000]

13 hours ago, NodakFan said:

I keep seeing comments that Sandra's behavior / statements towards Tony are poor game play / sportsmanship / etc.

However - I think it's actually really smart gameplay on Sandra's part.  She knows that she isn't going to play the under the radar / not a threat / anyone but me game - people are on to her, these people don't want to let her get close to the end again.  So she has to do the opposite - instead of being the weak older woman whose game people won't respect so you bring her to the end (when in reality they'll reward her) she has to be the obnoxious over the top jackass that no one will vote for, so you bring her for that reason.

She's playing the same game, but flipped the style / perception of her gameplay completely on its head, in an effort to stick around.

I don't think it was gameplay. I think that it was ego.

[Vyk]

5 hours ago, enlightenedbum said:

Tony's an asshole, but smug rarely looks good on anyone.

To each his/her own.  I think there are a select few people on whom it looks good, and Sandra somehow manages to make it look good on her.

1 hour ago, Superpole2000 said:

I don't think it was gameplay. I think that it was ego.

Again, to each his/her own.  I think it's neither.  I think it's just biting back at someone trying to blow up her game in a sore-loser fashion after he's already out of it.

[KimberStormer]

Game's still on.  She's playing to the other players, who are sitting all around her.  It's in Sandra's interest to make everyone think she's a goat yet again.  You're not out of the game til you walk down the stairs into Dr. Joe's tent to get weighed.

Anyway, it's freaking Tony we're talking about here.  Is there any chance his feelings were hurt by this?

[peachmangosteen]

8 hours ago, Vyk said:

I think it's just biting back at someone trying to blow up her game in a sore-loser fashion after he's already out of it.

It came off more like that to me and less like game play, but it still doesn't bother me.

[kikaha]

I don't believe the others will buy Sandra's argument to take her to the end.  Anyone that does seems crazy to me.  She is great in front of the jury. 

I think that calling herself the queen -- after she just took the target off her back and planted (or replanted) it on Tony -- hammers that even harder. 

Overall this season comes across to me as Mission Impossible for Sandra.  Very eager to see how long she can navigate her way through mine-infested waters. 

[Rachel RSL]

12 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

Anyway, it's freaking Tony we're talking about here.  Is there any chance his feelings were hurt by this?

He didn't even seem annoyed during his exit confessional. If anything, he seemed almost slightly amused/impressed that Sandra got him.

 

5 hours ago, kikaha said:

Overall this season comes across to me as Mission Impossible for Sandra.  Very eager to see how long she can navigate her way through mine-infested waters. 

Me too. I'll hate it when she's finally voted out but, honestly, I'm surprised she made it past the first 2 TCs.

[303420]

Sandra said in one interview that if she makes it 3 days, she'll make it 39 days. I feel like that's true but it would be insanity on the part of her tribemates. I do hope she does it, though, because then @KimberStormer will have to admit that she is indeed a ninja and not just lucky (all in good fun!).

I'm pleased to see, though, some understanding coming through that "as long as it ain't me" is a gross oversimplification of her strategy. She has always been a loyal alliance-mate, but her key is that she's adaptable. She'll try to (and often succeed in) redirecting the target toward someone she prefers, and she doesn't always care who that is (she'd never put herself in a Sarah position of insisting so hard on one target that the target moves to her). If she can't do anything about a member of her alliance going, then you better believe that "as long as it ain't me" rises to the surface (bye, Courtney). But she can also hate the crap out of someone ("I'm against you, Russell), and still work with them if she has to ("I'm stuck with him"). 

I'm sure TPTB told her to play up the only-two-time-winner-queen stuff. I don't think her TC comments to Tony will be that damaging to her. It's nothing that they don't already know. 

[Special K]

22 hours ago, 303420 said:

Sandra said in one interview that if she makes it 3 days, she'll make it 39 days.

 

I kind of agree that getting through ANY TCs without getting voted out is a huge accomplishment for her at this point.

[LadyChatts]

On 3/10/2017 at 11:08 AM, fishcakes said:

Sandra sent a nice tweet to Tony referring to him as "king."

Notable only because Richard Hatch had to immediately chime in to the replies that Tony is no king. Hatch will never get over the fact that people other than him, playing against more savvy players, also won the game.

Hatch would likely get his ass handed to him playing nowadays.  I picture him as the old guy of the group that everyone is nice to, only because they are respecting the "elder" and want to make him feel cool (before they send him packing).  He did play a great game for the first season, the only person out there besides Joel who seemed to understand that it was a game and not just about survival.  But things have changed and evolved.

[fishcakes]

21 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

the only person out there besides Joel who seemed to understand that it was a game and not just about survival

I also give Gervase and Greg credit for understanding that, but Gretchen was the problem. I love her, but her refusal to even consider Pagong voting as a block doomed them. If Gretchen had gone home before the merge instead of Joel, I don't know how the season would have ultimately turned out, but I don't think it would have been such a cakewalk for Tagi and Richard.

[ProfCrash]

Sandra earned her win in HvV. She worked hard for that one.

She spotted that Russell was a problem early on and was happily telling people that, they choose not to listen because they saw Russell as a goat. Sandra realized that he was more destructive and wanted him gone but the others saw him as a rash, loud player and didn't see the danger. Sandra was not going to risk her game by slamming them over the head with a sledgehammer and let them work with Russell as long as she was not a target.

Sandra could not control the idiocy that was Rupert and JT and handing off a hidden immunity idol. The Heros saw the new guy as the last man standing and were so worried about a womans alliance that they gave Russell a freaking idol. She cannot control Rupert and his ego. It doesn't matter what she said, Rupert was not going to listen. Keep in mind, this is the same idiot that built a shelter in ground on a beach so it could be flooded on a regular basis. He is so hard to move off his opinion that his tribe allowed him to do that. Saying that Sandra's game was crap because she could not convince he of the giant ego to do something smart is silly.

Sandra was well aware that Russell knew she was targeting him. She used that knowledge to her advantage. She allowed, hell encouraged, Russell to see her as a goat when she knew she was not. She knew that she had all the Hero's votes because she knew that they would not like Russell's grandstanding. She knew Russell was not seen as a strategist. She used Russell's ego against him.

All of her efforts to toss Russell paid off at the final vote because she had told everyone who Russell targeted what Russell was going to do and they allowed their own egos to ignore her. But the game played out exactly as she told them it would. There was not a jury member who knew that she had been right and that they had a chance to change the game and didn't take those opportunities. On top of that, Russell's crowing and bragging and asshole behavior pissed them off. So Sandra was golden when she hit the final tribal. The fact that Russell and Parvati had so totally misread the jury is amazing.

So saying her win was lucky is flat out BS. She read the situation right and couldn't control the massive egos out there. JT thought he was a great strategist and wanted to show he could win without Rob. Rupert and Russell's have massive egos that no one can contain. Parvati thought she was controlling the game and didn't realize how her own behavior pissed people off. Sandra saw all of that and went with it. Remember, she had conversations with Rupert where she flat out said that Russell didn't trust her and did not want her talking to Rupert on her own. She knew that they knew she was targeting them. Instead of changing her behavior she kept doing it because she knew that Russell didn't see her as a threat so she could get away with it.

Sandra is very capable of reading people and responding to them in a manner that they are comfortable. She is loyal. She is loud, louder then I like but it seems like she is capable of dialing it back when needed. She can pull together an alliance really fast. She is not good at challenges but she is able to convince people that that is not important. She knows how to sell herself and her game.

[KimberStormer]

4 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

 Saying that Sandra's game was crap because she could not convince he of the giant ego to do something smart is silly.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, failing to convince the Heroes was not the problem; trying to convince them in the first place was.  There was one road to the win for Sandra and that road was an All-Villain F3.  She tried to wreck her own game by trying to vote out Russell.  Nothing good for Sandra could have come from them believing her and working with her.  And nothing would have made it worth the Heroes' while to take her along; she would have been like Candice, voted out as soon as she was not useful.  If Sandra succeeds at the merge, I see either JT or Amanda winning, unless Amanda totally blows it at F3 again and some horrible result like Colby winning is the upshot.  (And HvV becomes a terrible season because who wants to watch those horrible Heroes winning?  Ugh.)

I love Sandra, and as we are seeing she is wily and adaptable even to the position of Queen (so convincingly that now it seems "She can put together an alliance in 15 minutes!" is becoming a retroactive Sandra Thing That Everyone Knows About), and she did play a great game at several points during HvV; but I just don't think that it makes any sense to point to the attempt to convince the Heroes to vote out Russell as a resume bullet for Sandra.  It was a bad idea and its failure (whoever you want to "blame" for that) saved her bacon.

Edited March 15, 2017 by KimberStormer

[loki567]

I'm not sure about that, although we're getting into territory we have no way of knowing about. But in a hypothetical situation where the Heroes got the upper hand at the merge, there still would have been a lot of game to play. Amanda would probably end up screwing over JT, Rupert, and Colby at some point, could she do that and make effectively make her case at F3? Think about her track record.

Then you got a couple players left like Danielle, Candice, Jerri who would be completely overlooked and unlikely to win that season regardless what they have done. The perception of them was too weak. I'd like to say that the corpse of Colby was similar, but he's a male player with huge reputation so if he got himself to FTC, he could definitely win.

Once again, this is all stuff that is pointless to speculate about, but I definitely don't buy that Sandra "only had one path," to the win. 

[Vyk]

9 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

Sandra could not control the idiocy that was Rupert and JT and handing off a hidden immunity idol. The Heros saw the new guy as the last man standing and were so worried about a womans alliance that they gave Russell a freaking idol. She cannot control Rupert and his ego. It doesn't matter what she said, Rupert was not going to listen. Keep in mind, this is the same idiot that built a shelter in ground on a beach so it could be flooded on a regular basis. He is so hard to move off his opinion that his tribe allowed him to do that. Saying that Sandra's game was crap because she could not convince he of the giant ego to do something smart is silly.

I'm gonna check you right there, @ProfCrash.  Everything in your post is spot-on except for this.  At the merge, Sandra immediately went to Rupert, pulled him aside, and warned him about Russell.  Rupert believed her just as quickly because, based on their Pearl Islands history, she would've had no reason to lie to him.  He, in turn, went to J.T., Amanda, Candice, and Colby, saying, "He's on the Villains tribe for a reason!"  And indeed, the latter three agreed that they shouldn't just blindly trust him.  It was J.T. and his own giant ego that forced the Heroes to trust Russell, because Rupert was the one who said that he knew they shouldn't have trusted him after they got screwed at the Tribal Council with Parvati's two-idol play.

Everything else, though?  Very much accurate.

[Lantern7]

Am I naive to think that maybe Sandra didn't want to eat baby goat? And that she was screwing with the heads of the tribe? I mean, she's a mother, right? Goat veal shouldn't be on the menu. I'm still rooting for her, but I understand if she gets a backlash. At least she didn't do it herself. Sia would've given Tai $100,000 at the reunion, then try to curbstomp Sandra.

[susannot]

I so want to agree Lantern7.  But in what way would this have screwed with the heads of the tribe,to her advantage?  I do note,of course, that she now survives another tribal council, and will make it to Day 12.

[choclatechip45]

I love Sandra. I think she earned both of her wins.

[Lantern7]

My biggest fear: "You think I'm a bitch? DO YOU?!? GUESS WHAT?!? [rips off mask] I'm back! I'm the best that's ever been!!! You assholes shoulda checked for the 'Hantz' tattoo! Dumb fuckers! That bitch set mah hat on fire, so I took her place!! I'm gonna win, and they ain't a goddamn thing you can do about it!"

Once again . . . I really want to think the best of Sandra. I'd only be more shaken if Cirie wanted goat for dinner in between giggles.

[KimberStormer]

On ‎2‎/‎15‎/‎2017 at 10:54 PM, KimberStormer said:

Today I was thinking (is this morbid?), if Tai creates Mark Jr., will this cast go along with it?  I feel like Sandra, for example, is unsentimental enough to put the axe to 'im.  After all, she ate Freckles.

Ahahaha I was so right!

We could talk about HvV all day but should probably do that in that season's thread, I suppose.  I do want to stick up for Jerri; she played a hell of a game and I think she would have done really well at F3.

[ProfCrash]

16 hours ago, Vyk said:

I'm gonna check you right there, @ProfCrash.  Everything in your post is spot-on except for this.  At the merge, Sandra immediately went to Rupert, pulled him aside, and warned him about Russell.  Rupert believed her just as quickly because, based on their Pearl Islands history, she would've had no reason to lie to him.  He, in turn, went to J.T., Amanda, Candice, and Colby, saying, "He's on the Villains tribe for a reason!"  And indeed, the latter three agreed that they shouldn't just blindly trust him.  It was J.T. and his own giant ego that forced the Heroes to trust Russell, because Rupert was the one who said that he knew they shouldn't have trusted him after they got screwed at the Tribal Council with Parvati's two-idol play.

Everything else, though?  Very much accurate.

Gotcha. I don't rewatch seasons so I don't always remember the details right. I remember her talking to Rupert and telling him what was going on. I remember JT and comp wanting to work with Russell. I hate Rupert and tossed him into their camp and forgot that he had talked to them about getting rid of Russell.

[Lantern7]

Still thinking Sandra wasn't that hungry. New theory: She's putting on an act as a middle finger to Burnett over S20. "Hey, I got cast as a vlllain because I had a mouth and opinions. I'm here to make sure I'm the only two-time champ. After that, I may as well be the bitch." Then comes another shakeup, and she's trying to sell the others on killing, cooking and eating Tai. "If it's him or the chickens, he'd volunteer. Don't worry about Sia . . . I'll handle her. I'll hang that weirdo from the chandelier."

[Rachel RSL]

Stealing this from another thread, Caleb discussing Sandra in an interview: 

Quote

 I was completely wrong about who Sandra is. Sandra is nice. She’s bright. She’s fun. She’s a good player. She deserved to be there. Everything I said going in, I don’t say now. She has my respect. She was very respectful on the island, very nice and sweet. 

They never show this side of her but it answers the question about how good her social game is. I guess it's easier to edit her as a villain.

[Lantern7]

So basically: "She'll fuck you up, but she'd never fuck you over." Sounds about right.

[Lantern7]

To review: Sandra played under the radar on Pearl Islands, and she won. She played the same game in Heroes vs. Villains, and she won. Right now, it's a huge shock that she didn't show up with a t-shirt proclaiming "HAIL TO THE QUEEN," and she hasn't gotten a single vote in three Tribal Councils. I love her to pieces, but if I'm playing the game with her, she goes over the top rope. She's won twice. Wasn't past wins the reason Tina, Richard and Ethan got booted from All-Stars?

At this point, I am convinced that Sandra can shoot a contestant, and not only would she not get thrown off and arrested, but the victim would not vote for her. Somebody check her for three sixes or a pentagram.

[KimberStormer]

It is pretty amazing.  Still, she should have listened to Hali tonight.  It's only Brad's bad decision-making that kept Sandra from being idoled out. 

[MrsR]

Hey, in HvV if everything had gone right and Tyson hadn't voted himself out, the final four would have been, Rob Tyson Courtney and SANDRA.

She made an excellent alliance right from the get go.  

But Tyson...

[Vyk]

2 hours ago, KimberStormer said:

It is pretty amazing.  Still, she should have listened to Hali tonight.  It's only Brad's bad decision-making that kept Sandra from being idoled out. 

Bad decision-making by not doing something to help J.T.?  Hardly.  I actually don't even think she was ever in consideration, at least not by the time Tribal Council arrived.

[peachmangosteen]

I said this in the ep thread, but I'm saying it here again because it truly just boggles my mind: How do some viewers still not see what a great player Sandra is? I just, I can't fathom it. She is a freak of nature!

That being said though, I think it was mistake of her not to go with Hali's plan of getting rid of Brad. Now, ultimately, it probably wouldn't have worked because JT likely would have told Brad and then the idol would've been used on Brad and Malcom still would've gone. But still. 

I'd like to know why Sandra sees Sierra as such a threat. I'm thinking there's some pre-game reason for that.

Edited March 23, 2017 by peachmangosteen