Travelers - General Discussion

[iMonrey]

They never really did much with Trevor's parents beyond the first season. We saw him packing up and moving out this season, but he just ended up moving to HQ to live with Philip. Don't his parents want to see where he lives? Does he never expect them to visit? The characters were just sort of dropped.

[MisterGlass]

Just finished binging the last of the season, and wow what a closer.  I'm stunned at how good the last part of this season was.  I've liked the show from the beginning, but it really stepped up near the end.  Agree with other posters that either it's a great set up for a change or its a dynamite series finale.

I was surprised at the initial mind wipe of the characters to minimize the damage due to exposure, but liked that they explored the inevitability of maintaining protocol 5 with David and Kat.  I liked the exploration of their reactions to the crisis.  I have felt bad for Kat since the beginning because she was a victim of the program; I liked that she took a stand for herself and kicked out 3468.  David's death caught me by surprise, but not nearly as much as Marcy sacrificing herself to protect the code.  I would actually have liked more direct cooperation with the FBI agent.  Maclaren kept her at arms length and could have had her as a stronger ally.

I figured Amanda Tapping would be a long term host for 001, but no.  I never expected Jeff to become a traveler, let alone 001.  He did nail the cadence of Enrico Colantoni in the scene with Marcy.  I should have realized it at the operations base; in retrospect he was doing it then too.  I thought he was a little loopy after the kidnapping.

Every season I have loved the world building.  I wanted to see more of Phillip's view and we got that this season.  I wanted to know more about 0115 and his many lives, and we got that too.  We even had a quick flashforward to him and his wife in the dome, watching the sun.  The idea of the archivist and genetic coding of memories was a brilliant addition.

All the guest stars on this show make me nostalgic for old scifi shows.  I think this is the nicest character I've ever seen Christopher Heyerdahl play.  I haven't seen Jim Byrnes in quite a while.  I was happy to see Poppy for a moment too.

[alexvillage]

So, I am rewatching the show and was paying close attention to the episode where 001 arrives. 

I hope the writers don't scrap 9/11 from the show's history. It is not really necessary for the story. They don't want Vincent to arrive, they accomplished that. Mac can leave the building the same way Vincent did. 

 

And I find myself agreeing with the faction that we are not supposed to be governed by a machine. 

[Iamhydrogen]

On 12/30/2018 at 4:34 PM, aquarian1 said:

I can't help but get caught up in the  "timey wimey wibbly wobbliness" of it all.  If the director and travelors succeed, then the Earth and humanity are in good shape, most likely negating the creation and domination of the director so then the director doesn't exist.  Which means he/it never sent anyone back to fix history, which means we're right back where we started.  :-P  (Yes, I know parallel universes/alternate timelines/etc) 

Yeah I tried to make sense of it the best I could.  What I figure is they keeps jumping timelines as things change, and they do directly address that with the faction.  Once they jump back they are really starting a new timeline anyway since the person didn't die.  Since they exist, they will continue to exist.  If the Helios thing had been the one event that would have saved humanity, then they would have started a new timeline where the Director has not been made.  Then they just live out their lives.  So yes in that timeline there isn't a Director to send anyone back, but they are already there.  As I am typing I feel like I am going in circles.  But I think the bottom line is timelines just keep getting spawned on each action with the intention of spawning one without the Director.  But there are still brain-hurting issues like in the timeline before Grant went back, 001 was still in the future leading the faction which means the traveler program is different?  I guess all the Directors from all the timelines are connected somehow to share information.  

That last season sure felt like a season finale.  Maybe Netflix wanted to reboot the show with new actors, maybe film in the US instead or something.  Its possible some actors only singed on until the end of season 3.  But the end does give them the ability to make a whole new show if they want to.  Maybe one set in 2001 where we have one traveler already to greet new travelers and maybe set off a new and better path.

Edited January 4, 2019 by Iamhydrogen

[MisterGlass]

3 hours ago, Iamhydrogen said:

But there are still brain-hurting issues like in the timeline before Grant went back, 001 was still in the future leading the faction which means the traveler program is different?  I guess all the Directors from all the timelines are connected somehow to share information.  

I think there are two possibilities with 001's leadership of the faction.  001 clearly had issues with the director, and how he ended up as the first person sent back is still an unknown.  Maybe he volunteered, maybe it was punishment.  If he volunteered, maybe it was because of the habitat collapse that occurred in his original timeline, and didn't occur in the Helios timeline.  If he normally lived in the collapsed dome or was close to a lot of people in it, then when it collapsed he felt like the future had nothing more for him, and he volunteered. 

In the timeline where the dome didn't collapse, his allies or friends survived, and he became a rebel leader of a sort.  From his followers' perspective he may have been sent back in time as a punishment.  Or, his plan in the season 3 finale may have succeeded - he uploaded his consciousness to computers, and took the long way to the future, and leads the faction as a sentient program.  Perhaps he's more acceptable to them than the director because he used to be human.

[Clanstarling]

3 hours ago, MisterGlass said:

I think there are two possibilities with 001's leadership of the faction.  001 clearly had issues with the director, and how he ended up as the first person sent back is still an unknown.  Maybe he volunteered, maybe it was punishment.  If he volunteered, maybe it was because of the habitat collapse that occurred in his original timeline, and didn't occur in the Helios timeline.  If he normally lived in the collapsed dome or was close to a lot of people in it, then when it collapsed he felt like the future had nothing more for him, and he volunteered. 

In the timeline where the dome didn't collapse, his allies or friends survived, and he became a rebel leader of a sort.  From his followers' perspective he may have been sent back in time as a punishment.  Or, his plan in the season 3 finale may have succeeded - he uploaded his consciousness to computers, and took the long way to the future, and leads the faction as a sentient program.  Perhaps he's more acceptable to them than the director because he used to be human.

The one thing I remember about 001's motives is that he was dying of a terrible disease in the future. He was a volunteer as I recall, and was the test case because one way or another, he'd be dead. He didn't count on being able to survive in the past - he just expected to have enough time to send the message that the transfer worked. But then he saw an opportunity and ran with it and was against the director mostly because the director would eliminate him if he found him.

[MisterGlass]

4 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

The one thing I remember about 001's motives is that he was dying of a terrible disease in the future.

You're right, I forgot he mentioned that.

[alexvillage]

12 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

The one thing I remember about 001's motives is that he was dying of a terrible disease in the future. He was a volunteer as I recall, and was the test case because one way or another, he'd be dead. He didn't count on being able to survive in the past - he just expected to have enough time to send the message that the transfer worked. But then he saw an opportunity and ran with it and was against the director mostly because the director would eliminate him if he found him.

Yes, I rewatched the episode and that's what happened. He also took the money and some bonds (?) and presumably that's how he was able to buy security and influence, then pair up with the rich guy.

And he was right that the Director would kill him if he was found, which happened when his wife and partner died. That's why he created the faction. How it plays into the transfers and contacts between present and future sill confuses me. 

[Iamhydrogen]

15 minutes ago, alexvillage said:

Yes, I rewatched the episode and that's what happened. He also took the money and some bonds (?) and presumably that's how he was able to buy security and influence, then pair up with the rich guy.

And he was right that the Director would kill him if he was found, which happened when his wife and partner died. That's why he created the faction. How it plays into the transfers and contacts between present and future sill confuses me. 

I don't think that led to him creating the faction.  It was a different 001 that created the faction.  He didn't know he was leading the faction until the faction girl told him.  I think he ended up leading the faction in the new timeline because it makes the story more interesting.  Also I think he was supposed to jump into the Rich guys mind, not the IT tech.  I think since the IT guy was sitting in the chair and at the TELL the wrong guy was jumped into (although presumably all those people were going to die), but they just needed to jump into a guy at a keyboard.  I guess since he realized it was the wrong guy, he figured it would be easier to run.

[Clanstarling]

21 minutes ago, Iamhydrogen said:

I don't think that led to him creating the faction.  It was a different 001 that created the faction.  He didn't know he was leading the faction until the faction girl told him.  I think he ended up leading the faction in the new timeline because it makes the story more interesting.  Also I think he was supposed to jump into the Rich guys mind, not the IT tech.  I think since the IT guy was sitting in the chair and at the TELL the wrong guy was jumped into (although presumably all those people were going to die), but they just needed to jump into a guy at a keyboard.  I guess since he realized it was the wrong guy, he figured it would be easier to run.

I agree. The original TELL was the guy's whose office he was in, and jumping into the computer tech gave him an anonymity that helped him run. Also, being a computer expert (I think) from the future helped him create the business with the contents of the safe, though he flew under the radar at first, as the silent partner if I'm remembering it right.

Also if I'm remembering it right, the original faction members traveled to the present time after hi-jacking the director (or something like that). Later they started recruiting (I think, or did they just overwrite?) So 001 wouldn't have been able to create the faction. 001 ultimately becoming the leader of the Faction by their choice makes sense, though.

[alexvillage]

1 hour ago, Clanstarling said:

Also if I'm remembering it right, the original faction members traveled to the present time after hi-jacking the director (or something like that). Later they started recruiting (I think, or did they just overwrite?) So 001 wouldn't have been able to create the faction. 001 ultimately becoming the leader of the Faction by their choice makes sense, though.

I guess you are right. Something to do with Grace rebooting him and the faction taking advantage of the director being "offline"? 

This show confuses me sometimes.

 

Vincent did try to send the message but because he was't the I.T. guy he couldn't fix the computer and send the message because the screen remained frozen. And yes, walking away was easier then.

[Iamhydrogen]

41 minutes ago, alexvillage said:

I guess you are right. Something to do with Grace rebooting him and the faction taking advantage of the director being "offline"? 

This show confuses me sometimes.

 

Vincent did try to send the message but because he was't the I.T. guy he couldn't fix the computer and send the message because the screen remained frozen. And yes, walking away was easier then.

Thats right.  I had to go back and rewatch 201, I didn't understand the importance of those details at the time.  Also even the IT guy wasn't the one that was supposed to be there, the regular guy had called in sick.  So I wonder why the Director didn't send 002 a second later, either into the host (or the host at that location) or another host in that office.  Or maybe they tried another location altogether.

I wondered what happened with the shelter 41 collapse that was different due to the traveler interventions.  It seemed like it was a result of the Helios mission.  Maybe had to do with someone who lived, maybe the shelter was built in a different way.  It was referenced so much but there didn't seem to be a cause/effect relationship like we saw with other timeline changes.

[MisterGlass]

4 hours ago, Iamhydrogen said:

So I wonder why the Director didn't send 002 a second later, either into the host (or the host at that location) or another host in that office.  Or maybe they tried another location altogether.

I wondered what happened with the shelter 41 collapse that was different due to the traveler interventions.  It seemed like it was a result of the Helios mission.  Maybe had to do with someone who lived, maybe the shelter was built in a different way. 

Since the director didn't receive the initial okay arrival message, it may have assumed that the disaster happened too quickly to send it.  It might have sent another traveler soon after to another location where it was more likely to receive a reply.  By the time 001's survival was determined, there was no way to send a traveler back to his original known location because others had been sent.

The shelter being built in a different way is a good idea.  I also wondered if the Helios impact changed the geologic stability of the area, leading to the future building collapse.

[jhlipton]

I guess I'm the only one who hated the finale.  "Hey, guess what?  the past three seasons that you wat6ched?  Never happened.  And sure three people died but Our Heroes lead great lives (which is what Trevor was seeing at Marcy's and Mac's homes.  Small price to pay!"  And how is the plan reset?  By Mac sending a message to the past of the Director's timeline.  No, that's not stupid at all.

If there'sa a Season 4, I'll expect it to be just as meaningless as the past 3.

[Clanstarling]

8 hours ago, jhlipton said:

I guess I'm the only one who hated the finale.  "Hey, guess what?  the past three seasons that you wat6ched?  Never happened.  And sure three people died but Our Heroes lead great lives (which is what Trevor was seeing at Marcy's and Mac's homes.  Small price to pay!"  And how is the plan reset?  By Mac sending a message to the past of the Director's timeline.  No, that's not stupid at all.

If there'sa a Season 4, I'll expect it to be just as meaningless as the past 3.

I'd guess you aren't the only one who hated it.

Myself, I liked the reset as it opens up new story lines. I don't see it as meaningless - just one attempt that failed. Like the episode where they repeatedly tried to transfer to the skydiving woman. Eventually one attempt will succeed (presumably).

Sending a message to the past of the Director's timeline was critical at this juncture because at this point there is nothing to stop the Director from being eliminated by the faction, now that they've taken over the world leadership for the direct mission to end the Director. So, for me, not a stupid choice. But I can see how it would be to others, especially since the time travel loops and logic are not quite rock solid in the series.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Clanstarling

[Iamhydrogen]

So since we already have multiple timelines, why would it matter that Grant sent the message before 001 arrived?  I mean, the Director is in the future, the far future really and by the time it would send 001 it would have all the information about what happened.  It is analyzing all this stuff hundreds of years in the future, so its not like Grants 2001 email would get to the Director before sending 001, but then timelines so its not clear what Grants email would actually do.  And really what would be the difference in Ver 2 of the program.  Was it all based on 001 leaving the building that kicks off all those events?  It seems in Ver 2 you could just as likely have a 001 type travelers that will buck the system and go rogue.  I figured the point that was being made when they diverted Helios and the show didn't end was that there was always going to be something to cause humanity's downfall.  Its like plugging holes in a dam with your fingers, its short term solution that is ineffective in the long term.  Its an interesting story setup to go back in time to save the future, what what is the real end game.  That they will finally do the one thing that fixes it all.  It almost seems like the true solution is to just send everyone in the future back to the 21st so they can live full and happy lives.

[Clanstarling]

2 hours ago, Iamhydrogen said:

So since we already have multiple timelines, why would it matter that Grant sent the message before 001 arrived?  I mean, the Director is in the future, the far future really and by the time it would send 001 it would have all the information about what happened.  It is analyzing all this stuff hundreds of years in the future, so its not like Grants 2001 email would get to the Director before sending 001, but then timelines so its not clear what Grants email would actually do.  And really what would be the difference in Ver 2 of the program.  Was it all based on 001 leaving the building that kicks off all those events?  It seems in Ver 2 you could just as likely have a 001 type travelers that will buck the system and go rogue.  I figured the point that was being made when they diverted Helios and the show didn't end was that there was always going to be something to cause humanity's downfall.  Its like plugging holes in a dam with your fingers, its short term solution that is ineffective in the long term.  Its an interesting story setup to go back in time to save the future, what what is the real end game.  That they will finally do the one thing that fixes it all.  It almost seems like the true solution is to just send everyone in the future back to the 21st so they can live full and happy lives.

The director has been blinded, as it were, due to the archives being destroyed. As I recall, that's the stated method of how it's updated. And the AI connection to the director is in the hands of the Faction at the moment, if I remember right.

But I'm not going to argue consistency and logic regarding the timelines - it hurts my head.

[jhlipton]

13 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

Myself, I liked the reset as it opens up new story lines. I don't see it as meaningless - just one attempt that failed. Like the episode where they repeatedly tried to transfer to the skydiving woman. Eventually one attempt will succeed (presumably).

The difference with the skydiving woman is that we didn't get hours and hours of her back-story.  So not much was undone with each attempt.  Here we had three seasons to get to know these characters.  And for what -- they're all going to die, and soon (even Marcy -- that scene on the bus must happen before Traveler 3569 takes over).   So next season, if there is one, we start all over from zero with a new cast (if the Director sends Travelers to the same people, it's way too dumb to run things).  Blech.

13 hours ago, Clanstarling said:

Sending a message to the past of the Director's timeline was critical at this juncture because at this point there is nothing to stop the Director from being eliminated by the faction, now that they've taken over the world leadership for the direct mission to end the Director. So, for me, not a stupid choice. But I can see how it would be to others, especially since the time travel loops and logic are not quite rock solid in the series.

10 hours ago, Iamhydrogen said:

So since we already have multiple timelines, why would it matter that Grant sent the message before 001 arrived?  I mean, the Director is in the future, the far future really and by the time it would send 001 it would have all the information about what happened. 

McLaren's choice wasn't stupid; what was stupid was the writers thinking that time stood still in the future (or actually regressed.  Think about it: It was 18 years since 001 was sent, during which the Faction was formed and gained power.  2018 McLaren went to 2001, but the Director didn't go back in time.   I suppose one could wobble together a retcon that the email address was sent to the pre-001 Director, but since I'm not prone to giving them excuses, I say poppycock.

[roctavia]

A lot of this becomes the paradoxes of time travel... clearly there are multiple timelines in this time travel scenario... It's what Philip was seeing and also what protocol Omega is all about- you failed and the director gave up on that timeline, probably to focus on a different one. 

Grant went back in time, just as travelers in our seasons changed things that happened in the future, he went back even before that so he could change the past, his message went to the director who was about to send 001... it was probably the directors plan all along, that's why the director didn't stop anything happening in the finale, the director knew they would figure out that they could send Grant back who could send the earlier version of the director the message the that traveler program failed... hence the director being ready with program version 2.  Is it the exact same timeline that we've been watching all along? Maybe not, maybe we're now in an alternate timeline that has a better chance of making things better. 

 

I'm still hoping for a 4th season, because i'd like to see what they can do with this... as they have done a good job in general with the storylines, at least in my opinion anyway. I also think they have the means to keep some of the cast (or all of it if they want) but our characters save for Maclaren could be completely different travelers.  I would miss the storyline with Trevor, since he was such an old soul in a young new body... but most of the other characters we really didn't get much of their future backstory... so it becomes the same actor able to play a new personality. With the meeting they showed us between Marcy and David, I could see her as one character that we might not see back- or maybe more on the periphery of Mac running into her, knowing her from his original time travel, but her not being Marcy from the future. Or maybe David would be the Tell this time and become a traveler.  Without 001, Marcy won't be working at the library to get killed by the gang... 

The other characters deaths could change too... I would be okay with having another episode like the first where we see different situations of our team becoming travelers, but this time they have to find Mac instead of waiting for his time of death.  001 didn't arrive, Mac didn't marry Kat, Other traveler teams might come through differently, so that could have a ripple effect leading to our known characters still eventually dying, but in different ways. I like this cast so much, I wouldn't want to lose many of them, but would be fine with them playing a different role from our original series. Especially having Mac there who knows how things played out the first time.

[alexvillage]

Thinking about time travel as a logic linear line is not possible. Trying to explain how things can even happen is not possible. It is all hypothesis at this time. That's why I am just trying to understand the events the writers throw at us without digging - too much - into the absurds and if it is possible or not. I do fall back into the logic seeking sometimes.

But mostly I am just trying to be an uncompromising watcher.

[iMonrey]

Quote

Yeah I tried to make sense of it the best I could.  What I figure is they keeps jumping timelines as things change, and they do directly address that with the faction.  Once they jump back they are really starting a new timeline anyway since the person didn't die.  Since they exist, they will continue to exist.  If the Helios thing had been the one event that would have saved humanity, then they would have started a new timeline where the Director has not been made.  Then they just live out their lives.  So yes in that timeline there isn't a Director to send anyone back, but they are already there.  As I am typing I feel like I am going in circles. 

I think Continuum did a much better job grappling with this - at least in terms of explaining it in a way I agreed with, and by introducing a concept wherein specific people are assigned to protect the timeline from changing too much, so that every deviation from the original timeline is eventually mended and re-directed back toward the original timeline. And that series was more ambitious in terms of doubling down on time travel by sending characters back 2 weeks in time who then ran into previous versions of themselves. In Travelers, we just get dialogue from the people who travel back and tell us whether things have changed in the future and how. It's simpler but it's too much of a crap shoot.

I guess the main problem with the finale is it leaves too many unanswered questions in terms of how the timeline will proceed at this point. This show was never overly interested in exploring the issue of multiple timelines, and they ended up creating a paradox that the writers probably weren't up to the task of tackling, frankly.

For what it's worth, the show has not yet been officially cancelled by Netflix. Since this season just dropped a month ago or so they are probably waiting awhile to look at final numbers. I don't know how Netflix and other streaming services gauge this kind of thing. But I have to think the producers were hedging their bets when they wrote the finale this way, and I honestly don't know what a Season 4 would look like after this. I hope we hear from the writers and producers at some point about what they have or had in mind.

Edited January 7, 2019 by iMonrey

[Booklady1017]

On 12/30/2017 at 12:49 AM, roctavia said:

I think the consciousness transfer into the psychiatrist was to free him from the director. The director thinks he’s been overwritten and the error is now corrected. Assuming the director has no knowledge that vincent built a conscious transferring device. 

 

I do do want to know what happened to Simon. They didn’t show us a new body he was going into, and have now moved the device, so ???? 

It will be interesting to see how the world responds to knowing about travelers, and why the director didn’t intervene. The personal relationships will really be interesting to see as well, though the normal people need it to sink in that the travelers took over people who are dead/ would have been dead. Cop guy would have killed her and needed to live with that, etc. 

 

Overall it it was a good season. Some unexpected twists, and something I couldn’t turn off! I hope there is another season, though I hate having to wait a year! 

 

One thing I disliked was that 01 was always steps ahead of them... would have been nice for one of their plans to work at least for a little while!

It was interesting to find out that Marcy was normal before, I had assumed it was a lifelong mental disability, but I guess they didn’t go that far into her backstory in season 1. Vincent has been causing them trouble longer than we thought!

I was confused if Vincent (001) knew that Marcy was going to be a host and somehow wanted to put a monkey wrench into the Director's plans and damaged her as a host but somehow the Director didn't know and still used her as a host. 

[Booklady1017]

Burning questions:

Grant/Kat: I know in the first season, he was in a relationship with Carly the traveler (I don't recall her number) before they were transferred to their host bodies. Then all of a sudden at some point in season two, he was then into his wife. What changed? Was it when he mentioned how he gained Grant's memories at some point about Grant and Kat's relationship and how Grant felt about her? It seemed sudden and abrupt. To be honest, I didn't see them being in love and in a real relationship. And he did just get over Carly all of a sudden? 

Trevor: Trevor said he was in 3 bodies. How can that be if A) the travelers were first sent to 2001 in our time, I think? B) they can't be sent back to the future C) can they be transferred to another body? Wouldn't his hosts be really old when he was sent to them or did they die tragically? 

Marcy: Do you think Vincent (001) purposely damaged Marcy the host to ruin the Director's plan? 

On 12/30/2017 at 7:42 PM, Clanstarling said:

1) I think he got overwritten, but I can't quite remember when or why. That's what I get from binging - the details escape me. I need to rewatch.

1) They showed some scene where they were in some sort of facility with some high tech machines and Wakefield and his faction team were all suddenly overwritten into new travelers. 

On 12/30/2017 at 9:21 PM, roctavia said:

The known faction people were all overwritten when the director came back online. Mac was about to shoot his faction FBI partner when he got all screamy and was suddenly a new traveler.  The rest of the FBI was overwritten at that time. 

Yes I remember that. I couldn't remember how many of them were part of the faction, but I do remember that scene.

On 12/30/2017 at 11:37 PM, Primal Slayer said:

I just binged S1/2 and so happy to see this place is active! 

I am not really a fan of shows that out their characters so early in a series but they apparently have a grand plan so I have faith in them to not let this ruin the series. Though I am happy that all of their "loved" ones finally know the truth and hope that it stays that way.

The actress who plays Grace having to really introduce us to 2 very different characters was so great. I loved her original persona and I love her Traveler persona. When she was on trial I loved that she continued to just speak her mind it was so funny.

Grace 2.0 is so much fun. She can be annoying but I just love some of the things that come out of her mouth.

On 12/30/2017 at 11:54 PM, Paloma said:

He must have done it just before he let her go. We see him sitting in front of the computer screen watching videos of his son at different ages, and then I think there's a quick transition to him sitting in the chair staring blankly (unconscious?) with a fly on his face, and finally a new consciousness comes into his body (presumably the Director overwriting him, as punishment). So he must have transferred his consciousness into Dr. Perrow after he watched the video of his son and before the scene with a fly on his face, even though to us it didn't really look like any time went by.

When Simon was building the device, was Ingram really there with him or was that a delusion? At the very end when Simon was lying down apparently about to be "fixed" (which I guess meant to have his consciousness sent to another, healthy host), Ingram was initially in the scene talking to him but then disappeared. It wasn't clear to me when this scene took place--in present time while the travelers were confessing and their loved ones were being abucted and then released, or sometime in the past. 

I didn't realize at first that he transferred himself into Dr. Perrow. That may be what the whole machine was about and how he said he was going to help Simon. I don't know how much that would help Simon though if he still had his paranoid schizophrenia, but anyhow i think that was his plan with the machine. 

[Booklady1017]

On 12/31/2017 at 9:50 AM, Clanstarling said:

I do agree that the transference in the end got pretty confusing. Between Vincent, the shrink, and the poor mentally disturbed guy, I'm not sure who went where - because Vincent's body sure seemed dead to me. But I do plan to re-watch and savor, instead of binge and gulp. So maybe I'll pick up the pieces.

I was confused too about that whole thing. I didn't even catch on right away that Vincent transferred his consciousness into Dr. Perrow. It made sense the way he was talking to his son about Dr. Perrow taking care of him.

[Booklady1017]

On 1/11/2018 at 10:06 AM, snowwhyte said:

I think we all need more information about how things worked in the future. Maybe I'm not paying enough attention but I feel like I have too many questions. The director is the AI that makes the decisions and has a grand plan to fix the broken future but is there a separate machine that does the body swapping? Is it in a separate location? Where do all the travellers train to become travellers? If next season provided a bit more information about the future I'd probably be less confused.

I did really want some information about the traveler's future, so we could understand the whole process together and how they became to be travelers and programmers.

On 1/12/2018 at 2:35 PM, Txmomof2 said:

What I want to know is how the number system got started. Obviously we have met 001 that was the first traveler, but if Grace is 027 she wasn't the 27th traveler because she was a new arrival after all the others that have higher numbers. So do they get a number when they go into the program? It seems like it jumps around some on that. With the grounghog day episode it was consecutive numbers like they were just going down a list. But obviously after that programmrs and earlier numbers came for the trial. 

I'm confused about the number order of the travelers. Does that number mean the order they traveled or when they became travelers? I'm not sure of the significance. I heard the numbers are representative of the traveler's names in the future but not sure more beyond that.

On 1/14/2018 at 2:15 PM, Txmomof2 said:

I think it would be interesting to know if any of the people they took over remain. We know their memories are there. But what happens if the transfer goes wonky? Is it possible for a split personality type situation to happen? Those that have traveled into more than one body, like Trevor. Do they take any of the host memories with them? 

The whole Marcy back story needs to be cleaned up too. Is it a congenital defect, or was her brain damaged by 001? Was it an underlying issue that 001 triggered from his testing? 

I have a ton of questions about Marcy and some of the other travelers too.

[Booklady1017]

On 2/1/2018 at 12:17 PM, margol29 said:

Some very thought provoking ideas:

What happens to the Travelers body when their consciousness is sent back in time to a host? Does it stay in stasis? Does it die? Do Travelers ever return to the future to reclaim their original body?

Trevor made me think of these things when he said that he switched hosts many times. Did he just jump from one host to another or did he return to the future to be sent back again? Did the host die or did another Traveler jump into his body? Trevor also mentioned that he saw some of his children grow old and die. Was this as a Traveler? or in the future because Travelers are not supposed to procreate. 

It was also mentioned in one of the episodes that many of the early programmers traveled many different times. 

The numbering system: Did it only apply to people in the program or did names become obsolete and numbers were used instead. I know that I would not be able to remember numbers as names. I would be calling them "Hey You!!"

Sorry for the rambling post but I had to get my thoughts down while I could remember them. I would love to  hear your theories on this stuff or if it was addressed in an episode that I didn't catch.

Great questions, Margol, I am curious if some of these got answered.

[jhlipton]

The Director really sucks.

1) The future is really bad, so let's pull all our resources off of fixing the problem in the here and now in favor of some dubious 12 Monkeys adventure (surely the Director would know how that movie ended!)

2) Let's give these Travellers a set of hard and fast rules that will make their lives so much harder.  Geez.

3) Let's not do any real screening so an out-and-out sociopath becomes Traveler 001.  What could possibly go wrong there?

4) Let's not have all the Travelers team up and work together, both locally and and internationally.  That way it won't matter as much if umpty-odd Travelers die -- they're just cardboard cutouts.

5) Let's not send about 12 Archivists and Hackers back in the first group and make sure all the data gets sent back OK.  And let's keep all the data in 5 locations -- gotta make it easy for the faction to dispose of it all.

6) Let's not filter Hosts for those with few family and friends,  or those in positions of power (I mean, how could you possibly get a TELL of a president giving a speech in the Rose Garden at 5:15 PM on April 3rd 2019???)  Oh, but we can't over-write someone still living, even though billions will be saved by it.

All in all, the faction can hardly do worse!

[FormerMod-a1]

1 hour ago, Booklady1017 said:

Trevor: Trevor said he was in 3 bodies. How can that be if A) the travelers were first sent to 2001 in our time, I think? B) they can't be sent back to the future C) can they be transferred to another body? Wouldn't his hosts be really old when he was sent to them or did they die tragically? 

The way I understood it is they were testing the consciousness transfer for some time before the time travel aspect.  And Trevor was one of the initial test subjects for that, and as such lived at least a few lifetimes (he talked about growing old with his love/spouse/partner in one of these iterations).  Not sure how they picked the host bodies for that, though.  

[jhlipton]

I just thought -- do you think the ending would have been better or worse if the last scene was "Timeline 5: FAIL; Starting Timeline 6"?

[roctavia]

2 hours ago, Booklady1017 said:

I was confused if Vincent (001) knew that Marcy was going to be a host and somehow wanted to put a monkey wrench into the Director's plans and damaged her as a host but somehow the Director didn't know and still used her as a host. 

I think this was meant to be coincidence... Because Marcy was chosen as a Tell because of her time of death and the backstory that was found through facebook... but that was an exercise she and David had done about social media, so none of it was true, hence the big mix up and seizure problem when the series started. The director only knows when people die from the historical record and whatever info it can gain from things like social media reports etc. to get info on said host so the traveler can train/know what they are walking in to.

 

43 minutes ago, aquarian1 said:

The way I understood it is they were testing the consciousness transfer for some time before the time travel aspect.  And Trevor was one of the initial test subjects for that, and as such lived at least a few lifetimes (he talked about growing old with his love/spouse/partner in one of these iterations).  Not sure how they picked the host bodies for that, though.  

Yes, 001 was the first Traveler to go back in time, because that hadn't been tried before... I don't know if he was 001 because of that or if he was one of the people who started the program and that's how he got his number? Not all of the lower numbers are necessarily travelers, Grace was like 027 or something, but didn't travel back in time until after much higher numbers, so I don't know if we quite know how the numbering process works... sometimes it seems like it's soley for travelers but then other stuff doesn't fit, like Grace, and 001 since Trevor's number is higher, though not that high... and he was one of the first to do the consciousness transfer... but without the time travel... So he and his wife volunteered to get put in new bodies (I assume of people who volunteered?), the way 001 jumped from Vincent to the psychiatrist.  So the Traveler technology must have been decades in the making before they were ready to start sending teams back into the past... it may have even been years before they tried to send back more travelers after 001 went... 

[MisterGlass]

14 minutes ago, jhlipton said:

I just thought -- do you think the ending would have been better or worse if the last scene was "Timeline 5: FAIL; Starting Timeline 6"?

Interesting question.  It makes me think back to the twist in the Matrix Reloaded.  For Travelers, I prefer it the way that it was.  This way, we are in on it from the beginning.

[Booklady1017]

1 hour ago, aquarian1 said:

The way I understood it is they were testing the consciousness transfer for some time before the time travel aspect.  And Trevor was one of the initial test subjects for that, and as such lived at least a few lifetimes (he talked about growing old with his love/spouse/partner in one of these iterations).  Not sure how they picked the host bodies for that, though.  

Thank you for explaining!

1 hour ago, roctavia said:

I think this was meant to be coincidence... Because Marcy was chosen as a Tell because of her time of death and the backstory that was found through facebook... but that was an exercise she and David had done about social media, so none of it was true, hence the big mix up and seizure problem when the series started. The director only knows when people die from the historical record and whatever info it can gain from things like social media reports etc. to get info on said host so the traveler can train/know what they are walking in to.

 

Yes, 001 was the first Traveler to go back in time, because that hadn't been tried before... I don't know if he was 001 because of that or if he was one of the people who started the program and that's how he got his number? Not all of the lower numbers are necessarily travelers, Grace was like 027 or something, but didn't travel back in time until after much higher numbers, so I don't know if we quite know how the numbering process works... sometimes it seems like it's soley for travelers but then other stuff doesn't fit, like Grace, and 001 since Trevor's number is higher, though not that high... and he was one of the first to do the consciousness transfer... but without the time travel... So he and his wife volunteered to get put in new bodies (I assume of people who volunteered?), the way 001 jumped from Vincent to the psychiatrist.  So the Traveler technology must have been decades in the making before they were ready to start sending teams back into the past... it may have even been years before they tried to send back more travelers after 001 went... 

Thank you for explaining.

[roctavia]

1 hour ago, Aliferously said:

 

Original Marcy and David would have been about 12 to 14 years old in 2001.  Just saying. I think that other meeting happened post 2015. 

Also, babies! Babies that need to be born!

Yes, there was clearly a time jump to get to Marcy and David meeting on the bus... but there is nothing stopping them from still being in the story in s4 assuming we go to a time near when our original traveler team arrived... something certainly could happen to pull Marcy or David back into the story at that point, even if it’s not as travlelers or the way things happened initially.

[HazelEyes4325]

I saw a post from Eric McCormack on FB that Travelers is over.  Or at least Travelers Program 1 is over.  I'm not sure if that comment meant that there might be another incarnation of the series or not.  I'm sad that it is over, but I get it and I think it ended well.  And there really is no way to go forward with this group of characters.  That being said, I would be over the moon if we get a new series with new characters.

[MisterGlass]

TV Series Finale is calling it a cancellation.  :-(  But well done to all involved.  Really enjoyed this show.

[AngelKitty]

So disappointed this is over but it did have a good ending.

[alexvillage]

I think it is a smart decision. Time travel themes are also difficult to write, unless you are willing to disappear with some characters, and it throws reason into a loop that gets harder and harder. It was a good show though, even with its flaws. I wish they had expanded the finale a little, to focus on other character too, how their lives would be, and how Mac would deal with the marriage, without messing up the future. Protocol (whatever number it was)

[Clanstarling]

I'm disappointed too, but at least the finale served as a series finale. I would have liked more about their lives in the future*, but them's the breaks.

*by that I meant, what their original lives were like. I loved the one story we did get.

Edited February 6, 2019 by Clanstarling

[jhlipton]

On 2/6/2019 at 3:06 PM, Clanstarling said:

I would have liked more about their [original] lives in the future*

If you're talking about the lives in the 2010's before the transfer, wouldn't they be dead (except, I think, for Marcy)?  If you're talking about the Travelers's live in the FUTURE future, that could have been fun to see -- what was Grace like in the future??? 

[Clanstarling]

15 minutes ago, jhlipton said:

If you're talking about the lives in the 2010's before the transfer, wouldn't they be dead (except, I think, for Marcy)?  If you're talking about the Travelers's live in the FUTURE future, that could have been fun to see -- what was Grace like in the future??? 

Even when I clarified, I was not clear. I do mean the world / future they came from prior to their download. 

Yeah, original Grace would have been fun. 

Edited February 11, 2019 by Clanstarling

[Miles]

Marcy is a dumbass. She could have shot the remaining bodyguard and 001 with ease, after the bodyguard lowered his gun. Instead she shot herself in the head. That's such a cliche and so dumb.

I guess the ending on the bus was supposed to be sweet but, I think it was kind of disturbing. Original Marcy is not our Marcy and putting her together with David feels just so wrong.

I guess had this show not been cancelled, we would have gotten the travelers 2.0 with the team being put in the same bodies, except for Marcy, which is why David and Marcy got this extra goodby. That would make sense. Without the traveler program everybody on the team would die the same way as they did before, except for Marcy, as her path was significantly altered by 001.

But tbh I kinda would have liked it more when future-Marcy (whatever her real name was) had found David again in her new body. That would have been some romantic shit. But now that the story isn't going to continue that point is a bit moot anyway.

On 1/6/2019 at 7:16 AM, jhlipton said:

And how is the plan reset?  By Mac sending a message to the past of the Director's timeline.  No, that's not stupid at all.

That really doesn't make much sense. Our heros are always in the past realtive to the director. So they could always write an email saying "Hey the traveler program doesn't work, don't send 001".

But that is timetravel mess for you.

On 1/8/2019 at 3:17 AM, jhlipton said:

3) Let's not do any real screening so an out-and-out sociopath becomes Traveler 001.  What could possibly go wrong there?

To be fair 001 was supposed to die immediatly. So you couldn't do a lot of screening. it had to be somebody who was willing to die. The problem was more that he was sent back it bit too early, so he could still escape the tower.

Edited February 12, 2019 by Miles

[monakane]

I binged this series over the past few weeks.  I love scifi, but normally don't like time travel stories because they become hard to follow and break down logically.  I have to say that I really enjoyed this one.  I loved the characters especially David.  I liked the ending and was glad Marcy and David got to meet in the alternate time line.  By the end of the show, I was disliking the director.

The only character I did not like was Kat.  The last episode where there are nuclear explosions going off around the world and she's still focused on her marriage was ridiculous.  WTF?  How could you not be freaked out by the nuclear explosions?  The last thing I would be thinking about would be the state of my marriage.  I'm glad Mac reset that.

[kickingnames]

I liked (or didn’t mind) Kat in Season 2, but the writing for her was just exhausting during the last season.

[palmaire]

One of the main themes of the show was how the travelers adjusted to the lives of their host bodies, but I usually fast-forwarded during the home scenes. The Grant/Kat relationship was dull, repetitive and draining to watch, while Jeff was intentionally a bummer. The baby was a plot anchor, constantly dragging Carly down.

Philip and Trevor being pretty much on their own was a relief. For whatever reason, David/Marcy worked for me and I was invested in their home life.

[Holmbo]

I'm watching season three now. The length McLaren goes to keep his wife from figuring out the truth is outright cruel. Making fake confession of her consenting to have her memory erased. The show has not presented a strong enough reason for him to keep their marriage going for me to buy that it's necessary. Just divorce and let her live her life!

[FormerMod-a1]

Agree.  I don't know why he wanted to keep the marriage going, too.  Just get the divorce already.  It's not like divorce is uncommon.

[MissL]

Ok. So I watched the whole thing over the last few weeks but I’ve been afraid to come to this forum because the one thread format always spoils the show for me.  So I’ve forgotten most of what I wanted to say.

I wasn’t a David fan (saw more chemistry between Phillip and Darcy but whatever) but that was still a rough way to go.

I don’t understand how Jeff and Carly completely lost custody of their kid. I can’t officially remember what Carly did that was so bad and Jeff was a cop and admittedly the drunk driving was BAD but my friend is a foster mother and her kids mother has done MUCH worse and they are still trying to rehab her and reunite them. It takes ALOT to permanently separate a kid. I didn’t buy it. Just saw it as the show wanting them to be kid free.

I am so very curious of where they thought they were going with this story.