Greenleaf - General Discussion

[Scarlett45]

34 minutes ago, riverheightsnancy said:

As a mom of a 20 year old young lady, I cried when Faith found out about her daughter. I couldn't imagine having to tell my daughter that. (not that you can't have a baby in other ways, it is just a shock that something so precious has been taken away in a snap of a finger). 

Do you mean Grace? (I haven’t seen the episode yet, but Faith is the sister that died at the start of the series)

[riverheightsnancy]

7 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

Do you mean Grace? (I haven’t seen the episode yet, but Faith is the sister that died at the start of the series)

Yes, Grace. I will fix that. 

[TVForever]

Anybody thinking that Zora's weight gain might be from something more than just sitting around doing nothing at Grandma's house? And just as Sophia has lost her ability to have children?

Coincidence? Hmm...

[TGinKY]

As a teen, I would not have been upset if told that I could not have children. The child that I had as a young adult, I love more than life itself, but the maternal extinct never kicked in until I had one.

[Jodie Landon]

15 hours ago, TGinKY said:

As a teen, I would not have been upset if told that I could not have children. The child that I had as a young adult, I love more than life itself, but the maternal extinct never kicked in until I had one.

Sophia loves kids and seems to be good with them. And just that day her boyfriend told her that he could see a future with her. I'm sure in that future she imagined having children with him. As a young adult I was told that I have an illness that causes infertility. I was having surgery and there was a possibility that I wouldn't be able to keep my reproductive organs. I was devastated. I can only imagine how I would have handled that news as an emotional, hormonal teenager. 

On another note, can one oxy really make you flip out like that? I've only taken then after major surgery or for unbearable pain but they always made me very mellow. Maybe I just don't enjoy Deborah Joy Winans as an actor, but I thought that scene really missed the mark. I'm don't think it was supposed to be funny but it was to me.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Jodie Landon

[scruffy73]

7 hours ago, Jodie Landon said:

Sophia loves kids and seems to be good with them. And just that day her boyfriend told her that he could see a future with her. I'm sure in that future she imagined having children with him. As a young adult I was told that I have an illness that causes infertility. I was having surgery and there was a possibility that I wouldn't be able to keep my reproductive organs. I was devastated. I can only imagine how I would have handled that news as an emotional, hormonal teenager. 

On another note, can one oxy really make you flip out like that? I've only taken then after major surgery or for unbearable pain but they always made me very mellow. Maybe I just don't enjoy Deborah Joy Winans as an actor, but I thought that scene really missed the mark. I'm don't think it was supposed to be funny but it was to me.

I was devastated as an adult when I accepted that I couldn’t have kids because I had spent my whole life dreaming of being a mother. I cannot imagine being told at 16/17 that my dreams of being a mother wouldn’t come true.

 

and I agree about the Charity high off drugs thing. I know everyone responds differently but I think this just came off wrong. Bad acting probably superseded the bad direction. (I too think she is terrible.) 

[Athena5217]

On 9/21/2018 at 1:21 PM, Jodie Landon said:

On another note, can one oxy really make you flip out like that? I've only taken then after major surgery or for unbearable pain but they always made me very mellow.

I think Charity had alcohol with the oxy. Also, people can have very different reactions to medication.

[Kirkydee]

Yeah. Not only did Charity had booze with opiates, throw in the fact that she's all messed up in the head from her arrest, the baby daddy drama and losing her singing gig.  Plus she still hasn't fully come to grips that her ex is gay.  Seeing her reaction to the boyfriend proves it for me IMO

[Joimiaroxeu]

"That's nature's way." Thumbs up from the patriarchy.

So it looks like we're headed for an opioid addiction arc for Charity. She's not still breast feeding, is she?

Given Sophia's age, shouldn't she have had at least one GYN examination by now? Maybe if they'd caught her condition sooner there would've been less drastic options.

Quote

Anybody thinking that Zora's weight gain might be from something more than just sitting around doing nothing at Grandma's house? And just as Sophia has lost her ability to have children?

Yeah, there might be an abortion storyline afoot. I hope the show doesn't go there though since Zora is legally still a child herself.

[Dee]

Knowing Mae & Kerissa, they'd seize that baby and raise it as their own.

[scruffy73]

5 hours ago, Dee said:

Knowing Mae & Kerissa, they'd seize that baby and raise it as their own.

After sending Zora away to have the baby in secret.

[Scarlett45]

9 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Given Sophia's age, shouldn't she have had at least one GYN examination by now? Maybe if they'd caught her condition sooner there would've been less drastic options.

No not necessarily. She’s 17 or so? If she hasn’t had any issues (like irregular periods, extremely painful periods, a yeast infection etc) and isn’t sexually active or looking to be many girls in her position don’t need to see a Gyn until they are 18 OR thinking about being sexually active/ hormonal contraceptives. Basically she’s at an age where it wouldn’t be odd if she had been or odd if she hadn’t. 

9 hours ago, Dee said:

Knowing Mae & Kerissa, they'd seize that baby and raise it as their own.

 

3 hours ago, scruffy73 said:

After sending Zora away to have the baby in secret.

They so would. I do NOT want Zora to be pregnant because I wouldn’t want her to be tied to that abusive asshole. I’d be more interested in witness her growth as she deals with coming out of the violent relationship. 

[jhlipton]

On 9/16/2018 at 9:58 PM, Dee said:

Who ever said they were in competition?

Yoiu implied it.  Or I inferred it.

On 9/12/2018 at 9:44 PM, Dee said:

Season 3 of Greenleaf is kicking Season 3 of Queen Sugar's ass.

 

On 9/21/2018 at 10:21 AM, Jodie Landon said:

I'm sure in that future she imagined having children with him.

Just before she drifted off before her surgery, she said she wanted a life "with puppies and kids".

[Dee]

4 hours ago, jhlipton said:

Yoiu implied it.  Or I inferred it.

I compared the seasons, not the shows.

[Scarlett45]

12 hours ago, jhlipton said:

Just before she drifted off before her surgery, she said she wanted a life "with puppies and kids".

Also the poor thing just woke up from surgery! The anthesia messes with your brain chemistry on a good day, I’m not surprised she was a crying mess poor dear. Never mind if she wanted to have kids or not- also there’s a big difference between choosing to be childfree or adopting as an adult woman and having the choice taken from you at 17.

There are also health implications from having no ovaries at 17, she’s been kicked into menopause 30 years early (thinking of her bones, sexual functioning etc etc). 

[MulletorHater]

On 9/6/2018 at 6:05 PM, Scarlett45 said:

I think learning that her brother really did rape her daughter (and other girls too), combined with the guilt of having not believed her would do a number on anyone. Lady Mae is questioning her choices. 

That's one of the reasons I love this show so much.  It actually invests in character development (unlike Tyler Perry's shows).  One doesn't need drama every damn second to get the audience to invest in a show or a character.  Lynn Whitfield can tell a story just with her facial expressions without uttering a word.  She and David Keith are truly the anchors of this show and elevate the performances of the younger actors and actresses, particularly Merle Dandridge.

[Risha17]

On 9/13/2018 at 7:34 AM, bichonblitz said:

An abusive boyfriend that beats her up yet continually tells her he loves her?

And combine that with Zora having sex with said boyfriend, some (IMO) hints of colorism, Isiah being a star, and her always being a mouthy spoiled brat, you get her lashing at family and friends alike with little to no consideration of their feelings.  

[Dee]

James & Mae are the worst parents ever.

[mrsbagnet]

5 hours ago, Dee said:

James & Mae are the worst parents ever.

Mae's reaction during the talk with Iyanla was just cruel. She calls in the big guns to get help for her daughter but then disregards the advice and makes it all about herself. Just appalling. She's shown herself unfit to be a pastor. She doesn't even have compassion for her own children.

Edited October 4, 2018 by mrsbagnet

[bichonblitz]

1 hour ago, mrsbagnet said:

Mae's reaction during the talk with Iyanla was just cruel. She calls in the big guns to get help for her daughter but then disregards the advice and makes it all about herself. Just appalling. She's shown herself unfit to be a pastor. She doesn't even have compassion for her own children.

I'm back to hating Mae. She wouldn't even give Charity a chance to talk. Is anything ever her fault? Cold bitch. 

I thought Sophia was going to jump in to the water. 

Edited October 4, 2018 by bichonblitz

[Risha17]

1 hour ago, mrsbagnet said:

Mae's reaction during the talk with Iyanla was just cruel. She calls in the big guns to get help for her daughter but then disregards the advice and makes it all about herself. Just appalling. She's shown herself unfit to be a pastor. She doesn't even have compassion for her own children.

 

 

33 minutes ago, bichonblitz said:

I'm back to hating Mae. She wouldn't even give Charity a chance to talk. Is anything ever her fault? Cold bitch. 

I thought Sophia was going to jump in to the water. 

 

I fluctuated between hating Mae and feeling a great deal of sympathy for her in that scene because her response just reveals just how her traumatic background has pushed her to the point to automatically assume anyone and everyone either blames her for some past deed or is out to get her, so she has to always be in defense mode. I don't think she's unfit to be pastor per se; she's a great speaker, has charisma and it would be nice to see her dismantle the patriarchal culture within Cavalry. However, until she receives healing and learns to have compassion for others and self-forgiveness (I honestly think her blaming others for her problems is her projecting her own feelings of guilt and feeling responsible), she needs to stay far away from the pulpit. 

And speaking of Sophia, I was scared and worried she was going to jump in the water, too. Was totally relieved she just threw her necklace away.  And as horrible as this sounds, I really enjoyed her being mean to Zora and hope we get more moments like that (Zora deserves it). 

Edited October 4, 2018 by Risha17

[Scarlett45]

9 hours ago, Risha17 said:

And speaking of Sophia, I was scared and worried she was going to jump in the water, too. Was totally relieved she just threw her necklace away.  And as horrible as this sounds, I really enjoyed her being mean to Zora and hope we get more moments like that (Zora deserves it). 

I didn’t think Sophia was going to jump, but given how she’d fiddled with her necklace in her first scene of the episode I figured it be a crisis of faith. 

I also enjoyed her being mean to Zora. Zora has been a shitty daughter and friend/cousin for a while now. Intentionally cruel- time for her to see it dished back out. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

She doesn't even have compassion for her own children.

Which makes me wonder why Jacob thought it would be a good idea to dump Zora on her. I think Lady Mae only cares about her kids and grandkids to the extent that they can support her image and the family business. Any threats have to be reined in or largely disregarded. Jacob and Gigi seem to have her number but Charity is still learning. I think she's about to move Zora into the "not my problem" category.

[Dee]

Jacob is Mae's favorite. She grants him way more latitude than she does her daughters.

[Scarlett45]

13 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Which makes me wonder why Jacob thought it would be a good idea to dump Zora on her. I think Lady Mae only cares about her kids and grandkids to the extent that they can support her image and the family business. Any threats have to be reined in or largely disregarded. Jacob and Gigi seem to have her number but Charity is still learning. I think she's about to move Zora into the "not my problem" category.

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. 

 

Lady Mae’s isn’t the right place for Zora right now (although I did love her verbal smack down after she took the housekeepers phone, about how she doesn’t love herself if she wants a boy that hurts her)- Mae has her own things going on, and doesn’t have the bandwidth to deal with Zora. Which isn’t a character flaw, Zora has two parents alive and well, THEY should be dealing with Zora. 

I think Lady Mae loves her kids, but is too wrapped up in her own guilt (MAC!!) and the failing of her marriage to hear about Charity’s problems, especially since Charity was always the “easy” child. I recalled her showing her compassion etc last season during the divorce, Lady Mae falls into a trap a lot of older black women fall into, having to live with so much trauma, oppression, abuse, the see the younger generation as “whining” when addressing their emotional needs. She also thinks she’s being “blamed”, I don’t recall Charity blaming her, but Mother’s guilt and all that. 

I am enjoying Sophia’s journey right now, her crisis of faith is understandable, especially as a new Christian, but they aren’t using her surgery to give her a personality transplant. Her “I’m not barren I’m STERILE” was golden, yes honey yes you tell him! Not that I’m particularly upset at her boyfriend, he’s a teenager too and he meant well but he was saying all the wrong things (which happens)- that didn’t mean Sophia needed to “take it” because his heart was in the right place. 

Edited October 5, 2018 by Scarlett45

[Arcadiasw]

Wow. Lady Mae needs to sit with Iyanla immediately. I felt so sorry for Charity. Her mother didn't listen at all to what she said. She's still feeling guilt with Mac and hadn't dealt with her own personal demons. James did seem to listen but Charity was right that nothing will change. 

In regards to Zoe going in people's phones and computers, doesn't anyone lock their stuff? Zoe deserved so much more than what Sophia said.

[jhlipton]

On 10/4/2018 at 6:28 AM, bichonblitz said:

I thought Sophia was going to jump in to the water. 

We were obviously meant to think that, with the placid water offering a refuge from the pain of life.  I'm glad she just threw her cross in, and I hope she remains apostate (but not atheistic -- that doesn't fit her) for a while.

[PsychoDrone]

When Patti says to Lady Mae that she is going to call someone, I said to my wife, "Who is she calling? Iylana Vanzant."  And, lo and behold that's who comes on the screen.  Not feeling Patti or Iylana in their scenes.  Patti seems to be trying too hard and I'm not a fan of Iylana anyway.  It's worse than watching Oprah when she did her scenes.

I think Charity's problem is she still lives with her parents.  Why are these grown adults still living "at home"?  Jacob FINALLY moved out, but Grace moved back.  I know it's about the show, but would Grace really have moved back in considering their history?  It's not like she didn't have a career outside the church and couldn't afford her own place.

The seeds are being sown for the upcoming storylines.  Crypto currency is going to play a big part.  Rochelle is sniffing around Rick Fox.  Not sure what that look Mr. Fox was giving where Rochelle is concerned.  Rochelle better watch out.  Grace has already killed one person that she had issues with.  Sophia's storyline is too extreme.  Something else could have been written to give her a crisis of faith.

Also, what happened to Bishop's Parkinson's?  That storyline has been completed dropped.  "It's a miracle!!! He's cured."

Edited October 8, 2018 by PsychoDrone

[jhlipton]

On 10/7/2018 at 8:57 PM, PsychoDrone said:

Rochelle is sniffing around Rick Fox.  Not sure what that look Mr. Fox was giving where Rochelle is concerned. 

Rick Fox knows that Rochelle is a con artist and her giggle gave her away.  He's going to ket her "play" him until he' (and Grace) are ready to pounce.  I just hope they keep meach other informed about what they're doing.

[Arcadiasw]

On 10/7/2018 at 11:57 PM, PsychoDrone said:

 

I think Charity's problem is she still lives with her parents.  Why are these grown adults still living "at home"?  Jacob FINALLY moved out, but Grace moved back.  I know it's about the show, but would Grace really have moved back in considering their history?  It's not like she didn't have a career outside the church and couldn't afford her own place.

The seeds are being sown for the upcoming storylines.  Crypto currency is going to play a big part.  Rochelle is sniffing around Rick Fox.  Not sure what that look Mr. Fox was giving where Rochelle is concerned.  Rochelle better watch out.  Grace has already killed one person that she had issues with.  Sophia's storyline is too extreme.  Something else could have been written to give her a crisis of faith.

Also, what happened to Bishop's Parkinson's?  That storyline has been completed dropped.  "It's a miracle!!! He's cured."

They still live at home because they are waiting for the parents to die so they can get the house in the will. I might've stayed home if my parents had a house like that. Their bedrooms are like suites. I think Charity's problem is she has no one. Kevin was her husband and best friend (probably only friend) He knew about her issues with her family and she doesn't have that person to confide in anymore.  

Grace knows there is something shady with Rochelle but I can't tell if she's pretending to work with her to find out her game plan or if she's genuinely working with her despite knowing she's shady.

I think after the first season they decided which storylines to keep and dropped. It's the same with Grace drama with her ex in the first season: magically disappeared! Bishop dropped Parkinson's story is a reason why I'm not a fan of Sophia's storyline. As the series progress this storyline will change or be forgotten. 

[Scarlett45]

5 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

I think Charity's problem is she has no one. Kevin was her husband and best friend (probably only friend) He knew about her issues with her family and she doesn't have that person to confide in anymore.  

This. Charity lost a child (quite far along in the pregnancy), lost her husband, her best friend, became a single Mom, lost Jabahri-I don’t think she was ready to date anyway but he was hot and she deserves sexual attention. Lost her tour which meant a lot to her professionally. I’m sure her womanhood and sexual desirability has been questioned with Kevin’s coming out as bi, she may intellectually know it’s “not her” but emotions and intellect are two different things. 

The woman needs a good friend to give her some emotional support (Kendra was there for her but Zora went off the rails and there we have it), and a good therapist where she can just let her feelings out, not wanting to burden her loved ones. She’s been through a LOT, and I think people for get that because she didn’t start screaming and acting a fool right when it happened. 1. She had a newborn, 2. Kevin was gone so she didn’t have to think about him. I still contend Kevin & his boyfriend hurt her heart not out of homophobia but because she is mourning her marriage, Kevin has someone new and she doesn’t. 

[Arcadiasw]

So Jacob is upset with Kerissa for thinking he hasn't changed from his cheating ways? Guess he showed Kerissa how wrong she is. Smh.

I laughed at Tasha talking how she is different from her early church days. Who has she fooled that she's changed? I guess Jacob but it's not hard to fool him. 

Bishop really screwed up trusting Rochelle. They might be putting that house up for sale soon. Didn't he learn from Mac you gotta be wary of trusting shady  people? Just like Jacob. A smile and ego stroke and you're in with the Greenleaf men. 

Kerissa should've ignored Lady Mae and not bother consulting Jacob. Those are Hamilton tickets!! And they're not cheap! I'd help Zoe break out the house myself to go to the show.

Maybe shipping Zoe out of state might've been a good idea. (Not the Oregon one) At least a boarding school or religious retreat would've prevent her from escaping and running off with her boyfriend. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

After that hateful look Zora gave Lady Mae regarding the Hamilton tickets, I might could see some cut brake lines in Grandma's future.

Aw geez, the Greenleaf men. Such patsies.

So much for the punitive, authoritarian approach. All Lady Mae accomplished was steeling Zora's resolve to escape as soon as she turned 18. Zora probably isn't going to see the light until her boyfriend all but kills her and even then she might still stick with him.

I'm not surprised Bishop raided the joint bank account. I'm surprised Lady Mae didn't do it first. She really needs to get herself a shark divorce attorney and stop living in the past. While she's desperately trying to hold onto her social status, the Bishop will have let Rochelle or whoever suck the Greenleaf assets dry.

[mrsbagnet]

6 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

Kerissa should've ignored Lady Mae and not bother consulting Jacob. Those are Hamilton tickets!! And they're not cheap! I'd help Zoe break out the house myself to go to the show.

 

1 hour ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

After that hateful look Zora gave Lady Mae regarding the Hamilton tickets, I might could see some cut brake lines in Grandma's future.

There is no way Mae should have been able to overrule Kerissa regarding the Hamilton tickets. She and Jacob are the parents. They asked Mae to help them, but she is not the end-all and be-all. When she had the gall to say "Zora can't go," Kerissa should have said, "I'm her mother, I bought her a present, and we are going." The end. The fact that none of Mae's children like her, except Baby Jacob, should be a big clue to her parenting skills.

I know I should be upset about Zora leaving to be her with asshole boyfriend, but I don't care much at this point. Some people have to fall on their faces before they learn anything. Her parents have zero ability to control her now. She's in love with Isaiah and keeping them apart only makes her want him more. That's not going to change until she understands how bad he is. We can only hope that her life doesn't end before she realizes her mistake. I just feel bad for everyone involved because it is gut-wrenching to see your child in such a horrible situation.

[MulletorHater]

10 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

So Jacob is upset with Kerissa for thinking he hasn't changed from his cheating ways? Guess he showed Kerissa how wrong she is. Smh.

I laughed at Tasha talking how she is different from her early church days. Who has she fooled that she's changed? I guess Jacob but it's not hard to fool him. 

Bishop really screwed up trusting Rochelle. They might be putting that house up for sale soon. Didn't he learn from Mac you gotta be wary of trusting shady  people? Just like Jacob. A smile and ego stroke and you're in with the Greenleaf men. 

Kerissa should've ignored Lady Mae and not bother consulting Jacob. Those are Hamilton tickets!! And they're not cheap! I'd help Zoe break out the house myself to go to the show.

Maybe shipping Zoe out of state might've been a good idea. (Not the Oregon one) At least a boarding school or religious retreat would've prevent her from escaping and running off with her boyfriend. 

I'll just start by saying that the neither of the Greenleaf men have a lick of sense.  I'll be the first to admit that Lady Mae has a whole lot of shit with her, but in this instance, Bishop would do well to L-I-S-T-E-N.  When it comes to women with game, real recognizes real and Mae knows of which she speaks.  Color me shocked--shocked!--that Mae's lawyer didn't advise her to (a) get credit in her own name; and (b) transfer half of the money in the joint accounts into a separate account that James doesn't have access to.  That way she wouldn't have been ass out and caught off guard the way she was.  Didn't she watch Waiting to Exhale?  The moment James fixed his mouth to suggest that they trust Rochelle with their joint funds, Mae should have been at the bank later that day or first thing the following morning before the doors opened. 

Jacob...his unholy dick is like a weather vane!  He has one serious argument with Kerissa about their child, and he's sick of being judged because Kerissa may still be harboring some "I'm Willing to Forgive, But I Can't Forget" resentment in her heart.  Sick of being judged, bruh?  Then STOP doing stupid shit!  Like telling your personal business to the Real Housewife of a Tennessee Megachurch. Like, siding with your mother (who evidently hasn't had much success in raising girls) over your wife.  Even my husband murmured, "That's fucked up" when Mae interjected herself between Kerissa and Zora, who was so excited about seeing Hamilton.  It's like neither James nor Jacob get it.  It's not the physical fucking around; it's the mind fucking that they've been doing by allowing other women's opinions and machinations (including a mother) to come between them and their wives.  James didn't screw Rochelle--yet. But, she has skillfully played the game in such a way where he doesn't see her what's plain to both Mae and Grace.  Now, she's messing with Mae's money, which is why James had to go that day.  Same thing with Mrs. Skanks (how apropos).  By Jacob blabbing his personal business, crying on her shoulder and allowing her to select a necklace ostensibly for Kerissa, he opened the door to an emotional affair.  BTW--I have to laugh at the writers' attempts to make it appear that old girl has a conscience.  Sorry, y'all!  That's an epic fail for me because I've seen how old girl rolls.

Zora...Let's just say that I've been "churching" practically all my life and my granddaddy was an AME preacher from Florence, South Carolina.  Frankly, even without the usual teenage drama, Zora's behavior isn't that unusual for PK's (preachers' kids).  Weren't her parents listening to her during their argument, where she made it plain when she turned 18, they wouldn't be able to control her?  Unfortunately, she's seen the hypocrisy around her.  Like most kids, they pay more attention to what adults do rather than what they say. That's why she couldn't help but to give Kerissa some lip when she tried to lecture Zora about valuing herself. Zora knows that her mother chose to stay with a man who disrespected her.  Plus, Grandma Dynamite isn't helping either. I guess it's no wonder that she models what she knows. 

[Dee]

‘Murphy Brown’: Merle Dandridge Joins Season 1 Of CBS Revival

Quote

She’ll play Diana Macomber, the team’s arrogant CRC network boss, a no-nonsense, tough-as-nails career woman who is proud to have worked her way up to where she is today. Her character will be introduced in the October 18 episode.

‘Chicago Fire’: Tye White To Recur On Season 7

Quote

Greenleaf alum Tye White is joining NBC’s Chicago Fire in a recurring role. White will play Tyler, a former athlete turned college scout on the seventh season of the Dick Wolf series.

[Scarlett45]

7 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

 

There is no way Mae should have been able to overrule Kerissa regarding the Hamilton tickets. She and Jacob are the parents. They asked Mae to help them, but she is not the end-all and be-all. When she had the gall to say "Zora can't go," Kerissa should have said, "I'm her mother, I bought her a present, and we are going." The end. The fact that none of Mae's children like her, except Baby Jacob, should be a big clue to her parenting skills.

I know I should be upset about Zora leaving to be her with asshole boyfriend, but I don't care much at this point. Some people have to fall on their faces before they learn anything. Her parents have zero ability to control her now. She's in love with Isaiah and keeping them apart only makes her want him more. That's not going to change until she understands how bad he is. We can only hope that her life doesn't end before she realizes her mistake. I just feel bad for everyone involved because it is gut-wrenching to see your child in such a horrible situation.

At this point Zora is 18-she is free to leave at any time. 

 If she wants to break house rules and be disrespectful to the people paying the bills I would tell her to back her clothes and let her have one month of paid for cell phone, and let her know she’s always welcome to come home if she can follow rules. Why did Lady Mae look so surprised when Zora left?

Kerrissa should’ve put her foot down with Mae then and there. Did Jacob actually sleep with Tasha or was it just the hug?

 

Poor Sophia, her pain is real and understandable, I liked how her Mom comforted her, that was a genuine moment. Speaking of Grace, did she ever get therapy or talk to someone after Mac died? Killing someone (even though Mac had it coming) is a traumatizing thing. 

7 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

 

There is no way Mae should have been able to overrule Kerissa regarding the Hamilton tickets. She and Jacob are the parents. They asked Mae to help them, but she is not the end-all and be-all. When she had the gall to say "Zora can't go," Kerissa should have said, "I'm her mother, I bought her a present, and we are going." The end. The fact that none of Mae's children like her, except Baby Jacob, should be a big clue to her parenting skills.

I know I should be upset about Zora leaving to be her with asshole boyfriend, but I don't care much at this point. Some people have to fall on their faces before they learn anything. Her parents have zero ability to control her now. She's in love with Isaiah and keeping them apart only makes her want him more. That's not going to change until she understands how bad he is. We can only hope that her life doesn't end before she realizes her mistake. I just feel bad for everyone involved because it is gut-wrenching to see your child in such a horrible situation.

At this point Zora is 18-she is free to leave at any time. 

 If she wants to break house rules and be disrespectful to the people paying the bills I would tell her to back her clothes and let her have one month of paid for cell phone, and let her know she’s always welcome to come home if she can follow rules. Why did Lady Mae look so surprised when Zora left?

Kerrissa should’ve put her foot down with Mae then and there. Did Jacob actually sleep with Tasha or was it just the hug?

 

Poor Sophia, her pain is real and understandable, I liked how her Mom comforted her, that was a genuine moment. Speaking of Grace, did she ever get therapy or talk to someone after Mac died? Killing someone (even though Mac had it coming) is a traumatizing thing. 

[scruffy73]

On 10/11/2018 at 10:15 PM, Scarlett45 said:

At this point Zora is 18-she is free to leave at any time. 

 If she wants to break house rules and be disrespectful to the people paying the bills I would tell her to back her clothes and let her have one month of paid for cell phone, and let her know she’s always welcome to come home if she can follow rules. Why did Lady Mae look so surprised when Zora left?

Kerrissa should’ve put her foot down with Mae then and there. Did Jacob actually sleep with Tasha or was it just the hug?

 

Poor Sophia, her pain is real and understandable, I liked how her Mom comforted her, that was a genuine moment. Speaking of Grace, did she ever get therapy or talk to someone after Mac died? Killing someone (even though Mac had it coming) is a traumatizing thing. 

At this point Zora is 18-she is free to leave at any time. 

 If she wants to break house rules and be disrespectful to the people paying the bills I would tell her to back her clothes and let her have one month of paid for cell phone, and let her know she’s always welcome to come home if she can follow rules. Why did Lady Mae look so surprised when Zora left?

Kerrissa should’ve put her foot down with Mae then and there. Did Jacob actually sleep with Tasha or was it just the hug?

 

Poor Sophia, her pain is real and understandable, I liked how her Mom comforted her, that was a genuine moment. Speaking of Grace, did she ever get therapy or talk to someone after Mac died? Killing someone (even though Mac had it coming) is a traumatizing thing. 

Jacob didn’t sleep with Tasha on screen but they kissed. I wouldn’t have been surprised if he had sat her on the desk and hiked her her dress up. She would have let him.

[Scarlett45]

4 minutes ago, scruffy73 said:

Jacob didn’t sleep with Tasha on screen but they kissed. I wouldn’t have been surprised if he had sat her on the desk and hiked her her dress up. She would have let him.

Thank you. I missed the kiss!

What is wrong with Jacob? If he wants to cheat why does he keep doing it in church?!!!!

[scruffy73]

5 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

Thank you. I missed the kiss!

What is wrong with Jacob? If he wants to cheat why does he keep doing it in church?!!!!

Because he is NASTY and unfit to lead a church. His daddy is proving himself stupid too. This Rochelle chick pops out the woodwork and he risks his marriage for her “friendship”? And has given her his PERSONAL MONEY!?!? DAFUQ!?!? Someone upthread said that Lady Mae should have been taken her money out of that account and she is right. I’m surprised that in all her “plant your own church” advice, Pastor Patti didn’t tell her to get some of that scrilla right out of bishop’s account before it got ugly. As soon as he said “you have to leave Calvary”, Mae should have said “with my half” (in her head) and gone to the bank. She is not as strong, worldly, and smart as she thinks she is. 

Lynn Whitfield is playing the HELL out of Lady Mae though. So “Mother of the Church” but looks like she totes a switchblade. I would not mind if she stabs the bishop when Rochelle runs off with their money.

[Arcadiasw]

On ‎10‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 3:06 PM, mrsbagnet said:

I know I should be upset about Zora leaving to be her with asshole boyfriend, but I don't care much at this point. Some people have to fall on their faces before they learn anything. Her parents have zero ability to control her now. She's in love with Isaiah and keeping them apart only makes her want him more. That's not going to change until she understands how bad he is. We can only hope that her life doesn't end before she realizes her mistake. I just feel bad for everyone involved because it is gut-wrenching to see your child in such a horrible situation.

Sometimes people are blind to their faults. Mae is definitely one of them. I hope for Zora's case a child isn't added to the equation and when she falls on her face, admits her faults instead of blaming others. 

 

On ‎10‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 6:20 PM, MulletorHater said:

I'll just start by saying that the neither of the Greenleaf men have a lick of sense.  I'll be the first to admit that Lady Mae has a whole lot of shit with her, but in this instance, Bishop would do well to L-I-S-T-E-N.  When it comes to women with game, real recognizes real and Mae knows of which she speaks.  Color me shocked--shocked!--that Mae's lawyer didn't advise her to (a) get credit in her own name; and (b) transfer half of the money in the joint accounts into a separate account that James doesn't have access to. 

Jacob...his unholy dick is like a weather vane!  He has one serious argument with Kerissa about their child, and he's sick of being judged because Kerissa may still be harboring some "I'm Willing to Forgive, But I Can't Forget" resentment in her heart.  Sick of being judged, bruh?  Then STOP doing stupid shit!  

Zora...Let's just say that I've been "churching" practically all my life and my granddaddy was an AME preacher from Florence, South Carolina.  Frankly, even without the usual teenage drama, Zora's behavior isn't that unusual for PK's (preachers' kids).  Weren't her parents listening to her during their argument, where she made it plain when she turned 18, they wouldn't be able to control her? 

Yeah. Her lawyer definitely should've mentioned that in the first meeting. As soon as you know you want a divorce, get separate accounts I think it's only been a year or two in the Greenleaf timeline. Did Jacob really believe two years will be enough for Kerissa to believe he wasn't cheating anymore? As for Zora, Jacob and Kerissa thought it was an empty threat. Many kids have said, "As soon as I'm 18, I'm gone" but they don't leave.  I don't understand why there hasn't been a scene between Jacob and Kerissa and Zora's boyfriend's parents. 

 

On ‎10‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 11:15 PM, Scarlett45 said:

At this point Zora is 18-she is free to leave at any time. 

 If she wants to break house rules and be disrespectful to the people paying the bills I would tell her to back her clothes and let her have one month of paid for cell phone, and let her know she’s always welcome to come home if she can follow rules. Why did Lady Mae look so surprised when Zora left?

 

Because no one would dare defy Lady Mae. In her eyes, Lady Mae thought she was getting through Zora. Anyone with half a brain would know predawn bible readings and locking Zora away from any privileges wasn't working.

 

7 hours ago, scruffy73 said:

Jacob didn’t sleep with Tasha on screen but they kissed. I wouldn’t have been surprised if he had sat her on the desk and hiked her her dress up. She would have let him.

I thought it was implied he did since he wiped himself when driving home and took a shower when he got home.

[Risha17]

Lady Mae has her multitude of faults, but I was on her side when it came to Zora and her birthday as well as Bishop and Rochelle.  Zora doesn't deserve a birthday gift (especially one as nice and expensive as Hamilton tickets) after being atrocious and disrespectful to her family, stealing money from the church, and going through the help's belongings. Not to mention, she was claiming how when she turns 18, she's grown and no one can tell her anything. So, if I was in the Greenleaf's collective shoes, on her birthday, Zora wouldn't get squat, not even a B-day card. No reward for bad behavior and let her learn as an "adult" she's responsible for treating herself for her birthday with her own money. Anyway, IMO, that scene to me gave a glimpse as to why Zora is the way she is (besides being a DV and possible sexual assault victim); her parents spoiled her rotten and never thought to discipline her and any punishment they try to implement, they (especially Kerissa) don't follow through because they desperately want to be their child's friend rather than her parents. And I want to be upset about Zora leaving with her asshole boyfriend, (and a part of me is because it's really sad how low her self-esteem and self-worth is) but she strikes me as one of those who has to learn the hard way. So Jacob and Kerissa should let her go, but make sure she doesn't leave with stuff they brought for her; she thinks she's grown, well, as an adult, she's now responsible for providing for herself. That said, as much as Zora gets on my nerves, I hope she doesn't end up in a graveyard or a really sad state before she fully grasps how much of an abusive POS Isaiah is and isn't worth it.   

Jacob and James...Jesus Christ the Greenleaf men are naive as hell and can easily be led by anyone stroking their pricks and/or egos. I pray that gene skips Winky or otherwise, he's doomed, too and/or is going to need a smart lover/spouse to guide him because he can't be trusted to spot a smooth-talking liar and con artist. Speaking of Jacob, (I'm readying myself for the rotten vegetables that will thrown my way), in another universe in which he doesn't have Kerissa and his kids, I would be rooting for him and Tasha. However, given his history of rampant cheating , his and Kerissa's relationship and coming so far in redeeming himself, I can't root for it and just wanted to slap Jacob. Way to go, Jacob! You sure proved Kerissa wrong! /sarcasm 

 As for Mae and Grace, I was screaming at the TV for them to finally sit down and talk. Both of them don't trust Rochelle and knows she's up to no good, but both women are so wrapped up in their own individual issues and the issues they have with each other, they won't put their heads together to take Rochelle down. I'm crossing my fingers that Grace and Mae get the healing they need, finally reconcile (and soon!) and team up in S4. They would make one helluva formidable team. 

I'm sure Percy has his dark side, but so far I like him and really appreciated he tried to help Charity in her depressed state. And poor Sophia...my heart broke for her in that breakdown scene. 

Edited October 14, 2018 by Risha17

[scruffy73]

1 hour ago, Risha17 said:

Lady Mae has her multitude of faults, but I was on her side when it came to Zora and her birthday as well as Bishop and Rochelle.  Zora doesn't deserve a birthday gift (especially one as nice and expensive as Hamilton tickets) after being atrocious and disrespectful to her family, stealing money from the church, and going through the help's belongings. Not to mention, she was claiming how when she turns 18, she's grown and no one can tell her anything. So, if I was in the Greenleaf's collective shoes, on her birthday, Zora wouldn't get squat, not even a B-day card. No reward for bad behavior and let her learn as an "adult" she's responsible for treating herself for her birthday with her own money. Anyway, IMO, that scene to me gave a glimpse as to why Zora is the way she is (besides being a DV and possible sexual assault victim); her parents spoiled her rotten and never thought to discipline her and any punishment they try to implement, they (especially Kerissa) don't follow through because they desperately want to be their child's friend rather than her parents. And I want to be upset about Zora leaving with her asshole boyfriend, (and a part of me is because it's really sad how low her self-esteem and self-worth is) but she strikes me as one of those who has to learn the hard way. So Jacob and Kerissa should let her go, but make sure she doesn't leave with stuff they brought for her; she thinks she's grown, well, as an adult, she's now responsible for providing for herself. That said, as much as Zora gets on my nerves, I hope she doesn't end up in a graveyard or a really sad state before she fully grasps how much of an abusive POS Isaiah is and isn't worth it.   

Jacob and James...Jesus Christ the Greenleaf men are naive as hell and can easily be led by anyone stroking their pricks and/or egos. I pray that gene skips Winky or otherwise, he's doomed, too and/or is going to need a smart lover/spouse to guide him because he can't be trusted to spot a smooth-talking liar and con artist. Speaking of Jacob, (I'm readying myself for the rotten vegetables that will thrown my way), in another universe in which he doesn't have Kerissa and his kids, I would be rooting for him and Tasha. However, given his history of rampant cheating , his and Kerissa's relationship and coming so far in redeeming himself, I can't root for it and just wanted to slap Jacob. Way to go, Jacob! You sure proved Kerissa wrong! /sarcasm 

 As for Mae and Grace, I was screaming at the TV for them to finally sit down and talk. Both of them don't trust Rochelle and knows she's up to no good, but both women are so wrapped up in their own individual issues and the issues they have with each other, they won't put their heads together to take Rochelle down. I'm crossing my fingers that Grace and Mae get the healing they need, finally reconcile (and soon!) and team up in S4. They would make one helluva formidable team. 

I'm sure Percy has his dark side, but so far I like him and really appreciated he tried to help Charity in her depressed state. And poor Sophia...my heart broke for her in that breakdown scene. 

Jacob and Tasha would probably be good together in a different time. I think Tasha is being influenced by Rochelle to play Jacob but I think she does have some true affection for him. She is in a bad place and is caught up in bad things.

i wish that Lady Mae would get off her poor-me-everyone-hates-me horse so she can find some peace with her daughters. Charity needs love so bad and Grace just needs peace. Mae is to angry to see Grace as a potential ally instead of competition. 

[Dee]

Mae is a woman who does not like other women.

[Scarlett45]

On 10/14/2018 at 12:17 PM, Risha17 said:

Lady Mae has her multitude of faults, but I was on her side when it came to Zora and her birthday as well as Bishop and Rochelle.  Zora doesn't deserve a birthday gift (especially one as nice and expensive as Hamilton tickets) after being atrocious and disrespectful to her family, stealing money from the church, and going through the help's belongings. Not to mention, she was claiming how when she turns 18, she's grown and no one can tell her anything. So, if I was in the Greenleaf's collective shoes, on her birthday, Zora wouldn't get squat, not even a B-day card. No reward for bad behavior and let her learn as an "adult" she's responsible for treating herself for her birthday with her own money. Anyway, IMO, that scene to me gave a glimpse as to why Zora is the way she is (besides being a DV and possible sexual assault victim); her parents spoiled her rotten and never thought to discipline her and any punishment they try to implement, they (especially Kerissa) don't follow through because they desperately want to be their child's friend rather than her parents.

Oh I agree. Let her go with one suitcase of clothes and one month of cell phone, BUT how Lady Mae acted was due to her not respecting her place as a “grandmother”, Kerrissa may be 100% wrong but Zora is her daughter and she can buy her whatever she wants with her own money. 

I think the Greenleafs love each other but there are huge boundary and trust issues in that family which get in the way of authentic intimacy (I don’t mean sexual/romantic intimacy I mean emotional intimacy between family).

[mrsbagnet]

So much goodness in this episode.

My favorite scene was Charity jumping out of the car like she was gon' do somethin'... but then she couldn't run in those shoes and that dress. That's okay, though. It's nice to know that Zora's auntie has her back. If Charity had known what was going down at the gate, she would have come correct with her outfit.

I applaud whoever writes the dialogue for James and Mae. They are so wonderfully pretentious.

• Finally moving out of that harridan's lair
• that pile of saggy cornbread and pantyhose that you gave my money to

I also loved Percy's "okay" shrug when James said, "The mothers are handling it."

During the Zora incident and afterward, Jacob was comforting his mother, not his wife. So telling. I hope one day Kerissa finds the right man for her.

Edited October 18, 2018 by mrsbagnet
comment about Jacob and Kerissa

[TomGirl]

4 minutes ago, mrsbagnet said:

I applaud whoever writes the dialogue for James and Mae. They are so wonderfully pretentious.

• Finally moving out of that harridan's lair
• that pile of saggy cornbread and pantyhose that you gave my money to

I also liked the comment about all the people who have been sucked into the family mess by “Greenleaf gravity.”

[Arcadiasw]

How the hell did they let Zora get in the car??!!! My Dad would have literally ran and grabbed me before I got near that boy’s car and he has twenty more pounds on him over Jacob! I don’t understand why Mae wasn’t literally pulling Zora from the car instead of only closing the door. 18 or not there’s no way I would’ve let my kid get in that car. She would’ve physically have to stop me. I love Charity’s reaction. If she had kicked off her shoes, she would’ve reached Isaiah before he drove off.

I’m glad Charity kept that check from Percy. Someone will need to pay the bills when they realize Rochelle took all their money.

So glad it was only a kiss and not sex but is Tasha messy and needs some security in herself.

I'm not expecting Sophia's Dad to appear on the show but they did have a relationship. I guess it's a rewrite like the Bishop's Parkinson's but no mention of him at all since Sophia's surgery? No throwaway line about him calling Sophia 

 

2 hours ago, mrsbagnet said:

So much goodness in this episode.

My favorite scene was Charity jumping out of the car like she was gon' do somethin'... but then she couldn't run in those shoes and that dress. That's okay, though. It's nice to know that Zora's auntie has her back. If Charity had known what was going down at the gate, she would have come correct with her outfit.

I applaud whoever writes the dialogue for James and Mae. They are so wonderfully pretentious.

• Finally moving out of that harridan's lair
• that pile of saggy cornbread and pantyhose that you gave my money to

I also loved Percy's "okay" shrug when James said, "The mothers are handling it."

During the Zora incident and afterward, Jacob was comforting his mother, not his wife. So telling. I hope one day Kerissa finds the right man for her.

Yep. Probably another reason why at the end she didn't let Jacob comfort her and walked away, 

[Scarlett45]

I had some wonky things with my cable so I only saw the first 7min. I loved Charity not being able to run in her outfit but still trying to protect Zora. Zora- she may be an ungrateful brat but somewhere inside she knows her parents love her. That look in her eyes where she took her Mom’s cell phone, my heart lept when Isaiah threw it out of the window- he’s done “pretending” Zora is his POSSESSION and he wants everyone to know it. This isn’t a game, women DIE in these situations or end up like that woman Sophia is helping, Zora doesn’t deserve that. It would break Kerissa’s heart. I didn’t see it but I believe Jacob comforted his Mom first, which doesn’t surprise me but it’s god awful. Of course I think it’s good for men to have close friendships and family relationships outside of their spouse, but comfort your wife FIRST damn it. 

3 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

I'm not expecting Sophia's Dad to appear on the show but they did have a relationship. I guess it's a rewrite like the Bishop's Parkinson's but no mention of him at all since Sophia's surgery? No throwaway line about him calling Sophia 

Yeah that sucks. I get actors cost money but no lines or even a prop of flowers from him?

[mrsbagnet]

56 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

That look in her eyes where she took her Mom’s cell phone, my heart lept when Isaiah threw it out of the window- he’s done “pretending” Zora is his POSSESSION and he wants everyone to know it.

After that conversation with Kerissa at Isaiah's parents' house, I'm convinced Zora knows it, too, She told her mom, "The worse thing for me would be if he sees you here." So she knows he's controlling, and she knows she's walking into a bad situation. I think at this point she's only leaving to prove her family wrong.

 

4 hours ago, Arcadiasw said:

I'm not expecting Sophia's Dad to appear on the show but they did have a relationship. I guess it's a rewrite like the Bishop's Parkinson's but no mention of him at all since Sophia's surgery? No throwaway line about him calling Sophia

Yes, this. I thought that package would be from him. Her boyfriend is a nice kid, though.

Edited October 18, 2018 by mrsbagnet