S12.E23: At Last

[Shellie]

2 hours ago, NathanRiggsfan said:

I agree,but where are they to go from here into S13?  What was their hook up about? I mean they could have easily had Meredith hook up with a random guy in a bar for her to have a sexual partner - safe and easy, no strings attached.

I just find it weird to use Riggs for this.

I thought the prevailing theory here was the eventual reappearance of Owen's sister, and this would be a complicating factor in that scenario.

[Kate213]

1 hour ago, dmc said:

Umm because Callie isn't a bad parent and she is biological mother. Screwing someone else and breaking up your family is on par with moving to NY to be with your gf. Both of them have made selfish decisions..

Callie's case for wanting to modify the custody arrangement and move Sofia out of state was weak.  It has nothing to do with either of them being a bad parent (despite Callie trying to paint Arizona as one in court).  You can't have joint custody when the parents live on opposite sides of the country.  Therefore, one of them was getting sole physical custody and it is not automatically given to the biological mother -- the law does not (nor should it) work like that.  Callie being biologically related to Sofia doesn't make her "more" of a parent; Callie and Arizona are equally Sofia's parents in the eyes of the law.

Edited May 14, 2016 by Kate213

[Gtr187]

5 hours ago, HeresTo2016 said:

I've never really understood what happened with this. Somebody please tell me how Patrick pissed Shonda off, thanks!!

Well, there's not a lot of detail that's been put out there, but we know this much:

1)Patrick is a big racing fan, and he wanted to devote more time to it. 

2)His real life marriage was also having trouble.

3)He approached Shonda about a reduced schedule so he could spend more time on his marriage/racing. She agreed (that's why Derek went to DC to do the brain mapping thing).

4)At some point after the 1st agreement, Patrick came back to talk about the next season. Something happened in that discussion that really angered Shonda, so she decided to kill the character off. Stories vary (he demanded a much reduced schedule for s12, more money, creative differences, etc). We'll probably never know for sure unless she decides to go into more detail. Shonda is famous for not tolerating "diva" behavior (see: Heigl) and has made some vague comments suggesting Dempsey was turning into a diva. 

[kingshearte]

On 5/13/2016 at 1:40 AM, Black Knight said:

Which once again shows how badly Callie ruined everything. They had a great arrangement, and now, even though Callie is staying in Seattle, they can't just go back to it. Not until Callie earns some trust back with Arizona, which at her current rate of self-introspection isn't going to happen quickly. One of the biggest problems in my view is that this custody battle ended up reminding Arizona of all the things she most hated about being with Callie - the selfish obliviousness to Arizona's point of view, the angry reaction upon learning Arizona wouldn't just roll over, trying to get her way by fighting dirty and browbeating and trying to make Arizona feel like a bad person for disagreeing with her. Callie can't just claim that this was uncharacteristic for her - it was only the ugliest manifestation of some traits she's always had - and even if she gives a big speech now acknowledging these issues and promising to change, Arizona can't take that at face value when she knows this is a longstanding pattern of behavior.

This. And I think this might have been the first time someone has really put their foot down and not ultimately rolled over and given her what she wanted. I felt a little bad for her for a moment, but really, she is well past the age when she should have learned that you don't always get your way. And while I hope that Arizona hangs on to enough grace to not be too vindictive about the arrangements all the time, I do think that here, given the way Callie has treated her (always, really, but especially recently), the fact that it was the second time that day that she had asked to switch, and the fact that, as someone else pointed out, Callie basically wanted to use her daughter as a pick-me-up, Arizona was definitely in the right here. Frankly, I think Callie needs to share some of the seats everyone is offering Stephanie.

21 hours ago, DrKarevFan said:

Jo Speculations

What if she is really Ava/Rebecca?

Honestly, I always thought the whole living in a car thing was a little far fetched, I think she's been lying about that. And if you watch the episode where she beat up Chest Peckwell, he told Alex that Jo had lied to him(Chest) about something. But they never explored that storyline.

Oh good grief. Now that would be a shocking twist. Insane, but certainly more interesting, given that a spare husband would be about as shocking as the Mere-Nathan hookup we just witnessed. Just in time for Megan to show up, of course. Unless they want to hold off for another season on that, so she can be well and truly invested, just like she was with Derek when Addison showed up.

As for Meredith, I was willing to cut her some slack, up to a point. When she was just being a little ornery, and not into being jovial with everyone, that was legit. We're all allowed to have days when we don't feel like our usual selves. But her behaviour in that surgery started to push it, and her spiel to Amelia crossed and left the line way behind. Those two really do need to not have a relationship. It always ends up with one or the other of them lashing out, and it's just ugly. Amelia can be the kids' aunt, and she and Meredith can be civil, but they should just stop even trying to be friends or sisters. It's not working.

[HeresTo2016]

1 hour ago, Gtr187 said:

Well, there's not a lot of detail that's been put out there, but we know this much.

Thank you! Makes a lot more sense now ...

[Gtr187]

6 hours ago, dmc said:

Umm because Callie isn't a bad parent and she is biological mother. Screwing someone else and breaking up your family is on par with moving to NY to be with your gf. Both of them have made selfish decisions.

Arizona legally adopted Sofia, so she has equal standing with Callie - biological doesn't automatically trump adoptive legally speaking. 

The big legal question here is, what's in Sofia's best interests. Sofia's age is a factor, the ability to provide a stable home, the fitness of the parents, and if the move is best for her. 

Given they were both fit parents with the ability to provide for Sofia, the decision really came down to if the move was a good thing for her. Courts tend to be reluctant to uproot children, especially young children, without a good reason. The outcome makes sense from the perspective of how a real court would view such a case. 

Edited May 15, 2016 by Gtr187

[WhosThatGirl]

So since GA has some bizzaro Friends references, I'm going to just assume Owen's sister Megan was missing from her plane because it got sent to Yemen. 

Wasn't there also a rumor about Patrick's departure about him having had a hooked up with someone  behind the scenes? I don't really believe it, but I remember reading an article about it. The thing is, I understand why he wanted to leave, he had real life stuff going on that sort of takes precedent over this show. 

Onto the show.. the thing is, with all the court stuff, Callie  did mess things up. She was planning to take Sophia away from everything she knows so that Callie could date her couple of months girlfriend. That's not..okay and like with the judge's ruling, what is best for Sophia is not moving to New York away from a support system. As for being a person, Callie was being a bad person too. I still can't get over her scenes last week when she acted like AZ's lawyer was hitting below the belt asking if Penny know Sophia's favorite things, how old she was, what grade she was in, etc and then had the nerve to have her lawyer insinuate that AZ was a slut a big drinker and things of that nature. And this week, while Beyonce's lemonade song played and she broke up with Penny, who really did nothing wrong.. as if it was her fault. I just.. don't get this character anymore. I used to like Callie. 

Edited May 15, 2016 by WhosThatGirl

[arilliope]

I really don't understand Callie these past 2 seasons. She essentially said she felt suffocated in her relationship with Arizona because Arizona chose to do the fellowship under Herman and delay having their 2nd child. In other words, she felt suffocated because Arizona wasn't making the choices that Callie wanted her to make. Then she finally meets the perfect girl, (they "finish off each other's sentences"), the girl she tried so hard not to love, the girl who was worth getting a demotion for, the girl who was worth going through a custody battle for, the girl who was worth ruining Arizona for.... yet.... the girl she couldn't possibly love long distance.

What was this all for?!

If Callie knew before all this custody bullshit, that she didn't have a love that was strong enough to last long distance for a year, than what made her think their relationship would even last in NY?! Why hurt your daughter, your friends, yourself and more so, why hurt Arizona, the person who you once loved so much, if you were able to break up with Penny in less than 2 minutes?

And then she has the nerve to ask Arizona accommodate for her twice, the second time being for the reason that she was having a "bad day" (Sofia isn't an object to play with to forget about your shitty day and to forget about when all is fine); knowing that you've lost her trust and patience and grace by keeping tabs on her text messages, her work life and social life to use against her.

I know Callie isn't the most selfless, self-aware character on the show, I mean who is right? But this version of Callie is just unbelievably stupid and pitiful. I just can't see how in the hell the writers thought to do this to her if their purpose was to bring back Calzona. If Arizona had any love left for Callie, this episode sure as hell took that away.

Edited May 15, 2016 by searims

[BabyBBQKendall]

It's not just Callie though. Most of the characters have acted more awful this season than ever before. Only a few made it through S12 unscathed. And yet GA is one of the highest rated shows on ABC, so we can only expect this unfortunate trend to continue.

[arilliope]

20 minutes ago, BlindMaryIngalls said:

It's not just Callie though. Most of the characters have acted more awful this season than ever before. Only a few made it through S12 unscathed. And yet GA is one of the highest rated shows on ABC, so we can only expect this unfortunate trend to continue.

I totally get you, and for me as a Calzona fan and I'm mainly focussing on Callie. 

Greys has been drilling in this whole #drama! #thrills! bullshit at the expense of their characters. I'm a strong believer of character-centred drama over plot-centred drama, and what the writers are essentially doing here is trying to fit the character into their story rather than writing a story for the character.

I remember during creative writing class in high school, my teacher told us that a story that changes it's characters to match the story is a story that's not worth telling.  I understand that ratings play a huge role in shaping the path of a TV show... but seriously come on.. I hate hating characters I once loved.

Edited May 15, 2016 by searims

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

Jo Speculations

What if she is really Ava/Rebecca?

If this results in Jo ripping off her wig like Kimberly Shaw Mancini (and I guess a really amazing mask like Mission Impossible), then this storyline will finally be totally worth it.

[Deanie87]

5 hours ago, searims said:

I totally get you, and for me as a Calzona fan and I'm mainly focussing on Callie. 

Greys has been drilling in this whole #drama! #thrills! bullshit at the expense of their characters. I'm a strong believer of character-centred drama over plot-centred drama, and what the writers are essentially doing here is trying to fit the character into their story rather than writing a story for the character.

I remember during creative writing class in high school, my teacher told us that a story that changes it's characters to match the story is a story that's not worth telling.  I understand that ratings play a huge role in shaping the path of a TV show... but seriously come on.. I hate hating characters I once loved.

The "drama!!/#thrills!!" mindset has been around for awhile and I agree that it is a big part in what has lowered the quality of the show.  Yes, the cast is too big and yes lots of beloved characters have left, but if the writing in general were better I think that some of that could be accepted better.  Someone recently, I think on this board, had such a great quote and unfortunately, I can't find it anywhere so I apologize for not quoting it directly.  But they said that the writers are now more interested in the getting to the shocking!!111 ending so much so that they skip the entire middle of a storyline and the result is that this huge ending that they emphasis over and over again, just loses its impact because we never get to see the lead up to it.  (This person said it so much better than me so again, I apologize that I wasn't able to find it).  Why should we care about the "shocking" kiss between Mer and Riggs when they have barely interacted before?  Why should we care about Kyle and Stephanie when their entire story was told in snippets over 3 episodes?  Why should we care about Jo's "shocking" secret when she has had absolutely no development and her entire relationship with Alex has been offscreen and used only for fake "shocking" promos and cliffhangers that never come up again?  Why should we care about Owen and Amelia when they have been hitting the same beats for the entirety of their relationship?   Organic character driven storytelling seems to be a thing of the past on this show and it really shows (except in the ratings somehow.)

Quote

I actually have no problem (since Derek is dead) of a Mere/Alex long awaited hook-up.

How wonderful and enticing for Alex, lol.

[GreysFan89]

6 hours ago, searims said:

I really don't understand Callie these past 2 seasons. She essentially said she felt suffocated in her relationship with Arizona because Arizona chose to do the fellowship under Herman and delay having their 2nd child. In other words, she felt suffocated because Arizona wasn't making the choices that Callie wanted her to make. Then she finally meets the perfect girl, (they "finish off each other's sentences"), the girl she tried so hard not to love, the girl who was worth getting a demotion for, the girl who was worth going through a custody battle for, the girl who was worth ruining Arizona for.... yet.... the girl she couldn't possibly love long distance.

You just know that's Callie for interrupting Penny and putting words in her mouth.

Surely Callie must realize soon that's she's bullshitting herself, if you loved someone as much as she's claiming to love Penny, you would at least try long distance, deep down she must know she doesn't really love her enough to make it work.

[Shellie]

42 minutes ago, GreysFan89 said:

You just know that's Callie for interrupting Penny and putting words in her mouth.

Surely Callie must realize soon that's she's bullshitting herself, if you loved someone as much as she's claiming to love Penny, you would at least try long distance, deep down she must know she doesn't really love her enough to make it work.

At first I thought it was crazy that Callie refused to try the long-distance relationship.  Then I wondered if the relationship has taken on an aspect of disgust for her because she has lost something so very important because of it.  Also considering how horrible she must feel about losing joint custody, maybe she doesn't feel like she has the energy or motivation to go on with this romance long-distance.  

[Nobodysfan]

16 hours ago, Shellie said:

I thought the prevailing theory here was the eventual reappearance of Owen's sister, and this would be a complicating factor in that scenario.

I am disappointed with Meredith and Nathan - how it is written. They jumped at each other like two bunnies. Primitive. 

The whole anymosity. Then some stupid hook-up in the car.

I think they should have left Thorpe there for Meredith, they devoted so much time to that storyline and either bring Megan back in or have the relationship for Maggie( without starting anything with Deluca) for Nathan.

I think Shonda did disservice to Martin,she hired him like a sex buddy for Pompeo´s character. And some almost unknown day time soap opera actor who played Thorpe got a more in-depth mature storyline than Henderson.

We know almost nothing about Nathan after 17 episodes. 

I would have rather preferred him with Maggie, they are able to speak to each other like adults, share things with one another. 

I want to see her fight for him. Meredith only wants him for sex. She could care less about him.

Even as Martin said he thought Nathan would be with Maggie. They have natural rapport and Nathan can let his mask down.

Edited May 15, 2016 by NathanRiggsfan

[GreysFan89]

3 hours ago, Deanie87 said:

The "drama!!/#thrills!!" mindset has been around for awhile and I agree that it is a big part in what has lowered the quality of the show.  Yes, the cast is too big and yes lots of beloved characters have left, but if the writing in general were better I think that some of that could be accepted better.  Someone recently, I think on this board, had such a great quote and unfortunately, I can't find it anywhere so I apologize for not quoting it directly.  But they said that the writers are now more interested in the getting to the shocking!!111 ending so much so that they skip the entire middle of a storyline and the result is that this huge ending that they emphasis over and over again, just loses its impact because we never get to see the lead up to it.  (This person said it so much better than me so again, I apologize that I wasn't able to find it).  Why should we care about the "shocking" kiss between Mer and Riggs when they have barely interacted before?  Why should we care about Kyle and Stephanie when their entire story was told in snippets over 3 episodes?  Why should we care about Jo's "shocking" secret when she has had absolutely no development and her entire relationship with Alex has been offscreen and used only for fake "shocking" promos and cliffhangers that never come up again?  Why should we care about Owen and Amelia when they have been hitting the same beats for the entirety of their relationship?   Organic character driven storytelling seems to be a thing of the past on this show and it really shows (except in the ratings somehow.)

How wonderful and enticing for Alex, lol.

Do you maybe mean my post? :)
 

Quote

 

Since everyone has guessed Jo is already married, Jo is most probably already married, the show doesn't do big shocks any-more. Can you imagine how over the top Shonda and co will be when Owen's sister shows up? 'It's the biggest twist in Grey's history' etc lol 

This ep is a good example of how lazy the writers have become, they want the big payoff moments but don't do the work to make the payoff interesting for the viewer. I'm referring to the Stef/Kyle storyline, how are we supposed to be invested in that couple when we've seen so little of them and they haven't even giving us enough to care about who Stef dates in the first place. 

And next week yet another time jump, that is such lazy storytelling. The show needs to start showing us the build up to a story and stop skipping ahead to the payoff moments.

 

[Deanie87]

40 minutes ago, GreysFan89 said:

Do you maybe mean my post? :)
 

Yes!  Thank you and sorry I couldn't quote directly.  Clearly I agree with you!

[PepSinger]

If Amelia had pulled out a scalpel and stabbed Meredith 1,000 times after she told her that she needed to get her own life, I would have applauded. I say that as a Meredith fan, for God's sakes. 

I hate Stephanie. Home girl has NO respect for boundaries. WTF is wrong with her? 

I am sick of Jo and her anti-marriage bullshit. Alex deserves better. It is utterly ridiculous that an attractive, pediatric surgeon cannot find a woman to be with. Seriously. WHAT. To quote someone on the first page of this thread, I volunteer as tribute.

Edited May 15, 2016 by PepSinger

[timimouse]

On 5/14/2016 at 10:18 AM, Biggie B said:

I understand that seeing Derek's former trailer going away was a massive trigger for Meredith, but my god, she said some really shitty things to Amelia. Just flat out nasty and intentionally hurtful. And yup, if this show weren't on ABC, I as a writer would've have had Amelia reply, "Fuck you, fuck your miserable life." 

I couldn't care less about Callie or Penny. 

Thank you for saying that you COULDN'T care less. It's a huge pet peeve of mine when people say "I could care less". I then point out that that would mean that you do care somewhat... Then I get called a bitch. 

Carry on.... 

[Scylla]

Hi guys! I'm new here but have lurked before on these forums when Grey's has annoyed me to no end. I read most of this thread (so I apologize if someone has said this already)  -- but 1. love that some of you guys are FRIENDS junkies. To say I'm obsessed with that show for 20 years now is an understatement 2. I am a fan of Jo Wilson (I think I may be the only one lol). 3. So over Meredith but she still entertains me. 4. Using this first post to mention something not sure if anyone else has said -- I was fuzzy with Jo's background (other than living in a car, ok we get it), but I didn't necessarily take her "I can't", "I w--" (as my subtitles shows) as "I was married.." no, i was more so thinking of something along the lines of she can't because of legal reasons OUTSIDE of marriages. She's illegal (from canada maybe?) or part of witness protection program (why she is so jumpy and has a gun). I pulled up her 'wikia' from fans who took notes of crap about her (some of it is interesting), but all seems so sketchy. LIke a girl on the run. Curious on your thoughts? I just feel 'sham marriage or prostitute' is too easy for a deep dark secret. Maybe im just going overboard on the idea she's undercover from not being American, I don't know. I just feel she really wants to but legally cannot. 

[Gtr187]

3 hours ago, Scylla said:

Hi guys! I'm new here but have lurked before on these forums when Grey's has annoyed me to no end. I read most of this thread (so I apologize if someone has said this already)  -- but 1. love that some of you guys are FRIENDS junkies. To say I'm obsessed with that show for 20 years now is an understatement 2. I am a fan of Jo Wilson (I think I may be the only one lol). 3. So over Meredith but she still entertains me. 4. Using this first post to mention something not sure if anyone else has said -- I was fuzzy with Jo's background (other than living in a car, ok we get it), but I didn't necessarily take her "I can't", "I w--" (as my subtitles shows) as "I was married.." no, i was more so thinking of something along the lines of she can't because of legal reasons OUTSIDE of marriages. She's illegal (from canada maybe?) or part of witness protection program (why she is so jumpy and has a gun). I pulled up her 'wikia' from fans who took notes of crap about her (some of it is interesting), but all seems so sketchy. LIke a girl on the run. Curious on your thoughts? I just feel 'sham marriage or prostitute' is too easy for a deep dark secret. Maybe im just going overboard on the idea she's undercover from not being American, I don't know. I just feel she really wants to but legally cannot. 

If she were illegal, that'd be more incentive to get married - she'd become a citizen by marriage. It's mostly a paperwork issue and they're both highly paid doctors. Plus if she is illegal, she had to get fake papers or she wouldn't have been able to apply for a medical license or be employed at Grey-Sloan. She would have also had a detailed background check when joining the surgical resident program. She is in a profession where her papers would be checked every time she applied for a research grant or fellowship or wanted to participate in clinical trials, etc - if her fake paperwork is able to navigate all that, marriage would be cake.

Her being in WitSec is an intriguing idea but then why didn't she just say no to the proposal the first time? That's not something that would change unless she left WitSec. 

Edited May 16, 2016 by Gtr187

[Nobodysfan]

Interesting quote from Shonda: Tonight's episode of #GreysAnatomy has one of those final moments that you don't see coming. For real. I didn't. And I planned it.  

I wonder what did not she see coming about Meredith/Nathan scene - (I presume it is this scene she mentioned) when she planned it herself?

Edited May 16, 2016 by NathanRiggsfan

[choclatechip45]

I thought it was Jo saying no since Camilla mentioned she found it shocking

[esco1822]

3 hours ago, NathanRiggsfan said:

Interesting quote from Shonda: Tonight's episode of #GreysAnatomy has one of those final moments that you don't see coming. For real. I didn't. And I planned it.  

I wonder what did not she see coming about Meredith/Nathan scene - (I presume it is this scene she mentioned) when she planned it herself?

She didn't see it coming that everyone in the world saw it coming. 

[Shellie]

2 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

I thought it was Jo saying no since Camilla mentioned she found it shocking

That's what I thought too.

[schnauzergirl]

I just got around to watching this episode and was reminded yet again how selfish, self-centered and insensitive Meredith is.  If she can't be happy, nobody can be happy.  Her behavior in the OR was unprofessional even by Grey Sloan standards.  Riggs has become my hero for calling Meredith out, but come on, that parking lot passion had me laughing out loud.

[Anela]

On 5/13/2016 at 10:43 PM, candall said:

Jo's already married.  Put your money down.

That was my thought, as well. 

I felt bad for Meredith at the beginning, but her giving Amelia a similar speech to the one she gave Little Grey, years ago, was annoying. Amelia did not kill her husband, and would love to have her brother back, just as much as Mere. 

I don't mind Riggs. 

[Anela]

And what's this about Owen's sister? Missing, and not necessarily dead? Bloody hell, they're that desperate for a story line that they're going there? 

[bonniejmac]

On 5/16/2016 at 0:31 PM, NathanRiggsfan said:

Interesting quote from Shonda: Tonight's episode of #GreysAnatomy has one of those final moments that you don't see coming. For real. I didn't. And I planned it.  

I wonder what did not she see coming about Meredith/Nathan scene - (I presume it is this scene she mentioned) when she planned it herself?

 

On 5/16/2016 at 4:26 PM, esco1822 said:

She didn't see it coming that everyone in the world saw it coming. 

Even Jerrika Hinton tweeted this from her dad: 

‏@hellojerrika

"You want to say anything to Twitter before I go?" Mom: GREY'S FOREVER! Dad: I really have enjoyed the season. And I knew #Miggs was coming.

[dmc]

On 5/14/2016 at 6:22 PM, Kate213 said:

Callie's case for wanting to modify the custody arrangement and move Sofia out of state was weak.  It has nothing to do with either of them being a bad parent (despite Callie trying to paint Arizona as one in court).  You can't have joint custody when the parents live on opposite sides of the country.  Therefore, one of them was getting sole physical custody and it is not automatically given to the biological mother -- the law does not (nor should it) work like that.  Callie being biologically related to Sofia doesn't make her "more" of a parent; Callie and Arizona are equally Sofia's parents in the eyes of the law.

Right which is why a judge would have given them joint custody

[GreysFan89]

48 minutes ago, dmc said:

Right which is why a judge would have given them joint custody

How what that have worked? Sofia taken a 6 hour flight every couple of days?

You cannot have joint custody when the parents live that far apart, one of them has to have physical custody.

[esco1822]

1 hour ago, dmc said:

Right which is why a judge would have given them joint custody

Yeah the whole point of that trial was there could not be joint custody because they'd be living across the country, hence the sole physical custody being the outcome and purpose of the trial.  The judge basically said that at the beginning of the episode. 

[Nobodysfan]

On 16. 5. 2016 at 8:06 PM, choclatechip45 said:

I thought it was Jo saying no since Camilla mentioned she found it shocking

I naturally assumed she referred to Meredith/Nathan hook-up, but it is possible she meant Jo.

[Nobodysfan]

23 hours ago, schnauzergirl said:

I just got around to watching this episode and was reminded yet again how selfish, self-centered and insensitive Meredith is.  If she can't be happy, nobody can be happy.  Her behavior in the OR was unprofessional even by Grey Sloan standards.  Riggs has become my hero for calling Meredith out, but come on, that parking lot passion had me laughing out loud.

Some do say it was awkward or not passionate at all. Why did it make you laugh? Was it unbelievable? Do you think actors have or do not have chemistry with each other? Was it badly acted or directed or both?

I think both actors were sort of wooden and tense. I think Martin had more natural chemistry with both actresses from Off the map series even with Kelly or Caterina  on Greys. I just find Meredith too bitchy and unattractive in this scene,almost unwomanly if there is even such a word.

I would like to give this pairing a chance and enjoy the scene but I just find it very weird,not natural,she pounced on him like a vampire or like a lunatic whore. And also the way she says shut up, very off-putting, I think it is Meredith who makes the scene almost unwatchable or cringy. She is like  a harpy to him. And the kiss is not passionate at least not from her, it seems more like she kissed him out of hate or anger, fury.

I think Martin did  a much better job acting-wise than Ellen in this scene.  

I´d rather it would have been Nathan reuniting with Megan.

Edited May 18, 2016 by NathanRiggsfan

[schnauzergirl]

57 minutes ago, NathanRiggsfan said:

Some do say it was awkward or not passionate at all. Why did it make you laugh? Was it unbelievable? Do you think actors have or do not have chemistry with each other? Was it badly acted or directed or both?

I think both actors were sort of wooden and tense. I think Martin had more natural chemistry with both actresses from Off the map series even with Kelly or Caterina  on Greys. I just find Meredith too bitchy and unattractive in this scene,almost unwomanly if there is even such a word.

I would like to give this pairing a chance and enjoy the scene but I just find it very weird,not natural,she pounced on him like a vampire or like a lunatic whore. And also the way she says shut up, very off-putting, I think it is Meredith who makes the scene almost unwatchable or cringy. She is like  a harpy to him. And the kiss is not passionate at least not from her, it seems more like she kissed him out of hate or anger, fury.

I think Martin did  a much better job acting-wise than Ellen in this scene.  

I´d rather it would have been Nathan reuniting with Megan.

NathanRiggsfan, your first paragraph summarizes why I laughed at this scene, so my answer to each of your legitimate and reasonable questions is YES.

[Anela]

6 hours ago, NathanRiggsfan said:

Some do say it was awkward or not passionate at all. Why did it make you laugh? Was it unbelievable? Do you think actors have or do not have chemistry with each other? Was it badly acted or directed or both?

I think both actors were sort of wooden and tense. I think Martin had more natural chemistry with both actresses from Off the map series even with Kelly or Caterina  on Greys. I just find Meredith too bitchy and unattractive in this scene,almost unwomanly if there is even such a word.

I would like to give this pairing a chance and enjoy the scene but I just find it very weird,not natural,she pounced on him like a vampire or like a lunatic whore. And also the way she says shut up, very off-putting, I think it is Meredith who makes the scene almost unwatchable or cringy. She is like  a harpy to him. And the kiss is not passionate at least not from her, it seems more like she kissed him out of hate or anger, fury.

I think Martin did  a much better job acting-wise than Ellen in this scene.  

I´d rather it would have been Nathan reuniting with Megan.

I thought it was weird, too. I think he has more chemistry with Meredith's sister, although I think she's his boss (not that that stopped anyone else). 

[Nobodysfan]

16 hours ago, Anela said:

I thought it was weird, too. I think he has more chemistry with Meredith's sister, although I think she's his boss (not that that stopped anyone else). 

Something was off in that scene. I don´t know maybe the way it was edited,acted,directed, written,or all mixed up. 

Hard to say but compared to Crowen first kiss  or their first vent room kiss (then Owen became a face eater) or even Cristina/Burke or Izzie/Alex first kiss, I think there was much worse almost zero chemistry between Meredith and Nathan and it did not feel natural to me, too forced. Way over the top. 

I think people have different subjective opinions but everybody can see what is natural, where you can feel the actors´ chemistry and what is totally fake and /or forced. Their car park hook-up was not good. JMHO

At first when I saw their scene, I was quite excited but when you rewatch it a couple of times and analyse it, I think it was not well-done which is quite sad. 

Edited May 19, 2016 by NathanRiggsfan

[Chas411]

To be honest Meredith is just so spiteful, bitter and full of hate right now that I don't know if I could buy her with anyone. Even in her friendship scenes with Alex it comes off as all him making the effort. I don't know if it's how Ellen plays her these days but there's just no warmth there. There hasn't been since season 9 in my opinion this episode just highlighted it.

[Nobodysfan]

6 minutes ago, Chas411 said:

To be honest Meredith is just so spiteful, bitter and full of hate right now that I don't know if I could buy her with anyone. Even in her friendship scenes with Alex it comes off as all him making the effort. I don't know if it's how Ellen plays her these days but there's just no warmth there. There hasn't been since season 9 in my opinion this episode just highlighted it.

Very true indeed. 

Edited May 19, 2016 by NathanRiggsfan

[timimouse]

I just watched this episode again (I won't get to see tonight's episode until tomorrow) and something struck me again, as it did the first time I watched. I think the writing has gotten lazy. I don't get that shock factor that I used to, because the stories are setup far too obviously. I wasn't surprised Jo said no to Alex because we had that patient at th the beginning trying to set him up with her daughter. I wasn't surprised that Fez died because we had that big scene with his family and of COURSE him and Steph reconciled and made plans for the future. I wasn't surprised that Amelia and Owen got engaged because they were just having a "hypothetical " conversation about it. I was surprised to see Katherine in the elevator waiting for Richard. I give them that one. I also wasn't surprised about the Riggs/ Meredith pairing because we had that whole "angst" thing going. I also will not be surprised when we have a Riggs/Pearce/Grey triangle because Maggie was making some serious googly eyes at him (before the box of bacon).

Also, I found it a bit strange that the gallery for Fez's surgery was empty. It seemed like a pretty big deal surgery. Remember when everyone used to fight to be in on these surgeries and then those that didn't get in would be in the gallery moaning about it? So how was Stephanie the only one watching?

[dmc]

On 5/18/2016 at 10:41 AM, GreysFan89 said:

How what that have worked? Sofia taken a 6 hour flight every couple of days?

You cannot have joint custody when the parents live that far apart, one of them has to have physical custody.

Its called summer in NY and the rest of the year in Seattle or vice versa.  I have so many friends that had this growing up

[Chewy101]

Its called summer in NY and the rest of the year in Seattle or vice versa.  I have so many friends that had this growing up

Technically, that is not joint custody. One parent has physical custody, and the other has visitation. I don't know of a joint custody situation, personally, where there wasn't equal time given to each parent, based on that verdict. 

My dad only got two weeks in the summer because it wasn't joint custody. And he lived five miles from us. Joint custody is pretty rare because it is so unrealistic for most circumstances.

Edited May 20, 2016 by Chewy101

[dmc]

33 minutes ago, Chewy101 said:

Technically, that is not joint custody. One parent has physical custody, and the other has visitation. I don't know of a joint custody situation, personally, where there wasn't equal time given to each parent, based on that verdict. 

My dad only got two weeks in the summer because it wasn't joint custody. And he lived five miles from us. Joint custody is pretty rare because it is so unrealistic for most circumstances.

Joint custody frequently doesn't mean equal time and it isn't that rare.  See below:

In the United States, many states recognize two forms of joint custody, which include joint physical custody and joint legal custody.[2] In joint physical custody, the actual lodging and care of the child is shared according to a court-ordered custody schedule.[5][6] In joint legal custody, both parents share the ability to have access to their children's records, such as educational records, health records, and other records.[7]

 

I don't know what the legal definition of your arrangement but joint custody could definitely mean with one parent part of the year the other parent in the summers.  It could also mean just weekends with one parent.  I had a lot friends of divorce parents growing up so this is something I am well versed in. 

In a case like Sophia, unless there was an issue with one parent...a judge wouldn't have awarded sole custody.

They would have either done a joint custody arrangement or mandated a parent to stay in the area (sometimes this happens when the reason you are leaving isn't job related).

[Chewy101]

Joint custody absolutely gives access to records for both parents. And that is definitely common. And I guess my experience has been that joint custody is rarely displayed as both parents having equal access to the actual child. Things have definitely changed a lot. So, back to summers only for one parent? I would not call that joint custody. Correction: I would not call that successful joint custody. 

Honestly, I thought the judge should have mandated that Callie grow a brain and not leave unless she was ready to leave her child. Because it wasn't work related, it was immature related. But now that AZ has custody, I am happy. Let Callie do whatever she wants. She always has.

[dmc]

2 hours ago, Chewy101 said:

Joint custody absolutely gives access to records for both parents. And that is definitely common. And I guess my experience has been that joint custody is rarely displayed as both parents having equal access to the actual child. Things have definitely changed a lot. So, back to summers only for one parent? I would not call that joint custody. Correction: I would not call that successful joint custody. 

Honestly, I thought the judge should have mandated that Callie grow a brain and not leave unless she was ready to leave her child. Because it wasn't work related, it was immature related. But now that AZ has custody, I am happy. Let Callie do whatever she wants. She always has.

It's not ideal, I mean ideal would be both parents under one roof still together.  I think its difficult on parents to not have you all the time or for every holiday.  I also think when a kid gets older they are less open to leaving for an entire summer.

That being said, custody agreements are about trying to find a middle ground for the child's best interest. A middle ground is usually a joint agreement simply because if a child has two parents that love him/her most judges want both those parents to be a part of the child's life. 

As for Callie, I pretty much agree with you.  I mean before the issues with Arizona when Bailey was like...so you are leaving your job...to follow a resident...I basically completely agreed.  Penny and Callie don't know each other that well.  Who moves across the county and puts their child through that for something that may not even work out.  That being said, I still don't think a judge would have awarded Arizona full custody. But you know this show?  The plots aren't always realistic. 

[taanja]

On ‎5‎/‎15‎/‎2016 at 7:21 PM, Gtr187 said:

Well, there's not a lot of detail that's been put out there, but we know this much:

1)Patrick is a big racing fan, and he wanted to devote more time to it. 

2)His real life marriage was also having trouble.

3)He approached Shonda about a reduced schedule so he could spend more time on his marriage/racing. She agreed (that's why Derek went to DC to do the brain mapping thing).

4)At some point after the 1st agreement, Patrick came back to talk about the next season. Something happened in that discussion that really angered Shonda, so she decided to kill the character off. Stories vary (he demanded a much reduced schedule for s12, more money, creative differences, etc). We'll probably never know for sure unless she decides to go into more detail. Shonda is famous for not tolerating "diva" behavior (see: Heigl) and has made some vague comments suggesting Dempsey was turning into a diva. 

Rumor has  it he was also having an affair. It's what broke up his marriage. Shonda doesn't go for that.

[Chewy101]

2 hours ago, taanja said:

Rumor has  it he was also having an affair. It's what broke up his marriage. Shonda doesn't go for that.

Except on her show... Where just about every character has one, lol.

 

2 hours ago, dmc said:

That being said, I still don't think a judge would have awarded Arizona full custody. But you know this show?  The plots aren't always realistic. 

Amen. I certainly didn't see that coming. But in Grey's world, it was the best case scenario, realistic or not.