S02.E04: Penny And Dime

[Danny Franks]

Honestly, I want the Defenders to be Matt, Jessica and Trish, with assistance from Foggy, Karen and Malcolm. Don't need anyone else, really. Not Big N. Bland, Luke Cage, and not Ser Danny of Rand.

[Primetimer]

Lisa Schmeiser is not a crackpot: she thinks, after S02.E04, that this show is squandering an actor of considerable, brainy menace.

Read the story

[Linderhill]

sorry Lisa, I can not disagree more.  We don't need Finn back at all.  And I know I'm in the minority but the thing that bothered me the most about the first season of Daredevil was spending so much time with Vincent D'Onofrio's Kingpin.  If I never see him shoved in my face again I'll be happy.

yes, I know he's back, I've watched that far but he seems to be more subtle and tolerable this time around.

I watch these super hero shows to see the super heroes, not the villains so much.

Edited March 22, 2016 by Linderhill

[JustaPerson]

Finn was good for a one off. After threatening that dog, I laughed when Frank shot Finn's face off. I know, I'm evil.

 

ETA: Whatever you may think of Matt/Karen, I think we can agree that Charlie Cox was amazing in that whole mellowed-out, lovestruck moment of peace right before he realized Elektra was sitting on his couch. It was perfect. 

Edited March 22, 2016 by JustaPerson

[Eeg162]

Speaking of...what happened to the dog? I'm trying to watch ep 5 but I keep thinking about punishers dog!

[Grace284]

The nice Irish fellas sent him to live on a lovely dog farm with lots of treats and new doggie friends.

[that one guy]

I'm sure the dog is okay, since, like many of these characters, Max the dog is a recurring character in the comics. They wouldn't kill him offscreen.

 

As for Matt and Karen - I can't find it now, but someone pointed out to me in one of these threads that Matt's not honest with anyone, and only told Foggy because Foggy found him beaten and bleeding and in costume.  He likes being a lone wolf and doesn't want to be accountable to anyone. 

I was really hoping that she would either grow out of it or that she would go out with Foggy, which seemed like the better pairing in my opinion.  I wonder what changed on Matt and Foggy's parts?  Foggy was clearly very interested in Karen last season as well and I see none of that this season.

 

 

I dunno. Foggy was obviously attracted to her early in Season 1, but then he ended up getting back with his ex, and Ep.1 indicated they split up again about two months ago, didn't talk for a while, and its still awkward. So I kind of feel it's complicated with Foggy, and anyone he'd started dating last season would have been Rebound Girl and not worked out, even someone as clearly awesome as Karen. Frankly both these guys have issues. 

[Dandesun]

I'd have to agree about Matt hiding things. It's been such a part of his life since he was quite young, hiding the fact that he's got the other senses that allow him some sense of super despite not being able to process things through his eyes, that it's probably just default. I mean, Foggy knows that Elektra existed and was Matt's girlfriend for awhile and almost caused Matt to flunk out of college...  but does he know just how much of a wreck she is? Did Matt tell him about Elektra getting Sweeney for Matt to pummel and kill? I'm going to guess that's a big fat no.

 

I think Matt really is just used to hiding large portions of his life from people. Even the people he cares about. It's as much a part of him as his blindness/sonar and it's obviously not easy for him to break that habit. Hell, Foggy doesn't want to know the details of what Matt is doing out there because of the trouble it could get him into... even if he's certain that if Matt was found out, he'd go down with the ship, too.

[Bec]

That's a really good point. As much as it annoys me in the story, it makes perfect sense that Matt's not good at being truthful. It does make me feel better that it's a character driven thing, not a thing that's only happening because the plot demands it.

 

I don't think he really likes being a lone wolf, though. He's just used to it from years of having no choice but to be all alone. Old habits and all that.

[AudienceofOne]

That was an amazing episode. Just brutal and tragic and sexy and everything. I'm not behind the Karen/Matt romance but if you have to do it then this is how you do it. That scene was great.

 

The cemetery scene was just incredible. It really made me feel all the feels. And yes, the Punisher was insane and wrong but for him to just give up like that was the most powerful thing I've seen in television in a while.

 

I'm loving this season way more than S1. Partly it's because I'm not being dragged down by Fiske's one-dimensional romance with his one-dimensional girlfriend. But partly because the show is letting all these scenes breathe. And that is what makes Netflix shows (when they're done right) head and shoulders above other shows.

[RustbeltWriter]

The Punisher can be such a one note character that I'm glad he was so well treated here. Bernthal really did a nice job.

[Eneya]

Karen was shown as QUITE disturbed and bothered by killing Wesley and the death of Ben. I can even point scenes, individual scenes.
Outside of it... of course there are less women in whatever area... recently I had the misfortune of reading how women in mining and other male-dominated areas are treated by their male colleagues. It was freaking disgusting... so... no wonder not more women want to subject themselves to such experiences. Also... sure, we are talking about undead ninjas... OF COURSE we are going for realism and realistic men/women proportion, you silly geese. That is why we watch superhero series... cause we want perfect realism... /end sarcasm.

[GenieinTX]

The Irish mob head, or Van Gogh to me as a Doctor Who fan, was infectiously gleeful, I'm almost disappointed he's gone.

 

 

I was so happy to see Tony Curran.  Too bad he got his face shot off.  I highly recommend watching him on Defiance.  He totally gets into that character and bad asses all over the place.

 

It kills me to see Matt and Karen getting together.  As much as Matt needs someone awesome and deserves love, this is going to hurt Karen so badly.  When she finds out, she is going to feel so betrayed because you know he's not going to tell her.  She's going to find out in some horrible way and it's going to be heartbreaking.

[Beardrunner]

Wasn't Finn in Marvel comics but with a messed up face from a bomb blast? They could have plans for him to make a comeback.

[amass]

(I saw you, flashing green light!)

I think green light indicated that the house was being monitored, that's why that van showed up.

[Anela]

On 3/18/2016 at 7:21 AM, pootlus said:

Two thoughts from this episode:

 

Did the dog live?

 

Jon Bernthal's near-monologue towards the end was awesome.  I was bawling like a baby at the end.

I started to cry, too. He was perfect for this. I was glad when he shot the guy who threatened his dog, and said, "who cares?" about HIS family, when he was just torturing this guy over the death of his son. Wilson Fisk was involved in all sorts of bad things, like human trafficking, from what I recall (his associations were with people doing that, at least). This guy wanted to rid the place of the people like that, and I can't say that I blame him. 

I'm watching episode 5, but just barely. I'm going to have to finish tomorrow. After what I just watched, I have no interest in this Elektra person right now (I'm not a big comic fan - I only got into this because I'd heard it was good, last year, and it actually was). 

[Captanne]

Just finished the episode and find Electra completely revolting.  I see vastly more chemistry of Matt with Foggy than with her.  I think it's the actress.  Also, the setup was too abrupt and shallow.  There are limits to the comic book genre and I have to keep reminding myself of that.

 

ETA:  Speaking of chemistry.  Yeah. Karen.  Meh.  Too bad.  I get that he is looking for "the girl next door" type ("I'm from a tiny town in Vermont!" she says.)  He has certainly found it.  And as much as the show is trying to make her smart and sassy -- and give us a build up to the "will they/won't they" -- it's just that the two actors don't have it.  They just don't have it.  For me, that is.  I don't see it.  They are cute but it's forced.  Which returns me to the limits of the comic book venue -- there really isn't much nuance.  "Girl Next Door" meets "Bad Boy Trying to be Good".  It's been done a million times.  They need chemistry to overcome the blandness of the trope.  Ultimately, the source of the story has an audience of 13 year old boys and starry-eyed girls who grew up on Cinderella.

Edited September 6, 2017 by Captanne

[Akenta]

I always thought Foggy and Karen would make a good couple.  I don't care for the women Foggy was with last (not sure if they are still a couple)

[sinkwriter]

Karen drives me up a wall. I appreciate her courage and drive to find answers, but for fuck's sake, when someone gives you the address for the PUNISHER, why do you go alone?? Bring some backup, just in case, you idiot. Or maybe don't take your time lurking for so damn long. ARGH. 

[Affogato]

On 3/19/2016 at 11:02 AM, Ottis said:

 

 

I will take as many hi-quality Marvel shows on Netflix as they can create, regardless of the sex of the hero (or antihero). 

I am Late to this party.

I could do with a pregnant spiderwoman show. I think Jessica Drew’s  comic was was around 2015. Lost opportunity.