Sleepy Hollow in the Media

[MissAlmond]

On 11/17/2016 at 11:46 PM, Free said:

That and it looks so painfully generic especially their pathetic attempt at trying to get rid of just about everything that made the show what it was to begin with.

Yes, it does.  That's why I have no interest in S4.  I will, however, follow the ratings because ratings for all network shows interest me.  This season CBS is cooking on high heat with their Friday night lineup of MacGyver ->Hawaii 5-O ->Blue Bloods.   If that continues, FOX's midseason lineup of Rosewood ->Sleepy Hollow will be lucky if it gets up to simmer. 

[Free]

4 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

Yes, it does.  That's why I have no interest in S4.  I will, however, follow the ratings because ratings for all network shows interest me.  This season CBS is cooking on high heat with their Friday night lineup of MacGyver ->Hawaii 5-O ->Blue Bloods.   If that continues, FOX's midseason lineup of Rosewood ->Sleepy Hollow will be lucky if it gets up to simmer. 

Rosewood already bombed on Thursdays and SH is only going to decline further or at the very least, stay low.

[MissAlmond]

17 hours ago, Free said:

Rosewood already bombed on Thursdays and SH is only going to decline further or at the very least, stay low.

Sleepy Hollow was originally slated to return with the better rated Masterchef Jr as its lead.  I truly believe that's why they added a Cousin Oliver to the cast (Yaffe was a former Masterchef Jr contestant).   FOX's plan probably was Masterchef Jr would give SH a lift and SH itself remain steady on a slow night.   Maybe they hoped to even squeeze out a S5 to add for syndication purposes this way.  However, FOX Thursday’s have been a major disappointment, so Pitch was capped at  its original 10 episode  order (although I swear it was 13 at first), Rosewood was switched to Friday, and Masterchef Jr was moved to Thursdays to join a whole bunch of other cooking shows for a revamped mid season lineup.  Meanwhile, over at CBS, they hit the Friday night jackpot.  Although MacGyver’s ratings aren’t spectacular, the show has done wonders for Hawaii 5-O’s followed by the already solid Blue Bloods.  So what happens now to FOX on Friday's will be interesting.  I'm sure Dana and Gary fantasize Rosewood/SH will somehow duplicate that CBS Friday night magic, but the goat FOX sacrificed for a thrilling 7 game World Series is long gone. 

Edited November 21, 2016 by MissAlmond

[Free]

On 11/20/2016 at 8:02 PM, MissAlmond said:

Sleepy Hollow was originally slated to return with the better rated Masterchef Jr as its lead.  I truly believe that's why they added a Cousin Oliver to the cast (Yaffe was a former Masterchef Jr contestant).   FOX's plan probably was Masterchef Jr would give SH a lift and SH itself remain steady on a slow night.   Maybe they hoped to even squeeze out a S5 to add for syndication purposes this way.  However, FOX Thursday’s have been a major disappointment, so Pitch was capped at  its original 10 episode  order (although I swear it was 13 at first), Rosewood was switched to Friday, and Masterchef Jr was moved to Thursdays to join a whole bunch of other cooking shows for a revamped mid season lineup.  Meanwhile, over at CBS, they hit the Friday night jackpot.  Although MacGyver’s ratings aren’t spectacular, the show has done wonders for Hawaii 5-O’s followed by the already solid Blue Bloods.  So what happens now to FOX on Friday's will be interesting.  I'm sure Dana and Gary fantasize Rosewood/SH will somehow duplicate that CBS Friday night magic, but the goat FOX sacrificed for a thrilling 7 game World Series is long gone. 

Thankfully they moved MCJr away from Fridays as it was being wasted.

Even against MacGuyver, Rosewood was already weak, but it's going up against another procedural, otherwise it's a dump for them.   CBS is still a great night for CBS.

[Briony]

Its super transparent what they are trying to do now that CBS has ran away with Friday nights. Fox is betting that the audience that doesn't show up for CBS might tune into FOX's Friday if they offer more diverse faire. But Sleepy Hollow has spent its last two seasons going hard for viewers more at home at CBS and spent a good portion of S4 writing for the Master Chef crowd... so how is that gonna work exactly?

It's laughable. 

[Free]

4 hours ago, Briony said:

Its super transparent what they are trying to do now that CBS has ran away with Friday nights. Fox is betting that the audience that doesn't show up for CBS might tune into FOX's Friday if they offer more diverse faire. But Sleepy Hollow has spent its last two seasons going hard for viewers more at home at CBS and spent a good portion of S4 writing for the Master Chef crowd... so how is that gonna work exactly?

It's laughable. 

Not to mention, CBS has a solid overall lineup for Fridays, FOX just dumped 2 low rated flop shows here.  You need to strengthen your lineup and FOX didn't do that.

[MissAlmond]

1 hour ago, Free said:

Not to mention, CBS has a solid overall lineup for Fridays, FOX just dumped 2 low rated flop shows here.  You need to strengthen your lineup and FOX didn't do that.

Rosewood must have filmed all of their episodes.  These days, networks allow even Dead Shows Walking to finish airing shows in the can.  And to be fair, FOX didn't plan on airing back to back problematic shows.  Masterchef Jr was there to give Friday's strength and FOX thought Thursday night was secured.  After all, before this season started,  everybody predicted Pitch would be FOX's 2016-17 breakaway hit.   Come to think of it, everybody also predicted MacGyver would become one of CBS's 2016-17 bombs.  The best laid plans of mice and men . . . .

[Briony]

The thing about CBS is that it knows its audience and it doesn't really deviate from the formula that often. That's how shows critics hate (ala MacGyver and Bull) can survive there because they aren't made for the critics. They are tailor made for the NCIS crowd.

 I think FOX has this problem where they think they are serving some kinda middle. They want the traditionally CBS viewers and these other demographics that they see as underserved. But when they create for both, they don't really win over either.

I don't know how they didn't think Rosewood was gonna bomb. I remember hearing it was really only doing well because of its Empire lead in and that was a while ago. But then again, they renewed SH and think Lucifer is a winner so maybe unwarranted optimism really is the way things operate at Fox HQ. 

Edited November 23, 2016 by Briony

[MissAlmond]

45 minutes ago, Briony said:

I don't know how they didn't think Rosewood was gonna bomb. I remember hearing it was really only doing well because of its Empire lead in and that was a while ago. But then again, they renewed SH and think Lucifer is a winner so maybe unwarranted optimism really is the way things operate at Fox HQ. 

I have no idea what FOX thought/thinks about Rosewood.  But the reason they renewed Sleepy Hollow is simple.  It's produced by FOX Studios so they own it, they've said repeatedly Sleepy Hollow does well and makes money for them internationally, and FOX wanted additionally episodes for syndication purposes.  In other words, strictly business. 

45 minutes ago, Briony said:

That's how shows critics hate (ala MacGyver and Bull) can survive there because they aren't made for the critics. They are tailor made for the NCIS crowd.

Critics thought MacGvyer AND FOX's Lethal Weapon were going to bomb because Rush Hour, Minority Report, and a few other movies made into TV shows/rebooted TV shows had just bombed recently. 

Edited November 23, 2016 by MissAlmond

[Briony]

1 hour ago, MissAlmond said:

Critics thought MacGvyer AND FOX's Lethal Weapon were going to bomb because Rush Hour, Minority Report, and a few other movies made into TV shows/rebooted TV shows had just bombed recently. 

yeah but it also was just you know... bad. maybe its improved since the pilot. *shrugs*

Edited November 23, 2016 by Briony

[NuncaNunca]

44 minutes ago, MissAlmond said:

Critics thought MacGvyer AND FOX's Lethal Weapon were going to bomb because Rush Hour, Minority Report, and a few other movies made into TV shows/rebooted TV shows had just bombed recently. 

AD BUYERS thought MacGyver was going to bomb. It had one of the cheapest $/30-second ad buys of the 2016-17 season ($72K) and one of the lowest of any drama on the Big 4 networks. (You can look at the stats on Ad Age.) The only dramas that did worse among upfront ad buyers were ... drumroll ... The Exorcist and Sleepy Hollow.

(Buyers did bet on Lethal Weapon doing really well and paid ~$172K/30 sec for it!)

[Free]

3 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

Rosewood must have filmed all of their episodes.  These days, networks allow even Dead Shows Walking to finish airing shows in the can.  And to be fair, FOX didn't plan on airing back to back problematic shows.  Masterchef Jr was there to give Friday's strength and FOX thought Thursday night was secured.  After all, before this season started,  everybody predicted Pitch would be FOX's 2016-17 breakaway hit.   Come to think of it, everybody also predicted MacGyver would become one of CBS's 2016-17 bombs.  The best laid plans of mice and men . . . .

Even if MacGuyver did bomb, CBS would still be able to replace it with another new show or they could plug Amazing Race in there, FOX is still stuck dumping flop shows there.

[MissAlmond]

7 hours ago, Tehateki said:

(Buyers did bet on Lethal Weapon doing really well and paid ~$172K/30 sec for it!)

Probably due to Empire being its lead in, LW the show however didn't get good reviews.  But you are right - it's the ADS (ie money) that really matter. 

 

6 hours ago, Free said:

Even if MacGuyver did bomb, CBS would still be able to replace it with another new show or they could plug Amazing Race in there, FOX is still stuck dumping flop shows there.

Les Moonves knows how the game is played.  He's the only network head who bases his decisions on the older 25-54 demo because he stated that's where the money is.

[NuncaNunca]

4 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

Probably due to Empire being its lead in, LW the show however didn't get good reviews.  But you are right - it's the ADS (ie money) that really matter.

Actually, Lethal Weapon is in the same time slot as Rosewood last season (as lead-in to Empire, not Empire as lead-in), and ad buys for Rosewood in that slot in 2015-16 were $88K. LW doubled that for FOX.

[Briony]

5 hours ago, MissAlmond said:

Les Moonves knows how the game is played.  He's the only network head who bases his decisions on the older 25-54 demo because he stated that's where the money is.

I don't know if that demo is the most profitable. But I do imagine they are the easiest to cater to.

 

[LeeLeePanda]

I belong to a black nerd group on Facebook that has a Abbie Mills Vs Misty Knight thread going on right now. I love Simone Missick as Knight, but felt sad because I could totally see Nicole in that role. Maybe she could play her sister in season 2. I haven't finished season 1, so no spoilers! 

Also, this was my favorite response to the thread: 

[CocoaGoddess]

It's crazy because Misty Knight had so many Abbyisms, it was difficult for me to watch without getting irrationally angry at how badly Fox completely butchered SH. 

[LeeLeePanda]

9 hours ago, CocoaGoddess said:

It's crazy because Misty Knight had so many Abbyisms, it was difficult for me to watch without getting irrationally angry at how badly Fox completely butchered SH. 

Me too! I think that's one of the reasons I haven't been able to finish Luke Cage. 

[NuncaNunca]

Everything I see come out about S4 looks spectacularly stupid. A recurring teen internet star? Yikes.

I feel like even the CW wouldn't even greenlight the show that SH has become now.

Personally, I'm excited to try out Emerald City on NBC on Fridays at 9PM starting January 6. At least it's targeting an adult audience and taking big creative risks, not just following the tired supernatural procedural format.

[kieyra]

3 hours ago, Tehateki said:

Everything I see come out about S4 looks spectacularly stupid. A recurring teen internet star? Yikes.

I feel like even the CW wouldn't even greenlight the show that SH has become now.

Personally, I'm excited to try out Emerald City on NBC on Fridays at 9PM starting January 6. At least it's targeting an adult audience and taking big creative risks, not just following the tired supernatural procedural format.

To be fair, the CW has some pretty awesome and original (and diverse) shows now.

(And I don't just mean the genre stuff.)

[NuncaNunca]

2 hours ago, kieyra said:

To be fair, the CW has some pretty awesome and original (and diverse) shows now.

(And I don't just mean the genre stuff.)

Oh, for sure! (No shade.) The current CW wouldn't touch something that looked like SH S4 with a ten-foot pole.

I meant it might've had a chance ca. 2009.

[kieyra]

2 hours ago, Tehateki said:

Oh, for sure! (No shade.) The current CW wouldn't touch something that looked like SH S4 with a ten-foot pole.

I meant it might've had a chance ca. 2009.

God, I'm trying to remember what I was even watching on CW back then vs now. I was probably watching TVD ironically. :) And yeah, I know what you mean, you'd have to be like, "It's on the CW, but wait listen ..." when trying to recommend something to someone. 

[Free]

On ‎12‎/‎6‎/‎2016 at 1:10 PM, Tehateki said:

Everything I see come out about S4 looks spectacularly stupid. A recurring teen internet star? Yikes.

I feel like even the CW wouldn't even greenlight the show that SH has become now.

Personally, I'm excited to try out Emerald City on NBC on Fridays at 9PM starting January 6. At least it's targeting an adult audience and taking big creative risks, not just following the tired supernatural procedural format.

Teen star?  Wow, they're really blowing everything about this series up and I mean everything.

[NuncaNunca]

52 minutes ago, Free said:

Teen star?  Wow, they're really blowing everything about this series up and I mean everything.

Yep--the guy who played Peter Pan on Once Upon a Time is set to recur as a teen internet star. You cannot make this stuff up.

[Blackhoney]

Here is my opinion on the S4 opener, Columbia. I wasn't going to review the show because I didn't in any way want to promote it, but then decided to once I read TVLine's blatant lie about Abbie appearing in the episode. I think they also tried to rile up fans by alluding to two characters hugging. I think they want fans to believe it's a Ichabod and Diana, when it is not  

 

http://brownsista.com/real-review-season-4-premiere-of-sleepy-hollow/

[GHScorpiosRule]

7 hours ago, Tehateki said:

Yep--the guy who played Peter Pan on Once Upon a Time is set to recur as a teen internet star. You cannot make this stuff up.

Seriously? What are they gonna do? Have Mison and this guy have a battle over who has the sexier accent? I couldn't stand him in Once Upon a Time. Of course I'm biased, because I hatehatehate those showrunners for perverting my favorite fairy tales and characters. Like MY FAVORITE: Beauty and the Beast.

[Trini]

Season 3 DVD announcement:

Quote

Fox Home Entertainment has scheduled Sleepy Hollow - The Complete 3rd Season to arrive in stores on DVD this coming January 3rd. Due to falling sales on the Blu-ray versions of the first two seasons, Fox has elected to go DVD-only on this latest season set. The 5-disc set will include all the episodes, plus Deleted Scenes and a Gag Reel, for $39.98 SRP. ...

[Free]

On ‎12‎/‎10‎/‎2016 at 8:46 AM, Tehateki said:

Yep--the guy who played Peter Pan on Once Upon a Time is set to recur as a teen internet star. You cannot make this stuff up.

 

22 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Seriously? What are they gonna do? Have Mison and this guy have a battle over who has the sexier accent? I couldn't stand him in Once Upon a Time. Of course I'm biased, because I hatehatehate those showrunners for perverting my favorite fairy tales and characters. Like MY FAVORITE: Beauty and the Beast.

Don't forget, the Big Bad of the season is an evil rich tech mogul.

[LeeLeePanda]

On 12/10/2016 at 9:23 PM, Trini said:

Season 3 DVD announcement:

The fact that blue ray sales are slipping warms the cockles of my cold, petty heart. 

[Watermelon]

No commentary? I find that hilarious for petty reasons.

[Morrigan2575]

On 12/10/2016 at 5:08 PM, Blackhoney said:

Here is my opinion on the S4 opener, Columbia. I wasn't going to review the show because I didn't in any way want to promote it, but then decided to once I read TVLine's blatant lie about Abbie appearing in the episode. I think they also tried to rile up fans by alluding to two characters hugging. I think they want fans to believe it's a Ichabod and Diana, when it is not  

 

http://brownsista.com/real-review-season-4-premiere-of-sleepy-hollow/

I was curious to see what you thought. I think one line summed it up perfectly

This is now the Ichabod Crane show

I imagine some FOX executive decided early on that Crane/Mison was the draw/breakout star of the show and has been pushing for this exact outcome.

Edited December 12, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[LeeLeePanda]

4 hours ago, Watermelon said:

No commentary? I find that hilarious for petty reasons.

Riding the Pettycopter with you! Though, I would love to hear certain folks do an unauthorized commentary track. 

[Blackhoney]

On 12/12/2016 at 2:35 PM, Morrigan2575 said:

I was curious to see what you thought. I think one line summed it up perfectly

This is now the Ichabod Crane show

I imagine some FOX executive decided early on that Crane/Mison was the draw/breakout star of the show and has been pushing for this exact outcome.

Towards the end of the show Ichabod is reassured several times that he is at home and that various people will be there for him and it just annoyed me. In my mind 4 seasons equals 4 years so why the hell is Ichabod being babied and treated like he just crawled out of the earth? I was also annoyed by what I call the New Abbies. Everyone, including Jenny and Diana, seem to be tasked with making Crane feel good and wanted. Expect them to burp him before the season is out. Jenny especially seems to be picking up where Abbie left off, there’s even a passionate (and boring) hug between her and Ichabod, which I think the writers hope will become their hallmark, like with Abbie and Ichabod. Treating Crane like a soft piece of cotton isn’t overwhelming, but it is there and because it’s all pooled together at the end of the episode, it came off a bit heavy-handed.

 

Also, why is the show even bothering with the Witness plot? What is the purpose of the two Witnesses? Their importance was played down heavily in season three. Anyone can kill the demons and apparently the apocalypse is over. So, again, why are two Witnesses needed? They aren’t if you ask me. Just another poor plot decision on the part of the writing staff. Plus, if there is another Witness outside either Diana or her daughter, where does that leave Diana as far as being Ichabod’s new partner?

 

Honestly, as much as I hate this show, I just can’t stop talking about how bad it is and the blatantly poor decisions they keep making. Seeing Sleepy Hollow fall apart is like watching a car wreck- I seriously can’t look away no matter how hard I try.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Blackhoney

[Free]

On ‎12‎/‎12‎/‎2016 at 10:26 AM, LeeLeePanda said:

The fact that blue ray sales are slipping warms the cockles of my cold, petty heart. 

Maybe that should've been a sign for them, but they seem intent on running what's left of the show into the ground.

On ‎12‎/‎13‎/‎2016 at 10:27 PM, Blackhoney said:

Towards the end of the show Ichabod is reassured several times that he is at home and that various people will be there for him and it just annoyed me. In my mind 4 seasons equals 4 years so why the hell is Ichabod being babied and treated like he just crawled out of the earth? I was also annoyed by what I call the New Abbies. Everyone, including Jenny and Diana, seem to be tasked with making Crane feel good and wanted. Expect them to burp him before the season is out. Jenny especially seems to be picking up where Abbie left off, there’s even a passionate (and boring) hug between her and Ichabod, which I think the writers hope will become their hallmark, like with Abbie and Ichabod. Treating Crane like a soft piece of cotton isn’t overwhelming, but it is there and because it’s all pooled together at the end of the episode, it came off a bit heavy-handed.

 

Also, why is the show even bothering with the Witness plot? What is the purpose of the two Witnesses? Their importance was played down heavily in season three. Anyone can kill the demons and apparently the apocalypse is over. So, again, why are two Witnesses needed? They aren’t if you ask me. Just another poor plot decision on the part of the writing staff. Plus, if there is another Witness outside either Diana or her daughter, where does that leave Diana as far as being Ichabod’s new partner?

 

Honestly, as much as I hate this show, I just can’t stop talking about how bad it is and the blatantly poor decisions they keep making. Seeing Sleepy Hollow fall apart is like watching a car wreck- I seriously can’t look away no matter how hard I try.

IA, for me, it's the new Heroes, a show that implodes on itself and seems intent on ruining the show more and more.

[netlyon2]

10 hours ago, Free said:

IA, for me, it's the new Heroes, a show that implodes on itself and seems intent on ruining the show more and more.

Very apt comparison, especially since Heroes is another show that was initially lauded for the diversity of its cast and uniqueness of its premise, only to abandon both in favor of stale cliches and a focus on "fan-favorite" (read: white) characters.

[Free]

20 hours ago, netlyon2 said:

Very apt comparison, especially since Heroes is another show that was initially lauded for the diversity of its cast and uniqueness of its premise, only to abandon both in favor of stale cliches and a focus on "fan-favorite" (read: white) characters.

Exactly, it's the show that comes to mind with a show that has infamously tanked itself as hard.

[Yolapukka]

On 12/13/2016 at 11:27 PM, Blackhoney said:

Towards the end of the show Ichabod is reassured several times that he is at home and that various people will be there for him and it just annoyed me. In my mind 4 seasons equals 4 years so why the hell is Ichabod being babied and treated like he just crawled out of the earth? I was also annoyed by what I call the New Abbies. Everyone, including Jenny and Diana, seem to be tasked with making Crane feel good and wanted. Expect them to burp him before the season is out. Jenny especially seems to be picking up where Abbie left off, there’s even a passionate (and boring) hug between her and Ichabod, which I think the writers hope will become their hallmark, like with Abbie and Ichabod. Treating Crane like a soft piece of cotton isn’t overwhelming, but it is there and because it’s all pooled together at the end of the episode, it came off a bit heavy-handed.

 

Also, why is the show even bothering with the Witness plot? What is the purpose of the two Witnesses? Their importance was played down heavily in season three. Anyone can kill the demons and apparently the apocalypse is over. So, again, why are two Witnesses needed? They aren’t if you ask me. Just another poor plot decision on the part of the writing staff. Plus, if there is another Witness outside either Diana or her daughter, where does that leave Diana as far as being Ichabod’s new partner?

 

Honestly, as much as I hate this show, I just can’t stop talking about how bad it is and the blatantly poor decisions they keep making. Seeing Sleepy Hollow fall apart is like watching a car wreck- I seriously can’t look away no matter how hard I try.

 I can't love this post enough.

As much as I haaaated what was done to the show in season two , it not only had standout episodes, but it also gave us that fabulous finale that reset everything,.... which the subsequent show runner entirely failed to capitalize on in season three. One of the best things about it was Captain Crane. Instead of fish-out-of-water Ichabod,  they showed us the man of substance and action that he was in his own time, not the persnickety, befuddled, dependent goofball/sensitive soul he was reduced to last season. A shift to the Captain Crane characterization was a logical progression for the character and one which would have made him a better partner in all senses of the word for Abbie, especially the Abbie of season one,  something that finale also seemed to promise. What they've done to the character is horribly reductive and the infantilizing treatment your comments describe is not appealing to me as a viewer.

Edited December 23, 2016 by yuggapukka

[calibabe]

On 12/13/2016 at 8:27 PM, Blackhoney said:

Honestly, as much as I hate this show, I just can’t stop talking about how bad it is and the blatantly poor decisions they keep making. Seeing Sleepy Hollow fall apart is like watching a car wreck- I seriously can’t look away no matter how hard I try.

Honest question and not trying to be snarky by any means, but if as you say "as much as I hate this show', why are you still reviewing it? I know you said you were sent the episode but can't you not review it if they send it to you, with your reasons why noted in a reply? 

In all honesty how unbiased can your review of the S4 premier be with that amount of dislike and discomfort you apparently have for the show? I would hazard a guess that a large quantity of posters here in this forum will not watch the S4 premier and that is their prerogative to do so. I'm willing to give it an honest shot but that is my choice. If after the first few episodes it doesn't hold my interest I will be on to other interests I have. 

[NuncaNunca]

8 hours ago, calibabe said:

Honest question and not trying to be snarky by any means, but if as you say "as much as I hate this show', why are you still reviewing it? I know you said you were sent the episode but can't you not review it if they send it to you, with your reasons why noted in a reply? 

In all honesty how unbiased can your review of the S4 premier be with that amount of dislike and discomfort you apparently have for the show? I would hazard a guess that a large quantity of posters here in this forum will not watch the S4 premier and that is their prerogative to do so. I'm willing to give it an honest shot but that is my choice. If after the first few episodes it doesn't hold my interest I will be on to other interests I have. 

A harsh or negative review is not necessarily a dishonest or problematically biased review. (Also, all reviews are biased by expectations, taste, prior knowledge, etc.)

That said, Blackhoney posted a review of the premiere at least in part as a response to another (p)review of the premiere on TVLine (which itself is biased by the editors' relationships w/ networks/studios) that actually misrepresented facts about the premiere. Some people want to know what they're getting into prior to watching something and correctives to a promotional narrative are totally fair. For example, the promotional material and trailer for the new film Passengers presented a key aspect of the plot one way, but in the film it is very different. I am thankful reviewers and critics pointed this out because now I know I will absolutely avoid the film. Even though I didn't plan to see it in theaters, I have information now to put it in the "never" column rather than the "maybe I'd rent it from Redbox on a rainy day" or "if a friend begged me to go" columns.

[Free]

On ‎12‎/‎21‎/‎2016 at 8:59 PM, yuggapukka said:

 I can't love this post enough.

As much as I haaaated what was done to the show in season two , it not only had standout episodes, but it also gave us that fabulous finale that reset everything,.... which the subsequent show runner entirely failed to capitalize on in season three. One of the best things about it was Captain Crane. Instead of fish-out-of-water Ichabod,  they showed us the man of substance and action that he was in his own time, not the persnickety, befuddled, dependent goofball/sensitive soul he was reduced to last season. A shift to the Captain Crane characterization was a logical progression for the character and one which would have made him a better partner in all senses of the word for Abbie, especially the Abbie of season one,  something that finale also seemed to promise. What they've done to the character is horribly reductive and the infantilizing treatment your comments describe is not appealing to me as a viewer.

I know, it was a mess, how they reset things just to rehash the same mistakes again and again.  This is also the problem I had with Heroes and the new season seems like the new Reborn revival series.

[Blackhoney]

On 12/22/2016 at 3:24 AM, calibabe said:

Honest question and not trying to be snarky by any means, but if as you say "as much as I hate this show', why are you still reviewing it? I know you said you were sent the episode but can't you not review it if they send it to you, with your reasons why noted in a reply? 

In all honesty how unbiased can your review of the S4 premier be with that amount of dislike and discomfort you apparently have for the show? I would hazard a guess that a large quantity of posters here in this forum will not watch the S4 premier and that is their prerogative to do so. I'm willing to give it an honest shot but that is my choice. If after the first few episodes it doesn't hold my interest I will be on to other interests I have. 

I hold no malice towards the show or anyone associated with it. I can indeed review the show and be objective because that’s just how I am. I didn’t poorly review the show in hopes of deterring ppl from watching. I reviewed it actually for the same reason I started reviewing episodes back in season two: because other reviewers were blatantly being misleading and often downright dishonest.

I reviewed the S3 opener and a lot of Ichabbie fans (I count myself as one) hated my guts because of it. I was told I should have either gave a more glowing review, or just kept quiet, lest I cause fans not to watch. I continued to pan the show in my reviews before I eventually stopped watching, despite loving Nicole, liking Tom and adoring my precious Ichabbie.

I call my reviews the REAL review because I don’t lie, I don’t BS, and I don’t mislead. If it’s good, I’ll say it- and if it is not I will say that too.

People will see and get out of my reviews what they want, but they are truthful. The S4 opener, outside of the great cinematography, is a steaming hot mess of S3 nonsense. It’s just like the mindless, dull, demon-focused episodes of S3. The show is poorly written, plain and simple. Anyone who says otherwise is lying to themselves. Now, if looking at Ichabod stand in front of pretty monuments excites you, then by all means tune it cause that’s the most exciting thing in Columbia, outside of my belief Diana’s daughter might be the second witness.

And I'll say it again, I just can't look away from this train wreck... I can't.

Edited December 24, 2016 by Blackhoney

[Free]

3 hours ago, Blackhoney said:

I hold no malice towards the show or anyone associated with it. I can indeed review the show and be objective because that’s just how I am. I didn’t poorly review the show in hopes of deterring ppl from watching. I reviewed it actually for the same reason I started reviewing episodes back in season two: because other reviewers were blatantly being misleading and often downright dishonest.

I reviewed the S3 opener and a lot of Ichabbie fans (I count myself as one) hated my guts because of it. I was told I should have either gave a more glowing review, or just kept quiet, lest I cause fans not to watch. I continued to pan the show in my reviews before I eventually stopped watching, despite loving Nicole, liking Tom and adoring my precious Ichabbie.

I call my reviews the REAL review because I don’t lie, I don’t BS, and I don’t mislead. If it’s good, I’ll say it- and if it is not I will say that too.

People will see and get out of my reviews what they want, but they are truthful. The S4 opener, outside of the great cinematography, is a steaming hot mess of S3 nonsense. It’s just like the mindless, dull, demon-focused episodes of S3. The show is poorly written, plain and simple. Anyone who says otherwise is lying to themselves. Now, if looking at Ichabod stand in front of pretty monuments excites you, then by all means tune it cause that’s the most exciting thing in Columbia, outside of my belief Diana’s daughter might be the second witness.

And I'll say it again, I just can't look away from this train wreck... I can't.

I figured as much, no matter how many resets it has, it's not going to work if you don't actually address the core issues, the same mistakes over and over again.

[Blackhoney]

As God is my witness, if the S4 opener was good I would have said so. But it is bad. Really bad. You won't feel anything when you watch it, and I implore ppl to do just that. Make up your own minds. 

I see a preview of the episode was released by Fox and it is as boring as the episode itself. Note how it looks good though. Fox spent money making things look great, a little bit extra though shoulda been spent bringing in better writers and a more imaginative showrunner. 

It's obvious they're hoping a flashier looking Sleepy Hollow will lure fans back or attract new ones. Sadly, their focus on the superficial, scenery and demons, will continue to be the show’s undoing. 

Another odd thing I noticed in the S4 opener is that Ichabod and Jenny are not as solid together as they were in season one and especially “This is War” from S2. I have delighted in how well Jenny meshed with both Ichabod and Abbie in the past, but that relationship, like all the other relationships that once mattered, has been stripped away. They are just blah now. It's like something is missing. Now of course this is all opinion, but I think you'll all agree after you watch. Another blogger also noted this me. She too felt Ichabod and Jenny were off. I think fans who think “well at least we still have Jenny and Ichabod,” will be shocked as just how boring a duo they are. 

This too I blame on the writing. I felt every ounce of spark the Witnesses had was stripped away in S3. Yeah we had a few random Ichabbie moments, but overall their chemistry was almost non existent because their bond was no longer the show’s focus, the boring demons are. 

This season will suffer the same fate. Demons, demons, demons. That's all the writers care about now. Creating duller and duller demons every week. I also wanna add that all the demons are starting to look alike. 

[Free]

8 hours ago, Blackhoney said:

As God is my witness, if the S4 opener was good I would have said so. But it is bad. Really bad. You won't feel anything when you watch it, and I implore ppl to do just that. Make up your own minds. 

I see a preview of the episode was released by Fox and it is as boring as the episode itself. Note how it looks good though. Fox spent money making things look great, a little bit extra though shoulda been spent bringing in better writers and a more imaginative showrunner. 

It's obvious they're hoping a flashier looking Sleepy Hollow will lure fans back or attract new ones. Sadly, their focus on the superficial, scenery and demons, will continue to be the show’s undoing. 

Another odd thing I noticed in the S4 opener is that Ichabod and Jenny are not as solid together as they were in season one and especially “This is War” from S2. I have delighted in how well Jenny meshed with both Ichabod and Abbie in the past, but that relationship, like all the other relationships that once mattered, has been stripped away. They are just blah now. It's like something is missing. Now of course this is all opinion, but I think you'll all agree after you watch. Another blogger also noted this me. She too felt Ichabod and Jenny were off. I think fans who think “well at least we still have Jenny and Ichabod,” will be shocked as just how boring a duo they are. 

This too I blame on the writing. I felt every ounce of spark the Witnesses had was stripped away in S3. Yeah we had a few random Ichabbie moments, but overall their chemistry was almost non existent because their bond was no longer the show’s focus, the boring demons are. 

This season will suffer the same fate. Demons, demons, demons. That's all the writers care about now. Creating duller and duller demons every week. I also wanna add that all the demons are starting to look alike. 

Bad idea wasting anymore money on this thing.

Ichabod/Jenny is only going to get worse since they have an entire new team to focus on.

The demons might've been more interesting had they not felt like rejects of better supernatural shows.

[NuncaNunca]

1) No one needs to watch the premiere to make up their minds about it. We have more than enough information from promo and official sources (and S3) to make a judgment about it. If you expect the writers/producers to suddenly have storytelling talent or for FOX to have pumped extra money into it, you're delusional. If you expect to see Tom Mison pinching his brows in a forgettable, below-average supernatural network procedural, well, your low expectations are exactly what FOX is aiming for.

2) Scenes with Lyndie and Tom are like a black hole of bad acting, and they have been for everything beyond Crane/Jenny's first scene together in S1. Even Zach Appelman--who, like Nicole Beharie as Abbie, was very grounded and realistic in his role as Joe--couldn't pull her up. Only Nicole and Orlando Jones could take the grating edge off of Lyndie's lesser talent. Tom can't. It's glaring.

3) The monsters have looked bad AND similar for several seasons. Isn't the one in the promo basically the same design as the one in 3x09? Unimaginative and cheap.

4) There was nothing special about the quality of the directing/cinematography in the promo, and I doubt there is in the season either. Overall, the quality of network TV productions is now very high just because of available technology. Shooting outside and resisting the horrid blue filters in post-production helps. But recreating the aesthetic of Bones isn't exactly expensive, groundbreaking, or interesting or, you know, worth checking out. That said, the CGI looks so terrible you can see the pitiful $$ on the line item.

[Arnella]

Tehateki, I came over here because I have Sleepy Hollow on my Hulu watchlist (because I can't be bothered know when shows are on) and I saw that they had removed the cover photo of Tom and Abby and replaced it with one of just Tom.

Thank you for your analysis.  I was going to give it a try but I will accept Abby's death as it's conclusion 

[bobbysgurl]

Just show a promo still for S4.  I didn't even bother to open the link up to view the promo video.  I just can't. Sleepy Hollow, for me, died with Abbie.

[jhlipton]

On 12/10/2016 at 5:08 PM, Blackhoney said:

Here is my opinion on the S4 opener, Columbia. I wasn't going to review the show because I didn't in any way want to promote it, but then decided to once I read TVLine's blatant lie about Abbie appearing in the episode. I think they also tried to rile up fans by alluding to two characters hugging. I think they want fans to believe it's a Ichabod and Diana, when it is not  

 

http://brownsista.com/real-review-season-4-premiere-of-sleepy-hollow/

I think you have a typo: "heal their wombs" should be "heal their wounds".  Otherwise great review -- thanks!

 

On 12/10/2016 at 9:46 AM, NuncaNunca said:

Yep--the guy who played Peter Pan on Once Upon a Time is set to recur as a teen internet star. You cannot make this stuff up.

Robbie Kay is an actor to watch out for (much like Dylan O'Brien, who got his start on another show not worthy of his talent).

[Blackhoney]

On 12/24/2016 at 0:03 PM, Free said:

Bad idea wasting anymore money on this thing.

Ichabod/Jenny is only going to get worse since they have an entire new team to focus on.

The demons might've been more interesting had they not felt like rejects of better supernatural shows.

Previous demons, particularly those in season one, were all tied to the overall story of the Witnesses. Ro'kenhronteys and The Golem are two excellent examples. Now, some random person is killed, they discover a demon did it, Ichabod ties the demon to some story in history, and voilà- case solved. Game over. The show is a supernatural procedural, only the cases aren’t interesting and neither is the show. That's why I said in my review people who liked season three would like season four. If demons killing ppl is your thing, SH may be right up your alley. But if you long for the Sleepy Hollow of S1, you're in trouble. Those days are long gone. Crane is now an unpaid detective and the big bad is a tech mogul who looks like he doesn't bathe.

Thanks @jhlipton

Edited January 4, 2017 by Blackhoney

[Free]

2 hours ago, Blackhoney said:

Previous demons, particularly those in season one, were all tied to the overall story of the Witnesses. Ro'kenhronteys and The Golem are two excellent examples. Now, some random person is killed, they discover a demon did it, Ichabod ties the demon to some story in history, and voilà- case solved. Game over. The show is a supernatural procedural, only the cases aren’t interesting and neither is the show. That's why I said in my review people who liked season three would like season four. If demons killing ppl is your thing, SH may be right up your alley. But if you long for the Sleepy Hollow of S1, you're in trouble. Those days are long gone. Crane is now an unpaid detective and the big bad is a tech mogul who looks like he doesn't bathe.

Thanks @jhlipton

That's exactly the problem, they left the mythology in the dust and ended up with rejects from other supernatural shows.