S04.E12: Unchained

[Guest]

Does Felicity's dad know Oliver is the Arrow now? Because if the camera lens was in Roy's eye, Oliver looked straight at him when he went after him without the Arrow suit. Her dad saw all of that. He must connect the dots somehow. 

 

Now I'm wondering whether her dad will do a little digging...

 

Hmm.

 

Felicity is in a wheelchair. She was never dead. There is no second chance to give.

 

She's in a wheelchair?!!! I missed this! 

 

LOL seriously though. Okay? My point was everyone gets magically healed apart from Felicity. Magic tea, magic lotus flower...and none for Felicity Smoak!

Edited February 4, 2016 by Guest

[Racj82]

It was a fairly enjoyable episode, very nice to see Roy back though it was a shame we couldn't see Speedy/Arsenal team up. I wasn't exactly sure, were those mercenaries Calculator hired. Ghosts? If not can they please get some different looks?

Seeing Katana, however brief, was so nice and this (to me) puts to bed that DC is forcing them to kill off these characters that they share with SS. Though was she going to spend her life sitting in front of that alter thing? The set looked straight from Tomb Raider which I loved.

And we get to add two more characters to "this is my life" speech to Oliver, that should hopefully be over with now.

I wonder why Oliver doesn't try to get in contact with Constantine again, at least mention that he has tried.

I was a bit surprised that they seemingly wrapped up the Palmer tech storyline. Though Papa Smoak could always jeopardize that in the future. I feel like the writers are kind of moving through Felicity's insecurities a little to quickly, I don't need 5-6 episodes of her agonizing or questioning herself, I think 2-3 episodes would be a good amount, but good for her getting back that fire in her for her job.

We don't know if Katana is dead now and since they reintroduced her, she could still be killed.

[Racj82]

Does Felicity's dad know Oliver is the Arrow now? Because if the camera lens was in Roy's eye, Oliver looked straight at him when he went after him without the Arrow suit. Her dad saw all of that. He must connect the dots somehow.

Now I'm wondering whether her dad will do a little digging...

Hmm.

She's in a wheelchair?!!! I missed this!

LOL seriously though. Okay? My point was everyone gets magically healed apart from Felicity. Magic tea, magic lotus flower...and none for Felicity Smoak!

Sorry, second chance implies she died since everyone else who got a second chance died. And it's been a few episodes. There is nothing to my knowledge stating she can't be cured. But, I also one of the complaint lobbied at this show all the time is that nothing sticks. People die, come back, etc. It's probably time they continue to let these things stick. She's in a wheelchair. It's not the end of her world. She just needs to readjust. I don't want this for her but I don't need it reversed either. This world should have more long standing consequences. Even for the least deserving ones.

[Chaser]

 

So cute. 

I thought it was random. Who jumps to that? Turns out it's a wink to the comics. Roy Harper was replaced by a clone at one point. 

[TrueMyth]

So, I actually liked this episode, but a few things:

 

FLASHBACKS

I was floored to see Shado again.  So glad I wasn't spoiled for it or anything.  And then I was so sad that it was some nonsensical hallucination.  When she started to advise Oliver to go THROUGH the darkness, I was excited again.  I've really been looking forward to seeing darker Oliver in the flashbacks.

 

Here's how the flashbacks could get bearable; instead of Oliver waking up weak from fever with Poppy mopping his brow, have him jerk out of his passed out state chained up being tortured and go BADASS on those MOFOS!  He should use those totally too slack chains to choke someone, make Shado's shot real and stab something into the lead guy, be badass.  When they wrestle him down, they should try to torture Poppy to make Oliver talk, and then Oliver should be like, "whatever, like I care about her.  I killed her brother!"  He could use her reaction to make them stop torturing her (he feels bad, we see that, but it's much more dark)... next episode, he breaks them out and they go commando on the Shadowspire installation, but Poppy doesn't trust him... I don't know, just give me more than these boring, one note scenes!

 

CALCULATOR

Okay, so he knows his daughter is living in Star City and CEO of PT... why exactly was he gearing up to KILL EVERYONE IN THE CITY?  I know we'll obviously get at least one more episode to get to know the scope of his plans, but I feel like we should have had some indication that he either 1) created some kind of protection bubble around the area he expected Felicity to be in, 2) didn't realize that Felicity was in Star City until after his 'net bomb was blown, or 3) didn't know Felicity was his daughter.  I know they wanted the shock value of his smarmy lean-into-frame reveal with Oliver, but that makes it seem that he's figured out who Felicity is, you know?  They COULD have had him approach Felicity as the Calculator who's somehow figured out that Felicity is the hacker who helped foil his plot, only to have FELICITY recognize HIM.  Felicity has probably changed a fair bit since he last saw her...  To sum up, why you trying to kill your daughter, Mr. Smoak?

[Racj82]

With the way they've massively underused Thea this season and haven't even begun to integrate her into the team by talking to Felicity/Oliver/Diggle, I think she's safe. Thea has been severely sidelined this season IMO and still has a lot of potential considering none of her storylines have been tied neatly... Plus now that she's in a coma and fighting for her life again, I think it would be pretty underwhelming to see her die.

I'm not really sure how she has been underutilized. She has had her own storyline and arc this whole season. Everyone else has not named Felicity or Oliver has gotten far less focus this season than her. We've seen her dealing with her rage, trying to stop the blood lust, potentially dating a new guy, dealing with possible death. Far from underutilized, imo.

[looptab]

I don't think it was a board meeting? I thought it was a presentation of the power cell to the press, not different from when Ray held his new logo presentation last year. Felicity said she was going to be the face of the new launch or something. So I guess her father could have gained access way easily than for a board meeting, and Oliver, well, he is the CEO's fiance.

 

 

If Cisco on the Flash can now hack and create tech for the heroes(along with everything else he does) can Arrow let Felicity start creating her own things instead of having to reverse engineer things from villains, depend on something Ray created that she suddenly rememberd or something Curtis built? Why is she the only character limited to the skills she had in season 2 (and even some of those have been taken away and given to others).

 

Because the guys at GATV lament that Felicity's skill are unrealistic. That's why.

 

I thought it was an okay episode, but, were some parts lame. They only had Shado in the flasbacks because they know they royally suck. And, I guess, since neither the script nor the actors can sell it, to tell us that Oliver+Poppy=LOVE. Which, I had to LOL at Shado's reasoning: "She has been your nurse, of course you love her!" They do have a strange definition of love. And was that revelation scene in the cell painfully bad. Plus I roll my eyes every time I hear the word "darkness" (and where are they going with that?IDK). /end fb complaints/

 

Roy, welcome back. I missed you and your flips, and that last scene with Thea made me tear up. Come back soon.

 

When Oliver shook Malcolm's hand I thought there was something more there. Like, I thought Oliver was going to turn on him and use him somehow for this DD/Bloodlust thing. Some kind of surprise twist.  But no, it was a real moment. Oliver is just dumb.

 

Beth Schwartz LOVES the "It's my life, it's my choice" line. If you had any doubts.

 

Loved Nyssa's escape, Nyssa+Katana, even if I agree with everyone else that it didn't belong in this episode, and why the hell doesn't Nyssa kill Malcolm herself? Still, Katrina Law has amazing hair. And so does Celina Jade.

 

Felicity was a precious little cupcake, that exchange with Oliver about being proud that he understood her was lovely, as were the scenes with Curtis. If I have to nitpick, though, she was distracting as hell going back and forth during the presentation. And YAY, the Calculator is her father, and not her collge professor, haha.

 

I took the mention to CC as just a reference to the crossover, not that he has been going there.

 

 

 

Number of times Laurel didn't exactly fail as a vigilante or a human but just proved to be generally useless, three: 1, standing back and watching as Team Arrow removed the contact lens from Roy's eye, like, that was helpful, Laurel, 2. standing back and watching as a wound opened on Thea's chest, like, that was helpful, Laurel, 3, opening the hallway door and shouting, "It's Thea!" when Thea collapsed again, like, again, helpful, Laurel, although to be fair maybe those few seconds were just the time that Iris needed to pack up her bags and leave that hospital room.

 

Sigh.

That's not fair, she shoved the stuff on the gurney (?) off the way! She helped!

Edited February 4, 2016 by looptab

[Guest]

Sorry, second chance implies she died since everyone else who got a second chance died. And it's been a few episodes. There is nothing to my knowledge stating she can't be cured. But, I also one of the complaint lobbied at this show all the time is that nothing sticks. People die, come back, etc. It's probably time they continue to let these things stick. She's in a wheelchair. It's not the end of her world. She just needs to readjust. I don't want this for her but I don't need it reversed either. This world should have more long standing consequences. Even for the least deserving ones.

 

I see your point, I just don't think this should be the thing that sticks. The one person on the show/team who doesn't wear a mask gets stuck with long lasting consequences. Nope. Not really what I want to see tbh. It probably will stick this time though so I guess some people will get what they want from this storyline. Not me though.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Guest

[Xenith22]

Shado's fake return

Was it just me or when hallucination Shado said she was not Shado...did you expect Oliver to say of course you are not, you are Mei, Shado's twin sister.  I mean that's honestly where I thought that was going.  I mean Mei conceivably could have received the same archery training from her father that Shado did, and she could have been sent/coerced by Waller into going...

 

2. Shado's fake return did manage to make the flashbacks more interesting, but at a price: I never exactly bought Oliver/Shado as an epic romantic pairing, but they made a much more convincing couple than, alas, Oliver and Poppy tonight, even as the show tried to tell me that flashback Oliver has now fallen in love with Poppy.

Love is way strong of a word to me.  At this point Oliver hasn't been with an woman romantically/sexually for like 2-3 years.  So I can see him being somewhat attracted to her personality/looks where he might want to see if there was anything there.  Again keeping in mind the time he has been without intimacy, and the fact that at this point he is being tortured and probably starved, etc he is confusing those attraction feeling for love which is why his hallucination said the L word.

 

Loved the banter between Felicity and Calculator, actually wish there had been more of it. And nice reveal at the end that he's her dad. Does that mean he knows he was battling his daughter online or did he just check in to see her because he was in town?

I'm going with option A.  I mean he just tried to kill everyone in Star City...aka the city where his daughter lives.   If he really cared for her at all that he was interested in visiting her, would he really have tried to murder her first?   Does not compute...

 

I expect Oliver to be there when Felicity is giving her big speech because she goes to all his big speeches.

Oliver is the fiance of the companies president....also I've lost track of the business plots but did he not still have some shares of the company?   I'm assuming either Calculator was a board member, or else he created a fake ID to get in or maybe went further and actually stole some stock to become one?

 

----

 

On a different note with Calculator apparently being a recurring character we may have another strong suspect for the mystery "him" killer.  Since it was indeed Felicity who first urges Oliver to kill "him" I'm putting Calculator right at the top of the suspect pool next to Andy.  Plus with her father being the killer it makes sense that Oliver would ask Felicity if she is okay before vice versa.

 

Meanwhile I'm dropping Malcolm down to the very bottom of my suspect list next to Alex.  I mean with the Oliver trying to kill Malcolm plot next week and the ensuing LoS battle involved it seems like too much of a rehash too soon for Felicity to be telling Oliver to kill Malcolm at the funeral.

 

Sadly nothing changed in this ep to convince me that Diggle is not still the most likely doomed character, as that's still unfortunately where all the "evidence" points the strongest to me.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Xenith22

[Chaser]

Oliver looked like he was about to cry at Felicity's presentation. Felicity's lucky that the power cell was ready to go when the board pushed up the presentation. Wish we had heard something about it previously. I'm curious if it's going to make a reappearance down the line.

 

Anyone else find it weird that Roy didn't try to help Thea when she was going to fall off the building? I know he was being watched, but still.

 

I may not be a fan of Overwatch but I did enjoy them indulging her new codeword. It was sweet.

 

Still sad that Tatsu and Shado were wasted. I swear they were just used for the sizzle reel. 

 

It annoys me that they wiped Roy from Calculators files and acted like that was all that was needed. They established this guy is wicked smart and he tried to wipe out the city. I would think they would at least make comment about needing to track him down. 

[bijoux]

This is my biggest question: why didn't Dad recognize Oliver when he was sitting next to him? Oliver first caught Roy in his street clothes. (And, man, was I pumped during that scene.) While Roy still had the contact with the camera in. Meaning, the Calculator definitely saw Oliver.

 

I'm just so impressed with Roy and Thea. They're still kids basically, but they are honestly just so good at loving each other. See, this is a couple I would believe could be with other people in 10 years time and happy and content with their lives, but would still see each other as the love of their life. I loved Roy for being there for Thea while giving her all the space she needed last season and she was now excellent as well. And Roy was such a nice breath of fresh air in this episode. Particularly this:

 

How I have missed Roy Harper, who performs unnecessary flips and warns mercenaries to exit soon to be blown up buildings.

 

Such a Roy thing to do. Cutie.

 

Who's there left to say, "My life, my choice"? Can they just get shirts printed and be over with it? Although, I did enjoy one mention of it, and that was Malcolm Freaking Merlyn! I laughed so hard when he started going about it being Thea's life and choice, which he respected! Just like last season! Mallcolm Merlyn, father of the year.

 

I don't mind that Nyssa wants Malcolm dead, I'm just puzzled that the woman who took issue with Oliver killing her father instead of letting her do it wouldn't want to go after Malcolm herself. Unless it's a ploy to distract him with Oliver and then deliver the final blow? I have to say I like how respectful she was with Tatsu. That was a really nice touch in a fly-by scene.

 

Hot Wheels would actually have worked for Felicity. She's really proficient at handling the chair. Although I do wish she ran over the bastard who practically blamed her for being shot and incapacitated. I don't like you, sir, and hope you are one of the victims of the annual May attack on the city. Bastard.

 

I know some have problems with Curtis being perfect, but I don't because he shows real affection, respect and concern for Felicity. Echo makes him come across as genuine. I had no problems with him getting a few punches in, since Roy was trying to avoid hurting him. 

 

Can’t Oliver expose Ruva as Dhark’s wife to the public?

 

To freak Dig out a bit, Oliver Queen doesn't know she's his wife, the Green Arrow does.

[bijoux]

I thought it was random. Who jumps to that? Turns out it's a wink to the comics. Roy Harper was replaced by a clone at one point. 

 

I didn't mind it at all. Her brought back from the dead re-souled sister is off time travelling. Which is just one of the many examples of the screwey world they live in. Somebody able to look like Roy is actually pretty tame in comparison.

 

Was it just me or when hallucination Shado said she was not Shado...did you expect Oliver to say of course you are not, you are Mei, Shado's twin sister.  I mean that's honestly where I thought that was going.  I mean Mei conceivably could have received the same archery training from her father that Shado did, and she could have been sent/coerced by Waller into going...

 

Oliver actually thought she was Mei at first. The only reaction I had at "your love" thing was to think, wow, Shado. Oliver gave the hallucination you shampoo commercial hair and this is all you've got for him? Not a fair trade.

[Xenith22]

To freak Dig out a bit, Oliver Queen doesn't know she's his wife, the Green Arrow does.

Okay...but then honestly could the Green Arrow not expose her?   I mean he's still enjoying hero status in the city is he not?  Could he not go to the police or otherwise have felicity hack his message across?   Ruva is a public figure now, it's not like the Green Arrow would not have seen her where it should endanger Oliver's identity to expose hers?  I mean really the Green Arrow saying this woman is evil without proof would probably be a better received message than an opposing political candidate saying it.

[La Dee Da]

I found the flashbacks quite enjoyable - it's so rare that the show works in so much comedy! I laughed a lot. Oliver having to hallucinate to manufacture feelings ... Hahahahaaaaaa. My only question is whether the magic pet rock resurfaces at the end of the season as a weapon against Darhk, once Oliver sets aside/ goes through his "darkness " (whatever that means, Shado) and Felicity forgives him.

The rest of the episode was solid, but Malcolm as Oliver's evil father figure is so weird - I'm betting he's letting Thea decide her fate in order to lure Nyssa in and get the lotus thingy for himself. Which would be pretty close to last season's plot line. I agree Malcolm is the "him" from the flash forward.

The calculator was a great villain - I didn't miss DD too much - next episode will be great as Felicity shifts through dealing with a long-lost father to realizing he's a nemesis. And Madame Darhk in the mayoral race will be fun.

[Chaser]

I just realized that it was Speedy calling Felicity Overwatch. I thought it was Oliver. That was nice.

 

I didn't mind it at all. Her brought back from the dead re-souled sister is off time travelling. Which is just one of the many examples of the screwey world they live in. Somebody able to look like Roy is actually pretty tame in comparison.

I didn't mind it. I just said it was random. He is acting weird therefore it's not him just someone wearing his face? That is quite a leap. But as it turns out there was no reasoning needed because they just wanted a nod to the comics. Actually, Laurel getting the line makes perfect sense.

[wonderwall]

I didn't mind it. I just said it was random. He is acting weird therefore it's not him just someone wearing his face? That is quite a leap. But as it turns out there was no reasoning needed because they just wanted a nod to the comics. Actually, Laurel getting the line makes perfect sense.

 

Hee :p Laurel is the embodiment of BC (because comics)

Edited February 4, 2016 by wonderwall

[Guest]

As Oliver was hallucinating Shado, where did he find that dumb rock?

 

About halfway through typing that I realized that I don't care. Haha.

[kismet]

Last season, Nyssa was furious at Oliver for killing her father before she could do it herself. Now she's forcing him to do her dirty work? Lame. This is such an obvious case of plotting that serves the story instead of the characters. And what exactly did she say to Tatsu to convince her to hand over the super-secret magic flower? "I will use it to hold the life of Oliver Queen's sister hostage in order to force him to kill my enemy for me?" This is the kind of plot development that only serves to make things unnecessarily harder for everyone, but does not actually make any earthly sense.

 

I love that they got the accessibility issue in the lair figured out, but watching Felicity manoeuver down that ramp made me wonder about the design of the place in general. Why have the computer station raised like that? Why the railing around it? Why the one ramp? History shows that sometimes, when the bad guys find the Arrowlair, you have to be able to GTFO in a hurry. And since Felicity spends the most time there while the others are in the field, I have to wonder how effective that whole design would be if she ever needed to travel between her workstation and the exit in an emergency. I mean, she can't exactly just hop the guardrail and sprint for the door like everyone else. Aiming for that one narrow ramp and steering down it is a cumbersome process. Even taking down the railing (which does zero for safety anyway) so that she could roll off and drop to ground level in a life-or-death situation would be an improvement. I know it's THEIR lair, but that whole area of it is really Felicity's workstation, designed for her ease of use, so maybe it's time for a more practical re-design than just adding one little ramp.

 

Thank you for putting thought into her workspace & accessibility. But it will all be unnecessary in a few episodes when she will magically walk again and the writers are done writing their little wheelchair homage/comic stolen plotline this season. PS - Totally agree with you about Nyssa.

LOL seriously though. Okay? My point was everyone gets magically healed apart from Felicity. Magic tea, magic lotus flower...and none for Felicity Smoak!

Patience you must have....my young padawan. For all be revealed in due time. Magical cure is only a few ep away.

[kismet]

I thought it was random. Who jumps to that? Turns out it's a wink to the comics. Roy Harper was replaced by a clone at one point. 

In LL's defense, at the current rate of crazy dead people returning from everywhere, her idea did not seem that crazy. If she had said that in s1 or 2, I would have criticized her. But after this season & the Ghosts with their scrambled DNA, Andy and Sara- I think a Roy clone is not that far from possible. Plus there are look-alikes & twins coming out of the woodwork too.

[looptab]

Line of the night must be:

"I'm asking this just to ask. Are you sure it's Roy?"

In other words, Diggle needed to say something, but there wasn't anything useful for him to say. Lol

[Lady Calypso]

This is my biggest question: why didn't Dad recognize Oliver when he was sitting next to him? Oliver first caught Roy in his street clothes. (And, man, was I pumped during that scene.) While Roy still had the contact with the camera in. Meaning, the Calculator definitely saw Oliver.

 

I know some have problems with Curtis being perfect, but I don't because he shows real affection, respect and concern for Felicity. Echo makes him come across as genuine. I had no problems with him getting a few punches in, since Roy was trying to avoid hurting him. 

 

 

Well, here's another question for you: who said Calculator didn't recognize Oliver? 100% he did; there's a reason why the episode had Oliver running after Roy in street clothes. There's a reason why he obviously sat down beside Oliver during the presentation. At this point, he probably knows all he needs to about Oliver Queen and the Green Arrow. 

 

As for Curtis, I don't think he's perfect, per say. To be fair, we have only seen Curtis either at Palmer Tech, or at Oliver's holiday party. We don't know a whole lot about him, besides that he's quirky and is good at making things. Oh, and he's married. Sure, he can throw a few punches but with Roy parkouring his moves, it looks fairly easy to do. We just haven't had enough time to see Curtis' flaws. I like to think of Curtis like the male Felicity. He's cute, he's quirky, he's very good at what he does and he can stand up for himself. We didn't know that much about Felicity when we first met her. But over time, the show gave her more room to breathe and grow as a person. We didn't see her flaws right away either. It's why I have no problem with him building the tech for Felicity.

 

I have problems with Cisco's ability to do everything technical (although he can't even make a good security system!) but what I love about Felicity and Curtis is that they are both good in their own departments. Felicity excels at computer-based things, like hacking and creating online systems and viruses. Curtis is good at the engineering of machines and technologies, like Ray. It doesn't mean that Felicity is incompetent for not building these things. I expect her to help create the idea, at the very least. Her and Curtis' skills need to be brought together, after all. They'd make an awesome super team. But their skills are entirely different. Just because someone is good at working technology, doesn't mean they'll be able to build new tech. Of course, if the show ever changes this, I will be thoroughly pissed. But for now, they haven't underminded Felicity or Curtis, so I'm happy. 

 

But it's why I don't expect Curtis to be able to hack into the Pentagon. I don't know; maybe it's because Curtis is so damn adorable and so supportive of Felicity that I can't help but love him. 

[Guest]

Patience you must have....my young padawan. For all be revealed in due time. Magical cure is only a few ep away.

 

Yeaaaaaah. Not convinced. I'd love to be wrong though.

[EmilyBettFan]

I still think it's Laurel "Backbone" Lance in the grave. She's so irrelevant. Exhibit 793: When talking to Roy about how everything is his (Oliver's) fault all the time, Oliver told Roy that Felicity and Diggle also got onto him about feeling responsible for every bad thing that happens. It seems like Oliver completely FORGOT that #TeamBackbone* said those exact words to him last week when they were training, um practicing boxing moves she's NEVER used in the field.

Furthermore, LL just co-opts other TA members' roles. Sure, Felicity is a freaking genius, so it totally makes sense for Laurel to make suggestions related to Felicity's domain. Everyone will get a chance to tell Laurel how to lawyer, right? She adds nothing to the team or the show.

*Incorrect use of hashtags a la Poppy is my preferred way to convey #UtterContempt.

She is telling everyone how to do their job. It's like be quiet lol. She told the police just last week that they weren't doing their jobs. What is her problem?

[bijoux]

Well, here's another question for you: who said Calculator didn't recognize Oliver? 100% he did; there's a reason why the episode had Oliver running after Roy in street clothes. There's a reason why he obviously sat down beside Oliver during the presentation. At this point, he probably knows all he needs to about Oliver Queen and the Green Arrow. 

 

I want this to be true and am almost hoping for it to be true, but this show is wonky like that. Though they might go for it and the final blow to Felicity will be finding out that her dad didn't even come for her after a twenty year absence, he came for Oliver.

[lemotomato]

I know we've debated endlessly about whether or not the actors' off screen relationships affect their on screen chemistry, but I thought tonight's episode really made the case for "yes, it does." Oliver looked like he was going to burst with pride and affection during all the scenes with Roy, and he visibly softened in the scenes with Shado. It seemed to me that SA was really happy to work with Colton Haynes and Celina Jade again, and it bled into his performance.

 

In contrast, even after we had to be told that Oliver "loved" Poppy, I still saw nothing in their interactions that indicated he felt anything for her but guilt that he killed her brother. Oliver had more chemistry with Shado's magic rock than he does with Poppy. The flashbacks are such a massive waste of time.

 

As for present day storylines, I loved the battle between Felicity and the Calculator. I didn't watch the Flash episode where she went up against Queen Bee, so I was really happy to see her go toe-to-toe with a nemesis, with bonus clever banter! And of course he turned out to be her dad. Donna wasn't kidding when she said Felicity took after her father. Tom Amandes did a great job and I really hope we get to see a lot of him next week.

 

Welcome back, Oliver solo stunts! How I have missed you, parkour and balancing on moving trucks sequences!

 

And finally, I'm at the point where I want to throw a temper tantrum whenever Nanda Parbat and the LoA show up. Full on, all out, throwing things at the TV while screaming "No! No! No! Do not want!" That's how much I hate them. As bad as the flashbacks have been, I've accepted that they're inevitable as part of the show's structure. The LoA storylines, however, are constant reminders of the awfulness of season 3 and have no place in season 4 when there are already a million things going on in Star City. There's no point in them, just like there's no point in keeping MM around, and yet they keep. coming. back. I'd like to find out who at DC gave Arrow the go-ahead to use Ra's and the LoA and kick him where it hurts.

[wonderwall]

I know for sure that if it wasn't for Stephen/Emily I wouldn't love Olicity as much as I do... I mean LOOK at that sweet kiss, that cute wave and wink :')

 

[kismet]

I know for sure that if it wasn't for Stephen/Emily I wouldn't love Olicity as much as I do... I mean LOOK at that sweet kiss, that cute wave and wink :')

Thanks for posting the wink... I missed the wink in the live broadcast ;) I just love the wink. :) Why must they force drama on such an adorable and functional part of the show?

[bijoux]

Thanks for posting the wink... I missed the wink in the live broadcast ;) I just love the wink. :) Why must they force drama on such an adorable and functional part of the show?

 

Because we'd e bored otherwise, don't you know? No worries, the writers know you better than you know yourself, they're looking out for you.

[Starfish35]

I'm really too tired to say more right now but...

- I'm glad Katana lived.

- I get why the show presented Nyssa and Tatsu as being evenly matched, but I don't believe it. I guess I've just seen Nyssa beat too often.

- I'm glad Calculator really is Felicity's dad.

- I was so glad to see Roy again - I've missed him. And Thea/Roy forever(Alex who?)

- I enjoyed seeing Curtis again.

- I am starting to outright loathe the flashbacks.

- It's completely absurd that the show is suddenly trying to convince me that Oliver is in love with Tatiana.

- I would be delighted to see Nyssa again, if she didn't bring another absurd LoA plotline with her. Just kill Malcolm yourself, Nyssa. I'll cheer for you.

[Happy Harpy]

My baaaaabies!

 

They killed me. My lovely, adorable, sweet Roy and Thea. They just killed me.

 

*off to read the thread*

[bijoux]

The little OTA scene is wicked cute, really. Oliver knew he was making a misstep even as he asked Felicity if she had any luck, he just couldn't help himself. And then the side-eye between him and Dig after she blew up. Awesome.

[millennium]

I guess Roy survived that scrape in the Puzzles and Dragons commercial.

 

A better episode than usual, everybody in just the right doses.   

 

I would watch a show about Nyssa and Tatsu.

[Happy Harpy]

 Which, I had to LOL at Shado's reasoning: "She has been your nurse, of course you love her!" They do have a strange definition of love.

Well, after all, that's how Slade fell in love with Shado, IIRC. One scene of nursing his burns/wounds and bam! She was the lurve of his life he went psycho for.

Yeah, continuity?

(Should I LOL or shake my head? I'm conflicted here.)

 

I love Felicity Smoak and I will never be tired of saying it. I'm usually disappointed when a plotline is hyped beforehand, but not in this case. Tom Amandes was great and I can't wait until his character faces Donna -claws out, girl! The father/daughter beyond the screen confrontation was just fabulous.

I agree that he could be a good Big Bad, but I kind of hope that they'll use this opportunity to make him the real anti-villain or even anti-hero they tried (and failed, imo, because he had gone too far already) to create with Malcolm. My Father is the Big Bad is already taken by Thea.

 

One short OTA scene? Aren't we spoiled. Yep, this is sarcasm.

 

I have lost track of spoilers and episode numbers but I knew it was my baby Roy as soon as I saw the parkour move. I love my Parkour Boy.

I'm still not over Roy/Thea.  If Roy dies to save her I will sue the writers for emotional cruelty.

 

Kudos to John Barrowman. He managed to keep a straight face while he had to make Malcolm talk about the importance of Thea's choices. I couldn't keep a straight face watching those scenes.

I don't know which, of Malcolm's "Her Choice" speech, or Instant Poppy Love, wins the WTF of the week.

 

I love Katrina Law, and Katana looks cool, but count me in for the NP/LOA allergy. The first thing I thought was: "Great, because the flashbacks are not enough."

 

Curtis is the wasted guest of the season, isn't he? He works wonderfully with Felicity, even though I do agree there isn't much place for him on the canvas so far (although I know who could go and make space). His confrontation with Roy was hilarious and I actually enjoyed the stunt work.

 

Also, there's a blond piece of furniture just standing there for the sake of it way too often, and I'm quite certain that it goes against the Feng Shui rules. Maybe the writers could try to remove it and see what it does for the general energy of the lair/fight scenes. I'm just saying.

Edited February 4, 2016 by Happy Harpy

[SleepDeprived]

I've seen the episode twice (one each of the ET and PT airings because--if the NSA or the FBI or the Nielsen company or whoever tracks these things are reading this--I always try to right my not-exactly-legal ways with the right ways to watch tv, sirs/ma'ams) and I still did not catch Shado telling Oliver about his sekrit burning desire (or, love. Whatever.) that he's feeling for Poppy. I wouldn't even know about it if it weren't discussed/beautifully mocked on these boards. So weird. Then again, the flashbacks are USELESS to me. So, gdi! Just end these, Show! Do whatever it takes.

 

Forgot to add - I'm so happy for Star(ling) City's Door and Window guy. I'm pretty sure he just bought a 2nd vacation home and a new yacht.

 

I know. I'm so happy for him. You're the true hero and role model everyone should aspire to be, Star(ling) City Doors and Windows dude! It just goes to show that hard work, fortitude, and living on an actual hellmouth that attracts all sorts of villains and vigilantes can only lead to great things for you in this apocalyptic happenings-prone world.

 

Anyone else find it weird that Roy didn't try to help Thea when she was going to fall off the building? I know he was being watched, but still.

 

I have a lot of affection for Roy right now so I'mma try to defend him. When Thea knocked him over the railing, it looked like he was scrambling to right his balance on the ledge. It didn't look like his position was stable enough that he could've grabbed onto Thea's arm and not fallen off the ledge with her, as well. That being said, it was weird that he didn't try to do something anyway, considering he knows that's Thea and, if Oliver didn't get there in time, he would've watched the love of his life fall to her death.

 

I just realized that it was Speedy calling Felicity Overwatch. I thought it was Oliver. That was nice.

 

Yeah, that scene was super cute. And Thea's little snort of amusement after she called Felicity by her codename was totally adorable, too.

Edited February 4, 2016 by SleepDeprived

[Happy Harpy]

That being said, it was weird that he didn't try to do something anyway, considering he knows that's Thea and, if Oliver didn't get there in time, he would've watched the love of his life fall to her death.

I 100% expected him to catch her and his identity to be discovered because of it. Actually, I was looking forward to it from the moment she fell.

So if your explanation isn't the right one, I'm thinking 1) plot convenience (too early in the episode) or 2) another forgotten detail, like S3 electrocuted Roy.

[bijoux]

Did Roy say he was in Up City when the Calculator found him? I can't find it on the list of DC Comics towns and cities.

 

Wherever he goes next, I hope he drops by Barry on his way. They should start a club. Dudes wearing red who Oliver enjoys shooting up with arrows. They're both tied at two right now. I wonder who takes the lead.

Edited February 4, 2016 by bijoux

[kes0704]

I'm wondering, can I really say I watched an episode of Arrow if I fast forwarded through large portions of it? I knew it was not going to be a contender for favourite episode of S4 when the opening scene was in Nanda Parbat. I loathe LOA storylines even more than I do the flashbacks.

The best parts of the episode were The Calculator and his reveal as Felicity's father (not that it was particularly surprising) and the return of Roy. It's such a pity they had to remove him from the narrative to make way for others. He fits into the team so seamlessly and it gives Oliver someone to mentor rather than having to play a game of everyone is equal all of the time.

I'm going to withhold judgement on the Central City name drop. But, if it turns out that Oliver has been secretly skipping town to see BM/kid leaving Felicity to deal with life in a wheelchair on her own then, for me, the lie becomes completely unforgivable. Plus it makes both Oliver and BM total morons to continue on with visits following such as brutal attack on Oliver and Felicity.

Last weeks episode was so enjoyable and this one..not so much. It's so frustrating that the only thing that maintains any level of storytelling consistency is the flashbacks, and that's only because they continue to be pointless week in and week out.

[bijoux]

I'm going to withhold judgement on the Central City name drop. But, if it turns out that Oliver has been secretly skipping town to see BM/kid leaving Felicity to deal with life in a wheelchair on her own then, for me, the lie becomes completely unforgivable. Plus it makes both Oliver and BM total morons to continue on with visits following such as brutal attack on Oliver and Felicity.

 

This is actually the first time I've thought of this, but there is a pretty big red flag for Oliver actually visiting the kid - Darhk's one month detante, during which he advised GA to be with his family or some such. And Oliver, plagued by his mid-season bout of stupid, takes him up on it. Even while the offer was extended to GA, and Darhk has Oliver followed, thus putting a target on the kid. Ta-da!

 

Man, if this happens, I really hope someone expresses concern for this child, because neither of his parents would be demonstrating admirable deductive skills. It plays nicely into Samantha sucks though.

[cambridgeguy]

 

And Oliver, plagued by his mid-season bout of stupid, takes him up on it. Even while the offer was extended to GA, and Darhk has Oliver followed, thus putting a target on the kid. Ta-da!

Forget Darhk, the Calculator has probably done some digging into his future son in law's activities. 

 

Speaking of that guy, people saw him involved with that kidnapping a few episodes back.  Is Mrs. Darhk going to pretend to be single or married to someone else?  Star City has many, many issues but I don't think they'd vote for someone married to a known criminal.

[stormymac]

Did Roy say he was in Up City when the Calculator found him? I can't find it on the list of DC Comics towns and cities.

 

Wherever he goes next, I hope he drops by Barry on his way. They should start a club. Dudes wearing red who Oliver enjoys shooting up with arrows. They're both tied at two right now. I wonder who takes the lead.

He said Hub City.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ha, I imagined all the Roy/Oliver slashfic people squeeing when Oliver told Roy to take his shirt off.

 

Let me get this straight - Malcolm, who made Thea kill Sara and then sent someone to attack Thea to force her to kill someone to satiate her Lazarus pit blood lust, is now the one preaching to Oliver about how they have to let Thea make her own decisions? Ooooookay, Malcolm.

 

I love whenever Ray parkours all over the place because then I get to yell, "PARKOUR!" like on The Office:

[theacostov]

After last week this episode was a let down. There was just a lack of urgency or something. There were way too many plots. Last week we had Diggle flashbacks which connected to Diggle's present day story and then Felicity's struggles. That was all. This week we've got the Calculator VOW/Roys return, Felicity at PT, Nanda Parbat stuff, awful sleep inducing flashbacks, Thea's bloodlust/apparent imminent death. Way too much and yet it all felt a bit meh.

Also I couldn't really enjoy any Olicity after the central city mention. I was in denial that they hadn't mentioned it and after almost being killed he wouldn't go and see his kid because that would be the smart thing to do. But nope! Also the flippant way he mentioned it pissed me off.

He apparently is in love with the European woman even though there's been no sign of it and he actually told her the truth and is still lying to Felicity. Great contrast guys. I'm annoyed.

I could take or leave Roy but his scene with Thea was lovely. Are they seriously trying to sell this Alex crap?

I liked the calculator. Looking forward to how that plays out. Yeah just a meh episode for me.

[AyChihuahua]

 

I took the mention to CC as just a reference to the crossover, not that he has been going there.

Two things: The crossover was like two trips, which is not back and forth. And, it was two months ago. He wouldn't say he hasn't noticed Thea's recent, as in the last few weeks, problems because of something that was over and done with two months ago. That was absolutely setup that he's been visiting the kid. And presumably lying about it.

[bijoux]

He does bring up not even noticing Thea suffering from acute bloodlustiness two months ago, but I doubt the writers will be so kind not to have him been visiting CC since the crossover.

[greekmom]

Why is it that everyone expects Oliver to kill the Ra? Malcom had wanted Oliver to kill Ra and now Nyssa wants Oliver to kill Ra-Malcom.  For gawd's sake the gal wants to be Ra? She should do her own killing.

 

As well, pissed off at the fact that no one wants to help Felicity in regards to regaining her ability to walk. 

[Velocity23]

After ghost Shado saying Island Oliver loves poppy seed flashback girl things became so clear to me. And why Oliver thought he loved Laurel.

PURE GUILT!

[looptab]

Two things: The crossover was like two trips, which is not back and forth. And, it was two months ago. He wouldn't say he hasn't noticed Thea's recent, as in the last few weeks, problems because of something that was over and done with two months ago. That was absolutely setup that he's been visiting the kid. And presumably lying about it.

Except I don't seem to recall Thea recently struggling with bloodlust? At least she wasn't in the last two episodes. So I'll stick with the crossover reference until proven otherwise :)

[AyChihuahua]

Except I don't seem to recall Thea recently struggling with bloodlust? At least she wasn't in the last two episodes. So I'll stick with the crossover reference until proven otherwise :)

She was struggling with the bloodlust against Anarky in 4.10.

[looptab]

Was she? I thought that was more of a psychological reaction to have the living proof of the effects of the bloodlust right in front of her. But I could be remembering it wrong.

[Happy Harpy]

Speaking of that guy, people saw him involved with that kidnapping a few episodes back.  Is Mrs. Darhk going to pretend to be single or married to someone else?  Star City has many, many issues but I don't think they'd vote for someone married to a known criminal.

In a normal universe, there'd be no way you could be wrong on this. But they were ready to vote for a known criminal (Moira) two seasons ago, so I actually have no idea which way the wind is going to blow on this one.