S01.E06: Hand of Five Poisons

[formerlyfreedom]

In the Season 1 finale, Sunny and M.K. fight to escape Quinn's grip once and for all. Meanwhile, the Baron's enemies conspire to take him down and change the Badlands forever.

 

 

[paigow]

This is like Julius Caesar...Conspirators kill the leader...Will they turn against each other later??? Guess that is S2... 

[SimoneS]

So Sunny is from Asra, also. Could it be that Sunny, like the Widow, used to be like M.K.? I highly doubt that Tilda will kill the Widow. Why didn't Sunny just ask the monks why they wanted M.K.  before fighting them? I cannot believe that Quinn took M.K. to the town to help him fight. How could he be sure that M.K. would not kill him since he is the one who stabbed him? This show is so wacky. I don't even understand that plot point. Is Quinn is really dead? I wonder if this will get another season. It has the potential to improve.

 

I watched the extended version of The Fellowship of the Ring earlier today and thought the actor who played the elf, Celeborn looked familiar. It was only as I watched the extra scenes that I realized that it was the actor who played Quinn. 

Edited December 21, 2015 by SimoneS

[rogueprinzess]

I think it was interesting that the other "Dark Ones" hit certain points (seemingly Chi points" on MK to take him down. it's like it disabled his power. i wonder if perhaps that's what happened to Sunny; that his chi was somehow blocked as a child and that's why he can't go all super saiyan per se, but still has the advanced agility/fighting skills/etc. But...that doesn't explain why the Widow isn't a better fighter then. Mind you, maybe there's more than one kind of "special" with them. So does that mean that the hilltop/airbending temple that the other Dark Ones were at is Azra? How come they have a car? Why didn't they notice that Sunny's fighting ability was crazy good for a "normie"? How did Quinn know everything about everything in the end? Why didn't Sunny cut Quinn's head off? Man, this episode left me with SO many questions.

 

That last fight scene was boss though. One of the best I've seen in a long time.  

[Stardancer Supreme]

Quinn better be dead, at least for Veil's sake.   There has to be a Season 2!  We need to see Sunny trying to get back to Veil,  Ryder finding out that he's not about the Baron life, Lydia coming back to smack her son down for getting her put out, Jade running her long con at the Fort, etc...

 

Oh yeah! And MK going back to the factory to get refurbished. Heh.

Edited December 21, 2015 by Stardancer Supreme

[Shriekingeel]

Not worried about the Widow, they seem to have plans for her. Loved the Sunny-monks fight.

[Yolapukka]

I'm glad Quinn is most likely dead. Pompous, rambling, jack-ass, horn-dog psycho. It looks to me like Ryder will be the main adversary in the next chapter, which I see as both good and bad as I completely loathe the character, but I don't believe the actor has the gravity to carry off a villain unless said villain is intended to be a pouting nincompoop who can best defend himself by wetting his pants and hoping his adversaries slip in the puddle. However as far as that goes, this show is all broad strokes and action sequences, not subtle character moments. I think Martin Csokas is a reasonably competent actor but he gave us a continuous cheese buffet as Quinn. I have no worries about Sonny, the only question is whether he'll escape from the boat or his final destination. (I wonder if he's intended for some sort of fight to the death arena?) In his absence and with the consequent chaos following the death of Quinn,  I assume Veil will go into hiding. I believe Jacobee and his regent, Zypher are dead, but they might have survived to cause further trouble. Sonny seemed to suffer worse than they did, but he's wearing main character teflon and they were just dressed in dark plaid.

 

It appears that MK is going somewhere that could be of benefit to him, at least in controlling his abilities. It seems also that the Widow had access to similar powers and lost the ability as she learned to control it. Given that Sonny also has ties to Azra, does he have something similar inside of him that remains untapped?

Edited December 22, 2015 by yuggapukka

[AzureOwl]

I cannot believe that Quinn took M.K. to the town to help him fight. How could he be sure that M.K. would not kill him since he is the one who stabbed him?

I think that's why Quinn didn't even tried to participate in the fight. He knew the chances of getting clipped "by friendly fire" where high so he hid in the alley as soon as MK went all black eyes.

[Tarasme]

I think it was interesting that the other "Dark Ones" hit certain points (seemingly Chi points" on MK to take him down. it's like it disabled his power. i wonder if perhaps that's what happened to Sunny; that his chi was somehow blocked as a child and that's why he can't go all super saiyan per se, but still has the advanced agility/fighting skills/etc. But...that doesn't explain why the Widow isn't a better fighter then. Mind you, maybe there's more than one kind of "special" with them....

This is interesting- I didn't consider that Sunny's extraordinary power- everything over an above his kung fu parkour- could have been manually shut down. And that The Widow could have been similarly affected. I guess I didn't get beyond wondering if Sunny is a "light one" as opposed to a "dark one." Cause- "Sunny." It could be that his metaphysical state is affected by his moral state- maybe his "light one" (sheesh- if there even is such a thing) power is unable to function while he continues killing. But then, maybe "light one" power isn't all that useful? ::::shrugs::::

 

Quinn better be dead, at least for Veil's sake.   There has to be a Season 2!  We need to see Sunny trying to get back to Veil,  Ryder finding out that he's not about the Baron life, Lydia coming back to smack her son down for getting her put out, Jade running her long con at the Fort, etc...

 

Oh yeah! And MK going back to the factory to get refurbished. Heh.

As happy as I was to see Quinn get stabbded, I was as unhappy to have his lifeless body omitted from the scene of Veil's walk through town. If Veil's stuck having to provide more medical attention to that jackass, I'm gonna be Up.Set.

 

Is there a question about ItB renewal? I haven't heard one way or another.

 

Jade. Jade jade jade. If you're going to attempt to throw the switch to get all of your enemies removed in a single blow, you'd better damn well make sure they're all gone when you get out of bed. Especially when your best maneuver is to poison yourself. Sheesh.

[SimoneS]

Morning after, I highly doubt that Quinn is dead if this show returns. Most shows do not kill off characters. Veil will probably be treating Quinn in secret while he plots to regain his barony. 

Edited December 21, 2015 by SimoneS

[FlowerofCarnage]

If Quinn didnt die immediately given how crude the state of medical care is in the Badlands, I doubt he would survive a wound like that.

I am firmly Team Widow and what she is trying to do.

The three warriors gave me Three Storms from Big Trouble in Little China vibes. Lol

[NorthstarATL]

Really Veil? "I think it's wrong to teach girls to kill", followed by "The blue potion is a cure; the other two are poison; you decide" to Tilda. It seems that Veil's moral outrage was more about the fact that the girls were being taught to defend themselves physically, rather than the more acceptably feminine means of poisoning that she and Jade opt for.

  I REALLY would love a Quinn-less series! I dislike Ryder intensely, but if his plans turned out to be effective he'll develop the bloated ego that his father had, ande without the ridiculous accent.

   I'm hoping that MK's name has some payoff in the initials having something to do with who his parents are/were. If Sunny and Minerva are both from Azra, perhaps there's some genetic engineering going on there, and there are different skills? I doubt they'd all be Dark Phoenix-y.

[Stardancer Supreme]

I'll have to rewatch the finale. I feel that Ryder poisoned Jade to get his mother out of the Fort.  He's crafty, but he's not that smart.  If Tilda doesn't kill the Widow and Zephyr survives her run in with MK, I will enjoy watching them pull Ryder's strings.

[MrWhyt]

Is there a question about ItB renewal? I haven't heard one way or another.

AMC has renewed it, no info on how many episodes.

[rogueprinzess]

 

I guess I didn't get beyond wondering if Sunny is a "light one" as opposed to a "dark one." Cause- "Sunny." It could be that his metaphysical state is affected by his moral state- maybe his "light one" (sheesh- if there even is such a thing) power is unable to function while he continues killing. But then, maybe "light one" power isn't all that useful? ::::shrugs::::

 

I like the idea of a "light" vs "dark" ones from Azra. This could be a result of the genetic engineering, perhaps some come out "light" while others "dark" and the "dark" ones have started congregating because people (like Lydia's father and his cult) hunt them. Or maybe they're all 'dark" but some can be "switched off" if maybe they're too dangerous or don't comply with the "dark ones" rules. But I find it interesting that dark monks from the temple didn't seem to know about MK at all, sense him etc., so I also wonder if maybe MK's mom was one of them, but ran away before MK was born so he wouldn't end up like them? Bah, so many questions raised.

 

 

As happy as I was to see Quinn get stabbded, I was as unhappy to have his lifeless body omitted from the scene of Veil's walk through town. If Veil's stuck having to provide more medical attention to that jackass, I'm gonna be Up.Set.

 

I am not feeling great about the fact that Sunny stabbed Quinn in the abdomen. I mean, I understand that he wanted Quinn to suffer, but he could have slit his throat, just deep enough to bleed out but slowly and nearly impossible to fix. An ab wound can be fixed especially if it's a clean one straight through. But I'm praying that Sunny twisted that sword and nicked plenty of arteries/veins on the way in and out. I can't do another season with Quinn.

 

 

Really Veil? "I think it's wrong to teach girls to kill", followed by "The blue potion is a cure; the other two are poison; you decide" to Tilda. It seems that Veil's moral outrage was more about the fact that the girls were being taught to defend themselves physically, rather than the more acceptably feminine means of poisoning that she and Jade opt for.

 

I interpreted that scene a bit differently. I think Veil is just against killing period (a slave to her nature as Quinn put it). I think her naivete comes from her sheltered life. She grew up under the protection of being the Baron's doctor's child, so she's never been branded, never had to do manual labour, has education, etc. unlike the vast majority of her sistren. Then in her adulthood, she entered a relationship with a Regent, so again, more protection from would-be assailants. Also, Veil didn't exactly spend much time actually asking the Widow about her philosophies. I think to Veil, the Widow is like Quinn in that she "forces" others to kill for her and cares only about power. But I also think the show messed up with her dialogue/development in this episode a bit. I had a bigger issue with her giving Sunny attitude about not stopping the Baron from killing her parents. Yes, I get that Sunny should have been more forthcoming about being there when it happened, but if Veil thinks it through, she should have known that at that time, Sunny clipping Quinn wouldn't have guaranteed that she, her parents or Sunny would be safe. She also knows how loyal Sunny was to the Baron at that point. Anyhow, it just made her seem a bit hypocritical, but I'll chalk that up to pregnancy hormones. Speaking of which, I'm very happy the baby survived.

 

 

I feel that Ryder poisoned Jade to get his mother out of the Fort.

 

I'm pretty sure Jade poisoned herself. Ryder kind of confirmed as much when Lydia realized he told Jade about the Baron's second wife. Also, Jade kind of smiled to herself when Quinn threw Lydia out of the Fort, like she was satisfied with herself. But I do think she worked with Ryder to figure out where Lydia kept that secret box full of the poisonous plants. Jade moved too rashly IMO. Her biggest trump card was having the Baron in pocket, but now that he's *dead* all she has is Ryder and he isn't strong enough to keep the clipper force or cogs that are left in line. I'm pretty sure most will take off once they find out Quinn's gone.

[johntfs]

I love the way that Quinn established himself as smarter than Sunny when he chuckled his way through telling MK, "I don't think you're capable of doing what you're told."

[mjc570]

 

It looks to me like Ryder will be the main adversary in the next chapter, which I see as both good and bad as I completely loathe the character, but I don't believe the actor has having the gravity to carry off a villain unless said villain is intended to be a pouting nincompoop who can best defend himself by wetting his pants and hoping his adversaries slip in the puddle.

Ha ha, well said.  I admit, I very much like Quinn as a character, mainly because of his Abraham Lincolnesque whiskers. 

[paigow]

Is there enough material for an Acronym thread?  I can lead with RPP: Ryder Pee Pants. 

[Shriekingeel]

I won't miss Quinn if they choose to kill him off. Martin Czokas is a terrific actor--you can't take your eyes off him in The Debt--but he's too hammy here. And that odd half-Southern, half Eastern European accent is offputting.

[thuganomics85]

I wouldn't be against Quinn dying since I think he's more or less served his purpose, but the way it was shot makes it likely that they could end up reviving him somehow if they wanted too.  Since it looked like Veil was heading in the same area, I can easily seem them having her find him and save him for some odd reason. I'm wondering about Jacobee and Zypher though.  Are they dead?  Jacobee seem to get punched through a building while Zypher smacked into that brick wall pretty hard, but I guess anything is possible.

 

It certainly looked like Jade poisoned herself, in order for Lydia to take the fall.  So, now Lydia has been banished and has gone back to her dad/Lance Henriksen.

 

Waldo was on Team Widow!  Go Waldo!  And Widow!  Really curious about her background.  It sounded like she might have been "special" like M.K.?

 

The final fight scene was great and it was definitely a change of pace watching Sunny get his ass stomped.  These guys do not messed around.  I knew something was going to happen when I saw one of them was played by Cung Le.

 

So, if there is a season two, it looks like Sunny has been captured by River King, Tilda isn't sure if she should follow The Widow or not (really doubt she'll actually poison her), Lydia is part of this religious cult, Quinn is dying, Ryder is fleeing, Jade might have just become the one calling the shots, and M.K. is currently locked in a trunk and going off into the desert.  So much going on!

[rogueprinzess]

 

I wouldn't be against Quinn dying since I think he's more or less served his purpose,

 

THIS. That's my main reason for not wanting any more Quinn. MS did a good job with Quinn, despite his weird accent and over the top "evil eye" he had on pretty much permanently, his character's purpose was to make us hate him and feel uncomfortable around him and MS accomplished that. I think he would have been doing something wrong if we were all rooting for him to live. I agree that his death was intentionally shot to leave ambiguity about his survival, but I really, really hope the writers choose to let him die in season 2 (I'm just going to act as though the show is renewed, positive thinking...yeah). It makes for much more interesting fodder for the remaining characters if Quinn's dead (i.e. Jade, Ryder, Lydia). 

 

I'm still trying to decide where I'd like the second season to start off. Right after what happened in the finale? Or maybe a year later, with Sunny fighting his way out of whatever the River King sold him into trying to get back to Veil, Veil trying to raise their super-saiyan stabby-from-birth child while believing Sunny's dead, Baron Pee Pants failing miserably at running the territory, Lydia plotting revenge after taking her father out and leading the cult for herself and the Widow moving in on other Barons...

Edited December 22, 2015 by rogueprinzess

[Yolapukka]

I thought Quinn's death looked unambiguous but the next season could prove me wrong. Considering the context, that he was was already dying, I just see it as an end that was hastened but already inevitable. I don't see much to be accomplished by his survival unless they plan to retell the story they already told this past season.  I don't see him walking in to reclaim to his kingdom and lord it over all with the same attitude of strength and intimidation that carried him in the past and he's not going to be a rootable underdog. As has already been said, he's served his purpose.

[candall]

Veil finally managed to find a loophole so she could hold Sunny responsible for her parents' deaths.  Did she forget, during her will-I-or-won't-I speech, that she's not "allowed" to have Sunny's baby?  Did Sunny forget same when he passed on his Last Chance To Leave?  Not many good parents in this show.

 

Someone mentioned MK's darkness thing would diminish each time he used it, so maybe Sunny and The Widow exhausted their juju.  (Sunny's constantly hurling bodies through the air anyway--it wouldn't be that odd if he couldn't remember parts of every single dustup.  Heh.)

 

I agree that mewling Ryder is an inadequate replacement for the dissolute Baron, but I don't see coming back from that through & through.

 

It tickles me every time there's a scene with an old Chevy truck.  I keep forgetting they have those.

***************

 

I'm feeling discouraged by how thoroughly patriarchal this society is.  I thought we were off to a decent start with The Baron vs. The Widow.  But now I see The Widow, Zephyr and Prince Valiant Tilda are anomalies.

When your husband kicks you out and your only option is to go groveling home to your father, where you have to swear permanent fealty to him, I detect a lack of progress.

 

[johntfs]

Veil finally managed to find a loophole so she could hold Sunny responsible for her parents' deaths.  Did she forget, during her will-I-or-won't-I speech, that she's not "allowed" to have Sunny's baby?  Did Sunny forget same when he passed on his Last Chance To Leave?  Not many good parents in this show.

 

Someone mentioned MK's darkness thing would diminish each time he used it, so maybe Sunny and The Widow exhausted their juju.  (Sunny's constantly hurling bodies through the air anyway--it wouldn't be that odd if he couldn't remember parts of every single dustup.  Heh.)

 

I agree that mewling Ryder is an inadequate replacement for the dissolute Baron, but I don't see coming back from that through & through.

 

It tickles me every time there's a scene with an old Chevy truck.  I keep forgetting they have those.

***************

 

I'm feeling discouraged by how thoroughly patriarchal this society is.  I thought we were off to a decent start with The Baron vs. The Widow.  But now I see The Widow, Zephyr and Prince Valiant Tilda are anomalies.

When your husband kicks you out and your only option is to go groveling home to your father, where you have to swear permanent fealty to him, I detect a lack of progress.

 

I don't think it was a loophole so much as a real thing.  Sunny could have saved Veil's parents, at least temporarily.  He chose not to do so.  He chose to allow Quinn to take his sword and murder them.

 

It's not so much about patriarchy, though there's plenty of that present, it's about despotism.  The Barons hold all the power.  Sonny became Regent at the whim of Quinn and lost ot the same way.  Presumably if the Widow had remarried and had a husband (or two), those men would have had power and prestige at her whim as well.

 

I think the key difference between Veil and the Widow is that the Widow wants to change the gender of those at the top whereas Veil would prefer everyone to be relatively equal.

Edited December 25, 2015 by johntfs

[Iguessnot]

Maybe Sunny could have saved her parents,but that would have involved murdering the Baron, not exactly cannon fodder. Such a kill would have more consequences than a tattoo. Sunny who was trying to disguise aspects of his relationship with Veil took a big risk in not committing the murder himself. That could have been a treasonous act and Sonny could have been cut down right there. In any case I thought Veil's comment was a little naive given the world they live in.

 

Given how large their territory is, the situation of having only one doctor, now dead, and Veil playing a back alley doctor, takes me out of the show every time. 

[johntfs]

Maybe Sunny could have saved her parents,but that would have involved murdering the Baron, not exactly cannon fodder. Such a kill would have more consequences than a tattoo. Sunny who was trying to disguise aspects of his relationship with Veil took a big risk in not committing the murder himself. That could have been a treasonous act and Sonny could have been cut down right there. In any case I thought Veil's comment was a little naive given the world they live in.

 

Given how large their territory is, the situation of having only one doctor, now dead, and Veil playing a back alley doctor, takes me out of the show every time. 

 

Killing the Baron would have been risky, but doable.  He and Sunny were alone.  Hell, with the doctor's scans, Sunny could well have claimed that Quinn asked him to kill him to avoid the pain and weakness of his illness.  As Regent, Sunny probably could have claimed the Barony since the Clippers would be more likely to follow him, their commander over the Baron's wives or weakling son.

 

Sunny did not do that.  He also turned down Zephyr's suggestion to do it later and Zephyr was likely truthful when she said the other Barons would have supported/accepted it.  I think the truth is that Sunny could leave Quinn for Veil but could not truly bring himself to outright betray or kill him at that point.  Sunny loved Veil more than the Baron, but ultimately "loved" Quinn more than he loved Veil's parents.

 

The lack of doctors actually keeps me in the show.  Education on this show is a rare and precious thing.  Sunny is second in command to Quinn and he reads at perhaps the level of a six year old child as I recall - and that only because of Veil.  MK can't read at all.  Likely neither can most cogs or clippers.  Absent being some kind of doctor or other necessary profession (whoever renders poppies into opium or turns oil into gasoline) figure scientific education is almost unheard of in the territories.

[Iguessnot]

But a territory with the "bestest" fighting force ever, must have more medical backup than a couple of old folks who live in a shoe. At the least, all those colts in training need to be patched up constantly and there would have to be some level of medical knowledge passed on to the nursing corps.

 

I do agree that Quinn weighed heavier on the scales than Veil's parents. Sunny doesn't seem thirsty for this leadership, so the prospect of the parents' murder, wasn't going to push him to kill Quinn and take control. He was content just to leave.

[jhlipton]

Let me say right from the outset that The Widow is my favorite charactder by far and if she goes, so do I.
 

I believe Jacobee and his regent, Zypher are dead, but they might have survived to cause further trouble.

I'm wondering about Jacobee and Zypher though.  Are they dead?  Jacobee seem to get punched through a building while Zypher smacked into that brick wall pretty hard, but I guess anything is possible.

 

I hope they have survived. Getting punched through a building seems like it ain't no thang on this show, so I'd more surprised if they were dead.
 
 

Really Veil? "I think it's wrong to teach girls to kill", followed by "The blue potion is a cure; the other two are poison; you decide" to Tilda. It seems that Veil's moral outrage was more about the fact that the girls were being taught to defend themselves physically, rather than the more acceptably feminine means of poisoning that she and Jade opt for.

I interpreted that scene a bit differently. I think Veil is just against killing period (a slave to her nature as Quinn put it). I think her naivete comes from her sheltered life. She grew up under the protection of being the Baron's doctor's child, so she's never been branded, never had to do manual labour, has education, etc. unlike the vast majority of her sistren. Then in her adulthood, she entered a relationship with a Regent, so again, more protection from would-be assailants. Also, Veil didn't exactly spend much time actually asking the Widow about her philosophies. I think to Veil, the Widow is like Quinn in that she "forces" others to kill for her and cares only about power.

 

It seems totally incongruous no matter how you slice it. Frankly, when she made the snide comment about "girls who kill", The Widow should have asked just what the hell she thought would happen to her, to the "girls" or to her workers. And when she was handing out bread, they didn't seem all that surprised. I doubt she treats any of them as "cogs".
 

I'm feeling discouraged by how thoroughly patriarchal this society is.  I thought we were off to a decent start with The Baron vs. The Widow.  But now I see The Widow, Zephyr and Prince Valiant Tilda are anomalies.
When your husband kicks you out and your only option is to go groveling home to your father, where you have to swear permanent fealty to him, I detect a lack of progress.

 

Lydia could have, and should have, gone to The Widow. The Widow would have treated her like a real person.
 
 

I think the key difference between Veil and the Widow is that the Widow wants to change the gender of those at the top whereas Veil would prefer everyone to be relatively equal.

 

I don't get that from The Widow at all. She wants to end the abuse of everyone, especially women, by the Barons. If Zephyr takes the place of Jacobee, that would be good, but I didn't get the feeling that displacing him was a high priority.

[candall]

 

Lydia could have, and should have, gone to The Widow. The Widow would have treated her like a real person.

 

Well, there you go:  capital idea.  Even though we've seen few women imbued with power, those few are formidable.  Uniting is a much better idea than eliminating each other, Veil.

[maczero]

That's

Veil finally managed to find a loophole so she could hold Sunny responsible for her parents' deaths.  Did she forget, during her will-I-or-won't-I speech, that she's not "allowed" to have Sunny's baby? 

I don't believe she's not allowed to have his child. The law is that Clippers can't have families. Waldo said Clippers produce children all the time. They just don't claim them.

So she could end her relationship with Sonny and raise the child on her own in relative safety of Quinn's fiefdom. Or she and Sonny can run off into the unknown and start a family. She was all for the second choice until she found out Sonny stood aside and let Quinn murder her parents. I can't say I blame her.

Lydia could have, and should have, gone to The Widow. The Widow would have treated her like a real person.

How would she have found the Widow? The Widow lost her territory and is in hiding. Not to mention, that Lydia would be easy prey for nomads and rival barons so wandering the Badlands for too long isn't a smart idea. Besides her father has power and resources, it makes sense that she would go to him. I'm sure she could put up with his bs long enough until she can plan her next move.

I'm confused by Ryder. Is there some reason he can't fight? Like a physical handicap. I get that he's a coward but he doesn't seem to have any training. I don't think Quinn would raise a son that was incapable of defending himself.

[johntfs]

I'm confused by Ryder. Is there some reason he can't fight? Like a physical handicap. I get that he's a coward but he doesn't seem to have any training. I don't think Quinn would raise a son that was incapable of defending himself.

As I understand it, Ryder was kidnapped and tortured by raiders/nomads. They maimed his feet.

[maczero]

As I understand it, Ryder was kidnapped and tortured by raiders/nomads. They maimed his feet.

Thanks.  Doesn't seem to affect his ability to walk. 

[johntfs]

I think the injury more psychological than physically function.  Like if someone scarred you with acid.  You might be fully functional physically, but the scarring and psychological trauma would mess with your confidence.

[rogueprinzess]

I think the injury more psychological than physically function.  Like if someone scarred you with acid.  You might be fully functional physically, but the scarring and psychological trauma would mess with your confidence.

 

I agree with this. They showed that Quinn hasn't been at all sympathetic to Ryder's plight, even when he was a child. Lydia mentioned that Quinn refused to pay the ransom on Ryder and that's why Ryder was maimed in the first place. Between the mental torture that his captors likely inflicted on him, the emotional abuse that his father then subsequently put him through when he a) refused to treat him like a priority by paying the ransom (though I get to an extent why Quinn didn't want Nomads thinking that they could use his family against him - cold but effective) and b) essentially disowned him when he realized Ryder wasn't "whole" anymore -  it's highly likely that Ryder is crippled on the inside. 

Edited January 11, 2016 by rogueprinzess

[jhlipton]

How would she have found the Widow? The Widow lost her territory and is in hiding. Not to mention, that Lydia would be easy prey for nomads and rival barons so wandering the Badlands for too long isn't a smart idea. Besides her father has power and resources, it makes sense that she would go to him. I'm sure she could put up with his bs long enough until she can plan her next move.

 

True enough.  And having no possessions but her idols would have pushed her to her father as well.

[Grace19]

I just finished watching this show, i love it and everybody, except Quinn, Rhyder and Jade. I will not be upset if i don't see them next season.

[millennium]

On 1/10/2016 at 3:53 AM, jhlipton said:

Let me say right from the outset that The Widow is my favorite charactder by far and if she goes, so do I.

 

She's the main character, as far as I'm concerned.