S04.E08: Legends Of Yesterday (2)

[Chaser]

I'm not entirely sure what makes Savage so scary. Sure, he can fight, and he is immortal, but that just means he doesn't die. He's not invulnerable to harm. You can shoot him. A rocket launcher should do some damage, surely Argus could scrounge up one. Or better yet, since these numbskulls let his ashes just lay around for Malcolm to play with you could fill him full of arrows, wrap him in chains, stick him in a metal box, cover it in steel reinforced concrete and dump it in the deepest part of the ocean. He'll have a lot of time to think about his life choices. 

I immediately thought of a scene in Buffy, where Angelus brings back this demon who can't be killed by any weapon and Buffy's like "That was then" and pulls out a freakin' rocket launcher.

[tarotx]

Surprise/Innocence one of the best seismic shifts on a tv show. If only Marc...

And lol they recovered the body parts...

[ElectricBoogaloo]

And they knew to keep the body parts separated! Still shaking my head at Team Arrow/Flash just leaving Vandal's ashes in a pile on the floor.

[Chaser]

I don't pay much as much attention to the actions scenes as I used to so I don't tend to catch the finer points till I see it in gif form. For instance, I stumbled onto one wear the guys bust out of the van and did Laurel trip getting out? She has a very "Oh Shit!" look on her face for a moment before getting back into the scene. 

[SzmuttyPratfall]

I am not current on Arrow, catching up on Netflix, before this season, and was on the Olicity train even as I am halfway through 3. I just watched this episode for the crossover and...

I don't care about what the context leading up to this episode. I am off the Olicity train. I am off Felicity. Like she can be clingy but good god, never expected that level of selfishness from her. When you are in a relationship with someone you don't own them, you don't own everything about them, and they are allowed some personal privacy. Oh gee Felicity, you weren't the first person to know, oh gee, its up to him not you when he is ok telling people this. Her desire to own everything about Oliver now, whatever is spurring this, is abusive. It's flat out controlling and abusive. And Jesus, you find out your S/O discovered they had a kid, found it out that day, and you rip them apart for the fact that you don't know that day as they haven't made it all about you? You tear him down when you know he's hurting because of your goddamn ego? How friggin selfish.

Even at the end scene, Felicity kept trying to manipulate Oliver into telling her something he wasn't comfortable with yet, caring more about her knowing than about him. JESUS. WHAT THE HELL. IF THIS IS THE WAY THEY ARE TOGETHER THEY CAN STAY FAR FAR APART

 

Good God.

Please someone tell me this was bad writing/out of character for her. 

Edited December 9, 2015 by GenL
Edited fandom talk

[theacostov]

I think you need to watch the end of season 3 to understand why Felicity is unhappy about secrets. I feel like her wish for him to not keep secrets is valid. And she only blew up at him when he lied straight to her face re: Dhark. And the last scene imo was just her letting him know that he should be able to confide in her because they're in a team now and he's notoriously had difficulty unburdening his feelings before.

Having said I do think that the scene in the first timeline Felicity was a bit OTT. But I think that had more to do with the writers trying to show us in a very short amount of time, 'DON'T LIE OLIVER, IT'S A BAD THING TO DO'. I don't think Felicity would have reacted like that. Then again I didn't really think Oliver would lie so there was a whole lot of writing for good old contrived drama right there.

Edited December 9, 2015 by theacostov

[wonderwall]

So do people just throw around the term 'emotionally abusive' nowadays? Because I've seen it be misused a LOT over the internet...

[Guest]

So do people just throw around the term 'emotionally abusive' nowadays? Because I've seen it be misused a LOT over the internet...

 

THIS. I'd hate for people to see real emotional abuse because wanting honesty from your boyfriend is not it. 

[dtissagirl]

I mean, the whole point of the entire thing is that Barry DIDN'T HEAR that the reason Felicity was pissed was that Oliver was lying to her face even after she already knew what was going on, and not at all about Oliver having a kid, so I don't even know where to start here.

[statsgirl]

Along with Oliver lying when he said he wouldn't and Felicity's OTT blow-up, I blame Barry for causing the situation.

 

Felicity's go-to move when she's so angry she can't talk is to walk away and "get some air".. Barry interpreted it as Felicity breaking up with Oliver.

 

Barry then gave Oliver the impression that Felicity broke up with him because she found out that he had a child he was concealing from her.  NOT TRUE.  She walked away because he lied to her face, repeatedly, and this brought up the whole trust issue from seasons 2 and 3.

 

I give Barry 50% of the blame. 

Edited December 9, 2015 by statsgirl

[dtissagirl]

It's kinda Barry's fault that Felicity found out too. She wasn't investigating what Oliver was doing -- she was looking for the two of them to tell them the stuff about Vandal Savage they learned from the betamax tape. But THE FLASH WAS TOO SLOW in trying to hide a piece of paper in his pocket, trolololol.

 

[statsgirl]

Good point.

This is what happens when they let Barry on to the Arrow show.

[SzmuttyPratfall]

THIS. I'd hate for people to see real emotional abuse because wanting honesty from your boyfriend is not it. 

That sense of ownership, where your partner is to have no privacy, and nothing to themselves for a moment, where one side acts and enforces an idea that nothing can happen in their lives without them immediately telling them, depending on them, that dragging out of their flaws, exaggerating them in order to mentally scar them, guilt them, and control them, that use of a recent trauma to further hurt someone to protect your own sense of self importance, pretty much everything we saw in that scene between Felicity and Oliver, was, not exaggerating, emotional abuse.

If this was a woman who had had a shocking, semi-traumatic, rug-pulling change happen in her life, and the man that that woman was with, as she was still processing this information, tore her down for saying nothing the same day as she found out, treated her the same way we saw Felicity act to Oliver, press her at the end of the show for something the woman was clearly uncomfortable with at this time, enforcing all of this, we would be appalled.

[dtissagirl]

tore her down for saying nothing the same day as she found out,

 

Oliver didn't say nothing. He said:

 

I think Damian Darhk has someone operating in Central City. So I sent Barry to run down a lead.

 

That's a lie that disrespects Felicity on a personal level, and on a partners-in-vigilante-ing level right there. Which is what Felicity was reacting to:

 

Just to be clear, I don't care that you have a child. I can't believe that you have a child that you didn't tell me about. I care that you lied to me just now.

[Ceylon5]

That sense of ownership, where your partner is to have no privacy, and nothing to themselves for a moment, where one side acts and enforces an idea that nothing can happen in their lives without them immediately telling them, depending on them, that dragging out of their flaws, exaggerating them in order to mentally scar them, guilt them, and control them, that use of a recent trauma to further hurt someone to protect your own sense of self importance, pretty much everything we saw in that scene between Felicity and Oliver, was, not exaggerating, emotional abuse.

If this was a woman who had had a shocking, semi-traumatic, rug-pulling change happen in her life, and the man that that woman was with, as she was still processing this information, tore her down for saying nothing the same day as she found out, treated her the same way we saw Felicity act to Oliver, press her at the end of the show for something the woman was clearly uncomfortable with at this time, enforcing all of this, we would be appalled.

 

Every couple has their "thing" that is an issue for them, and with Felicity and Oliver, that thing is keeping secrets.  You said you're only half way through season 3, so you haven't seen the full extent of why trust and honesty is such an issue, but if you've seen Oliver's actions through the first 2.5 seasons, you must have some idea of his unhealthy and unhelpful penchant for keeping secrets and lying to people close to him.  It's clear that Felicity managed to forgive him for what he did to her last season, but an intimate relationship could really only work for them going forward on the condition that they don't keep secrets from each other while they're together.  And I'm sure her trust in him is pretty fragile still, so even the slightest hint that he's going to start keeping important secrets from her again is the equivalent of exploding a bomb in the middle of their relationship.  When someone trips your trigger, you react.  Oliver tripped Felicity's trigger and she reacted.  Couples fight.  It's not the end of the world.  If they had had a chance to talk later in Timeline 1, I've no doubt they would have sorted it out.

 

Also, I'm not really seeing why it has to be all about Oliver?  Him having a kid (which I'd categorise as overwhelming, not traumatising) affects her too.  Oliver suddenly keeping secrets from her affects her even more (if anyone has a right to be traumatised by Oliver's secrets and lies, it's Felicity - I refer you to episodes 321-323 for further details).  He had something huge happen to him, but she had something huge happen to her too.  They're both allowed to react to it.  He reacted poorly by keeping secrets and lying for no reason at all.  She reacted poorly to him doing that.

 

In Timeline 2, she in no way "enforced" anything.  She briefly offered to be Oliver's sounding board (something that, frankly, he needs like he needs oxygen), and when he basically blew her off (which you could see she knew he was doing), she didn't press him.  In that timeline, it was the first time she'd brought it up since he'd said the day before that he'd tell her all about it later.  Perfectly reasonable and normal conversation for two people in a loving relationship to have.  Worrying about someone and wanting to be there for them is about as far from "controlling", "abusive" and "selfish" as you can reasonably hope to get.

[Delphi]

So here's my newest question. Moira bribed/blackmailed BM into lying to Oliver and going to Central City. With an offer of either one or two million dollars. She made it very clear that the girl was out of Oliver's life no matter what happened. So notSandra runs off and out of the goodness of her heart or honour or whatever decides that she doesn't want millions of dollars from a billionaire who wouldn't even notice it had gone missing when she's now a single woman with a child to raise. Does anyone actually do that? In real life, someone gave you a million dollars, would you just go 'nah, I'm good off that'. That to me is more ridiculous and farfetched then reincarnated hawk people.

[Starfish35]

In real life, someone gave you a million dollars, would you just go 'nah, I'm good off that'.

It would depend on the circumstances. But if I had a child to think of, and presumably no health insurance or job, you'd better believe I'd be taking that money. Sorry. *shrug*. I mean, how many thousands of dollars does a hospital birth alone cost?

Edited December 11, 2015 by Starfish35

[kismet]

I'm not sure what I would do. Cashing the check makes her beholden to MQ in a way. Anyone willing to pay you to disappear must be willing to pay to have a lot of other things done. Cashing that check makes her at the mercy of MQ, because it's MQ's money. Nobody gives you money without strings attached that they can pull at a later date. Then again, kids are expensive. But I could see myself not cashing the check as easily as I see myself cashing the check.

 

Ultimately though I really do think the writers remember that is was a 2 million dollar bribe, not a 1 million bribe. I think BM cashed one check and kept the other as reverse blackmail. And if I was presented with 2 checks, that is exactly what I would have done. You get the money to help raise the kid. You show you are willing to keep the promise you made. But you are also showing that you don't trust the person and are keeping them on notice as well to keep up their end of the bargain. It's smart decision making all around.

[quarks]

So here's my newest question. Moira bribed/blackmailed BM into lying to Oliver and going to Central City. With an offer of either one or two million dollars. She made it very clear that the girl was out of Oliver's life no matter what happened. So notSandra runs off and out of the goodness of her heart or honour or whatever decides that she doesn't want millions of dollars from a billionaire who wouldn't even notice it had gone missing when she's now a single woman with a child to raise. Does anyone actually do that? In real life, someone gave you a million dollars, would you just go 'nah, I'm good off that'. That to me is more ridiculous and farfetched then reincarnated hawk people.

 

I'm still questioning why it was a check and not a wire transfer. A check of that size, even from Moira Queen, would raise eyebrows at most banks.

[Chaser]

A check is stupid, but a personal check is even dumber.

 

Her name shouldn't have been anywhere. 

[DeadZeus]

I love how Oliver can suddenly shoot like 10 arrows in 5 seconds in these crossover episodes. Suddenly hes super fast! But at the final fight he shot like 5 arrows super fast but nothing happened with them. Vandal was fighting the others, Oliver shoots 5 arrows.. and thats it LOL! Not being dodged, not being hit, they just dissapear! Very weird scene for me.

[bettername2come]

As the episode is on re-run tonight I noticed the stupidest thing happening in the background. When Carter kicks Cisco out of his and Kendra's training session, there's a donkey sneaking through the fence behind them.

[Morrigan2575]

As the episode is on re-run tonight I noticed the stupidest thing happening in the background. When Carter kicks Cisco out of his and Kendra's training session, there's a donkey sneaking through the fence behind them.

You missed the Donkey first time round? He was the best actor in that scene. LOL

[bettername2come]

Apparently I'm a bad viewer and a bad thread reader.

[catrox14]

 

hat I would do. Cashing the check makes her beholden to MQ in a way. Anyone willing to pay you to disappear must be willing to pay to have a lot of other things done. Cashing that check makes her at the mercy of MQ, because it's MQ's money. Nobody gives you money without strings attached that they can pull at a later date. Then again, kids are expensive. But I could see myself not cashing the check as easily as I see myself cashing the check.

 

I would think that once BM  learned that Moira was murdered there was little chance of anyone finding out if she cashed that check and no one would really think much about a million or two out of the apparent billions the Queens have being gone.

 

The whole thing is so fucking stupid.

 

Respectfully, Felicity is not being emotionally abusive to Oliver. If you watch everything leading up to that moment I think you'll have a different outlook...even if you disagree with her being angry.  I'm a DV survivor and Felicity's anger is not remotely close to emotional abuse. Not even a little bit.  She is rightfully angry over yet ANOTHER secret Oliver has kept from her. 

[kismet]

I would think that once BM learned that Moira was murdered there was little chance of anyone finding out if she cashed that check and no one would really think much about a million or two out of the apparent billions the Queens have being gone.

The whole thing is so fucking stupid.

Respectfully, Felicity is not being emotionally abusive to Oliver. If you watch everything leading up to that moment I think you'll have a different outlook...even if you disagree with her being angry. I'm a DV survivor and Felicity's anger is not remotely close to emotional abuse. Not even a little bit. She is rightfully angry over yet ANOTHER secret Oliver has kept from her.

U used my quote about the check and the paying. I understand your points. I still think cashing the checks would have been complicated for BM considering MQs influence.

However the lower part of your post has nothing to do with my post or quote. I never mentioned anything about FS being emotionally abusive to OQ like ever. I think that is an over statement that I never made. I think FS was rightly angry in the moment, I think she was definitely mean to him but she never even got close to emotionally abusive. So not sure who you were directing that statement too. Sorry to hear about your own struggles :( no one deserves to be abused.

[catrox14]

I'm kind of confused. I was replying to both situations. I quoted your post and replied to that re Moira's money.

 

I made a separate paragraph about Felicity allegedly being abusive as a response in general, not towards you specifically at all. 

[kismet]

I'm kind of confused. I was replying to both situations. I quoted your post and replied to that re Moira's money.

 

I made a separate paragraph about Felicity allegedly being abusive as a response in general, not towards you specifically at all. 

Ok... sorry for the confusion. I just wanted to make sure that the two different paragraphs were not connected in theme. I guess I was just bring a little overly defensive. I tend to be very careful about using words like emotionally abusive because I have seen it and the consequences in real life, so I try not to throw it around lightly. So I just wanted to make sure that I had not mislead you in my previous postings that I thought the situation was emotional abuse.

[tv echo]

This episode was the second part of a two-part crossover with The Flash 208. Therefore, I'm posting my transcriptions from both that Flash episode and this episode...

The Flash 208 (Legends of Today) – Felicity forgets that she’s speaking over open comms:
Felicity: (Lowers voice) "'Felicity, magnetic arrow gag will never work!' (Normal voice) Huh, 'yes, it will, my love, because I am really smart.'  And guess what, Oliver? It did work."
Oliver (over comms): "Felicity? Honey? It's a little hard to fight with you doing that in my ear."
Felicity: "Oh! I totally forgot this was an open line! Keep doing what you're doing - make smart decisions."

The Flash 208 (Legends of Today) – Barry experiences what it’s like to date Felicity:
Felicity: "Barry! So good to see you." 
Barry: "Felicity! (Hugs her) Oh, good to see you, Felicity."
Felicity (hitting Barry on chest): "How come you didn't tell me that Zoom broke your back?"
Barry: "I -”
Felicity (hugging him): "Oh, I'm so glad you're okay."
Barry (to Oliver): "So this is what it's like dating her."
Oliver: "More bruises from her than from Deathstroke."

The Flash 208 (Legends of Today) - When Cisco objects to Oliver interrogating Kendra about her stalker, things get tense with Oliver, and Felicity steps in to cool them down:
Oliver: "You came here because you need my help. This is what my help looks like.”
Barry: "Oliver, I just saved you guys from whatever the hell flock of seagulls was about to do. The least you can do is –"
Oliver: "Barry, none of us have superpowers. You brought Kendra into our world without knowing who she is, or what this dude that is after her is looking for. You made all of us unsafe. So maybe you ask the questions."
Felicity (who had been slowly sliding her chair closer to Oliver during his speech): "Whoa, whoa, whoa - we're all friends here, right?"
Oliver: "Uh-hmm."
Felicity: "Why don't we go back to our place and have some drinks, and we can talk?"
Barry: "Cool."

The Flash 208 (Legends of Today) – Felicity wonders what an Earth-2 Oliver would look like:
Barry: “So the CEO of Palmer Technologies is living with Oliver Queen. It’s insane how much can change in six months.”
Felicity: “Which you would know better than anyone, considering that there is another Flash, another Dr. Wells… from another Earth?! I mean –“ 
Barry: “Yeah, it’s been trippy lately.”
Felicity: “I wonder what Oliver’s doppelgänger would look like… Bald. Pot-bellied.”
Barry: “Uh-huh.”
Felicity: “Agreeable.”
(They laugh.)

The Flash 208 (Legends of Today) – Oliver tells Barry that he’s happy being with Felicity:
Barry: “I gotta say, this isn’t the same Arrow team I’m used to seeing.  Or the same Oliver Queen.  You seem really –“
Oliver: “Happy?”
Barry: “Happy, yeah.”
Oliver: "I am happy. I finally have everything that I’ve ever wanted. Being with Felicity has given me a real sense of peace - something that I haven’t had in a long time."
Barry: “Didn’t you tell me that guys like us don’t get the girl?”
Oliver: “Yep. I was wrong.”
(Barry laughs.)

The Flash 208 (Legends of Today) – Felicity shows concern when Oliver and Barry prepare to leave to confront Vandal Savage:
Felicity (Taking Oliver’s hand): “Hey, are you sure you want to do this? If this guy is immortal, and Merlyn’s right about how powerful the staff is?”
Barry: “We’ll be fine. Kiss her.”
Oliver: “We’ll be fine.” (Kisses Felicity)
Felicity: “Careful.”
Barry: “Let’s go.”

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – No Oliver Queen voiceover intro.

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Team Arrow and Team Flash meet at a remote farmhouse to discuss Vandal Savage; and Felicity notices that something's bothering Oliver:
Thea: "A bunch of superheroes in a farmhouse? I feel like I've seen that in a movie before."
Oliver: "We need a secure location."
Caitlin: "What's wrong with S.T.A.R. Labs?"
Oliver: "Well, I mean, absolutely nothing if you forget about the revolving door you guys installed so the bad guys can come and go as they please."
Caitlin: "Remind me again what happened to your old lair, or the one before that."
Felicity: "Well, lair number one was compromised by the police, and... I will stop helping."
Oliver: "Savage only let Barry and I live because he felt Kendra start to emerge as Hawkgirl and went after her. He can sense her and Carter's presence. We don't need to make it easier on him by staying in the city limits."
Diggle (to Laurel): "Bet you wish you were staying at your mother's place now."
Laurel: "Mm-huh."
Oliver: "We need to find a way to neutralize Savage's advantage. Barry, you're late."
Barry: "Sorry. It turns out, it's not easy finding the ass end of nowhere."
Cisco: "Yeah, for real. The roaming charges alone are going to bankrupt me."
Oliver: "We're discussing how to take away Savage's newfound power."
Felicity: "And his magic stick thing."
Carter: "Yeah, Staff of Horus."
Barry: "Well, it's protected by some kind of energy field. I couldn't lay a finger on it."
Felicity: "Maybe if you wear mittens next time."
Caitlin: "What if we made some sort of insulated gauntlets?"
Cisco: "Oh, yeah, yeah, the magnetic shielding could disrupt the -"
Felicity: "The staff's magnetic polarity."
Oliver: "Well, while the geek squad works -"
Felicity: "Heard that, honey."
Oliver: "While they work to get the staff away from Savage, we need to know everything there is to know about him."
Thea: "Well, I Googled reincarnated nut jobs and came up with nothing."
Carter: "Kendra and I would be the reincarnated nut jobs. Savage is merely immortal."
Laurel: "Merely?"
Thea: "Welcome to the new normal."
Diggle: "Anyone who's been around for 4,000 years should leave a trail. I'll check with A.R.G.U.S., see if they have anything on him."
Thea: "Laurel and I can check police reports and stuff like that."
Oliver: "Good. (To Kendra) We need to find a way to utilize your new ability."
Kendra: "My ability?"
Oliver: "It might give us an advantage."
Barry: "Yeah, whatever you do, don't let him train you. I'm sorry, but when it rains, I can still feel where he shot me with those arrows."
Carter: "I'll handle her training, then."
Oliver: "Yeah."
Felicity: "Oliver."
Oliver: "Uh, I need to run something down. I'll be back as soon as I can."
Felicity: "And what exactly are you running down?"
Oliver: "Don't worry, it's nothing dangerous."
Felicity: "Well, are you okay?"
Oliver: "Well, we're up against an immortal mad man armed with a magical staff, so I do have a few things on my mind."
Felicity: "Yeah, but you were acting fine with everything while we were home, and now that we're here in Central City, you've just been not... you."
Oliver: "Well, maybe it's too bright and sunny for me here. There is something going on, and I am going to tell you all about it. I would just like the chance to know what I'm dealing with first."
Felicity: "Okay."
Oliver: "Okay."
*  *  *
Kendra: "Until what?"
Oliver: "Until we are supposed to hand you and Carter over to Savage, or -"
Carter: "Savage lays waste to Central City."
Oliver: "Yeah."
Carter: "We've been through this before. 1887, the Huang He floods, Savage killed nearly two million people to get to us. And he did."
Oliver: "We weren't helping you then. We are now. We have 24 hours to come up with a workable plan."
Kendra: "No, this is insane. My life isn't worth millions of people's lives." (Leaves)
Carter: "Kendra. I'll talk to her."
Oliver: "Yeah."
Cisco: "Hey, I got this."
Carter: "I said, I'll talk to her."
Cisco: "Hey, here's an idea - why don't we just toss him (Indicating Carter) over to Vandal Savage?"

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Team Arrow and Team Flash watch a recorded message from Dr. Aldus Boardman about Savage:
(Felicity gets Carter and Kendra, who are out in the meadow, to return to the farmhouse.)
Felicity: "Hey. Sorry to interrupt... the weirdness. Um, John, Laurel, and Thea are back, and they've got something."
(Cut to inside of farmhouse.)
Diggle: "Where are Oliver and Barry?"
Felicity: "Oliver's back in secret-keeping mode, apparently. Barry, I don't know. Caitlin and Cisco are working on the anti-staff gauntlets. What do you guys have? (Laurel hands her a tape) Beta Max. Aww, what, did you guys get this off of? EBay?"
Diggle: "Lyla hooked us up."
Felicity: "Yeah, well, it's going to take a while to play since we live in a digital world now."
Laurel: "The tape came from a conspiracy theory group that's interested in Savage."
Diggle: "Pentagon had a file on Savage back in '86, but it's all been heavily redacted."
Felicity: "Got it."
Dr. Aldus Boardman (recorded video): "Is this on? I hope so. My name is Dr. Aldus Boardman. I'm a professor at St. Roch University. The date is April 8th, 1975. I don't think anyone else knows this, and those that do, don't believe. He's a myth. An urban legend. He has been compared to Machiavelli and Nostradamus. He's gone by many names, but I know him as Vandal Savage, and he will be the death of the world. But I believe there is a way to stop him. Savage is an immortal, Egyptian priest. His long life is a result of an unearthly calamity. I believe that any object associated with this calamity should be able to undo its effects and kill him. And I suspect that our precious, fragile world may one day depend upon us doing so."
Felicity: "Oh, that's the understatement of the year. Or, you know, the last 4,000 years."
Diggle: "Do you have any idea what he meant by these objects? This calamity?"
Carter: "No, I - I don't recall a calamity."
Kendra: "The staff."
Felicity: "Staff of Horus?"
Kendra: "Yes. I think the staff belonged to Savage back in ancient Egypt."
Carter: "You remember?"
Kendra: "It's a hunch. And if Professor Boardman's guess is right, that staff has helped me kill Savage."
Laurel: "Okay, someone needs to inform Oliver and Barry."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Barry shows the DNA test on William's hair strand to Oliver and then to Felicity:
Barry: "Okay, here you go. I gene sequenced the hair strand with the blood sample you gave me. Still not sure what it has to do with Damien Darhk, but the Y chromosomes match. Are you okay?"
Oliver: "Thanks for this. It's a big help."
Barry: "Yeah, well."
Oliver: "Barry."
Barry: "Yeah?"
Oliver: "Don't tell anyone about this." (Leaves)
(Felicity enters.)
Felicity: "All right, I'd like to know what's going on here."
Barry: "Felicity -"
Felicity: "Yes, I tracked you down. I find people for a living. Actually, I don't get paid, but - (Barry flashes paper into his pocket) what was that?"
Barry: "What was what?"
Felicity: "You just super-speeded something into your pocket."
Barry: "Oh, um, no, nothing. Um, well, actually, it's, um, it's something Oliver wanted me to track down. It's, uh, it's about Damien Darhk -"
Felicity: "I want to see it."
Barry: "Why?"
Felicity: "Because you don't want me to see it."
Barry: "I'm sorry, Oliver specifically asked me -"
Felicity: "Show me."
Barry: "Okay... I don't know what the big deal is. It's just a DNA test."
Felicity: "No, it's not."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Oliver confronts Samantha about William, and she sets stringent conditions on Oliver's being able to see her son:
Samantha: "Honey, why don't you finish that inside?"
William: "Mom, the Flash hasn't saved the city yet."
Samantha: "Now, honey." (William goes inside the house)
Oliver: "Can we talk?"
Samantha: "Look, I don't know what you're trying to accomplish here, Oliver."
Oliver: "I know, Samantha. I know that William is my son."
Samantha: "Okay."
Oliver: "Why didn't you tell me?"
Samantha: "Okay, just keep your voice down. Your mother told me not to."
Oliver: "What?!"
Samantha: "She offered me a million dollars to tell you that I miscarried."
Oliver: "My mother was a complicated person, but she would never do that."
Samantha: "Wait here. (Hands him check) I never cashed it. I didn't need her money to know I didn't want her anywhere near my child."
Oliver: "Or me anywhere near him."
Samantha: "So what, he can be just like his dad? Punching out paparazzi and getting young girls knocked up?"
Oliver: "Samantha, I'm not that person anymore."
Samantha: "I know, I know. You're - you're running for mayor. Your mother was killed. Your friend Tommy. You're a different person now. But can you really tell me that your life is any less crazy? Can you honestly say that William isn't better off with your world kept away from his?"
Oliver: "No, you're right. I'm being selfish. But I want an opportunity to get to know my son, and I think that a young boy deserves the opportunity to get to know his father."
Samantha: "He's happy. He's - he's well-adjusted. I don't want to run the risk of him getting sucked into your orbit. That can't happen. Which means... that he can't know that you're his father. And nobody else can. I don't care if that sounds harsh. I'm his mother, and I will do whatever - whatever I feel I have to do to protect him."
Oliver: "Samantha, there is someone in my life now. Please, don't make me keep this from her."
Samantha: "Oliver, you will if you want a relationship with my son. These are my conditions. You've already asked the world of me. I'm just asking for the same in return."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Felicity confronts Oliver about the paternity test and he lies to her:
(Felicity meets the returning Oliver outside the farmhouse.)
Felicity: "Everyone's waiting for you."
Oliver: "Sorry. Just something I had to take care of."
Felicity: "So I guess you're off the secret-keeping wagon."
Oliver: "That's not it."
Felicity: "Then what is it?"
Oliver (sighing): "I think Damien Darhk has someone operating in Central City. So I sent Barry to run down a lead."
Felicity: "This kind of lead? He didn't know what he was giving me. But I run enough tests on your blood to recognize your DNA sequence anywhere."
Oliver: “Felicity, you don't -"
Felicity: "You had to run a paternity test, didn't you?"
Oliver: "Look, Felicity -"
Felicity: "Stop. I cannot hear another lie."
Oliver: "It's more complicated than that."
Felicity: "God, Oliver, you are the only person on this planet who considers the truth complicated. Just to be clear, I don't care that you have a child. I can't believe that you have a child that you didn't tell me about. I care that you lied to me just now."
Oliver: "You know that my whole world just exploded? And I think that I'm entitled to a... a minute to process that by myself."
Felicity: "You somehow managed to go to CCPD and track down Barry. You didn't keep it to yourself. You kept it from me. When were you planning on telling me?"
Oliver: "I don't know."
Felicity: "If you loved me, if you trusted me, telling me this wouldn't be such a burden - it would be a relief. But you don't trust me. You never will. And how can I be with someone who doesn't trust me?" (Leaves)
Oliver: "Felicity..."
Barry (coming out on front porch): "Are you guys okay? Oliver? What happened?"
Oliver: "Nothing. I'm fine." 
Barry: "Uh, are you sure? I mean, you don't seem fine. You seem out of it."
Oliver: "Is everyone inside?"
Barry: "Yeah."
(They go inside the farmhouse.)
Oliver: "Coming up on Savage's deadline."
Laurel: "Where's Felicity?"
Oliver: "Are the gauntlets working?"
Caitlin: "They have to be, we're out of time."
Cisco: "I think they'll work. That staff's going to go from 'can't touch this' to 'invisible touch.'"
Oliver: "Savage doesn't know Kendra has access to her full abilities, which makes you our ace in the hole. We're going to put you up against Savage. You attack with the element of surprise. I will lay down the cover fire. Barry, you speed in, and -"
Barry: "Snatch the staff, I got it."
Diggle: "Where do you need us?"
Oliver: "This is me, Barry, Kendra and Carter. We've got it."
Thea: "Ollie!"
Oliver: "No, we're not risking any more lives tonight than we have to."
Barry: "Suit up."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Barry tells Oliver about his time traveling back in time and what happened before:
Oliver: "We need to brief the team. Come up with some type of counterattack."
Barry: "It's not going to work."
Oliver: "What?"
Barry: "Um, nothing. All right, never mind, I shouldn't have said anything."
Oliver: "What's going on?"
Barry: "Okay, look, this isn't going to make any sense to you, but I - all right, so I traveled back in time from when we tried to take out Savage. I - I mean, later, when we tried to take him down in the future, and it doesn't work."
Oliver: "You're right, that doesn't make sense to me."
Barry: "My world is stranger than yours."
Oliver: "Well, maybe we use that to our advantage. You say that whatever we do against Savage doesn't work?"
Barry: "Yeah."
Oliver: "Then we come up with a new plan."
Barry: "No. No, no, no. Okay, look, you can't. You - when I mess with time, it just, it doesn't end well."
Oliver: "But what you're telling me is that it already doesn't end well. Barry, people in our line of work, we don't get second chances. We need to take this one."
Barry: "All right, I hope you're right."
Oliver: "All right, let's start with what went wrong."
Barry: "You did. When we go up against Savage, your head's not in the game. You're not yourself."
Oliver: "Why not?"
Barry: "Oliver -"
Oliver: "Barry! Why not?"
Barry: "Okay, are you planning on giving me a hair sample to run forensics on in the near future?"
Oliver: "Yeah."
Barry: "Well, I did. And you were pretty shaken after the fact. And then Felicity found out, and you guys had a pretty big fight, and it sounded like it was over between you two."
Oliver: "What was the fight about?"
Barry: "I'm pretty sure you're someone's father, Oliver. So when we go up against Savage, you're not focused. And then, Kendra can't access her powers, and then the tech they're developing to counteract Savage's staff does not work, and... everyone dies, Oliver."
Oliver: "This time they won't. This time we do things differently."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Kendra remembers her first death at Savage's hands and how to defeat Savage:
Cisco: "Oliver, you were right. I don't know how you knew, but you were right - the gauntlets won't work, they're missing a critical element."
Diggle: "How do you know?"
Kendra: "Because I remembered. I remember how Savage killed us the first time. Back in Egypt."
Carter: "I've never been able to remember our first death."
Kendra: "Well, these sky rocks - meteors - they fell and they completely destroyed the royal palace."
Felicity: "During the Middle Kingdom, Egypt experienced a high level of meteorite activity. (Everyone looks at her) I know stuff."
Laurel: "Which is one of the many reasons we love you so much, but also doesn't seem to help us stop Savage."
Kendra: "It's the calamity Professor Boardman was referencing. The meteors, they had a glow about them. And Savage's staff had two gemstones with the exact same glow."
Barry: "Yeah, the gemstones might be made up of the same element as the meteorite."
Felicity: "The Egyptians would use meteorite in their craftsmanship."
Caitlin: "And the minerals glow in proximity to each other."
Cisco: "Like Sankara Stones."
Thea: "Oh, wait, the Indiana Jones reference is the only thing I understood."
Cisco: "Two pieces of the same meteorite, like an nth metal... that is the key to counter-acting the staff."
Oliver: "Believe it or not, this isn't actually the craziest thing I've heard today."
Felicity: "There's a sample of the meteorite from the Middle Kingdom at the Keystone City Museum of Natural... (Barry flashes out and back withe the meteorite) History."
Barry: "Hopefully I got the right one."
Cisco: "I could synthesize the compatible isotope out of this and coat the gauntlets with it."
Oliver: "Okay. Do it. Savage doesn't know that Kendra has gained access to all of her abilities. It makes you our ace in the hole."
Diggle: "Where do you need us?"
Oliver: "Suit up."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Barry gives Oliver advice about William:
Oliver: "Well, you did it, Barry. Everyone's alive. Our guardian angel."
Barry: "That's what you told me I could be when I told you about my powers."
Oliver: "Meant it then and I know it now."
Barry: "Hey, Oliver, um, we need to have a difficult conversation, I think."
Oliver: "About my son? God, it feels weird to say that."
Barry: "Less about your son, and more about whether or not you're going to tell Felicity about him."
Oliver: "I don't think that's any of your business."
Barry: "You know, yeah, you're right, it's not really my business, except I told you, when I mess with time, time messes back. And we've already changed how things turned out with Savage, and I'm worried about temporal backlash."
Oliver: "Wait, you think that the timeline cares about what I tell my girlfriend?"
Barry: "What are you going to tell her?"
Oliver: "Well, you're right when you say that the rules keep changing and that the lives that we lead, they make us feel... powerless. And it makes me wonder if - if William wouldn't be better off with my world kept separate from his."
Barry: "Look, Oliver, take it from someone who didn't get to grow up with his father - I think the best thing for William is for you to be a part of his life."
Oliver: "Thanks, Barry."
Barry: "Yeah."
Oliver (laughing): "I'm not really a hugger."
Barry: "Yeah, tell me something I don't know. But the thing is, I am fast enough to just hug you without you knowing, so you might as well let me." (They hug)
Oliver: "Yeah. Thanks."
Barry: "Wasn't so bad, right?"

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Oliver agrees to Samantha's stringent conditions for seeing William:
Samantha: "These are my conditions, Oliver. You've already asked me for the world. I am just asking for the same in return."
Oliver: "Okay, I won't tell anyone. Even Felicity."
Samantha: "Felicity, that's a nice name."
Oliver: "She is a nice person. She's the best."
Samantha: "William is in his room. You're just a friend of mommy's, okay?"
(Cut to William's room.)
Oliver: "Hey, William."
William: "Hello."
Oliver: "You like the Flash? Can I tell you a secret? I've actually met the Flash."
William: "What's he like? Is he cool?"
Oliver: "Yeah, he's cool. He's - he's one of the best guys that I know. I'm Oliver. I'm a friend of your mom's. We've known each other a long time."
William: "Want to play action figures?"
Oliver: "Sure, sure. William, I'd love to come by every once in a while and say hello. Would that be all right with you?"
William: "It's Captain Cold. He's a bad guy."
Oliver: "Yes, he is. The Flash is going to have to be very fast to catch him."
William: "He will. He's the fastest man alive."
Oliver: "Oh!"
William: "Gotcha."

408 (Legends of Yesterday) – Oliver lies to Felicity again and hides the secret of his son from her:
(Oliver and Felicity return home to the loft.)
Felicity: "Oh, what a mess. Well, we have to clean this place up. Unless you're ready to tell me what you said you'd tell me."
Oliver (sitting on sofa): "Felicity, um..."
Felicity: "Oliver... We have a life together. Right? We're a team." (Throws sofa pillow on him)
Oliver: "Ow."
Felicity: "If something is bothering you and I don't know about it, I can't help you fix it. I can't be a good teammate. I love you, and that makes me want to be the best teammate ever. Not in a Lance Armstrong performance enhancing drugs kind of way. More like... more positive sports analogy I would use if I knew anything about sports. What had you acting so strange when we got to Central City?"
Oliver: "It doesn't matter, it's over. And I am back in Star City. With you. Come here." 
(She sits down next to him and he cuddles up to her.)

Edited February 25, 2020 by tv echo