Flesh And Bone - General Discussion

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Damn it, I totally forgot about your warning and ended up going "EWWWW!" when the toe moment happened in this episode. Bleeeeech! If I had such a messed up big toenail, I would not want to wear those Louboutins (or any open toed shoes for that matter). My feet were never anywhere near that bad and I was still self conscious about wearing any kind of peep toe or strappy shoes that showed too much of my toes or feet for years after I quit ballet.

 

I am disappointed (but not at all surprised) that the French guy expected sex from a girl who was clearly uncomfortable/not all there. It's ruining my memories of Cass Winthrop! It creeped me out that he was being so nice and charming at the beginning of dinner but when it was time to get down, he was a cold bastard. I guess I am supposed to be glad that he didn't have sex with her after she puked, but no, I still hate this guy.

 

Claire's brother can GTFO too. I will admit that I don't always want to sit next to a chatty stranger when I'm traveling but dude! That's what headphones are for.

 

Also yukky: Sascha Radetsky's character trying to cop a feel during rehearsal. Charlie from Center Stage would never do that!

 

It's one thing for the random girls to be two faced with Claire but her roommate Mia is running hot and cold. When Claire first moved in, she was a bitch, then she was nice to her, and now she's being a bitch again. Damn, girl - make up your mind!

 

Even though I suspect Romeo is supposed to be the guardian angel character (hey, maybe he'll be the one to kill Claire's creepy brother!), I agree - don't just accept random drugs from people, not ask what they are, and then take them.

 

One thing I loved was how Claire reminded Daphne to pull up without saying a word and Daphne knew exactly what she was talking about. That non-verbal communication is actual dancer stuff right there so I like that they are including realistic details. I hope we get to see their friendship develop more.

 

I couldn't believe that Claire actually thought she was being promoted to principle dancer just because she's supposed to dance the lead in one of the ballets. First of all, don't count your chickens before they've hatched. The company hasn't even hired a choreographer yet, let alone held auditions, announced the cast, or started rehearsals. A lot can change between now and then aka you could annoy Paul enough that he replaces you. But no, they are not going to change your contract (or your salary) just because you are dancing a lead role.

Edited November 9, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Pestilentia]

Another in to say I loved the hell out of this- gorgeous bodies doing gorgeous dancing. If I have to sit through the drama to see the dance then that's just what I have to do. I haven't screened this with husband yet- I hope he enjoys it as much as I did.

And yes with the full length shots during the dance segments.

[Empress1]

I fast-forwarded anything that looked like it was going to be a close-up of feet because feet are gross, dancer's feet are especially gross, and I wanted to avoid the toenail. But I liked the campiness and the dancing is beautiful. I don't think I was supposed to, but I cracked up at the director fucking ... whoever that was ... over his desk.

[ms gilly]

I'm watching.  Just YUUUUUUCCCK!  I don't even know what to say.  They had us sympathizing with the lead character for 5-1/2 episodes, only to burn that to the ground.  Why?  Whyyyy???  I'm with you, jvr....not interested in watching Claire anymore.  And the rest of the characters are so cliche....I do enjoy the dancing, although not necessarily Claire's.

[numbnut]

I had a feeling that Claire was willingly sleeping with Brian when she wouldn't hang up while he was having phone sex in the pilot ep. While I buy the incest backstory and Claire anguish/guilt/sexual issues, the character arcs aren't strongly developed. Brian comes off as two different people instead of as a complex/layered character (I also blame the one-note actor). The vagueness of Claire's emotional needs can make it harder for viewers to sympathize but I get the idea: the abused siblings needed each other as emotional anchors which led to sex as a source of comfort. That said, the premise is a yawn. I'm more interested in seeing how Claire navigates friendships (did she have any friends in Pittsburgh?).

Edited November 9, 2015 by numbnut

[numbnut]

Hmmm...I've been wondering why Sergei gave 250K over to the Company for Daphne with nothing in return...been waiting for the other show to drop.

 

I was wondering about this too. It can't be just because he loves ballet. And since Daphne knows a lot about Sergei, why wouldn't she think twice about getting in so deep? Odd. And the sex slaves on the yacht! That was intense. The girls were so young, wobbly and scared. Can't Claire give the cops an anonymous tip? It may not shut Sergei down but it's a start.

Edited November 9, 2015 by numbnut

[numbnut]

What do people think of the choreography we have seen so far for this modern piece?

 

It's lovely but not that impressive. I thought it would be more outside the box after all the hype about the choreographer.

 

I was typing this "hate what female actresses have to reveal on shows with nudity and sex that guys never have to expose themselves to..." right before the scene of Paul on the massage table where he exposes himself to Claire and flashes his flaccid penis.

 

Lots of full frontal on TV lately. Paul is a sexual harassment suit waiting to happen. I'm still marveling on Ben Daniels' performance. He's so reserved on House of Cards; it's like night and day.

Edited November 9, 2015 by numbnut

[Mhl2016]

Who is playing Laurent Brosseau? I know I should know him but can't figure it out. It's bothering me so badly and is not on imdb

[jvr]

But see we can imagine all kinds of things but there hasn't been any indication that they were abused...not that I can recall. We don't know where their mother is, she could be dead or have left after she realized how fucked up her kids were, we don't know.

 

The father seems like lots of dads that worked lots of hours to support his family and is emotionally distant and maybe a bit of an asshole. Neither one seemed scared of him but maybe he was more intimidating before his disability? The dad was being mean to Bryan but not Claire and we learned his anger was justified because he was mad his son fucked his daughter! He probably blames him most of all with the logic of he is older and a boy and believes he was was the aggressor. Even if Claire approached him he should have known better or just plain not wanted to! (ughhhh) That lock on Claire's door surely wasn't to keep her father out, he can barely walk. His banging on the door in the beginning was just to throw us off. I don't think being raised by a single Dad who was probably barely home -> emotional anchors -> incest.

 

I can't see Claire, from what we have seen, being the aggressor (though who knows with this show). Bryan has been overly sexual and violent (physically and sexually) since the moment we see him. The first time he talks to his sister in 2-3 years and he feels the need to masturbate into the phone on her bed... is his sexual need that powerful? He finds her and immediately fixates on sex with the roommate, even though he seemed singularly focused on getting to his sister. He couldn't wait till she got home...a few more hours were too much for him? And then the sex scene with Mia...that bordered on hate towards her...like he was mad she wasn't his sister. Don't forget he implied that he wanted to marry Claire to the poor nice man he knocked out at the bus station. 

 

I'm not absolving Claire of any wrongdoing though Bryan seems like a true psycho, she has been sending signals like she hates him (running away from home, mafia beatdown etc.) for what he did but then acting like he didn't do anything wrong! Ughhhhhh. I'm thinking the only problem she had with Bryan was that he left, not that he is her brother and knocked her up.

 

I'm going to finish these last two eps now and hopefully forget all about the Claire and Bryan characters.

[jvr]

Paul is still an asshole and on my can die now list. 

 

You know what? I completely missed that the program director lady stole money from the company to pay for her child's private school and to continue their lavish lifestyle. With the hopes her husband would get her her alimony in time to put the money back. I kept seeing those scenes and wondering if we knew her husband and why this was significant lol. Damn rich people are so fucking crazy. lol She couldn't put her damn child in public school? Not have lavish dinners for a little bit? Damn. Daphne not giving her the donor name was doing her a favor but she tracked it down in her desperation. I'm still trying to figure out what Russian Mobster sex trafficker is getting out of this, gotta be more than tickets and his name listed.

 

And now we know Claire didn't know her mother..the mom must have known her kids were mentally unstable at birth.

 

I skipped the phone scene with Claire where it looked like she was going to deal with brother/lover. If there was anything of note to explain this craziness let me know (family dynamic, something said). I did see Dad hit Bryan, and no that doesn't equate to abuse in their childhood, the father hates him now because of the incest and is just an angry old man. I did hear that sad ass voicemail where she was like...'ummm the sex we had last week..yea, lets forget that. Until next time we both disgustingly desperate.'

Edited November 10, 2015 by jvr

[jvr]

Even a childhood photo of little Bryan and little Claire together made me nauseous lol. What is known cannot be unknown. Who knows when this started. 

 

So they tried to show us some backstory on their upbringing with the home videos, looked like some level of emotional abuse with a drunk daddy...did not instill any sympathy in me though, not enough. These two are so fucking creepy, break this nasty cycle!

 

Yes Claire, if that baby looked anything like your brother and with the addition of too many shared genes...it may literally have been a monster.

 

Kiira finally let her husband get some now that she isn't dancing anymore. Good for him.

 

Glass in her slipper? wtf...anyone got any thoughts on that? Hallucination?

 

Liked seeing actual dancing this last episode and all the practice moments we saw come together into a complete piece. I'll leave the critique of the dancing to the experts.

 

Bryan actually called Romeo crazy? lmao...anyway...Romeo was truly the hero of the story.

 

So happy this is over and I am done! Yay! I'll come back every so often to read comments as others suffer along.

[racked]

I just binged the whole series and I'm not sure what the spoiler policy is for the All Episodes discussion so to be safe I'll leave my thoughts here.

There were things I loved about the show - the dancing was beautiful, the actress who played Claire was excellent and I did enjoy the darkness though it felt artificially gratuitous at times. I know she was cliche but I loved Kira! Especially watching her dance, she was phenomenal.

Way way too much Romeo. Through the whole season. He wasn't charming or endearing and they spent an insane amount of screen time on him. I wish they could let us watch more of the dancing without interspersing it with other dramatic/annoying moments. It seemed like they started with Brian as a straight up molesting psychopath, but switched gears midway through to make the situation a bit more Flowers in the Attic. I don't mind that though, Claire is way more interesting that way than just as some timid ingenue. She's completely nuts but they have her be lucid and self righteous at times. If it gets a second season they really need to decide who they want her character to be.

I guess I would prefer more Center Stage/Fame and less Black Swan if the show comes back.

[WatchrTina]

Hmmmm. I think it's interesting that you've all posted mostly positive reviews. I really WANT to love this show. I am totally in the target market. But so far I don't love it. I just keep scoffing at everything. The artistic director deciding that she's a STAR! after one adagio? Seriously? And she's so trigger happy about inappropriate touching that she whacks a guy in a bar upside the head with a beer bottle when he touches her hair but she's able to flirt like a champion with the big donor? I"m just not buying it. Yet. I'll hang in for all the positives you've already listed but I really hope this improves.

BTW -- the Artistic Director? He cannot act. Or perhaps he can but the script is so bad he can't do anything with it. I cringe the whole time he is on camera. Here's hoping THAT improves.

 

ETA:  Okay, upon further reflection I've realized that when Claire trips and falls and spills wine on Monsieur Le Big Donor she didn't do it on purpose to coquettishly throw herself into his arms. She -- a professionally graceful person -- just happened to trip and fall and break the heel of a very expensive pair of shoes at just the perfect moment to be delightfully clumsy and charming to Le Grand Fromage.  Mon Dieu!  How much willful suspension of disbelief am I supposed to bring to this party?

Edited November 10, 2015 by WatchrTina

[numbnut]

It seemed like they started with Brian as a straight up molesting psychopath, but switched gears midway through to make the situation a bit more Flowers in the Attic. I don't mind that though, Claire is way more interesting that way than just as some timid ingenue. She's completely nuts but they have her be lucid and self righteous at times. If it gets a second season they really need to decide who they want her character to be.

 

ITA. The characters were definitely uneven, so I was less invested with each episode. When the sexually adventurous Mia freaked out with that guy in the bathroom stall after her night(mare) with Brian, I thought, "Wait, isn't that Claire's issue?" A tightly scripted show would avoid that overlap.

[WatchrTina]

 

I agree - don't just accept random drugs from people, not ask what they are, and then take them.

Yeah, that really bugged me although I guess that's supposed to be a clue about both Claire's poor judgement and her desperation to escape from abusive situations.  BTW, Drunk/Drugged!Claire has a completely different personality than Sober!Claire -- in a way that did not ring true.  I call bad writing.

 

I need more ballet! More dancing dammit! This show is depressing and dark.

 

True dat!  

 

Also there are too many body fluids on camera.  I can do without close-ups of puke AND gross dancer toes (again).  And what the actual fuck is up with Claire and the weird kiss marks on mirrors?  Do I recall correctly that in the first episode she put leftover lube out of a condom wrapper on her lips?  And in this episode she put nasty toe blood on them and then kissed the mirror?  Ew.  Just ew.

 

The artistic director is continuing to bug the crap out of me.  Cringe-worthy acting and/or writing.  

 

I really want to like this show but so far, I'm really not.  I no longer wonder why this was shelved for two years.

 

ETA: Okay I"ve been totally negative about this show.  Let me compliment a few things.  The non-verbal battle in the bathroom was excellent.  Oh, you're going to stalk through the room naked to show off both your body and your indifference to my presence?  Here, let me don my brand-new-fuck-me-shoes from the powerful donor like you're not even here (you know you wish you were me).  And I'll take your lipstick thankyouverymuch.  

 

I also loved the older prima ballerina saying she had to get back to the school so she could piss on her turf (or words to that effect.)

 

The big donor's non-verbal dismissal of Claire's cheap tie was also nicely done.  And the hotel "foreplay" scene was actually really well shot  -- both erotic (the lead actress has a lovely body) and genuinely disturbing (gah, that donor was such a creep.)  Aaaannnd now I'm back to the puke. Damn I'm annoyed to have that image in my head.

Edited November 10, 2015 by WatchrTina

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Okay, upon further reflection I've realized that when Claire trips and falls and spills wine on Monsieur Le Big Donor she didn't do it on purpose to coquettishly throw herself into his arms. She -- a professionally graceful person -- just happened to trip and fall and break the heel of a very expensive pair of shoes at just the perfect moment to be delightfully clumsy and charming to Le Grand Fromage. Mon Dieu! How much willful suspension of disbelief am I supposed to bring to this party?

I know a lot of professional performers/dancers and you'd be surprised how clumsy they are outside the studio/off stage. We're talking tripping over their own feet, on cracks in the sidewalk, walking into doorways and walks, etc. Apparently when they aren't focused on being coordinated, they are total klutzes.

Edited November 10, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[adam807]

BTW -- the Artistic Director? He cannot act. Or perhaps he can but the script is so bad he can't do anything with it. I cringe the whole time he is on camera. Here's hoping THAT improves.

 

 

I've seen him in other things (on stage) and I think this is primarily an accent issue. Which is bizarre -- why not just let the character be British? 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I would understand it more if he were related to another character who is American but since that's not the case, I agree that there's no reason not to let the character be British so the actor can use his real accent. I have this issue with a lot of actors/shows though.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Mia: I wonder if frog dick tastes like chicken too.

Monica: Kerwyn Voss is sort of a pretentious douche. Okay, not sort of, but don't be intimidated. He likely got pummeled in dodgeball one too many times.

Kerywyn: So I assume Polish Hill is pretty Polish.
Claire: Polish and hilly.

Edited May 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo
Fixed wonky spacing after forum upgrade

[Pestilentia]

 

BTW -- the Artistic Director? He cannot act. Or perhaps he can but the script is so bad he can't do anything with it. I cringe the whole time he is on camera. Here's hoping THAT improves.

 

I thought he did a good job, particularly during Claire's final audition piece where we never saw her dancing, just a long shot of his face. I've watched that several times and appreciate being able to see his wheels turning as he watches her.

 

I think he looks and sounds like a gay Liam Neeson.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I know Claire didn't want to keep those Louboutins, but dude, walking the streets of New York barefoot? The germaphobe in me was so grossed out, especially knowing that she had that nasty open wound on her toe.

 

I know some choreographers prefer to work barefoot (I had one teacher who was totally into that "feel the floor through every part of your feet" thing too) but I haaaaaate it for multiple reasons, one of which is my aforementioned germaphobia. Again I feel I must point out that Claire has an open wound on her foot so being barefoot seems like a great way to get it infected.

 

I forgot to mention this after watching the previous episode but damn, that is the nicest strip club I've ever seen. The giant screen in the back is something you usually see in night clubs - but I guess maybe that's what you see in strip clubs now too? I hope that Sergei doesn't turn out to be a creepy/violent/pervert/rapist too, but so far it seems like all the guys are gross. Ir's sad when Romeo is the nicest guy on the show.

 

Laurent is super gross. Pulling his donation because he didn't get to fuck the dancer of his choice, blech. The ballet company is not a brothel, dude. I'm curious as to how he was able to pull his donation this late into the season. Usually donations for the current season are made during the previous season, and once the money is given (as in the check is cashed), you can't really ask for a refund. If they had the gala in the first episode, that would make me assume that Laurent had already donated the money and it was a done deal. Plus it makes him look super pissy to resign his chairman position at this point. I wonder what he told his wife. I'm so used to him playing a nice guy (Cass on Another World) that I'm kind of relived I don't have to see him being a creepy predator anymore. But hey, it's early in the season so he could always come back and perv on someone else in the company.

 

I'm guessing that Daphne's proposition for Sergei is providing the $250K the company needs, but first of all how is she going to give the money to Paul without arousing suspicions? She can't just hand him a stack of cash. I guess she could get a cashier's check and then tell Paul that her father wants to remain an anonymous donor so that his name isn't listed in the programs and on the website. But what is Sergei going to ask Daphne for in return for his donation?

 

I liked that the bouncer at the strip club asked Claire if she was sure she wanted to see Sergei. Maybe he can join Romeo's "we're not total jerkwads" club.

 

Normally I'm not crazy about the cliche of the shy/withdrawn girl getting on the stage of the strip club and losing her inhibitions but given how messed up Claire, is I buy it. I could see her dissociating.

 

Oh, Monica, this is exactly why you aren't supposed to give out personal information about your employees!

 

Was Bryan's motivation to upset Claire or was it that he just couldn't turn down a blow job from her roommate?

 

I can't tell if the reporter was annoyed enough with Claire to do some digging to try to find some dirt or not. One thing I will say about Kiira is that at least she knows being a prima is not just about the dancing. She knows dealing with the press is part of the job.

 

While we know that Claire's brother is a violent weirdo, I hate that the nannies kicked him out of the park. Not everyone who goes to a park without a kid is a pervert. I understand wanting to keep out the creepy creepers, which is why there are parks that have signs specifically saying you can't come in unless you have a kid, but if you aren't at one of those parks then it's rude to harangue people into leaving. As a non-pervert who doesn't have kids but likes parks (and still goes to parks), it sucks when I can't go to one but I respect the rules if they are posted. If there aren't any signs saying I can't be there without a kid, then sorry, I'm going!

Edited November 10, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Mhl2016]

. I'm so used to him playing a nice guy (Cass on Another World)

Thank you!! That was killing me

[racked]

While we know that Claire's brother is a violent weirdo, I hate that the nannies kicked him out of the park. Not everyone who goes to a park without a kid is a pervert. I understand wanting to keep out the creepy creepers, which is why there are parks that have signs specifically saying you can't come in unless you have a kid, but if you aren't at one of those parks then it's rude to harangue people into leaving. As a non-pervert who doesn't have kids but likes parks (and still goes to parks), it sucks when I can't go to one but I respect the rules if they are posted. If there aren't any signs saying I can't be there without a kid, then sorry, I'm going!

It wasn't so much a park as a playground, which yes here in NYC is all you get in a lot of neighborhoods if you want to sit on a bench and mess around on your phone. But he's a big creepy looking man (the actor seriously looks distractingly like a shark) who was staring at these little kids. I was all for the women chasing him out.

[racked]

ITA. The characters were definitely uneven, so I was less invested with each episode. When the sexually adventurous Mia freaked out with that guy in the bathroom stall after her night(mare) with Brian, I thought, "Wait, isn't that Claire's issue?" A tightly scripted show would avoid that overlap.

Right? And then Claire invites him back to their apartment! I did appreciate her calling him a monster and saying their baby was a monster.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Trey: You know how I abhor gossip so I'm only going to say this once but Emil and Dex my Parisian friends told me when Toni worked over there she made the whole company rehearse Don Q in the butt fucking nude. What? You think I'm lying?
Blonde dancer: No, I just can't believe you managed to work the Parisian friends into another conversation.
Trey: Close your legs, girl. All that envy is pouring out your vag. I can't help that I'm a global phenomenon.
Brunette dancer: Getting bukkaked by an Air France flight crew doesn't make you a phenomenon. It makes you a slut.
Trey: But I'm a phenomenal slut.

Yasmine: I'm just saying, you gotta know your audience. Takes all kinds. I mean, you got your cock waggers, your jack in the boxes, and the seals, and them motherfuckers will try to bite you. And then you got your saviors. Don't even get me started on them. And whatever you do, don't buy none of this "I'm not a strip club kind of guy." Bullshit. What? They kidnap you? You here for the buffet, motherfucker?

Yasmine: A snow white girl like you? You're gonna have to bleach that asshole.

Bryan: She's my sister.
Mia: You ever think that word means more to you than it does to her?

Kiira: Drop me and they will never find your body.

Toni: You're avoiding me.
Paul: Why would I avoid you when I love you? That makes no sense.

Paul: Not everyone responds to this whole downtown power dyke Vagina Monologue thing you do. Not that there's anything wrong with that. It's great. You're a genius. I love it. You know I do.

Edited May 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo
Fixed wonky spacing after forum upgrade

[WatchrTina]

Hey Pestilentia, I think it's interesting that that is your reaction because in the comments for the next episode I observe that some of my favorite moments in this show are the non-verbal ones.  I think that's as much a criticism of the writing as it is a complement to the acting and directing but yes, watching the Artistic Director react to Claire's dancing was a nice moment.  It was also a clever fake-out for me because I thought "Oh, okay, this is like Black Swan where the lead actress has enough training to pass as a ballerina in close-ups and warm ups but we'll never see her doing the really hard stuff -- they'll use a body double for that."  Surprise!  She  is a fully qualified ballerina and quite a lovely one too -- which we finally see during her post-Yankee-Doodle solo-adagio.  Nicely done by the director/editor.

 

It's interesting that Claire's best performances come when she's stressed out and distraught (when she thinks she's not going be allowed to do her final solo audition and when the artistic director threatens to throw her out after the cell phone incident.)  It's also interesting that one of the dancers calls her on it -- telling she only looked good during the adagio because she was able to take all that stress and emotion and imbue her dancing with it.  Does this mean someone is going to have to traumatize Claire before every performance in order for her to give her best?  I hope not.  Then again, she seems sufficiently damaged to be able to tap in prior trauma as needed.  Hmm. I've gone negative again.  But this show really IS dark.

Edited November 10, 2015 by WatchrTina

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Bryan: I got no money. I got no job.

Me: You got no woman and there you are! Don't just stand there. Bust a move!

 

One thing I don't like is that we're halfway through the series and I feel like they are telling us rather than showing us why Claire is so special. This is nothing against Sarah Hay's dancing either. But when she had to dance for her life in the first episode, all we saw was Paul's face. Since then, we have seen her do a little bit of barre work, a little bit of adagio and allegro, a lift combo with Ross when he tried to cop a feel, and then finally some dancing during Toni's rehearsal. I feel like we just haven't seen enough of her dancing to understand why Paul thinks she's amazing enough to commission a new ballet for her. Then in this episode we had Sergei telling her she doesn't know what she has.

 

What is this Flowers in the Attic craziness? I mean seriously, ballerina who runs off to New York to join a ballet company and escape her brother's creepy love and has to keep telling him to go away.

 

Mia is a bitch but I felt bad for her. She did not know what she was getting into with Bryan. What a scary dude.

 

Re: Claire's strip club friend - even though Yasmine told her not to believe the guys who claim they're not strip club guys, I kind of believe him since all he was fine just talking to her instead of getting lap dances. A girl I knew in college had a phone sex job and she said that most of her regulars just wanted someone to talk to.

 

I appreciate that the bouncers initially told Bryan to just go because they didn't want to have to kick his ass. I know it's their job and all but that doesn't mean that all bouncers want to kick the shit out of people in alleys.

[Primetimer]

After a promising premiere, Flesh And Bone is already going over the same steps.

Read the story

[meep.meep]

It's kind of Black Swan meets Smash meets the video for Broken Wing.  The dancing is good.

 

Has no one on the production side ever had sex?  They showed three "encounters" and they were all of the loud overly energetic bouncing  and thrashing variety.  Where are the L-shaped sheets and the slow seduction?

 

I'm not sure I'd want Dewey Crowe living underneath my apartment building. 

[RedHackle]

 

The artistic director deciding that she's a STAR! after one adagio? Seriously? And she's so trigger happy about inappropriate touching that she whacks a guy in a bar upside the head with a beer bottle when he touches her hair but she's able to flirt like a champion with the big donor? I"m just not buying it.

This. Exactly. I just caught the first episode last night.  And while I was riveted, I did have a couple of things tugging at me, and you hit them on the head, Watchr Tina.  (A quick BTW, love your plaid!) 

 

Based on the industrial strength lock we saw on Claire's door, we know she's the victim of sexual abuse (confirmed by her Uber Creep brother) but then if that's the case, I would expect her to have a better poker face. I love that they demonstrate how physically tough she is, but the sexual abuse survivors I know (far too many to count) tend to not wear their vulnerability on their face.

 

And I may not know much, but I'm pretty sure if you break a bottle over another patron's face in a strip club, the owner isn't likely to apologize to you.  Maybe I'm wrong about that.  If so, I guess I need to hang around strip clubs more, because they must very nice, sympathetic people.

[inyourmarrow]

Binge watched the whole thing yesterday. The entire series had me anxiety-ridden from start to finish. I was literally waiting for each and everyone of these characters to shatter like glass.

 

I'm SO GLAD the "big thing that happened" happened at the end. IMO, the writers backed themselves into a corner with that whole "flowers in the attic" approach to this storyline. In order for Claire to develop (and to re-establish sympathy), we need to move forward. So good call.

 

Overall, this season was convoluted and uneven in storylines and development. With tighter writing, there's some really good stuff there to be mined, should they get (I hope) a second season. Thankfully, the dancing that we got to see was beyond exquisite. As it should/is expected to be. I don't know what to make of that final exchange between Paul and Claire, and why they chose to end it there. 

[adam807]

Ummm... you don't need to destroy your entire phone to change your number. 

 

And in fact, even if you did destroy your phone, a person calling it would still get your voicemail, not a "this phone is not in service" number unless she then borrowed Mia's phone or went online and cancelled her account. It didn't make it into the post but my notes included "THAT'S NOT HOW CELL PHONES WORK, SHOW!"

[Arynm]

I'm so over the brother. I'm glad she told the bouncers to keep beating him. He is just so gross. I like the strip club guy. He seems like a stand up guy. I guess time will tell.

[Arynm]

Finally some dancing! Swan lake was beautiful. More please! Of course the Russian is a sex trafficker. Poor girls!

[bourbon]

I entered this excited and optimistic that I was watching something fun and soapy like Fame or something gritty about the cutthroat world of ballet like Turning Point. Instead it was some psychodrama like Black Swan. Except it was not creatively weird enough to be Black Swan and not fun enough to be Fame. It existed in some odd netherworld of misbegotten shows. I don't feel like the creators ever really decided what it was going to be and what Claire was going to be.  

 

It had so much potential, even with the tropes and cliches, and the dancing was gorgeous. 

[WatchrTina]

Well I'm feeling very mixed about this episode.

 

THE GOOD

 

The suspense was killing me.  Claire's brother was closing in on her like a shark circling his prey the whole freaking episode.  The chase down the stairs got my heart pumping and when he grabbed her I was yelling at the screen for her to scream, scratch his eyes, something!  But no, they just go back upstairs, not talking,  make a sandwich, not talking, make up a bed on the couch, not talking except to say goodnight . . . and then is RIGHT THERE on the floor next to her.  Oh. My. God. That whole sequence just creeped me out.  Strangely enough, Romeo watching from outside actually struck me as comforting, which goes to show how disturbing this show is.

 

Claire's pole dance was very sexy . . . right up until she ended with the whole deer-in-the-headlights moment.  The whole thing was surreal and unbelievable but in a good, David Lynch / Twin Peaks kind of way.

 

I liked the bit of Daphne's life that we got to see (though her Dad is a douche) and I'm VERY curious to find out what her proposition is to the strip club owner.  This story line has potential.

 

THE BAD

 

Yea gods, that poor Artistic Director.  The writing for him is crap.  Throwing the baby birds out the window?  Throwing eggs at his former partner's (former lover's?) headstone?  Shrieking at Claire to GET OUT!  Dreadful.

 

Why did Claire go to visit the owner of the strip club?  I kept waiting for her to say why she asked to see him.  Did she just want to hang out with him?  I know the plot needed her in the club so that she could have her moment on the pole but that stilted conversation between her and the owner was weird and NOT in a good David Lynch / Twin Peaks kind of way.  More in a bad writing kind of way.

 

THE UGLY

 

Aaaand they felt the need to show both the gnarly toe injury and the puking in the "previously on Flesh & Bone" section.   Ugh.

 

 

I know Claire didn't want to keep those Louboutins, but dude, walking the streets of New York barefoot? The germaphobe in me was so grossed out, especially knowing that she had that nasty open wound on her toe.

 Oh gosh yes.  I lived in NYC for 20 years and that is just gross.

 

 

Was Bryan's motivation to upset Claire or was it that he just couldn't turn down a blow job from her roommate?

I think he has a fierce attraction to ballet bodies due to their similarly to the object of his obsession and he was also pretty keyed up anticipating seeing Claire, so when a slutty ballerina offered up a BJ the temptation was just too great to pass up.

 

I have to say I was surprised that the actress/dancer who plays Claire has such a nice rack.  I thought the low body-fat ratio of a professional ballerina pretty much guaranteed an A-cup chest.  

Edited November 11, 2015 by WatchrTina

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I didn't feel too bad for Ross when Paul was trying to cop a feel during rehearsal since Ross did the same thing to Claire, but then I felt bad for Ross when Paul pulled him from partnering Kiira and was clearly so gleeful about it. I know this sounds hypocritical but the sexual harassment was one thing and taking away a part is another.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Paul: Viagra on pointe shoes. Angels, we're relying on you. Please engorge me.

Mia: It's my eye. One's not working right. No big deal.
Pasha: You know this how? You're a doctor? You have medical degree?

Pasha: My ophthalmologist. He's Chinaman but still not bad.

Daphne: Yo, angel. Not bad work for a stripper skank!
Claire: Thanks. I hope Kiira doesn't throw acid in my face.
Daphne: Acid's a Moscow thing. That bitch is Ukrainian.

Eduardo: You're gonna drink. You're gonna dance. No more poopy face tonight.

Ophthalmologist: Do you have any history of substance abuse?
Mia: Diet pills, laxatives. Do those count?
Ophthalmologist: Yes. What about stress? Any undue pressures from work or at home?
Mia: Are you shitting me?

Mia: So I just need to eat more, right? This happened to a girl last season. She went blind right before she got a serious case of the runs. Her colon was perforated. She had to go to the hospital and she lost her place in the corps. She auditioned again this year but the hospital food porked her out. She's a waitress at Hooters now. They make good money but I don't think they're that pretty.

Mia's mom: Nice tits. They real?

Trey: You know how straight boys are, always so touchy about their dance belts.

Paul: You actually believe those lilies will protect your faggoty ass from being fired?
Trey: No, I think the whistleblower protection act will protect my faggoty ass.

Mia: What's your name, handsome?
Nick: Nick. Nick Coleman.
Mia: Of the Westchester Colemans?
Nick: You know my family?
Mia: I'm fucking with you. Mia Bialy of the Jersey Bialys. Exit 15 off the turnpike.

Edited May 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo
Fixed wonky spacing after forum upgrade

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I have found that I enjoy Paul more when I view all of his dialogue as intentionally campy. His whole viagra on pointe shoes/engorge me speech is ridiculous if taken seriously but hilarious if taken as comedy.

 

I wish they would give Sarah Hays more to do besides look like she's on the verge of tears because when they let her do more, I enjoy her acting more. I blame a lot of the problems with this show on the writing. For example, in the previous episode, Toni was telling Claire to loosen up and then in this episode Claire was happy to see Toni at the photoshoot. Then all it took to make Claire smile was for Toni to take down her hair. What is this? Some teen movie where the nerd takes off her glasses and pulls her hair out of a ponytail and suddenly she's hot?

 

I love to read but how are we more than halfway through the series and they haven't explained why the hell Claire insists on sleeping with all of her books on top of her?

 

As gross as Claire's toe was, one of my fears is losing my vision so even though Mia's trip to the eye doctor wasn't graphic, I was silently freaking out. I still don't like Mia, but it sucks to get ditched by your mom at a bar. Ugh, and her mom is one of those annoying moms who thinks her daughter isn't good enough and pretends that they're sisters. No wonder Mia is such a messed up little bitch. But yay for Pasha!

 

After Eduardo gave Paul the whole "I know you" speech in bed, I was afraid that Paul was going to murder him in his sleep. Ha, I already liked Eduardo but after shitting on Paul's pillow, I love him! I think that was a failure on both their parts though. As Sergei warned his girls, you can't get personally involved with your clients. Eduardo and Paul both had to know this relationship wouldn't end well once they crossed the line past Eduardo being his on call fuck.

 

I must be gullible as hell because at first I thought Trey was going to Paul to try to help Ross.

 

Nick Coleman can fuck right off. A girl is not crazy for making out with you and then deciding she doesn't want to have sex with you in a bathroom stall. I hate seeing guys who act like they're entitled to sex. Guess what, dude? She can tell you to stop at any time and that doesn't make her crazy.

 

In previous episodes, I liked the camera work during the dance scenes but I hated the camera work in this one. Like Sergei, I love Swan Lake so I wanted to see Claire and Daphne's dancing. I didn't like all the closeups and the shots with people's heads in the shots. I wish they had shown Daphne dancing. I wanted to see her doing the black swan's 32 fouettes, damn it.

 

When Cameron invited Claire to his work event and then Sergei wanted Daphne and Claire to perform for him on the same night, I was convinced that the two events would end up being the same and that no matter which one she decided to say yes to, she would end up being caught (either by Sergei finding out she was seeing a client outside the club or by Cameron finding out she was a ballerina). When she was taking publicity photos for the new ballet, I wondered how long before Cameron sees them and finds out her real name.

 

So Kiira is married to nice guy Prescott but screwing Paul and off doing coke? Giiiiirl.

 

And Claire, come on. You had the bouncers beat the shit out of your brother after you told him to go away. Do not send him mixed messages by calling him. I know this is more complicated than a regular breakup but dude, you told him to leave you alone and he's probably pretty mad at you so DO NOT ENGAGE.

Edited November 11, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ivana: You eat disgusting things, your baby will have shit for brains.
Monica: My baby will be an enlightened being with a caustic wit and opposable thumbs.

Trey: Where's home for you?
Claire: Pittsburgh.
Trey: Steeltown? Yikes.

Patrice: Is that a bratwurst in a sweater? Is she going to give birth to a walrus?
Brunette dancer: She's like a walking mailbox with arms.
Claire: She's beautiful. She's fucking pregnant. Have some respect.

Paul: That was terrorism.

Prescott's mother: Deer poop! Don't be fooled by that species' overrated so-called elegance. They're actually long-legged rodents with pretty eyes. Speaking of shit, Prescott, tomorrow when you go see your father and Brenda or Janet or Yum Yum or whatever post graduate anorectic scurvy he's arranging in his yoga room these days, please tell them that I still need to get the wooden braces for my old tennis rackets.

Claire: Where's the pepper mill?
[Bryan hands her the pepper]
Claire: That's the spice rack.
Bryan: Yeah, pepper's a spice.
Claire: Pepper's not a spice. It's a seasoning.

Jessica: Sweetheart, eat your cranberry sauce.
Molly: It looks like blood.
Jessica: Don't be silly.
Molly: Blood from a smelly pig's butt.

Reggie: So your family had a black lab named Derek Jeter.
Trey: And a black cat named Sambo.
Reggie: That's messed up.
Trey: Ironically my mother didn't get the irony.

Edited May 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo
Fixed wonky spacing after forum upgrade

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Ha, I love how all of the other military terms used as episode titles were explained but this one just said "military acronym." You can show boobs and incest sex but you can't put the word "FUCK" onscreen?

 

I don't like when mental illness is used as a plot device, but I like that Dewey Crowe uses a fountain pen.

 

Yay for more dancing! But gawd, Paul and Kiira are the worst! Toni is nice enough to end rehearsal early so everyone can leave for Thanksgiving and fucking Paul has to make everyone stay out of spite. This is why you get the hell out of there immediately, people! And of course Kiira takes advantage of her prima status to breeze out of there. Look, I get if there are corrections that need to be made, but "Stop, again," offers no feedback whatsoever. Tell them what you want them to do differently or stop being such a sadistic jerk. Just because you are a sad, lonely, miserable asshole with no plans for Thanksgiving doesn't mean you should torture your entire company. It's actually terrible to overwork them like that because it's just inviting fatigue and injury. And ugh, forcing them to throw him a surprise Thanksgiving party? THE WORST. And poor Trey. Hope the lead in Rubies was worth it, dude.

 

Poor Mona. Not only did she get fired the day before Thanksgiving but when she asked if she did anything wrong, he just told her to go away. Seeing what a maniac he was after she left, Eduardo is lucky he got away from this psycho.

 

The camera work during the dancing was so great during the first few episodes but in the previous episode and this episode, they started doing too many closeups for my taste. Back up, camera people! And way too much handheld camera work too (not just in the dance scenes but also in the  scenes at Claire's house and Romeo on the roof - I was on the verge of getting seasick watching some of it). I know, I know, it's the director's fault, but still. At least I get to see Alex Wong!

 

Jessica, you just got a check for $35K. Please go buy a 99 cent letter opener instead of using a kitchen knife to open your mail.

 

Woo, Kelly Bishop! Loved her deer rant.

 

I know I have watched too many soap operas with murder and mayhem because when Claire's dad picked up the electric knife to slice the turkey, I was expecting someone at that table to get stabbed before Thanksgiving dinner was over.

 

Similarly, when Claire pulled that box out of the floor of her closet, I was expecting to see her aborted incest fetus in it. I noticed the Flowers in the Attic similarities in one of the previous episodes but to throw in a baby on top of all that (although to be fair, in FiTA, Catherine miscarried). What's next? Claire marries an old doctor or an abusive dancer while Bryan becomes a doctor? Okay, not likely on either count, but still.

 

I've been waiting to see who attempted suicide first: Mia, Bryan, Romeo, Paul, or Eduardo. I guess this episode answered that question! I knew as soon as the ophthalmologist sent her to a neurologist that this was going to end up being a brain tumor or something beyond that she needed to eat more.

 

ETA: I do not care about Jessica's home life, her ex-husband, or her bratty daughter.

Edited November 11, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I am not judging Daphne or Claire for dancing at Sergei's club. Like, at all. But what I do judge them for is walking around with flyers and matches from their club for people like Bryan and Jessica to find. Strip club is like fight club - if you want to keep it a secret, then keep it a secret. That means don't carry around evidence of it.

 

But I totally loved that Daphne refused to give Jessica the identity of the donor and I really loved that when Jessica tried to guilt trip Daphne about her responsibility to the company, Daphne reminded her that her only actual responsibility was to dance, stay skinny, and go to rehearsal. We only saw a tiny bit of Daphne's with her father so I don't want to make too many assumptions about Daphne's childhood or her relationship with her father, but it was bitchy of Jessica to assume that Daphne is rich just because her father has money. Yes, a lot of parents support their kids (especially dancers since they make so little) but Jessica was totally out of line. It's not Daphne's responsibility to find donors.

 

Jessica has the worst poker face. Love that Sergei immediately knew she had embezzled.

 

One thing this show captured was how neverending and tedious tech rehearsal is.

 

Ha, Romeo has a rope to slide down from the roof to the ground. He's like a homeless Batman.

 

While I buy that Paul called Claire's last company to ask why she left, I seriously doubt that HR would say, "By the way, there are rumors in our tiny town of Pittsburgh (population 2 million) that she was fucking her brother. But you didn't hear that from me!"

 

Paul can DIAF. I am tired of his smug sadistic power trips.

 

I actually preferred Kira's dancing over Claire's during dress rehearsal. I HATED the camera work during Claire's performance. Seriously, you guys, stop trying to be artsy. Just let me see them dance.

 

It would be one thing if Kiira came to her senses and decided not to dance in the A cast of Dakini because of her injury, but instead her decision was based on jealousy and insecurity. The way she cleaned out her dressing room made it seem like she isn't just skipping out on this particular show. It looked like she was planning to leave the company entirely which you kind of can't do after the season starts since you have a contract. I guess she can always use her injury as an excuse to retire, but you'd think that she would want one last glorious performance.

 

I don't get the back and forth with Claire and Bryan. He was so desperate to see her after he got discharged but now when Claire is calling him, he doesn't answer his phone and doesn't want to go to New York to see her? I thought for sure he was going to conveniently let his dad fall and hit his head while he was helping him out of the bathtub.

 

I'm just glad Claire only cut her hair. I was afraid she was going to cut herself again. Paul is going to have a shit fit when he sees her hair. Most ballet companies have a clause that says the dancers can't make significant changes to their appearance. I guess they can always give her a fall or a faux bun for performance.

Edited November 11, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Paul: I'm handing the kid a cat turd in a bowl of milk.

Jessica: This is your company too, Daphne. We're all responsible for what happens to it.
Daphne: You know what I'm responsible for? I'm responsible for dancing to the best of my ability, for keeping my weight a few pounds over malnourished, for showing up to rehearsals on time.

Kiira: A little pain is a fact of this life. To feel it is a choice. I choose no.

Paul: Imagine you haven't all fucked each other blind in the bathrooms, please.

Paul: I've died and gone to Stevie Nicks' house.

Paul: What is that, a kilt?
Gregson: Unbifurcated garments allow increased freedom and mobility.

Paul: When can I look forward to this gadget arriving?
Tech: Let's see. It's pretty late.
Reggie: It's 2:45.

Edited May 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo
Fixed wonky spacing after forum upgrade

[Maximona]

Chestiness is actually the reason why Sarah Hay ended up dancing in Dresden and not NYC.

 

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Daphne: So you know how i'm the only girl in the company you haven't fucked? If you make me look good tonight, there is an epic blow job in your future.
Matilda: Ahem.

Pasha: You will get bedsores. Not sexy.

Mia: Every thing I have done every fucking day of my entire fucking life is officially fucking pointless.
Pasha: Five years is lifetime for ballerina. Every dancer retires young.

Mia: I'll never be a prima.
Pasha: You were never going to be prima. But always you will be smart and funny and world class piece of ass.

Paul: Tell me. Tell me everything you're feeling.
Claire: No.

Edited May 10, 2018 by ElectricBoogaloo
Fixed wonky spacing after forum upgrade

[ElectricBoogaloo]

So Romeo sleeps in a kayak and covers himself with bottlecaps? Uhhhh, okay. Maybe that's why he and Claire get along so well. He sleeps under a blanket of bottlecaps and she sleeps under a pile of books.

 

A few episodes ago when she told Mia that she hadn't seen Romeo but that she heard him up on the roof, I wondered why she didn't just go up to the roof if she knew he was up there. Similarly in this episode, I thought it was kind of rude of her to open her window and yell up to Romeo because she wanted to talk to him. Walk your lazy ass up there! And then when he came down, she made him stay out on the fire escape instead of letting him come inside. But I'm glad she told him that he was the hero for rescuing Mia. Man, Romeo has all kinds of mad skillz. He can sew, draw, repurpose books, etc. plus he's psychic!

 

Reggie must be the most patient, tolerant guy to work for Paul without throwing things at him on a daily basis.  I had to laugh when Paul saw Claire's hair and was genuinely concerned that she had lost her mind or had a stroke.

 

This show gets the details right in a lot of ways but fitting Daphne for her Rubies costume the day of the show? No. There is always a B cast and if Daphne was supposed to dance that role in the B cast, she would already have a costume, just like Claire would already have a costume for Dakini. And it's very unlikely that Ross would have danced the lead in both Rubies and Dakini on the same night, but I'm not going to complain about getting to see Sascha Radetsky dance in both. And shirtless in Dakini - thanks, show!

 

So did Claire tell Bryan he was a monster because she was doing one of those noble White Fang things?

 

Pasha is the best. I'm glad he helped Mia realize that being a dancer doesn't mean she has to be on the stage. I also liked his honesty when she started crying about how she'd never be a prima ballerina.

 

Jessica can DIAF with Paul. When he told the company, "I am but your humble servant," as part of his pre-show pep talk, I just rolled my eyes. Yes, a humble servant who is also a terrorist.

 

What was with Claire's 30 minute call after Rubies ended? Did they have an hourlong intermission?

 

So glad that most of the camera work during the big performance was long shots so we could see the dancers' legs and the formations.

 

Interesting that the backdrop for Claire's performance was a giant U-shaped piece of fabric with blue lighting while Bryan was under a an upside down U with blue lighting. I was glad when Bryan told Claire he was leaving because it seemed like he was trying to do the right thing by ending things between them. I actually thought that he was going to kill himself after he left so I wonder if Romeo really had to kill him.

 

In the Thanksgiving episode, I tried to decipher the tattoo on Bryan's chest but I couldn't make it out. Even though they showed it at great length after Romeo stabbed him I still couldn't tell what it was supposed to say. When Romeo held the knife up to his own chest, I thought he was going to kill himself so I was surprised when all he did was carve the same tattoo onto his own skin.

 

At the very end, I thought Paul was going to try to have sex with Claire so I laughed when he said, "Tell me everything you're feeling," and all she said was, "No."

 

Glass in her slipper? wtf...anyone got any thoughts on that? Hallucination?

It's happened before at the Bolshoi.

Edited November 11, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Primetimer]

Paul stops just short of tying a maiden to some railroad tracks in 'Reconnaissance'; we've ranked all the misdeeds that made it to air.

Read the story

[numbnut]

So did Claire tell Bryan he was a monster because she was doing one of those noble White Fang things?

 

I've never seen White Fang, but Brian's demanor changed when Claire said that she needed him to see the performance so her new life in NYC can feel real. He didn't want her to be emotionally independent, so he did a 180 and decided to bail so Claire would remain stuck in their dysfunction, hence he's a monster. Lashing out about their baby, etc. was her monsterous way of striking back.

 

So glad that most of the camera work during the big performance was long shots so we could see the dancers' legs and the formations.

 

I kept noticing a slight wobble whenever Ross had to balance on one leg, like in the equivalent of yoga eagle or tree poses (I don't know ballet terms). He was the only one so it stood out. The cinematography was strong throughout the series. It was one of the reasons I kept watching.

 

Edited November 11, 2015 by numbnut

[jvr]

 

While I buy that Paul called Claire's last company to ask why she left, I seriously doubt that HR would say, "By the way, there are rumors in our tiny town of Pittsburgh (population 2 million) that she was fucking her brother. But you didn't hear that from me!"

 

I didn't get the sense that Paul knew about Bryan...but that he knew Claire had been pregnant. That is something I could see the previous company knowing and someone there blabbing to Paul. And obviously she is not towing a baby around with her now so..I think Paul was just hinting he knew more than she had revealed about why she left and was maybe implying things he didn't have direct knowledge of because Claire is such a mental case he could take blind guesses.

[LittleIggy]

I thought guys went to strip clubs to watch dancers with ginormous boobs not tiny ballerina ones! ;-) Anyway, I love getting to see the ballet dancing and practicing. The strip club stuff is like Littlefinger's brothel in GoT, laughably gratuitous.