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Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

I can see Laurel going to Oliver to ask him to help her keep her self-defense skills sharp, and him agreeing to that. But Laurel training with Oliver to be a masked vigilante loses me because -- never mind the complete lack of motivation for Laurel -- why on Earth would Oliver agree to that?

 

Because he tends to be an idiot.

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Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

BkWurm1
BkWurm1

I tend to think that trying to make KC a place on the show had a ripple effect that did hurt the show pretty badly.  She's what turned Quentin stupid and into a creepy stalker.  So that wipes off the

calliope1975
calliope1975

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

SA said in the Facebook Q & A that he hopes Oliver doesn't train Felicity because he doesn't want her in (near) danger. I would think the same would apply to Laurel because Felicity would need even more self defense lessons than Laurel seeing as she goes into the field sometimes.

 

I think these are terrible reasons/answers, actually. It's one thing to train them to initiate and/or hold their own in an aggressive fight, it's another to train them to defend themselves. Laurel forgets that she can defend herself when it's convenient to the plot, and we saw Felicity get some training from Digg and some pointers from Sara. Anyone who cares about either one of these women shouldn't want them to be completely defenseless - I mean, I get that context implies "training" to be "preparing them for street fights," but we really do need to see a more proactive approach from all of them regarding Felicity, and to some extent, Laurel. It's all well and good that Oliver likes Felicity to stay out of trouble, but she's been in it more than once and just because he shows her how to trip up an attacker doesn't mean she's going to suit up to raise hell vigilante-style.

 

I'd actually like it if something happened this season where Felicity was able to deter someone physically (by strategically tripping them and/or using some kind of basic self-defense move), and let it out that she took a few self defense classes. I mean, nothing like taking out a member of the LoA or anything, but just...I don't know, putting the hurt on someone's henchman or something. She's savvy - she has to know it would behoove her to learn just a little bit. And it would surprise the hell out of Oliver, which I'm always a fan of.

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calliope1975

calliope1975

Plus, the whole keeping someone "safe" by trying to hide them away, leaving them uninformed, and defenseless NEVER works. By the nature of their work, Digg and Oliver should have been training Felicity from day one. At the very least, I hope Diggle kept up the training even if we never saw it. 

 

If I have to watch Laurel be trained, I hope it's not Oliver. Mostly, because he's terrible at it as we saw with Roy. 

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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

(edited)

Plus, the whole keeping someone "safe" by trying to hide them away, leaving them uninformed, and defenseless NEVER works. By the nature of their work, Digg and Oliver should have been training Felicity from day one. At the very least, I hope Diggle kept up the training even if we never saw it.

 

THIS. Slade figured out where their base of operations was, and the Clock King was able to inflitrate their systems. Felicity is alone in the Arrowcave a lot when the others are out on missions. The least Dig and Oliver have to do is teach Felicity how to defend herself *in the lair*, with one or two pieces from all the weaponry available around her.

 

I'm still thinking about the Oliver training people as a plot point thing. In the comics Oliver does have a whole bunch of sidekicks he trained, so it's not something completely out of thin air. The person I would really love to see Oliver training is Thea, later in the season if/when she gets out of Malcolm's influence. Because I haven't given up on my pet theory that Thea = Artemis yet.

Edited by dancingnancy
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

THIS. Slade figured out where their base of operations was, and the Clock King was able to inflitrate their systems. Felicity is alone in the Arrowcave a lot when the others are out on missions. The least Dig and Oliver have to do is teach Felicity how to defend herself *in the lair*, with one or two pieces from all the weaponry available around her.

 

I'm still thinking about the Oliver training people as a plot point thing. In the comics Oliver does have a whole bunch of sidekicks he trained, so it's not something completely out of thin air. The person I would really love to see Oliver training is Thea, later in the season if/when she gets out of Malcolm's influence. Because I haven't given up on my pet theory that Thea = Artemis yet.

 

Seconded.

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TanyaKay

TanyaKay

I think Lyla dying would be all kinds of messy for the show.  Besides being a kick-ass person, she's the only female character left over 30 and having Diggle a single father would severely limit his ability to be part of Team Arrow, much more than Oliver pushing him away.

 

 

Laurel is supposed to be 30. Both Tommy and Laurel were 28 when the series started making her 30 in third in third season. (I am being nit picky here, I know KC is not 30 in real life

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Guest

Guest

That's interesting about Felicity's parents! I assumed that Mama Smoak was just in the flashbacks but that really implies otherwise. I'm excited about this. Does this mean we'll meet her dad too? I haven't heard of anyone being cast though.

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TanyaKay

TanyaKay

may be not in episode 5 but I am sure that Felicity's parents will spring up in present day Starling City. I mean what's the point in hiring cast and establishing a back story via flashbacks if they do not turn up in present. So far, Slade, Sara and Anatoly has resurfaced in present from the past and Malcolm Merlyn has literally come back after being dead so why not Mommy and Daddy Smoak.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Regarding J.R. Ramirez becoming a regular on another show, I guess that means Ted/Wildcat is going to be either a one-shot character or a recurring character on Arrow this season.  If a one-shot character, then he can't be Laurel's love interest and trainer this season - so who's her love interest then?  The only other new male character we've heard of (who's not Ray Palmer and not in flashbacks) is Ra's al Ghul.  If Ted is going to be a recurring character, then he can be Laurel's love interest and trainer for season 3 only - if he dies near the end of the season and his killer escapes justice on a legal technicality, then that could be her impetus to move forward on her vigilante 'hero' journey (though it would be difficult to reconcile with her legal and ethical obligations as a DA). Having another lover die would also be consistent with Laurel's self-pitying "everyone leaves me" attitude.

Edited by tv echo
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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

I've been thinking about the Lyla dying speculation. I'm going to throw my vote in on No for Lyla, since spoilers indicate that she does have the baby early in the season (a little girl IIRC). Last season I did think they might kill Lyla off - there was some scenes in Suicide Squad that seemed ominous. But now....there's very few shows that will kill a baby. And leaving Diggle as the single father of an infant would be something extremely complicated to pull off. So I think Lyla's safe for now.

The rest....

I do think they may still kill Sara off, if they're really determined on the Laurel Black Canary issue. But if it happens it will be later in the season. She's safe for probably at least the first half of the season, since she's confirmed for at least five episodes so far (I keep seeing six, but I haven't seen a source for that yet).

I do think both Sin and Nyssa are real possibilities however. I still think Nyssa's death is likely to be what causes the war with Ra's, and Sin's death might easily be the thing that Colton Haynes referred to that brings Roy and Sara closer together.

Edited by Starfish35
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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)

According to this the JR Rameriz/Ted Grant  "role is envisioned as a potentially recurring"

 

http://deadline.com/2014/07/arrow-j-r-ramirez-wildcat-casting-cw-811507/

 

So it's quite possible that he might only end up being in the one episode or that he shows up in 303, disappears until after filming ends on Power and then makes another appearance.  He's beginning to sound like Bronze Tiger from S2 (202, 212 and 216).  

 

It's the same situation with the new Count Vertigo, he was listed as a potentially recurring character so he may show up again after 301 but he might not.

Edited by Morrigan2575
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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/flashs-grant-gustin-my-favorite-724921?utm_source=twitter

 

Felicity's (Emily Bett Rickards) drop-by in episode four "does complicate things for Barry," he hints. "We left their relationship on a weird note [on Arrow], but she's also in a weird predicament with Oliver where she clearly loves him. Barry and Felicity clearly have a lot in common but I don't know that any of those relationships are going to work out. At the same time, it's not something he can worry himself with too much right now."

 

This is the only Arrow related part of the interview, the relationships he's talking about are (I believe) Iris/Eddie, Iris/Barry and Barry/Felicity.

 

It's possible they will expand it depending on fan reaction and/or actor availability, I guess.

 

That is what I suspect, I think fandom kind of put more importance on the character than perhaps the EPs intended.

Edited by Morrigan2575
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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)

Yes. at SDCC 2013 they announced Bronze Tiger and Brother Blood as new characters for S2.  Along, with the big Black Canary reveal and the hint that Merlyn might come back...

Edited by Morrigan2575
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TanyaKay

TanyaKay

(edited)

At times they make a lot of noise about a certain character but not much pans out, Sharpnel last season was one of them.

 

I have always assumed that Starmore - the actor playing Count 2.0 - will not feature beyond the season premiere because he has far too many acting commitments. I am sure Oliver will go all savage ninja on him after Felicity's injury and will most probably kill him.

 

Similarly, there was such a lot of brouhaha about the casting of Katana but the interviews and social media chatter says that she has just shot one scene so far with Stephen (that's what SA revealed in one of his interviews) but the actor playing her husband apparently has a more pronounced role and has tweeted about being present in most episodes shot thus far.

Ted Grant, I have a feeling, would be like Brother Blood. That actor was not in Van for most of the time and shot his portions in a bulk during multiple visits. This Ramirez guy can do that too.

Edited by TanyaKay
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Starfish35

Starfish35

(edited)

I didn't think about that. If they shoot a whole lot of scenes with Laurel and Ted together they could then spread them out over the season.

From TVLIne - Oliver's child may not be in season three after all.

http://tvline.com/2014/08/18/arrow-season-3-olivers-child/

Though it was previously suggested that the paternity secret, which in large part died with Moira, would be revisited as early as Season 3, Oliver may have to wait longer to learn of and/or meet his long-lost progeny.

Likening the situation to that of Felicity’s backstory — which until now has barely been teased but will finally be explored this fall — Arrow showrunner Marc Guggenheim explains to TVLine, “Half of our job is coming up with ideas, and the other half is exercising judgement in terms of the right time to play those ideas.”

So in addition to ensuring there is room both on the canvas and within the larger narrative to circle back to Oliver’s kid, “We also need to have that moment happen in the right context. So is it Year 3, is it Year 10…? I don’t know,” Guggenheim says. “We’ve put it out there and we’ve got some cool ideas about where to go with it, should we do it, but we havent committed to actually doing it or even when to do it.”

Kind of sounds to me like they're realizing how much they have going on already.

Edited by Starfish35
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abhi

abhi

(edited)

Just shows that the EPs do not plan things too much, otherwise they wouldn't have dropped one of the major themes of this Season while filming Episode 4.

Edited by abhi
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FurryFury

FurryFury

Kind of sounds to me like they're realizing how much they have going on already.

 

Kind of sounds like it's finally dawned on them how shitty this idea is. Of course, I'm probably thinking too well of them.

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abhi

abhi

(edited)

The change of the title might have to do with Gotham. The title appears to be too melodramatic, would have preferred a simpler one like "Felicity" similar to the "Sara" title.

Edited by abhi
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

From TVLIne - Oliver's child may not be in season three after all.

 

 

Doesn't surprise me at all .  I got the impression they were going to bump it back when they weren't talking about it in the upcoming spoilers they dropped. 

Changed the title of Felicity's episode. The secret origins of Felicity Smoak

 

This was the episode they were calling Oracle, right?  Wonder if that means some idea got nixed by DC.  When Charlotte Ross (cast as Mama Smoak) read her script, her tweet was just a wow and a bigger wow.  Between that and not getting a first name, they are building some expectations that I'm not sure they will be able to meet. 

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Starfish35

Starfish35

Yeah - wonder if DC killed the Oracle title. From the link above:

In the hour, we’ll finally get to meet Felicity’s mother, portrayed by NYPD Blue alum Charlotte Ross. “We’ve established in the past that mom is a cocktail waitress in Vegas,” executive producer Marc Guggenheim says. “She and Felicity are two very different people. Episode 5, which is when Felicity’s mom comes to town, really deals with the differences between these two women and how much of their relationship is a struggle as a result. It’s a real challenge for these two people to find some common ground.”

As for Felicity’s father, fans will have to wait a little longer to get more information. “The mystery of who Felicity’s dad is probably gets extended more than it gets answered,” Guggenheim adds.

So Felicity's mom won't just appear in flashbacks - she'll show up in Starling City.

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DrSpaceman10

DrSpaceman10

 Between that and not getting a first name, they are building some expectations that I'm not sure they will be able to meet. 

 

They have high expectations because they waited so long to even scratch the surface of Felicity's backstory and because they teased it from Comic-Con 2013 all through the end of season two. People are so desperate for any info about Felicity, that every male character over the age of 45 who comes on the show is speculated to be her father. I hope they shorten the title to just "Felicity".

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

The change of the title might have to do with Gotham. The title appears to be too melodramatic, would have preferred a simpler one like "Felicity" similar to the "Sara" title.

 

Well, per the showrunners, "Sara" apparently has another meaning to it (I think it's an acronym for something), so if they don't want to set the precedent of having episodes named after characters, I can see why they wouldn't want to call it "Felicity." But they could've chosen anything that didn't make it seem like she was hatched in a Petri dish.

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Guest

Guest

Am I the only one pleased that they're not doing the Oliver's child storyline? I really did not want that at all. Adding in child actors to a show like Arrow would be awkward. I'm ok for it happening in a later season I suppose but s3 has too much going on as it is. 

 

I'm SO excited for Felicity's episode. Mama Smoak is coming to town! 

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JayKay

JayKay

I hope the "Secret Origins" episode is meant to be funny. I can see things being played as ominous but turning out to be more like Fred's parents did on Angel. They could have named it melodramatically to feed into the comedy. She probably has a secret, but my bet is that it's more embarrassing than dangerous, as the title would imply.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

I hope the "Secret Origins" episode is meant to be funny. I can see things being played as ominous but turning out to be more like Fred's parents did on Angel. They could have named it melodramatically to feed into the comedy. She probably has a secret, but my bet is that it's more embarrassing than dangerous, as the title would imply.

 

Judging by the two instances where Felicity's mentioned her mother, I bet she's pretty embarrassed of her and probably of where she came from/her family situation. The "secret" probably has something to do with that.

 

I wonder what brings her mom to town and if she has something on Felicity?

 

Just MHO, but I'd like to see something where her mother comes to town with some kind of low-level ill intent and Oliver goes to visit her (as himself, not the Arrow) and convinces her not to use it, or something along those lines. Felicity's gone to bat for him so many times, it'd be nice to see him do something like that for her.

Edited by apinknightmare
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poetgirl925

poetgirl925

(edited)

I'm still leaning towards Felicity Smoak not being her real name since they're not releasing mom's name, but overall I'm keeping my expectations in check because I want to be happy with the story no matter which way it goes. So far I'm very excited that her mom comes to town in the present - I figured as much since we know the flashbacks take place at MIT but it's nice to have confirmation. And I'm very, very happy to hear Oliver's secret love child is on the back burner because we already have enough going on for two seasons of any normal show. The Digglet is more than enough kid story for now.

The title change is weird since DC let them announce it at Comic Con. They really have no one to blame but themselves for expectations because that was a heavy title to drop in a comics crowd if they weren't sure what they were doing. I'm perfectly happy for her not to be Oracle, though. Her role on the team is indispensable no matter what, and she'll still be 100 kinds of awesome even if that title reminded me of an old Disney movie (The Secret Life of Walter Mitty.)

Interestingly though, I googled 'The Secret Origins of...' because it sounded familiar and 'The Secret Origin of Tony Stark' was a special issue of Iron Man released last year, so maybe the title has comic significance.

Edited by poetgirl925
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Orion

Orion

I wonder if the title change has anything to do with her moving to the Green Arrow Comic book. I know the comic won't mirror the show but if they do want to give her the "Oracle" identity they might not be able to because the comics want to use it. And it would be pretty weird for her to be X code name on the show and Y code name in the comics.

 

SUPER excited about Mom in the present.

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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

I agree with @JayKay -- if Mama Smoak turns out to bring the melodrama with her, the title being such a ridiculous mouthful makes complete sense.

 

Just MHO, but I'd like to see something where her mother comes to town with some kind of low-level ill intent and Oliver goes to visit her (as himself, not the Arrow) and convinces her not to use it, or something along those lines. Felicity's gone to bat for him so many times, it'd be nice to see him do something like that for her.

 

I can see this happening. In fact, I'd like to see it too. I wonder if what brings Mama Smoak to town is that she's learned of Felicity's closeness to Oliver, or QC/Ray Palmer, and she wants to cash in.

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foreverevolving

foreverevolving

(edited)

 

I wonder what brings her mom to town and if she has something on Felicity?

 

I'm actually wondering if she comes into town in tow of some whale or criminal of sorts (as his gf or wife) and that complicates things for team arrow as they try to take him down... or not.

anything is possible.

I'm still on board with giving Felicity the Oracle moniker.

 

excited we're getting mama smoak in present time. is it november yet!?

Edited by foreverevolving
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

I'm still leaning towards Felicity Smoak not being her real name since they're not releasing mom's name,

 

Something along the lines of she wanted to separate herself from her past or her mother's past and changed her identity before she went to MIT.  Maybe picked a random name out of a comic book?

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SmallScreenDiva

SmallScreenDiva

I really like the new title for Felicity's episode -- "The Secret Origins of Felicity Smoak -- kinda tongue-in-cheek, I think :) I've waited a long time to learn more about her and that's how it's coming across to me. I do wonder about the reasons behind the title change, and another line from that article is piqueing my interest: "the producers are going in a different direction with the character." Actually, it worries me a little ... it implies to me that after 2 years they're still a bit unsure where to take Felicity. Considering the disastrous way they write characters they don't have a handle on ... yikes! (*thinking positive thoughts*). Can we have Season 3 now, please?

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KenyaJ

KenyaJ

(edited)

I really like the new title for Felicity's episode -- "The Secret Origins of Felicity Smoak -- kinda tongue-in-cheek, I think :) I've waited a long time to learn more about her and that's how it's coming across to me. I do wonder about the reasons behind the title change, and another line from that article is piqueing my interest: "the producers are going in a different direction with the character." Actually, it worries me a little ... it implies to me that after 2 years they're still a bit unsure where to take Felicity. Considering the disastrous way they write characters they don't have a handle on ... yikes! (*thinking positive thoughts*). Can we have Season 3 now, please?

 

I didn't find anything worrying about it. All it says to me is that fans speculated Felicity might become Oracle (which was never confirmed), but it appears that that's not the direction they are taking. I only take that to mean that the fan speculation was wrong, not that the producers have shifted their plans or don't know who Felicity is.

Edited by KenyaJ
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

I really like the new title for Felicity's episode -- "The Secret Origins of Felicity Smoak -- kinda tongue-in-cheek, I think :) I've waited a long time to learn more about her and that's how it's coming across to me. I do wonder about the reasons behind the title change, and another line from that article is piqueing my interest: "the producers are going in a different direction with the character." Actually, it worries me a little ... it implies to me that after 2 years they're still a bit unsure where to take Felicity. Considering the disastrous way they write characters they don't have a handle on ... yikes! (*thinking positive thoughts*). Can we have Season 3 now, please?

 

That could be the writer's speculation based on the name change though. When the producers announced that the ep title was "Oracle," a lot of people thought that meant Felicity was going to become Oracle and now that they've changed the name maybe the writer is assuming she's not becoming Oracle when in all likelihood she never was. Since the 'going in a different direction' isn't a quote, we probably shouldn't worry about it too much (although they've definitely given us reason to in the past, haha).

 

ETA: Ooops, looks like I posted at the same time @KenyaJ did!

Edited by apinknightmare
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poetgirl925

poetgirl925

(edited)

Something along the lines of she wanted to separate herself from her past or her mother's past and changed her identity before she went to MIT. Maybe picked a random name out of a comic book?

Heh, that would be funny! I don't know what I'm thinking exactly, but I think she's going to turn out not to be exactly what she seems - not necessarily in a bad way, but if it was simple as abandoned by father, raised by single mother (even one who may embarrass her) then there wouldn't be a need for all this secrecy about Mama Smoak and her dad and we wouldn't need a 'secret origins' story. Plus this is a comic book show.

Edited by poetgirl925
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foreverevolving

foreverevolving

(edited)

Something along the lines of she wanted to separate herself from her past or her mother's past and changed her identity before she went to MIT.  Maybe picked a random name out of a comic book?

I've been thinking that too. someone as good with computers as Felicity? a woman who can easily hack into high government systems? someone like that can easily change, delete or add information about her past. Oliver, unless using Argus resources, would be non the wiser.

of course, it is also possible that- as an audience member, i have gotten so used to characters having ulterior motives, shady pasts and just stuff to hide- Felicity Smoak may become the exception-ish to what i have apparently been inclined to expect from these kind of shows.

Edited by foreverevolving
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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

(edited)

Even if it IS a quote, it reads like PR spin talk for "we know we announced Oracle at SDCC, but behind the scenes stuff happened and now it's not anymore and we're not gonna explain why". It could range from DC deciding Oracle wasn't available after all, to a legit creative change, really.

Edited by dancingnancy
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