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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

Spoiler Discussion Thread

Morrigan2575

By Morrigan2575
in Arrow

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Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

Me for all of last summer hiatus and 5A: Me after reading the WM interview from a few weeks back about Felicity's arc giving her a more profound understanding of Oliver: Me after r

BkWurm1
BkWurm1

I tend to think that trying to make KC a place on the show had a ripple effect that did hurt the show pretty badly.  She's what turned Quentin stupid and into a creepy stalker.  So that wipes off the

calliope1975
calliope1975

Challenge accepted.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

2 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Yeah, but any plans for her on LoT (or The Flash, though I have no idea what else they're going to do with Black Siren on there unless they're planning a big redemption arc) might be taken into consideration when it comes to contract negotiation and therefore any future in any Arrow episodes.

I guess if they need her, but I think they threw in those shows just to get her on Arrow for what they wanted to do with NuBC, not bc they actually wanted her on those shows. Pot-sweetener, basically. She can say she has an "across the Flarrowverse contract" that way, and they still only had to give her four or whatever episodes. It's all about leverage in negotiations.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

(edited)
2 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

While there are funnier answers, simplest explanation seems to be Evelyn told him

Huh. I didn't even think about that. Probably because I tend not to think about the newbies all that much other than WD is annoying and there needs to be more Rory. I kind of forget what Evelyn does and doesn't know. I guess they would have filled her in on the crossover stuff before finding out about the betrayal. So that does make sense. Now, will they even bring that up onscreen or will we be left to just assume that? (Or maybe they'll mention it in a post-episode interview.) 

Edited by insomniadreams88
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lemotomato

lemotomato

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

While there are funnier answers, simplest explanation seems to be Evelyn told him

I thought of that, but I can't really think about how that would've come up in conversation. I guess I could imagine Felicity telling the newbies about her experience on the Waverider after the crossover event.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

5 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

The bigger question is how he even knows Black Siren exists. 

 

1 minute ago, AyChihuahua said:

We don't even know that Oliver, etc., know about Black Siren, do we?

And if they did, would they have told Evelyn so she could tell him? Why?

I'm going to assume they don't or someone should have questioned "Laurel's" appearance right from the beginning.

Maybe Prometheus has been keeping an eye on CC because of reports of GA and Flash teaming up? But then that goes back to the "How long exactly has Prometheus been planning this/how much does he know/etc." questions.

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Cleanqueen

Cleanqueen

 wendy said her return has to do with Flashpoint, so perhaps thats the explanation of how they know she exists. But if they do, wouldn't that be their first guess as to who she is. 

According to the spoiler, Oliver speaks with Barry and Co., and they say she was left on her own accord but then she says Zoom kidnapped her. It's all a mess, I guess we have 7 days before we find out.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

(edited)
4 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

 

I'm going to assume they don't or someone should have questioned "Laurel's" appearance right from the beginning.

Maybe Prometheus has been keeping an eye on CC because of reports of GA and Flash teaming up? But then that goes back to the "How long exactly has Prometheus been planning this/how much does he know/etc." questions.

Yeah, and if they didn't know, they obviously couldn't tell Evelyn, who couldn't tell Prometheus. (And even if it turns out in 510 they did know, I still don't see why they'd tell the newbies: "Hey, you know that Black Canary chick who died? Well it turns out she has a doppelganger from another universe who is evil. It's cool, though, she's locked up in a super-secret prison in this universe so you'll never see her. Why am I telling you this if you'll never see her? Um, certainly NOT so you can tell the evil guy you've secretly been working for!")

I'm sticking with tropey villain omniscience.

Edited by AyChihuahua
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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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7 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

 wendy said her return has to do with Flashpoint, so perhaps thats the explanation of how they know she exists. But if they do, wouldn't that be their first guess as to who she is. 

According to the spoiler, Oliver speaks with Barry and Co., and they say she was left on her own accord but then she says Zoom kidnapped her. It's all a mess, I guess we have 7 days before we find out.

So Flashpoint means she was left alone and not in jail? That's just freaking dumb.

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calliope1975

calliope1975

6 minutes ago, Cleanqueen said:

 wendy said her return has to do with Flashpoint, so perhaps thats the explanation of how they know she exists. But if they do, wouldn't that be their first guess as to who she is. 

According to the spoiler, Oliver speaks with Barry and Co., and they say she was left on her own accord but then she says Zoom kidnapped her. It's all a mess, I guess we have 7 days before we find out.

Dammit, Larry! His "Con" list grows longer every day. 

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Guest

Guest

That was actually a good promo! Did they hire someone new to do that stuff? LOL.

I just want to know who Felicity punches tbh.

And yikes at them having Black Siren destroy the BC statue, like that means anyone can be BC now. Haha. I can't.

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Trisha

Trisha

It looks like the smashed up limo that they keep posting BTS pics of may have to do with Cupid somehow?

Between this and the new promo's super brief glimpse of what looks like an Olicity stunt, I'm sort of curious to see what happens next. Which is more optimism/anticipation than I've felt for a while. 

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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

(edited)
13 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

And yikes at them having Black Siren destroy the BC statue, like that means anyone can be BC now. Haha. I can't.

What are you talking about, this is super high brow sophisticated ~symbolism~.

Edited by dtissagirl
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Guest

Guest

(edited)

These 510 scenes just confirm (to me) that KC should've been playing villain all along. I'll never stop thinking this.

6 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

What are you talking about, this is super high brow sophisticated ~symbolism~.

LOL. It's subtlety at its finest!

Edited by Guest
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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

The discussion over in Heartaches about no one noticing Felicity shutting everyone out got me thinking. Imagine if Lance, once he's out of rehab, is the first one to notice something's going on with Felicity. Imagine if the guy who's been drinking and in rehab all season is the one to realize that Felicity's up to something separate from the team/someone should be checking in to see how she's doing because he recently had to deal with a loss. (This might just be the part of me that wants more Felicity/Lance scenes and for Lance to have something to do other than the rinse-repeat cycle he's been in.)

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)

I think Rory will be the one to realize something is wrong with Felicity.

They seem to have a pairing, Diggle/Rene and Oliver/Rene, plus Felicity/Rory and Felcity/Curtis.Plus they had Rory/Felicity connect over Havenrock.

Ironically, I think Felicity/Rene works better as a pairing. I know, people here hate Rene/Wild Dog but, I like him and I think those 2 character types play well off each other (gruff vs sunny). 

Edited by Morrigan2575
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way2interested

way2interested

6 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I think Rory will be the one to realize something is wrong with Felicity.

They seem to have a pairing, Diggle/Rene and Oliver/Rene, plus Felicity/Rory and Felcity/Curtis.Plus they had Rory/Felicity connect over Havenrock.

Ironically, I think Felicity/Rene works better as a pairing. I know, people here hate Rene/Wild Dog but, I like him and I think those 2 character types play well off each other (gruff vs sunny). 

Same regarding Rory. Although I think he'll be the one to notice but be unable to do anything about it (one of the people who's keeping it a "secret" from Oliver), saving the actual confrontational-type stuff for Oliver later on.  

Weird thing with the pairing off of characters is that you've got Oliver's the one who recruited Rory in the first place and Felicity who wanted to recruit Rene, yet those characters have had little interaction with each other, save the group scenes. I really liked the heart-to-heart with Oliver and Rory in 502 and I do like the scenes when Rene is actually personable to other characters, so I'd really want more.

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Cleanqueen

Cleanqueen

I was thinking lately how Katie has hair to the side in both her Arrow appearances, it's how she normally wears it now. Also the multiple rings and now nose ring. It's just Katie acting Laurel but them not showing anything that was Laurel or even Black Siren. It's odd that nobody seemed to care. I guess it was all about just getting done with her appearance.

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statsgirl

statsgirl

47 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Ironically, I think Felicity/Rene works better as a pairing. I know, people here hate Rene/Wild Dog but, I like him and I think those 2 character types play well off each other (gruff vs sunny). 

I think on TV opposites play well against each other (I didn't like Ray till they paired him with Grumpy Cat Oliver) but Rene has got to stop dismissing Felicity as a person because that's not entertaining, it's infuriating.  No more calling her Blondie since she's repeatedly asked him not to, no more ignoring her as a person because she can't do the salmon ladder.

They may be trying to write Wild Dog as the second coming of the Hood/Arrow, but Oliver always respected Felicity not just for her abilities but for who she is as a person.  Rene dismissing her the way he does just makes him look like he's not smart enough.

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Cleanqueen

Cleanqueen

(edited)
30 minutes ago, bijoux said:

My favorite part is probably that Oliver and Felicity get a stunt together. I'm trying to think of the last time it happened and... Exploxion in 301?

4x09 lol

Edited by Cleanqueen
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bijoux

bijoux

Who was the one to suggest Lance being the first to realize something is going on with Felicity. It's like you summoned up that pic of him and EBR in the bunker with the episode director. Lance also looks banged up.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

6 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Who was the one to suggest Lance being the first to realize something is going on with Felicity. It's like you summoned up that pic of him and EBR in the bunker with the episode director. Lance also looks banged up.

I did! That pic made me happy. But poor Lance! Wonder if Lance being banged up connects back to the BTS photo of PB with the guy who plays Pike - as in, there's something good coming up with him that's not just being in the mayor's office. 

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statsgirl

statsgirl

They need to free Lance from being stuck in the mayor's office, although with SA saying Oliver is mostly wearing the mayor's suit for several episodes, maybe Lance'll get some real work to do there.

Felicity remained in the bunker through 2B too, she just barely had anything to do i.e. pushed out of the storyline.  Hopefully they won't make that mistake now.

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lemotomato

lemotomato

25 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Looks like Felicity is still in the lair as of 16, hopefully that calms some fears about Felicity getting pushed out.

If anything, SA's comments about Oliver doing more mayor stuff and something about outfit changes seem to indicate that he's the one getting pushed out of the lair and Team Arrow.

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insomniadreams88

insomniadreams88

2 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

If anything, SA's comments about Oliver doing more mayor stuff and something about outfit changes seem to indicate that he's the one getting pushed out of the lair and Team Arrow.

You know, thinking about it, I wonder if they'll have anyone else suit up as GA or just hope that no one realizes the mayor is making more public appearances just as GA sightings are going down. Or if they won't even bother thinking about that.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

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(edited)
11 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

If anything, SA's comments about Oliver doing more mayor stuff and something about outfit changes seem to indicate that he's the one getting pushed out of the lair and Team Arrow.

I figured 11 and 12 being out of town and 13 being a Wild Dog centric episode probably accounted for most of the episodes sans costume.

I guess it could stretch into 14-16 but, I wonder how long they'd go.  In S3, he was out of the GA suit from 19-23, would they go another 5 episodes?

Edited by Morrigan2575
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LeighAn

LeighAn

4 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

If anything, SA's comments about Oliver doing more mayor stuff and something about outfit changes seem to indicate that he's the one getting pushed out of the lair and Team Arrow.

Maybe he's being opposite season 3 guy and instead of Oliver Queen being the danger he's decided Green Arrow is the danger and commits himself more fully to Mayor Queen. Then in the season 5 finale he can declare to the entire city that Oliver Queen is the Green Arrow and finally become a real boy with his two sides complete :p 

Joke spec but kinda not joke spec haha.

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Chaser

Chaser

I was too distracted by her shoulders being pushed up to her chin. It looks odd.

The editing was really good in that preview. It's the first promo I've scene that makes me want to watch the episode.

Should we be getting pics for 5x11 tomorrow?

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

9 hours ago, AyChihuahua said:

I really think this episode is the cap/end of WWLD/St. Laurel. All that crap was intended to lead into Tina/NuBC, and now the mentions, etc., will be rare. I also personally doubt that KC will return to Arrow at all after this.

 

Question, anyone actually think this lead up to introducing Tina/NuBC with Laurel makes sense?  I really don't.

5 hours ago, insomniadreams88 said:

I did! That pic made me happy. But poor Lance! Wonder if Lance being banged up connects back to the BTS photo of PB with the guy who plays Pike - as in, there's something good coming up with him that's not just being in the mayor's office. 

I wonder if Lance will be back in the SCPD by the end of the season.  I also wonder if the early spec that Pike is connected to Prometheus will come true.  If Pike starts getting more screen time...

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

8 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Question, anyone actually think this lead up to introducing Tina/NuBC with Laurel makes sense?  I really don't.

I said it'd happen ages ago, so to me, sure it makes sense. Remind the audience BC in whatever form exists, destroy the statue implying LL's "the one," etc. I guess I can't say it's good storytelling, but it is obvious storytelling. (IMO nothing about the show is "good" storytelling anymore, but a lot of it is obvious.)

I think it helps if the audience accepts that who's behind the BC mask doesn't matter. The EPs have been pushing that general idea in interviews for awhile.  It's been all masksmasksmasks, which I think is part of the overall DC push. 

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