Spoiler Discussion Thread

[calliope1975]

Just now, BkWurm1 said:

There's different kinds of magic.  ;) Baum chicka bow wow.

And Oliver does believe in magic. He just said so. :p

[AyChihuahua]

7 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

That works too.

 I was thinking that we only now would find out the real power of his tattoo - to make his penis magical.  Seems he only fully activated it last season otherwise Isabel would have been saved as well.  

Oh, I just realized, she probably had immunity since she'd already banged his dad.

[Chaser]

The idea of Felicity working with Vigilante was brought up. EBR just started following the actor on IG. Maybe they are filming together.

[Morrigan2575]

That would be cool and, gives some reason for the actor getting a series regular contract

[tv echo]

Here's something interesting about the episode title for 513 - Spectre of the Gun...

"Spectre of the Gun" was also the name of a Star Trek episode in 1968. In that episode, Kirk & crew were transported into an alien recreation of the historic gunfight at the OK Corral in Tombstone. Kirk's crew were members of the Clanton outlaw gang, who were doomed to be killed by Wyatt Earp and his brothers plus Doc Holliday. Chekov was Billy Claibourne, a member of the Clanton gang.  In the alien recreation, Chekov was "killed" before the big gunfight was to occur. However, historically, Billy Claibourne survived the big gunfight because he ran from the shoot-out immediately after it began.

Although the name is spelled slightly differently, it is oddly coincidental that the name "Claibourne" is a character's name in a Star Trek episode  and the name "Claybourne" is a character's name in Arrow this season, with both shows having an identical episode title: "Spectre of the Gun". 

If it turns out that Detective Billy Malone faked his death and is really Prometheus, and that his real name is Billy Claybourne, then the 513 episode title will not be a coincidence, but a clue.

However, that seems unlikely, given that Tyler Ritter has already posted good-bye tweets to the Arrow cast/crew.  But still, it's interesting - especially since we've questioned why Malone was given the first name of Billy, when Oliver's son is named William, and it would've been very easy to have given Malone a different first name (like Tom, for example).

Anyway, I wanted to point this out, on the long shot chance that it's not a coincidence.

ETA: It's possible that Carly Pope is in 513 because of that tweeted pic of Oliver and Quentin in the Mayor's office, where some have speculated that one of the doodled over parts is Susan sleeping on the couch. Also, it was reported during 513 filming that CP "was in once in the last week or so."  But it could've been for a pick up shot, so who knows.

Edited December 17, 2016 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

12 is possible, 13 is unlikely, she was in Australia from pretty much Thanksgiving till about 3 days ago (according to her twitter).

However, even her appearance in 12 isn't going to be much, going by KPs tweet. Probably 2-3 brief scenes where her story comes out or whatever.

[tv echo]

20 hours ago, AyChihuahua said:

That lemon person who apparently is married to Ken Pursuit said EBR is filming today but Steve is "long gone." (The latter seems to be confirmed by Steve's twitter.)

Edited December 17, 2016 by tv echo

[tv echo]

FWIW (if anything), JH's twitter account currently describes her as "@CW_Arrow's newest recruit"...
https://twitter.com/JulianaHarkavy

[Chaser]

2 hours ago, tv echo said:

The twitter also says she is working with Echo. No mention of WH or PB. Not that that means anything with that accounts track record.

[statsgirl]

3 hours ago, tv echo said:

If it turns out that Detective Billy Malone faked his death and is really Prometheus, and that his real name is Billy Claybourne, then the 513 episode title will not be a coincidence, but a clue.

However, that seems unlikely, given that Tyler Ritter has already posted good-bye tweets to the Arrow cast/crew.  But still, it's interesting - especially since we've questioned why Malone was given the first name of Billy, when Oliver's son is named William, and it would've been very easy to have given Malone a different first name (like Tom, for example).

I would really like that twist.  I wish it were true, I liked Tyler Ritter and I think he could pull off Prometheus.

However, I think it's unlikely for the reasons you gave and also because they already did that to Felicity with Cooper, a boyfriend she thought was dead and mourned only to find out that he's alive and a bad guy.  It would nullify her 5B arc and makes her look like an idiot.

Also, since Billy was a member of the SCPD, they would be sure that his body would stick around and have a hero's funeral.

[Chaser]

Combining Felicity/Villains/Argus theories, maybe Felicity creates another Suicide Squad? Granted it's a little Chloe and Smallville but this show isn't exactly original.

If we can't get Felicity undercover, I hope we can get Felicity back in her goth look for an episode. If she is working some badies and since she doesn't do the mask thing, it would be fun to see her change her look to meet with these people.

[Primal Slayer]

If the spoilers I read are true for 5x10, the episode sounds kind of horrible and just doesnt make sense. But they sound so bad that it's probably true given this shows writing. 

[ARLES]

So spoilers according to this person who episode 10, earth 1 Laurel is back, earth 2 BS attacks, and there is a new BC with sonic scream about to be recruited

[Morrigan2575]

Which spoilers would those be? Could you post them here (if you don't trust the source enough to post in the spoiler only thread).

[Primal Slayer]

Yet somehow Laurel just disappears from the 2nd half of the episode once Siren shows up. Either they forgot about her or we are to believe that she gets wiped out of the timeline again?

1 minute ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Which spoilers would those be? Could you post them here (if you don't trust the source enough to post in the spoiler only thread).

[ARLES]

8 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Yet somehow Laurel just disappears from the 2nd half of the episode once Siren shows up. Either they forgot about her or we are to believe that she gets wiped out of the timeline again?

Remove earth one Laurel and this episode makes a lot more sense. 

Have earth one Laurel alive and this makes absolutely no sense. 

 

Also this being BS and not Laurel adds up with Katie not being on the arrow set since filming 508-9-10

[Primal Slayer]

They just clarified that E1-Laurel is E2-Laurel. Now how she knows about the Legends....again no sense or why she is afraid of Prometheus...

[Morrigan2575]

And this person knows what happens in the episode because? Obviously no screeners have been sent out, they won't send them out until January. So did this person read the script? Work on the show for the entire episode production?

Honestly this sounds like a foiler to me.

[insomniadreams88]

That...sounds bad. Like an episode that shouldn't be the first one back after winter hiatus. Maybe it just sounds that way because of how it's written, but... 

So no time has passed, Malone's not buried yet, but no one cares? They really decide to just throw a party? Also, if true, Donna is only going to be mentioned as related to Lance's storyline from now on? 

[ARLES]

6 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

And this person knows what happens in the episode because? Obviously no screeners have been sent out, they won't send them out until January. So did this person read the script? Work on the show for the entire episode production?

Honestly this sounds like a foiler to me.

This person is legit. Spoiled exact dialogue from arrow episodes beofre they aired. The Olicity talk in episode 2 and that Oliver killed Malone, with the exact lines of dialogue of him telling Felicity and the team 

[tangerine95]

Yeah this does sound like what might happen tbh, they really go into details so I wouldn't be suprised if its true. Sounds really boring tho imo.

[Trisha]

Can someone post the source for this? Is it on Twitter or Tumblr?

[EmilyBettFan]

Sounds like a Bunch of boring nonsense.

[tv echo]

6 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Can someone post the source for this? Is it on Twitter or Tumblr?

If you click on the above quoted summary, it'll take you to the reddit page where it was originally posted.

Edited December 18, 2016 by tv echo

[Morrigan2575]

9 minutes ago, ARLES said:

This person is legit. Spoiled exact dialogue from arrow episodes beofre they aired. The Olicity talk in episode 2 and that Oliver killed Malone, with the exact lines of dialogue of him telling Felicity and the team 

Yeah, sorry I'm skeptical.

[tv echo]

Original poster (Yonkou Productions) answered some questions in the comments section following its posted summary in that reddit thread...

Quote

[–]AdamantAce [score hidden] an hour ago 
Wait so both E-1 Laurel AND Black Siren are in the episode? And if E-1 Laurel is back then why does Oliver need to find a new Canary?
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[–]YonkouProductions... [score hidden] 34 minutes ago 
I left out that E-1 Laurel was actually E-2 Laurel playing the part. Edited in some dialogue to clarify.

Quote

[–]clara-oswald#JusticeForHelenaBertinelli [score hidden] 17 minutes ago 
but you just said e1 laurel asks felicity about e2 laurel, is she going back and forth pretending to be two different people in the same like, building? lmao also the dna shouldn't match if it was e2 laurel all along, they're mirror images yes but e2 laurel has the metagene canary cry, that would show up on her dna.
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[–]YonkouProductions... [score hidden] 11 minutes ago* 
My bad I was tripping.
The dna thing is explained in a weird way too.

Quote

[–]Shadybug [score hidden] 47 minutes ago 
I had to read this twice. The inclusion of Siren, a 'cured' E1 Laurel, a hunt for a new Canary, and then Talia on top of it all makes this plot feel very convoluted.
Is the woman at the bar E1 Laurel now with sonic scream or a new person? ...Honestly, almost everything this show has done with BC from the start makes me feel tired.
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[–]YonkouProductions... [score hidden] 33 minutes ago 
E-1 Laurel was E-2 Laurel acting the part. She goes through a redemption arc basically.

Edited December 18, 2016 by tv echo

[insomniadreams88]

Wait. So they're using the Arrow midseason premiere to give a Flash character a redemption story? Really? If true, that's a big disappointment. It would be one thing if they had introduced BS on Arrow and then moved her over to The Flash. But just because she's played by KC doesn't change the fact that her story is a Flash one. 

Also, Prometheus shows up at STAR Labs? And no one thought to call anyone in Star City? So it's just another example of the really bad security at these bases and no one talking to each other unless it's crossover time. 

[Carrie Ann]

This pretty much sounds like I imagined it would go down, minus the Dig parts because his pointless plot is too boring to speculate about. I don't really get what's happening at the very end, but everything else fits for me. Another ep to skip!

[way2interested]

So Tina's a metahuman and "the best fighter he's ever seen"? 

[lexicon]

That...sounds awful and like nothing I'm even slightly interested in seeing. I appreciate this may not be the case for everybody but it's a little disheartening to know that we'repast the MSF and now have spoilers for 5.10 as well and so far there's not one single episode of s5 that I feel tempted to watch. I used to count down the days to a new ep. Sigh

[Trisha]

Whoever this person is, if you look at their past posts they revealed the exact lines of dialogue from the last three scenes of ep 9 (even the "Hi, Ollie.") Seems legit. Makes sense too that it would be Black Siren instead of the real Laurel (and WM did say that Felicity would be the most skeptical of Laurel's real identity). 

It sucks that they seem to be putting BS on a redemption arc (which will probably continue on Legends). KC is so much better when she's playing bad. Why even have her play other characters is the point is to find what's left of Laurel in each of them?

[Trisha]

4 minutes ago, way2interested said:

So Tina's a metahuman and "the best fighter he's ever seen"? 

She might just have a sonic cry device, like Laurel and Evelyn?

[Primal Slayer]

This all seems like a downgraded version of Faith and her stunt on Angel

But I'll pray that they do a decent job. 

4 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Whoever this person is, if you look at their past posts they revealed the exact lines of dialogue from the last three scenes of ep 9 (even the "Hi, Ollie.") Seems legit. Makes sense too that it would be Black Siren instead of the real Laurel (and WM did say that Felicity would be the most skeptical of Laurel's real identity). 

It sucks that they seem to be putting BS on a redemption arc (which will probably continue on Legends). KC is so much better when she's playing bad. Why even have her play other characters is the point is to find what's left of Laurel in each of them?

Well redemption doesn't mean she won't be a "bad" girl. She would probably still have attitude and not be against killing certain people.

[HighHopes]

1 hour ago, Morrigan2575 said:

And this person knows what happens in the episode because? Obviously no screeners have been sent out, they won't send them out until January. So did this person read the script? Work on the show for the entire episode production?

Honestly this sounds like a foiler to me.

Actually way back in season two they sent the 2x10 screener out in December. I remember a Tumblr user who got one, she wrote for some entertainment/recap website that I can't remember the name of. But it has happened in the past that people have gotten the episode 10 screeners a week or two after the mid season finale aired. 

Edited December 18, 2016 by HighHopes

[Chaser]

If true....

I'm confused by that whole last confrontation with BS/Prometheus. Actually I'm confused about a lot of things.

So this woman in the bar just happens to have the same 'power' all the other canaries have had? What are the odds people.

I like her cover story was that she asked Sara to drop her off with Ollie for a second chance. Stalker enough to pass as Laurel.

[Primal Slayer]

Finally. It's about time someone figured it out. You know, I am so sick and tired of playing this weak, vulnerable Laurel. She's such a pill, it's pathetic.

[Primal Slayer]

And I am guessing that Felicity lets Siren go so they can get to Prometheus? And is she taken as hostage? 

[way2interested]

Just now, Chaser said:

If true....

I'm confused by that whole last confrontation with BS/Prometheus. Actually I'm confused about a lot of things.

I took it as a fight scene between Team Arrow and BS/Prometheus, where Oliver talks BS down and they catch her while Prometheus escapes, but yeah not sure either...and also confused about some of these other scenes...

But I'm also kind of bummed that there seems to be no scene between Oliver and Felicity "looking for BC," like the paps said, unless one of these scenes is that in actuality but eh who knows? (Although I am kind of looking forward to this: "Oliver asks Felicity about E-2 Laurel and she says that she's not the same as her and that despite not understanding parallel worlds understanding how circumstances can impact a person and understanding those differences can help reach out to E-2 Laurel." since it seems to be typical "Felicity tells Oliver to do something and Oliver does it.")

[Chaser]

That was something I was confused about. It sounds like that is what's going on but then I thought it sounded like the Team didn't know. Of course it could be both, 'Dark Felicity' let's out BS in order to catch Prometheus. Oliver didn't want that because BS looks like Laurel and can be totes saved.

I wonder about them doing this whole redemption thing and then writing her out and another BC taking her place. The LOLs.

[Primal Slayer]

I just want to know why does Thea apparently have nothing to do in this episode that involves her old friend returning? And if they wanted to redeem Siren, let Thea or Quentin have that honor of talking some sense into her, it would be a lot more emotional and powerful coming from them then Oliver or Felicity. 

[insomniadreams88]

Maybe Thea got lost in one of the other levels of the lair since Oliver had her move in for her safety in 509 but she didn't come up to check when Laurel apparently was hanging out, waiting for Oliver to return. Or maybe she went home since they forgot about that safety thing by the end of the episode and she's off covering for Oliver at the mayor's office because that's totally more important. Or they just forgot about that relationship completely. 

Also, does Felicity not punch someone in the ep or did I miss that mention? Maybe that's not in 510? 

[Chaser]

17 minutes ago, Primal Slayer said:

Quote

 

Finally. It's about time someone figured it out. You know, I am so sick and tired of playing this weak, vulnerable Laurel. She's such a pill, it's pathetic.

Who is she supposed to be talking too? Felicity cause she ran DNA? 

Maybe that line is in reference to all those that hated Laurel until she got a mask.

[way2interested]

Yeah, I guess Thea and Lance just...aren't in the episode at all? Unless they're at that party thing. And if they are putting the "redemption" stuff for Siren with Oliver and Felicity, then I guess they want to kind of keep emotional focus on them, which isn't bad since they're the mains and have season arcs to continue but isn't good if you wanted a good redemption arc for a character that people might be tuning into see.

Just now, insomniadreams88 said:

Also, does Felicity not punch someone in the ep or did I miss that mention? Maybe that's not in 510? 

Thought it was in 510 myself but idk for sure, might be in the fight scene since it seems like BS is trying to kill Felicity. But I'm also wondering about what reshoots they had for this episode that MG mentioned.

[Primal Slayer]

1 minute ago, way2interested said:

Yeah, I guess Thea and Lance just...aren't in the episode at all? Unless they're at that party thing. And if they are putting the "redemption" stuff for Siren with Oliver and Felicity, then I guess they want to kind of keep emotional focus on them, which isn't bad since they're the mains and have season arcs to continue

That's just weak writing, it should make sense in the end. It would be like JW having Buffy talk down Dark Willow. But it doesn't surprise me.

[Midori Ya]

The person who wrote the summary may not have included every single detail.

But overall if it's: convoluted, has major plotholes, refers to important events that had to happen offscreenville (or better yet, doesn't even refer to them so the viewer has to make inferences or create headcanon in order to connect crucial dots), and has characters doing things that miss major emotional beats - then that does sound like something MG would come up with.

[ComicFan777]

If Oliver is the one throwing the welcome back party for Laurel while Felicity is planning Mayo's funeral, I think it's more than weird - it's really insensitive of Oliver considering he killed Mayo.  I don't get this writing choice.

[Morrigan2575]

If that's legit, it sounds like a mess of an episode. I'll take it with a grain of salt for now. There's a lot that lines up with my own personal spec. But, there's stuff that was filmed or mentioned that seems to be missing or deliberately omitted.

Maybe he's just playing to his audience? Maybe he's just taking standard spec and filling in the blanks?  Guess we'll find out next month.

[insomniadreams88]

1 minute ago, ComicFan777 said:

If Oliver is the one throwing the welcome back party for Laurel while Felicity is planning Mayo's funeral, I think it's more than weird - it's really insensitive of Oliver considering he killed Mayo.  I don't get this writing choice.

Especially if the party takes place at the loft and that's where EBR's photo of the guys in the loft is from. "You were just crying alone on this couch after I accidentally killed your boyfriend! But let's celebrate someone coming back from the dead here!"

[dtissagirl]

"Hey, Felicity, I know I killed your Mayo and all, but Laurel is back from the dead -- see, one person died another comes back, it's life el oh el, but more importantly, I'm a homeless Mayor, so I need your place to throw her a party. K? K."

Edited December 18, 2016 by dtissagirl

[Primal Slayer]

9 minutes ago, Morrigan2575 said:

If that's legit, it sounds like a mess of an episode. I'll take it with a grain of salt for now. There's a lot that lines up with my own personal spec. But, there's stuff that was filmed or mentioned that seems to be missing or deliberately omitted.

Maybe he's just playing to his audience? Maybe he's just taking standard spec and filling in the blanks?  Guess we'll find out next month.

Certain things could have been cut. We know they had a Black Canary on set for S4 finale that never showed up in the episode. But I am sure that the person didnt give us the rundown to a t. Or maybe certain things they moved to 5x11, but something (imo) should've played out over at least 2 episodes being done and wrapped up in a pretty bow in 1 episode doesn't leave me feeling warm and fuzzy in the end.