Spoiler Discussion Thread

[bijoux]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1440261349392461&id=146921975393078&_rdr

SA's Q&A. Sometime before the three minute mark, there is a question about the Susan storyline and how it ended abruptly without really going anywhere. The first part of his answer made me laugh (I loved working with... Carly; sure, dude, it really translated onscreen, Oliver was the proverbial ball of sunshine with Susan), but then he says, "That storyline ended rather abruptly but that doesn't mean that it's over." That really makes Oliver being outed as GA likely IMO. They don't even need CP for it, they just need to mention it was Susan who broke the story. I still don't want it.

[Mellowyellow]

Anything about Olicity? 

[LeighAn]

6 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Maybe not exactly a spoiler but per this comment, I guess SA intends to stick with Arrow for as long as possible.  

Ugh he's going to pitch them ending it with Oliver dying right? Wasn't he a big fan of that from answers he's given at cons? 

 

Dear writers: Please remember that all Stephen does for a living is recite lines. Remember Katie Cassidys pitch of a one sided Lauriver desperate Laurel death scene- how'd that work out for you?  Don't feel the need to always take story ideas from your actors.

Sincerly,

the fandom who have gone through 5 years of your crap and aren't interested in hanging around for another 7 years just to have it end with dead Oliver (even if that fandom consists of solely me)

Edited June 29, 2017 by LeighAn

[bijoux]

34 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

Anything about Olicity? 

Not that I remember. There was a question about William bonding with Felicity, Dig and Aunt Thea, but SA said he couldn't discuss it.

@LeighAn, yup, he's a fan of Oliver dying at the end. I mean, if it's 86-year-old Oliver falling asleep in his reclining chair and never waking up after his extended family has come for the traditional Sunday lunch, okay. Not that I need to see that either.

[Midnight Lullaby]

7 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Maybe not exactly a spoiler but per this comment, I guess SA intends to stick with Arrow for as long as possible.  

Yeah..I think if his movie was successful the answer could have been different..

If Emily decides to leave at some point in the future they could always arrange things to bring her back for the final episodes..I don't think SA will get his preferred ending. (If he is still talking about OQ dying)

[Mellowyellow]

But they won't live happily ever after with Olicity babies. Nooooo 

And there will be other love interests until she comes back. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

I wouldn't get upset over a hypothetical future, LOL. She might never leave and the show might end sooner than later..

[LeighAn]

49 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Not that I remember. There was a question about William bonding with Felicity, Dig and Aunt Thea, but SA said he couldn't discuss it.

@LeighAn, yup, he's a fan of Oliver dying at the end. I mean, if it's 86-year-old Oliver falling asleep in his reclining chair and never waking up after his extended family has come for the traditional Sunday lunch, okay. Not that I need to see that either.

Old Oliver dying I'm okay with. If they did like a Notebook type final episode where we see Old 80 year old Oliver with his family flashing back to our Olivers most memorable battle. Maybe in connection to offering words of wisdom to a son or daughter of his dealing with the mantle of Green Arrow/Arrowess. Then passes away of old age peacefully. (Felicity as his loving wife and mother of his children of course)

 

But something tells me Stephen sees himself as Matthew Foxs character in LOST dying a heros death that no one really predicted or saw coming.

[bijoux]

I gave up on Lost before it ended, so I'm not really sure about Jack's demise, but I agree that SA's scenario is undoubtedly the polar opposite of the one I laid out.

[LeighAn]

31 minutes ago, bijoux said:

I gave up on Lost before it ended, so I'm not really sure about Jack's demise, but I agree that SA's scenario is undoubtedly the polar opposite of the one I laid out.

Basically he sacrifices himself to save everybody else and the ending pays a homage to how the show started with Jacks eyes closing instead of opening.

 

*Spoiler alert for people who have been living under a rock and haven't heard of/or watched LOST. 

[strikera0]

2 hours ago, LeighAn said:

But something tells me Stephen sees himself as Matthew Foxs character in LOST dying a heros death that no one really predicted or saw coming.

Actually, many people in the Lost fandom correctly predicted that the final shot of the series would be Jack's eye closing as he dies a hero's death. What they didn't see coming was the whole heaven storyline. 

[Chaser]

If Reporter comes back it better be to expose Oliver so Felicity and Thea can get some vindication. 

[bijoux]

I'm not banking on her coming back in person, but this gives legs to the thing about Oliver being outed being one of the two truths.

[tv echo]

Ugh - sounds like they aren't changing child actors for William... and possibly more Susan in S6.

[insomniadreams88]

All I know is if Susan comes back, I don't want to hear anyone say she's a "good person" or "good reporter," whether it's on-screen or in interviews. And nothing that even comes close to Oliver defending her. (Though since he and Felicity will be together, I don't see that happening? But still. Sometimes I'm not so sure with these writers.) 

You know, I'd rather see the PI she hired than see Susan. Have the PI show up and threaten to out Oliver using the information Susan had him gather. Have Oliver realize just how serious it was that Susan found out who he is because she had someone else digging into his life, meaning she wasn't the only person who knew and it is a threat, despite what he said in S5. 

Also, since hopefully Oliver won't be as stupid as he was in S5, he'll realize that this affects the entire team and not just him and therefore it's not really up to him to go "oh, it's fine that X knows about me, no big deal." 

[leopardprint]

Wasn't there some spec here about Oliver returning to Star City post-splodey island and his identity is revealed? Maybe that's how she will return as being mentioned that she outed him in a report. IMO, their breakup was not that definitive, Oliver later said he was dating her because he was lonely, but he told her it was because it was too dangerous so who knows. I know they seem to want to avoid romantic drama but they always cave to their worst impulses and go for the easy drama. Not a triangle but maybe a woman scorned thing. 

Susan, William, Samantha, GA outed...ugh.

Edited June 29, 2017 by leopardprint

[wonderwall]

2 hours ago, tv echo said:

Ugh - sounds like they aren't changing child actors for William... and possibly more Susan in S6.

Well it's hard to say what the kid is capable of acting wise considering he wasn't given anything in season 4 and 5. I don't think the actor is the issue for now

[leopardprint]

The writing is definitely not going to do him any favors though. 

[statsgirl]

I'm holding on to the hope that since SA loves the William storyline but couldn't say anything about it wrt Thea Felicity or Diggle, there's nothing planned there and William won't be sticking around much.

I hate both the 'Oliver is outed' and 'Oliver dies' with the fire of a thousand suns.  This show can take away my excitement for the season faster than anything else I can think of.

Edited June 29, 2017 by statsgirl

[Proteus]

IMO, the show cannot go on if Oliver is outed. So I do not think that'll happen.

[LeighAn]

12 minutes ago, Proteus said:

IMO, the show cannot go on if Oliver is outed. So I do not think that'll happen.

Iron man/Tony Stark outed himself right from the start and he's been able to get 6 movies worth out of it and is scheduled to be in a least 3 more. 

[insomniadreams88]

23 minutes ago, Proteus said:

IMO, the show cannot go on if Oliver is outed. So I do not think that'll happen.

I think it can. What I don't think the show can do (well) is handle the immediate aftermath of him being outed. There would have to be a time jump, so a season finale or even midseason finale. Maybe even the penultimate episode of the season with the finale beginning to deal with the immediate aftermath and then we get the summer time jump. 

So if they want to say that Oliver found out he's been outed as the GA upon returning from the island and the S6 premiere shows the immediate aftermath in some flashbacks, that might work. 

Edited June 29, 2017 by insomniadreams88

[Starfish35]

18 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Iron man/Tony Stark outed himself right from the start and he's been able to get 6 movies worth out of it and is scheduled to be in a least 3 more. 

Oliver's no Tony Stark.  There's a whole lot of differences there.   This would be more like Bruce Wayne being outed as Batman. 

[LeighAn]

1 minute ago, Starfish35 said:

Oliver's no Tony Stark.  There's a whole lot of differences there.   This would be more like Bruce Wayne being outed as Batman. 

I wasn't saying in personality they were similar. Just that Tony outed himself and was able to continue to remain a superhero when the argument I was replying to is that being outed would be the end of Oliver.

 

In a scenario where Oliver gets outed, you're looking at 2-3 episodes of drama before Oliver continues carrying on still being Green Arrow doing what he does, except with people knowing who is in the suit.

 

I mean Oliver Queen in Smallville outed himself and still continued being Green Arrow and I believe for a period Oliver Queen was outed in even the comics as Green Arrow and still continued being Green Arrow.

[leopardprint]

IIRC, in Iron Man he outed himself so the government wouldn't take control of the suit? Then he becomes part of the government /government sanctioned. Also he's pretty much only killed terrorists and aliens right? 

I don't think it's really a good comparison but I agree the only way they could do it is to skip past the immediate aftermath. It just makes no sense in terms of the rest of TA and their families, but when has consideration of other people ever stopped Oliver? It's like a warehouse full of worm cans to open that they aren't going to want to deal with. 

Edited June 29, 2017 by leopardprint

[Starfish35]

1 minute ago, LeighAn said:

I mean Oliver Queen in Smallville outed himself and still continued being Green Arrow and I believe for a period Oliver Queen was outed in even the comics as Green Arrow and still continued being Green Arrow.

I must have quit watching before then.  I didn't know that happened.  Don't know about the comics.  

I just don't see how it could work.  I'm not just talking about personality.  Tony Stark is a billionaire that isn't running around putting arrows in people at night.   He's very much an "in the light of day" hero.  Oliver is not.  And I'm not just talking about literal day and night.  

I'm not saying they won't do it - I have zero faith in this writing team at the moment.  But if they do I think it will end up being the "jump the shark" moment for the show.  

[Proteus]

45 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

Iron man/Tony Stark outed himself right from the start and he's been able to get 6 movies worth out of it and is scheduled to be in a least 3 more. 

I knew Iron Man would be mentioned. Just because that worked for one super hero in another universe and medium doesn't mean it'd work here. They are two totally different characters.

 

38 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

I think it can. What I don't think the show can do (well) is handle the immediate aftermath of him being outed. There would have to be a time jump, so a season finale or even midseason finale. Maybe even the penultimate episode of the season with the finale beginning to deal with the immediate aftermath and then we get the summer time jump. 

So if they want to say that Oliver found out he's been outed as the GA upon returning from the island and the S6 premiere shows the immediate aftermath in some flashbacks, that might work. 

Oliver being outed would mean his whole team is. There's no way I could see everyone else's identities not being figured out. Plus the Green Arrow is a vigilante that occasionally executes people. Iron Man is not.

Edited June 29, 2017 by Proteus

[wonderwall]

6 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I knew Iron Man would be mentioned. Just because that worked for one super hero in another universe and medium doesn't mean it'd work here. They are two totally different characters.

 

I think Oliver being outed will be met with contention by the citizens of Star City and that will be the main drama for the season until Oliver does something heroic and the citizens consider him a hero.

It's not impossible. IMO it could work and would offer great drama for the show (that's not contrived)

[insomniadreams88]

9 minutes ago, Proteus said:

Oliver being outed would mean his whole team is. There's no way I could see everyone else's identities not being figured out. 

This is true. I just hope this is something that's discussed in the writers' room and the focus isn't on Oliver being outed. After all, he didn't seem to think about anyone else on the team last season when Susan found out. Which was so stupid. Let's hope that kind of stupidity doesn't continue. 

[apinknightmare]

A couple things happened last season that set the table for Oliver being revealed as the Green Arrow without much blowback. The one big stain on his record was Billy, and they already worked through that plot point with his speech to Pike about having to live with his guilt, and the revelation of Chase as Prometheus. I think it's dumb and don't want it, but I wouldn't be surprised if it happened. 

[leopardprint]

Vigilanting (sp?) is illegal. So everyone is going to look the other way while the mayor runs around in a costume with a bow and arrow, seriously injuring people? Assault is a thing. Assault with a deadly weapon is a thing. Like the city can't just decide something isn't illegal if this one guy does it. Ok but it would be kind of hilarious if the city council passed a pro vigilante ordinance and there were tons of vigilantes running around so Oliver spends all his time rescuing would be vigilantes. 

Also Felicity would go down for cyber terrorism and be dumped in a black site never to be seen again. 

Beyond William, two other members of his team have small children who could be in serious danger. 

Remember when Arrow was supposed to be gritty and realistic? 

Edited June 29, 2017 by leopardprint

[LeighAn]

From the pilot episode of this show you've been required to watch the show with a suspension of disbelief. To watch ANY comic show/movie you have to watch with a suspension of disbelief because normal people don't decide to put on tight spandex and fight crime.

 

I don't know why six seasons in people are watching Arrow through the lens of straight realism *shrug*

[leopardprint]

How many times has he been arrested "in show" for suspicion of being The Hood, Arrow...? Roy was arrested for it and had to leave town. It's the show's reality. 

Edited June 29, 2017 by leopardprint

[apinknightmare]

The show's reality was also Arrow having a good relationship and working with the SCPD at the beginning of S3, so it's gone both ways. 

[leopardprint]

3 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

The show's reality was also Arrow having a good relationship and working with the SCPD at the beginning of S3, so it's gone both ways. 

Wasn't that specifically Laurel and Lance? Did the rest of SCPD know about it? I can't remember. 

Though I guess Pike pretty much knows now as well. 

Edited June 29, 2017 by leopardprint

[LeighAn]

1 minute ago, apinknightmare said:

The show's reality was also Arrow having a good relationship and working with the SCPD at the beginning of S3, so it's gone both ways. 

And had Green Arrow appear on television to inspire hope for the city and been given a public thank you from the Police Department for his efforts.

[insomniadreams88]

The public/SCPD's opinions on vigilantes is all dependent on what they need it to be for that episode/arc/season. If they want everyone to be all for the GA so Oliver can be outed and they can keep moving forward without too many consequences, they'll throw him a parade. If they want to deal with hate towards him for being the GA, they'll have protests or something. And for all we know, they may even have everyone's opinions about vigilantes be different for each team member, if everyone's identities are outed. Sadly, that's the nature of the show. 

[BkWurm1]

38 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I knew Iron Man would be mentioned. Just because that worked for one super hero in another universe and medium doesn't mean it'd work here. They are two totally different characters.

 

Oliver being outed would mean his whole team is. There's no way I could see everyone else's identities not being figured out. Plus the Green Arrow is a vigilante that occasionally executes people. Iron Man is not.

I hate the idea of the GA being outed.  Far too messy, but Tony absolutely killed people in the first movie.  He used rockets and targeted bullets on the attackers in that village.  He was a masked vigilante killing people without Government sanction.  It was just not in the US.

I don't want to have to deal with the fallout if Oliver really gets outed but Tony Stark did kill.

[way2interested]

3 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Tony Stark did kill.

Plus he experienced virtually no punishment for making Ultron other than his own guilt and obligation to sign the Accords. Heck, he was giving a college talk at the beginning of Civil War and no one seemed to have a problem with that.

Basically, plot's gonna plot for both of them.

[lemotomato]

29 minutes ago, leopardprint said:

Vigilanting (sp?) is illegal. So everyone is going to look the other way while the mayor runs around in a costume with a bow and arrow, seriously injuring people? Assault is a thing. Assault with a deadly weapon is a thing. Like the city can't just decide something isn't illegal if this one guy does it. Ok but it would be kind of hilarious if the city council passed a pro vigilante ordinance and there were tons of vigilantes running around so Oliver spends all his time rescuing would be vigilantes. 

The city put up a big ole memorial statue and had a ceremony for BC/LL, a vigilante and former ADA for the city. Realism or even consistency has never been a priority on the show

Edited June 29, 2017 by lemotomato

[calliope1975]

I'm convinced GA will be outed. The show doesn't care much about real world consequences so they'll hand wave away all the deaths. I'm not a fan, but I'll just have to deal.

[leopardprint]

14 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

If they want to deal with hate towards him for being the GA, they'll have protests or something. And for all we know, they may even have everyone's opinions about vigilantes be different for each team member, if everyone's identities are outed. Sadly, that's the nature of the show. 

Yes, I agree, unfortunately they will flip flop about this as needed for whatever story they want to tell.

I also think it's one thing when they didn't know the man behind the hood and an entirely different situation if Mayor Oliver Queen is off vigilantiing (sp?) in his free time and shooting people with arrows. 

I get they are trying to do some kind of Oliver Queen has reconciled all facets of himself and is finally a real boy, living in the light of day. Maybe if it had been more entertaining, I would be more willing to suspend disbelief. 

6 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

The city put up a big ole memorial statue and had a ceremony  for BC, a vigilante. Realism or even consistency has never been a priority on the show

Haha, I keep forgetting about BC 2.0. I feel like Oliver should have been impeached for misuse of city funds. 

Edited June 29, 2017 by leopardprint

[LeighAn]

4 minutes ago, way2interested said:

Plus he experienced virtually no punishment for making Ultron other than his own guilt and obligation to sign the Accords. Heck, he was giving a college talk at the beginning of Civil War and no one seemed to have a problem with that.

Basically, plot's gonna plot for both of them.

Honestly Tony Stark was the Villan of Avengers 2 in some ways- that why I HATED the second movie. I mean he was also actually creating an army of robots which is basically the start of most robots turn on humans and take over the world Villan/hero movies haha.

[insomniadreams88]

You know what I wonder? If Oliver is outed as GA (and that wasn't a lie about S6), is he going to reveal he was also the Hood and the Arrow or let the public continue to think Roy was the Arrow and is dead? Since I don't think Colton Haynes is returning to the show anytime soon, I feel like they might just ignore/forget about that. 

[apinknightmare]

He is stupid, but I hope he's not stupid enough to put himself on the hook for something someone else has already knowingly and willingly taken the fall for, haha.

Edited June 29, 2017 by apinknightmare

[Chaser]

Whose been on the Fans wishlist? I can only think of Ra's.

[lemotomato]

Probably referring to Richard Dragon (aka Ricardo Diaz) , based on the casting notice posted a few weeks ago.

Edited June 29, 2017 by lemotomato

[Chaser]

Probably, I just wasn't aware fans were waiting for him to come on the show. I hadn't even heard the name before.

[way2interested]

Though it said 7/13 fractional series regular, so is that how they cast all the big bads for the whole season?

[Morrigan2575]

1 hour ago, way2interested said:

Though it said 7/13 fractional series regular, so is that how they cast all the big bads for the whole season?

Pretty much, Chase had 19 episodes, Dark had 18 episodes, Ra's wasn't a regular but he was in more 10 episodes, Slade had 19 episodes (although credited for 23) in S2 and, Merlyn had 12 in S1.

My guess is they're going for a S1/S3 formula, maybe we'll have mini bads or bads of the week?

Edited June 29, 2017 by Morrigan2575