Spoiler Discussion Thread

[Morrigan2575]

Ah, thank you.

Yeah, that's not going to end well.

Edited November 3, 2016 by Morrigan2575

[calliope1975]

What is happening? Is it the World Series? Beyonce on the CMA's? What started the madness? Step away from the computers/phones Arrow PTB. No one on either side will win.

[statsgirl]

2 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

So Oliver sleeping with the reporter was a false spoiler.

There's still time.   Isn't she on until 509?

Never underestimate the stupidity of the EPS.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

Here's the full photo

I wonder why they're dressed like they're in a cult. LOL.

Also, I really thought that was SA in the pod at first. Now I'm not sure. 

[apinknightmare]

5 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

Also, I really thought that was SA in the pod at first. Now I'm not sure. 

I think if he was, DR would've tagged him in the original, and he didn't. 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I think if he was, DR would've tagged him in the original, and he didn't. 

Ah. That makes sense.

Also, I'm catching up on spoilers because I've been gone all day but did SA say the 100th is basically a "what if Oliver never knew Diggle and Felicity" scenario? Or did I imagine that?

[BkWurm1]

1 minute ago, Angel12d said:

Ah. That makes sense.

Also, I'm catching up on spoilers because I've been gone all day but did SA say the 100th is basically a "what if Oliver never knew Diggle and Felicity" scenario? Or did I imagine that?

If he did say that, it had better be a nightmare scenario.  

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

If he did say that, it had better be a nightmare scenario.  

I must've imagined it then. I could've sworn I read something somewhere. Never mind!

[Mellowyellow]

Will be interesting to see if there are anymore O and F scenes for the rest of the season or will Felicity be shipped off into separate plots like Laurel.

[lemotomato]

10 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

Will be interesting to see if there are anymore O and F scenes for the rest of the season or will Felicity be shipped off into separate plots like Laurel.

If TPTB are serious about giving them new long term LI (and by long term, I mean until Feb sweeps or the end of this season) I think they'll have to keep them separated because they keep making heart eyes at each other even when they're not supposed to. 

[Mellowyellow]

Is the Havenrock arc over? I thought Felicity was supposed to have some sort of meltdown? 

[looptab]

40 minutes ago, Mellowyellow said:

Is the Havenrock arc over? I thought Felicity was supposed to have some sort of meltdown? 

I think EBR said that, and it might have been another instance where they told her what would happen, she anticipated something, and then  the execution was very different from what she expected.

[Password]

3 minutes ago, looptab said:

I think EBR said that, and it might have been another instance where they told her what would happen, she anticipated something, and then  the execution was very different from what she expected.

Unfortunately, I agree :(

[Ophanim]

I am really starting to worry about EBR job status. It's like KC all over again: no visible storyline, no interview or teasing about anything new, and weirdly silence on her part.  Havenrock storyline was due to fan reaction, and it's over, so Q remain what IS really her own storyline this year now?

...not sure, but I think her contract expires after season 5, Y/N? I don't have info or anything, just speculation.

[Belinea]

I don't know if he’s ready to move on, but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship. -SA

What is that even supposed to mean? He just needs to get laid? 

I mean, I am not even against it but please just get it over with... At least it seems as though the reporter has a purpose other than bedding Oliver. What is Billy's purpose again? 

2 minutes ago, Lidach said:

am really starting to worry about EBR job status.

I don't think that they'd let her go. She is one of the few players that they can put into the other shows effortless and she is one of the only 2 regular women on the show. It just seems as though they don't know how to write for women. Even Thea has the same storyline over and over again. I think that if EBR were to leave, it would be her own wish. I however doubt that. 

[Velocity23]

In KCs case her screentime was reduced to be actually below Willa Holland. That isnt the case with Emily, she has the same amount of screentime as last year. Not sure about her actual contract but i do know she got a pay raise before s4 started. At the same time as KCs was reduced.

[apinknightmare]

1 hour ago, Belinea said:

I don't know if he’s ready to move on, but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship. -SA

What is that even supposed to mean? He just needs to get laid? 

Based on what he said later in the interview, I'm guessing yes?

Quote

‘Concurrently, we’re not allowed to say playboy. He has dated one woman since season two ... Stop writing playboy. If you would like him to be a playboy, then, by all means, start writing him like one and then we can do it.’

Like...weren't you the one who said you wanted that to stop, Steve? This show...lol

[Morrigan2575]

6 hours ago, statsgirl said:

There's still time.   Isn't she on until 509?

Never underestimate the stupidity of the EPS.

Yeah, there could be something with the reporter I thought she was a possible LI from the casting announcement.

However, the spoiler was FALSE. It was VERY specific. He was going to find out about Felicity/Malone go on a drunken bender and sleep with Reporter but, instantly regret it AND the reporter would be gone by 507.

Could he sleep with her in the future? Sure but THIS particular spoiler was False and, I want that to be very clear. 

[lemotomato]

Spoilery stuff from the seat42 interview video:

- lots of stuff about Susan. Everything about her is reported in the Den of Geek article

- Tina is someone the team "tracks down, that's operating in another city" and SA "think(s)  that she can be a cool character"

- Talia is supposed to facilitate the advancement of the flashback storyline

- Artemis is going to have trust issues with Oliver, which they're going to explore soon

- Oliver is living in the bunker (not spoilery, just thought I'd mention it because people were wondering)

The rest of the video is about the logistics of shooting the crossover and talk about what it's like to work with Dolph Lungren.

Edited November 3, 2016 by lemotomato
formatting and editing is complete crap on mobile

[apinknightmare]

Regarding Oliver living in the bunker - didn't Felicity - I think it was in the premiere maybe? When she and Curtis were fiddling around with a computer - say something to Oliver like, "You're here late" when he walked into the bunker? If he lives there, like...

stop trying to make it make sense, stop trying to make it make sense

[bijoux]

I love how they apparently think it's logicl for the mayor, with actual security detail, to be living in a sublevel bunker. LOL

Artmeis suddenly having trust issues seems out of the blue and lame. If she should have them, Wild Dong would make more sense. First he dragged her into a fight unawareas, then snitched on her to Oliver and then gave up Oliver's identity to a really bad dude. Meaning he could do it to her one day in a not too distant future. 

[apinknightmare]

6 minutes ago, bijoux said:

I love how they apparently think it's logicl for the mayor, with actual security detail, to be living in a sublevel bunker. LOL

How awkward for him when Susan asks, "My place or yours?" 

Then again, maybe Oliver goes peak dumbass and invites a reporter down into the lair. And then they can get comfy on his dorm room cot. Romantique! 

[lemotomato]

Quote

Amell confirmed that there would be a "certain element of romance" between Oliver and Susan, adding that: "I hope that people enjoy it because I’ve found it to be really dynamic so far."

He must be talking about the same people that WM hopes will root for Tiny Hands. 

What are they putting in the water up there?

[dtissagirl]

2 hours ago, Lidach said:

...not sure, but I think her contract expires after season 5, Y/N? I don't have info or anything, just speculation.

If someone has a source, help!, but I've read that during one of the cons she attended, she said she signed a 6 year deal after S1, so -- her contract is all the way up to S7, same as Steve's.

[Belinea]

50 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

He must be talking about the same people that WM hopes will root for Tiny Hands. 

So, she is supposed to be somewhat unlikeable. At least that is what the normal viewer should take away, right? But further down the line you should change your mind because she is having sex with Oliver. Am I getting the logic right? 

Edited November 3, 2016 by Belinea

[Morrigan2575]

34 minutes ago, dtissagirl said:

If someone has a source, help!, but I've read that during one of the cons she attended, she said she signed a 6 year deal after S1, so -- her contract is all the way up to S7, same as Steve's.

All i know is that her contract has been renegotiated a couple of times since she signed.  They did something before S3 which seemed to include her Flash crossover appearances (that's what I heard).  Her contract was renegotiated again before S4 where she got a pay raise and a rise in perks.

There's absolutely nothing in the show of BTS that even remotely indicates that Felicity or EBR is going anywhere.  In fact, from what i can see, just the opposite 

[Mellowyellow]

5 minutes ago, Belinea said:

So she is supposed to be somewhat unlikeable. At least that is what the normal viewer should take away right? But further down the line you should change your mind because she is having sex with Oliver. Am I getting the logic right? 

Does this mean she will leave Louis Litt alone on Suits? Silver lining!

I've come to a stage of acceptance and now I just want Felicity to get a better storyline. If there is a future love interest please make him cuter and more interesting!

[Thundercatmary]

The more of these spoilers I here the more certain I am that I'm done. 

[ladylaw99]

I'm sorry but anytime SA, EP's or one of the writers like a storyline it is a guarantee I will hate it.

[apinknightmare]

2 minutes ago, ladylaw99 said:

I'm sorry but anytime SA, EP's or one of the writers like a storyline it is a guarantee I will hate it.

I learned that lesson early on, when I was new to the show and he kept saying that 2x15 was THE BEST EVER. And pretty much the only good thing about that ep was Oliver trying to escape the Amazo, and Slade catching him by the foot as he slammed into the side of the boat, and then flipping him onto the deck. My fave Arrow gif in existence. 

If SA likes it, it's guaranteed to be garbage. 

[insomniadreams88]

5 hours ago, looptab said:

I think EBR said that, and it might have been another instance where they told her what would happen, she anticipated something, and then  the execution was very different from what she expected.

That's what I think too. Because wasn't there an interview that the Havenrock storyline would be eps 3-5? Where was it in 5? 

This worries me for whatever's supposedly coming up for Felicity in 5B. It'll probably be one or two scenes or a line or two here that's brushed aside for everything else going on. (Sort of like what happened with her father last year in 413; it seemed like every conversation about him became about Malcolm.)

4 hours ago, Belinea said:

I don't know if he’s ready to move on, but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship. -SA

What is that even supposed to mean? He just needs to get laid? 

I mean, I am not even against it but please just get it over with... At least it seems as though the reporter has a purpose other than bedding Oliver. What is Billy's purpose again? 

Billy's purpose is clearly so that Oliver doesn't look like the bad guy by "moving on" first. Hasn't Susan already had more scenes than Billy has in half the episodes? 

[Chaser]

His comment about it being time for another relationship made me roll my eyes. I wonder what handbook he pulled out for that - "The Moonlighting Curse and How To Avoid it", "TV Tropes for Dummies", "Cliche! Cliche! Cliche!"

I hope their relationship is as romantic as Felicity's and as quick as her lunch hour. 

This is why I want to throw a book at the writers heads. Mayo isn't about Felicity, it's about giving Oliver a reason to move on to his Temp. They clearly have no interest in writing this relationship for Felicity. He has serviced his purpose, can they just dump him and give her something good?

[tv echo]

@quarks, thanks for remembering all of the other female characters that have appeared on Arrow over the past four seasons. Clearly, your memory is superior to mine.

[Password]

Whilst I find what SA said about Oliver needing another relationship laughable, I can't hate on SA. He's such a trooper with these terrible storylines. Maybe he says he loves them because he knows they're terrible. 

I struggle to understand WHAT Felicity's storyline is this season. Considering how never mind Havenrock was, I have little hope for 5b.

[dtissagirl]

22 minutes ago, Chaser said:

They clearly have no interest in writing this relationship for Felicity. He has serviced his purpose, can they just dump him and give her something good?

Back in S3 when Guggenheim was all over Tumblr, and everyone was pissed at Felicity being stuck in Palmer Island, he legit did. not. get. that her simply being on screen and having lines = does not a storyline makes. He said something like "she's part of an ensemble, so she's part of the story". He thinks screentime means agency and/or character development. I don't think that has changed in anyway since then.

[lemotomato]

5 minutes ago, Password said:

Whilst I find what SA said about Oliver needing another relationship laughable, I can't hate on SA. He's such a trooper with these terrible storylines. Maybe he says he loves them because he knows they're terrible. 

Except in this case where it sounds to me like he gave them the OK, if not actively encouraged the EPs to bring back playboy Oliver.

Quote

‘Concurrently, we’re not allowed to say playboy. He has dated one woman since season two ... Stop writing playboy. If you would like him to be a playboy, then, by all means, start writing him like one and then we can do it.’

Edited November 3, 2016 by lemotomato

[dtissagirl]

I need someone [or everyone also works!] to passive-aggressively send Steve a clip from that Nerd HQ panel wherein he boasted about going to the writers and asking for the cavalcade of women to stop. Spouting the company line is kinda like being Winston Smith, Steve. In the end, he loved Big Brother.

[Sunshine]

WM said at least 2 things in some of her interviews (don't remember which and too lazy to go look) which I think are playing out right now.

1.  Oliver & Felicity are both going to have to figure out what their relationship means to them before they can decide to fight for it (not a direct quote).   This can only mean romantic relationship because their working relationship is fine which they have been stressing since SDCC.   Cue new boyfriend and Oliver dating or whatever.  If it's not the reporter it will be someone else.  We might be better off if the reporter is more than just a hook-up.  In 5.06 Felicity CONSIDERS telling the Detective about what she does.  What she does will give us an idea of long-term temp or soon to be over-temp. (I think this also explains SA's I don't know if he's ready to move on but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship.)

2.  The most ominous...We are not necessarily reuniting them this season.  We will have to wait and see how that plays out. 

In season 5 the only regular getting a fleshed-out story appears to be Oliver, at least in 5A.  The other focus is on Wild Dog and 5.07 is supposed to be focused on Vigilante.  Diggle & Felicity's stories as set-up in 5.02 are supposed to be still paying dividends at least through 5.12.  I think we know Diggle's arc (guilt) but it might end up being more about mentoring Wild Dog so we'll see.  IMO, Felicity's is probably about finding and setting up a network of vigilantes.  I just don't expect much else.  I'm not sure what else Havenrock related would/could occur other than her having scenes with Rory, doing what I don't know. Even if they went the route of her setting up Smoak Tech I would think that would be more about giving Curtis a place to create his technology than her.  I agree with @dtissagirl that they equate screen time with story lines.

SA's remarks about finding Tina in another city versus the description of a CC cop who is anti-vigilante was interesting.  Do they find her in Hub City?  Maybe she is Black Canary but she simply comes and goes throughout the story.  This would also lend credence to the idea of a vigilante network.

Edited November 3, 2016 by Sunshine

[apinknightmare]

I wonder what the tone of the playboy comment was when he said it-because the "by all means" sounds kind of sarcastic. I don't expect this show to stick to its own canon at this point, but the playboy thing was something that SA got so many fan complaints about that HE brought it up to TPTB, so going back on something that was his idea seems weird. Because doesn't seem like the type of guy who can admit he was wrong and thus backtrack on something that he brought up on the first place. 

Edited November 3, 2016 by apinknightmare

[Chaser]

If you like the direction the show is going, read SAs interviews. If you don't, avoid his interviews. He's a company man.

[Carrie Ann]

13 minutes ago, lemotomato said:

Except in this case where it sounds to me like he gave them the OK, if not actively encouraged the EPs to bring back playboy Oliver.

I really hate to defend any part or player in this mess right now, but when I watched the video of the interview (it's at about 15:45 minutes in the video posted in the Spoilers Only thread--I know you posted the vid @lemotomato, but just in case others haven't watched), I saw SA's "playboy" statement as joking, or more likely, defensive of Oliver in advance as NOT being a playboy, because of what he knows is coming. I think he knows people aren't going to like it or that they will jump back on the "Oliver is a womanizer" train, and he's saying that Oliver has been with one woman since S2 and being with another won't make him a playboy. I don't like the statement or the likely impetus behind it, but I really don't think (yet) that he wants Oliver to be the Ollie of the comics w/r/t women. If the EPs want it, then I'm sure he will be fully supportive.

Edited November 3, 2016 by Carrie Ann

[bijoux]

5 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

In 5.06 Felicity CONSIDERS telling the Detective about what she does.  What she does will give us an idea of long-term temp or soon to be over-temp.

She told Curtis he was a telemarketer. I'm clear about where this is going.

[tv echo]

From the Seat42F video...

SA: "I don't know if he’s ready to move on, but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship. We actually had a moment - we had a moment earlier this year and I was speaking with Wendy Mericle, and I'm like, ‘Look, guys, there's two things that we're no longer allowed to write about Oliver. We’re no longer allowed to call him a billionaire because he’s been broke for three years. Right? Not broke, but not a billionaire. He’s lost his family’s fortune. So, we’re not allowed to say billionaire anymore.' I said, concurrently, we’re not allowed to say playboy. He has dated one woman since season two. And, you know, he hasn't even - I mean, he had a fling with Isabel Rochev, that was it. Stop writing playboy. If you like him to be a playboy, then, by all means, start writing him like one, and then we can do it. So, I think that it's - you know, I've had a couple of scenes with Carly, who's doing a great job as Susan Williams, and I do think that it's - that there'll be some exploration of a certain element of romance between the two of them and I hope that - I hope that it's - I hope that people enjoy it because I've found it to be really dynamic so far." 

SA: "I thought that Oliver was fine, if not slightly confused, that Felicity didn't tell him that she was dating someone. That wasn't ever - I wasn't actually a huge fan of the idea that she wouldn't say something because of, you know, all the reasons that their relationship fell apart last year, which was secrets being kept. So, um - to me, when I played those scenes tonight, it was like, 'Hey, you know, we work together, so if you’re keeping anything from me, anything, why? You know, is it because you don't trust me? You don't trust me, is that a problem?' So, to me, it was really about getting to the source of what her issue was. It was less about Oliver and it was more about, you know, 'Are we OK? Are we good? Because now it’s not just you and me down there. We have John back in the fold, we have Thea operating the political axis of Star City, and we have these new recruits who look for us for guidance, so let's make sure that as the... theoretical leaders of the team, that we are on the same page.'" 

[Sunshine]

Thanks @tv echo.  I tried to watch but after about 3 minutes couldn't bear to listen to him speak anymore. Just wasn't interested in what he had to say. :-)

[bijoux]

Well, I do like that he calls them the leaders of the team.

As for the playboy bit, it's a bit all over the place, but I think the point was that they can't promote Oliver as a billionaire playboy since he hasn't been either of those things for the better run of the show. If you want to promote him as such, write him as one.

[way2interested]

3 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

1.  Oliver & Felicity are both going to have to figure out what their relationship means to them before they can decide to fight for it (not a direct quote).   This can only mean romantic relationship because their working relationship is fine which they have been stressing since SDCC.   Cue new boyfriend and Oliver dating or whatever.  If it's not the reporter it will be someone else.  We might be better off if the reporter is more than just a hook-up.  In 5.06 Felicity CONSIDERS telling the Detective about what she does.  What she does will give us an idea of long-term temp or soon to be over-temp. (I think this also explains SA's I don't know if he's ready to move on but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship.)

I'm wondering where they're going to take the whole "considers telling him" plot, since that and the context of their relationship in 505 basically hints that she doesn't. Like, are they going to go for the idea of not sharing everything with the bf, showing that this thing isn't real as she/Oliver thought it could be? Or would it just be an avoidance thing since the GA is going to be touted as a serial killer, showing a beginning of the end type thing with that relationship while Oliver grows closer to the reporter?

[blixie]

Quote

I don't know if he's ready to move on but it's time for Oliver to have another relationship.

I actually agree with this and I like the idea that he might retreat to if not full playboy at least, to what's familiar to him, aka superficial relationships that aren't particularly intimate, because I pretty much want it to be only a few people who are capable of bringing that level of vulnerability out in Oliver. IDK Berlanti et al are just so bad at writing relationships, so I'm not even sure why I want to see them attempt Olicity again, besides the obvious that EBR/SA are so so so great together. 

And yet I don't actually want to watch him hooking up with randoms even if the hook ups are significant dating, because SA doesn't have great chemistry with very many of his LI that aren't EBR and for me The Huntress actress.

[insomniadreams88]

2 minutes ago, way2interested said:

showing a beginning of the end type thing with that relationship while Oliver grows closer to the reporter?

I'm guessing this. And then they can have Felicity realize that her relationship with Billy isn't "real" just as she thinks Oliver is moving on.

Honestly? I think they don't know how to write the beginning of a relationship for Oliver and Felicity, so if they do get back together this season, it'll be at the end of it and then they can do the standard 5 month time jump before the premiere. Think about it. 301 - the first date, ended in a disaster. 320 - slept together, but they didn't get together until the end of 323. Picked up with 401, they were living together in domestic bliss. 

[statsgirl]

No matter what she tells Mayo, I don't see this being over any time soon.   She tells him; they're moving into a serious relationship with honesty (shock!)  If she doesn't tell him she's still not breaking up with him.  But I'm pretty sure she's going to tell him now that he's working with Oliver unless they really want to kill the character.

Personally, if Oliver is going to sleep with someone else, I want him to sleep with everyone else.  First, because there will be less chemistry than with Olicity, and second because let's give the comic book bro dudes what they really want and watch the ratings drop.  And because I really want him to look like a sleazebag again since they're throwing Felicity to the wolves to get back season 1.

Just not with that terrible dialogue from the Tina sides "you're the best fighter I've ever seen.".

[bijoux]

1 minute ago, statsgirl said:

No matter what she tells Mayo, I don't see this being over any time soon.   She tells him; they're moving into a serious relationship with honesty (shock!)  If she doesn't tell him she's still not breaking up with him.  But I'm pretty sure she's going to tell him now that he's working with Oliver unless they really want to kill the character.

Do we know this for certain? I'm not saying she does break up with him in the next episode, even though I very mch doubt the so called relationship goes on for long, but I don't see the connection that clearly indicates they don't break up.