Spoiler Discussion Thread

[AyChihuahua]

His "marriage" to Nyssa is exactly as binding as the writers want it to be.  So far they seem to be treating it as a joke (which, legally IRL is what it would be).  Now that Nyssa would die before helping Malcolm with his schemes, I'm not too worried.  (I always thought she'd show up, with Malcolm, at O/F's wedding and it'd be a big "He's already married...to me!" drama, but I think Nyssa would kill herself before she'd help Malcolm.  She could end up with her own scheme and use the "marriage" against Oliver to secure his assistance, though, maybe.)

[lemotomato]

Someone just posted this on tumblr. I'm just really amused at the faces SA makes whenever Ray Palmer is brought up.

[SmallScreenDiva]

I had to check if Stephen did actually make that face during that question, and OMG, he did! It starts right around the 9:32 mark of this clip. I don't think he realizes it, which makes it even funnier, LOL! It's like an automatic reaction to Ray's name (a reaction probably shared by many on this board, hehehe)

Edited October 24, 2015 by SmallScreenDiva

[Chaser]

LOL. Nice duck face.

Anyone else think his answer to Ray was a bit of a ramble?

[BkWurm1]

To be fair, SA then went on to mildly rant about how because of LoT, stuff that normally would be secrets on Arrow are common knowledge (Sara,Ray, Vandle Savage)

The face maybe about their not being any surprises this season except the mystery grave. 

[Happy Harpy]

His "marriage" to Nyssa is exactly as binding as the writers want it to be.  So far they seem to be treating it as a joke (which, legally IRL is what it would be).  Now that Nyssa would die before helping Malcolm with his schemes, I'm not too worried.  (I always thought she'd show up, with Malcolm, at O/F's wedding and it'd be a big "He's already married...to me!" drama, but I think Nyssa would kill herself before she'd help Malcolm.  She could end up with her own scheme and use the "marriage" against Oliver to secure his assistance, though, maybe.)

I think you're right on the money with the last one. I was surprised by the "sister in law" mention, since TPTB took heat because they forced a gay woman to marry a straight man so I believed they'd want this detail dead and buried and unLPed.

I have no idea of what they're cooking, though. If Nyssa needs his help, I think Oliver would help her (she did help him, twice) and wouldn't need to be coerced; moreover I believe she doesn't have enough to coerce him. I mean, if Oliver refused  to break his truce with Malcolm by helping her out of jail, for example, I don't see how he'd accept  in order to be able to marry Felicity, and Felicity wouldn't let him anyway. Same if Nyssa asked him to do something evil that would prompt him to refuse.

Moreover, I have a huge capacity to suspend disbelief when it comes to law, but even I won't swallow that a grand-guignolesque ceremony in a shadowy cult has any legal value whatsoever in the USA.

 

But TPTB want Malcolm around, so I would say that if Nyssa is back this season, there's a good chance it will be a Team Arrow to the rescue in NP and the "sister in law" line might factor, hopefully just in order to remind forgetful  (or back after quitting during S3) viewers that Oliver and Nyssa were allied once without Sara, so he has a reason to help her.

 

For Oliver's campaign funding, I'm waiting for some fanservice and another Walter Steele name dropping. I wish there could be a cameo for the Christmas episode, sigh.

Edited October 24, 2015 by Happy Harpy

[Guest]

I have no doubt the 'marriage' to Nyssa will be a problem at some point. I knew they'd use some lame joke to bring it up (I predicted Nyssa would call Oliver her husband so I wasn't far off haha). Anything to throw a spanner in the Olicity works at some point. I can't see it being a long term issue though. 

 

Also I love how SA has no poker face when it comes to Ray Palmer. Bless!

[kismet]

About the ying-yang kiss ~ can I make a request, perhaps almost prediction?

 

That it will be when we finally hear OQ & FS tell each other they are in love with each other. I know we know & they know they are in love with each other, but I want to hear it. It was so nice to hear SA say it in his interview when talking about OQ's relationships. But I need it in canon on the show. I want more than just an "I love you" I want a straight up "I am in love with you" or "I am so in love with you". Bonus points if it leads to or comes after hot sex.

[Velocity23]

Stephens face when Ray is mentioned is glorious!

[wingster55]

I don't think those are displeased faces re: Ray.

[AyChihuahua]

I was thinking about how much FB Oliver still needs to change to match S1 present-day Oliver.  I think, for me, it's not so much his overall actions, bc again, he was not a serial killer in S1 and he never killed a good guy.  So for me, I think it's his demeanor that needs to change.    (Plus his skills, since he couldn't take down a regular drug dealer a couple episodes ago.)  He basically just doesn't seem blank/focused enough.  The focus thing could come about from his determination to right his father's wrongs, which he doesn't really have yet.  But something else pretty bad needs to happen to him, which could get him properly blank/depressed rather than him necessarily doing really bad things.

[dtissagirl]

I barely get where the "Oliver was a serial killer" thing came from. Sure, he killed a whole bunch of people, Lance even told Roy and Thea an actual number. But imo, S1!Oliver was waging a one-man army war, and soldiers kill their enemies in war times. And he's not a soldier yet in the flashbacks, which is what I think they need to get him to. He already has the survival instincts, but in S1 it felt like he was conflicted between surviving and a ginormous death wish -- hence the war time thinking of kill or be killed.

 

The whole motif of his S1 vigilante-ing for me was Oliver realizing he was never gonna win the war -- because you cannot fight a war alone -- but once you find the right people to assist you, you can have yourself a crusade.

[statsgirl]

I wonder if they're having trouble being able to take Oliver as dark as they need to to get him to where he was in s1.  People don't like their heroes to be that bad.

 

I think Nyssa's "sister-in-law" was MG's way of saying neener, neener to everyone who hated the marriage.

 

It was cute when Lance wasn't super terrible. And if he is the one that dies in 5 months (and somehow stops being super terrible), I really don't want that for Donna..

I'm pretty sure that by the time he meets Donna, Quentin will have gone through a whole redemption arc and be working with Oliver and Diggle to take down DD/HIVE.  He'll probably needs lots of sex by then.

 

 

But imo, S1!Oliver was waging a one-man army war, and soldiers kill their enemies in war times.

Not if you're Omar Khadr. Then it's murder. (Sorry but it infuriates me.)

[apinknightmare]

I don't think the sister-in-law joke was a jab. I think it was just a joke - something to let the audience know that they're not pretending the wedding didn't happen. It was a good joke, too, until people started asking MG to explain it, and he started explaining it. 

Edited October 24, 2015 by apinknightmare

[tv echo]

Back in May of 2014 (right before the S2 finale aired), MG gave this interview to OK Magazine in which he said this about Felicity's father:

OK!: There’s a lot of theories about Felicity’s father, and how the reveal will impact the team. Any hints?

MG: It’s funny, the whole back story for Felicity was worked out at the beginning of season 2, and we thought, We’re absolutely going to get to it in season 2. We’ll finally do this episode, and you’ll finally seeing this parent. And then we just have a lot of characters and we’re pushing a lot of story. That story kept getting kicked down the road. Then we realized we ran out of room in season 2. We’re determined to tell that story in season 3. We’ve dropped little hints about it.

http://okmagazine.com/meet-the-stars/arrows-executive-producer-shares-the-secret-to-felicity-and-olivers-chemistry/

 

But more recently, the EPs said this about Felicity's father (from S4 spoilers):

-- MG and WM hope to reveal more information about Felicity’s dad at some point.  MG: “I think Felicity’s dad remains that topic - we were talking about it in the room yesterday. We’re always talking about it. But, again, we have to find the right story and the right moment. I guess we trust our own process, that it will come to us when it’s meant to come to us… just like with the comics, we don’t sit there with a checklist. We don’t sit there with a list of cards we want to turn over; we have a deck of cards that we know we can turn over, but it’s about finding the right moment, not just doing it to do it." (KsiteTV article, page 21 of Spoilers thread)
-- On whether we’ll learn any information about Felicity's father now that Donna Smoak’s visit has been extended, WM: “We’re hoping."  Also, MG: "We’re always talking about it, but we have to find the right story and the right moment. We trust that it will come to us when it’s meant to come to us.”  (TVLine article, page 22 of Spoilers thread, and IGN article, page 22 of Spoilers thread)

 

Also, per EBR, Felicity's father is coming this season.  So do you think the EPs really have a plan for Felicity's father, or are they just blowing smoke playing it by ear?

Edited October 25, 2015 by tv echo

[dtissagirl]

That MG answer to OK magazine looks to me that it's about Donna. He totally sidestepped "father" by saying "this parent". And I'm pretty sure they've mentioned before that they had Mama Smoak planned for S2 [after the S1 hints of casino, and counting cards, and Vegas], but she was pushed back to S3.

[Morrigan2575]

IIRC there was an interview in S1 or the summer before 2 where they talked about having a whole bio/backstory written out for Felicity. I believe Geoff Johns did the write up for them. So yes, I think they had a general idea of Felicity's story for awhile now. Was it 100% set in stone? Nope, I'm sure there was some general plan dad = villain causes issues for TA. I wouldn't even be surprised to find out that the level of villain was dependent upon the staus of Olicity when tbey got around to introducing him into the story.

Since I'm in the minority regarding DD being Felicity's dad, I actually take the latest round of interviews as actual confirmation that DD will (most likely) turn out to be DD.

[tangerine95]

I'm in that minority too.I think its DD and I want it to be.It doesn't make sense to me to make it seem like DD has a family and then make them someone random.Also the way they are hyping this it has to be a big villain and bringing in another big bad would take away focus from DD which I don't think they want.Making Felicity's dad someone working for DD,though I would be okay with it if written well,would be kind of underwhelming after all the hype.

[jay741982]

IIRC there was an interview in S1 or the summer before 2 where they talked about having a whole bio/backstory written out for Felicity. I believe Geoff Johns did the write up for them. So yes, I think they had a general idea of Felicity's story for awhile now. Was it 100% set in stone? Nope, I'm sure there was some general plan dad = villain causes issues for TA. I wouldn't even be surprised to find out that the level of villain was dependent upon the staus of Olicity when tbey got around to introducing him into the story.

Since I'm in the minority regarding DD being Felicity's dad, I actually take the latest round of interviews as actual confirmation that DD will (most likely) turn out to be DD.

I don't get Wanting someone Uber Evil to be Felicity's Dad. Plus it has been done before and this show hits the stupid button to Keep MM around and he should be dead or in Jail

[looptab]

 I wouldn't even be surprised to find out that the level of villain was dependent upon the staus of Olicity when tbey got around to introducing him into the story.

 

Could you expand on that thought? You think the closer they are,the less evil or the more? It's an interesting consideration.

[apinknightmare]

Yeah, I'm not keen at all on the big bad evil dad route. It's a replay of the Malcolm/Thea dynamic, which hasn't been all that great IMO. I don't mind Felicity's dad being a villain necessarily, I just don't want him to be some talisman-using, magic-having, Lazarus Pit-using psycho. He's over 122 years old, I just...I can't. The idea that some dude who wanted to be the next Ra's al Ghul, stole Lazarus Pit waters, and has some kind of magic-granting totem or whatever hiding in a closet shacked up in Vegas and had a family with Donna for 5-6 years is so ridiculous to me I absolutely dread them going there. I agree that there are anvils falling all over the place with his comment about daughters and NM's comment about having something precious in his life that it is likely he is her father, but I will hope until I can't hope anymore that isn't the case. 

 

I'd rather he be Donna's father/Felicity's grandfather, or basically anyone else other than her dad. 

Edited October 25, 2015 by apinknightmare

[bijoux]

I'd rather he be Donna's father/Felicity's grandfather, or basically anyone else other than her dad. 

This is a theory that's popped up on Tumblr in the past few days. It's not the worst one ever. There's also the possibility of him being the grandfather on the disappearing dad's side. Like, maybe and Donna were the dad's act of rebelion. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[apinknightmare]

This is a theory that's popped up on Tumblr in the past few days. It's not the worst one ever. There's also the possibility of him being the grandfather on the disappearing dad's side. Like, maybe and Donna were the dad's act of rebelion. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

It's been brought up here before, too. 

 

I also think him being her grandfather is ridiculous, but less ridiculous than him being her father. 

[Morrigan2575]

Could you expand on that thought? You think the closer they are,the less evil or the more? It's an interesting consideration.

I think if Olicity wasn't a couple or were just being teased Felicity's father would be a low level villain, like The Clock King. Someone that gets wrapped up in an episode only to come back once or twice a season to be a mild thorn in TAs side.

Because Felicity and Olicity are central to Oliver's story than Felicity's father had to be central to the main season long story. We pretty much knew from S2 that Felicity's father was going to be introduced as a villain, especially after we learned Donna was normal. It was only a matter of the level of villain.

[hogwash]

If Felicity's dad has to be a villian, I hope it's not DD. It doesn't make any sense. I'm hoping she doesn't recognize him when they see Lance talking to him. After the clusterfuck that was Thea and Malcolm's S03 relationship, I don't trust them to do this right.

Plus, I always imagined him as the bad version of Felicity with Team Arrow. If that makes any sense...

[tangerine95]

I'm fine with her dad being a DD level villain because I don't think we got that with Thea and Malcolm.They had a good start at the end of season 2 but it just turned into Thea being used to keep Malcolm relevant so they can keep JB on the show.It barely explored Thea's character beyond Malcolm teaching her to fight so she can put on a mask.She changed her mind about him every other episode according to what the plot needed her to think,it made no sense.

I think they can do it much better with Felicity and DD and it would be interesting to see Felicity deal with that.

[dtissagirl]

I think they've made it clear Papa Smoak is at least morally ambiguous by having that line Felicity said that he would have been in jail. So Felicity IS aware that he's done something that would have gotten him arrested. Which doesn't really sound so much like Evil Villain Who Wants to Be Master of the Universe to me, but it's not like this show doesn't go for the obvious when they want to.

 

If it's not DD, I'm wondering if it'll be one of his "partners in HIVE", but an age-appropriate one who isn't 120+ years and took a rando decade-long vacation in Vegas in the '90s.

[looptab]

I think if Olicity wasn't a couple or were just being teased Felicity's father would be a low level villain, like The Clock King. Someone that gets wrapped up in an episode only to come back once or twice a season to be a mild thorn in TAs side.

Because Felicity and Olicity are central to Oliver's story than Felicity's father had to be central to the main season long story. We pretty much knew from S2 that Felicity's father was going to be introduced as a villain, especially after we learned Donna was normal. It was only a matter of the level of villain.

Thank you. I wasn't sure whether you meant it as you explained, or if you thought it could have been used as a mean to deepen/explore Olicity.

[apinknightmare]

If it's not DD, I'm wondering if it'll be one of his "partners in HIVE", but an age-appropriate one who isn't 120+ years and took a rando decade-long vacation in Vegas in the '90s.

 

I really hope so. And I'm hoping that DD's issues with kidnapping daughters isn't because he has one, but because he knows one of his partners does (and possibly even knows about Felicity) and thinks family in general is off-limits. 

 

Also, given what we know about Felicity's dad - that they were close, and that he was into electronics - I really just don't see that with DD. My biggest fear if he is her father is that she's going to recognize him next week, and she's not going to tell Oliver about it (although that interview with NM about Oliver using something against him, or saying something that gets to him indicates that she might possibly tell him right away). 

[Morrigan2575]

If it's not DD, I'm wondering if it'll be one of his "partners in HIVE", but an age-appropriate one who isn't 120+ years and took a rando decade-long vacation in Vegas in the '90s.

It's certainly possible. I only ruled that out because that would mean introducing another Big Bad for the season. Of course they could have a HIVE partner show up and team up with Arrow to stop DD because of Felicity but I don't know if they'd go in that direction.

To me, it all seems to be adding up to DD = Felicity's father but I'm prepared to be wrong.

[HighHopes]

I'm in that minority too.I think its DD and I want it to be.It doesn't make sense to me to make it seem like DD has a family and then make them someone random.Also the way they are hyping this it has to be a big villain and bringing in another big bad would take away focus from DD which I don't think they want.Making Felicity's dad someone working for DD,though I would be okay with it if written well,would be kind of underwhelming after all the hype.

 

I remember in season two when they made Ivo have a family that he had abandoned, and then the fandom at the time went crazy with the "Ivo is Felicity's father!" theory. I was in the camp that was firmly against that theory, for multiple reasons but the main one was being the "Oliver killed Felicity's father" reason. I wonder though, as SA had said that they apparently said up until mid season 2 that Oliver/Felicity was not happening, if Ivo was supposed to be her father. (I also wonder then if Oliver was supposed to know that he was her father... so many questions about season two and their original plans!)

 

I'm not so against DD being her father though. Probably because DD isn't just Oliver's story? But I would also like it if it was someone we have yet to meet, and that while he is still a bad guy, he isn't The Villain. 

[bijoux]

If Felicity's dad has to be a villian, I hope it's not DD. It doesn't make any sense. I'm hoping she doesn't recognize him when they see Lance talking to him. After the clusterfuck that was Thea and Malcolm's S03 relationship, I don't trust them to do this right.

Plus, I always imagined him as the bad version of Felicity with Team Arrow. If that makes any sense...

 

It makes complete sense- All of Fellicity's skill and intellect without proper channelling.

 

If it's not DD, I'm wondering if it'll be one of his "partners in HIVE", but an age-appropriate one who isn't 120+ years and took a rando decade-long vacation in Vegas in the '90s.

I'm completely open to this idea.

[dtissagirl]

My biggest fear if he is her father is that she's going to recognize him next week, and she's not going to tell Oliver about it (although that interview with NM about Oliver using something against him, or saying something that gets to him indicates that she might possibly tell him right away). 

 

Yeah. I'm terrified that they'll make Felicity keep that kind of secret for plot reasons, even though she just said LAST EPISODE that she hopes "we learned a lesson of the benefits of trusting our friends with our problems".

[tangerine95]

I remember in season two when they made Ivo have a family that he had abandoned, and then the fandom at the time went crazy with the "Ivo is Felicity's father!" theory. I was in the camp that was firmly against that theory, for multiple reasons but the main one was being the "Oliver killed Felicity's father" reason. I wonder though, as SA had said that they apparently said up until mid season 2 that Oliver/Felicity was not happening, if Ivo was supposed to be her father. (I also wonder then if Oliver was supposed to know that he was her father... so many questions about season two and their original plans!)

 

I'm not so against DD being her father though. Probably because DD isn't just Oliver's story? But I would also like it if it was someone we have yet to meet, and that while he is still a bad guy, he isn't The Villain.

I think there was a plan to maybe make Ivo her dad but they decided against it because as Felicity's role expanded and they decided to make her the main love interest they wanted her dad to be a bigger story.

Yeah I agree it doesn't feel like DD is just about Oliver in a way Slade or Ras were.I would be okay with someone else as long as it well written and nothing like the mess that was season 3 Malcolm/Thea relationship.But I also really like the idea of it being DD since he will be a season long villain at least and is the central story of the season.I would prefer that for Felicity than a side villain.

[Chaser]

If DD is her father, it doesn't sound like something they are tackling until midseason at least. It may be that Felicity doesn't recognize him when she sees him in the next episode, allowing the speculation about DD to die down. Then Donna shows up in 3x09 throwing everyone for a loop.

[AyChihuahua]

I can't with any of this stuff with DD either being her dad or having issues with family being injured or whatever other code of honor bullshit.  Of course, I hated that supposed code of honor bullshit with the other villains: RAG perfectly happy to take out 50 innocent people a day/an entire city after being all pissy at MM for trying to take out a section of a city; MM, with anything, EVER; or Maseo, perfectly happy to help murder a whole bunch of people the same way his son was murdered.  At least Slade never acted above it all when he was willing to murder ERRYONE just to make Oliver sad.  I mean, how many FAMILIES did DD think were going to die when he blew up the damn train station?  And he was so offended by Anarky taking the daughter, who was RIGHT THERE in that trunk....here's a thought, DD, you don't like him taking the daughter, how about killing Anarky and releasing the girl?  If you don't want her to see your face, just have the whole trunk transported outside!  Or use your telekinetic juju to open the trunk from the other damn room?

 

See, the logic of him caring about families/daughters falls apart so fast.  He cares about families, except when he's killing them.  He cares about Donna/Felicity but hasn't bothered to keep track of what they're doing all these years?  That would only work if they'd been in hiding, and come on, DONNA ain't hiding from anyone.   

 

Plus, NM also said Oliver goes after the thing DD loves, and obviously Oliver would never hurt Felicity.  AND, this would be the THIRD evil dad storyline.  Hoping that this time it would be about the daughter v. the evil dad seems overly optimistic to me.  The first two evil dad storylines had the daughter as an afterthought at most.

 

I will say a lot of my issues would be reduced if he were her paternal grandfather.  The timing would work with him having a walkabout in the 70s (from the spoiler).  Then he wouldn't have lived with his family for 8-ish years.  Heck, it was the 70s, his son could have been the result of a villains' club key party.  

Edited October 25, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[Smoaking Reporter]

If DD is her father, it doesn't sound like something they are tackling until midseason at least. It may be that Felicity doesn't recognize him when she sees him in the next episode, allowing the speculation about DD to die down. Then Donna shows up in 3x09 throwing everyone for a loop.

In 2x13 she did tell Oliver that she can barely remember her father so if DD is her father I don't think she will recognize him right away.

[AyChihuahua]

 

Yeah. I'm terrified that they'll make Felicity keep that kind of secret for plot reasons, even though she just said LAST EPISODE that she hopes "we learned a lesson of the benefits of trusting our friends with our problems".

I would be okay with her not telling him instantly.  That's the kind of thing she'd need to process for a bit, and maybe discuss with her mom.  So if she recognizes DD in 4.4 and tells Oliver in 4.6, I'd be okay with that.

Edited October 25, 2015 by AyChihuahua

[Happy Harpy]

We pretty much knew from S2 that Felicity's father was going to be introduced as a villain, especially after we learned Donna was normal.

I love Donna, to bits, but it would have been so much more original from a writing standpoint if she had been the one with secrets. Part of me wouldn't mind her persona to be a cover, in order to protect Felicity, but another part of me loves that she's normal.

 

I'm in the camp of those who don't want DD to be Felicity's father. Indeed, after the way they imo botched Malcolm/Thea, I'm not optimistic at all. N.McDonough, C.Ross and EBR are great performers, but the problem with Malcolm/Thea was the writing, not the actors -it would have been ten times worse with less talented ones than J.Barroman and W.Holland, imo.

Actually, I don't even want Felicity's father to be a villain because after S3, I'm afraid that the writers won't know to exploit it otherwise than with cheap angst at best, with a fracture in OTA and a return of Podlicity at worst.

[Starfish35]

Was there ever any real evidence for the Ivo is Felicity's father theory? That just always seemed like a crazy fan theory that grew legs once Ausiello mentioned it.

[Morrigan2575]

Was there ever any real evidence for the Ivo is Felicity's father theory? That just always seemed like a crazy fan theory that grew legs once Ausiello mentioned it.

Yeah, I think I've was a fan theory that became something more when Ausi made that comment. What I don't understand is why he made that comment. It seemed to be something he knew and not just a random guess but who knows?

[HighHopes]

Was there ever any real evidence for the Ivo is Felicity's father theory? That just always seemed like a crazy fan theory that grew legs once Ausiello mentioned it.

I remember he was on the phone with his wife? (or a child?) and talked about how he had to leave them behind or something. I think that was the biggest part of it all. That and the EPs had been taking about Felicity's father being a thing in s2, and with 2x13, people jumped on Ivo being her father. I can't really remember anything else? But adding in Ausiello's mention, and fandom kinda turned theory into fact. 

 

I kinda feel the same way about DD being Felicity's father. A few mentions of a family, promise of her father finally appearing this season, and some of the more trustworthy reporters in the fandom getting on board with it, and then you have another "fact"? DD being her father just seems too easy for me? And a way of having the Big Bad and her father is killing two birds with one stone. Instead of needing to do two separate stories, they can combine them in one and save time and money. 

[statsgirl]

Thea and Nyssa both have evil fathers.  Laurel and Sara have a father who is a good guy but that they have problems communicating with.  Oliver has a father who was a fallible person and got caught up in something he couldn't handle.

 

If I had my druthers, I'd want Felicity's father to be like Oliver's, an essentially good guy, maybe a bit weak, who got into something over his head.  Maybe he thought he was doing the right thing and it ended up being for the wrong people.  I am so tired of the Evul Father trope in this show.

 

Felicity's statement that if her father hadn't left, he would have been in jail argues against it being DD because DD would be smarter than to let something be pinned on him. He's got minions for that.

 

I would, however, be okay with him being one of the partners in HIVE and incorporating him into the story that why when DD threatens/kidnaps Felicity.  Maybe by the end of the season, he could form an uneasy alliance with Oliver against DD and the others in HIVE. Or maybe just against DD, leaving HIVE to be the villain next season.

Edited October 25, 2015 by statsgirl

[kismet]

Yeah, I'm not keen at all on the big bad evil dad route. It's a replay of the Malcolm/Thea dynamic, which hasn't been all that great IMO. I don't mind Felicity's dad being a villain necessarily, I just don't want him to be some talisman-using, magic-having, Lazarus Pit-using psycho. He's over 122 years old, I just...I can't. The idea that some dude who wanted to be the next Ra's al Ghul, stole Lazarus Pit waters, and has some kind of magic-granting totem or whatever hiding in a closet shacked up in Vegas and had a family with Donna for 5-6 years is so ridiculous to me I absolutely dread them going there. I agree that there are anvils falling all over the place with his comment about daughters and NM's comment about having something precious in his life that it is likely he is her father, but I will hope until I can't hope anymore that isn't the case. 

 

I'd rather he be Donna's father/Felicity's grandfather, or basically anyone else other than her dad. 

 

 

This is a theory that's popped up on Tumblr in the past few days. It's not the worst one ever. There's also the possibility of him being the grandfather on the disappearing dad's side. Like, maybe and Donna were the dad's act of rebelion. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

It's been brought up here before, too. 

 

I also think him being her grandfather is ridiculous, but less ridiculous than him being her father. 

Yes! When I saw it resurface on Tumblr ~ I almost came here to post about it, but then I remembered we had the conversation a few months ago and there really was no new information to discuss. There is no even more to speculate on.

 

I am thinking that DD could be Donna's father/grandfather that would make more sense to me than DD as PapaSmoak. But I'm not sure they will bother to go there. I feel like his family is going to be random. But I would be on board with them linking it to DS, if it was done well. 

 

Honestly, I think PapaSmoak will be held until s5 and then set-up as the major villain. He will be introduced in s4, but then explored in s5 just like DD was. Every season they have parent issues. S1-MM & MQ; s2-MQ; s3-MM and s4-QL (weak, I know, but I think he stuff w/ DD is going to blow up big time). Unless they want to rethread MM or QL in s5, they need to bring in a new parent - enter PapaSmoak. I love MamaSmoak but she is like WS a good mirror to a villain but not a villain.

 

I also agree that the level of villain PapaSmoak is related to the level of importance of FS & Olicity to the Arrow narrative. Now that her stature has been elevated, so will the stature of her father which I think means season-long or major player of DD or MM-caliber (but not DD or MM). I wrote before that I think he could be a HIVE partner and help to take DD down - thereby indebting TA to him. With the debts comes the paybacks & payoffs and those can get dirty as we have seen with MQ & MM. He also could be unrelated to HIVE & perhaps Bratva linked (or maybe both). There are many angles they could take with PapaSmoak, and I don't think they are going to muddy the DD waters by making him PapaSmoak. They have good thing going with DD, if they make him PapaSmoak - they end all the angles they could possibly take with both characters. They didn't wait 4 years to introduce a character only to get to a dead end. They killed off MQ, its likely they might kill QL, MM can only give them so much parental/villain mileage. They need a new parent that can last a few seasons.

Edited October 25, 2015 by kismet

[Belinea]

Just read another article about the death on Arrow and for some reason that storyline bugs me so much. Most of all because 'not even the writers know'. So what does that mean: 1. They are lying  2. They don't even have a plan for the season (worrisome) 3. The writers don't know but the producers do 4. Back to 1, they know and are just milking this for what it is worth. Which again just shows that they don't know how to write a shocking story without killing off a main character. 

It just bugs me so much because by the way they are selling this, they might also be the people to kill off Diggle or Felicity.  Considering their PR skills, it seems  as though ripping out the heart of the show would be something that would fit their storytelling. One would think that they learned  a thing or two after the Sara thing and let's face it, they are not exactly GoT. 

Edited October 25, 2015 by Belinea

[AyChihuahua]

For people who know more about this than I, is the fact that the episode description for 4.06 is out, but the rating is TBD, really a sign that it's going to be a sexy episode?  (Sexisode?)  I would appreciate having an O/F love scene I can actually watch.

[apinknightmare]

I think they:

 

A) Know who they'd like to be in the grave, but are getting approval from the network

B) Know for sure who is in the grave, but are saying they don't so they don't have to tell the cast member who's dying

or

C) Know, but are pretending they don't. 

 

I don't believe that they don't know who's in there. 

For people who know more about this than I, is the fact that the episode description for 4.06 is out, but the rating is TBD, really a sign that it's going to be a sexy episode?  (Sexisode?)  I would appreciate having an O/F love scene I can actually watch.

 

It doesn't mean anything - over half of the CW episode descriptions are rated TBD for that week - I guess they haven't been reviewed yet. 

 

I'm fairly certain there is a sex scene in that ep though - that's where that upside-down kiss is from.

Edited October 25, 2015 by apinknightmare

[statsgirl]

 

I think they:

 

A) Know who they'd like to be in the grave, but are getting approval from the network

B) Know for sure who is in the grave, but are saying they don't so they don't have to tell the cast member who's dying

or

C) They know, but are pretending they don't.

I'd add

D) know who they want in the grave but are waiting to see how the fall episodes are received before they go with that person or change to their Option B.

[Morrigan2575]

Just read another article about the death on Arrow and for some reason that storyline bugs me so much. Most of all because 'not even the writers know'. So what does that mean: 1. They are lying  2. They don't even have a plan for the season (worrisome) 3. The writers don't know but the producers do 4. Back to 1, they know and are just milking this for what it is worth. Which again just shows that they don't know how to write a shocking story without killing off a main character. 

It just bugs me so much because by the way they are selling this, they might also be the people to kill off Diggle or Felicity.  Considering their PR skills, it seems  as though ripping out the heart of the show would be something that would fit their storytelling. One would think that they learned  a thing or two after the Sara thing and let's face it, they are not exactly GoT.

I don't think there's anything wrong with their PR, people are continuously talking and speculating about the death, which is exactly what they want.

As for not knowing the death, I think they have a short list of who is in the grave and will make the final decision probably over the Winter break. I'm fairly certain no one in the cast knows at this point.

[AyChihuahua]

As for not knowing the death, I think they have a short list of who is in the grave and will make the final decision probably over the Winter break. I'm fairly certain no one in the cast knows at this point.

I think they have a list of two.  And I think SA, among others, knows who's on that list.

 

Frankly, my ideal outcome, because Ray will be gone soon, would be for Quentin to die and Laurel to decide to start over in a new city offscreen, or join LoT.  (If I didn't know Ray was leaving I'd want it to be him, because I hate him 1000x more than I hate Laurel and Quentin combined.) 

Edited October 25, 2015 by AyChihuahua