S05.E04: Dog-Whistle Politics

[tomatoflyer]

Hated it. I used to be a hardcore olitz shipper, and then season 4 happened - I just couldn't when Fitz declared war and killed innocents by sending soldiers to war for something they never would have if they knew the real reasons. That was the moment that was too much, even for me.

So I'm sitting here, and Fitz only cares about his own wants - not America, or his kids or the mother of his kids. And I would love to go back to just feeling the romance but this show never lets me.

Seeing Huck on TV was freaky. He is the last person who should ever be on TV.

I don't like Marcus. I don't really like the racial stuff, and as a black woman, I still feel no sympathy for Olivia. Fitz' behavior is atrocious but she in no way gets a pass from me.

The Jake/B613 stuff is super lame. Die B613, die! I feel like the show has written itself into a corner with Jake - he can't hold a flame to Fitz, he doesn't feel integrated with the rest of OPA, so his plot has no longer interest.

I never liked Abby much, but I'm kinda a fan now. Looking forward to what's going to happen there.

[thewhiteowl]

For me, the B613 stuff is a welcome break from the White House stupidity.

[healthnut]

Finally there's a new member of OPA! It made no sense to me last season that they lost two people and they didn't add a single person. Marcus is a much needed addition. I liked his contribution. I agree that Huck should never be on TV. Dog whistle politics, is that a made up term? Never heard of it before but I liked it.

 

I liked Jake's character up through the season 4 finale. He no longer serves a purpose at this point. It was cute when he showed up in episode 2, but his purpose can't be Liv's new best friend. He can't serve a purpose at OPA because Huck and Quinn basically do the same thing. I think they would have been better off letting him die after he got stabbed. This crap with him now is ridiculous and unless it is going to have something to do with a future (good) plot, it is a complete waste, IMO.

 

So Nellie/Cyrus last 1.5 episodes. That sucks. I guess eventually he'll end up back with his true-love Fitz but I like Cyrus I need him to have a job. He speech was horrid, I can't believe he went there with the dead son. I'm glad Mellie is starting to finally get it. Roast Fitz over the coals girlfriend!

 

I don't want to like Olitz but dammit if they don't draw me in...

[unlabyrinth]

If I wanted to watch Alias, I'd break out the DVDs. The Jake/SD-6/B69 stuff is so disconnected from the main story.

When I saw Mia Maestro  in the credits, I had my fingers crossed that she'd be in a CotW or something related to the D.C media world wind. Had a nice long laugh when she approached Jake "in Paris" (ugh, that set design) and realized Scandal isn't just clinging harder to the B613 Alias-plots but now casting Alias alums.

Edited October 17, 2015 by unlabyrinth

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

New Hire
Olivia Pope and Associates hires hottie Marcus to help with their PR problem, and he gives them a master class in how the media perpetuates racism.

[PepSinger]

I loved this episode. All the racial stuff? So fucking on point it's ridiculous. As a black woman, I really appreciated it. I also felt bad for Olivia. Yes, she chose to have an affair, but she is being raked over the coals because she is black and a woman, her accomplishments be damned. That is infuriating to me.

[Tetraneutron]

I'm a big believer that show runners shouldn't cater to fans or lead via focus group. That the most invested fans have no clue how to run the program they love so much. 

 

But does ANYONE like F784? Does anyone think it's compelling, or interesting, or anything besides a massive waste of Joe Morton's talents? The best thing you can say about it is it pulls focus from the lead character. The worst you can say about it is it's sexist (I swear to God if Rowan gives Olivia one more speech where he tries to run her love life I'm going to punch my TV), melodramatic, incoherent, and so full of deus ex machinas it makes Greek theater look like The Wire. Not since Kalinda's ex husband on The Good Wife has anyone hated a story arc so much. 

 

This is pretty much the opinion of every professional critic and every pop culture website, right? I'm not just making it up? So why are we still dealing with it? It's no longer even remotely connected to Fitz, Olivia, or the White House any more. 

[CofCinci]

Shonda is very tied to the B8675309 concept, so she might as well just spin it off since she is unwilling to let it go.  Private Practice was a successful spin-off for GA.  It would keep Scott Foley employed, which is obviously meaningful to Shonda for some reason.  Pappa Pope, Charlie and special guest appearances from Huck during sweeps...

[ThomasAAnderson]

 

at least from this New Yorker cause I'm not gonna speak for us all. But I was born and raised there and this isn't something I gave a shit about. I heard it on the local news every night, didn't care for Guiliani, but...whatever.  Besides, Yankee Stadium was more the people's house for this New Yorker, not Gracie Mansion, LOL.

Thus proving my point that a mistress has moved into a "first lady" role in real life and nobody gave a shit. Therefore the show, hasn't gone off the rails or completely into fantasy world it's just forcing us to look differently at the scandals we've written off.

 

 

 

Good point about Fox News. I was thinking more of the mainstream media, as I think they can be unintentionally racist or sexist, but I didn't consider deliberately incendiary media outlets. I thought the Marcus/Quinn/Huck speaking tour was supposed to be on more mainstream shows like "Meet the Press." The ones who call Hillary Clinton "Mrs. Clinton" not because they're sexist pigs deliberately reducing a woman's accomplishments to her marriage, but because it's just how they do things and nobody has ever told them it's wrong.

That was a huge gathering of media that Marcus addressed, so I thought it was speaking more to contemporary reporting than a deliberate smear campaign. If Marcus was talking about (and to) deliberately incendiary media outlets, I like the subplot less. That's less of an opportunity for education and more of an exercise in futility.

It's not just Fox though, every network has talked about Hillary's laugh, hairstyle and lack of sex appeal for decades. Fox is only the least subtle but there is no line between Fox, Cnn and the rest anymore. You're missing the dog whistle. Hillary is a former Senator and SoS so she should be addressed as Madame Secretary or Senator not Mrs. Clinton. 'Mrs. Clinton', reduces her to Bill's wife and erases her being a politician in her own right. It's the point of a dogwhistle, those that don't hear it wonder why the person on the receiving end is kicking up such a fuss.

 

Marcus addressed his comments to all networks because all networks are guilty of dogwhistle politics. For example, every network uses "thug" as a euphemism for n*****. Note the Charleston Killer isn't a thug nor are the bikers that killed so many in Waco. Now that they've been called on it expect some new word to pop up in the national lexicon. The show got the definition wrong in that it's not only the person to whom the insult is aimed but the racist/misogynists who hear them.

 

Here's the article people think drove Shonda to write this episode..the first sentence alone is disgusting http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/21/arts/television/viola-davis-plays-shonda-rhimess-latest-tough-heroine.html

 

The idea that Olivia's father is a super spy and her mom is a terrorist is awesome. Bringing those characters to life and folding them into this story requires they bring in someone who writes spy well. I just can't get over what a bad TV kisser Scott Foley is. 

Edited October 18, 2015 by ThomasAAnderson

[Dejana]

But does she really love Fitz? Like in that love of my life, passionate way?  So would Fitz loving her be a win really? Maybe a win for her ego more than her heart I guess. I always got the impression that maybe she might have been fond of him a bit at one time, but that it was more a team that the two forged to make it to the White House and then once his time was over she would get her chance at power. I thought the main bond or passion that they shared was making it to the top in the political world. 

 

I never got this deep love, like Olivia was stealing the love of her life much less a man she truly loved. 

 

 

Responding in the Mellie thread

 

Huck being sent out to give interviews on political talk shows is one of the more unbelievable Scandal happenings ever, and that includes every B613 plot.

[ribboninthesky1]

I LOVED hearing all the racially coded language (I cannot tell you how many times I've been called articulate, "you speak so well," etc.) dropped in the episode because I know Shonda knows exactly what it means. And then to have ALL that shit laid bare in that media segment at the end was music to my "young[ish], gifted and black" ears. It was worth the whole episode (Jake ex Paris whatever).?When Marcus was talking about what he overheard in the grocery store, I was nodding. Shonda is excellent at describing and showing what it's like to be a black professional in a white world - which makes sense given her field. So many of those small "paper cut" experiences, like being mistaken for the assistant, are my experiences and it's refreshing to see them.

 

I also thought it was interesting that it was Marcus defending Olivia. It feels like an anomaly to see a black man PUBLICLY defend a black woman being thrown under the bus in such a way, particularly one that isn't "family."  

 

Anyway, I often question if Shonda even likes Olivia as a character, but she NAILS racial subtext like nobody's business. 

 

As for Fitz, I knew as soon as the "next time, choose a girl more palatable to the base" was delivered as a parting shot, he would toss all fucks and common sense out the window and go to Olivia.  Goldwyn doesn't get much acting credit because Fitz is so despised, but his face completely changed when that shot was fired - he went from pained resignation about his key legislation to defiance.  Then, he calls Olivia and she's breaking under the weight of the public scrutiny.  Yes, he went to Abby with the BS "what would Olivia do" scene, but to me, he made the decision before he went to her.  I'm not arguing that it was a smart move - but as someone mentioned upthread, it's refreshing to see Fitz willing to take his lumps now.          

 

The show will never get me to buy what they're selling with Mellie.

 

Thus proving my point that a mistress has moved into a "first lady" role in real life and nobody gave a shit. Therefore the show, hasn't gone off the rails or completely into fantasy world it's just forcing us to look differently at the scandals we've written off.

 

Yes, I learned a long time ago that infidelity doesn't always have a karmic price tag (actually, the longer I live, the less I believe in karma).  Sometimes, mistresses get their happy ending.  Olivia being a black woman, embroiled in the most scandalous of scandals, coming out of the other side of this with Fitz? If that's what she wants, I'm okay with that.  Olivia's done a lot of shady stuff - having an affair with a married POTUS is the least of it.  

[WhosThatGirl]

Ugh. This show. I will never get behind Fitz and Liv, ever and Fitz can't keep one promise to Mellie, can he? I hope he does get impeached and then he and Liv go to vermont and make jam forever. Then this show can be about Mellie and everyone else.

[fivestone]

I'm done with this show. I'm sorry I wasted hours of my life watching it. I get the sense that Kerry Washington is kinda over it too (not 100% - she keeps showing up to work and cashing those paychecks.) But maybe the plot line will keep getting so ridiculous that she tells Shonda either to rein things in or she's gonna bail. Either way, I refuse to hate-watch this show.

[janie2002]

But does she really love Fitz? Like in that love of my life, passionate way?  So would Fitz loving her be a win really? Maybe a win for her ego more than her heart I guess. I always got the impression that maybe she might have been fond of him a bit at one time, but that it was more a team that the two forged to make it to the White House and then once his time was over she would get her chance at power. I thought the main bond or passion that they shared was making it to the top in the political world. 

 

I never got this deep love, like Olivia was stealing the love of her life much less a man she truly loved. 

When they showed the flash backs of when they first got married they seemed very much inlove. I think she does love him and wants to be that powercouple they probably discussed when they were young and crazy about eachother. Then life happened, I do believe that is why she was willing to do the interview after he asked for forgiveness for taking from her. She felt like they could still be the power couple in a different way, he might not love her but they were going to accomplish everything they told eachother when they first dated, and that in itself could be a version of him still loving her. Like when divorced parents still have a good relationship and raise their children in a coparent way, the respect and admiration is there, tha is how I see Millies view on the presidency their baby their great accomplishment.

 

On a side note I hope Fitz does get impeached he is the shitiest president ever, and the declaration of war for his side piece should get him kicked out of office. This is why I never understood his rage at millie getting 12 jurors killed, when he got thousands of soliders killed for Oliva. I also really like Oliva with Jake.

[ZaldamoWilder]

I LOVED hearing all the racially coded language (I cannot tell you how many times I've been called articulate, "you speak so well," etc.) dropped in the episode because I know Shonda knows exactly what it means. And then to have ALL that shit laid bare in that media segment at the end was music to my "young[ish], gifted and black" ears. It was worth the whole episode (Jake ex Paris whatever).?When Marcus was talking about what he overheard in the grocery store, I was nodding. Shonda is excellent at describing and showing what it's like to be a black professional in a white world - which makes sense given her field. So many of those small "paper cut" experiences, like being mistaken for the assistant, are my experiences and it's refreshing to see them. Marcus is a good addition, and I've been saying they need associates.

I'm never going to accept "gladiate" though.

I found Cyrus's "Fitz is my son" dialogue completely repugnant. Just gross. That moment with Teddy, who I had quite literally forgotten about (he's like 5 now!) was cute.

 

and

 

Anyone who wants to fully exist in the 21st century knows there's a segment of society that will need to be dragged kicking and screaming into it. Then there are the others who don't know they hold bigoted ideas so they have to be thoroughly reeducated (i.e. intersectionality)

After Fitz called himself the 44th president I realized that the Scandal-verse is totally separate from reality.  

 

 

You mean the media that gleefully participated in the search for Barack Obama's birth certificate? Referred to his wife as his 'baby mama'? That routinely refers to his wife as 'angry'? That after getting called on saying "articulate" reduced his oratory skill to "teleprompter reading". There was actually a magazine article in which the writer complained that Obama walks too confidently.  This same  media that's obsessed with Hillary's hair and pants suits? The media knows exactly what it's doing when it refers to black boys as "thugs" and white criminals as "mentally ill". Biker gang vs. Motocycle club...I could go on but I'm sure you get the drift.

 

Someone said a while back that Mellie isn't savvy and doesn't have nearly the political chops she thinks she does. While it's terrible that she's being cheated on can we put to bed this notion that she's this genius being held back.

 

Rudy Guiliani moved his mistress into Gracie Mansion with his wife and kids. Only New Yorkers know that because it happened pre-9/11.  Sandford hiked the Appalachian trail; Gavin Newsome was elected Lieutenant Governor as the show emphasized last night, only the woman gets punished when these events occur.

 

Cyrus' rant was gross and creepy. It reminded me of the way gay characters were once portrayed as always frustrated and using affection in friendship as a cover for more lustful thoughts. Actually he was very much like Judi Dench in Notes on a Scandal!

 

As a black woman who's almost always "the only one" all of this episode resonated with me . Thank you Shonda for an amazing episode!

 

just because I needed eyes to be laid upon these one more time.

 

But does she really love Fitz? Like in that love of my life, passionate way?  So would Fitz loving her be a win really? Maybe a win for her ego more than her heart I guess. I always got the impression that maybe she might have been fond of him a bit at one time, but that it was more a team that the two forged to make it to the White House and then once his time was over she would get her chance at power. I thought the main bond or passion that they shared was making it to the top in the political world.

 

In my imagination Hillary chicken coop wire ties Bill to the couch every Thursday night and sideyes him while nodding at the tv.

 

 

I also thought it was interesting that it was Marcus defending Olivia. It feels like an anomaly to see a black man PUBLICLY defend a black woman being thrown under the bus in such a way, particularly one that isn't "family."  

 

Anyway, I often question if Shonda even likes Olivia as a character, but she NAILS racial subtext like nobody's business. 

 

As for Fitz, I knew as soon as the "next time, choose a girl more palatable to the base" was delivered as a parting shot, he would toss all fucks and common sense out the window and go to Olivia.  Goldwyn doesn't get much acting credit because Fitz is so despised, but his face completely changed when that shot was fired - he went from pained resignation about his key legislation to defiance.  Then, he calls Olivia and she's breaking under the weight of the public scrutiny.  Yes, he went to Abby with the BS "what would Olivia do" scene, but to me, he made the decision before he went to her.  I'm not arguing that it was a smart move - but as someone mentioned upthread, it's refreshing to see Fitz willing to take his lumps now.         

 

His naivete that it could even be an implication, bless his heart, followed by the dawn of recognition, then the oh yeah? watch me work-ness of it.   Love, love, more love.    

 

I see you, callback ;)

 

When they showed the flash backs of when they first got married they seemed very much inlove. I think she does love him and wants to be that powercouple they probably discussed when they were young and crazy about eachother. Then life happened, I do believe that is why she was willing to do the interview after he asked for forgiveness for taking from her. She felt like they could still be the power couple in a different way, he might not love her but they were going to accomplish everything they told eachother when they first dated, and that in itself could be a version of him still loving her. Like when divorced parents still have a good relationship and raise their children in a coparent way, the respect and admiration is there, tha is how I see Millies view on the presidency their baby their great accomplishment.

 

On a side note I hope Fitz does get impeached he is the shitiest president ever, and the declaration of war for his side piece should get him kicked out of office. This is why I never understood his rage at millie getting 12 jurors killed, when he got thousands of soliders killed for Oliva. I also really like Oliva with Jake.

 

He thinks there's a distinction between Mellie's ambitions and his own.  Or at least a distinction between their motiviation, because where he is concerned a) he'll never know if he could've done it himself and b) even if the end justifies the means, the means weren't worth it.  I want Shonda to make Mellie more Rachel Gellerish in these moments because  #suffocatedasupremecourtJustice  #overodecongressandsentacountrytowartogetyourbooback and #yourdadrapedme

 

I win, please never forget that.

Edited October 19, 2015 by ZaldamoWilder

[reggiejax]

This is why I never understood his rage at millie getting 12 jurors killed, when he got thousands of soliders killed for Oliva.

 

 

Not to diminish the loss of any life, but the soldiers who died in “The War of Fitz’s Boner” were prepared for what they faced. They signed up and trained with the possibility of death in mind. That is true whether the war itself was justified or not.

 

The 17 grand jurors, to put it lightly, were not prepared for any such possibility. Nor should it have ever even been a possibility. These are people who lost their lives because they happened to register to vote, making them eligible for jury duty. Really they died because Papa Dope and Schmuck have issues. And because Mellie's ambition far exceeds her capabilities. 

[janie2002]

Not to diminish the loss of any life, but the soldiers who died in “The War of Fitz’s Boner” were prepared for what they faced. They signed up and trained with the possibility of death in mind. That is true whether the war itself was justified or not.

 

The 17 grand jurors, to put it lightly, were not prepared for any such possibility. Nor should it have ever even been a possibility. These are people who lost their lives because they happened to register to vote, making them eligible for jury duty. Really they died because Papa Dope and Schmuck have issues. And because Mellie's ambition far exceeds her capabilities. 

I see what you mean, but I dont really agree. Soldier sign p with the possibilty to die for there country, or the greater good, not a mistress. 

[St. Claire]

I see what you mean, but I dont really agree. Soldier sign p with the possibilty to die for there country, or the greater good, not a mistress. 

But by joining the military, they are taking on increased risk of being killed than the jurors did. They don't get to say "as long as I agree that the politician's decision really is for the 'greater good,' I will fight this fight and risk my life." yeah, in this case they died for a politician's mistress instead of for their country's best interest, but they still agreed to fight a fight that was based on someone else's motivation regarding whether it was right or wrong. Anyone who joins the military knows that they have increased their risk of dying; serving jury duty doesn't include anywhere near that assumption of risk. 

[Guest]

I can see both signs, but wasn't there also a reasonable argument that the US should be going to war there anyway?  I can't remember exactly (because I've blocked a lot of last season out of my brain) but I thought some were pushing for war and some weren't.  Fitz was on the side of not wanting to rush into a war.  

 

Still completely disagree with what he did.  Just trying to remember the sequence.

[thewhiteowl]

I thought the whole Dog-whistle thing was a brilliant deflection of the actual issue. Doesn't make it any less real but Liv thrust herself into public domain with her weak willed little "yes" and once there you don't get to decide what others will say about you. She is the admitted side piece of a famous man. She had the benefit of a privileged education and is articulate and well spoken like many others who received such but if someone says this, it's an insult. Too bad,, so sad. Her "great love" for Fitz prevents her from being insulted when called a whore but say she's well-spoken and feel the wrath. Yes, lets focus on that rather than the fact that she's fucking the married prez in my house. Sure, ok. Nice deflection.

I am not saying it is not an issue but really not compared to being the Prez's side piece.

[ThomasAAnderson]

I'm so sick of Liv being a whore but Dr Grey and McDreamy are the greatest love story of all time.  Fuck outta here

[thewhiteowl]

I'm so sick of Liv being a whore but Dr Grey and McDreamy are the greatest love story of all time.  Fuck outta here

 

 Apples and oranges, IMO

[St. Claire]

I'm so sick of Liv being a whore but Dr Grey and McDreamy are the greatest love story of all time.  Fuck outta here

 

Apples and oranges, IMO

 

 

Mileage varies. Meredith slept with a married man (even though she didn't know he was married when they started dating) and possibly got advantageous attention at her job.They fell in love and eventually got married. Liv slept with a married man, people speculate that it gave her advantages in her work (what with having a connection to a very powerful man). They claim to be in love and have professed the possibility of getting married in the future. Either could be seen as using sex with a powerful married man to their own advantage. Either could be seen as just falling in love with a man who was married to the wrong woman.

[txhorns79]

Huck being sent out to give interviews on political talk shows is one of the more unbelievable Scandal happenings ever, and that includes every B613 plot.

 

I totally agree, but I did enjoy that the person interviewing him apparently didn't notice that Huck was a freaking nut job. 

 

And I get that Cyrus is, at best, unbalanced, but on what planet do you ever tell a mother how much luckier she is to have her son be dead because of all the worry that your imaginary "son" is causing you?  (Also, I don't know how old they are supposed to be in the context of the show, but Jeff Perry is only 5 years older than Tony Goldwyn, so the whole "father/son" relationship would be a little silly.)  I mean, he should be thanking God that Mellie didn't smack the crap out of him. 

Edited October 22, 2015 by txhorns79

[KaveDweller]

I can see both signs, but wasn't there also a reasonable argument that the US should be going to war there anyway?  I can't remember exactly (because I've blocked a lot of last season out of my brain) but I thought some were pushing for war and some weren't.  Fitz was on the side of not wanting to rush into a war.  

 

Didn't the old VP somehow fake having an attempt made on his life, and blamed that country because he (and someone else) wanted a war? That's the argument they gave the public, I think.  I don't remember the reason the VP didn't like that country.

[Guest]

Didn't the old VP somehow fake having an attempt made on his life, and blamed that country because he (and someone else) wanted a war? That's the argument they gave the public, I think.  I don't remember the reason the VP didn't like that country.

 

Okay. I remembered that but somehow in my brain I thought the goal of that was to be the final push to a way that they already wanted to get involved in.  I forgot that that was the only "reason" to go to war.  

[WhosThatGirl]

During Cyrus "Fitz is MY SON!" speech, I was thinking, "don't you have an actual child you should be worrying about?" The writing in this show is really bad, it wouldn't have made me laugh as much if Cyrus was comparing him and Fitz to being brothers, since I think underneath it all, that's what we were supposed to take from that speech, he cares about Fitz so much and wants to help him, but then I remembered he wouldn't be able to bring it back with Mellie being happy her son is dead or something. It didn't make sense at all. 







 

[txhorns79]

The writing in this show is really bad, it wouldn't have made me laugh as much if Cyrus was comparing him and Fitz to being brothers, since I think underneath it all, that's what we were supposed to take from that speech, he cares about Fitz so much and wants to help him, but then I remembered he wouldn't be able to bring it back with Mellie being happy her son is dead or something. It didn't make sense at all.

 

I think I kind of got where Cyrus was trying to go.  It was something to the extent that he cared deeply for Fitz, and was very worried that the people surrounding Fitz were steering him the wrong way.  Obviously, what Cyrus actually said was done in Shonda's ridiculous gobbedly gook (i.e. the way no human talks) where the only thing Cyrus accomplished was managing to deeply offend Mellie.