S08.E04: What Lies Beneath

[WendyCR72]

When Castle’s idol, a famously reclusive author, turns up dead, Castle is determined to solve his hero’s murder. But as he and Beckett dig deeper, they discover that truth is stranger than fiction.

[CastleSeason8]

I couldnt be less excited for an episode. Promos look terrible. When Castle and Beckett are hardly in them together it doesnt bode well. Not looking forward to this and can see tuning out quickly.

[VinceW]

I couldnt be less excited for an episode. Promos look terrible. When Castle and Beckett are hardly in them together it doesnt bode well. Not looking forward to this and can see tuning out quickly.

I expect that the fan backlash factor will show up in the viewership numbers quickly after the next few ‘fun’ episodes. If the separation lasts beyond the extended hiatus and into the February sweeps period, Castle and Beckett will have been separated for a longer period of time than they have actually been married which is pretty ridiculous. The story that seems to be unfolding is the strangest TV marriage in recent memory. Hawley’s comment “What can we do to make this thing feel new again? “ doesn't justify what has been presented so far, but it is definitely a new approach for a love story. The precinct team members only know that Kate just walked out on her marriage to “take some space”. While Beckett knows that Castle is hurt over it, she won’t talk about it. I doubt that fans will have much patience with this story line given what has been forthcoming in the upcoming promos. After three episodes, viewers still have not seen Beckett working from her new office which would exemplify her promotion. 

Edited October 9, 2015 by VinceW

[pepper]

Here's my prediction: the less time they spend on Beckett's reasons and Castle's anger and the more time they spend on love, longing and fluffiness, the higher the ratings will be. I've found a distinct difference between Internet response to episodes and real-life anecdotal response to episodes. Casual viewers tend not to be invested in motivation and give a severely limited number of craps about the very same things that tie boards (and apparently tumblr) in knots. And I'm definitely morphing into a casual viewer... which happily frees up my emoting for other things.

 

So I'm hoping for more of what I got this week: fun with Ryan and Esposito, genuine feeling between Castle and Beckett, an interesting case with unrealistic-but-handwaveable investigation of same. The only things on my wish list are less Alexis and please, writers, some more Martha. They deliver that ish and I'd along for the ride.   

[verdana]

Less Alexis pretty please writers, let her have a sudden desire to catch up on some college work. 

Edited October 8, 2015 by verdana

[madmaverick]

Didn't she do that last week? :P  Happy 21st to Molly, by the way.  Easy to forget she's still so young after this many years on Castle.

 

I don't mind Alexis P.I., at the right dosage level, and as long as they don't neglect other facets to her character and life.  I'll take a father-daughter team over an Alexis who's snappish and dismissive of her Dad with her boyfriend issues any day.  For anyone watching iZombie, a good Nancy Drew-ish/Veronica Mars type show, Alexis reminded me of Liv when she went all blonde.

 

KaveDweller, just caught up on The Good Wife premiere and I think the teenage, still in high school, daughter of the lead character there suddenly becoming her mom lawyer's paralegal definitely has Alexis beat in the unbelievable stakes.  But I handwave.  Both shows obviously feel there's a role for a daughter character in relation to the parental lead and that's why they take the pains to involve them more on the show, even if the roles they take on can stretch credibility.  

 

Looking forward to the episode with some insight into Castle's author preferences, some fun, as well as some continued attention to the underlying Caskett issues and scenes with genuine feeling.

[CastleSeason8]

This isnt Castle. Its the Rick and Alexis show, and Im quite sure Im done. Will tune in for Mr & Mrs Castle, only to be disappointed Im sure...

[McManda]

Mom-in-law intervention. I like that. <3 Martha.

 

We know Ryan went to Catholic school, but ... is Espo Catholic? I mean, other than the assumption that being Hispanic he'd be Catholic, but I don't know if we've ever been told.

The "you know I can find that, right?" after Espo threw the tracker made me laugh. I will say, I hate the overarching theme of the season (watch Beckett make what she thinks is self-sacrificing decisons but that are really decisions that hurt her family and will get her killed), but the writing is more fun than the last season or two.

 

I am getting tired of hearing Castle talk about how he's going to win Beckett back. Like, I get it, that's the only thing he can think to do, but (at risk of sounding like Beckett) this isn't about him. He literally didn't do anything wrong. He's got nothing to atone for, none of her personal feelings to try to change. If it goes on all season it's going to be too sad puppy. It's already starting to get that way and it's only the second episode. (And it makes me hate that whole storyline even more. I don't like sad, confused Castle.)

I don't get how Beckett being apart from Castle is "saving" him, especially if the only thing that's different is that they're literally physically separate. She still can't keep him out of the precinct (though she tries, but not very hard), is in contact with Martha, still calls "just because" she wants to tease him, and can't really hide the fact that she's still in love. The people that would be after her if they knew she was investigating McCord and company's deaths are super-secret, amazingly awesome, bad-CIA agents. I don't think they'd look at her an go "eh, she hasn't been sleeping at home, guess she doesn't care about him so we'll just leave him alone".

 

I get what they were trying to do, because yes, that resolved sexual tension has some of the elements of unresolved sexual tension now, but I still think they did it in a dumb, dumb way. They could have left the biggest bad out of it and used Beckett's promotion to authority and a shift in their professional relationship (he can't really work with her anymore, they have to abstain from office foreplay, etc, etc) to accomplish the same sort of thing without the pretense of a breakup or having to suspend disbelief that the Bracken storyline and Beckett in danger is still not over.

 

Of course that phone call was Vikram with info on the heroin. It's like Josh, but worse.

Edited October 13, 2015 by McManda

[FlickerToAFlame]

Another well written and fun episode that would have been amazing in seasons 1-4. The split just ruins everything. And why is Beckett calling Castle to make fun of him and tell him to stretch before bed (that he's going to alone)? Seemed very inconsiderate to me.

[371012]

I'm trying to like it.  Here's how:  I've suspended disbelief on anything Beckett related.  I like Espo better this year, he's not a total a$$ to Castle.  He and Ryan are remotely interesting though Ryan's money issues will get old fast.  Alexis is just weird, last year she tolerated Beckett and I would expect her to be a little less understanding but I can deal with that.  Just not her wardrobe.  Martha.  Please, more Martha.  And good for her for saying something.  Castle isn't being a total sap and is showi ng his worth in the investigations.  The writing is tighter and better.  Can you imagine how excited we'd all be if we had seen signs of continuity like we are getting this year in previous seasons?!  Too bad the reminder is of something that just can't interest me even a little bit.

 

So basically, if I discount KB (all while wondering why this was more appealing to SK) and ignore the underlying nonsense of the new bigger badder bad, there are things to like.

 

I realize the above probably sounds not very positive but I'm trying!!!!

[KaveDweller]

So, if I forget the stupid reason behind the stupid break up....I thought this was an enjoyable episode.  The case was interesting and seemed less gimmicky than most of the cases in the past couple seasons.  And even though there was less Caskett than last week, it didn't seem to drag as much between their scenes.

 

Beckett kind of sucks at hiding her super-secret investigation.  She took that call from Vikram in the middle of the precinct.  She knows there are no walls and people can probably hear her, right?  And she's leaving Vulcan Simmons files on her desk? Making phone calls about evidence from his case? But Castle helping her is a risk? Dumb.

 

I really liked the scene between Martha and Beckett.  Martha struck a nice balance with supporting Castle and Beckett with what she said. What was also nice was when they were hugging there was a moment when you see Beckett totally relax into the embrace.

 

If they have support groups for pathological liars, maybe they also have it for obsessive justice seekers?

 

I thought it was weird that Beckett stayed laying on the couch when the CSU guy came in to talk to her about heroin, but I guess they had Stana in a skirt and wanted to show off her legs?

 

Molly Quinn seemed to be rushing through a lot of her dialogue at the beginning.  Maybe she's not used to having to do so much exposition, but it sounded weird. On a positive note, she has really pretty hair.

 

I don't buy that Castle wouldn't know the real name of his favorite author.

 

At first the blind priest reminded me of the blind priest from Passions, but then I guessed he wasn't blind and it ruined that.  I thought he was the killer, so they did get me there.

 

I like Castle's admission that he left out an ingredient when he taught Beckett how to make coffee.

[Chado]

- The win her back idea really needs to stop, it makes Castle look pathetic. Why can't he see the timeline and realize something happened when she disappeared? How can he still think it has something to do with him?

 

- Was great seeing Martha

 

- Ryan the rat was funny, he was so not subtle at all

 

- Beckett's phone call was tasteless and all kinds of confusing to Castle, this whole plot element retracts my enjoyment of the whole season so far. Maybe it will get better once Castle has knowledge of the situation?

 

- The coffee lie by Castle was nice, Beckett's phone call not so much..

 

The writing is stronger, there is more 'laughing' moments...but I'm unable to just ignore the Beckett part of all of this. As others have said, if this was season 5 and their relationship was new....I'd be way more patient with everything, but it's season 8, they are married. It just doesn't work.

 

Like 371012 said, you need to be able to suspend disbelief of the whole thing, there's massive handwaving required.

[moodyblue]

I actually found the episode rather boring. It was obvious which scenes and lines I was suppose to find funny, but they kind of fell flat to me. And just in case you missed it the ten times Castle said it in tonight's episode, Castle is trying to win Beckett back.

 

I thought it was weird that Beckett stayed laying on the couch when the CSU guy came in to talk to her about heroin, but I guess they had Stana in a skirt and wanted to show off her legs?

 

I thought that was weird too and very unBeckett-like.

 

My favorite scene was with Beckett and Martha. I liked it, but I think Martha should have been tougher with her.

 

I don't think Espo is the only one of the guys who dyes his hair. My bet is all three of them do.

[Guest]

It had some really fun moments and I liked it more than I expected to. But I didn't like the split (still), Castle tracking Espo, or Castle paying off Ryan.

[statsgirl]

The show may have broken me with this episode.  I couldn't care about the case because I hated seeing any scene with both Beckett and Castle in it, although I'm pretty sure that's not what the new EPs were going for.

 

And when the blind priest suddenly showed he wasn't blind and ran and Rich and Alexis had a talk about whether they should follow him?  I don't watch comedy shows that stupid. I'm not going to accept it on this one.

 

The only thing I liked was Beckett's wardrobe, and I can buy a magazine for that.

[scenicbyway]

I still don't get why they are trying to pretend like seasons 4-7 never existed.  In this current world, Castle is still pursuing Beckett all the while Beckett is still pursuing her mother's once solved case.  But since 4-7 never happened the case never got solved.

 

Where is Beckett living?  Does the couch in her office pull out?  Why is Alexis not questioning Beckett leaving her father?  Why isn't Castle questioning Beckett leaving him?  Does he realize that if he wasn't interfering at the precinct he would literally NEVER hear from his wife?

 

It's not fun, there's no UST because they are married, the unresolved tension has been resolved.  By splitting them up so Beckett can work the case that will never die it just means she loves the case more than Castle.  He never really won her over to begin with.

 

Also Alexis went from being a cheerleader and valedictorian to hanging around her dad's most fake PI office in 3 years?  Did she have no social life beyond the one live in boyfriend?  Is she back living in the loft?

 

What is going on BTS?  I'm sorry but most of those Castle/Beckett scenes were done on the phone, computer or with stand ins for the other across the room.  If someone didn't want to work with someone else then why did they renew their contract?  And what the heck happened to cause them to not want to work together?

[KaveDweller]

Why can't he see the timeline and realize something happened when she disappeared? How can he still think it has something to do with him?

 

Because then they're be plot movement and that's not allowed until sweeps?

 

It's especially weird because when she left in XX, he asked her if it had anything to do with Bracken or her AG team.  Because obviously it does.  And she didn't answer him, so he should have pressed harder on that.

 

I did like that he commented to mobster guy he considered her "I need space" thing to be a cry for help. Because it kind of is.  If they are going to show him pressing Beckett to get back together, they should be having him talk about being worried about whatever personal meltdown she seems to be having instead of saying he needs to "win her back." Also, since Lanie desperately needs something to do, they should have her pressing Beckett too. If my best friend left her husband with no explanation (to him or me) I'd be worried about her.  Martha is the only one (besides Castle) who's seemed to show any concern about whether something's wrong with her.

 

And why is Beckett calling Castle to make fun of him and tell him to stretch before bed (that he's going to alone)?

 

I actually thought it was supposed to show that Beckett just can't stay away, but good point that the bed line was kind of insensitive.

[Chado]

So many good questions scenicbyway. The pretend season 5-7 never happened is one of the bigger handwaves we are expected to partake in.

[oberon55]

Just a few thoughts:

 

I liked the Martha scene.

 

Last week Alexis was talking about bondage with her dad & 2 cops now she's embarrassed talking about kissing.

 

They were really pounding on the liar theme this week.

 

Since when does the Captain interrogate suspects.

 

Does anybody know if Castle is trying to win Beckett back? I wish they would make that a little clearer.

 

Esposito & Ryan were good together.

 

They are still batting 1000 at interrupting them at just the right moment.

 

 

It's really hard for me to enjoy this season with the dark cloud of the breakup hanging over everything. Very little of Castle & Beckett interactions ring true to me.

[FlickerToAFlame]

I absolutely think the show is broken right now. I won't stop watching because of stubbornness and nothing else good being on at the same time. But just thinking about the show depresses me now.

If they aren't back together by the fall finale, I don't think the show is salvageable.

[Chado]

Does anybody know if Castle is trying to win Beckett back? I wish they would make that a little clearer.

LOL. It's funny that even Matt Mitovich said "he needs to win her back! He said so tonight, three times." in a twitter reply like 15 minutes ago.

 

I wish he would ask a question about that. Not that I'd expect a serious answer of course....It's like KaveDweller said, it's just artificial, there can be no plot development until November.

[Driad]

If Castle really wants to win Beckett back he should get a coffee cup with two handles. Or a saucer. He holds the handle of the cup and hands it to her, so she has to grasp the body of the cup. If the cup were actually filled with hot coffee, she would burn her hand.

If the murder victim was not Famous Author, where is Famous Author? I'm tired.

[oberon55]

 Also, since Lanie desperately needs something to do, they should have her pressing Beckett too. If my best friend left her husband with no explanation (to him or me) I'd be worried about her.  Martha is the only one (besides Castle) who's seemed to show any concern about whether something's wrong with her.

 

 

I'm sure Lanie thinks they are both grown ass adults and will be fine.

[Kromm]

Here's my prediction: the less time they spend on Beckett's reasons and Castle's anger and the more time they spend on love, longing and fluffiness, the higher the ratings will be. I've found a distinct difference between Internet response to episodes and real-life anecdotal response to episodes. Casual viewers tend not to be invested in motivation and give a severely limited number of craps about the very same things that tie boards (and apparently tumblr) in knots. And I'm definitely morphing into a casual viewer... which happily frees up my emoting for other things.

Cause and effect though. People don't know ahead of time what an episode is going to be like, even from previews. The only net effects are cumulative--a bleeding off of viewers who have just gotten pissed off and given up.  Sometimes a big event episode or guest star dribbles a few people BACK and only if the episode is better than expected do those returned viewers stick around. 

 

I guess what I'm saying is lost viewers tend to STAY lost.  Mostly.

[turnitwayup]

Tony Plana as the fake blind priest was fun but Castle with the mobster hit man was a funnier scene. The most positive change this season is that tptb manage to make Espo likeable again but the whole Espo/Ryan do the same thing in front of Lanie felt like the Caskett mind melding thing that they do. I did like them going for the sergeant exam and we didn't get like 4 in the box interrogations scenes. The Martha/Beckett scene was good. Castle with the boys were good too. Fake thumb drive with virus to get city employee was clever but was unseen Vikram that created the virus?

 

And onto the bad. The split and trying to win her back is still not working and makes the ep really weird. Especially since Castle is now sleeping in the office and that phone call with Beckett. The Caskett interactions are just now bizarre with clueless!Castle probably thinking his plan is working in the next few eps. Still don't like Alexis getting inserted in the cases and the possibility that she could get in danger on any one of them. It seems like she never goes to class since she's always around the PI office but somehow has time to take Castle's credit card and go to fashion week. Luke needs to stop dressing her as a 30something.

 

Not even sure what the point of what looks like cinco de mayo threw up in the loft party scene was. It came across as random insert a loft scene since I think that set has appeared in every ep.

 

If the murder victim was not Famous Author, where is Famous Author? I'm tired.

 

Yeah I was wondering about that too.

[TWP]

The Famous author is fine and elsewhere. The mobster was posing as the famous author. This was mentioned in about the 13th minute of the show. I'm watching now. But I don't understand the wife yet.

[verdana]

Watching this season I keep thinking of the Cher song "If I Could Turn Back Time!" because it's like the last three years never happened. Weird.

 

I could like be enjoying this season that's the frustrating thing about all this, even though the old partnership is dead and buried and clearly not coming back, even though Alexis has transformed into Veronica Mars and dresses fugly, even though Stana's wig has almost become a secondary character in its own right. I like Espo again (that's a miracle in itself), the dynamic between the boys and Castle is (mostly) fun, the writing has (mostly) tightened up, the cases although still silly hold my attention better but oh sweet baby Jesus the separation business is such a drag.

 

I don't give a rats ass about Beckett's lone vengeance quest. I have zero investment in it. She's conducting the worst secret investigation evah but badass Becks can take LOCKSAT down whilst living apart from her husband to keep him safe! Meanwhile Castle has to WIN HIS WIFE BACK did you hear that Castle fans I'll say it again WIN HER BACK for some inexplicable reason and ends up looking like a clueless confused sad sap. Yeah whatever.

[shapeshifter]

I'm glad this episode was stupidly fluffy with implausible plot points in a 1960s-show way. Real life (and a few other good shows) have enough serious drama for me.

[verdana]

Best bit, Martha. Don't married couples live together? Be honest with yourself and be honest with your husband. Yes thank you Martha! The voice of reason although I would have liked her to be a little firmer. She's the only person that seems to be acting like they care about what's happened.  Beckett ignored her good advice naturally not that she has a choice the plot requires she remain stubborn and stupid. 

 

Saddest bit, when she said she was going to be honest with Castle and the poor bastard looks so damn hopeful for a second (NF is so good at those little moments of desperate hope mixed with pain). Again that would have been a great scene IF she hadn't walked out on the guy and refused to tell him why, how about being honest about THAT. Urgh I need to ignore everything Beckett is doing right now because it's so irritating, makes me wish she could get a bump on the head during a case so she could start acting like a rational human bring again. I need this stupid story to be over with soon, but I know they'll be no forward progress on this until November sweeps, bastards.

 

The writers want these episodes to be fun, light hearted and enjoyable fare but splitting your lead could pretty much sticks a big pin in that all the fun you're trying to inject into things and seems woefully counter productive.  Watching them together every meeting it tinged with sadness. The scenes where they're being affectionate ring hollow since the reality is they're not living together, sorry it just doesn't work. I'm fed up of Kate giving him mixed signals it's not fair. I know it's not meant to be coming over like that but it does to me, all the looks and soft smiles and tender touches.... if they were together it would be great but not like this.  

 

Some honesty and direct communication between them is urgently needed, she owes him that much. I don't doubt she loves him but the way she's behaving seems off, being physically demonstrative and loving but continuing to keep him in the dark as to her reasons for walking out on their marriage. If this was real life she'd be on her way to damaging her marriage irreparably but it won't happen here, I doubt there will be any consequences because of her behaviour it's clear from the way they're portraying Castle that he'll take her back in a heartbeat no matter how long it takes. Sigh 

[madmaverick]

Passable episode for a first time writer on the show, though the case dragged a bit for me with all the lies after a while.  And the dumbness of the city guy having a folder titled "Slush Fund" made me lol.  I do think the writing continues to be generally tighter and there's a better use of the ensemble.  I did like the Caskett scenes, I'm not indifferent to the push and pull in them, though it does require me to more or less handwave everything about Beckett's illogical game plan.  I thought Castle interpreting Beckett's need for space as a "cry for help" was interesting, and it may explain why he's adopting a gentler approach with her despite her actions than some might imagine.  His first instinct may have been to question whether he'd done something wrong, whether he was enough for Beckett (this he may still be wondering if not the former).  But he also seems to be thinking she's not being honest with him about something and he believes she needs his help and he can help her get through whatever it is by her side.  So he's not getting angry and he's not deserting her in her hour of need.

 

I did like what they did with the coffee and what it represented.  From Beckett making bad coffee to Castle leaving out a secret ingredient so Beckett needs him.  I do wish we'd gotten that romantic scene of Castle teaching Beckett to make coffee, and him giving her his favourite books in their early days of dating.  We missed out on that whole early period of dating altogether, no thanks to Marlowe.  If this were reality and not a TV show that won't do significant movement on the arc until mid season, Castle would have pushed Beckett harder and asked her to be honest with him at the end.  She owes him that much as his wife.  But of course, we get a phone call interruptus instead.

 

And oh, coffee made at the right temperature shouldn't scalding hot.  I don't have trouble holding my mugs after making coffee from my espresso machine.  

 

Great Beckett/Martha scene also.  Thank God someone finally gave some good advice, though I also agree if this were reality Martha would be tougher with Beckett.  I did like the balance of honest advice and genuine affection that came through.  And i think honesty is a very important lesson for Beckett going forward in her marriage when this arc resolves.

 

I see that Beckett's personal demons and current crisis haven't affected her glamourous wardrobe at all. ;)  The blue outfit on Beckett looked great, but I can see that Luke is already falling into the trap of showing cleavage under a work suit, which is one of my pet peeves. And yes, it was weird and quite unnecessary and unprofessional for Beckett to be lying on her couch in her office as a colleague came in.  Would have been a different scene altogether if she was working late into the night and it was Castle coming in.  Luke really needs to work on buying Castle's suits from wherever Beckett buys hers. ;)

 

i'd been wondering why Martha and Alexis had been finding Castle in his P.I. office so much.  So it looks like he's sleeping there, and Beckett's sleeping who knows where, even if her wardrobe magically doesn't get crinkly when sleeping in her office.

 

The Ferrari and the loft party were a bit random and wasted.  If we were going to see the Ferrari again at last, put it to better use!

 

I do like that Espo isn't being a jerk to Castle this season.  The Ryan/Espo storyline was a relevant one.  Massive handwaving necessary to ignore why Beckett didn't need to sit the Sergeant's exam though!

 

Of course that phone call was Vikram with info on the heroin. It's like Josh, but worse.

 

LOL.  But true about the Josh vibe.  Felt very S3.  Except they're supposed to be married. ;)

Edited October 13, 2015 by madmaverick

[verdana]

Castle is bribing cops now? Great. And much worse Ryan accepted it, that seemed OOC to me, way to go in risking screwing up your career buddy! Yet more plot driven storytelling - Castle has a trusted inside man. Meh.

 

Captain Beckett overkill, I get it she's captain now stop running it down my throat and was Beckett tired and needed a rest? Is that where she sleeps now she's not with Castle? What the hell was she doing sprawled out on the sofa whilst talking to a colleague who she called in specifically to talk to, that was so unprofessional, I presume it was so they could show off Katic's figure. Not impressed. 

 

What was that party all about? Was it just an excuse to show Castle wearing a silly hat? When I said I wanted his wardrobe to be given a revamp by Luke, making him wear a sombrero was not quite what I had in mind and he's been wearing that horrible green tweed jacket for the last two episodes.

 

The nose wrinkle over the coffee was a nice touch. 

 

Liked the moment when the wife is talking about when she met her husband and it was like she'd known him all his life, Kate turns her eyes slightly on to Castle.

 

It's complicated! Is that really all she's got?  That's not good enough and actually it's not that complicated at all, she needs to stop depriving Castle of agency over this like he's some child and simply tell him what's going on. 

 

I didn't see the point of Alexis being in the scene when he was video conferencing with Beckett that seemed a classic case of shoehorning her in there when Castle could have simply told them himself. I know the writers want to give Molly increased screen time but ouch that was way too obvious.

 

I agree that the Ferrari scene was also a random insert that wasn't needed. 

Edited October 13, 2015 by verdana

[TWP]

I watched real time tonight! The show came on while I was reading.

In many ways I liked the episode. Of TV choices, it's certainly one of the better ones for me. If I can compartmentalize Castle as just a dumb guy for not cornering Beckett or dumping her, I can avoid feeling terrible about his broken heart.

My notes:

I wish Martha had given Beckett an ultimatum -- Tell Castle what's going on or let him go and have his dignity. Could anything possibly be worth ripping his heart out of his chest? Give him his life back, one way or another. Don't leave him hanging on. Of course she didn't though. It was a softball, ineffective discussion.

I do like the increased non-case conversation.

IMHO Beckett on the couch was supposed to convey that she wasn't sleeping well and was exhausted (without Castle, who was also sleeping on his couch). Can't bear the empty bed. It was a love thing.

I liked Keith Carradine as mobster better than as Penny Hofstadtler's dad. That was him wasn't it?

I could really use some taquitos with guacamole and a Margarita right now. Espo! The burrito! Nooooo don't throw it away!

I'm glad that Ryan and Espo have such open lines of communications....unlike a certain other couple I know.

Ry-the-spy maybe can't go well. Or maybe the truth will come out, which would be refreshing. Castle can investigate big bad on the sly for the rest of the season, of course separated from Beckett. Maybe that's the Mr and Mrs Castle ep, where he learns her secret but can't tell her. At least he'd know why she did this..... Maybe he'll make the "Always" decision that he doesn't want to watch her get killed and will decide to leave (temporarily, of course). Or maybe she'll disappear again and Castle and Slaughter will try and find her. I should be talking about this in the speculation thread.

If Alexis is going to be a super-hero, she had better learn to run as well as Beckett in high heels.

The wig really was spot on today. Best supporting cast Emmy material. Only surpassed by the hot lip action with the phone, LOL. Spicy!

Beckett should have given Castle his time at the end and called the evidence person back. All of the " interruptus scenes" have really jaded me. I can't enjoy their times together now, when I know the interruption is clearly coming. I'm honestly not sure why I torture myself. Castle looked at Beckett in the Season 1-4 way, which was nice. Why we can't have those looks when they are a couple, I'll never know.

COTW was fine. I had hoped it would rejuvenate Castle's network of authors, but that's what I get for hoping.

Next week will clarify that Beckett is still completely smitten.

Edited October 13, 2015 by TVWithPity

[verdana]

Another well written and fun episode that would have been amazing in seasons 1-4. The split just ruins everything.

Yeah it does. I saw one fan on tumblr who said she has a family member going through a separation and watching them trying to make light of what's happening feels insulting due to the true emotional repercussions that happen when the person you love walks out on you. Made worse if you don't know why (usually both parties know why). The writers may argue they're not treating it lightly and using continuity (which Marlowe rarely did), but what I'm seeing each week doesn't make any sense, especially they way they're playing Castle as being this happy go lucky guy when his life should be falling apart and no one seems that bothered aside from Martha. Yet they seem to think if they throw in the odd wistful more serious moment that deals with the ongoing heavier drama that will do it, instead it only makes the lighter elements even more discordant.

 

Leaving the separation drama, I found it weird that Beckett had to be told by Ryan and Castle to stay out of their Midnight Run style sting, seems that's something should be pretty obvious, and I see she's already using her increased powers to pull strings to get Espo a place for the Sergeant's exam.

[Chado]

It seems really silly to me that the whole episode was themed around lying and yet Castle never actually confronted Beckett over her own.

 

It was the perfect episode for an ultimatum to come from somebody, whether it be Rick or Martha....and yet nothing happened. Beckett has seemed to shrug off Martha's words, she has shrugged off Castle's comment about lies in a marriage.....and so we are stuck with this artificial environment where these characters and the situation are stuck in some sort of weird unrealistic limbo until November and it just feels completely unnatural.

 

Castle has to corner her and get the truth. Beckett has to completely cut ties with Castle if she really believes that is what she has to do. At the moment Castle looks stupid, Beckett looks to be simply taking advantage of Castle and hugely selfish.

 

I don't get what showing Beckett 'in love' or 'smitten' accomplishes? I'd rather they show Castle angry, show Beckett torn about her decision. Show Castle debating whether the marriage should go on after this. Show Beckett actually understanding the risk she is taking in her personal life.

 

Showing that Beckett and Castle are still in love is missing the point of this situation entirely in my opinion. It's........emotional manipulation to tide fans over until November sweeps. Nothing they are showing actually means anything.

[madmaverick]

Did anyone's mind go the gutter when they talked about "immersion"? Heh.  Yes, give me some uninterrupted Caskett immersion, please.

 

I would have preferred it if the case had actually delved more into a writer's world than that of pathological liars.

 

And I want to know if Castle has ever been a janitor for research heh.  Nathan did play one on Community.

[verdana]

If Alexis is going to be a super-hero, she had better learn to run as well as Beckett in high heels.

Watching Molly Quinn trying to run anywhere is a painful experience and I wish they'd stop making her do it, I might laugh if they gave her a cape. 

 

The wig really was spot on today. Best supporting cast Emmy material. Only surpassed by the hot lip action with the phone, LOL. Spicy!

I never vote during the PCA's but I expect the wig to make it into best supporting role in a comedy (because that's what Castle is these days according to Hawley and co) and I intend to vote like mad. I say you're being overly optimistic about an Emmy nod but it's early days for the wig so we shall see but it has outshone both Vikram and Hayley. 

 

Edited October 13, 2015 by verdana

[Chado]

I would have preferred it if the case had actually delved more into a writer's world than that of pathological liars.

The theme of lying would of been fine if it actually came across in Beckett's situation at all. The off-handed comments were insignificant in comparison to someone actually confronting her, giving an ultimatum....anything.

 

It was just a way to reference it without actually exploring it. Meaningless.

[verdana]

It seems really silly to me that the whole episode was themed around lying and yet Castle never actually confronted Beckett over her own.

 

It was the perfect episode for an ultimatum to come from somebody, whether it be Rick or Martha....and yet nothing happened. Beckett has seemed to shrug off Martha's words, she has shrugged off Castle's comment about lies in a marriage.....and so we are stuck with this artificial environment where these characters and the situation are stuck in some sort of weird unrealistic limbo until November and it just feels completely unnatural.

That was the weird thing about this episode the big fat elephant sitting in the room and all I got was the Martha advice giving and a slightly guilty look from Beckett when Castle has that line about lies in marriage and I was waiting for Castle to at least dig a bit deeper since they were hitting me over the head with lies, lies, lies in the promo but no they can't risk upsetting the apple cart lets give it a wide berth. 

 

They won't address this issue because it's not sweeps so everything is stalled and that's what's so stupid about it, nothing much has really changed, yes there's more continuity so at least fans see that she's investigating which is a plus but there's no genuine emotional development or movement here. No matter how many times she opens a file and looks at it, nothing changes for the characters - Clueless!Castle keeps chasing Robot!Beckett who remains intransigent - it becomes frustrating when you know every conversation is going to end with an interruption to stall any further story development until such time as they want to kick start it again.

 

And it's totally WTF that the whole basis of their separation is that Kate must leave to keep Castle safe yet she's calling him up to flirt with him and also get help on a case - where is the logic in that writers? WHERE. Argh!

 

These LOCKSAT people must be in a coma or something they're so quiet and unquestioning. 

 

I saw some fans saying don't worry hang on in there everybody this separation arc is almost over. No idea where they've got that idea from, I pity them, they really do believe this will be over with very soon. 

Edited October 13, 2015 by verdana

[TWP]

It seems really silly to me that the whole episode was themed around lying and yet Castle never actually confronted Beckett over her own.

 

It was the perfect episode for an ultimatum to come from somebody, whether it be Rick or Martha....and yet nothing happened. Beckett has seemed to shrug off Martha's words, she has shrugged off Castle's comment about lies in a marriage.....and so we are stuck with this artificial environment where these characters and the situation are stuck in some sort of weird unrealistic limbo until November and it just feels completely unnatural.

 

Castle has to corner her and get the truth. Beckett has to completely cut ties with Castle if she really believes that is what she has to do. At the moment Castle looks stupid, Beckett looks to be simply taking advantage of Castle and hugely selfish.

 

I don't get what showing Beckett 'in love' or 'smitten' accomplishes? I'd rather they show Castle angry, show Beckett torn about her decision. Show Castle debating whether the marriage should go on after this. Show Beckett actually understanding the risk she is taking in her personal life.

 

Showing that Beckett and Castle are still in love is missing the point of this situation entirely in my opinion. It's........emotional manipulation to tide fans over until November sweeps. Nothing they are showing actually means anything.

Yep. Sweeps is now an outdated mode, since we can record viewer behavior down to how many seconds of commercials they watch. Imagine if showrunners designed their shows around telling a good story, rather than feeding us a bunch of wheel - spinning fluff for all but the few weeks of sweeps.

But within the constraints of TV politics, it's reassuring that maybe Beckett's feelings will become crystal clear next week. I'm definitely in the camp where disaster will ensue unless a relationship breakthrough comes before the loooong hiatus. Wallz 2.0 will not keep interest up into February! And if ratings go into sub 1.0 territory, they can blame the "Moonlighting Curse," wherein the fanbase will be moonlighting with other shows!

@Verdana, I wonder if People's Choice allows write-ins.....

[Chado]

But within the constraints of TV politics, it's reassuring that maybe Beckett's feelings will become crystal clear next week.

What makes you say that?

[TWP]

@Chado, why do I say that? Because the preview aludes to the idea that Beckett won't deny that she's still in love with Castle.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it! An SNL Liar's reference.

[Chado]

@Chado, why do I say that? Because the preview aludes to the idea that Beckett won't deny that she's still in love with Castle.

When haven't they been showing that though? That's the only thing they've focused on. They keep telling the audience how the characters aren't thinking about divorce and how Castle wants to win her back and how Beckett still loves him. It's a way to try and buy patience with the fans. The promo to me suggests more of the same.

 

I'd be much more interested in a promo that gives off the impression that Castle learns what Beckett is lying about.

[femmefan1946]

Of course that phone call was Vikram with info on the heroin. It's like Josh, but worse.

 

And no one is around to hear it.

Still willing to believe Vikram is a hallucination. The real Vikram sensibly went back to DC.

 

And while they might have purchased a 25watt bulb, since there was a little more light this week, in that corridor scene with Espo and Ryan, it was so dark the boys seemed to be followed by Godzilla or BigFoot. Some huge dark shape.

 

But I did like the episode.

I gather the victim was really a city hall accountant, who was fired for snooping? He really worked as a janitor, but not at City Hall, and was lying both  about being an author and about being a mobster?

[verdana]

When haven't they been showing that though? That's the only thing they've focused on. They keep telling the audience how the characters aren't thinking about divorce and how Castle wants to win her back and how Beckett still loves him. It's a way to try and buy patience with the fans. The promo to me suggests more of the same.

 

I'd be much more interested in a promo that gives off the impression that Castle learns what Beckett is lying about.

They are trying really hard to make me sympathise with Beckett, what a huge emotional sacrifice this is etc and don't fret she adores and loves him. I already knew she loved him that's not the problem here. It doesn't change the fact she's refusing to be honest and open with him when as his wife that's exactly what she should be doing, they're married now this is not s4 but the writers seem to forget this trifling matter. There maybe love here but there's not much respect being shown and zero communication. So next week she's even more smitten? Okay Fine, but it doesn't change my annoyance with this pointless story which they don't need to generate sparks and magic between them, it was always there they just didn't write it in. Sigh

[Julie23]

I loved the scenes with Espo, Ryan and Castle. The "boys" crime fighting is fun when it needs to be (Castle tracking Espo) and serious when it needs to. I don't even mind Alexis working with Castle. But pretty much every scene with Beckett bugged. From laying on the couch when someone walks into a room to talk to you (who does that?), to making calls on prescinct phones for her private case to "teasing" Castle. It was all just weird and not Beckett.

I seriously dislike the tired trope of spending years getting a couple together only to find ways to keep them apart. STOP IT SHOW!

Beckett needs to come clean and be honest with her spouse. You should never lie to your spouse, it will ruin the trust of the relationship. I can't see how Castle is not angry to the point of divorce with her shenanigans already. She is looking like a horrible person and an even worse spouse.

[ZingerCaskett]

I disagree.   I've been married a looooong time, and with my hubby 10 years before that.    You don't tell your spouse everything....especially if you are trying to figure something out.     Nothing that Kate is doing seems out of character or unrealistic to me, because I've lived something similar to it.   

 

I'm looking forward to seeing Kate and Rick to work through and resolve this crisis to their marriage.   Because it can be done, and the marriage is stronger for it...because you know that you can go to the brink...and make it back to each other.  

 

From that little snippet of conversation with the Irish mob hit man (lol),  Rick knows that something is going on with Kate and that she's crying out for help.   Whew,  a step up from last week's initial reaction....which is Rick being Rick by thinking it was him.  

 

As much as I hate seeing them apart....its obvious that they still love one another and will find their way back to each other.    In the meantime,  I'm getting tons of great scenes with Nathan, Stana, Jon, Seamus, Molly and Susan.     And what some see as a season 4 retread....I'm seeing callbacks galore.    I did a rewatch of the DC arc, and now am hitting all the seasons 1,2,3 and 4 callbacks that present itself.   

[Cyranetta]

 

Saddest bit, when she said she was going to be honest with Castle and the poor bastard looks so damn hopeful for a second (NF is so good at those little moments of desperate hope mixed with pain). Again that would have been a great scene IF she hadn't walked out on the guy and refused to tell him why, how about being honest about THAT.

I found that bit not just sad but irate-making, just a nasty tease by the writers to the audience eager for any movement back from the Swamp of Separation. 

[oberon55]

I guess their idea of continuity is that every week we have a check list.

 

1)Castle is trying to win Beckett back and will never give up. He will say it multiple times & it has to be brought up by a third party at least once an episode.

 

2)Beckett is still investigating LOCKSAT. We need at least 1 file and a phone call every week.

 

3)Alexis is an adult now (the proof is she drinks skotch & knows about sex & everything).

 

4)Beckett still loves Castle even though she basically kicks him in the balls every week.

 

5)If the breakup comes up Beckett will say "it's complicated" & whoever brought it up will say "oh ok".

 

6)Strangers will tell Beckett she is amazing & Castle that he sucks.

 

Things that won't make the list:

 

1)Where Beckett is staying.

 

2)Where she is storing the 3 metric tons of clothes that she owns.

 

3)Why we never see her doing any Captainy stuff (so far it looks like being Captain is exactly the same as being a detective).

 

4)How Beckett has a large cut that she stitches up herself & the very next week she is working out like an MMA fighter. I guess she is a fast healer.

 

5)What happened to Tory (did Beckett fire her to make room for Vikram or maybe she eloped with Sully).

[Chado]

I disagree.   I've been married a looooong time, and with my hubby 10 years before that.    You don't tell your spouse everything....especially if you are trying to figure something out.     Nothing that Kate is doing seems out of character or unrealistic to me, because I've lived something similar to it.   

There's a difference between 'you don't tell your spouse everything' and leaving your marriage without an explanation and expecting your partner to take you back at the end of it.

 

He's already been married twice, I struggle to understand where the patience comes from. The mentality of 'winning her back' defies reality.

[verdana]

I found that bit not just sad but irate-making, just a nasty tease by the writers to the audience eager for any movement back from the Swamp of Separation. 

"Swamp of Separation" so apt and yeah I expect they'll be more of these in the future, dangling that carrot and then tugging it away again.