S31: Stephen Fishbach

[pennben]

Heh, well there's that too.  I guess perhaps there is also a bit of revision going on that he had a inkling something was a miss and to put both his votes on Abi when he saw Spencer taking so long voting in the tribal when he was booted, but decided against it because he just couldn't believe Spencer would flip.

 

ETA:  Okay, listening to the Dalton Ross interview, he completely contradicts part of what he wrote about Spencer in his blog.  In his blog, he makes a bit of a jab that he thought Spencer was above making an emotional reaction to him not being taken on reward.  Then in talking to Dalton, he's explaining that Spencer told him that wasn't what happened and that he had Stephen's boot lined up even before the reward happened, and, after talking to him, Stephen knew he hadn't really made a decision based on that reward moment.  Pick a lane, Stephen.

Edited November 30, 2015 by pennben

[Oscirus]

Probably what he learned after the twitter war last night.

 

Back to his blog,  if Stephen would've used the advantage at the Ciera boot then it just would've tied up the vote with Ciera and they would've booted him on the revote.

Edited November 30, 2015 by Oscirus

[pennben]

n/m

Edited November 30, 2015 by pennben

[Guest]

not to mention the fact that he said he was  shocked the day after in confessionals on the show.

Where did he say that?  His 'day after' video or Ponderosa?  

[Oscirus]

Where did he say that?  His 'day after' video or Ponderosa?

 

It was in his confessionals right after Ciera was booted/he was talking to Jeremy and Kimmi(?).

 

.

Stealing Ciera's vote would have made it 1 vote Kimmi, 4 votes Ciera, 5 votes Stephen. Stephen goes home even without Jeremy's idol. If he does cave into his obsession and steal Moby-Dick's vote, Stephen stays. Hilarious.

 

Ciera only had 3 votes on her. Even if he stole joe's vote, it only would've been a tie.

[Guest]

It was in his confessionals right after Ciera was booted/he was talking to Jeremy and Kimmi(?).

Oh, I was confused and thought you meant he didn't see it coming his own boot episode, not Ciera's.  My mistake.  

[spritz]

He didn't play the game well at all IMO. Kimmi, Abi and Keith have made it farther than he did without doing squat.

 

 

Flipping on his alliance just to get out Wigles without having a clear plan for what came next was a mistake.

 

 

It seemed to me that Fishbach fell into the trap of "making a big move".

 

I know that Probst, and probably the producers as well, encourage the players to make "big moves". Blindsides and big moves may make the show more entertaining, but they may not always be in the best interest of a player. Fishbach's big move in voting out Wigglesworth was a case in point.

 

What exactly did getting rid of Wigglesworth accomplish for him? It just exposed Fishbach as disloyal and as a game player that everyone should be cautious of. Making a big move for the sake of making a big move is dumb strategy. Fishbach's big move backfired on him. Or at the very least, his timing for making a big move was wrong.

 

As the poster wrote, Kimmi, Abi and Keith have made it further without doing anything big, so far. 

[ByaNose]

Yeah, I think Stephen wasted his time voting out Wigglesworth. There were bigger fish to fry. Of course, he wanted to fry Joe but he kept winning II. He should have moved on and aims for someone else. It's the old would of, should of & could of. He seemed okay with how he did in his exit interviews. He said he played a good game but not a great game.

[LadyChatts]

Stephen's only big move this season seemed to involve doing anything and everything to get Joe out.  When that failed, he took out one of Joe's allies but in the process blindsided the majority that he was with (and quite honestly, Jeremy and Spencer could have screwed with their games by going with him on that).  Then he mis-managed the damage control.  Jeremy stuck his neck out for him at TC by playing an idol, and yet it still didn't seem to sink in that maybe he needed to be more careful in his game play or decisions when the majority had just tried to vote him off.  Joe loses and he just automatically thinks he's finally going to have this big moment in voting off the alpha, knowing that there's a vote split happening at TC because of idol fears, and not thinking there's a chance he could still be the target.  I believe he came into this game with a chip on his shoulder, that he wanted to go down as some Survivor great in a season like this, and he just let the game get the better of him.  I also don't think he can take the criticism as well as he can dish it out, and I'm sure we will see more damage control and revisionist history in his other interviews.

 

http://hollywoodlife.com/2015/11/30/stephen-fishbach-eliminated-survivor-cambodia-second-chance-interview/

 

Here, he said he didn't believe Spencer would go with the other group because that side was better in challenges (as opposed to Jeremy and Tasha, I guess).  He also said people were threatened by him and that's why he was voted off (I believe he put that threat on himself by his poor game play), and also said his reality TV days are behind him.  So if CBS ever did some crossover edition of Big Brother or TAR we won't be seeing him show up.  Actually, after watching this season, I'd love to see some of these guys stuck in the confined quarters of the BB house together.  

Edited November 30, 2015 by LadyChatts

[wonald]

Is it a chip on his shoulder or just something to prove, like the other 19 players this season? Just exactly who did he have a chip against "entering the game "? There might be some revisionist history but I am seeing it EVERYWHERE, not just in Fish's interviews.

[pennben]

Oh, sure, there's revisionist history going on everywhere, I just happened to listen to Stephen's today and was annoyed with a few things he said.

[Jextella]

The two things I give credit Spencer credit for - in both his seasons, is that he a) owns his weaknesses and b) doesn't claim to know it all.   I'm nor sure we always see that on the show but his behind the scene footage makes it crystal clear.

 

Fischback does these things on the surface and convinces himself he is doing them thoroughly, but he's not.   I dont mind because I like Fishbach, but I don't think he has the authentic and realistic self-awareness and honesty Spencer has.

Edited December 1, 2015 by Jextella

[wonald]

Fish confirmed that he had trench foot/ immersion foot, poor sod.

 

Spencer has a certain confidence/cockiness that lets him be more immune to criticism than Fish ever could.

Well, except for when Spencer has to admit that he sleeps over people's home who are not his" friends" like his BFF Shirin so he has no problem flipping on them.

[pennben]

That whole twitter thing was stupid last night on both sides, by the time I looked at it (and certainly some things may have been deleted), I would summarize it as follows:

 

Stephen:  I trusted my very close friend so much, and he voted me out.

Spencer:  I guess so, if you consider a friend strong enough not to vote you out to be someone you met in person once

Stephen:  I guess you don't remember being at my apartment?

Spencer:  That's what I was referring to when saying we had met in person once.

Stephen:  I didn't introduce you to my co-workers at my office on a different occasion? (you are gas-lighting me)

Spencer:  Damn, you are right, we did meet in person twice....I forgot about that time I was at your office.  (I wasn't gas-lighting you)

 

It was so totally juvenile and they just let Shane stir the pot.  Again, I'm just relating what I saw on twitter, who knows what really went down in real life.

 

I think perhaps they are gas-lighting all of us with this little feud.  More power to them, if so.

Edited December 1, 2015 by pennben

[Bryce Lynch]

That whole twitter thing was stupid last night on both sides, by the time I looked at it (and certainly some things may have been deleted), I would summarize it as follows:

Stephen: I trusted my very close friend so much, and he voted me out.

Spencer: I guess so, if you consider a friend strong enough not to vote you out to be someone you met in person once

Stephen: I guess you don't remember being at my apartment?

Spencer: That's what I was referring to when saying we had met in person once.

Stephen: I didn't introduce you to my co-workers at my office on a different occasion? (you are gas-lighting me)

Spencer: Damn, you are right, we did meet in person twice....I forgot about that time I was at your office. (I wasn't gas-lighting you)

It was so totally juvenile and they just let Shane stir the pot. Again, I'm just relating what I saw on twitter, who knows what really went down in real life.

I think perhaps they are gas-lighting all of us with this little feud. More power to them, if so.

So Stephen considers someone he met in person twice to be a "very, close friend"?

I think that the exchange demonstrates that by any normal human standards Spencer was correct that they were not very, close friends. The fact that he forgot about 1 of their 2 meetings only strengthens that case.

Stephen sounds like some sort of obsessive stalker in the exchange.

Regardless of that, Survivor is a game where you vote out your own mother...ask Ciera.

[Oscirus]

Yes, corrected! But it would be interesting to know if Stephen would have been told he got to use the stolen vote on the revote, as he and Ciera weren't allowed to vote, but Joe's vote was still his. (If so, it would be a tie again unless one of the others flipped.)

 

Unfortunately, even if that tie happened, Kelley and Abi would get to revote first and they'd definitely vote out Stephen.

 

Stephen has some of the weirdest revisionist history out there. Some other bulletins from his interviews

 

His preferred final 3 was Him, Abi and Kimmi

He created a fake twitter account with Spencer to out pregame alliances.

He's really pissed at Spencer, though he's trying to play it off.

His first alliance was him, Jeremy, Ciera, Tasha.

The reason he targeted Ciera was that she was targeting Spencer ( Ponderosa says different, but ok).

Jeremy suspected Spencer but he ignored Jeremy because apparently, Jeremy was ultra paranoid.

Spencer planned how the vote split would go with him for two hours.

Spencer and Tasha spent hours looking for the hii and were pissed at Jeremy for not doing the same thing

Kimmi was spilling information to Abi through Joe and apparently accidentally spilled that Stephen was targeting Abi by verifying this with Stephen while Abi was in the vicinity.

He's never playing again.

Edited December 1, 2015 by Oscirus

[LadyChatts]

Maybe being paranoid in this game is a good thing sometimes.  Especially when you were almost blindsided the previous vote, but saved because of an idol (an idol you your #1 ally lied to you about having originally).

 

I really wish there was a way for these Survivors to do interviews as soon as they were voted off.  Maybe do one after they were voted off and one after they've had months to sit home and come up with their story.  I'd like to see how much they differ.

Edited December 1, 2015 by LadyChatts

[wonald]

So Stephen considers someone he met in person twice to be a "very, close friend"?

I think that the exchange demonstrates that by any normal human standards Spencer was correct that they were not very, close friends. The fact that he forgot about 1 of their 2 meetings only strengthens that case.

Stephen sounds like some sort of obsessive stalker in the exchange.

Regardless of that, Survivor is a game where you vote out your own mother...ask Ciera.

 

 

Sigh. You know that you are basing all this on an obviously slanted, sarcastic post by someone who doesnt like Fish. right? Whatevs.

[Guest]

He's really pissed at Spencer, though he's trying to play it off.

 

Stephen said that in an interview, including that 'he's trying to play it off', or is that last personal commentary?  I'd like to hear/read that one.  Is it on RHAP?  

 

I don't really care that much about who played worse here but the few Stephen interviews/blogs I've read, he doesn't come off as self-righteous or angry.  He's his usual -- self-deprecating and appreciative of the experience and the players around him.

[Special K]

I have slept over at the homes of people I do not consider my close friends or whom I didn't even know before I arrived at their house.  This kind of thing happens when you are young, when you are going, say, with a bunch of people to a city to see a concert or run a race or go to a party, and somebody has a generous friend there, and so you all sleep on their floor, couch, etc.

 

Seriously, I've crashed at people's houses whose names I don't even remember now.   I think that's pretty normal in your 20s.

Edited December 1, 2015 by Special K

[kakiphony]

I don't really understand why the difference in perceptions of their level of friendship is such a big deal. Stephen thought they were closer than Spencer did. Big deal. To me, it says more about their personalities than it does about their level/lack of delusion.

 

Stephen seems like the kind of guy who does make friends, and who genuinely likes people. He's said before that the backstabbing in his first season took a serious toll on him, and that he tried to avoid making deep personal connections this season because of that. He also seems like the kind of guy who forms bonds with people online. This is not weird to me. Some of my closest friends are people I've never met in person. We talk daily, are supportive of each other, and have been in one another's lives consistently for 10 years. I may not have slept over at their houses, but I value them. Stephen may have felt this way about Spencer.

 

Spencer, on the other hand, admittedly has trouble with relationships and personal connections. I think for him to trust someone and really consider them a friend it takes a lot. So, the daily interaction with Stephen on their secret "exposing pre-game alliances" project, and even the personal visits, may not have developed the bond well enough for Spencer to have considered it a tight friendship. He hadn't bared his soul or anything, and to him that level is what a friendship means.

 

So it's about perception and expectation. Neither is wrong. Neither is delusional. They see the world differently and interpreted their interactions differently. This is LIFE. It's why some of us are surprised when we get asked to be in wedding parties, and others are hurt when they aren't. It's why party guest lists are such a bitch.

Edited December 1, 2015 by kakiphony

[peachmangosteen]

I just went through a post with all of Stephen's tweets and this post he made on reddit. I just think someone should stop him from tweeting/posting online tbh. He's not doing himself any favors. And combined with how he was this season I just feel bad for the guy. He's just so embarrassing!

Edited December 1, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[peachmangosteen]

He seems to reply to every tweet about him that's negative. He comes off very emotionally needy to me. I've actually grown to like his neurotic messiness tbh!

 

My fave thing about this whole mess was how much he came off like some kind of jilted ex-lover of Spencer. "Oh I guess I imagined you meeting my coworkers and staying in my home!"

 

How old is Stephen?

Edited December 1, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[LadyChatts]

Why does he think Spencer turning on him was a bad strategical move?  Made sense to me.  Jeremy played his idol on Stephen, which may have shown he valued Stephen higher than anyone else in his alliance; Stephen picked Tasha/Jeremy for the reward, he openly said he wanted to mend fences with Tasha.  Where does that leave Spencer?

 

Also, he seems a little hung up on the whole friendship thing with Spencer.  Why does it matter that much what Spencer says or thought?  Maybe he didn't consider himself as close of friends as Stephen did.  I think it's pretty hysterical, and no matter what he says, I think he's got an issue with his portrayal given his reputation outside of the game.  You'd think he got a Dan Foley style edit.

Edited December 1, 2015 by LadyChatts

[wonald]

It looked to me that he cleared his schedule to be extra present online this week since he knew this was his boot. He knew that he would get questions from everywhere. It would look WORSE if he was LESS present.

 

He can disappear next week when noone will care anymore.

 

And nothing says "I think you made a bad strategical move" more than giving you the Fishy.

Edited December 1, 2015 by wonald

[Nashville]

Dad's Rules For Arguments:

• There are three sides to every argument - Thing 1's side, Thing 2's side, and The Truth.
• The Truth resides somewhere between the other two. Both may claim it, and it could quite possibly be skewed towards one side more than the other, but it is exceedingly rare - virtually nonexistent, in fact - for one side to totally own it.
• If you exercise your own personal freedom of choice and decide to take one side as gospel over the other, have at and God bless - just don't expect anybody else to feel obligated to conform to your decision and accept that side as law. The other person has freedom of choice too, after all.
• Incessant repetition of speculation or untruth does not magically turn it into The Truth - no matter WHAT Rush Limbaugh says.

:)

[slowpoked]

Stephen just said Ciera is a little lazy around camp, and Ciera didn't deny. Heh!

[Guest]

If it's embarrassing for Stephen to defend himself online we all should be mortified at whatever we do here week after week.  

[Kromm]

I just went through a post with all of Stephen's tweets and this post he made on reddit. I just think someone should stop him from tweeting/posting online tbh. He's not doing himself any favors. And combined with how he was this season I just feel bad for the guy. He's just so embarrassing!

Oh man. This really confirms this neediness we saw in the show, doesn't it? And actually even if he IS responding to both negative and positive tweets, to me the key issue is that he's even bothering to reply to more than just the handful most people would. Again, I think it all comes down to some strong need to preserve some place in "history" that he sees the show as some avenue towards.

Honestly, he should just be able to do a mea culpa, say he screwed up, and go silent for a while. It would do him a lot of good and allow him to eventually come back saying he's had time to think over how it all went wrong. Never mind that he's had months since this all actually happened... what's new now and stoking the fires are people having just SEEN what he did and how he did it. He needed to wait till it wasn't fresh in people's minds to give his side, basically, because at this point his hyper-responsiveness just echoes the mistakes we saw on the show.

[Oscirus]

Stephen said that in an interview, including that 'he's trying to play it off', or is that last personal commentary?  I'd like to hear/read that one.  Is it on RHAP?

 

You mean the fact that he repeatedly brings up his relationship with Spencer and can't stop talking about how Spencer used his personal friendship to betray him while at the same time overly praising the move wasn't a big giveaway?

 

And nothing says "I think you made a bad strategical move" more than giving you the Fishy.

 

Stephen's not an idiot, he knows that not acknowledging the move would just make him come off as a sore loser. He's fairly protective of his online image.

 

That ew interview was weird to me. Why was he sniping at Ciera about targeting him? Did he think she was going to play the game for him to win  and not target him just because he was willing to work with her?

 

[wonald]

 

 

Stephen's not an idiot, he knows that not acknowledging the move would just make him come off as a sore loser. He's fairly protective of his online image.

 

That ew interview was weird to me. Why was he sniping at Ciera about targeting him? Did he think she was going to play the game for him to win  and not target him just because he was willing to work with her?

 

There is acknowledging and then there is saying you made the best strategic move that episode. It seems that whatever Fish does is wrong.

[Kromm]

There is acknowledging and then there is saying you made the best strategic move that episode. It seems that whatever Fish does is wrong.

There are levels of wrong. I think the least overtly wrong among his choices would be as I said, a simple mea culpa (for playing a shit game) and letting the show actually go out of people's memories before he tries pushing out his side of things.  Especially when one of the main problems with his portrayal was how over-reactive he is. 

 

Obviously there would still be some criticisms and negatives from doing even that, but I really do think it's the key to him battling any image of him being desperate, and overly engaged with Survivor.

[fishcakes]

Even though Stephen is being very How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days over Spencer, he's still not as embarrassing to me as Lex was about Boston Rob in All-Stars. When I remember Lex's furious, spit-flecked tirade about how he did all kinds of "special friend favors" for Rob, I still want to laugh even this many years later. But it would be funny if Stephen showed up at the next TC with a blue mohawk.

[Whimsy]

Let's stick to our "Be Civil" rule please.  Some posts have been deleted for not following this rule. 

 

Thanks and happy posting.

[Zuleikha]

Stephen's very engaged in social media and has been for a long time. I don't think his gameplay was so bad that he's obligated himself to slink away for several weeks or not give his POV. Personally, I don't see the inconsistency in his talk about Spencer. He's been asked about it and a third party did a bunch of sh*t stirring, which I think makes it seem like Stephen is making a bigger deal out of it than IMHO he is. 

[peachmangosteen]

Even though Stephen is being very How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days over Spencer, he's still not as embarrassing to me as Lex was about Boston Rob in All-Stars. When I remember Lex's furious, spit-flecked tirade about how he did all kinds of "special friend favors" for Rob, I still want to laugh even this many years later.

 

No one will ever be as embarrassing as Lex. He takes the cake. Memories!

 

I just want it known that I actually like Stephen for the most part and I'm very endeared by his neurotic ways, but I still find most of his behavior this season and post season pretty embarrassing. Not like annoying Lex embarrassing, but like a 'Ah, what a cute little dumb dumb! I wanna hug him!' kind of embarrassing.