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Social Media and Behind the Scenes: AKA Everything Else Not "News and Media"

Zalyn

By Zalyn
in Arrow

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dtissagirl
dtissagirl

What bugs me is the implication that if you are not patient, you're watching it wrong. Naw, son. You don't get to tell me how I watch TV. I'm an actual pro at doing it.

WindofChange
WindofChange

Oh wow, Emily. I'm impressed because this is really brave and I'm really proud that she said this in such an eloquent way.

dtissagirl
dtissagirl

Ha. Reading those stage directions, and realizing how EBR went the opposite way [curious and skeptic rather than faint by hot guy] makes me understand 100% how fucking lost they were at that time, and

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

I can buy that years of training matches up well with years of training. At someone point, you're going to have seen pretty much everything. If you're seasoned, you're seasoned for the most part, whether it's 8 years of survival or a lifetime of training in technique. I can buy Oliver beating Nyssa, although I'd like to get her a win.  

 

Theoretically, Sara should be able to take Laurel pretty easily/quickly, since she's still very new and learning. The only way someone like Laurel should be able to beat Sara is if she used a distraction, like the straining poo shriek, or if she got the drop on Sara somehow. But last season Laurel was bested by common street thugs in one ep, and then somehow holding her own with and beating LoA people the next, so who even knows. 

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Sakura12

Sakura12

Laurel's character is so inconsistent it's hard to even know who she is or what she can do. That's why she's Because Comics. 

 

Before this season we've only seen Oliver lose to the big bads, not to the one offs. Nyssa would be included in that since she was never really an enemy. This season Oliver's seems to have forgotten he's a seasoned fighter, because the newbies need a purpose on the team. 

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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

(edited)

I always saw the street thug fight as Laurel having to learn not to underestimate her enemy which seemed to be what Nyssa was getting at.

Yeah Laurel shouldn't beat Sara in straight up combat, but she should be able to beat her if she put her brains to work and used her devices to her advantage.

But it's hard to use the "years of training" when it comes to Laurel but ignore sometimes when it comes to others.

Edited by Primal Slayer
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wonderwall

wonderwall

(edited)

Laurel's character is so inconsistent it's hard to even know who she is or what she can do. That's why she's Because Comics. 

 

Before this season we've only seen Oliver lose to the big bads, not to the one offs. Nyssa would be included in that since she was never really an enemy. This season Oliver's seems to have forgotten he's a seasoned fighter, because the newbies need a purpose on the team. 

 

The Because Comics disease is contagious y'know. It affects the people around it too.

 

Last year Digg was sidelined. This year Oliver is made to look like he can't fight at all. 

 

*looks away*

 

ETA. That was sort of mean... Whoops

Yeah Laurel shouldn't beat Sara in straight up combat, but she should be able to beat her if she put her brains to work and used her devices to her advantage.

If Laurel can put her brains to work, so can Sara? Sara isn't just a mindless fighter, she can be creative too which is why even when Laurel is being creative and use her brain to her advantage, she'd still lose because Sara would be using her brain too. It's like how Oliver can beat Barry in a fight. While Barry can use all of his devices to his advantage, Oliver will still win because of his years of training and practice and creativity in the field. 

Edited by wonderwall
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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

But it's hard to use the "years of training" when it comes to Laurel but ignore sometimes when it comes to others.

 

No one is ignoring it in this argument, though? Thea couldn't beat Sara, and I don't recall Roy and Sara ever going at it when he wasn't hopped up on Mirakuru.

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Sakura12

Sakura12

(edited)

Sara's been shown to set up traps, so she would use her brain in a fight as well. Even more so since she's learned how to be mindful of her surroundings. Which from what I've seen Laurel is not very mindful of her surroundings. 

Edited by Sakura12
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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

No one is ignoring it in this argument, though? Thea couldn't beat Sara, and I don't recall Roy and Sara ever going at it when he wasn't hopped up on Mirakuru.

When it is said that Oliver is the main character thus should win, that's ignoring to me. They had Thea help best Slade, and we don't know what they would do with Thea/Sara since Thea never fights for her life when it comes to Sara.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

When it is said that Oliver is the main character thus should win, that's ignoring to me. 

 

What exactly does this have to do with Laurel and the discussion we were having? You wrote that people were ignoring the "years of experience" for other characters, but not Laurel. Oliver has years of experience, and took his fair share of defeats while he was still learning, so I'm not sure what your point is. Oliver shouldn't always win because he's the main character, but he's a skilled enough fighter that it's believable for him to win often.

Edited by apinknightmare
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wonderwall

wonderwall

(edited)

I don't think that it's the case that the more you practice and the more years you have as a fighter means you continually get better. IMO your skills tend to plateau at a certain point which is why for me it's not hard to believe that Sara/Oliver/Nyssa would be equally skilled which is why I don't really mind seeing Oliver win in a fight with Nyssa. It's not like Oliver always wins his fights. he's had his fair share of losses too. 

 

Oliver getting beat up by random people in S4 IMO IS ignoring the years of experience Oliver has had only because the show wants to incorporate newbies into the team and make them look important. So while they go out and fight, Oliver just stands there and does nothing and only gets used in fight scenes to get beat up to level the playing field. There's a reason why Diggle/Oliver didn't need Thea/Laurel before. They're pretty capable by themselves. But this season, it's like the show is making Oliver look incapable on purpose. It's annoying. And it makes me resent the new team a bit. 

Edited by wonderwall
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tarotx

tarotx

Nyssa has never had to fight one of our other characters when she wasn't emotionally weakened. Nyssa hasn't been able to train though her emotions. It's her weakness. I think She wants to feel but that it does affect her.

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hogwash

hogwash

Oliver beat Ra's Al Ghul in a one-on-one fight. It didn't make a lick of sense then or now but that's what the show has established. No one should be beating him in physical fights outside of special circumstances/powers (Vandal Savage, Darhk, etc.). 

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wonderwall

wonderwall

Oliver beat Ra's Al Ghul in a one-on-one fight. It didn't make a lick of sense then or now but that's what the show has established. No one should be beating him in physical fights outside of special circumstances/powers (Vandal Savage, Darhk, etc.). 

 

It made sense to me because Arrow's Ra's was a wimp tbh. Take away his comic reputation, and he's actually a wimp. 

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doesntworkonwood

doesntworkonwood

Maybe Oliver is having a season long punk'd at Thea and Laurel, pretending he forgot how to fight ruthlessly so they do the brunt and grunt of the unimportant red shirt fights, and he can protect the biceps.

Naah... Why wouldn't he want to give Felicity and excuse to play nurse? 

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tarotx

tarotx

Ra's was being all lol Oliver here you are dying alone. But by that time Oliver was like hells no, it's you Ra's who are alone. It was Ra's ego and Felicity just having gave Oliver the big season speech.

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Primal Slayer

Primal Slayer

As the series goes on, the enemies should get harder. Buffy went from operating solo in battle to gaining a witch, a vampire, and another Slayer. She would've lost if she hadn't accumulated the friends she did by s5. Arrow just needs to find a way to make the enemies more lethal so it requires a team.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

(edited)

Oliver beat Ra's Al Ghul in a one-on-one fight. It didn't make a lick of sense then or now but that's what the show has established. No one should be beating him in physical fights outside of special circumstances/powers (Vandal Savage, Darhk, etc.).

If we're going by Arrow's version of Ra's Al Ghul I didn't see a problem. They way they set up the victory was very similar to how Oliver defeated Malcom in S1, putting his life/body in danger in order to get the upper hand.

If we're talking Comics, Ra's Al Ghul isn't unbeatable. Batman has defeated him, Nyssa/Talia teamed up to take him down and most recently Black Canary (Dinah Drake) defeated Ra's twice (once using her Canary Cry in an amplified room) and in the Future's End BoP issue, Dinah basically took over the LoA after defeating Ra's.

Edited by Morrigan2575
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hogwash

hogwash

Ra's and S03 LOA sucked at everything they tried to accomplish. But Malcolm was scared of Ra's and Ra's literally murdered Oliver in the midseason finale. Nothing Oliver did between his miraculous recovery after getting literally murdered  and the one-on-one fight in the finale explains why the crap he won. It was a stupid looking fight but it happened so Oliver needs to stop losing to randoms. 

 

This is reminding me of that review guy quitting the show cause he hated Thea and Laurel becoming instant heroes. I thought he was overreacting... Guess not.

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apinknightmare

apinknightmare

(edited)

Ra's and S03 LOA sucked at everything they tried to accomplish. But Malcolm was scared of Ra's and Ra's literally murdered Oliver in the midseason finale. Nothing Oliver did between his miraculous recovery after getting literally murdered  and the one-on-one fight in the finale explains why the crap he won. It was a stupid looking fight but it happened so Oliver needs to stop losing to randoms. 

 

Well, Oliver told Malcolm that the reason he lost was because he hesitated to kill Ra's (SURE, JAN), and he had been training with Malcolm in sword fighting. So I *think* that we were supposed to believe that Oliver's willingness to kill coupled with his newly learned LoA sword skills helped him win. Especially since Ra's was apparently a tired bastard who used the exact same moves in both fights. YMMV, of course. 

Edited by apinknightmare
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wonderwall

wonderwall

Don't forget Felicity's awesome pep talk. "Stop trying to kill yourself, Oliver." "You're blowing my mind, Felicity."

If having sex with Felicity can make Ray have a scientific breakthrough then her speeches to Oliver can make him strong enough to kill Ra's.

LOL basically Felicity is the one you need to associate yourself with if you want to achieve what seems to be the impossible.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

Ra's and S03 LOA sucked at everything they tried to accomplish. But Malcolm was scared of Ra's and Ra's literally murdered Oliver in the midseason finale. Nothing Oliver did between his miraculous recovery after getting literally murdered  and the one-on-one fight in the finale explains why the crap he won. It was a stupid looking fight but it happened so Oliver needs to stop losing to randoms. 

 

This is reminding me of that review guy quitting the show cause he hated Thea and Laurel becoming instant heroes. I thought he was overreacting... Guess not.

THANK YOU.  Seriously, a couple months of training and a pep talk do not magically grant sword-fighting skills sufficient to beat a dude who's been sword-fighting for a hundred+ years.  

 

God S3 sucked.

 

RAG being such a fail was a huge reason S3 didn't work for me, not just because boring villains are boring, but because we were supposed to buy that RAG was so terrifying that Oliver really did have to do all this crazy/stupid shit to beat him.  But the whole time, I didn't believe it.  Dude was a greasy 70s porn star lounging in a hot tub.  NOT SCARY.  Have Waller toss a couple bunker-busters at Nanda, and it's all over.  Oh, and Oliver, instead of bringing a sword as told to a sword-fight, should have used his brain and pulled a Raiders move on RAG.  He was so weirdly obedient to the bad guy and the bad guy's rules in S3.

 

This is why I try not to talk or think about S3.  So much residual rage.

Don't forget Felicity's awesome pep talk. "Stop trying to kill yourself, Oliver." "You're blowing my mind, Felicity." 

EXACTLY.  The main character is SO DUMB that he actually had to be TOLD this.

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

(edited)

LOL…are you sure about that? 

The rage part or the talking about it part?

 

I've been pretty honest about how very much I hated it.  I cannot personally remember ever hating a tv show even half as much as I hated Arrow S3.  I had a lot of issues with Veronica Mars S3, and I wasn't a huge fan of Buffy S6, but yeah, I had actual rage-induced insomnia because of Arrow S3.  I just loved Oliver so much, and seeing him act like that...man.  

Edited by AyChihuahua
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Angel12d

Angel12d

The rage part or the talking about it part?

 

I've been pretty honest about how very much I hated it.  I cannot personally remember ever hating a tv show even half as much as I hated Arrow S3.  I had a lot of issues with Veronica Mars S3, and I wasn't a huge fan of Buffy S6, but yeah, I had actual rage-induced insomnia because of Arrow S3.  I just loved Oliver so much, and seeing him act like that...man.  

 

I meant the talking about it part. You've spoken a lot about how much you hate s3 and Oliver.

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Morrigan2575

Morrigan2575

(edited)

EBR back in Vancouver last night. Taken by Canadagrpahs

CVC_BR8VEAAVwD-.jpg

Apparently she also apologized to Canadagrpahs for not stopping to sign for him when she was leaving for Maui...[sarcasm]what a Bitch![/sarcasm]

Edited by Morrigan2575
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wonderwall

wonderwall

LOL I saw that canadagraphs guy said that even though EBR apologized to him, she's still not a nice person, she was only nice THAT NIGHT. *rolls eyes*

 

I know this is fandom talk, but this guy is such an ass. He trash talks EBR behind her back and then asks her for her autograph so he can turn around and make a profit out of it. 

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KenyaJ

KenyaJ

As the series goes on, the enemies should get harder. Buffy went from operating solo in battle to gaining a witch, a vampire, and another Slayer. She would've lost if she hadn't accumulated the friends she did by s5. Arrow just needs to find a way to make the enemies more lethal so it requires a team.

 

Better yet, Arrow could stop trying to fit square pegs into round holes. As much as I enjoy Thea having more to do these days, as fighters, she and Laurel are completely extraneous. Oliver doesn't need them in order to effectively fight crime, and that's why all these four-person fight scenes stick out like a sore thumb. Unlike the Scooby Gang, which each had unique skills and roles to play in helping Buffy, Thea and Laurel don't bring anything unique or indispensable to Team Arrow. They're just two extra bodies to add to the fight scenes, and that's no justification for their presence on the team.

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SmallScreenDiva

SmallScreenDiva

(edited)

To be fair, I felt the same way last year with Roy. Digg and Oliver have this; extra masks need not apply. But Digg in 4x03 actually explains Thea and Laurel's. They're extra "boots on the ground." The show's explanation for them is basically that there are more Ghosts to fight, not that they contribute any unique skills to the team, as Felicity and Digg do.

Edited by SmallScreenDiva
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Angel12d

Angel12d

I have no issue with the bigger team because it makes sense to have more people out there. It's just I'm bored of watching the same thing every week, which is they all go out together and usually, Oliver/SA gets limited action scenes because they're too busy pimping Thea and Laurel fight scenes. I think it says a lot that the biggest stunt they've ever done on this show was in 407 and SA wasn't even a part of it. Badly done, IMO.

 

As with most things on this show, they need to balance things better.

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EmilyBettFan

EmilyBettFan

I have no issue with the bigger team because it makes sense to have more people out there. It's just I'm bored of watching the same thing every week, which is they all go out together and usually, Oliver/SA gets limited action scenes because they're too busy pimping Thea and Laurel fight scenes. I think it says a lot that the biggest stunt they've ever done on this show was in 407 and SA wasn't even a part of it. Badly done, IMO.

As with most things on this show, they need to balance things better.

Exactly why Laurel needs to be the one to go. She's not as good as a fighter as Thea and anyone can wear that canary cry. She just takes up too much time with the same story lines each season. About Sara and Quentin.
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