Prince Charming: I will find them. I will always find them!

[KingOfHearts]

James in the Underworld added nothing to anything. Nothing gained, nothing lost. He continues to be dead and David continues to see him as a selfish jerkface. He didn't contribute to anyone's character development, nor even the plot itself. Over the course of several episodes, his meeting with David was setup as important. While we did get a serious confrontation, it fell flat because we had already seen it happen to the other characters and (Belle with Gaston, for example.) it didn't change anything. Others who encountered the dead were affected. David was not.

[HoodlumSheep]

Yeah, david and james got gypped.

[Souris]

Everybody who isn't Regina/Zelena got gypped.

[YaddaYadda]

It's too bad because David's life changed completely when James died. He became a prince, he met Snow. A lot of things he is now, he would never have become had it not been for James' death.

I think it would have been interesting if James had brought that up. Because it's sort of true.

[Mari]

True.

If James hadn't died, David would have likely gone to Anna and Whatshisname's wedding, and gotten iced over with Arendelle.

It couldn't have been very long after he met Anna, who heroified him (Blech.  Just, blech.), that James' father came to fetch him.  

[InsertWordHere]

Hmm, David getting iced before meeting Snow is an interesting idea for a fanfic. Would Rumple try to find another TL couple and someone else (still not Zelena) who hated the TL couple enough to cast the curse or would he be forced to de-ice Arendelle so David could meet Snow?

[Camera One]

It seems like True Love couples are a dime a dozen, so the whole importance of Snow and Charming in Season 1 seems to be completely over-inflated.  

[Camera One]

Call him judgmental or sanctimonious, but I really like that side of David sometimes.  He didn't seem at all apologetic in the scene in "Mother", when Lily was flying around as a dragon.

------

DAVID: It's headed this way.

MM: She.

MALEFICENT: Thank you. I'm worried. You need to be taught to fly, and she was way too low. If one wing tip hit a tree, she could be badly hurt.

DAVID: And maybe hurt a lot of people around you, too. 

------

[Camera One]

It was David's centric and Young David got 1 minute of screentime.  Sounds about right...

Edited March 13, 2017 by Camera One

[Rumsy4]

15 minutes ago, Camera One said:

It was David's centric and Young David got 1 minute of screentime.  Sounds about right...

It was more about James, and developing sympathy for Young James. You know--the twin who has until now been portrayed as a straight-up douche bag. The writers wanted us to have sympathy for the evil Twin. How typical.

[InsertWordHere]

I would say the flashbacks were more about Papa Charming than either David or James. 

I did like that young James was wearing the classic Snow White Disney Prince outfit. 

[PixiePaws1]

So..when David finds out that Hook killed his dad (or thinks he did..)  what are the chances of David remembering that he'd have died in Neverland if not for Hook and that he killed deckhand!Hook in Isaac's alt reality...and that Killian was mortally wounded by Excalibur because he was saving Snow from being strangled to death??? 

Doesn't excuse the apparent random murder  (still not certain those pages and the memories are legit...)..but they are all things that David shouldn't ignore..

Edited March 13, 2017 by PixiePaws1
Spelling...*sigh*

[Camera One]

That's the reasoning they use to explain why Emma and Snow should be complete forgiving robots about what Regina has done (since she has saved their lives so often and even sacrificed herself), so I have no doubt that at the end of the day, Hook will be forgiven.  However, what is so maddening about this new "twist" is that this particular murder wouldn't be that easy for David to forgive and forget.

Add to that, on this show, "angry" people never act or think in a rationale manner.  Just look at David through 2/3 of this episode.  Did they write him any differently than Edmond Dantes?  Nope...

Edited March 13, 2017 by Camera One

[Curio]

I think what will help David get over Killian killing Robert is:

1. Robert was still a drunk father to David for as long as David could remember. Just because he started turning his life around in two weeks time doesn't take away David's bad memories of being a six-year-old boy whose father always ditched his family to go drinking.
2. David only has very brief childhood memories of his father. Most people don't remember much of their lives before three years old, so it's not like David is mentally saying goodbye to a really close person with whom he shares a lot of good memories with. Granted, it sucks that Hook is the reason why David doesn't have more memories with his father, but Robert was going to die no matter what that night. If Hook hadn't killed him, King George's henchmen would have instead. Hook killing Robert doesn't change David's fate of being fatherless.
3. David already has gotten to stab Killian in the back and kill him. Granted, it was a fake realm, but it's catharsis nonetheless.
4. He saw Emma stab Killian and kill him with a sword. It's literally karmic justice for Hook stabbing Robert with a sword. David saw how beat up and bloody Killian was in the Underworld. He's seen him die numerous times. I think David knows Hook has suffered enough.
5. If Emma doesn't have Killian around, David will see how miserable Emma is without her True Love. I think he'd rather see his daughter happy and in love than hold a grudge against Hook forever.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Curio

[Camera One]

56 minutes ago, Curio said:

I think what will help David get over Killian killing Robert is:

1. Robert was still a drunk father to David for as long as David could remember. Just because he started turning his life around in two weeks time doesn't take away David's bad memories of being a six-year-old boy whose father always ditched his family to go drinking.

You actually gave me an idea that might be right out of A&E's cerebrum.

We will get a flashback where we find out David's father cheated on Ruth with Cora and he broke Cora's heart.  Now, there's no reason to feel sad.  He deserved it!  Scratch that, he created the Dark Curse.

That's why this show is actually quite easy to write.  You could literally write ANYTHING.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Camera One

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

That's why this show is actually quite easy to write.  You could literally write ANYTHING.

As evident in the last five minutes of last night's episode. All I can see the hands of the puppeteer, not the puppets. It's very distracting. And no, that was not a Pinocchio pun.

[Mari]

1 hour ago, Camera One said:

 

We will get a flashback where we find out David's father cheated on Ruth with Cora and he broke Cora's heart. 

His cheating code name was Jonathan.  (There may or may not have been a relationship with Maleficent.  Dragon pregnancies are surprisingly long.)

[Camera One]

Quote

I donno why Killian looks up to him. Prince Charming is bit of a  sexist bigot (and am saying this as someone who likes Charming despite his flaws).

I think David sees the world more in black and white, but I think a lot of his actions do not support a blanket label of a sexist.  He is willing to defer to Snow a lot and he had confidence in her abilities before he knew her in the flashback in 6A.  He was willing to have her face Regina alone with the fake Excalibur.   He also gave pep talks to Red, Rapunzel, Elsa, Emma, and he trusted in them and saw them as capable women.  He was open to Anna teaching him how to sword fight when a real sexist would never have put himself into such a "demeaning" position.  

I know a lot of people dislike him for his old fashioned values of being protective of Emma and feeling like he could judge her love interests, and for being so mean to Hook all the time.  But I personally know a few fathers and older brothers (and mothers and older sisters) who have that type of reflex reaction with their daughters or younger siblings, and I wouldn't stand there and call them sexist.  

Edited March 18, 2017 by Camera One

[Shanna Marie]

51 minutes ago, Camera One said:

But I personally know a few fathers and older brothers (and mothers and older sisters) who have that type of reflex reaction with their daughters or younger siblings, and I wouldn't stand there and call them sexist.  

Yeah, my little brother is like that with me -- if I even mention a male friend, he gets all puffed up and talking about "is there some guy I need to have words with?" -- though it is possible that he is a sexist. I find it highly amusing and ironic that a guy who cheated on his wife and left her for another woman is feeling the need to "defend" his big sister against any man who looks at her (maybe because he's projecting on other men?).

I don't think David's necessarily all-purpose sexist. It mostly just seems to apply to Hook, and then only in the designated Captain Charming Bromance episodes. He certainly didn't go all overprotective daddy on Neal. That may have had something to do with wanting Neal to make an honest woman out of Emma or create an intact family for Henry so Henry would have a dad in the picture, or possibly a naive belief in first love being true love. We don't know how much he knew about Neal's past, if he knew Neal was a thief, though he had to have known that Neal slept with Emma when she was underage, and even if that was an age that would have been okay in the Enchanted Forest, David has enough of the Storybrooke download to be icked out.

So, basically, it's just about Hook, and only when the writers want to generate conflict. We can't have Hook and David just working together in a relationship that's built on everything that's happened before and maybe bringing up new stuff. We have to revert to "you're a pirate who's not good enough for my daughter" to give them conflict.

[Mathius]

I said this before, but David and Hook's relationship felt like it had organic growth from 2B through 4A.  In 4B and 5A, suddenly it regressed so that David wasn't close to Hook, didn't trust him not to go dark, and even would have preferred it if Emma let him die.  In 5B, he suddenly is bonding with Hook again, only for Season 6 to give them yet another reset in their relationship.  It's annoying as hell.  This show cannot do natural progression.

Edited March 18, 2017 by Mathius

[Rumsy4]

3 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

That may have had something to do with wanting Neal to make an honest woman out of Emma or create an intact family for Henry so Henry would have a dad in the picture

Yeah. His lack of any issues with Neal seems to stem from the fact that he fathered Emma's child, and seemed like a conventional good guy in contrast with Hook or Rumple. That also stems from sexist tendencies. 

He does let Snow call the shots (even on occasions where he should have put his foot down), but when it comes to his own children, he does seem to become this old fashioned patriarch. He even wanted a firstborn son before finding out he had a daughter. Also, he has kept some secrets from Snow, which again suggests some insecurity in that relationship. And after the eggnapping, I feel like Charming has no moral high ground over Hook, because he and Snow literally did nothing to reverse what they did. I hate the eggnapping because it waa so OOC, but in-canon, it had no consequences for Snowing. Only for other people. And if the eggnapping was meant to frame Snowing as people who did bad things like Regina, why never call attention to it? And why is Charming killing Percival okay when literally any other killings are labeled "murder"? Why am I/Killian supposed to accept blindly that Charming is some paragon compared to Hook when he is actually a morally grey character? It would be more interesting to explore Charming's other flaws and inconsistencies than the retread of the stupid sexist "you alone not good enough for my daughter no matter what good you do, or how much my daughter loves you, you filthy pirate" schtick. He doesn't even consider Emma's feelings, let alone Hook's, when he goes off on him.

Granted, Charming is nastier to Hook when no one else is around, but he makes it clear to Emma that he still doesn't apparently like her live-in boyfriend all that much because they moved in. This is the same guy who did nothing to find Emma in the missing year until he and his wife needed her to save their unborn son. But apparently being separated from her is not worse than her ending up with the man who reunited them with their daughter. He has a closer relationship with Emma than Snow, but that's not based on real understanding of his daughter. He's already been treating Hook like he killed his father--and now apparently he really did kill his father. I can't wait for Charming to explode on Hook again--NOT. 

Edited March 18, 2017 by Rumsy4

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

I said this before, but David and Hook's relationship felt like it had organic growth from 2B through 4A.  In 4B and 5A, suddenly it regressed so that David wasn't close to Hook, didn't trust him not to go dark, and even would have preferred it if Emma let him die.  In 5B, he suddenly is bonding with Hook again, only for Season 6 to give them yet another reset in their relationship.  It's annoying as hell.  This show cannot do natural progression.

I agree 100% with this. Charming has the same issue with Hook that he did back in 3A - he's a pirate. He doesn't care that he sacrificed his life to save his daughter among other things. Hook is supposedly morally bankrupt simply because he has the image of a pirate, no matter what he does to change. That's just petty discrimination on Charming's part. It bothers me that Hook is technically much older and wiser from his experiences, yet Charming treats him like he has some sort of seniority over him. The whole dynamic is just messed up.

And as @Rumsy4 said, Charming has made some very questionable decisions. He was just about to kill out of revenge, just like Hook wanted to. The difference is, Hook will gladly admit his mistakes and try to atone for them. Charming will brush them side like they never happened, then judge people as a hypocrite.

Edited March 18, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Camera One]

It goes to show how shallow the character development is on this show.  It works both ways, though.  Since his only problem is Hook is a "pirate", then forgiveness will come easy too.  And then they would have done this all over again in Season 9.  The dearth of creativity is truly astounding, especially with a character like Charming who they haven't even begun to dig into, since they "explore" him about once every 22 episodes.  

[KAOS Agent]

What bothered me most about David's attitude towards Hook is how it ignores Emma's feelings about the matter. David is perfectly entitled to distrust/dislike Hook and it seems like David has even more reason now, but he doesn't have the right to act like just because Hook was/is a pirate that it's totally cool to use him to steal from and lie to Emma. He's potentially putting Hook's relationship with Emma in turmoil for his own selfish needs. That's something that affects Emma's happiness. And why does David believe it's okay to steal from Emma? How can David be so judgmental about Hook's past thievery when he's stealing from his own daughter?

[Camera One]

Well, it set up a cute scene between Emma and Hook, so it's all worth it.   This episode's not about Emma.  It's about Hook.

That's basically how the Writers think.  

Edited March 18, 2017 by Camera One

[superloislane]

I was annoyed at David for not going to Emma in the first place. As far as we know, Emma doesn't know anything about him investigating the death of his father since we haven't seen her learn about it so why does David assume that she would have the exact same feelings about this that Snow does? And even if she did have the same attitude as Snow, I can't imagine Emma not helping David if he went to her and asked her to help with the investigation or with magic. So David just decided to go behind his daughter's back, bring her boyfriend along and make him lie to her and then go and steal from her even though she most likely would have helped him if he asked.

[Camera One]

And what's more - that would have been more interesting to watch.  It would have given Emma and David an actual full episode.  But nope, all the questions on Twitter were asking about the "bromance", and we need to give "The People" what they want.  Plus it is really difficult to write about two boring characters like Emma/David, so let's just default to Apologetic Pirate vs. Unreasonable Sexist Hero who would kill for revenge without his frenemy around.  

[KingOfHearts]

I hate on this show, the "good" characters keep lying to each other even though it never works out well. How did lying about cutting things off from Kathryn, the eggnapping, and the dreamshade work out for David? Now he's deceiving his wife and daughter, and it's like he'll never learn. 

[Camera One]

The only way they know how to make good characters "flawed" is lying.  

[andromeda331]

10 minutes ago, superloislane said:

I was annoyed at David for not going to Emma in the first place. As far as we know, Emma doesn't know anything about him investigating the death of his father since we haven't seen her learn about it so why does David assume that she would have the exact same feelings about this that Snow does? And even if she did have the same attitude as Snow, I can't imagine Emma not helping David if he went to her and asked her to help with the investigation or with magic. So David just decided to go behind his daughter's back, bring her boyfriend along and make him lie to her and then go and steal from her even though she most likely would have helped him if he asked.

You know that would have been cool to see. And maybe see Emma learning about her grandparents. Have we ever seen Charming talk to her about his father before or Ruth? Has Snow ever talked to her about her parents? It could have been fun to see Emma and Charming working together on the murder and Emma learning more about her family.

[Camera One]

11 minutes ago, andromeda331 said:

You know that would have been cool to see. And maybe see Emma learning about her grandparents. Have we ever seen Charming talk to her about his father before or Ruth? Has Snow ever talked to her about her parents? It could have been fun to see Emma and Charming working together on the murder and Emma learning more about her family.

Yes, and growing up feeling that their parent had abandoned them?  The feeling that maybe they were not good enough?  Adult Emma also went ballistic trying to find out her origins.  Her talking David back from the edge would have been just as effective as Hook.

[andromeda331]

9 minutes ago, Camera One said:

Yes, and growing up feeling that their parent had abandoned them?  The feeling that maybe they were not good enough?  Adult Emma also went ballistic trying to find out her origins.  Her talking David back from the edge would have been just as effective as Hook.

It really would of if not more effective. Emma did trying to find out about her origins as an adult. She also would have understood how David felt about not knowing what really happened. David spent most of his life believing his father fell off the wagon and didn't keep his promise only to learn he was murdered. Emma spent her entire life only knowing she was left on the side of a road and not finding out until later who her parents were and why they sent her away.

[KAOS Agent]

Having an Emma/David team up also would have given Emma some emotional stake in the fallout of Hook's killing David's dad. She didn't see any of David's emotional breakdown and has zero investment in Robert as a person unlike Hook & David, who learned about Robert helping young James and standing up to the King. The backstory humanizes Robert and gave David a much more positive perspective on his father than he's ever had. Having Emma along for the discovery about what happened would have made the final reveal resonate more fully in terms of David's relationship with both Emma and Hook. 

[Shanna Marie]

If they had Hook and Emma working together with David to solve the mystery, that would also have had the added benefit of David getting to watch them really interact and work together and come to his own conclusion about not just Hook's worth as a person, but how well they work as a team and how they feel about each other. David's so hung up on Hook's past -- that he doesn't even know that much about -- and whether or not that makes him worthy of Emma that he doesn't seem to have bothered looking at Emma and how she feels about being with Hook, what Hook does for her, how they work as a couple. Yeah, I know, David seems to be plenty aware of that when it comes time to outsource dealing with Emma to Hook, but they could have been wild and crazy here and not started the episode with a reversion to David's "you filthy pirate" mode, but rather had him just asking Emma and Hook for help, and with him at the end letting Hook know how he feels about the two of them together, which would have made Hook decide to take the leap toward proposing.

I mentioned this on the episode thread, but them having such a standard pattern for the Captain Charming episodes makes David into the Shepherd Who Cried Pirate. He's been treating Hook like he killed his father all along, even though Hook started changing within weeks of David meeting him and even while Hook was doing good, heroic things. That makes it a little hard to sympathize much with David now that we know Hook did kill his father. He's already punished Hook plenty.

[superloislane]

I just wanted to say that Josh Dallas has been knocking it out of the park during this half of the season. He's had a few emotional moments during the episodes which make me angry that they haven't used him as much as they should have. In his centric episode, his scene with Hook at the cell was damn good and in the last two episodes, he's been the emotional one regarding Emma while Snow seems to lack all emotion and thinks of the town constantly. His face at the door while watching little Emma was lovely. I wanted to give kudos to Josh Dallas since he's often overlooked.

[KAOS Agent]

When they give Josh something to do, he usually does it quite well. The thing I loved most about David this last episode was that he told Snow that Emma's wedding is for Emma (and Hook) and it's their special day. It's not an event that should be held to make others happy and give them hope. He's so much more in tune with reality and what they've done to their daughter than Snow is and I was glad that it was addressed in the episode that he wants to give Emma something special for herself and not for the benefit of other people.

[Camera One]

Sometimes, it's tough to applaud one actor over another, because a lot of it has to do with the lines they're given and how the writing portrays the character.  In this case, Charming got better lines which showed deeper care and emotion, while Ginny had to deliver the usual duds.  Although I have been disappointed with her performances lately, could she seriously have delivered it in a way that would make us agree?

What I do appreciate about Josh Dallas' performance is he gives a lot of intensity with so few lines.  You could see in his eyes looking at Young Emma that he desperately wanted to ditch it all and just go to her.  He brought a lot of internal fire to his argument that Emma deserves a good wedding.  Again, it's partly because his lines allowed the character to connect it back to his own experience and how he felt, but he definitely made the most of it.  

[CCTC]

8 hours ago, Camera One said:

You could see in his eyes looking at Young Emma that he desperately wanted to ditch it all and just go to her.

I thought that was interesting, because Ginny seemed rather resigned to it and a bit detached, and then did not really show emotion until she had to put Charming back into a coma.  I think Ginny is capable and has done of some great acting, but I am not sure she has not checked out from the role a little bit.  Even when she did cry when she was going to re-curse Charming, it seemed more technical than heart-felt.

This is probably been posted earlier, but Josh did great work in this short last year.  More understated than some of the more dramatic scenes on OUAT, but very effective.

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Sometimes, it's tough to applaud one actor over another, because a lot of it has to do with the lines they're given and how the writing portrays the character.  In this case, Charming got better lines which showed deeper care and emotion, while Ginny had to deliver the usual duds.  

I think this is true to an extent. Of course everyone would praise Josh's acting in 6x12, because he got something really meaty to work with. We've seen all the actors show their chops on different occasions. As you said, it's the writing that's hit or (mostly) miss. In some cases, they actors get plenty to do, but they have no idea what direction to go with for their character because the scripts go all over the place. (Such as with Lana and Bex.) The writers make their jobs tough most of the time. It's like trying to making a pile of crap look like a bed of roses.

8 hours ago, CCTC said:

I thought that was interesting, because Ginny seemed rather resigned to it and a bit detached, and then did not really show emotion until she had to put Charming back into a coma.  I think Ginny is capable and has done of some great acting, but I am not sure she has not checked out from the role a little bit.  Even when she did cry when she was going to re-curse Charming, it seemed more technical than heart-felt.

Replying in Snow's thread.

[KAOS Agent]

Quote

Sometimes, it's tough to applaud one actor over another, because a lot of it has to do with the lines they're given and how the writing portrays the character.  In this case, Charming got better lines which showed deeper care and emotion, while Ginny had to deliver the usual duds.  Although I have been disappointed with her performances lately, could she seriously have delivered it in a way that would make us agree?

I think that both of them and their reactions were in character. It's just that if you care at all about Emma, Snow's argument falls flat because of the way it's framed. It fit that David looks at Young!Emma and realizes that she shouldn't be sacrificing her happiness for a bunch of people she doesn't know while Snow focuses on the "heroic" side of things and chooses sacrifice over selfishness. Snow isn't the bad guy, but her choice and argument was about setting an example of heroism rather than looking at Emma as a person, not a Saviour. To be fair, Snow was crying during that scene where they were looking through the door, but too much of her argument was about Snow and her role as a hero and not about Emma. David was focused on Emma and her needs while Snow was focused on her own need to not be selfish and not being able to live with herself for consigning others to misery. David often needs to be convinced when others are being sacrificed. He's much more likely to sacrifice himself than he is to expect or want someone else to do so.

In terms of his daughter, David has a lot of guilt about Emma. We know David thinks he failed her based on his dream in 3B. And truthfully, they did fail her. His daughter just expressed to her boyfriend that she's shocked that she's experiencing some happiness. That's got to be something that David recognizes. Emma's life has been so screwed up that being happy is a surprise for her. They had no part in raising her, expect way too much from her and now it seems she's supposed to give her life for them. For someone who is all about protecting those he loves, that's a pretty hard pill to swallow. You add in this latest retcon where he had to choice to save Emma and chose others over her and David's got to be a mess. While Snow is ignoring reality, David is looking it square in the face and doing his best to not let it affect how he and his family live their lives. 

[Rumsy4]

I think Snow gets an uneven amount of heat for choices David has also endorsed. David seems to understand Emma better than Snow, and he may have more guilt over the shit he and Snow let Emma go through, but he is equally responsible for the choices they made as a couple. I also think that the lines the writers give Snow are so horrendously bad, that it's impossible to take her as a full-fledged character any more. She's a cardboard cutout. A&E apparently were unwilling to stretch their creativity to accommodate a pregnant actress, and that was the beginning of the end for Snow. 

[Camera One]

3 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

I also think that the lines the writers give Snow are so horrendously bad, that it's impossible to take her as a full-fledged character any more. She's a cardboard cutout. A&E apparently were unwilling to stretch their creativity to accommodate a pregnant actress, and that was the beginning of the end for Snow. 

And Snow is one of the characters where the agenda is clearly obvious.  It's almost never about Snow.  It's about Regina.   A&E could easily have thought... one of the gems of Season 1 was Mary Margaret and Emma.... let's just focus Ginny's screentime on that.  When one character is used solely as a prop for another character, they can only really be a cardboard cutout.  Meanwhile, David is used often as a sounding board for Snow, so he gets to utter the opposing position until Snow "decides" on one.  

[Rumsy4]

59 minutes ago, Camera One said:

And Snow is one of the characters where the agenda is clearly obvious.  

Oh, definitely! The writers' choice to make her a prop for Regina completely destroyed her character. What little screen-time she gets is spent making hope-speeches or apologizing to Regina. 

Quote

Meanwhile, David is used often as a sounding board for Snow, so he gets to utter the opposing position until Snow "decides" on one.  

That's an excellent point! I really wish the writers had taken the "hard" path, and shown David actually forging ahead instead of going along with Snow on something they disagreed on. That would've made for a more interesting choice. But the writers dislike actual stakes--they prefer to create artificial drama. 

Edited April 28, 2017 by Rumsy4

[andromeda331]

5 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

Oh, definitely! The writers' choice to make her a prop for Regina completely destroyed her character. What little screen-time she gets is spent making hope-speeches or apologizing to Regina. 

That's an excellent point! I really wish the writers had taken the "hard" path, and shown David actually forging ahead instead of going along with Snow on something they disagreed on. That would've made for a more interesting choice. But the writers dislike actual stakes--they prefer to create artificial drama. 

Definitely, Snow's a puppet when she speaks A&E's lines come out. Its the same thing they do to Belle and her constant defending Rumple. Their histories and what happened to them doesn't matter, the character that was established in Snow and in Belle the only reason for their exists is to prop up Regina and Rumple. It doesn't matter what Regina and Rumple have done to other people or to Snow and Belle respectively and it never will.

[Camera One]

8 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

I really wish the writers had taken the "hard" path, and shown David actually forging ahead instead of going along with Snow on something they disagreed on. 

Interestingly, I think they finally went closest to that this past week, since Emma sided with David regarding her wedding.  That's healthy and Snow eventually saw David's side of it (though it's hard to tell because the B plot abruptly ended as they went back to the A plot).  I liked the disagreement this week because it was more real... I can't say either David nor Snow were completely wrong.  For a moment, they both felt a little more like people. They were just coming to it from a different perspective.  The weirdest thing, though, was we actually had no idea what Emma thought of the situation, until she gave her opinion at the end.  It seemed like she was going along with whatever, which was a tad weird considering it was her wedding.

Edited April 29, 2017 by Camera One

[KAOS Agent]

I think David seems to understand Emma the best because he's the most real of the fairy tale characters. David has a complicated past, but for the most part, he wasn't aware of that growing up. He was deeply loved by his mother, lived in a small community and probably didn't wander much, was very poor and understands hunger and hard work. He's basically just a regular guy who was thrust into the craziness as an adult. Royal intrigue, power plays, revenge, magic, etc. weren't a part of his life. This is a guy who can connect with someone like Emma because he gets it. 

David had some choices taken away from him when his farm and mother were threatened, but he later chose to fight his father and marry Snow. He chose to stand against Regina. He chose to have a child and put all his faith into her being the Saviour. He's totally aware of what he's asked of his daughter. She wasn't given a choice and was thrust into this role as a newborn. It's nice that the show acknowledged his need to try to pay her back by giving her something just for her. He even says it's the least they can do considering everything she's been through. Stop with the hero speak and giving people hope and blah, blah, blah and for once give Emma what she needs. I appreciated someone other than Hook wanting to do something for Emma and not giving a crap about anyone else.

However, it's vastly amusing to me that everyone wants to give Emma this dream wedding and I don't think she cares a bit about the trappings. She's just going along with it because her mom was all excited. Even Hook seemed to have more thoughts than Emma - he wasn't impressed with the town hall, he wanted a sea wedding on the Jolly Roger. Still, it's nice that they want to make it special for her and David recognizes that it should be about her.

[Camera One]

And for once, the Writers thought of what the so-called "hero" would be feeling.  I liked how David said the wedding day became a nightmare.  Yes, it was all iconic with the crazy lady walking in and threatening to destroy their happiness and they made a great show of defiance, but really, that would have totally sucked.

Edited April 29, 2017 by Camera One