Season 17 Live Feed Discussion: Watch People Sleep All Day!

[pennben]

 

ETA: She told Austin she'll nominate John/Liz. Well, that's another way to go.

 

That's not a horrible move.

[AndreaK1041]

I think an Austin backdoor is a decent play. Austin and Steve are the most emotionally fragile, so spare them the nomination. If Austin wins veto, Vanessa gets rid of Steve, because she has "no choice" (but overall that's good for her). If anyone else wins veto, Austin goes home. Eh, I like it. Either way if Austin wins veto, he's safe, so why not stroke his massive ego?

[Katesus7]

I'll just say this. If she puts up Liz/John, I totally called it! I should get a prize or something. Although it will change about 24 times before nominations.

Also incentivize is a word I never, ever want to hear again. I don't know why it rankles me so much, but it does.

[Cutty]

I'm assuming the taped eviction will be Monday. It can't get here soon enough.

I don't understand Vanessa. She wants to target JMac, the one person who she *just* said she could bet in F2. I mean, I'm fine with him going but it's makes not a bit of sense.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Cutty

[Sara2009]

I'm assuming the taped eviction will be Monday. It can't get here soon enough.

I don't understand Vanessa. She wants to target JMac, the one person who she *just* said she could bet in F2. I mean, I'm fine with him going but it's makes not a bit of sense.

I thought she was just going to use him as a pawn.

[Brian Cronin]

Yeah, she knows he's safe because Steve won't vote him out and she won't vote him out. John/Liz are fine nominations by her. 

[Katesus7]

Vanessa now making "deals" with Vanessa/Austin, and talking about putting up Steve/John? God damn, Liz and Austin are going to be the final two, terrible.

[mooses]

Vanessa now making "deals" with Vanessa/Austin, and talking about putting up Steve/John? God damn, Liz and Austin are going to be the final two, terrible.

She just told Austin when she got HOH that words and deals don't mean anything anymore because everyone will just say what she wants to hear.

I don't know. I'll have to hear her talk to Steve and John again. I think she's just trying to cover all her bases in case things go awry but I can't be sure.

Edited September 11, 2015 by mooses

[Cutty]

I dunno, it sounds like she's turning on JMac. 

 

My favorite was when she said he has to go because Audrey had a dream that he won. LMAO.

Apparently the feeds will be down all day tomorrow. Not sure what that's about.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Cutty

[mooses]

I dunno, it sounds like she's turning on JMac.

My favorite was when she said he has to go because Audrey had a dream that he won. LMAO.

Apparently the feeds will be down all day tomorrow. Not sure what that's about.

I was so sure that John was the only one who was safe when she won.

I have a hard time seeing the forest through the crazy, or however that saying goes.

[Brian Cronin]

If she's seriously targeting John then, well, that's pretty weird. 

[lyric]

Vanessa, please do not fumble the ball on the 5 yard line.  Woman up and target Austin, Liz or Steve.  Gah, this is why you don't throw HOH at final five, JOHN.

Edited September 11, 2015 by lyric

[Brian Cronin]

As best as I can tell, Vanessa's thinking is this - if she is on the block next week against Liz, and Steve wins veto, he votes out Liz. If she is on the block next week against Austin and Steve wins veto, he votes out Austin. However, if she's on the block against John and Steve wins veto, he votes out Vanessa. 

 

So it's about her odds at getting voted out at final 4. However, I think she's underestimating the problem of having Austin/Liz playing for veto. If they're not HoH, that means if one of them wins POV, you're automatically going home. John is not a guaranteed vote against her vs. Austin.

 

It would then have made the most sense to just not win the F5 HoH, so she would have the MOST chances at being safe at F4. There were very few scenarios where she went home this week with a John HoH. 

Edited September 11, 2015 by Brian Cronin

[pennben]

Welp, now Steve is up to a full marathon pacing, I'm so tired of his "look at me I'm awkward" schtick.  You loved talking to/dismissing people when you were in charge and thought you ruled the game, now you are walking your freaking ass off all night talking to yourself.  That's on you and I frankly don't give a damn about how much you are frantic now (I'm not going to pat your head, widdle Stevie, even tho you have lots of sads and scaries). Grow up.  

 

I'm sure this means Steve wins, because I'm always wrong, but I'm over him.

Edited September 11, 2015 by pennben

[Brian Cronin]

I mean, whatever, once you've gotten this far, things are almost always a crapshoot anyways, so I can't necessarily even blame her too much for this move. Hell, watch her win POV next week so it doesn't even matter. But this is not a good decision to decide to keep Austin/Liz together. It might all still work out for her, but this is not a good move. 

[loki567]

I'm dumbfounded by the fact that in this situation that John and Steve haven't even make a token effort with Vanessa tonight. Austin and Liz haven't left her side since the feeds returned while those two numb-skulls decided to not have a single conversation with her. Good job, gentlemen. 

[Vicky]

I don't know how this will go for Vanessa, but she's decided that Everyone left would take Johnny Mac over her to the final three and he has to be her target. She's explaining it to Steve (around 1:50 am). She says when she first won HOH she was going to put up Austin and Liz and she had her reasons, but now she's switched to Johnny Mac. Steve said "they really schmoozed you" meaning Liz and Austin. Vanessa bristled at the idea that she'd been schmoozed and said he's wrong if he thinks she is "manipulatable".

Steve is right. She was schmoozed.

maybe it'll work out for her, and I'm too biased against Austin, but I've lost a little respect for her at this moment.

[Vicky]

I am heartbroken for what could have been. I think Johnny Mac is the one person Vanessa could have trusted and she's going to cut him loose (as of right now, but she seems pretty set on it and since neither Steve nor Johnny Mac are good at talking with Vanessa, It'll surely stay that way).

I know some people don't like Johnny Mac's game play - or lack of it.

I think he's wanted to be a loyal teammate all game and people he trusts keep kicking him in the teeth.

I thought he'd found a home with Vanessa.

Sigh. Vanessa is getting too clever by half and throwing away her most loyal ally.

[Vicky]

Okay - Johnny Mac told Vanessa if she doesn't think she can beat him at Final Four Veto then put him up.

That flummoxed Vanessa.

She wants to just agree with him because that's what she wanted, but she can't quite bring herself to say OK I will.

He's being completely and absolutely honest with her, and he's willing to do whatever she says. He's not offering any insight - he even agrees with her 'nominate one from each side' plan. He agrees she doesn't have any way to know that he'll pick her over Steve. He says "my word is no good this week”. And he tells her she might not go to jury because everyone hates her (so she'd be the 'goat'), which really pushes her button. He tells her he hates everyone and wants to evict them all one by one.

She's not sure how to take it. She thanks him for being a straight shooter and not blowing smoke up her ass.

She doesn't really believe he knows what he's agreeing to when he says "uh-huh"

I don't know either.

In the end, he said a few things that made me think she was second guessing herself. But, Steve came up to HOH after and Vanessa said Johnny Mac is still the target. She did say that Johnny Mac has convinced her she's really hated in the jury and has no chance to win.

As it turns out I'm the one that's flummoxed. I still like Johnny Mac, but I'll be darned if I know why!

Okay - I'm giving up now.

[Vicky]

Vanessa and Steve are working through all the scenarios using M&Ms. I figure this is a good time to get out.

Vanessa tells Steve she truly and 100% believes Austin will NOT take Liz to final two.

Isn't that a flaw in her logic? I think Austin would do anything to get to final 2 with Liz...even lie to Vanessa. He likes to be called Judas, for goodness sake!!!!!

Anyway...just as I'm about to walk away who should bust into the HOH room but that dastardly Austin.

Grrrr. My dislike of him grows every time I see him.

Now I have to stay to see what kind of deceitful web he'll weave to 'schmooze' the un'manipulatable' Vanessa.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Vicky

[Vicky]

Yeah Vanessa is so over the moon with Austin. There's no way she'll break from him.

[Ceeg]

I guess I'm rooting for a Steve veto win.

[Brian Cronin]

She's way off base on Austin (I mean, does she even realize how insane that sounds? He's going to kick out Liz at F3 and have her and Julia vote against him? That she thinks that that is a real possibility is cuckoo bananas), but, again, so much left in the house is just crapshoot comp wins, so I really can't blame anyone's strategy at this point. They pretty much all have to win comps to get to the end, so even a dumb move like this likely doesn't move the needle too much. 

 

Helen is likely applauding this move right now. "You're absolutely right, Vanessa. This is too soon. Maaaaybe think about breaking up Austin/Liz after the third part of the final HoH, but maybe that is even a BIT early."

Edited September 11, 2015 by Brian Cronin

[TOL]

She's making a ridiculous mistake. I'll tell you what, if I sat at her poker table and saw this performance I would always call her bluff based on this decision.

[Brian Cronin]

She's making a ridiculous mistake. I'll tell you what, if I sat at her poker table and saw this performance I would always call her bluff based on this decision.

I dunno, as a move it makes such little sense that i think that would make her sort of un-callable, bluff-wise, as who the heck knows what she's thinking at any given moment?

 

I suppose there's still a scenario where Austin goes home if Steve or John wins POV. But even there, she'd probably nominate Liz at this point. She really thinks Austin is her guy. It's staggering in its ludicrousness. 

 

EDITED TO ADD: Also, how awesomely hilarious is it that we're going to have the whole day (and most of the night) to wait to see who wins POV. We get to just go over this all day long. Yay us.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Brian Cronin

[Ceeg]

EDITED TO ADD: Also, how awesomely hilarious is it that we're going to have the whole day (and most of the night) to wait to see who wins POV. We get to just go over this all day long. Yay us.

Is the POV for sure today? Usually it's on Saturdays, and they haven't even had the nomination ceremony yet.

 

As for Vanessa's move, as a viewer, I want Austin and Liz on the block so badly. In the house though, there really isn't a bad move right now. Steve will always choose John over Vanessa, so eliminating him will be better for her chances with Steve going forward. No matter who wins veto, Vanessa is assured that one pair will be broken up, and it incentivizes the one left standing to pair with her and go after the other pair.

[Skycatcher]

Dang! Y'all paid for the feeds, y'all should get them! All the time! Or do you get a one day refund?

Edited September 11, 2015 by Skycatcher

[blixie]

 

As for Vanessa's move, as a viewer, I want Austin and Liz on the block so badly. In the house though, there really isn't a bad move right now.

 

I do get this, but I'm still don't get Vanessa's unshakable loyalty to Austin WHY GOD WHY?

 

I really really want to understand what the fuck she's thinking, because as of now, the only thing that makes any sense to me is that she DOES buy her own integrity bullshit, she thinks she has to stay loyal to Liztin/Steve (this is why JMac is the target). JMac, because he is TERRIBLE at this game, fed into her mindset there by telling her, he still doesn't like her, and that she's correct not to trust him, and also that everyone in the jury hates her (ergo will vote for him in F2?) This is why she was even more set on ride or dying with Liztin, if she can keep them happy with her, she can have two jury votes? I just....I still want her to win, but GURL when Austin fucks you over, you will have EARNED that fucking over like you would not believe.

 

 

Helen is likely applauding this move right now. "You're absolutely right, Vanessa. This is too soon. Maaaaybe think about breaking up Austin/Liz after the third part of the final HoH, but maybe that is even a BIT early."

 

IKR? I'm never getting over Vanessa playing a HELEN-game pwease don't be mad at me I never put you on the block....GAG.  Ugh I'm so so so disappointed. It may yet work out for her, but I won't feel bad if she loses. To fucking Liztin. Nightmare fuel, but Austin and Liz will deserve it so much because yes they have been managing Vanessa's crazy for 80 something days, and God knows that's worth at least the 50K. Austin just keeps playing the beta, whining and showing her his belly every time she threatens to put him on the block and works every fucking time, because yes Vanessa anyone with an ego like yours can be manipulated. 

 

And now no feeds so I won't even know if she followed through on this horrible no good depressing plan to nominated John and Steve and protect Lizting?! 

[kellog010]

Vanessa is in a tough spot because Steve has planned all along to take John to F2 and cut Vanessa. She knows Liztin will always pick each other over her. Even with watching the feeds and hearing the DRs I still don't know which moves is best for her games so I can't fault her since she's only going with the information she has and gut feelings. I think she knows she has to win POV next week no matter what.

[Ceeg]

I just....I still want her to win, but GURL when Austin fucks you over, you will have EARNED that fucking over like you would not believe.

I honestly think Austin will throw comps before he would put up Vanessa. I think whatever weird loyalty they have to each other goes both ways, and both of them talk a big game, but I can't see either taking the other out themselves. 

 

And, I think Austin knows that both Liz and Vanessa would take him to the F2, so really can actually throw that F3 comp. So, it would just come down to Vanessa vs. Liz. Whereas, with Steve and John, they're both taking each other and they will both go balls to the wall to win that F3.

[blixie]

 

And, I think Austin knows that both Liz and Vanessa would take him to the F2,

 

That's my problem with it, I'm not clear why Van thinks she's going to beat Austin in F2. I really don't think she's going to in fact he's the last person who ANYONE left should be taking to F2. Austin is likable AND has played a reasonably good strategic game, no one left has both things going for them.  Johnny Mac is likable as well, but I can see arguing against his strategy since he was voted out, and the only reason he made it of F4 is because he worked with Vanessa instead of against her. Liz/Van have great strategy but aren't super well liked, Steve is not seen as strategic force so much as a Vanessa hanger on and no one really likes him. 

 

I'm not critiquing this as a "bad" move, just that I don't see how it's Van's BEST move out of all available scenarios, same with last week when she kept Liz over Julia. If winning competitions is everything keeping the two strongest comp beasts next to yourself and Steve makes no sense to me, I've been saying I have no idea who her ideal F2 is and to find out it's Austin seems like a major miscalculation on her part. But I've doubted her before and been wrong! I'll be happy to be wrong again.

[mooses]

She really should get out Steve or Austin. She's taking a couple to F4 either way (Rockstars or Showmance) - Austin/Liz and John/Steve will never choose her over each other, but John is the worst choice out of those four to target IMO. I think he's the only one that might take her over Austin or Liz if Steve isn't there. Austin or Liz wouldn't take her even if the other isn't there. And Steve wont let her touch Final 2. They know she's too good because they've been so close to her.

She trusts Austin and Liz more to keep their word to throw the HOH (not happening) and, next week if they won HOH and she's on the block against Steve or John, to keep her out of loyalty. That group has always had this weird dynamic, so she thinks Austin will have as hard of a time screwing her over as she has had getting him (although I think he'll take her out as his big Judas moment in a heartbeat).

I could say, okay, fine move if she was targeting Steve. But John? Mistake.

ETA: I read someone mention this on Joker's, but was wondering if there was more to it: did anyone hear Vanessa's theory about John's message from home? That the air guitar means stick with the Rockstar alliance?

Edited September 11, 2015 by mooses

[mayziemay]

I guess JMac is trying to lose this thing.  I really can't stand him or his whole sctick at this point.

[Vixenstud]

IMO, I think Vanessa could beat anyone in F2....I know a good chuck of the jury members don't like her but most of them have said that she's played the game and would vote for her to win.

 

 

 

[Ceeg]

Idk I think getting out John is better for her than getting out Steve actually. She makes a good point that John is the new Julia and if Vanessa is on the block against Steve she has a better shot at staying than against John.

It's definitely an interesting week and I don't think there's really a right answer.

[mooses]

IMO, I think Vanessa could beat anyone in F2....I know a good chuck of the jury members don't like her but most of them have said that she's played the game and would vote for her to win.

Yes, after this week she will beat anyone. Everyone knows she's running the House and she has enough competition wins (and will need a couple more) to impress.

[Ceeg]

ETA: I read someone mention this on Joker's, but was wondering if there was more to it: did anyone hear Vanessa's theory about John's message from home? That the air guitar means stick with the Rockstar alliance?

Vanessa thinks that it was a message indicating that Steve and John actually are a lot closer and will always take each other over her. Despite John telling her that he'd vote Steve out in a heartbeat, I think John's family doing the "rockstar" motion kind of cemented in her mind that she's not part of that deal. So, it sort of made it even clearer to her that there really are two solid, virtually unbreakable duos.

[peachmangosteen]

What is this hold Austin has over Vanessa?????

It's probably because he's willing to stand there and take everything she puts out there.  Everyone else gets bored.  Even Johnny Mac put his sunglasses on when he was done with their conversation.  

 

I think this is it. Austin is very good at playing Vanessa. He grovels and tells her what she loves hearing which is exactly what she wants when she goes on one of her little guilt trips.

 

Also incentivize is a word I never, ever want to hear again. I don't know why it rankles me so much, but it does.

 

I've just started screaming in horror every time I hear it.

 

IMO, I think Vanessa could beat anyone in F2....I know a good chuck of the jury members don't like her but most of them have said that she's played the game and would vote for her to win.

 

I agree. Vanessa has the win sewn up, but Austin is actually the only person left who has a legitimate chance against her. He's played a great game and he's better liked by at least 4 people on the jury currently, 5 with Liz. Plus he's a man. Vanessa will probably still end up beating Austin, but it's not as sure a thing as it is against the rest.

 

LMAO at Vanessa having theories on the family messages. This is like when she thought one of Austin's HOH photos meant he should 'stick with his gay friend.' She's crazier than Audrey tbh.

Edited September 11, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[Cutty]

The family message theory is as bogus as bringing up Audrey's dream. But she has done this every time she's been HOH. Make up fake "reasons" to rationalize her decision why someone has to go.

I'm actually happy she's targeting John though. Good riddance.

[alihart41]

Vanessa thinks that it was a message indicating that Steve and John actually are a lot closer and will always take each other over her. Despite John telling her that he'd vote Steve out in a heartbeat, I think John's family doing the "rockstar" motion kind of cemented in her mind that she's not part of that deal. So, it sort of made it even clearer to her that there really are two solid, virtually unbreakable duos.

It's a Reason. When in reality they did it because he's the Rockstar Dentist. I'd love to see her mind explode if she were to see JMac and Austin air guitar together.

My dream scenario is she nominates JMac and Liz. Steve wins Veto and pulls down JMac, forcing Austin to go up, and they vote out Austin.

[peachmangosteen]

I'm actually happy she's targeting John though. Good riddance.

Me too. I love it tbh. Maybe you shouldn't have 'thrown' every comp and made yourself into everyone's favorite patsy as game play, John. Bye!

[Katesus7]

Well, here's hoping John wins veto.  And that Vanessa gets booted at final four.  Because I'm vindictive like that.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Katesus7

[peachmangosteen]

And that Vanessa gets booted at final four.

 

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!

 

Do we have confirmation yet on when exactly feeds will go down and for how long? I read yesterday that they're going down Sunday until after Tuesday's ep, which does make sense.

[Ceeg]

Do we have confirmation yet on when exactly feeds will go down and for how long? I read yesterday that they're going down Sunday until after Tuesday's ep, which does make sense.

I think it's today from 9:45am-11:30pm BBT.

[peachmangosteen]

I think it's today from 9:45am-11:30pm BBT.

 

What? Well that is very strange. What is the reason for this? It obviously isn't for the eviction. So they'll have to go down again for the eviction. Weird.

[Ceeg]

What? Well that is very strange. What is the reason for this? It obviously isn't for the eviction. So they'll have to go down again for the eviction. Weird.

I'm not sure, but they were told a lot is supposed to happen today and Vanessa was told she (and I guess the House) has to wake up at 9:30am. Maybe it's nominations, veto, and veto ceremony all today. But, it can't be the eviction yet, because Liz still has to go on her luxury thing.

[blixie]

Yeah I'm confused about why there is Feed Blackout so are they really speeding it up (Noms/Veto/Eviction)? Or are they going down TWICE? Like that is some bullshit. 

[peachmangosteen]

I'm not sure, but they were told a lot is supposed to happen today and Vanessa was told she (and I guess the House) has to wake up at 9:30am. 

 

Why does this mean the feeds will be down though? 

[mooses]

I'm not sure, but they were told a lot is supposed to happen today and Vanessa was told she (and I guess the House) has to wake up at 9:30am. Maybe it's nominations, veto, and veto ceremony all today. But, it can't be the eviction yet, because Liz still has to go on her luxury thing.

Maybe something is happening in The House while Liz luxuries? Like Frankie torturing them with stories of his fame or something. A Pandora.

Vanessa thinks that it was a message indicating that Steve and John actually are a lot closer and will always take each other over her. Despite John telling her that he'd vote Steve out in a heartbeat, I think John's family doing the "rockstar" motion kind of cemented in her mind that she's not part of that deal. So, it sort of made it even clearer to her that there really are two solid, virtually unbreakable duos.

John would choose Steve over her in a a heartbeat, I think. And I don't need a video message to convey that to me. Edited September 11, 2015 by mooses

[AndreaK1041]

What I don't understand is if Vanessa nominates Steve and JMac, why would Liztin keep Steve? They know the comps that are coming up. He has a good shot of winning them.