Spoilers and Spoiler Speculation: Benchmarking

[Nobodysfan]

I think it is a lie.

 

 

I think Amelia might get totally mentally insane/unstable towards the end of the season. If Scorsone thinks 1218 is crazy (double) and the rest of the season is gonna be bananas as I think she is as narcissistic as her character,she can only be referring to Amelia.

Edited February 17, 2016 by Meredithfan

[windsprints]

Kagomei, do you know what website originally posted that? I'm just curious what the source was. I think it sounds like speculation, like someone found out a character was returning to GA (Katie Bryce) plus the Ausiello blind item and came up with Sandra. I love Sandra and would be thrilled with her popping in for a visit but I just don't think its true. If she were returning this season I think it would have been when Meredith was attacked but JMO.

I can see Shonda putting her in the forefront even more next year, finding a new love interest for her, or developing a story for Penny / Callie. I hope I'm wrong.

 

Unfortunately I could see it too. S13E2, Penny walking around talking about her love of puzzles, board games, whatever and by E6 be part of Meredith's sister squad.

 

 

[Kagomei]

Unfortunately not, windsprints. I just saw it on Twitter but someone said it's from Inquisitr.

Ops, I found it: link

Also here.

Speculations ZzzzzZzzzzZzzzz

Edited February 17, 2016 by Kagomei

[Nobodysfan]

Unfortunately not, windsprints. I just saw it on Twitter but someone said it's from Inquisitr.

Ops, I found it: link

Is this really true?OMG!

 

It can´t be true.

Edited February 17, 2016 by Meredithfan

[windsprints]

Unfortunately not, windsprints. I just saw it on Twitter but someone said it's from Inquisitr.

Ops, I found it: link

Thanks!  Maybe I read it wrong but its talking mostly about the Denzel episode which already passed. 

 

ETA: Oops, I was reading this article before you added the link.

Edited February 17, 2016 by windsprints

[Kagomei]

You're welcome :)

I don't think it's true at all. Don't get your hopes up, Meredithfan.

[Nobodysfan]

http://jerrikahinton.com/frame/mine/

 

Jerrika took photo of Henderson filming with whom???  Photo no 4.

 

Is it a Riggs scene at Joe´s with whom? Meredith or Amelia?

Edited February 17, 2016 by Meredithfan

[Greysaddict]

http://jerrikahinton.com/frame/mine/

 

Jerrika took photo of Henderson filming with whom???  Photo no 4.

 

Is it a Riggs scene at Joe´s with whom? Meredith or Amelia?

I don't know who else is in that picture, but her photography is really beautiful. (sorry, way off topic I know)

 

Also, I am fairly certain this Sandra/Cristina returning is completely made up.  i read one of the Inquisitor articles which basically just took a bunch of actor's various statements and made them out as though they meant Cristina was coming back.  

Edited February 17, 2016 by Greysaddict

[Nobodysfan]

I don't know who else is in that picture, but her photography is really beautiful. (sorry, way off topic I know)

Haha, I keep swooning over that shot,too. She caught Martin or Nathan,hard to say if it is from shooting the scene or just between takes. 

 

Do you think they will pair Nathan with Amelia?

Edited February 17, 2016 by Meredithfan

[Greysaddict]

ABC Chief Paul Lee Forced Out, Channing Dungey Named Entertaiment President

 

Not really a speculation but I thought I'd put this here.  ABC has a new President of Entertainment, who apparently has a good established relationship with Shonda.  THR (above) is calling her "the Shonda Rhimes' whisperer".  I don't think there was ever any doubt ABC would cancel Grey's, but I think this new President of ABC Entertainment solidifies we'll be seeing a lot more of GA (and other Shonda shows) in the future.  

[Kagomei]

ABC Chief Paul Lee Forced Out, Channing Dungey Named Entertaiment President

 

Not really a speculation but I thought I'd put this here.  ABC has a new President of Entertainment, who apparently has a good established relationship with Shonda.  THR (above) is calling her "the Shonda Rhimes' whisperer".  I don't think there was ever any doubt ABC would cancel Grey's, but I think this new President of ABC Entertainment solidifies we'll be seeing a lot more of GA (and other Shonda shows) in the future.

I was about to post a similar article :P

http://tvline.com/2016/02/17/paul-lee-abc-president-quits-leaving/

I found this part interesting " Lee “resigned on Wednesday after losing a power struggle with a higher-ranking executive,” "

[Greysaddict]

I was about to post a similar article :P

http://tvline.com/2016/02/17/paul-lee-abc-president-quits-leaving/

I found this part interesting " Lee “resigned on Wednesday after losing a power struggle with a higher-ranking executive,” "

The rumors are that Ben Sherwood (President of Disney-ABC) wasn't a fan of his (Paul Lee), but he wasn't able to kick him out last year because ABC was riding high on HTGAWM and Blackish (among others).  

 

NYT has a good article with the clash between Ben Sherwood and Paul Lee http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/18/business/media/paul-lee-resign-abc-entertainment.html?_r=2

Edited February 17, 2016 by Greysaddict

[CED9]

Good lord, they really are trying to shove Penny into every storyline possible:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BB8LC2TiyN-/

[Joana]

It's obviously her turn to be Amelia's punchbag now after being done with Meredith. 

[funnygirl]

Between viewer annoyance toward Amelia and most people not liking Penny, episode 18 looks like it's going to be a big winner! /sarcasm

[beautifulGA]

Between viewer annoyance toward Amelia and most people not liking Penny, episode 18 looks like it's going to be a big winner! /sarcasm

[Nobodysfan]

In promo pictures 1212 we see the patient from S1E1 - Meredith and Amelia are with her, then there is another set where there is another patient who seems to be treated by Meredith,Penny and Nathan. But the synopsis/press release mentions nothing about this other patient who seems to be a difficult case - a brunette is playing her. She seems like a woman in her 40s having a heart problem. I assume that is why Riggs is there.

 

Rigg is sitting on the bench after the surgery looking devastated - the patient might remind him of Megan´s case. The actress´s name (the one who plays the patient) is Meredith Salenger - what a coincidence.

 

 

Do you all think we will only see Japril´s history and no real progress in anyone´s current storyline next episode 1211?

Edited February 20, 2016 by Meredithfan

[BaseOps]

New episode titles from SpoilerTV: 

 

12.13 - All Eyez on Me
12.14 - Odd Man Out

Do you all think we will only see Japril´s history and no real progress in anyone´s current storyline next episode 1211?

 

I think the next episode will be 99% April / Jackson with other characters thrown in for dressing on their storyline. 

[windsprints]

From the press release:

Guest starring is Samantha Sloyan as Penny Blake, Debbie Allen as Catherine Avery, Maya Stojan as Tatiana, Robert Baker as Charles, Caitlainne Rose Gurreri as Lori and Linda Klein as Scrub Nurse Linda

 

Whew. Don't worry guys, we'll get to see Penny!

 

The press release says that we'll see Jackson's patient over the course of the year so the other cast members we will see will probably be ones working on that case.

[gator12]

How come Shonda never ask Nora Zehetner back for these flashback/alternate episode?

[funnygirl]

Whew. Don't worry guys, we'll get to see Penny!

 

Yes, because God forbid Penny misses an episode, especially one where the entire focus is on two characters who Penny has hardly, if ever, interacted with. 

 

[Artymouse]

How come Shonda never ask Nora Zehetner back for these flashback/alternate episode?

That is a bit strange. But I'm glad; for me, she was like the Penny of that season.

[kurtz]

Nora Zehetner may be the one actor that Shonda couldn't stand and so she reflected it by her death.

Edited February 21, 2016 by kurtz

[Greysaddict]

Didn't Dr. Percy have a crush on April?  I have a feeling that's why he is back for flashbacks.   

[stopthestatic]

Nora Zehetner may be the one actor that Shonda couldn't stand and so she reflected it by her death.

 

Could be. Since she wasn't brought back for If/Then either.

 

 

And Dr. Percy had a crush on Reed, not April.

[beautifulGA]

I hope the writers remember that japril wasn't a love story until season 8 ending. April had a thing for Derek, than Alex, than Stark and Jackson and Lexie were one full blown romance. Changing the history of events so they could link japril romantically from the start will annoy me.

[PrincessTT]

I hope the writers remember that japril wasn't a love story until season 8 ending. April had a thing for Derek, than Alex, than Stark and Jackson and Lexie were one full blown romance. Changing the history of events so they could link japril romantically from the start will annoy me.

 

Jackson also had a thing for Cristina when the merger first happened.

[Greysaddict]

I'm wondering if we are going to see any other characters in the flashbacks besides Jackson, April (and Dr. Percy).  I mean people who are still around like Meredith, Alex, Webber, Bailey, Callie, etc not anyone who is not currently on the show.  Callie did briefly go to Mercy West before the merger.  It's probably unlikely since the flashbacks are supposed to show the Japril relationship but it would be cool to see.  

[Artymouse]

It would make sense to see some other folks, especially since Lexie and Jackson were an item for a good while. And since Sloan became his mentor after initially being angry about Jackson dating Lexie. And Lexie was such a bitch to April in the beginning, stealing her notebook and using it to make fun of her.

 

Also, since April was with Meredith during the shooting and was present for the miscarriage, Lexie became jealous of the two of them growing closer. So it would be cool to see her in this episode. I'm guessing she's probably not, but an appearance would fit into the storyline.

[craziness]

The actress who plays Lexie is busy on Supergirl.

[Nobodysfan]

Martin accidentally ( or not?) spoiled on his instagram photo the title of 1219 - It´s allright,ma (I am only bleeding).

 

I hope Rhimes will not reprimand him for this. I like his courage. McKidd usually cowardly hides the title with a pencil.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Meredithfan

[BaseOps]

Martin accidentally ( or not?) spoiled on his instagram photo the title of 1219 - It´s allright,ma (I am only bleeding).

 

I hope Rhimes will not reprimand him for this. I like his courage. McKidd usually cowardly hides the title with a pencil.

 

Cowardly? All actors do that unless they're given permission, lol. 

 

As for the title, I wonder if we're having someone's mom show up? 

Edited February 23, 2016 by BaseOps

[beautifulGA]

12.13 'all eyez on me' PR: Meredith, Bailey, Jackson, Callie and Jo travel to a military hospital to perform an extraordinary and extremely risky surgery on a veteran with an advanced tumor. Meanwhile back at Grey Sloan, Andrew is tired of being Maggie’s worst kept secret; Ben makes an impulsive surgical decision; and a team of cheerleaders wreak havoc in the ER.

Yay for Callie and Jo teaming. that's the only way I can stand them these days.

[Joana]

Arizona is still considering dating, I guess. 

Edited February 24, 2016 by Joana

[Deanie87]

Well, I guess I'm just going to rant about this everywhere, apologies in advance.  Is anyone else having as hard of a time with this season as me?  For the life of me, I don't know where these writers are going, and this latest episode is a glaring example of that.  Its like they are trying to write the show in sections and it just isn't coming together for me and hasn't since season 10, probably.  So we are all caught up on Jackson and April, I guess, so now the "next phase" of their storyline can continue, but I guess I don't really care anymore.  And that goes for a lot of these storylines that have been stretched out for years now.

 

In the promo, we get "Yes or no, Jo?"  Ugh.  I kind of don't care anymore.  On the one hand, she should say no because they have literally never talked about or resolved the real reason that Jo wanted a break from Alex, and I don't really think that Alex understands why Jo felt the way that she did.  On the other hand, waaay back in episode 3, Jo was demanding that Alex tell her where they were going and what she meant to him (even though SHE was the one that was seemingly scared of commitment in seasons 10-11).  Since that time he has offered to start a family with her and proposed, so he IS sort of listening and showing her how he feels, so for her to say no, doesn't seem right either.   But her problems at work seem to be gone, her problem with Meredith seems to be gone, her problems with her friends seem to be gone, so...yay?  Now they can "start their storyline," even though it has been going on for years now.  Its like all of the things that happened at the end of last season don't jibe with the beginning of this season, which doesn't jibe with the start of the second "half" of this season.  And most of that doesn't jibe with what went on in season 10.  Unless you are Meredith, Maggie or Penny.  Not even Amelia anymore, her storyline is stagnant as well.  She and Owen have been going around and around for YEARS now and don't go anywhere (which is fine with me.)  Even if there have been good individual episodes (and there really have), nothing as a whole makes sense to me anymore.

 

I get that things happened last season, and I know that the cast is huge, but that excuse is working less and less for me. I don't think that so much had to be completely shelved/reworked/ruined, just so Derek could have his send off, especially considering how crappy that sendoff and the aftermath was.  And now they seem to be throwing as many centric and flashback-filled episodes at us as they can, but it is making even less sense.  If they want to refocus the show and make it into the Meredith Hour, with occasional sidekick storylines, then they need to bring the 1,000 other hanging storylines and character arcs to an end, but they don't even seem to be doing that.  Maybe it will become clear as the season goes on, but I just don't get what they are going for and they are really losing me.  It can't just be me, can it?

[Joana]

It's definitely not just you! 

 

At this point I do think those time jumps have ruined some of the storylines beyond repair. It's perfectly natural that not all stories and characters would have the same dynamics over time, it happens on pretty much every show, but when literally half the storylines have been stuck in the same place and so many characters haven't had anything happen to them in years, I don't think there's a way to write yourself out of such mess. And the pace they're going at isn't helping anything. We're now three episodes into the second half of the season and all we've had are basically standalone episodes with almost no relevance to what had previously going on. Yeah, April/Jackson divorce storyline seems to be resolved (for now, God knows what's coming with the baby she's expecting) but it really did not need an entire episode dedicated to it, the way it was done. 

 

I'm starting to think a show could really use a cleen sheet at this point. Like, drop half the cast and get rid of those already tired plots not going anywhere. Not likely to happen, I know. 

[funnygirl]

I get that things happened last season, and I know that the cast is huge, but that excuse is working less and less for me. I don't think that so much had to be completely shelved/reworked/ruined, just so Derek could have his send off, especially considering how crappy that sendoff and the aftermath was.  And now they seem to be throwing as many centric and flashback-filled episodes at us as they can, but it is making even less sense.  If they want to refocus the show and make it into the Meredith Hour, with occasional sidekick storylines, then they need to bring the 1,000 other hanging storylines and character arcs to an end, but they don't even seem to be doing that.  Maybe it will become clear as the season goes on, but I just don't get what they are going for and they are really losing me.  It can't just be me, can it?

Only speaking for myself here, it's not just you. 

[windsprints]

I agree, not just you.

Its like all of the things that happened at the end of last season don't jibe with the beginning of this season, which doesn't jibe with the start of the second "half" of this season.  And most of that doesn't jibe with what went on in season 10.  Unless you are Meredith, Maggie or Penny.  Not even Amelia anymore, her storyline is stagnant as well.  She and Owen have been going around and around for YEARS now and don't go anywhere (which is fine with me.)  Even if there have been good individual episodes (and there really have), nothing as a whole makes sense to me anymore.

This, 100%. Its like the show developed ADD.  Storylines started and then they see something else and forget and move to something entirely different. 

At this point I do think those time jumps have ruined some of the storylines beyond repair.

Completely agree. Even if they try to address in flashbacks the emotional impact is long gone.

It's perfectly natural that not all stories and characters would have the same dynamics over time, it happens on pretty much every show, but when literally half the storylines have been stuck in the same place and so many characters haven't had anything happen to them in years, I don't think there's a way to write yourself out of such mess.

At this point I think they'd have to dedicate half of each episode to tying up everyone's storylines. Then they should make a decision on who they want to write for. If its only Meredith, Maggie, Penny and Amelia then start writing characters out. If they really want the Meredith hour then commit to it and do it instead of leaving everything else hanging.

Edited February 26, 2016 by windsprints

[Evie]

It's not just you. I don't get what they are going for either. I thought the first five episodes showed potential and then it all started to fall apart. Then they came back from break and it completely crumbled.

I was against the Meredith centric episode from the start, but I thought "If it really does have a lasting impact for all the characters like everyone is saying, okay." The only lasting impact I see is making non Meredith and Maggie "storylines" even more anti-climatic and confusing. Another time jump that left characters in limbo. Important beats taking place offscreen. "Resolutions" that have me scratching my head. Like was Jo covering Alex with a blanket really the resolution to Meredith being a bitch to Jo for no reason for over a season?

I want Alex and Jo to get a storyline, but I'm so confused by this proposal business. At this point, what does it matter if she says yes or no? Too much has taken place offscreen. Their issues have dragged for too long and since it's Grey's, won't be satisfactorily resolved. Just look at Jackson and April.

Grey's should be mindless entertainment but all I have is questions? What are Amelia and Owen? Why has Arizona been debating dating for two years? Is Jo ever going to pick a specialty? Etc...

[Greysaddict]

i agree with what everyone has said regarding the flow and narrative of the show.  but changing topics a little, I just saw this article

 

'Grey's Anatomy' Recruits 'Happy Endings' Star Casey Wilson, Rita Moreno (Exclusive)

 

We saw Rita Moreno in some BTS pics already, and the article speculates that Casey Wilson is playing the pregnant patient....but the tone of the article suggest they are not just one-time guest stars.  I really hope that's not the case.  What is even happening BTS??

 

episode synopsis from the article 

 

 

Richard throws everyone for a loop when he switches the resident and attending pairings and Arizona takes a huge risk on a woman who is pregnant with quadruplets. Meanwhile, April is faced with a difficult decision, on Grey's Anatomy."

Edited February 26, 2016 by Greysaddict

[Joana]

That's why I didn't like the concept of this April/Jackson-centric episode. It was clear it could either be retcon BS or rehashing the things we already knew with any possibility of an emotional impact long gone. Basically it turned out to be filler stuff - at the time the show desperately needs to get going somewhere, anywhere.

 

 

 What are Amelia and Owen? Why has Arizona been debating dating for two years? 

 

Those are just textbook examples of lousy writing. A completely undefined relationship that lingers on for years in show time is something that should have never happened and certainly wasn't planned - it simply shows the writers have lost the plot somewhere along the way.

As for Arizona, people not seeing anyone in a longer while is not something particularly unusual and they could have simply left it at that if they don't have any better ideas. Instead they've turned her character into an utter joke. 

[Deanie87]

I figured it wasn't just me, but I'm glad to know that others have this problem too.  I had always liked Stacy McKee and Bill Harper as writers, so I was excited to see what they brought to the show, but color me completely unimpressed.  Now, I can't blame everything on them because I don't believe that it is their choice to add so many new characters to the show, but they must have some responsibility for who they choose to focus on and how those stories are told.  They seriously added FIVE new people in the last two seasons alone, and that is not counting Cross or the upcoming doctor that Meredith will meet.  It is counting Penny, though, because she gets more storyline and screentime than Jo, and Stephanie and AZ combined.  

 

And I just don't think that behind the scenes issues are a good enough excuse anymore.  This show has been around long enough, and Shondaco has dealt with enough cast departures to be able to handle it better than they have been.  They've never been great at it, but it usually only affected the character that was leaving and/or that person's love interest.  Now they use timejumps, flashbacks, retcons like crazy so that it affects everyone.  I just don't get it.

 

ETA - you guys were posting when I was.  Well, I LOVE Casey Wilson, but she doesn't need to overstay her welcome either!  Also, WHAT RESIDENT/ATTENDING pairings?!?!?!?  Yes, once upon a time Jo liked Ortho, Steph liked Neuro and Ben liked plastics, but that hasn't been touched in about a year.  I'll just let me bitterness consume me and assume that it is so everyone can see Penny's brilliance.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Deanie87

[windsprints]

Richard throws everyone for a loop when he switches the resident and attending pairings

 

Let me guess - Maggie and DeLuca will be paired. PLEASE don't make Alex be stuck with Penny.

Edited February 26, 2016 by windsprints

[Joana]

The whole Penny thing is weird as well. Sure she's got a lot of screen time, but she hasn't had that much of a story either. Basically we either saw her with Callie or as a punchbag for Meredith and Amelia. We don't know anything about her, except that she "killed" Derek and must redeem herself for it. Now, I'm not saying I want to know more about her, but if they wanted to introduce her as a new character, it could have been done so much better. And what would be even better is if the actress that plays her had ANY screen presence. 

 

I see the next episode deals with Richard's discovery of Maggie's and Andrew's relationship. Actually, last week it took me a few moments to realize why he was so upset when he found out who "the wild cat that can't be tamed" was. That's how much of an importance the show puts on his relationship with Maggie. 

Edited February 26, 2016 by Joana

[Deanie87]

Let me guess - Maggie and DeLuca will be paired. PLEASE don't make Alex be stuck with Penny.

I'm sure the fact that DeLuca isn't even a resident will be conveniently forgotten. Also Richard did this to the original residents too, so I don't think the loop that everyone will be thrown for will be all that huge.

[Greysaddict]

And I just don't think that behind the scenes issues are a good enough excuse anymore.  This show has been around long enough, and Shondaco has dealt with enough cast departures to be able to handle it better than they have been.  They've never been great at it, but it usually only affected the character that was leaving and/or that person's love interest.  Now they use timejumps, flashbacks, retcons like crazy so that it affects everyone.  I just don't get it.

 

For me, when I say "BTS" I don't just mean actors leaving but also what happens with writers, producers, etc.  That being said, I do wonder if contract negotiations are holding back some of the writing/story flow.  While the head writers did leave at the end of S10, like you said Bill Harper and Stacey McKee are veterans with the show and should be able to do a much better job than they are doing.  Its possible that with the assurance Ellen P/Meredith is sticking around and Amelia, Maggie and Penny secured on (assumed) long term contracts, they thought it was safe to stick to mostly those characters.  

 

One of my favorite things about Grey's has always been how they weaved a story and narrative beautifully through the medical cases/hospital and personal lives. There used to be so much happening, yet it all made sense.  Now its almost like they throw anything they can think out there and see what sticks.  I don't know what has happened to show this once was but its getting further and further away from that as the episodes progress this season.  

 

Also, I don't know if I'm just noticing more but it seems like since the start of season 11 there have been more "centric" episodes than ever.  Back in S11, we had the Amelia episode with Herman's tumor.  Arizona sort of had a centric episode with her crash fetal surgery course, this season Meredith's attack, then this last Japril.  And that's just off the top of my head.  Prior to season 11, the only real centric episode I can recall is the musical which was sort of Callie centric, but not even really.  

[windsprints]

One big change this season is Debbie Allen as executive producer. It seems (by interviews, etc) that she's taken over many things that Shonda used to oversee. IMO, I think that could be part of why everything feels in flux. Its shifting from Shonda to Debbie and Debbie is finding her way.

Edited February 26, 2016 by windsprints

[tua20782]

There was also one in season 10 with callie's trial where calzona got back together and another one when they broke up

Eta: plus the cristina owen centic ep in season 10.

Edited February 26, 2016 by tua20782

[CED9]

My issue is their current obsession with time jumps. You can't say "6 month time jump here" "1 year time jump there" and have some of the characters move along with the jumps and others stuck in the same place.

That's been more prevalent this season than in the past where they showed how they all moved on.

[Kagomei]

What I find interesting is Shonda's apparent lack of interest in Grey's. Yesterday I decided not to watch the episode live (still haven't seen it until now) but I was on Twitter to watch the reactions and Shonda is a lot more active when Scandal starts. She tweets one thing or two Grey's related and then it's all Scandal. That show is clearly her baby. I, for one, cannot stand Scandal and didn't even give HTGAWM a try.

I agree with everything you guys said. Tbh since season 9 the show has gone downhill. I'm doing a rewatch with my mom and we are currently in season 2. So many things were different that it feels like a complete different show now. One of the things I noticed is how the show used to have actual comedy, we used to laugh (at least I used to) in some scenes. Even the sound effects were good and helped the comic scenes. This scene for example:

Aside from Sandra's amazing acting can you guys hear the song playing? Those songs used to play all the time and they brought life to the show. Now the scenes have a weird silence and then all of sudden awful music covers start playing. The insert song scenes made sense before but it's like they forgot how to do it now.

This is one of many things that have changed.