S03.E12: I Am Abassin Zadran

[Dev F]

Also, we got to watch Philip and Elizabeth keep calm as Abassin gloated about cutting the throats of young Soviet soldiers (Misha, anyone?) after they swam in a river. Whew, I'm sure they were itching to break every bone in his body.

 

Yeah, that was one of the main ideas in the episode -- that sometimes the only way to maintain the status quo is to grit your teeth and pretend like everything is normal when someone catastrophic is happening right in front of you. That's Henry, sitting along in his house playing electronic football while his parents rush off to handle some family crisis. It's the Jenningses wrangling Paige back into line by showing her that they can still act like normal concerned parents in front of Pastor Tim. And Oleg and Tatiana saving Arkady's job by pretending that a complete clusterfuck of an operation is a perfectly sensible source of intelligence. And the Center responding to the implosion of the Jared operation by trying the same exact thing all over again. And Elizabeth handing over the money to Maurice like he hasn't just changed their whole deal, and Martha acting like she's totally fine when Stan comes over for tea.

 

That's why I suspect that Martha is doomed -- because in the end she can't keep up the charade that she's totally fine, so Philip knows that things needs to change. So he takes off the wig and gives her the ultimate "I am Abassin Zadrad" moment, one so catastrophic that she knows the status quo is blown to hell beyond recovery.

 

I think I could sympathize with Paige if she seemed to be afraid and cautious.  Her flippant, in your face, I don't care who hears me witching doesn't ring true to me. With this kind of news, I would imagine a more toned down and careful approach, not, smarty pants.  Her repeated insistence that she talks loudly when Henry could over hear, tells me that she may be hellbent on exposing her parents.  

 

I dunno, I've known plenty of people who simply don't understand that other people can hear what they're saying. I recall it particularly being an issue when I was young -- e.g., a friend asking loudly, "Is that the girl you like?" while she's standing right over there. I think it makes sense that as a teenager in the midst of a huge crisis, she wouldn't be thinking clearly about how far her voice carries, but I don't think it necessarily means she would deliberately give her parents away.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Dev F

[AGuyToo]

Its not tough to come up with an explanation as to why Paige would not be back in DC if she stayed in russia.  Heck that is the easy part.  She wouldn't disappear.  They could just say she went off somewhere to school, she decided to go live with a relative for personal problems (which, technically, would not be a lie), she joined some overseas year long mission associated for religous reasons, I can come up with any number of plausible explanations.  They wouldn't just have her disappear with no reason.  Plus everyone pretty much knows she is unhappy where she is, so its completely believable and not out of nowhere.

 

I think it would be much harder to disappear Paige than that.

 

Pastor Tim and his wife know that Paige has been having problems at home. I expect that Tim also imagines Philip to be capable of violence -- given Philip's late night visit to the church last season dressed in his serial-killer clothes. I don't see how Tim just buys a boarding school or a relative story without investigating further or (more likely, in my opinion) calling the cops. (Really, given what he knows, he SHOULD call the cops in that circumstance.)

 

Stan can be kind of oblivious around the Jenningses, but still I'm having trouble picturing him showing up at their house for a home-cooked meal, noticing an empty place at the table, hearing that Paige has been pulled out of her own school and sent to board school (in the middle of the school year),  and having no uncomfortable follow-up questions.

 

And I think Henry is the hardest problem. Are P & E really going to tell him that his big sister just left without saying goodbye to him in person. And he can't call her on the phone or go visit her? And maybe she'll be back in a year or two or three? The kid's already lonely and maybe a little messed up. I'm not quite sure what he would end up doing, but I'd be willing to wager that Child Protective Services would soon show up to investigate what's going on in the Jennings home.

[spaceghostess]

Teens can be rebellious and act out, but IMO Paige gets away with a lot and always has.  I'm not that much older than Paige and I would NEVER have thought of talking to my parents the way she does and neither did most of my peers.  Recall when she skipped school and lied about it?  She got punished, but my parents would have really gone off on something like that. My world would have come to stand still.  Her parents are quite tolerant of her behavior.  Then to leave a note about spending the night without prior approval?  I can't imagine it.  It's not normal for a 15 year-old, IMO, but I was raised in the south.  Backtalk wasn't tolerated very well and not falling house rules had consequences. 

Backtalk was "normal" for me, and my parents were far from pushovers. I was raised in the New York, not the South, but my mom and dad are South Philly-bred Italians, so there were most definitely consequences (which I most definitely suffered). I just didn't care at the time. As an adult, I can look back and cringe, but I think plenty of kids may well have reacted like Paige (or worse) back then. That's also why I think the other shoe re: Paige's reaction may have yet to drop. When and if it does, it's going to drop hard, and I'm not talking unauthorized sleepovers at the pastor's house.

[RedHawk]

I expect that Tim also imagines Philip to be capable of violence -- given Philip's late night visit to the church last season dressed in his serial-killer clothes.

 

 

Perfect description of Philip in that scene. I still laugh every time I think about it! He did a bit of overkill there. Oh, I love this show.

 

But yes, Tim has never ever forgotten how Philip, um, introduced himself. IMO Tim and Alice genuinely believe they are "protecting" Paige from something. Yet there's also something wrong with a guy who would purposely, subtly taunt -- and Tim certainly does -- a man who has already menaced him the way Philip did.

 

Abassin the Assassin! Let the CIA clean up all that blood. Lucky for the Marriott their government rate was too high.

Edited April 16, 2015 by RedHawk

[spaceghostess]

 . . . it's going to drop hard, and I'm not talking unauthorized sleepovers at the pastor's house.

Heh. Just realized how gross that reads.

[Blakeston]

I dunno, I've known plenty of people who simply don't understand that other people can hear what they're saying. I recall it particularly being an issue when I was young -- e.g., a friend asking loudly, "Is that the girl you like?" while she's standing right over there. I think it makes sense that as a teenager in the midst of a huge crisis, she wouldn't be thinking clearly about how far her voice carries, but I don't think it necessarily means she would deliberately give her parents away.

In this case, though, Paige had her parents reminding her how dangerous it was to speak that loudly, and she still chose to maintain her volume while talking about how their whole family is a lie, and their relatives aren't really their relatives. And she did this while knowing Henry was nearby.

 

Even if she wants her parents to get in trouble - or just doesn't care - has she thought for a second about how he'd feel if he found out the truth, at a significantly younger age than her, by overhearing it? (I wouldn't be surprised if he already knows a lot, but so far as Paige knows, he's in the dark.)

 

I get that Paige is young, and in a difficult situation. But I still find her to be an insufferable brat.

 

[John S]

Teens can be rebellious and act out, but IMO Paige gets away with a lot and always has.  I'm not that much older than Paige and I would NEVER have thought of talking to my parents the way she does and neither did most of my peers.  Recall when she skipped school and lied about it?  She got punished, but my parents would have really gone off on something like that. My world would have come to stand still.  Her parents are quite tolerant of her behavior.  Then to leave a note about spending the night without prior approval?  I can't imagine it.  It's not normal for a 15 year-old, IMO, but I was raised in the south.  Backtalk wasn't tolerated very well and not falling house rules had consequences.

I'm going to assume that what your parents told you weren't 95% lies.

I'll bet that your parents names are ACTUALLY your parents names.

I'll bet that your relatives are ACTUALLY your relatives.

I'll bet that you ACTUALLY believed the vast majority of what your parents said.

Being from one part of the country has absolutely NOTHING to do with how a person is raised - but then again, the last time that I looked, Virginia is in the South.

[sistermagpie]

Dammit, I wrote a whole post that apparently went nowhere.

 

Yes, Paige made it happen sooner than Philip wanted and now he and Elizabeth are handling the fallout. What WAS Elizabeth's plan, if she'd had time for a slow reveal?

 

I don't think she had one. I honestly think she was just enjoying the idea that any day now Paige would know and everything would be great. She wanted to put it off but wasn't admitting it. It was perfect for her just knowing she could tell and would when she was ready.

 

Russian spies are completely different.  All of Paige's life has been spent learning that the Soviet Union is bad bad bad, Russian spies are bad bad bad bad.

 

 

Leaving aside what she'd have been taught--and while I agree there was no indoctrination about Russians being terrible they totally were obvious cartoony bad guys--Paige herself has never brought this up once. She hasn't expressed any horror at where her parents are from or the fact that they're spying. She just cares about the lying at this point.

 

Its not tough to come up with an explanation as to why Paige would not be back in DC if she stayed in russia.  Heck that is the easy part.  She wouldn't disappear.  They could just say she went off somewhere to school, she decided to go live with a relative for personal problems (which, technically, would not be a lie), she joined some overseas year long mission associated for religous reasons, I can come up with any number of plausible explanations.  They wouldn't just have her disappear with no reason.  Plus everyone pretty much knows she is unhappy where she is, so its completely believable and not out of nowhere.

 

 

 

 

How does this not shoot the KGB in the foot? They don't need a kid with a big hole in her record where she was supposedly at boarding school or on a mission trip. They want her to have a normal life in the US. Kidnapping her just makes her at best an asset under duress, which will blow up in their face, or an enemy. If anything the Centre has too much trust in Paige keeping her mouth shut.

 

On Mad Men, I believe that Kiernan Shipka will one day be a star.
On The Americans, I believe that Holly Taylor will one day be a star. Her abilities, at both verbal and nonverbal communication, are fantastic.

 

 

I think you're overpraising both. That's not meant as a criticism of either's performances, it just seems like every competent young actor gets this treatment and even when they grow up to be great actors, as some do, they're still better as adults. Usually they just fail to live up to the hype and everyone forgets about it. 

 

If you're expecting puppies and rainbows, you're certainly watching a different show from the electrifying one that I'm watching.

 

 

I don't think they really meant puppies and rainbows, but I agree the show does tend to take Elizabeth's emotional needs very seriously, often giving her what she wants so that she sees it's not so great and then sympathizing with her. Now that she's gotten to tell Paige it's no surprise the Centre and Philip are on board with giving her the trip to Russia so they can bond. 

 

To your last paragraph, I used to babysit when I was 12, and rarely were there less than 3 kids I was responsible for, usually past midnight.  Luckily, only one father ever seriously hit on me when he took me home.

 

 

 

Kids sometimes these days seem to be talked about like they're marionettes that can't live a rich life without parents pulling the strings. Every time Henry has a scene where an adult isn't interacting with him--and by interacting I mean an adult carefully indulging him--he's always read as lonely and neglected. My entire childhood would apparently have been just as sad as Henry's since I also did my homework alone, sometimes was in my room alone or watched TV alone and didn't care if my parents went out to pick someone up at 9:30 after they got home late. 

 

Both Philip and Elizabeth must really be out of touch with the Soviet Union circa 1980s, if they think a visit will convert Paige.  Again, their weakness is their inability to understand Americans and how we think.

 

 

There's no reason to think that Philip, in particular, thinks any such thing. He thinks she should go because the one concrete she's asked for is biological family and that's how they can give her that. He doesn't even want her to be recruited so he's not going to care if she takes to the place or not. Philip himself is pretty adaptable so he's not going to think seeing the place is going to recruit her.

 

I also disagree that Elizabeth's mother might ever have been ordered to tell her to go. First, that's just overly complicated, with Elizabeth being told not to tell her mother and her mother being told behind her back. Second, the KGB was a good gig. Her mother had every reason to think it was a good idea. And while the show doesn't always follow reality, IRL illegals could drop out of the program if they wished. You wouldn't want anyone in this job who was coerced into being there.

 

I don't understand what the Centre could possibly be wanting to use Paige for as a 15 year old. Things are moving too slow? Meaning they need her to take up spying for them right now? What could she even do?

 

 

It would be ridiculous and YA territory for Paige to be "a spy" at this point, I agree. Just annoying. Hopefully Claudia just means that she wants them to start making her into a good Communist by the time she gets to college. 

 

But yes, Tim has never ever forgotten how Philip, um, introduced himself. IMO Tim and Alice genuinely believe they are "protecting" Paige from something. Yet there's also something wrong with a guy who would purposely, subtly taunt -- and Tim certainly does -- a man who has already menaced him the way Philip did.

 

 

Tim is not at all acting like somebody who thinks he's protecting Paige from anything but inferior parents who don't realize how awesome he is. Philip showed up angry at Pastor Tim's office when the guy had emptied his kid's bank account of 600 dollars and he didn't touch a hair on his head. Pastor Tim has since lost no chance to basically troll Philip about religion and throw his influence over Paige in Philip's face. If he actually thought this guy was abusive and Paige needed protection from him (and Paige has never claimed any such thing to him--she's even tried to tell him that it's usually her mom who's the hardass) then why is he intentionally provoking the guy? Not just provoking him but provoking him by being possessive of his daughter?

Edited April 16, 2015 by sistermagpie

[txhorns79]

Teens can be rebellious and act out, but IMO Paige gets away with a lot and always has.  I'm not that much older than Paige and I would NEVER have thought of talking to my parents the way she does and neither did most of my peers.  Recall when she skipped school and lied about it?  She got punished, but my parents would have really gone off on something like that. My world would have come to stand still.  Her parents are quite tolerant of her behavior.  Then to leave a note about spending the night without prior approval?  I can't imagine it.  It's not normal for a 15 year-old, IMO, but I was raised in the south.  Backtalk wasn't tolerated very well and not falling house rules had consequences.

 

I think the key difference is that up until very recently, Phillip and Elizabeth had to balance their parenting with the extreme instability of their lives as spies, as well as maintaining the mountain of lies they were regularly telling their kids.  I view Paige's behavior through the lens of her suspicions of her parents.  For example, she skipped school and lied about it because she didn't believe a lie her parents had told her about "Aunt Helen."  She's acting out now because of what her parents have done.  It's obviously bratty, but entirely understandable, which is why her parents aren't going balistic with her.

 

Stan can be kind of oblivious around the Jenningses, but still I'm having trouble picturing him showing up at their house for a home-cooked meal, noticing an empty place at the table, hearing that Paige has been pulled out of her own school and sent to board school (in the middle of the school year),  and having no uncomfortable follow-up questions.

 

Why would Stan be asking uncomfortable follow up questions?  He's friends with Phillip and Elizabeth, and given his own personal relationships, I can't imagine he would start prying into something like that. 

[SmoothCriminal]

Elizabeth's and Paige's trip is really happening. In the preview, when they are crossing the street and Paige says "What's going on?", there is a neon sign behind them. It says "Apotheke", which is German for drugstore. I am guessing they are going to cross over to the "eastern block" from West Berlin and then continue on to the Soviet Union. I don't know what to think about this plotline. I believe it is possible for the KGB to arrange th logistics of this trip, but it doesn't make any sense to allow an american born teenager without any russian language skills into the Soviet Union. I mean, does Paige have to stay silent the entire time they are there? Also, Elizabeth now speaks Russian with an accent. How will they fend for themselves without arousing any suspicion?

 

That said, I can't wait to see the finale. The Martha/Phillip scene at the end was intense and I am guessing it's gonna be even more so in the next episode. I believe Philip will kill Martha and it's gonna be extremely hard to watch. My prediction is that Philip will hesitate, thus giving Martha the opportunity to get her gun and turn it on Philip. Of course, Martha will still end up dead, but Philip won't have time to make it look like a suicide. That would open up a whole other can of worms in S4. I mean at some point, the writers have to set Stan on E and P's path. I believe they already have set the groundwork for it.

[RedHawk]

Twice in this episode Philip and Elizabeth could have asserted their parental authority in better ways and maybe gotten control of Paige a little more. First, yes, they should have clearly stated to Paige that it's fine to go to church and even to go to a special event, but she can't stay overnight without advance permission. Leaving a note is not enough (even though of course they disappear from home all the damn time), no way no how. Second, when Paige interrupted their discussion of Martha's visit from Stan. She did knock and wait to enter but then she exploded about her supposed relatives and "then that's another lie". When she came in they should have said firmly, "Now is not a good time; we're having a discussion. Give us 10 more minutes and then we'll talk about whatever you want." Their failure to take charge in those scenes struck me. They're not making smart decisions, and these are people who are trained to listen, evaluate, and make the best decision about how to manipulate and control a situation. They're acting just like typical, fallible parents!

[sistermagpie]

I believe it is possible for the KGB to arrange th logistics of this trip, but it doesn't make any sense to allow an american born teenager without any russian language skills into the Soviet Union. I mean, does Paige have to stay silent the entire time they are there? Also, Elizabeth now speaks Russian with an accent. How will they fend for themselves without arousing any suspicion?

 

 

 

What suspicion? They're not under suspicion in the USSR, they're guests of the KGB who are taking a valuable agent to see her mother. American teenagers are allowed there. Elizabeth will openly interpret for her. (Also I doubt Elizabeth is supposed to be speaking Russian with an American accent any more than Philip was supposed to speak Russian with a Welsh lilt before he left the country!)

[DrSpaceman]

I think it would be much harder to disappear Paige than that.

 

Pastor Tim and his wife know that Paige has been having problems at home. I expect that Tim also imagines Philip to be capable of violence -- given Philip's late night visit to the church last season dressed in his serial-killer clothes. I don't see how Tim just buys a boarding school or a relative story without investigating further or (more likely, in my opinion) calling the cops. (Really, given what he knows, he SHOULD call the cops in that circumstance.)

 

Stan can be kind of oblivious around the Jenningses, but still I'm having trouble picturing him showing up at their house for a home-cooked meal, noticing an empty place at the table, hearing that Paige has been pulled out of her own school and sent to board school (in the middle of the school year),  and having no uncomfortable follow-up questions.

 

And I think Henry is the hardest problem. Are P & E really going to tell him that his big sister just left without saying goodbye to him in person. And he can't call her on the phone or go visit her? And maybe she'll be back in a year or two or three? The kid's already lonely and maybe a little messed up. I'm not quite sure what he would end up doing, but I'd be willing to wager that Child Protective Services would soon show up to investigate what's going on in the Jennings home.

 

 

So what if Stand has uncomfortable follow up questions or if Pastor Tim calls the cops?  Nothing would likely come from either of those.  There is no proof anything happened to Paige.  They just give the same story to the cops, could even call her and talk to her on the phone if needed to prove she is still alive, fine, off somewhere esle.  henry could probably call her on the phone.  What evidence if there that Henry is lonely.  He is ALONE much of the time but for the most part seems to be fine emotionally otherwise.  Why would CPS show up to investigate Hnery? 

 

People seriously send their kids off to boarding schools and to live with relatives all the time.  They don't all prompt major investigations by CPS and the cops, not sure why it would unless someone had some proof she was harmed somehow

[DrSpaceman]

Its not tough to come up with an explanation as to why Paige would not be back in DC if she stayed in russia.  Heck that is the easy part.  She wouldn't disappear.  They could just say she went off somewhere to school, she decided to go live with a relative for personal problems (which, technically, would not be a lie), she joined some overseas year long mission associated for religous reasons, I can come up with any number of plausible explanations.  They wouldn't just have her disappear with no reason.  Plus everyone pretty much knows she is unhappy where she is, so its completely believable and not out of nowhere.

 

 

 

How does this not shoot the KGB in the foot? They don't need a kid with a big hole in her record where she was supposedly at boarding school or on a mission trip. They want her to have a normal life in the US. Kidnapping her just makes her at best an asset under duress, which will blow up in their face, or an enemy. If anything the Centre has too much trust in Paige keeping her mouth shut

 

 

 

I think the idea of Paige being a spy is way on the back burner right now, or it should be if the KGB is smart.  Thats the last thing they should be considering.  The primary concern right now is keeping her from blabbing to Pastor Tim, Stan or anyone about who her parents are.  ANd the best way to prevent that is to keep her away from all thsoe people, as far away as possible, until they have a better handle on what she plans on doing with that information, which I think is still very much up in the air.

 

She is already going to be in Russia, or in some communist country, that is going to be on her passport or somewhere no matter how long she stays, that is something they will already have to explain later anyway. 

[John S]

I think the idea of Paige being a spy is way on the back burner right now, or it should be if the KGB is smart.  Thats the last thing they should be considering.  The primary concern right now is keeping her from blabbing to Pastor Tim, Stan or anyone about who her parents are.  ANd the best way to prevent that is to keep her away from all thsoe people, as far away as possible, until they have a better handle on what she plans on doing with that information, which I think is still very much up in the air.

 

She is already going to be in Russia, or in some communist country, that is going to be on her passport or somewhere no matter how long she stays, that is something they will already have to explain later anyway.

Are you saying that the KGB would keep her as a prisoner, locked up in a cell, a hotel room, or somewhere?

[RedHawk]

She is already going to be in Russia, or in some communist country, that is going to be on her passport or somewhere no matter how long she stays, that is something they will already have to explain later anyway.

 

 

She'll travel with fake documents. There will never be any record of her trip. 

[sistermagpie]

The primary concern right now is keeping her from blabbing to Pastor Tim, Stan or anyone about who her parents are. ANd the best way to prevent that is to keep her away from all thsoe people, as far away as possible, until they have a better handle on what she plans on doing with that information, which I think is still very much up in the air.

 

 

The KGB has not indicated at all that this is a primary concern. She hasn't told, there's no reason to think she's more about to tell now than she was last week. She's going to the USSR because Philip thinks she needs to meet family. The Centre were the ones who wanted her told and they want P&E to now step up on indoctrinating her into the cause.

[soapfaninnc]

 

 

I don't think they really meant puppies and rainbows, but I agree the show does tend to take Elizabeth's emotional needs very seriously, often giving her what she wants so that she sees it's not so great and then sympathizing with her. Now that she's gotten to tell Paige it's no surprise the Centre and Philip are on board with giving her the trip to Russia so they can bond. 

 

 

 

 

Yes, thank you. That's exactly what I meant though I didn't state it nearly as clearly. My biggest problem with the show at the moment is that Elizabeth is the special snowflake that gets everything she wants and everyone runs around worried about her feelings and indulging her. All the men are in love with her.  Even when she's horribly wrong. I still don't see her as seeing Paige as a separate person from herself. Though she's clueless, she's being given the chance to take Paige to see her mother and bond with her - even though its Phillip who accurately realizes what Paige is asking for - a sense of family.  I just cannot relate to Paige wanting to go anywhere with her mother at this point. I'd want to stay with my Dad, who tries to see things the way I might and recognizes I have feelings of my own and doesn't try to cover my mouth with his hand like a two year old. He reasoned with Paige and then - after she'd had some space - gently reminded her of how real their family was through her own experiences. 

 

I had no problem with them being mad about her leaving a note and staying with the Pastor overnight. And I was just as lippy and pulled similar stunts as a teenager about Paige's age. In the South. As I've said before, my mother was a lot like Elizabeth in her ideology and so I was terrified of the USSR government. My mother didn't respect me as being my own person and hence - even as a teen - I was disrespectful right back. So I don't think Paige is out of line. She probably doesn't realize how loud she's getting because she's close to hysteria at some points. She feels like they aren't hearing her. And I don't think Elizabeth even tries to.

[RedHawk]

Tim is not at all acting like somebody who thinks he's protecting Paige from anything but inferior parents who don't realize how awesome he is

 

 

I never said Tim suspected some kind of abuse. Perhaps I should have said "sheltering" instead of "protecting". Yes, he knows he gets under Philip's skin, and that's his big ego as far as I can tell. However, Paige has confided in him that something is "off" about her parents and her home life. She had suspicions. Now she's told him that she did as they discussed and confronted her parents. She has not shared with him what the result was. He knows something is wrong and Paige is hurting because of it. I think he and Alice genuinely think Paige needs "better parenting", and Jesus, and are trying to provide that. I have watched Tim's scenes carefully and sometimes I see him as trolling and others I could be persuaded that he's interested, intense, and certain that he's right.

[scowl]

One historical note that's not important. The Soviets were completely unaware that the U.S. intended to secretly supply Stinger anti-aircraft missiles to the mujahedin until it was too late. It was one of the biggest intelligence failures in their war in Afghanistan.

 

In September 1986, a band of mujahedin carried the first Stingers from Pakistan to a hill overlooking the Jalalabad airport where they watched Soviet soldiers protecting the runways. As soon as they saw eight Mi-24 helicopter gunships coming in for landings they fired five missiles that took three of the helicopters down. The rest panicked and flew away. The Soviets had absolutely no idea what had just happened.

Edited April 16, 2015 by scowl

[sistermagpie]

Yeah, I really don't get that. I think that your life is what you know. If it turned out that I was adopted, and my biological parents were not the people who raised me and whom I loved,  I honestly think that I would have no interest in meeting my real parents. Why would Paige be interested in meeting her biological grandmother? It baffles me. And really, why does it matter to Paige if Henry is her biological brother?

 

I think it's mostly so that meeting babushka is the obvious solution.

 

I mean, I understand her wanting to know about the most basic ties she has, like if she's adopted etc. That her whole life so it's the thing she's testing. But she's always had this focus on "not having any family" that seemed bizarre to me. Some people simply don't have family--and now we even see that at some point they claimed somebody was a distant cousin. Even in this ep Philip seemed to be saying that he had no family at all in the world and he didn't think it was weird.

 

Also, I'm with Claudia, there is no reason for a Greek diner to have 20 burgers on the menu. It's not even a Greek dish!

 

Greek diners are the best, though, so 20 burgers makes sense! Really, the two of them are so silly. The burgers are just different toppings. I'm remembering that old Wendy's commercial that made fun of the US view of Communism where they have a fashion show and everyone's wearing the same grey dress. I call foul on the waitress listing teas, though. They bring you Lipton at the diner unless you ask for otherwise.

 

I am trying to remember, obviously Martha knows Clark is not clark, but does she know he is Phillip, and that he is friends with Stan?  I can't recall if she would be able to make that connection or not.

 

 

 

Arkady into keeping Project Zephyr going, which means they will eventually read the conversation between Stan and Aderholt and find out that the bug in the pen was found.  Or does the Center already know that.  I thought Philip and Elizabeth didn't tell anyone the bug was found.

 

 

Yes, they told everyone. That's how the mail robot came to be bugged. Martha has never met Philip--she wasn't invited to the Beeman's that day. And if she had been Philip would never have let her see him. Those disguises aren't meant to fool people they know.

 

Also shout out to Paige's casual betrayal of Henry's trust in telling about the bear--in any other situation it would be no big deal because obviously Henry would no longer care, but here it was threatening.

 

And also, great call-back to Tootsie from a couple of episodes ago. They played "I'm Edward Kimberly, the reckless brother of my sister Anthea" for horror and it worked.

[scowl]

What radio station played Ultravox? I saw "Vienna" once on MTV back then.

[AGuyToo]

But if Paige is being kept in the USSR against her will, why would she get on the phone to confirm the KGB story?

 

And P & E (who, IMO, would never go along with this) couldn't just tell a story to the police or CPS. They'd have to provide the name of the school or the relative. Someone would want to check with Paige in person.

 

So what if Stand has uncomfortable follow up questions or if Pastor Tim calls the cops?  Nothing would likely come from either of those.  There is no proof anything happened to Paige.  They just give the same story to the cops, could even call her and talk to her on the phone if needed to prove she is still alive, fine, off somewhere esle.  henry could probably call her on the phone.  What evidence if there that Henry is lonely.  He is ALONE much of the time but for the most part seems to be fine emotionally otherwise.  Why would CPS show up to investigate Hnery? 

 

People seriously send their kids off to boarding schools and to live with relatives all the time.  They don't all prompt major investigations by CPS and the cops, not sure why it would unless someone had some proof she was harmed somehow

[SmoothCriminal]

What suspicion? They're not under suspicion in the USSR, they're guests of the KGB who are taking a valuable agent to see her mother. American teenagers are allowed there. Elizabeth will openly interpret for her. (Also I doubt Elizabeth is supposed to be speaking Russian with an American accent any more than Philip was supposed to speak Russian with a Welsh lilt before he left the country!)

 

 

Were Americans really allowed to enter the Soviet Union (generally speaking)? Weren't foreigners regarded with suspicion there? I am sorry if these questions come of as stupid, but I have no personal recollection of the Soviet Union at all. I was born in 1990. That's why I just can't imagine how this will work out in the show, but I guess we will all find out next week.

 

I met a German guy once who had been living in the US for almost 30 years. He spoke German with an accent and occasionally could not recall certain words. He did however speak English perfectly. It is definitely possible with enough training and practise to loose your original accent.

 

[jennybfry]

I think he *will* kill her.  I saw a lot of sadness in him as he took off his disguise--he's being forced to do something that he does not want to do.  I agree that his taking off his disguise would be partially a matter of respect, but I think he also would want to spare Martha the horror of being killed by someone she thought she knew and loved.  Being killed by Philip has to be better than being killed by Clark.  (But damn, I hope I'm wrong.  I'm not ready for Philip to kill Martha.)

That is how I read that last scene as well...there was a tear in his eye as he removed his Clark wig. I wouldn't be surprised to see a continuation of this scene next week. I also think that this will be excrutiating for Philip.

[scowl]

Were Americans really allowed to enter the Soviet Union (generally speaking)? Weren't foreigners regarded with suspicion there?

Everyone was regarded with suspicion there. They will be guests of the Soviet Union. While they're there, they'll see nothing but clean streets, happy citizens, and well furnished houses with refrigerators full of good food.

[sistermagpie]

That's exactly what I meant though I didn't state it nearly as clearly. My biggest problem with the show at the moment is that Elizabeth is the special snowflake that gets everything she wants and everyone runs around worried about her feelings and indulging her. All the men are in love with her.  Even when she's horribly wrong. I still don't see her as seeing Paige as a separate person from herself. Though she's clueless, she's being given the chance to take Paige to see her mother and bond with her - even though its Phillip who accurately realizes what Paige is asking for - a sense of family.

 

 

I noted that even in the diner Gabriel was saying this was bad for Philip and Elizabeth because "she'd been so much better with him" before this came up. I wondered what that meant exactly. I mean, obviously I know that they'd fallen in love so I knew the real story, but were Elizabeth's issues with Philip an ongoing concern that he was worried about?

 

Elizabeth's informing on Philip may have made them suspicious of him but they really do seem to see her as Agent Special Snowflake no matter what good work he's doing. 

 

Were Americans really allowed to enter the Soviet Union (generally speaking)? Weren't foreigners regarded with suspicion there? I am sorry if these questions come of as stupid, but I have no personal recollection of the Soviet Union at all. I was born in 1990. That's why I just can't imagine how this will work out in the show, but I guess we will all find out next week.

 

 

Yes, you could go there. Depending on the circumstance, but it's not like no Americans ever went there. They were noticed as foreigners and not allowed to go everywhere, but it's not a big problem if somebody on the street notices you're a foreigner. Elizabeth and Paige aren't in danger if somebody in a shop pegs them as foreigners or anything. 

 

But in their case Elizabeth and Paige are not foreigners. Elizabeth is a national hero and Paige is her daughter who no doubt has Soviet citizenship if she wants it too. They're not sneaking into the country, as far as I can tell, they're going on a visit home with the blessing of their government. 

[Ellaria]

Ah, but I meant (although didn't communicate clearly) that I believe Philip will kill Martha -- he'll just do it offscreen. I think Umbelina might be on to something with the idea that Philip could set up a "suicide" using Martha's (Chekov's) gun. Could definitely see this happening, with us finding out next week that her body has been discovered. :-(

 

I also kind of (OK, totally) love Oleg and wish there'd been more for him to do this season. Guess I'll have to be satisfied with "Beeeeeep" for now.

 

Oh, and did anyone else actually find the opening scene with Henry kind of creepy? I don't know, there was a weird vibe with him. The shot from behind the couch of him playing the game while the t.v. babysat certainly conveyed the message of disconnection and isolation I'm sure was intended, but it somehow felt more than just sad to me. Maybe it was intended to underline the irony that Henry, content to be on his own and possibly already tuned in to--and accepting of--the nefarious weirdness of his family, is the better Spy School candidate. But we all figured that out a long time ago!

 

To clarify...if Martha is to be killed, I don't think that it will happen off-screen. Too much has been invested in that story line for us to come back and find out that she is another body in a suitcase. I am still holding onto the tiny hope that she moves fast and bashes wigless Philip on the head with the spaghetti bowl or a lamp. Then she can grab the gun and run for her life. (Not sure what happens next so maybe this isn't such a great idea.)

 

I, too, love Oleg and hope for a better story line for him next season. And, please, let it not be the return of his "true love" Nina. I like him with Tatiana.

 

I'm hoping that Henry surprises Mom, Dad, Sis, everyone next week in a ridiculous turn of events. Henry has been ignored for too long.

[John S]

Were Americans really allowed to enter the Soviet Union (generally speaking)? Weren't foreigners regarded with suspicion there? I am sorry if these questions come of as stupid, but I have no personal recollection of the Soviet Union at all. I was born in 1990. That's why I just can't imagine how this will work out in the show, but I guess we will all find out next week.

 

I met a German guy once who had been living in the US for almost 30 years. He spoke German with an accent and occasionally could not recall certain words. He did however speak English perfectly. It is definitely possible with enough training and practise to loose your original accent.

Elizabeth is a Russian citizen. She wouldn't have any trouble with the authorities.

THEORETICALLY, she would watch over Paige VERY carefully. IF Paige were to roam around freely, then she would be watched - but not knowing the language would hinder her exploring around the neighborhood or talking to people, unless she somehow found someone who spoke English.

[PinkRibbons]

I sincerely doubt that Paige and Elizabeth will make it to Russia. For The Drama I'm sure they will run into trouble on the way, but on another note completely, Paige is a walking security risk, and it has nothing to do with what she knows.

 

The sensible thing to assume is that if the KGB has deep-cover agents in America, then the CIA has them in Russia. The clothes would be a dead give-away, but also one look at Elizabeth's American haircut will tell them she's a visiting American, and they will try to get pictures of her that could feasibly get back to the CIA. So okay, they don't bring them in as important guest, they even disguise both Paige and Elizabeth against this. Put them in Soviet clothes, wigs even. Still dangerous. Paige is an American. She smiles with her teeth, she holds herself differently from a Soviet Teen. She walks differently. She can't speak a word of Russian.

 

I'm serious about this -- my mother and I went back to Free Lithuania in the early 2000s and every single person that saw me did a double-take. With my mother it was because of her denim skirts -- older women in Europe weren't wearing them at the time. Otherwise she wasn't regarded as such an oddity. But me? Granted, I was short, dark-eyed and dark-haired in a country full of tall blonde people, but I was not an impossibility -- they had people from all over Europe visiting. I was dressed like every single other teen I saw -- jeans, t-shirt, jacket. And yet something made people look twice. It was my earrings from Claire's or small details on my jacket cuffs. My braces were slightly different. At one point Mama and I walked to the city's only synagogue and the Rabbi and his wife pegged us as Americans from the way we walked there. (The Rabbi and his family were American Missionaries from New York, and really glad to see us. We had a meal with the congregation after the service and the Rabbi introduced us with a joke about almost doubting my mother on her being Jewish until he saw me. This made me realize that one of the reasons I was getting so many confused once-overs was because a lot of people in the city didn't know what a Jew looked like anymore, especially the kids. )

 

Paige won't have a problem fitting in with her looks; but she has a lifetime of mannerisms to hide. Drawing attention to her in Russia could put her family in serious danger from the CIA.

[OrientalAmish]

"HEY MAURICE WHY DON'T YOU TAKE ALL THAT ENERGY YOU SEEM TO HAVE FOR MANSPLAINING AND GET A JOB."

 

 

LOL

 

And, this is why I love your recaps, Tara...

[RedHawk]

What radio station played Ultravox? I saw "Vienna" once on MTV back then.

 

 

Yeah, and what bunch of 15-year-olds were "all talking about" Yaz in 1982? Not likely any radio station in DC played Ultravox, only a college station. Let's stretch and say Paige could pick up a college station from Northern Va Community College or George Mason University.

 

The songs worked for the story and were out then, so I enjoy hearing them. "Vienna" was a huge surprise and its refrain "This means nothing to me" helped underscore Paige's feelings of disconnect. Elizabeth and Philip don't quite get it -- it's the lies lies lies that Paige is having trouble with. Same thing with Martha, she can't handle all the lies.

[RimaTheBirdGirl]

P&E just telling the 12-year-old Henry that they'll be out, make sure to go to bed by 10 pm.

I'm hoping that Henry surprises Mom, Dad, Sis, everyone next week in a ridiculous turn of events. Henry has been ignored for too long.

 

Stunning that P & E both ran out to "handle" Paige, with never a thought for Henry.  Who is the natural super-spy.  

  

That fact has been too carefully nurtured, not to pay out big.  (Smashing the duck-feeding psycho with a beer bottle; keeping caches of photos; doing a pretty fair Eddie Murphy.)  Can't wait to see what happens when the plot turns to Henry.   

 

I noted that even in the diner Gabriel was saying this was bad for Philip and Elizabeth because "she'd been so much better with him" before this came up. I wondered what that meant exactly.  

 

Perhaps the effectiveness of the Illegal couples is lessened when their personal bond is frayed.  As a working team, and as a source of mutual emotional support, perhaps Illegals do their best work in stronger marriages.  

 

And of course Elizabeth had told Claudia of Philip's wavering loyalties to the Mission.  And then confessed that to Philip.  Gabriel's statement might reflect that Elizabeth had not been expressing those kind of concerns, prior to Paige Issues arising. 

Edited April 16, 2015 by RimaTheBirdGirl

[RedHawk]

So Claudia said that the Centre nearly decided to close down Directorate S. That's the program E&P are working under, right, the illegals? What would have happened? I guess they would have been called back and welcomed home to the USSR and given a fine house and a dacha and cars and new jobs. But Paige and Henry -- suddenly to be told, hey, you're Russian and we're going home forever! 

 

Claudia also said that the Centre thinks Gabriel can "do it", get Paige to turn or whatever. So are we going to see Paige meet up with kindly old Uncle Gabe? I just can't imagine their game plan with Paige and it does take me out of the story. And all this, "she will have a choice". Total bullshit. She had no choice from the moment Elizabeth began to tell her the truth.

[RedHawk]

Can't wait to see what happens when the plot turns to Henry.

 

 

Me, too! While I believe he's happy to be left to his own devices as often as he is, like Paige, he's bright and curious and has to have noticed things around his house are not typical. That kid's crazy! He has probably been far more observant than anyone realizes. 

 

Perhaps the effectiveness of the Illegal couples is lessened when their personal bond is frayed.  As a working team, and as a source of mutual emotional support, perhaps Illegals do their best work in stronger marriages.

 

 

It seems to be the opposite. Claudia was not happy that their marriage has created a true emotional bond between them. They're supposed to be a team, co-workers, not "in love" with first loyalty to each other. She tried to undermine Philip's trust in Elizabeth and Elizabeth's in Philip. 

[Uncle Benzene]

Perhaps I'd just be a terrible parent, I don't know, but I don't understand why P&E don't just put the Fear of God (heh) into Paige, which I can't imagine would fail to shut her right the hell down with a quickness. It's not like they'd have to be mean about it, though I think  twinge of assholishness might actually work wonders. Just sit her down and have one of those "You want the truth? Alright, here's some brutal truth for you..." moments. Scare her straight. Because I think she's old enough and smart enough to intuit that what they're telling her is true. Something along the lines of...

 

Look, you need to calm the hell down right this minute and come to terms with what you now know. I know you're pissed off right now, maybe to the point that you don't even care what would happen to us if you insist on continuing to be a loose cannon here. But you need to think about what would happen to you, what would happen to your brother, if you don't get a hold of yourself. Because, newsflash, in case you haven't thought about it yet, there are any number of people on both sides of this conflict who are perfectly fine with killing anyone who even might be considered a possible threat, just in case. You need to understand the stakes here.

 

You keep accusing us of having lied to you all your life. And I guess you're technically correct, if that's how you insist on looking at it. But what exactly were we supposed to do? Tell you when you were ten? Do you really think anything good could have come of that? Do you really not understand that the more you know about all this, the more danger you're in? Do you really not understand that we were protecting you from all this, because we're your parents and we love you? Does the fact that we raised you and have given you a comfortable middle-class American life count for nothing? And before you get all righteous with us about having brought you into this life, do you really think you're the only kid whose parents have secrets? Do you really think you're the only kid who has to live with a certain amount of danger based on what their parents do for a living? What about the kids of the prosecuting attorney who sends a mob boss to prison? What about the kids of a police officer who busts a drug dealer? What about Stan Beeman's son? At least our true identities are secret, you're safer than those kids are... for now, anyway.

 

You wanted the truth. You demanded the truth. Now you have to deal with it. And we are more than happy to help you come to terms with all this in any way we possibly can. Because we're your mom & dad and we do love you. But you need to rein yourself in, because all this acting out is not going to end well. Not just for us, but for you and your brother, for Mr. Beeman and his family, and for any number of others. Hell, for that matter, it's not too big a stretch to imagine your actions -- yours, personally -- potentially having worldwide war and peace consequences. You need to understand that you forced your way into this, and now you're in. And you need to think very carefully about what you do going forward. This is not a game. It's life and death, every minute of every day, from now on.

 

Now how about taking our hands and letting us help you down from that cross before it kills ya? Whadd'ya say? 

[Dev F]

It seems to be the opposite. Claudia was not happy that their marriage has created a true emotional bond between them. They're supposed to be a team, co-workers, not "in love" with first loyalty to each other. She tried to undermine Philip's trust in Elizabeth and Elizabeth's in Philip. 

 

Yep. And back when Gabriel was their handler last time, Elizabeth hadn't fallen for Philip yet, so that couldn't be what Gabriel meant. But Philip was in love with her and she knew it, which no doubt allowed her to exert a certain amount of control over him when the need arose.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Dev F

[sistermagpie]

Yep. And back when Gabriel was their handler last time, Elizabeth hadn't fallen for Philip yet, so that couldn't be what he meant. But Philip was in love with her and she knew it, which no doubt allowed her to exert a certain amount of control over him when the need arose.

 

 

That's chilling. I love it.

 

Though I don't know how true it really is. Philip's like Henry--he always seems more docile because he's not in your face about his needs. But really he'd just do what he wanted. 

[Bannon]

If you're expecting puppies and rainbows, you're certainly watching a different show from the electrifying one that I'm watching.  There's nothing about any of this that will end happily for ANY of these characters, including Elizabeth.  it's all very dark and hopeless, not the least because of the fact that the Soviet Union will be falling in a mere eight years.  Neither Elizabeth nor Philip will be getting exactly what they want, or even ANYTHING that they want.  

Unfortunately, for anyone watching this show with an eye towards a sliver of realism, it is all puppies and rainbows for the KGB in Washington D.C., in that the FBI and CIA are composed of people whose cumulative IQ may not reach 3 figures. I watch this show for unintentional humor now, and this week didn't disappoint, what with the CIA, bringing in Afghans involved in a top secret mission, has them dressed in full boat Mujahideen garb as they traipse around a Washinton D.C. hotel! HA! What, all the CIA safe houses, or, hell, military bases, were booked? For added effect, they all should have been carrying AK-47s!

 

I'm pretty sure Clark isn't going to kill Martha, and his big reveal will succeed in bringing her knowingly and willingly into the fold, whereupon she'll be A Double Agent in Love, until Philip lets it slip that he has another wife, and kids, living a few Metro stops away, and then Martha will become A Woman Wronged, and say, "Clark, I could put up with your acts of espionage and occasional murder in service to a foreign government, and I could even stand it when you didn't put the toilet seat down, but I am shocked, SHOCKED, that you have not been honest with me regarding marital fidelity! I am officially off the Treason Bus!" Hijinks ensue.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Bannon

[Chaos Theory]

I don't think Clarke is going to kill Martha. I think eventually someone else will try (maybe the guy who is watching her apartment for Clarke) and she will end up killing him. Her gun hasn't come into play yet I think it will soon. I think Clarke rrvealing the Philip within is his last chance to save her life. He may not love her but he never like killing people unnecessarily. He is trying to control the situation.

[DrSpaceman]

She'll travel with fake documents. There will never be any record of her trip. 

OK, well before i was answering questions about "what about the gap in her history later"......if she is trravelling with fake documents, shouldn't matter then. 

 

My only point is that if I am Paige, or Phillip, I wouldn't trust the KGB at face value sending Paige with Elizabeth on a trip back to Russia to meet her grandmother with no other ulterior motive other than just getting to know her history and answer her questions.  They likely have more in mind that just that. 

[Bannon]

So does a district attorney who prosecutes mobsters also become a hideous parent the moment he or she chooses to conceive? How about an undercover cop? An FBI agent?

I am unaware of any prosecutors or undercover agents having children because their superior ordered them to, because it was believed that doing so would make them better prosecutors or undercover agents. I do think you likely are a pretty crappy parent if you choose to work undercover when you have children, and live apart from them for years as Stan Beeman did. You definitely are crappy and hideous beyond description, if you work undercover against people who would kill your children, if they knew your identity, and you continue to openly live with your children. Given I can't think of single instance of any prosecutor's children being targeted in this country, I think we can safely say it isn't really a risk to your chidren to be a prosecutor.

[DrSpaceman]

The KGB has not indicated at all that this is a primary concern. She hasn't told, there's no reason to think she's more about to tell now than she was last week. She's going to the USSR because Philip thinks she needs to meet family. The Centre were the ones who wanted her told and they want P&E to now step up on indoctrinating her into the cause.

She is acting out, asking all sorts of suspicous questions to P+E no matter who is around, she is not hiding her displeasure with what she has found out and while she has not TOLD anyone she is also not acting like someone trying to actively keep it a secret very much.  Just because we don't see the KGB indicating this is a concern does not mean much, they are not likely to tell Phillip especially if they were concerned.  Elizabeth could easily be communicating what is going on with the family to them and not telling Phillip, she did this before when she expressed concern over phillip's decidation to the cause so I have no reason to think she wouldn't do the same with Paige. 

 

Plus the indoctrination, if this is their main concern now, they may have planned all along to happen in Russia and not america. 

 

I wouldn't take anything the KGB is doing as straightforward or them being completely open with P+E about what they are planning, especially a trip back to Russia, or wherever they end up

[Chaos Theory]

What I was thinking during the Afgham story; Hey America wasn't always "The Great Satan". The Afghanis were once our friends against the Big Bad Soviets.

[shura]

It's only a truthful assessment/threat because you, as the parent, have decided to place your offspring in danger of death, because you decided you have greater loyalty to the Soviet State than you do to your child. Elizabeth and Phillip became hideous parents the day they obeyed an order to have children, as a means to strengthen their covers.

 

They are responsible for creating the circumstances, no doubt. But how is it a threat to explain them to Paige at this point? Is "I left a live wire down in the basement, don't touch it, or you'll be killed" a threat? I guess, to me, the word "threat" means "some unpleasant, but optional, retribution I'm going to inflict on you if you do X". There is nothing optional here, nor anything fully controlled by P&E -- there will be unpleasant consequences for Paige if she does not shut up. That's just the reality of the situation.

[Ellaria]

I'm pretty sure Clark isn't going to kill Martha, and his big reveal will succeed in bringing her knowingly and willingly into the fold, whereupon she'll be A Double Agent in Love, until Philip lets it slip that he has another wife, and kids, living a few Metro stops away, and then Martha will become A Woman Wronged, and say, "Clark, I could put up with your acts of espionage and occasional murder in service to a foreign government, and I could even stand it when you didn't put the toilet seat down, but I am shocked, SHOCKED, that you have not been honest with me regarding marital fidelity! I am officially off the Treason Bus!" Hijinks ensue.

 

I would applaud that turn of events.

 

I don't think Clarke is going to kill Martha. I think eventually someone else will try (maybe the guy who is watching her apartment for Clarke) and she will end up killing him. Her gun hasn't come into play yet I think it will soon. I think Clarke rrvealing the Philip within is his last chance to save her life. He may not love her but he never like killing people unnecessarily. He is trying to control the situation.

 

Yes - the gun has to come into play in the next episode and I agree that the unintentional target will be Hans.

 

It's only a truthful assessment/threat because you, as the parent, have decided to place your offspring in danger of death, because you decided you have greater loyalty to the Soviet State than you do to your child. Elizabeth and Phillip became hideous parents the day they obeyed an order to have children, as a means to strengthen their covers.

 

It is not the decision to have children "as a means to strengthen their covers" that deeply troubles me. It is the fact that they continue to do what they do (murdering innocents, random sex, leaving the kids to fend for themselves) now that they have children. They put themselves in danger of being killed or imprisoned on a regular basis. Elizabeth is OK with bringing her daughter into this life style. Really? I can't think of a "cause" that I would prioritize over my child's life and well-being.

[Bannon]

The people of Afghanistan have never been monolithic. We aren't "The Great Satan" today to all the people in that country, or even most of them. There's a reason why the Taliban was overthrown in  a few weeks at the end of 2001 and beginning of 2002, without a huge American military personnel presence.

[sistermagpie]

At this moment, Paige HATES Elizabeth - and if hate is too strong of a word - then very seriously mistrusts her - and yet you think that Elizabeth should/would give Paige that "truthful assessment of existing circumstances" - and that is going to help resolve their differences.

 

 

Philip actually took care of this--but not as a threat. He's been trying to be straightforward with her, answer the things she wants/needs to know without making it about what he needs. And what he did was to apologize for stating the obvious if she thought it was condescending, but that if she told anyone her parents would go to jail for good. So she knew that, and, it was implied, it was up to her what to do. She had the facts and knew the consequences. I think that's more the way this idea is being approached.

 

So rather than making it a threat it was more an expression of trust. She knew their lives were in her hands, with no hints that it would be hurting herself as well to get rid of them.

 

She is acting out, asking all sorts of suspicous questions to P+E no matter who is around, she is not hiding her displeasure with what she has found out and while she has not TOLD anyone she is also not acting like someone trying to actively keep it a secret very much.

 

 

She's really not being that bad in terms of questions or acting out. But regardless, not only has the KGB not once said they were worried about it even when Claudia and Gabriel was alone, they show the opposite attitude when we see them. I don't think we should assume that Elizabeth is secretly reporting a totally different attitude to the Centre than she is with Philip now that they're in this together.

 

And what is the point of having indoctrination happen in Russia? It goes against what we know of their plans here. They want the parents involved. They want her nurtured by her parents because that's the relationship she has. Why send her to a scary foreign country with strangers? Why would this make Communism more palatable to her than Communism explained by the people who love her and who she loves sitting in their familiar kitchen?  I know the KGB can be stupid but this is playing into American anti-Soviet fantasies even more than the secret Russian parents do and that's saying something.

 

The KGB isn't always straightforward, but this is taking it to a whole other level where they're giving orders while secretly wanting the opposite. It's a domestic story, not the story of teenagers in foreign countries indoctrinated by people who understand her far less than her parents. 

[Mrs peel]

I don't understand what the Centre could possibly be wanting to use Paige for as a 15 year old. Things are moving too slow? Meaning they need her to take up spying for them right now? What could she even do?

 

I assumed the whole program was intended for inside access to government agencies or what not, but with an adult, obviously.

I would guess that the reasoning is to start the process of grooming her background for adult work.  So what should she focus on in school, what college, what political/lifestyle background should she adopt "now" so it looks normal years later?  The 1960's British KGB spies developed years of Tory/conservative/glorious England background before/during their work as spies.

[Blakeston]

I noted that even in the diner Gabriel was saying this was bad for Philip and Elizabeth because "she'd been so much better with him" before this came up. I wondered what that meant exactly. I mean, obviously I know that they'd fallen in love so I knew the real story, but were Elizabeth's issues with Philip an ongoing concern that he was worried about?

 

I took that to mean that Gabriel thought Elizabeth - the true believer - was more effective at keeping Philip in line before they were ordered to turn Paige.

 

Perhaps I'd just be a terrible parent, I don't know, but I don't understand why P&E don't just put the Fear of God (heh) into Paige, which I can't imagine would fail to shut her right the hell down with a quickness. It's not like they'd have to be mean about it, though I think  twinge of assholishness might actually work wonders. Just sit her down and have one of those "You want the truth? Alright, here's some brutal truth for you..." moments. Scare her straight. Because I think she's old enough and smart enough to intuit that what they're telling her is true. Something along the lines of...

 

Look, you need to calm the hell down right this minute and come to terms with what you now know. I know you're pissed off right now, maybe to the point that you don't even care what would happen to us if you insist on continuing to be a loose cannon here. But you need to think about what would happen to you, what would happen to your brother, if you don't get a hold of yourself. Because, newsflash, in case you haven't thought about it yet, there are any number of people on both sides of this conflict who are perfectly fine with killing anyone who even might be considered a possible threat, just in case. You need to understand the stakes here.

 

This would probably scare her into silence, but it also might scare her away from volunteering for the cause. If you want her to think that you're working for peace around the world, it's not going to go over well if you acknowledge that you have comrades who will kill her if she talks.