S05.E22: Reunion Part 3

[CookieBud]

Kim's problem is Kim.  No one else.  She makes choices and they are bad ones. She chooses the words that come out of her mouth, she chooses the drugs and alcohol that go in that same mouth.  No one forced her to go to the bar, no one forced her to order a drink and no one held her down and poured the drink down her throat. This is a person who needs to hit rock bottom before there is any chance in hell of her even wanting to get help.  I'm glad the other housewives are stepping back from covering her rum soaked butt and letting her sink or swim on her own.  I do feel bad for those who love her, her kids and family, but I can't muster any kind of sympathy for Kim in the least.  She is abusive to anyone who disagrees with her and she is not fun to watch.  Kyle needs to be supportive of her kids but protect herself and her own family from the toxicity that is Kim Richards.

 

Kim's behavior on the third part of the reunion was just plain reprehensible.  She laughed as a grown woman apologized, again, and broke down in tears.  That joy at other people's pain seems to be the real Kim Richards, whom I sadly suspect just wants everyone else to be as miserable as she is.  I loved that LVP and Kyle seems to be back on track and I've totally enjoyed the addition of Eileen and Lisa Rinna, both of whom I've watched on Days for forever.  Brandi needs to go because she offers nothing but misery on this show.  She is no longer a fun, go-to girl but rather a mean middle-schooler who has to rain on everyone's parade if things don't go her way.  She also hurts my ears.  I hope Yolanda gets well, but offscreen.

 

As for Kim's future on the show, I have gone back and forth as to whether Bravo will give her one more season to do a redemption arc, or cut her loose because she is such a financial liability to them.  The recent blaming of Bravo for the fall off the wagon does not bode well for their relationship.  No boss wants to be blamed because his employee has issues and Kim may just decide to press a law suit against them.  Who knows?  I'm kind of leaning to her being gone for at least a year for Bravo to see if she gets her crap together and can come back in a friends kind of role.  And for the record, I don't get if she gets a deal or not for the drinking, bathroom hogging, disruptive behavior, but I hope she does have consequences for the battery on the police officer.  She should never get away with physically putting any part of her body on any part of anyone else's body.

[PreposterousISTA]

I am trying to remember a season with Paris in it   Portia looks about three and Kathy looks about 30 pounds lighter.  Is it possible this is a wedding or other event?

 

 

 

EXTRA Kathy Hilton Fashion Show @ The Grove

 

 

 

 

 

[zoeysmom]

EXTRA Kathy Hilton Fashion Show @ The Grove

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you.  Kim looked good in aqua.  Nice seeing the cousins together.

[zoeysmom]

So I found this episode of Paris Hilton's show-at about the 6:30 a minute mark Paris goes to her mother's house to discuss Brooke Mueller who has fallen off the wagon and Paris doesn't want to be associated with her and be accused of the same behavior.  All I can say is Kathy is a bit harsh talking about how Paris her eldest disappointed her and how her mother thought they should be perfect in public.  http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xk5ywj_the-world-according-to-paris-every-day-is-my-birthday-finale-s01-e08_shortfilms  This would have been filmed prior to Kim going to rehab.

 

Kathy Hilton is a tough bird.

[WireWrap]

So I found this episode of Paris Hilton's show-at about the 6:30 a minute mark Paris goes to her mother's house to discuss Brooke Mueller who has fallen off the wagon and Paris doesn't want to be associated with her and be accused of the same behavior.  All I can say is Kathy is a bit harsh talking about how Paris her eldest disappointed her and how her mother thought they should be perfect in public.  http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xk5ywj_the-world-according-to-paris-every-day-is-my-birthday-finale-s01-e08_shortfilms  This would have been filmed prior to Kim going to rehab.

 

Kathy Hilton is a tough bird.

I have to laugh though, Kathy at 1 point starts in with the "what about me", "what about my feelings" ! It is really something all 3 sisters say/use. LOL

[supermum]

Here's a Kim Richards blast from the not too distant past

 

[FozzyBear]

IMO Kyle's reaction to Brandi is the reaction, I believe, most people have with half of what Brandi says, on national television. It's that Brandi thinks bragging about her behavior, no discretion, is cool. Do we ever see Mohamed openly bragging about how many young women he's "had?" Brandi is just gross, and if I had to deal with her, I too would have that look on my face just like Kyle. I also think because the moving guy was in still in college and Amsterdam guy was Max Todd's childhood friend, it exaggerated a theme of crossing the line the way Brandi likes to do, or have us believe she does...

If I were Kyle, I wouldn't speak to her, ever again.

I don't think anyone thinks that Brandi is THE problem, just that many think, like Kyle, LVP, Eileen & Rinna that Brandi's actions are exacerbating the problems with Kyle. Example, poker night, hearing Brandi say Kyle wants Kim to fail, and again at the gay mixer. Brandi isn't the main problem at all, but she's contributing to their current angst and trying to get in between them to have someone on her team.

It just cracks me up what a scorched earth policy the Richards Sisters have about not liking people. When they unfriend you they really unfriend you and EVERYTHING you do becomes suspect. It seems to be a family trait. Once they hate you, watch the fuck out. Nixon took his enemies list less seriously than these gals.

[RHOSingapore]

I'd like to thank everyone for such awesome snark here….my dad recently passed away, and my mom (who's been living with us since his passing) and I have found some real solace in those idiot Housewives….and more especially in the comments of you awesome posters….My mom has macular degeneration, and she's unable to read your comments, so after each episode, I haul out my computer and read all of your snark aloud…..as well as the touching commentary from those who bravely share their own trials.  Thank you all for being so funny and so touching…..my mom and I appreciate all of your comments from the snug comfort of our quilt covered sofa (hey - it's Boston, and it's still COLD around here)!  All of our love to you all!  :-)

[GreatKazu]

So I found this episode of Paris Hilton's show-at about the 6:30 a minute mark Paris goes to her mother's house to discuss Brooke Mueller who has fallen off the wagon and Paris doesn't want to be associated with her and be accused of the same behavior.  All I can say is Kathy is a bit harsh talking about how Paris her eldest disappointed her and how her mother thought they should be perfect in public.  http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xk5ywj_the-world-according-to-paris-every-day-is-my-birthday-finale-s01-e08_shortfilms  This would have been filmed prior to Kim going to rehab.

 

Kathy Hilton is a tough bird.

I have mentioned this scene/episode a handful of times whenever it was mentioned Kathy probably didn't want to deal with Kim's addiction or something to that effect.

 

 

Favorite moment? Kyle's sour puss reaction shot when Andy was talking to Brandi about sleeping with younger guys. Seriously, why does that bother her so much?

How can any facial reaction, including a TH reaction, be connected to what is being shown or talked about? There has been mention of the TH facial reactions being edited to fit whatever is being shown on the show. The same could be said of the reunion show. I saw Brandi make all kinds of facial reactions to things supposedly being said by the women, but I didn't read much into those facial expressions because of the Bravo editing.

 

 

Now having said that, this is a snark board and that is what you are going to get when you come here. You can't go to a casino and complain about the gambling.

nc social worker - LOL I know, right?

 

 

For me, it's the asshole part that brings on my desire to shame and mock, not the addict part.

 

 

Not all addicts are irresponsible, unreliable, narcissistic balls of vileness like Kim.

IA.

I'd like to thank everyone for such awesome snark here….my dad recently passed away, and my mom (who's been living with us since his passing) and I have found some real solace in those idiot Housewives….and more especially in the comments of you awesome posters….My mom has macular degeneration, and she's unable to read your comments, so after each episode, I haul out my computer and read all of your snark aloud…..as well as the touching commentary from those who bravely share their own trials.  Thank you all for being so funny and so touching…..my mom and I appreciate all of your comments from the snug comfort of our quilt covered sofa (hey - it's Boston, and it's still COLD around here)!  All of our love to you all!  :-)

My condolences to you and your mother. I am truly sorry for your loss.

 

Yes, this board has me sometimes laughing so hard, I have tears coming down my face. I think humor can help many during any difficult time. I know it helps me at times.

 

Be strong! Thoughts are with you.

[missy jo]

Kim's behavior on the third part of the reunion was just plain reprehensible.  She laughed as a grown woman apologized, again, and broke down in tears.  That joy at other people's pain seems to be the real Kim Richards

 

 

Her modus operandi seems to be: Break the person down, then either pretend to comfort them or magnanimously accept their apology. For ex., Lisa R on this episode, and Kyle in Palm Springs.

 

The laughter's almost worse, in my opinion. "She's an expert, ha ha ha," at hearing about Lisa R's deaths in the family due to addiction (epidode 2) and "Oh look, she's gonna cry now," also to Lisa R, in this episode. She claims to be an actress, but she can't even "act" sympathetic.

[motorcitymom65]

Thanks WireWrap. :) I like you, too. Here's a picture of LVP and a llama to celebrate our relationship.

...Damn, she looks fantastic there.

Have said it before and I will say it again. Lisa should ALWAYS wear that color. She looks beyond fab. 

I'd like to thank everyone for such awesome snark here….my dad recently passed away, and my mom (who's been living with us since his passing) and I have found some real solace in those idiot Housewives….and more especially in the comments of you awesome posters….My mom has macular degeneration, and she's unable to read your comments, so after each episode, I haul out my computer and read all of your snark aloud…..as well as the touching commentary from those who bravely share their own trials.  Thank you all for being so funny and so touching…..my mom and I appreciate all of your comments from the snug comfort of our quilt covered sofa (hey - it's Boston, and it's still COLD around here)!  All of our love to you all!  :-)

I love messages like this...the ones that remind us of the good stuff.  Now when I read these funny comments I'm going to picture you lovingly reading them to your mom. I hope they make you both laugh your ass off!   Virtual hugs to you both from Detroit. 

[Sincerely Yours]

Kim had various people saying to her all season that they were there for her if she needed any help at any time.

 

And she ridiculed them, tried to humiliate them and threw obstacles ("blah, blah, blah"; "zip it!"; "I am not discussing this!") in their way.

 

Blah, blah, blah....

Apples and oranges. Sometimes its about Kim's addiction and then simple comparisons are made out of context or as if we are talking about teenagers on the schoolyard talking in terms of black and white "mean girl". The balance is off regarding context, examples, provocation, history, appropriateness, inappropriateness, privacy, justification, imposition, relevance and levels of intensity.

 

Kim's dismissal of the ladies in the kitchen was much less offensive, to me, than the way their "concern" of her addiction was handled all season. Plus I call bullshit on the whole season's worth of "concern". They didn't want to be subjected to it. Plain and simple. IMO, that's what it all boiled down to. Hey if that's how they felt fine. Noone should have to put up with whatever but it was the cloak of "concern" that they donned so that their unwavering needling seemed legite. Spare me. 

[Sincerely Yours]

Yes, there are. Anybody who has been around the disease can tell you horror stories about the shit people say -- being hectored and intruded upon with statements about the cancer being the person's fault (bad habit, negative thinking, too much stress, etc) and needing to eat better, take this supplement or do an obscure treatment -- or visualize better, or do Louise Hay/Bernie Siegal/etc -- cancer patients lose friends, family, are rejected, lectured, blamed and mocked -- and their disease is not an infectious one, like alcoholism is -- so again, using the disease model; cancer patients have had it much worse (imo) than Kim Richards,  handling any snark here at PTV

And most people would find it completely uncalled for, insensitive, rude and completely inappropriate. I think most people would agree.

[Sincerely Yours]

This brought tears to my eyes, thanks for sharing, NC --  for those people to keep fighting on, at that age -- glorious.  (And to all the people here who have mentioned being in recovery, just wanted to say, you have only my admiration. Getting sober is one of the highest achievements, imo, any human can attain and it is a victory that we don't really celebrate in a manner equal to the achievement. Maybe because the card would be difficult to write  { "Not raising a glass to your recovery!" doesn't have that festive ring :) but getting sober -- and getting back up after a relapse and owning the stumble and getting sober all over again -- that is the work of a hero.) 

 

And Found a Peanut -- thanks for sharing that (and  a big bouquet of flowers to you for handling that shit:)

 

ETA: 

..I think stories like yours, Jenny, are part of the reason misplaced and indulgent sympathy for Kim Richards (not seen here, elsewhere)  and how she is handling her disease makes me so crazy. All those feelings should be reserved for people like you -- people fighting on and fighting back,  and being brave as hell -- whether it's alcoholism,  cancer or AIDS, that's the road Kim should be taking (and could take, given her family and financial resources). And she doesn't because at core, she' s not just battling the disease of alcoholism, she's battling the disease of being Kim Richards.

Much admiration!!

But there is something to be said for unconditional.

I need to believe that word still means something in a world that's changed so much.

Advocating less compassion from those who have it to give? I don't get that philosophy...

[motorcitymom65]

Oh Kim. Shut up. Nothing Kyle instagrams will change the fact that your dog is dangerous.

Favorite moment? Kyle's sour puss reaction shot when Andy was talking to Brandi about sleeping with younger guys. Seriously, why does that bother her so much? What's it to her if Brandi dates college guys? How many dinner parties did she happily sit through with Mohammad and his series of child-brides? Also Brandi is not the problem between Kim and Kyle. Ugg, please no more Richards sisters. I hate them both.

I actually thought Kyle's reaction was pretty subdued, but then you should have seen the look on my face.

 

I don't think it's about Brandi sleeping with younger guys. I think it is the cumulative effect of Brandi being disgusting. She seems to think that the fact that she can attract younger guys and just bang them at will makes her somehow special. It doesn't. Newsflash for Brandi - it's not that hard to find guys to bang. Young guys, old guys, fat guys, handsome guys. They are everywhere and a lot of them aren't that particular when it comes to a one night stand. 

 

Brandi is disgusting because she talks about them on TV and uses terms like "beautiful cock". Mohamed might be just as gross - I have no idea. I do know that if he had been the one on camera sitting at that restaurant describing a 23 year old girl as having a beautiful pussy, I would think he was disgusting as well. If he were at a party yelling out "finger banging", I would think he is disgusting. 

 

Brandi is especially pointing the finger this season at Kyle for apparently (in Brandi's mind) implying that she isn't a good mother. Kyle has a right to roll her eyes at this accusation when Brandi is on TV talking about her sexual exploits. Do they make her a bad mother? I wouldn't think so. Have fun and be safe Brandi. But she does have impressionable young boys at home and constantly talking about such things isn't a good look. 

Edited April 20, 2015 by motorcitymom65

[Satchels of gold]

If the Kim Richards blind item is indeed true, where is the compassion for Kyle? She grew up with the same parents, in the same town and in the same industry. I have my doubts that this is true because of the source but it could be. Should Kyle get even more compassion that she endured such things and didn't turn into an addict. It seems that those urging compassion for Kim have none to give to anyone else.

[Stinamaia]

Much admiration!!

But there is something to be said for unconditional.

I need to believe that word still means something in a world that's changed so much.

Advocating less compassion from those who have it to give? I don't get that philosophy...

Yes, I agree.

 

I understand these women showing compassion by suggesting methods for Kim to help herself.  I also know that these kind of suggestions can be annoying.  I've been annoying to people, and others have annoyed me in this regard.   Recently, when sharing my worry about my cat continuing to lose weight despite being on medication, the woman I was talking to made all sorts of suggestions which I of course had tried and actually done even more.  It seemed to be hard to convince her that I really was doing what could be done, but I understood she was acting out of concern and a desire to help.   So I get how the recipient of "help" could be annoyed.  And let me say that anyone who says to a cancer patient that a positive attitude  is important to recovery -- well, words can express my dismay.  I agree that maybe the best thing is to say, This must be really difficult.  I'm on your side and please call me if you need anything because I want to help in anyway you need.   And then keep in touch and listen sympathetically.    I do think that the women were really concerned but also got annoyed with Kim.  That's pretty reasonable.

[Stinamaia]

If the Kim Richards blind item is indeed true, where is the compassion for Kyle? She grew up with the same parents, in the same town and in the same industry. I have my doubts that this is true because of the source but it could be. Should Kyle get even more compassion that she endured such things and didn't turn into an addict. It seems that those urging compassion for Kim have none to give to anyone else.

 

Compassion can be given to both freely for different reason, imo.  Both deserve compassion for different reasons -- and not just compassion, but understanding as well.  They both are acting out of pain and hurt but in different ways.  I wouldn't be friends with either of them, but not because of this mean back and forth between them, but a multitude of other reasons.  Of course, in this hypothetical I'm assuming I had enough money to ever even meet them!  :D

Edited April 20, 2015 by Stinamaia

[WireWrap]

Yes, I agree.

 

I understand these women showing compassion by suggesting methods for Kim to help herself.  I also know that these kind of suggestions can be annoying.  I've been annoying to people, and others have annoyed me in this regard.   Recently, when sharing my worry about my cat continuing to lose weight despite being on medication, the woman I was talking to made all sorts of suggestions which I of course had tried and actually done even more.  It seemed to be hard to convince her that I really was doing what could be done, but I understood she was acting out of concern and a desire to help.   So I get how the recipient of "help" could be annoyed.  And let me say that anyone who says to a cancer patient that a positive attitude  is important to recovery -- well, words can express my dismay.  I agree that maybe the best thing is to say, This must be really difficult.  I'm on your side and please call me if you need anything because I want to help in anyway you need.   And then keep in touch and listen sympathetically.    I do think that the women were really concerned but also got annoyed with Kim.  That's pretty reasonable.

IMO, I think it boils down to people wanting to help but not really knowing how to help or what to say. Factor in the knowledge that this person, Kim, said on camera 3 seasons ago, that her Dr. told her she was close to dying had she not quit drinking when she did. Are they supposed to keep their mouths shut and watch her OD/die or do they risk angering Kim in an attempt to reach out and help and when do they back off or even should they back off if Kim's Dr. was correct? Who would keep quiet if they knew someone had a treatable/curable cancer and then did nothing?

[Stinamaia]

IMO, I think it boils down to people wanting to help but not really knowing how to help or what to say. Factor in the knowledge that this person, Kim, said on camera 3 seasons ago, that her Dr. told her she was close to dying had she not quit drinking when she did. Are they supposed to keep their mouths shut and watch her OD/die or do they risk angering Kim in an attempt to reach out and help and when do they back off or even should they back off if Kim's Dr. was correct? Who would keep quiet if they knew someone had a treatable/curable cancer and then did nothing?

Well, and succinctly said.  

 

One time a friend told me that she had taken a gun from her parents' house and was going to kill herself -- time of carrying out this plan was uncertain.  I, of course, called her mother who I had never met and didn't have any idea who I was.    My friend was really mad at me as I knew she would be, but I would rather lose her friendship than lose her life.  Also, I knew that would devastate her parents.  So, we did remain friends because when she calmed down, she understood.  So yes.  sometimes you have to risk alienation.   The women couldn't know all the history when they spoke.  In hindsight, I'm sure although they didn't regret the motivation, they realized the approach was counterproductive.

[Sincerely Yours]

Yes, I agree.

 

I understand these women showing compassion by suggesting methods for Kim to help herself.  I also know that these kind of suggestions can be annoying.  I've been annoying to people, and others have annoyed me in this regard.   Recently, when sharing my worry about my cat continuing to lose weight despite being on medication, the woman I was talking to made all sorts of suggestions which I of course had tried and actually done even more.  It seemed to be hard to convince her that I really was doing what could be done, but I understood she was acting out of concern and a desire to help.   So I get how the recipient of "help" could be annoyed.  And let me say that anyone who says to a cancer patient that a positive attitude  is important to recovery -- well, words can express my dismay.  I agree that maybe the best thing is to say, This must be really difficult.  I'm on your side and please call me if you need anything because I want to help in anyway you need.   And then keep in touch and listen sympathetically.    I do think that the women were really concerned but also got annoyed with Kim.  That's pretty reasonable.

Simply put and beautifully expressed. Nice to see that it isn't that much of a stretch to understand that concern can turn rather annoying if not done in a sensitive manner. During the season I found some of the approaches as somewhat unknowingly insensitive (and I'm being nice but just for arguments sake) so I do think that it's not wrong to at least acknowledge where Kim's animosity was coming from. It's not like she was on the attack each and every time she was in the presence of these women.

[Higgins]

Yes, I agree.

 

I understand these women showing compassion by suggesting methods for Kim to help herself.  I also know that these kind of suggestions can be annoying.  I've been annoying to people, and others have annoyed me in this regard.   Recently, when sharing my worry about my cat continuing to lose weight despite being on medication, the woman I was talking to made all sorts of suggestions which I of course had tried and actually done even more.  It seemed to be hard to convince her that I really was doing what could be done, but I understood she was acting out of concern and a desire to help.   So I get how the recipient of "help" could be annoyed.  And let me say that anyone who says to a cancer patient that a positive attitude  is important to recovery -- well, words can express my dismay.  I agree that maybe the best thing is to say, This must be really difficult.  I'm on your side and please call me if you need anything because I want to help in anyway you need.   And then keep in touch and listen sympathetically.    I do think that the women were really concerned but also got annoyed with Kim.  That's pretty reasonable.

You are so strong to a cancer patient or parent of a child cancer is very annoying. Like we have a choice. My daughter had cancer as a toddler and I heard that all the time. I knew people meant well but, think about it, it is really stupid. People would say, I could never be so strong and I'm thinking, what's the alternative?

[film noire]

And most people would find it completely uncalled for, insensitive, rude and completely inappropriate. I think most people would agree.

 

Yes -- the key, vital difference being: those "inappropriate" things are said to people who are not cavalierly infecting other people with their disease; those things are said to people who *are* actively seeking treatment and trying to get well; and most importantly, those things are being said to people who are not pretending it's everybody else "being mean"  that is causing the cancer to spin out of control.

 

But there is something to be said for unconditional.

 

"Unconditional" for an alcoholic/ addict means more drinking, using, and codependence on the part of the individual mistakenly thinking they are offering unlimited love. We have decades of research proving that. 

[Stinamaia]

You are so strong to a cancer patient or parent of a child cancer is very annoying. Like we have a choice. My daughter had cancer as a toddler and I heard that all the time. I knew people meant well but, think about it, it is really stupid. People would say, I could never be so strong and I'm thinking, what's the alternative?

 

And also please recognize that sometimes people are strong, and sometimes they fall apart, put themselves together and are strong again.  It's like grief.  You don't know how someone is grieving because you aren't there when they are crying every time they are in private.   But, I think even when annoyed by comments, most of us realize the people mean it from the goodness of their hearts.   That's what Kim couldn't do because the questions and concerns seemed to her as if they were trying to pierce the veil she had over her using.  That's what provoked her anger which went way beyond annoyance.

Yes -- the key, vital difference being: those "inappropriate" things are said to people who are not cavalierly infecting other people with their disease; those things are said to people who *are* actively seeking treatment and trying to get well; and most importantly, those things are being said to people who are not pretending it's everybody else "being mean"  that is causing the cancer to spin out of control.

"Unconditional" for an alcoholic/ addict means more drinking, using, and codependence on the part of the individual mistakenly thinking they are offering unlimited love. We have decades of research proving that. 

There's one thing about having compassion for someone suffering from addiction, and then there's dealing with really bad and hurtful behavior.   I think it's very difficult.  Optimally, I'd like to be able to say, I'm going to ignore what you are saying and doing because I know this is because you are using.  Rant and rave all you want.  I'm not sure that's possible outside my fantasy.   

[Sincerely Yours]

"Unconditional" for an alcoholic/ addict means more drinking, using, and codependence on the part of the individual mistakenly thinking they are offering unlimited love. We have decades of research proving that. 

Offering love can never be a mistake. It's how you offer it. It's knowing how to offer it. The vehicle used. It's trying to find out the best way to offer it and making that effort. If it's by steering clear then by all means do that. If it's by not contributing to the mess again go for it. The only mistake is sticking around to save face and then allowing resentment to taint any kind of healthy interactions. Kim is not the only variable in her battle. She is the only one with the most power to fight it purposely and productively but she in not the only variable. Right, wrong, black and white she doesn't fight those demons in a serene place or in a place with no distractions or pitfalls. There's interference, bad decisions, circumstances and other details that contribute to how well or how badly she does in her struggle. Yes Kim is responsible for herself and no one else holds that on their shoulders but I don't think minimizing the effects of those around her and her lack of healing does anything to help Kim move forward in her journey. Actually I'm inclined to believe that the constant message that its her and only her that should bear responsibility for everything including the toxic contributions Kyle and whatever enablers in her life make are strong reasons why it seems that her efforts have waned, that is if they ever truly ever got off the ground to begin with. Who knows? 

Edited April 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[Sincerely Yours]

 

There's one thing about having compassion for someone suffering from addiction, and then there's dealing with really bad and hurtful behavior.   I think it's very difficult.  Optimally, I'd like to be able to say, I'm going to ignore what you are saying and doing because I know this is because you are using.  Rant and rave all you want.  I'm not sure that's possible outside my fantasy.   

I would think just not engaging would be the most commonplace action and not as difficult as one would suggest. Not once, aside from Poker Night did I find Kim's interactions impossible to side step. I mean even with minimal effort I thought all the public situations and gatherings had the makings of getting through them drama scene free. Just my observations. I'm talking about the other women not Kyle and I'm talking about before someone's "concern" set off a back and forth to begin with.

 

ETA, of course I'm talking about the situations on the show. Not suggesting it would be easy to not engage in more extreme situations when dealing with an addict but I'm with you on the idea that even intense ranting and ugly behavior can be met with cool heads, coping skills and de-escalation methods. Tall order I know but still possible especially if the addict in question is a loved one.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[Stinamaia]

I would think just not engaging would be the most commonplace action and not as difficult as one would suggest. Not once, aside from Poker Night did I find Kim's interactions impossible to side step. I mean even with minimal effort I thought all the public situations and gatherings had the makings of getting through them drama scene free. Just my observations. I'm talking about the other women not Kyle and I'm talking about before someone's "concern" set off a back and forth to begin with.

 

ETA, of course I'm talking about the situations on the show. Not suggesting it would be easy to not engage in more extreme situations when dealing with an addict but I'm with you on the idea that even intense ranting and ugly behavior can be met with cool heads, coping skills and de-escalation methods. Tall order I know but still possible especially if the addict in question is a loved one.

Oh my god yes.  I have never been in any social situation where people yelled and screamed at one another.  I've always wondered about this unrestrained yelling we see on the show.   Even when I'm having a private argument with someone, I rarely yell or shout.   I think that's why i like LVP and (omg now I've blanked on her name -- the Dutch woman.)   I really don't like to be yelled at either.  I think I would just get very quiet in those situations and then get fired from the show.  :)

[GreatKazu]

There is a huge difference between giving love and support versus enabling. Kim wants to be enabled. She is so angry when telling Kyle to leave her alone, to tend to her own family, but then she demands that Kyle be there for her. Mixed messages.

 

I don't think Kim has ever said exactly what it is she wants from Kyle, that she supposedly gets from Kathy. I don't even think Kathy gives Kim anything different, it is just that Kim loves to play one sister against the other.

 

 

I knew people meant well but, think about it, it is really stupid. People would say, I could never be so strong and I'm thinking, what's the alternative?

I would receive that very comment when dealing with my parent's cancer or other issues affecting myself or my family. To answer your question, there are plenty of people who just cannot handle devastating news or dealing with a loved one who is dying. They fall apart, they become depressed, they are in denial sometimes, there are many reactions I could list. Not everyone is woven from the same cloth. It is also not black and white. Some people could fall apart at devastating news, but find the will and the strength within to cope. Others could be strong at first, and then little by little find that they cannot handle a particular situation anymore. It is not a weakness, in my view. Just people being human.

 

 

With Kim, her overall issue was denial. I think the women looked upon Kim as the addict that she was, not the person Kim proclaimed to be: sober for three years. If Kim had been sober for three years, their approach may have been different for poker night. If there is one thing that I learned from the people in my life who are/were addicts, when you are around them, you know all their dirty secrets and you know when they aren't sober. On television, we don't see all of Kim's dirty secrets. There are likely more instances of Kim's addiction that we didn't get to see this season.

 

As far as not engaging, isn't that what LisaR did after Kim kicked her in the limo? Many people wouldn't take that lightly or ignore it.

Edited April 20, 2015 by GreatKazu

[Sincerely Yours]

Oh my god yes.  I have never been in any social situation where people yelled and screamed at one another.  I've always wondered about this unrestrained yelling we see on the show.   Even when I'm having a private argument with someone, I rarely yell or shout.   I think that's why i like LVP and (omg now I've blanked on her name -- the Dutch woman.)   I really don't like to be yelled at either.  I think I would just get very quiet in those situations and then get fired from the show.  :)

And therein lies some of my disdain for the women of this show. Knowing that treating these situations in the manner that most would in similar situations isn't what makes the show therefore allowing themselves to move full steam ahead in such ugly behavior to that degree. Yuck! Yes Kim is stupid and 100 other things but I don't care how many finger points, bathroom trips or verbal outbursts. Me is staying out of the very real tragedy that is Kim Richards addiction and dysfunctional family if I were a cast member. Pass me the want ads and a red pen. Not hard if you have integrity or morals. Yolanda resisted and LVP to a degree although some side eye to her as well but still.

[SwordQueen]

"Unconditional" for an alcoholic/ addict means more drinking, using, and codependence on the part of the individual mistakenly thinking they are offering unlimited love. We have decades of research proving that. 

 

Very true.  I also balk at the notion of unconditional love under all circumstances.  I don't believe that feelings or relationships are all that unconditional.  Most are quite conditional.  People generally can't force themselves to feel something they don't for someone, so when the feelings stop, they stop.  And relationships should be conditional because otherwise they become codependent and toxic.  Having conditions and limitations and boundaries is healthy, imo, and often love and conditions go hand in hand.  Now this is just from my own experiences in trying to unconditionally love a couple of people in hopes that they will one day be able to not only love themselves but also love me, in return.  Doesn't work, have the scars and therapy bills to prove it.  lol  

 

I'm not able to write out anything very coherent right now, but It's a tough place to be in when you want to help someone who doesn't want to be helped and you care about someone who doesn't want to be cared about.  I've been on both ends of that tug-of-war many, many times.  Frustration can flourish between both parties and that's understandable.  It's understandable to me why Kim was angry at them but it's not an excuse as to why she was cruel to them.  She has choices and if she doesn't want to work on recovery, that's fine, self-destruct.  She has free will.  But she can't self-destruct around other people and then become angry and cruel towards them when they have a problem with it.  Kim chooses to put herself in the path of a moving train.  She's going to kill herself and she's doing it publicly and doesn't seem to care who she affects and hurts in the process.  

 

The thing about compassion and empathy is that it goes both ways.  As much as I've been bothered by people "intruding" on my life and my choices (whether I was consciously choosing them or I was unconsciously lead by my illnesses), I can understand that they were concerned and I understand that they, having to be witness to my self-destruction, were in turn affected by it, personally.  I can also understand that I, myself, have felt this way about loved ones when I've worried about their health, happiness, and safety.  So I'm able to have compassion and empathy for those that I'm finding annoying and intrusive, in that moment.  And if I don't want said people annoying me and intruding on my life, I will keep myself, and my self-destruction, away from said people, and I've done that before.

 

Kim does not seem to have this capacity for compassion or empathy and doesn't seem to be able to think outside of herself in order to find common ground with others.  I would love to ask her if she worries about her son's health and happiness and how it affects her to see him go into a downward spiral.  I'd then love to ask her how she thinks he, her other children, Kyle and everyone else who cares for her feels when she heads into her own downward spiral.  I wonder if she'd be able to connect the dots and realize that people are affected by the choices she makes when she's around them and they care enough about her to risk blacklash, because they only want her to be well.  I truly do not think she she's capable of such thoughts, though.  

 

Kim is the only one responsible for Kim and I don't think it's at all minimizing to say so.  In fact, finding it minimizing and not empowering is a warning sign to me that she's not fully ready to change.  I have never and would never react to another person's concern the way Kim Richards has done, and repeatedly.  She's not a victim of anyone when her choice is to stay in the spotlight and hurt others.  If her environment is toxic for her, she can choose to change it.  She's not in poverty nor is she trapped at home with an abusive spouse or young children.  She has options that many do not have.  In fact, leaving her home and possibly the state and going into long term in-patient treatment would be the best thing for her.  But that would mean taking responsibility for herself and no loner relying on everyone else to carry her.  That would also mean not only admitting she has a substance problem but agreeing to quit all drugs.  She doesn't want to do those things.  Again, her choice and her right.  But other people have the choice and the right to not put up with it and not support her in her chosen lifestyle (or deathstyle, as I think of it).  

[Sincerely Yours]

 

 

As far as not engaging, isn't that what LisaR did after Kim kicked her in the limo? Many people wouldn't take that lightly or ignore it.

LisaR engaged the subject throughout the whole season. No need to have to ignore any of Kim's behavior after Poker night. Behavior that most likely wouldn't have transpired at all if it wasn't constantly brought up time and time again.

[DeeplyShallow]

You are so strong to a cancer patient or parent of a child cancer is very annoying. Like we have a choice. My daughter had cancer as a toddler and I heard that all the time. I knew people meant well but, think about it, it is really stupid. People would say, I could never be so strong and I'm thinking, what's the alternative?

But there is an alternative and that is falling apart, depression, anxiety, avoidance- there are many people who do not have the strength to get through such hardships and I, for one, admire those who do. As a psychologist, I see this everyday. There are people who can summon the strength they need for themselves and for those who depend on them and there are others who run away or succumb without a fight. It happens and it happens a lot. I am happy that you are one of those who is strong and fights and I hope everything is well in your family now.

On topic- I actually spoke with someone who works on the show last night and he said that Brandi is gone, that it's the same old stuff over and over with her and they've lost interest. They are on the fence with Kim because they are afraid that she will be completely lost without the show (my guess is the truth is that they are wanting to film the aftermath of the not!relapse and arrest).

[QuinnM]

 

On topic- I actually spoke with someone who works on the show last night and he said that Brandi is gone, that it's the same old stuff over and over with her and they've lost interest. They are on the fence with Kim because they are afraid that she will be completely lost without the show (my guess is the truth is that they are wanting to film the aftermath of the not!relapse and arrest).

You know that fact that Brandi has no story and has no life and has no money is a big part of this.  Adrienne had no story but she had that fun money.  Next to LisaR and Eileen, both of whom have a life they are filming (kids, husbands etc) helps them out.  I can see them wavering on Kim.  But if the first 'day off' from filming ends at the popo.  Well she won't make it to the next contract.  And that is really all they have to do.  Not offer a contract.  I remember when Jill was so upset about the timing of Andy telling her she wasn't going to get a contract his response was, you know most people just don't get a contract.  No one tells them.  They just don't get a contract.

[GreatKazu]

 

I don't care how many finger points, bathroom trips or verbal outbursts. Me is staying out of the very real tragedy that is Kim Richards addiction and dysfunctional family if I were a cast member.

You know, I think I found something I can agree with you on. I feel, to a degree, LisaR couldn't stand back and ignore the Kim situation because of her friendship with Kyle. LisaR knows more than Eileen. However, as far as the show is concerned, ignore it!! Let it all play out. If this is the only time LisaR has to deal with Kim on a personal level, then let it go. The only issue I have is, how much of this storyline was LisaR's doing and how much was she likely prodded to sit there and discuss with Brandi the whole situation?

[SwordQueen]

But there is an alternative and that is falling apart, depression, anxiety, avoidance- there are many people who do not have the strength to get through such hardships and I, for one, admire those who do. As a psychologist, I see this everyday. There are people who can summon the strength they need for themselves and for those who depend on them and there are others who run away or succumb without a fight. It happens and it happens a lot. I am happy that you are one of those who is strong and fights and I hope everything is well in your family now.

 

 

Agree.  There are also those, like myself, who go through life cycling through the stages of falling down, getting back up; falling down, staying down and not having the energy to get back up, getting back up; falling down, getting back up, etc, etc.  Strength is sometimes cyclical and needs to be regenerated.   If I've learned anything about anything; it's that one size does not fit all.  

[WireWrap]

LisaR engaged the subject throughout the whole season. No need to have to ignore any of Kim's behavior after Poker night. Behavior that most likely wouldn't have transpired at all if it wasn't constantly brought up time and time again.

So it is better to just let the person, Kim, jump off the bridge without trying to talk her down? What Kim is in effect doing, is committing suicide and expecting her fellow cast members, along with her own sister, to support her decision to jump to her death. Also, Lisa was never disrespectful towards Kim until Amsterdam, until then she was careful with her words/tone of voice IMO.

You know that fact that Brandi has no story and has no life and has no money is a big part of this.  Adrienne had no story but she had that fun money.  Next to LisaR and Eileen, both of whom have a life they are filming (kids, husbands etc) helps them out.  I can see them wavering on Kim.  But if the first 'day off' from filming ends at the popo.  Well she won't make it to the next contract.  And that is really all they have to do.  Not offer a contract.  I remember when Jill was so upset about the timing of Andy telling her she wasn't going to get a contract his response was, you know most people just don't get a contract.  No one tells them.  They just don't get a contract.

If they decide to bring Kim back, they need to do like they did to the NY HWs. Have conditional contracts that go a few weeks at a time. That way they have an easier out to let Kim go if she decides to get drunk or take another pain pill.

[film noire]

You know, I think I found something I can agree with you on. I feel, to a degree, LisaR couldn't stand back and ignore the Kim situation because of her friendship with Kyle.

I agree she knows so much more due to Kyle -- and that informed LisaR's chocies -- but also, if you have experience with substance abusers (i.e.,Harry) then being asked to sit silently by, as an addict runs their bullshit right in front of you, is not the kind of behavior that helps the *enabler* recover, either; bad on both ends of the disease. I think if LisaR had had the right to refuse to film with Kim when Kim was high (all season, imo: I can't think of a single scene in which Kim appears stone cold sober) then that's likely what she would've done, after the first few failed attempts to reach blah blah Richards.

 

Brandi gone? YAYAYAYAYAYYA!!!!!

Edited April 20, 2015 by film noire

[zoeysmom]

LisaR engaged the subject throughout the whole season. No need to have to ignore any of Kim's behavior after Poker night. Behavior that most likely wouldn't have transpired at all if it wasn't constantly brought up time and time again.

This was a 19 regular episode season.  Poker night happened at the mid-way point Episode #10.  So there was never "throughout the whole season".  The episodes where Kim was addressed directly were Episode # 14 and Episode #15.  In Episode #17 there was some talk -brought up by Brandi and the last mention of Kim and her problem directed at Kim was Episode #19 and it had more to so with what happened in the Brandi and Lisa Lunch.  So a more accurate would perhaps be that Kim had the topic of her sobriety brought up to her by Lisa Rinna in two of the 19 episodes or less than 15% of the episodes-not through out the whole season. Since Kim was given ample opportunity to address and apologize her verbal assault on Rinna and refused to do so I would say she got off lightly. 

 

Given the events of last week in retrospect Kim might have been well advised to take the slip seriously instead of blaming others for her behavior.  Kim's behavior is Kim's behavior to own.  No one  insulted her children, spoke ill of her husband or questioned her fiscal honesty.  These are all things Kim brought up though to hurt others.

[GreatKazu]

I agree she knows so much more due to Kyle -- and that informed LisaR's chocies -- but also, if you have experience with substance abusers (i.e.,Harry) then being asked to sit silently by, as an addict runs their bullshit right in front of you, is not the kind of behavior that helps the *enabler* recover, either; bad on both ends of the disease. I think if LisaR had had the right to refuse to film with Kim when Kim was high (all season, imo: I can't think of a single scene in which Kim appears stone cold sober) then that's likely what she would've done, after the first few failed attempts to reach blah blah Richards.

 

Brandi gone? YAYAYAYAYAYYA!!!!!

I agree. I put myself in Rinna's shoes and wonder what I would have done. It is hard to know since I don't know what is required of the cast members as far as what they are willing to mention on their own vs. what Bravo producers require of them to participate in. It seems obvious, to me, LisaR went with her feelings due to her own personal connection with addiction. I think she learned, as I did on one occasion, that you can't make people get help. You can let them know if their behavior bothered you personally and put them on check that it won't be tolerated, but other than that, let them know if they ever need you (not enabling), you will be there for them.

[Sincerely Yours]

So it is better to just let the person, Kim, jump off the bridge without trying to talk her down? What Kim is in effect doing, is committing suicide and expecting her fellow cast members, along with her own sister, to support her decision to jump to her death. Also, Lisa was never disrespectful towards Kim until Amsterdam, until then she was careful with her words/tone of voice IMO.

If they decide to bring Kim back, they need to do like they did to the NY HWs. Have conditional contracts that go a few weeks at a time. That way they have an easier out to let Kim go if she decides to get drunk or take another pain pill.

Aren't people who talk those down off of cliffs usually trained professionals? I mean when Mel Gibson handcuffed himself to that potential jumper and just jumped to the air bed below In "Lethal Weapon" it was pretty awesome but usually the normal course of action is more structured thought out than the average "heart to heart". I mean if we are comparing Poker night to a bridge jumper.

[Sincerely Yours]

This was a 19 regular episode season.  Poker night happened at the mid-way point Episode #10.  So there was never "throughout the whole season".  The episodes where Kim was addressed directly were Episode # 14 and Episode #15.  In Episode #17 there was some talk -brought up by Brandi and the last mention of Kim and her problem directed at Kim was Episode #19 and it had more to so with what happened in the Brandi and Lisa Lunch.  So a more accurate would perhaps be that Kim had the topic of her sobriety brought up to her by Lisa Rinna in two of the 19 episodes or less than 15% of the episodes-not through out the whole season. Since Kim was given ample opportunity to address and apologize her verbal assault on Rinna and refused to do so I would say she got off lightly. 

 

Given the events of last week in retrospect Kim might have been well advised to take the slip seriously instead of blaming others for her behavior.  Kim's behavior is Kim's behavior to own.  No one  insulted her children, spoke ill of her husband or questioned her fiscal honesty.  These are all things Kim brought up though to hurt others.

Ok semantics. However the conflicts and confrontations for the duration of the season stemmed from Poker Night. Either way the unpleasant escalation of events happened thereafter.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[LIMOM]

I agree she knows so much more due to Kyle -- and that informed LisaR's chocies -- but also, if you have experience with substance abusers (i.e.,Harry) then being asked to sit silently by, as an addict runs their bullshit right in front of you, is not the kind of behavior that helps the *enabler* recover, either; bad on both ends of the disease. I think if LisaR had had the right to refuse to film with Kim when Kim was high (all season, imo: I can't think of a single scene in which Kim appears stone cold sober) then that's likely what she would've done, after the first few failed attempts to reach blah blah Richards.

 

Brandi gone? YAYAYAYAYAYYA!!!!!

First off, it would be wrong for Kyle to discuss Kim's personal life with Rinna, IMO.

And secondly, LisaR did not look remotely concerned about Kim.

And she and Lisa V manipulated Kyle, IMO.

I have a hard time believing that Lisa V forgot Kyle's transgressions from last year.

Aren't people who talk those down off of cliffs usually trained professionals? I mean when Mel Gibson handcuffed himself to that potential jumper and just jumped to the air bed below In "Lethal Weapon" it was pretty awesome but usually the normal course of action is more structured thought out than the average "heart to heart". I mean if we are comparing Poker night to a bridge jumper.

I can understand why Kyle and the older cast members would feel compel to intervene,

Lisa R and Eileen not so much.

[WireWrap]

Aren't people who talk those down off of cliffs usually trained professionals? I mean when Mel Gibson handcuffed himself to that potential jumper and just jumped to the air bed below In "Lethal Weapon" it was pretty awesome but usually the normal course of action is more structured thought out than the average "heart to heart". I mean if we are comparing Poker night to a bridge jumper.

 Someone threatening suicide would get a ride to the closest psych unit when the police arrive but that is not what happens with addicts. You can not call the police, a counselor, a Dr. or anyone and then expect the addict will be taken to rehab even though they are committing a slow suicide. So what does that leave a person to do? Most try to convince the addict they need help and that is what LisaR was trying to do IMO.

[SwordQueen]

Aren't people who talk those down off of cliffs usually trained professionals? I mean when Mel Gibson handcuffed himself to that potential jumper and just jumped to the air bed below In "Lethal Weapon" it was pretty awesome but usually the normal course of action is more structured thought out than the average "heart to heart". I mean if we are comparing Poker night to a bridge jumper.

 

Sometimes there isn't time for a professional to intervene.  I wouldn't be here today if someone had stood back and went through red tape to intervene.  I've intervened when necessary, too.  Life isn't always so structured and exact and by the book.

 

 

I wanted to add that professionals don't always say and do the right things to help someone in the moment, either.  No one is perfect at handling intense situations.  Sometimes you go by the book, sometimes you shoot from the hip.  It's always a risk.  

Edited April 20, 2015 by SwordQueen

[Sincerely Yours]

Sometimes there isn't time for a professional to intervene.  I wouldn't be here today if someone had stood back and went through red tape to intervene.  I've intervened when necessary, too.  Life isn't always so structured and exact and by the book.

But it's already established that Kim's is a slow death (Hope not). She's been on the so called ledge for years so this convenient sense of urgency that absolves the blatant botched handling of all this by people who have trumped up their "invested interest"  in the whole matter doesn't really jive for me. It's just really reaching IMO.

Edited April 20, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[GreatKazu]

First off, it would be wrong for Kyle to discuss Kim's personal life with Rinna, IMO.

And secondly, LisaR did not look remotely concerned about Kim.

And she and Lisa V manipulated Kyle, IMO.

I have a hard time believing that Lisa V forgot Kyle's transgressions from last year.

I don't know how much of Kim's addiction is not known among the people who see her outside of this show. LisaR and Kyle have known each other for over 20 years. That is the same amount of time Kim claims she "put her kids through hell" with her addiction. I cannot imagine any friend not discussing with another friend about what they are going through with family. My close friends and I have turned to one another when things have gone bad, addiction included. If anything, Kyle and LisaR likely turned to each other many times because of what was happening due to those addicts. I, myself, talked to those friends who had experienced the same problems. I wouldn't talk to others who had no clue about addiction. Those friends I leaned on, were my support and rock. I don't think it is wrong for one friend to lean on another and to divulge the pain of dealing with an addict. Addicts aren't always good at hiding their disease. I am pretty sure Kim falls into that category. Many of us saw Kim not being sober. I don't think it was any different away from the camera. LisaR likely saw Kim inebriated many times in those 20 years.

 

There is a difference between forgetting and forgiving. LisaV has likely forgiven Kyle and vice-versa. People do that when they want to move forward and work on their relationship. I am sure LisaV hasn't forgotten what went down, but she will also not throw it in Kyle's face. LisaV seems to be a smart lady and has pretty much stated in her blog that Brandi manipulated that whole thing with the tabloids. So much more goes on after the show is done filming. I think LisaV and Kyle had a heart-to-heart and put the pieces of this manipulating puzzle together and realized the common denominator with a lot of the drama was Brandi.

 

 

it's already established that Kim's is a slow death

Kim stated on the show during her convo with Andy that her doctor told her this is it. She cannot be drinking anymore. She said the physician told her she would have died if she didn't stop this time. This may be why those around her are fearful for her.

 

It is the same thing one of my relatives was told this year - this is it! You will die within a year if you drink again like you have. Hard words to hear. Made even harder when you see that person relapse.

Edited April 20, 2015 by GreatKazu

[LIMOM]

I don't know how much of Kim's addiction is not known among the people who see her outside of this show. LisaR and Kyle have known each other for over 20 years. That is the same amount of time Kim claims she "put her kids through hell" with her addiction. I cannot imagine any friend not discussing with another friend about what they are going through with family. My close friends and I have turned to one another when things have gone bad, addiction included. If anything, Kyle and LisaR likely turned to each other many times because of what was happening due to those addicts. I, myself, talked to those friends who had experienced the same problems. I wouldn't talk to others who had no clue about addiction. Those friends I leaned on, were my support and rock. I don't think it is wrong for one friend to lean on another and to divulge the pain of dealing with an addict. Addicts aren't always good at hiding their disease. I am pretty sure Kim falls into that category. Many of us saw Kim not being sober. I don't think it was any different away from the camera.

 

There is a difference between forgetting and forgiving. LisaV has likely forgiven Kyle and vice-versa. People do that when they want to move forward and work on their relationship. I am sure LisaV hasn't forgotten what went down, but she will also not throw it in Kyle's face. LisaV seems to be a smart lady and has pretty much stated in her blog that Brandi manipulated that whole thing with the tabloids. So much more goes on after the show is done filming. I think LisaV and Kyle had a heart-to-heart and put the pieces of this manipulating puzzle together and realized the common denominator with a lot of the drama was Brandi.

I did not realize that Kyle and Lisa were such long timed friends. In that case, of course, it makes sense that she is privy to more sensitive information regarding Kim.

[SwordQueen]

But it's already established that Kim's is a slow death (Hope not). She's been on the so called ledge for years so this convenient sense of urgency that absolves the blatant botched handling of all this by people who have trumped up their "invested interest"  in the whole matter doesn't really jive for me. It's just really reaching IMO.

 

LOL  Okay, you seem intent on this, so imma let it go.  I'm going from my experiences with this as someone who has tried to both slowly and quickly kill myself many, many times (either through direct suicide attempts or through slow anguish, like the ED) and as someone who's been around people who've struggled with the same.  Addictions and disorders are both slow and quick.  Someone can struggle and slowly leech their life away, day by day, until they fade away or it suddenly reaches a boiling point.  It's really hard to watch someone -- even if you don't "love" them -- dying right before your eyes.  And I say this as someone who has not wanted people to intervene and as someone who has had people intervene where it made things worse, not better.  I'm still able to say that I understand the whys of their actions.    

 

I guess my point is that I don't think Lisa R et al were doing anything out of malice or harm.  They tried and it didn't work.  I think it would have been worse had they not tried at all. IMO.

Edited April 20, 2015 by SwordQueen

[WireWrap]

But it's already established that Kim's is a slow death (Hope not). She's been on the so called ledge for years so this convenient sense of urgency that absolves the blatant botched handling of all this by people who have trumped up their "invested interest"  in the whole matter doesn't really jive for me. It's just really reaching IMO.

My use of the words "slow death" and "on the ledge" were general comments for all addicts, Kim is closer to dying than not with her drug/alcohol abuse after 30+ years of addiction. By Kim's own words, her Dr. told her that she would have died had she not gone to rehab 3 years ago so I do think there is a greater urgency this time around. IMO, I am not reaching at all but looking at this from a different, very different, perspective than you.

[MatildaMoody]

But it's already established that Kim's is a slow death (Hope not). She's been on the so called ledge for years so this convenient sense of urgency that absolves the blatant botched handling of all this by people who have trumped up their "invested interest"  in the whole matter doesn't really jive for me. It's just really reaching IMO.

 

I didn't see any botched handling of anything. It was actually pretty straightforward and could have been let go if Brandi hadn't decided to do a CYA and  blame LisaR for the conversation she had with her. 

 

Poker Night and Brandi put LisaR on the alert that something was wrong with Kim.

LisaR approached the other women about the best way to talk to Kim.

LisaR and Eileen talked to Kim after the script read.

Kim "blah blah blah'ed it"

LisaR and Eileen felt they had said their piece.

 

BRANDI wound Kim up before they all got on a plane and Kim exploded all over LisaR as Lisa was trying to apologize.

Yolanda tried to stage an internvention that was disguised as something else.

LisaR tried to apologize again and Kim exploded again.

 

If Brandi had let the matter drop after LisaR and Eileen spoke to Kim, I truly believe it would have been the end of it. They had both said their piece to her in support of her and there was nothing to indicate that they were going to discuss it again.