Spoilers and Spoilery Discussion: The Machine Knows All

[stealinghome]

So, I'm looking forward to seeing Carter again, but I am NOT looking forward to more Reese manpain and constipated faces. Reese "going solo on a perilous and personal journey," per TVGuide, does not interest me in.the.slightest.

 

Also, I didn't even really ship Carter/Reese, but potentially seeing Carter/Reese set alongside Reese/Iris is just going to make how blah Reese/Iris is even more apparent. It's like the writers WANT us to be cheering against them.

 

Also, I am fearful that this sounds like another one-off episode--RIGHT BEFORE when we should be gearing up for the season finale. It may be that this is going to be another case of "this episode should've come earlier in the season, but placed where it is, it disrupts the flow".... Welp, my excitement level for this episode has dropped drastically. :( 

[Trillium]

So, I'm looking forward to seeing Carter again, but I am NOT looking forward to more Reese manpain and constipated faces. Reese "going solo on a perilous and personal journey," per TVGuide, does not interest me in.the.slightest.

Also, I didn't even really ship Carter/Reese, but potentially seeing Carter/Reese set alongside Reese/Iris is just going to make how blah Reese/Iris is even more apparent. It's like the writers WANT us to be cheering against them.

Also, I am fearful that this sounds like another one-off episode--RIGHT BEFORE when we should be gearing up for the season finale. It may be that this is going to be another case of "this episode should've come earlier in the season, but placed where it is, it disrupts the flow".... Welp, my excitement level for this episode has dropped drastically. :( 

Maybe Iris will end up being the perp and she'll finally be interesting and her doomed to fail relationship with Reese will be over. I have to have hope that they have bigger plans for the character since she's been given so much screen time and little character development.

[merylinkid]

So happy about this news.    I always hoped they would do this.    The show is so heavy on flashbacks it only makes sense.

[stealinghome]

Vid of the panel here.

 

So, six or so deaths? I'm guessing Martine (hopefully at Root's hands!), Greer, Dominic, one of Dominic's two lieutenants, Claire, and ...maybe Brooks (Grice's partner)? Honorable mention spots go to Lambert, Grice, and Elias. I don't know. Six is a lot--it can wipe out pretty much everyone connected to Elias vs the Brotherhood and/or Samaritan, but I'm not sure the show is going to wipe out either crew completely. I wish one of the deaths was Harper or Iris, but I don't think the show is going there. Would they kill Control? I wouldn't put it past them, but I think it would be a big mistake.

 

I would watch the crap out of a Bear flashback episode, ngl.

[tessaray]

I can't access the video right now (work) but did anyone ask if this season finale had anything in it that could serve as a series finale if they didn't get renewed? 

 

It seems like all over the internet that PoI is on the bubble but then I remember they had an exclusive syndication deal, so isn't the conventional wisdom that it would tend to favor renewal?

[stealinghome]

tessa, a few answers to your question. First, while Nolan/Plageman didn't explicitly confirm a S5, they seemed very confident that they're going to get it. (I still suspect that the show has been renewed but after the CBS comedy actors accidentally let slip that their shows were renewed, CBS came down like a ton of bricks on everyone else and told them not to blab.) Also, tvbythenumbers has PoI as a certain lock for renewal, so.

 

That said, there's a video with interviews of the main cast members here (which is well worth watching on its own once you get to the interviews at about the 15:03 mark) and at 23:35, Michael Emerson, when asked about the stakes for the finale, seems to be saying "the finale ends on a note of...they cannot survive, you know, it's impossible that they can go on." So it sounds like we might have the craziest cliffhanger we've gotten in a while for the finale!

[FormerMod-a1]

Discuss your spoilers here.  Since the whole thread is marked as spoilers, you don't have to spoiler tag your posts.  

 

If you want spoiler free discussion or speculation, stay away from here.  (There is a Speculation Without Spoilers thread, or stick to the other specific threads like the episode threads, Past Seasons Talk, etc).

[stealinghome]

Since we now have a spoilers thread: the press release for 4x21 makes the episode look freaking excellent, though I worry that by dealing with both Samaritan and the gang war AND the Relevant side, the last two episodes will feel overstuffed and rushed (why didn't they take out Dominic in the very blah 14-17/18 stretch?). But by far the most important thing: SHAW! I'm still betting that we're going to get a Shahi cameo in either 21 or 22, so wouldn't put it past the writers for the Shaw stuff in 21 to be a red herring/trap, only to REALLY have Shaw resurface briefly in 22....

Edited April 14, 2015 by stealinghome

[Mari]

 First, while Nolan/Plageman didn't explicitly confirm a S5, they seemed very confident that they're going to get it. (I still suspect that the show has been renewed but after the CBS comedy actors accidentally let slip that their shows were renewed, CBS came down like a ton of bricks on everyone else and told them not to blab.)

I feel dumb, but am unsure why they would want to keep a renewal under wraps--for POI or for the comedies you mentioned leaked renewal earlier?

[Trillium]

tessa, a few answers to your question. First, while Nolan/Plageman didn't explicitly confirm a S5, they seemed very confident that they're going to get it. (I still suspect that the show has been renewed but after the CBS comedy actors accidentally let slip that their shows were renewed, CBS came down like a ton of bricks on everyone else and told them not to blab.) Also, tvbythenumbers has PoI as a certain lock for renewal, so.

That said, there's a video with interviews of the main cast members

(which is well worth watching on its own once you get to the interviews at about the 15:03 mark) and at 23:35, Michael Emerson, when asked about the stakes for the finale, seems to be saying "the finale ends on a note of...they cannot survive, you know, it's impossible that they can go on." So it sounds like we might have the craziest cliffhanger we've gotten in a while for the finale!

Good video. I'm calling it now, the Machine is the AI thats destroyed. That would also fit in with what Michael said, because it would be very hard to see how they overcome that.

I would love some Root flashbacks to her life pre-Root Cause. Amy is so adorable though. Because I hate the Reese and Iris relationship I'm holding out hope that them admitting that he and Zoe have undeniable chemistry that they just can't seem to escape means there's still hope that Dr Bland will be gone sooner than later. Probably not but one can dream.

Edited April 15, 2015 by Trillium

[stealinghome]

I feel dumb, but am unsure why they would want to keep a renewal under wraps--for POI or for the comedies you mentioned leaked renewal earlier?

That is actually a big question right now in general. In years past, CBS has generally announced their veteran renewals in March. This year, for reasons no one really knows, they seem to be holding off until the upfronts in May to announce veteran renewals. But CBS has obviously renewed at least some shows, yet definitely didn't want the comedy renewals to be leaked--they only officially confirmed after at least one actor made the mistake of taking to twitter to celebrate (I think it was someone from Mom, but I could be wrong)--and even then, I believe they've only announced the renewals of the Lorre comedies.

 

But rumors about several shows' renewals, including PoI and I believe H50, have been leaking out regardless, so I'm not sure why CBS is still dragging their feet.

 

Good video. I'm calling it now, the Machine is the AI thats destroyed. That would also fit in with what Michael said, because it would be very hard to see how they overcome that.

Yeah, I had begun to doubt my guess that The Machine and Samaritan were going to merge at the end of the season, but now I have renewed confidence in the guess! That TM will be incorporated into Samaritan somehow...but maybe will therefore cause Sam some problems next season?

Edited April 15, 2015 by stealinghome

[yellowfred]

See, my guess has been that they'd have to either take the Machine offline or let Samaritan think it destroyed the Machine, all while keeping a backup drive hidden away (presumably in the impenetrable briefcase), which would leave them having to fight Samaritan without the Machine's help. The title of the last episode this season seems to indicate that there's only going to be one God left by the end of it, and I doubt that Samaritan is anywhere close to falling.

[kwnyc]

I'm holding out hope that them admitting that he and Zoe have undeniable chemistry that they just can't seem to escape means there's still hope that Dr Bland will be gone sooner than later.

 

Well, at the panel, the chemistry between Reese & Zoe was heartily acknowledged, and Iris wasn't mentioned at all. I think they KNOW they've got sparks with Reese/Zoe, but based on previous comments on Twitter, she's not someone who is available to be a full regular. And it's clear they like working with her.

[FurryFury]

but based on previous comments on Twitter, she's not someone who is available to be a full regular.

 

Makes sense, she's still alive on The 100. Although as much as I love it (and I do, believe me - it's my favorite show ATM, seriously, s2 is terrific), I'd prefer her to be on PoI because she brings the fun factor and because if we HAVE to have a Reese romance, she's the best candidate. Also, she's not that essential on The 100.

 

I still haven't watched the episodes after the midseason trilogy, but I really hope next season's all about the fight against Samaritan without any distracting stuff like Dominic, because it's by far the most compelling storyline and it deserves to become the focus of at least a full season.

Edited April 15, 2015 by FurryFury

[Gigi43]

In the Paley thing Nolan indicated "half a dozen" deaths. I'm worried about Elias for some reason. And The Machine. I mean he made a joke of having to break the news to the machine... But I really think that's going to be the big blow.

If Shaw were around I'd be more concerned about Reese.

Thank God they made it clear Bear will be the last one standing...

[FurryFury]

If Shaw were around I'd be more concerned about Reese.

 

Hopefully, next season.

[stealinghome]

What is basically the press release for the season finale is here, under Tuesday the 5th.

 

1) Please, please, PLEASE let Dominic be killed. Link and Floyd can stick around into next season, but Dominic has got.to.go. He brings the show's momentum to a screeching halt every time he's on and endlessly...endlessly...endlessly monologuing.

 

2) Yeah, The Machine is totally the AI that's "dying"--likely with a backup in the impenetrable briefcase, I'm guessing. A reset of TM could be super interesting for next season!

 

 

Also a short snippet from 4x21. Looks like Elias got the crap kicked out of him. And has been growing a grief beard since Scarface....

[Mari]

2) Yeah, The Machine is totally the AI that's "dying"--likely with a backup in the impenetrable briefcase, I'm guessing. A reset of TM could be super interesting for next season!

 

 

Also a short snippet from 4x21. Looks like Elias got the crap kicked out of him. And has been growing a grief beard since Scarface....

1)  Yes, if we're losing peripheral criminal characters, Dominic should be the first to go.

2) How much of the Machine's original programming could be in a briefcase that size?  How far back would it be reset?

 

As for the griefbeard?  Well, really stealinghome, it just makes sense.  How can a man properly express sorrow without increasing his facial hair?  A symbolic mask to hide his fragile state;  why talk or cry when you can beard?

 

:)

[stealinghome]

A little more on the season finale from TVGuide:

 

"We promised a war," executive producer Greg Plageman says of the CBS drama's fourth season finale. And while he may be alluding to the season-long battle between the Machine and its rival AI Samaritan, Reese will also find himself caught in the middle of the final showdown between rival crime bosses Dominic and Elias. Meanwhile, Finch and Root race to save the Machine after it is finally located by Samaritan — but how far will they go? "A big part of the theme of the end of the season is this relationship that they have with this inhuman entity," executive producer Jonathan Nolan says. "How loyal is it to them? How loyal are they too it? Are they just interchangeable servants working for it? Or does it actually give a sh--? We’ll see the stakes of that become very real at the end of the season." How real? "The finale features the potential death of up to three major characters," Nolan teases.

Oh man, if The Machine sacrifices herself to save Harold and her humans, I think it will get a little dusty in my house!

 

Now I'm thinking back to Samaritan's offer to The Machine in 4x10, that it would let Team Machine go if The Machine "came quietly," as it were. Wondering if The Machine cashes in on that deal, and lets herself be destroyed to save the team--but of course she has the backup of herself in the small case unbeknownst to Samaritan and its goons.

 

Whatever happens, I really, really, REALLY hope the show delves into Finch and Root's relationships with The Machine in this episode. Finch because Finch/TM is one of the show's most compelling (and pointedly unclear) relationships, and Root because maybe we will finally see what's been going on with her and The Machine since Shaw "died."

 

2) How much of the Machine's original programming could be in a briefcase that size?  How far back would it be reset?

That may be the question if this goes down like I'm predicting! Wondering if the Ernest Thornhill stuff comes back to play as well, those memory backups. There may be a reason the showrunners name-dropped Ernest Thornhill a few episodes ago, more than just letting us know TM is recruiting....

 

 

Also, I'm calling it now: one of the team (I'm leaning toward Reese, but could also totally see it being Fusco) is going to end the season in mortal peril, either apparently cornered by the enemy with no way out or just having gotten badly wounded with no allies around or something similar.

Edited April 19, 2015 by stealinghome

[FurryFury]

"We promised a war," executive producer Greg Plageman says of the CBS drama's fourth season finale. And while he may be alluding to the season-long battle between the Machine and its rival AI Samaritan, Reese will also find himself caught in the middle of the final showdown between rival crime bosses Dominic and Elias.

 

But... how, how can you compare the battle for the world between Samaritan and team Machine with Dominic and Elias? HOW?! This is my problem with this season, I just can't understand the disparity of the level of this battles. It makes no sense at all. Here you have something incredibly epic that potentially involves the fate of humanity... and NY crime bosses? What?!

[tessaray]

 

Now I'm thinking back to Samaritan's offer to The Machine in 4x10, that it would let Team Machine go if The Machine "came quietly," as it were. Wondering if The Machine cashes in on that deal, and lets herself be destroyed to save the team--but of course she has the backup of herself in the small case unbeknownst to Samaritan and its goons.

 

The only way this works for me is if TM has a way to change Samaritan's core programming and Harold knows it, because otherwise what would be the point?  Samaritan would probably kill off Team Machine anyway.  There's no way it would let them live.  

 

If this were the last season, though, I could buy it.  TM turns itself into a virus, sacrifices herself to bring down Samaritan, who goes ahead and kills everyone off just for spite.  (I can see the producers going all Blakes 7 for the series finale.)  For a brief time, the world would be AI free.  Then the cycle could start over the day someone opens up the briefcase with the backup and plugs it in out of curiosity.  :-)

Edited April 19, 2015 by tessaray

[Mari]

The only way this works for me is if TM has a way to change Samaritan's core programming and Harold knows it, because otherwise what would be the point?  Samaritan would probably kill off Team Machine anyway.  There's no way it would let them live.  

 

If this were the last season, though, I could buy it.  TM turns itself into a virus, sacrifices herself to bring down Samaritan, who goes ahead and kills everyone off just for spite.  

I don't know how much the show team worries about the computer stuff being even remotely plausible, but could the Machine turn itself into a virus that infects Samaritan, slowly morphing Samaritan into the Machine?

[Coxfires]

But... how, how can you compare the battle for the world between Samaritan and team Machine with Dominic and Elias? HOW?! This is my problem with this season, I just can't understand the disparity of the level of this battles. It makes no sense at all. Here you have something incredibly epic that potentially involves the fate of humanity... and NY crime bosses? What?!

 

 

I definitely see your point, saving the world for Root and Finch vs dealing with gang for Reese and Fusco are two disproportionate battles, but I give a pass to the writers admitting that, just because the AI threat exists doesn't mean the rest of humanity should be put aside. But this is a bit farfetched and I see where you are coming from. The other thing that annoys me a bit is that I'm tired of the team being split in groups, and also having the same pairs Finch/Root Reese/Fusco all the time. IMO, S3 managed to mix all TM players into all plots, and this is why it was so great. This season, it felt too fractured for me, and I hope S5 will bring some of that back.

Well, even if I'm a bit iffy about it, I'm still excited for the 2 last episodes, so I should wait and see.

[tessaray]

I don't know how much the show team worries about the computer stuff being even remotely plausible, but could the Machine turn itself into a virus that infects Samaritan, slowly morphing Samaritan into the Machine?

 

TM doesn't have a traditional operating system, according to Harold, IIRC but just the way normal everyday malware affects a computer, attaching to system files, overwriting or replacing them with their own, I don't see why not.    And it wouldn't have to overwrite everything, just the specific code that devalues human life.   

[tessaray]

But... how, how can you compare the battle for the world between Samaritan and team Machine with Dominic and Elias? HOW?! This is my problem with this season, I just can't understand the disparity of the level of this battles. It makes no sense at all. Here you have something incredibly epic that potentially involves the fate of humanity... and NY crime bosses? What?!

 

I just assume the mob wars are the (micro) parallel to the (macro) TM vs. Samaritan story.  

 

It's too bad Elias doesn't have a more interesting adversary.  Dominic is ruthless and capable, but even when he's thinking out of the box, he lacks something. His single-mindedness makes him boring to watch.      

[FurryFury]

Everything about Dominic is boring. But the worst problem is the scale. Bringing everything back to street-level crime after the epicness of Samaritan and the government and other organizations in s3 is laughable. Imagine if, I dunno, Avengers fight with Ultron and then go after Wilson Fisk. While Ultron is still alive, no less. This is how it feels like.

[kahauna]

It looks like Nolan and Plagerman are trying to tie up as many loose ends as they can, just in case the unthinkable should happen for some absurd reason and PoI were to be cancelled without a fifth season, which would truly suck out loud.

Edited April 20, 2015 by kahauna

[stealinghome]

More spoilery info from TVLine:
 

PRE-FINALE: In "Asylum" (airing April 28), Reese and Fusco track POIs Elias and Dominic, Finch and Root chase a new clue to Shaw's whereabouts ("Root has not given up hope," asserts Amy Acker) and Control goes rogue to uncover Samaritan's true agenda. "One of the most interesting aspects of our show," says showrunner Greg Plageman, "is to take someone who appears to be a Big Bad, a total villain, and as they start to understand that something else in play, they come over to another perspective."

 

SEASON FINALE (MAY 5): "We always aim to outdo ourselves" at season's end, says showrunner Jonah Nolan, and as such the episode "YHWH" is "pretty extraordinary," as Finch and Root endeavor to save The Machine from Samaritan, who has finally located its rival, while Reese gets caught in a showdown between Elias and Dominic. Is now the time for Team Machine, after so many setbacks, to rally? "Yes," says Nolan, "but in the way that you rally as the f—king world explodes into a billion pieces around you, and you cling to the wreckage." Adds cast member Kevin Chapman: "The finale's just remarkable. The audience will be blown away by some of what we're able to pull off!"

Okay, now I kinda feel like Control may be one of the deaths, even if I wish she wasn't going to be!

 

ETA: It's worth nothing that at the link, there's a picture of Control and Greer standing side-by-side, gazing at an offscreen computer monitor. And they both look pretty alarmed/horrified!

Edited April 20, 2015 by stealinghome

[StarBrand]

 

"A big part of the theme of the end of the season is this relationship that they have with this inhuman entity," executive producer Jonathan Nolan says. "How loyal is it to them? How loyal are they too it? Are they just interchangeable servants working for it? Or does it actually give a sh--? We’ll see the stakes of that become very real at the end of the season."

This, to me, is one of more interesting-and unanswered questions. Does the machine give a darn about its' "assets" And how exactly will this influence its decisions in the weeks to come?

[stealinghome]

Official press release for the season finale. We already got the episode description above, but what's crazy is the list of recurring characters:

Enrico Colantoni (Elias)
John Nolan (Greer)
Camryn Manheim (Control)
John Doman (Garrison)
Winston Duke (Dominic)
Luke Kleintank (Caleb)
Wrenn Schmidt (Iris)
Annie Ilonzeh (Harper)
Suzy Jane Hunt (Schiffman)
Nick Taraby (Grice)
Jessica Pimentel (Floyd)
Robert Manning, Jr (Zachary)

I'm guessing Garrison (Greer's senator "buddy") dies--the actor is busy with other stuff, and they basically announced in the season premiere they would be killing him off at some point. This seems like a ripe time.

 

Caleb coming back=The Machine is totally getting small using his compression algorithm. (And going in the case!)

 

Ugh to Iris and Harper...it's probably too much to hope that one or both of them dies. I'm just not that lucky.

 

Martine isn't here? Bet she dies in 4x21 then.

 

 

ETA: Jeez, today is a treasure trove. Promo pics for 4x21. Omfg, Finch as the patient--bwah! Emerson actually looks kind of adorable in the hat. And somewhere, Shaw's spidey sense is tingling, and she is both rolling her eyes and licking her chops at the prospect of Root in a lab coat.

 

Not particularly interested in Dominic monologuing at Reese/Fusco/Elias...again. Goodness, do they pay the actor by the word or something???

Edited April 20, 2015 by stealinghome

[Trillium]

I'd love if Iris, Harper and Dominic all died. Harper is the least annoying of the three but unfortunately I feel they all make it to next season. Maybe Iris will be a villain after all. I can't see why they'd waste valuable finale time on her and John hiding their relationship.

Other than the main cast, Control and Elias are on my "better not die" list.

[DeLurker]

I think they usually do a decent job with the casting for PoI but Dominic just doesn't work for me.  I decided to look up Winston Duke/Dominic on IMDB.  His only other credit is a L&O: SVU episode.  Curious casting decision.

[Bort]

I think they usually do a decent job with the casting for PoI but Dominic just doesn't work for me.  I decided to look up Winston Duke/Dominic on IMDB.  His only other credit is a L&O: SVU episode.  Curious casting decision.

Maybe it was just because he's a New York-based actor. If they don't want to sign to a contract, best to find actors who'll be around here and there instead of having to fly them in from L.A.

[Just Here]

Replied to DeLurker about Winston Duke in the "Cast in Other Roles" thread (which seemed the most appropriate).

[stealinghome]

Spoiler pics from the season finale. Holy balls, this looks AWESOME.

 

I've been speculating that John gets seriously wounded and his survival is a "cliffhanger" into next season--so it's curious that it looks like Root ends up with John's big gun....

 

I think The Machine is definitely going onto disks and into the case.

Edited April 22, 2015 by stealinghome

[Watch4Reese]

It's just as likely both Reese and Root each have their own big guns. I mean, Reese has what looks like a duffel bag which could be filled with weapons.

[Coxfires]

It's just as likely both Reese and Root each have their own big guns. I mean, Reese has what looks like a duffel bag which could be filled with weapons.

 

I'd love to see the "Plan B" bag make a come back

[Trillium]

Those who are upset that they keep saying Reese will eventually die should head over to the Grey's Anatomy board. At least on POI they are upfront from the beginning that everyone dies and giving fair warning. I have no hopes there's a fairy tale ending here. And I'm ok with that. Not all good endings need to be happy ones. It's all in the execution of the story.

[FurryFury]

Yeah, killing main love interests is something that always shocks me (although in the shows I watch, usually in a good way -  I hate safe and predictable storytelling). The point is if the character has reached the end of their narrative arc or not. With Reese, it happened in season 2. Writers could have invented something to do with him, but they haven't. It would be better to kill him now than to prolong the agony, at least if they are still committed to ambitious storytelling.

[stealinghome]

I swear I've also read interviews where Nolan and Plageman say EVERYONE in the main cast (except for Bear, of course!) will die, so none of us can say we weren't forewarned.

 

I've always thought Reese will die in the series finale (because I actually think dying is Reese's HEA), Root will die a season to half-season before the series finale, and Finch and Shaw and Fusco have the best chance to live out the series. Fusco probably the best of all of them, ironically enough!

Edited April 24, 2015 by stealinghome

[FurryFury]

TVLine spoiler:

I have a questionPerson of Interest Shaw Dies about Person of Interest: Is Sarah Shahi going to return as Shaw? –Russ
I asked the showrunners for an update when I saw them at last week’s Paley event, and their handshake agreement with Shahi remains in place. “Our deal with Sarah is that when she’s excited to come back, we’re excited to have her,” Jonah Nolan said. And if/when the new mom of twins gives her bosses the nod, “We have a killer storyline for how her character comes back into the universe of our show. We’re ready to roll with that just as soon as she is.”

 

I've never doubted Shaw will return, but I still hope they'll backtrack somewhat on Root/Shaw because while I love both characters, I just don't buy it as a romance, sorry. Still, I expect to see her full-time in season 5, personally.

[stealinghome]

I would love to see Shaw full-time in S5, but I'm tempering my expectations on that front--while hoping to be pleasantly surprised, of course. But Shahi's twins will be just 4.5 months old when S5 starts shooting. That seems a bit early for her to come back full-time (if it was just one, maybe not so much, but with twins...). I'm still guessing a cameo in S5--maybe in the premiere depending on what happens in the finale--and then to see Shaw more regularly in 5B, whether as a regular or recurring.

[DEM]

I have never heard of any kind of business arrangement like this in network television.  This talk of "whenever you want, dude, it's totally cool, man, whatever" strikes me as wholly implausible.  I think they're simply trying to keep a lid on her return, and the story of !THE GREAT AND MIGHTY TRAUMA OF NEWBORN CHILDREN! is part of that spin. It's understandable they want to keep a lid on things, but I don't think things are as murky and open-ended as they would have us believe.

 

I, too, hope they dial back on The Romance, but that's because it's becoming overwrought, IMO. Then again, I think they took a wrong turn with the story way back in S3.  Shaw and Root are not typical people, but the story is being written according to a much too traditional pattern. However, unless Shaw's character makes a sharp right turn in the final eps of S4, I don't foresee the writers dialing it down.  As I see it, even in her absence, the Shaw character is being completely boxed in by Root's story/characterisation.

Edited April 25, 2015 by DEM

[alynch]

I have never heard of any kind of business arrangement like this in network television.  This talk of "whenever you want, dude, it's totally cool, man, whatever" strikes me as wholly implausible.  I think they're simply trying to keep a lid on her return, and the story of !THE GREAT AND MIGHTY TRAUMA OF NEWBORN CHILDREN! is part of that spin. It's understandable they want to keep a lid on things, but I don't think things are as murky and open-ended as they would have us believe.

 

Yeah, I agree. This is just a standard TV maternity leave that they're trying to disguise as something potentially more long-term in order to surprise the audience. I consider it somewhat telling that Shahi's remained listed as a regular castmember in all the CBS press releases since leaving, despite no longer being in the opening credits. She'll make a "surprise" reappearance in one (or both) of the final episodes and be back full-time next year.

[stealinghome]

So now that 2 of the 6 (Martine, Link) are confirmed dead, updated guesses on what other characters die next week?

 

I'm gonna say Dominic, Senator Garrison, Control (pains me to type it but I think she goes out saving the team and preventing Samaritan's big plan), and Floyd (if both Dominic and Link are dead, no point to the character anymore).

 

Honorable mentions to Grice and Brooks--if Control lives, as I hope she will, at least one of them will die. I thought Greer might get offed in the finale, but tonight somehow makes me feel he's safe for another season. I think he and Harold need to have at least one more philosophical showdown before all is said and done.

[yellowfred]

Hmm, I'd put money on Garrison and, probably, Dominic.  I'm a bit more iffy about Control (possibly because I really, really don't want her to die) and I actually had Floyd pegged as the one who's going to kill Dominic and take over the Brotherhood.  I really feel like Harold's going to kill someone, and it seems like Greer would be the most likely option, but I could also see it being Claire.  Grice is actually the one I'm most worried about, because, if they're killing off six people, there's a good chance they'll want at least one of them to be one of the "good guys."

 

I wonder if they're counting the two people Control just killed in their six.  It's probably just wishful thinking on my part, but maybe they counted them to bolster the number and make it sound more daunting.

[Trillium]

As long as Elias, and obviously the regulars survive, I'm ok. I'd love for Control to stay but I'm realistic, someone we like is going to bite it. Dominick needs to go, but since Harper was far less annoying this last time, she can survive but then split do a while.

I'm quite perplexed as to what Iris is going to be doing in the finale. Right now Reese is captive and he obviously escapes but it's not like he's going to make a quick stop to see her on his way to help Finch and Root. So that leaves three possibilities. One is she's kidnapped, two, after the "correction" Reese rushes to make sure she's ok and they have some big emotional moment, or lastly, she really is a villain and its revealed. Please, please, please let it be the last one.

[beadgirl]

 

or lastly, she really is a villain and its revealed. Please, please, please let it be the last one.

While that would put an end to their budding romance and get her off the show, it would result in even more angst and disillusionment on Reese's part, which I at least don't need more of.

[Yokosmom]

I'm assuming that both Elias and Dominick will die next week--it sounds as though they plan to kill off at least one of the main characters, as well as a host of secondary ones, and Elias seems the most likely of those-who-are-not -TM to get taken out.  He's had an arc through the entire season, and now they are winding it up. Not that I want that, mind you, but I have a hard time picturing his role next season if he defeats the Brotherhood in the finale.  Just go back to being the charming crime boss that shows up once in a while?  Of the two, I think that Control is more likely to survive until next year.  Which is too bad--I would love to see those two together in the same scene...

 

or lastly, she really is a villain and its revealed. Please, please, please let it be the last one.

 

While that would put an end to their budding romance and get her off the show, it would result in even more angst and disillusionment on Reese's part, which I at least don't need more of.

 

Agree on the angst factor, however, I would be willing to put up with a lot of manly mopiness to get rid of Iris.

[kwnyc]

I think Control is going to die because she lost her mother when she was a child; she has a daughter and leaving her child motherless is her greatest fear.