S05.E02: Back To School

[Brooklynista]

What was the documentary...The 7 Ups? Something like that. Where they would check in on the participants every 7 years. I would be cool with something similar. These girls have enough going on for a yearly drop in.

[cheatincheetos]

What does the OG mean?

Ogre girls.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Orange Glow.

[brandyelf]

I figured it just meant "Oh Gawd", which is what I say when I see it pop up on my DVR.

[wrestlesflamingos]

Cate was 16 and the child of an addict. I think she had been told stories with happy endings all of her life and mimicked it to soothe her mother. Cate probably even believed those things when she said it, either lacking the maturity to know the truth or sensitivity to protect April. Cate was the child, perhaps April was hurt, thats parenting.

[ghoulina]

And since Bentley is going into school, is Maci ever going to finish up getting her degree?

 

At this rate, Bentley will probably get a degree before she does. 

 

Re: Cate and Tyler.  Does anyone know what they DO?  Before Cate had the baby, did they work?

 

At some point, in an earlier season, I think they had jobs. Well, Catelynn at least. I remember her filling out applications and then working in some little shop. I know they get paid to be on this show, but it won't last forever, and I've always appreciated the ones who realize that and try to set themselves up with something to rely on once the cameras are gone.

[ghoulina]

That sounds familiar. 

[snarts]

I vowed I wouldn't watch this. Damn MTV with their mini marathons...

Maci looks good, those stupid holes in her ear aside. But her boyfriend is ugly. I adore Bentley. Can't believe the kids are in kindergarten. The storyline is tired.

Catelynn & Tyler. WTF are they doing getting pregnant again? Did either of them go to school, do they work? Why are they still together? ugh, I can't stand them.

Amber. Still doing a lot of laying around on the couch. Leah is a cutie. Gary UGH. I'm the same category as Tyler for me. Why would anyone date him?

Farrah cracks me up. Seriously the most entrepreneurial one of this group. It's sad but I feel like she's the only one who won't be broke a year after MTV leaves.

[cereality]

When they were 17 or 18, I recall Catelynn working in a small shop in the mall and Tyler either worked at a pizza joint or delivered pizzas or both. What they've done since then is anyone's guess. I know they do speaking engagements when they can get them and they've recently written a book, but I don't get the sense either has a 40 hr work week -- even though they also aren't in school full time (I'm assuming -- he said he needs 3 more yrs to finish school!? If he's been going since 18, that means it's been pretty on and off or he dropped out and is now going back.) They used to have ideas about being everything from EMTs to social workers to adoption counselors, but it seemed pie in the sky; never seemed like they made efforts towards pursuing those things. I think they made some MTV money early on and that likely funded their house and cars and whatever money they make from speaking engagements or Couples Therapy or whatever is enough for day to day living -- so why aspire for more at least during this 15 minutes of "fame" time period.

[cereality]

As much as I don't like watching Farrah -- I feel like she is the only one in this group that can hustle. Whether it's making money with porn/sex videos or going to culinary school or working at a restaurant -- seems like she's always been doing something to make money. I recall they showed her working at a restaurant and it didn't look like a "for tv" kind of thing -- she was on her feet all day and trying to trade shifts/get more hours etc. I don't know if she finished culinary school, but I remember her cooking desserts in one of the episode . . . so it seems like she was putting in effort at least.

[Darknight]

When they were 17 or 18, I recall Catelynn working in a small shop in the mall and Tyler either worked at a pizza joint or delivered pizzas or both. What they've done since then is anyone's guess. I know they do speaking engagements when they can get them and they've recently written a book, but I don't get the sense either has a 40 hr work week -- even though they also aren't in school full time (I'm assuming -- he said he needs 3 more yrs to finish school!? If he's been going since 18, that means it's been pretty on and off or he dropped out and is now going back.) They used to have ideas about being everything from EMTs to social workers to adoption counselors, but it seemed pie in the sky; never seemed like they made efforts towards pursuing those things. I think they made some MTV money early on and that likely funded their house and cars and whatever money they make from speaking engagements or Couples Therapy or whatever is enough for day to day living -- so why aspire for more at least during this 15 minutes of "fame" time period.

I think they're just lazy. It's a family cycle. It's sad because they do have the resources. But how many speaking engagements can you do, talking about the same stuff. Lots of people go through what Catelynn and Tyler go through or much worse but they break the cycle

[tumamita]

I haaate Ryan!!! Still an asshole!!

 

Amber, you're still psychotic. 

Edited April 7, 2015 by tumamita

[GreatKazu]

I think they're just lazy. It's a family cycle. It's sad because they do have the resources. But how many speaking engagements can you do, talking about the same stuff. Lots of people go through what Catelynn and Tyler go through or much worse but they break the cycle

And how many people actually go to sit to watch them talk shit when their actions tell a different story? 

[Granimal]

If Tyler and Catelyn were two healthy-minded, mature people, who had made proper choices with their education and careers before having a baby, I might agree with you. Except, Tyler treats Catelyn pretty shabby. He has shown an angry side with his pet dogs. I am sure over the years of watching Butch and how he treats the women in his life (domestic violence), Tyler has learned similar behavior. I am just wondering how things really are with Tyler and how he treats Catelyn when the cameras aren't around. Just what he shows on camera is pretty pathetic. He leads Catelyn on with these marriage proposals as if to keep her from breaking apart mentally if he were to tell her he doesn't want to commit to her by way of marriage. He doesn't seem to receptive to what Catelyn feels, only his own feelings. These two have no real jobs, no careers, no education. Their decision-making is similar to tossing a coin in the air.  Now, bring a daughter into that mix and I don't see a healthy outcome. That child may feel as if she was brought into the world to replace Carly. Then, she will see that footage of her dad making those faces. Add all of that into whatever drama she will likely be enduring as she grows up with these two out-of-work people who didn't have the brains to get their lives together. I see Novacaine being Catelyn 2.0  Growing up with two people who will likely become resentful of one another when there is no more MTV money and they have no education or skills to fall back on.  The same way Tyler tries to appease Catelyn so she doesn't lose it mentally, he may end up doing that to his daughter when he really feels stuck to Catelyn and wants to get away from her, but he remains in the relationship because of his daughter.  Novacaine may end up being the next one Tyler treats with disdain. Sure there are men out there who want a boy, end up with a girl, but they forget all about that and end up adoring their daughters no matter what. With Tyler, I can't say the same because of all that I just posted.

 

I don't view it as a child being "too senstive" as much as children who may be affected by things growing up that cause them to have insecure feelings about their own self-worth. Many children of divorced parents have these kind of issues because they sometimes feel they are to blame for the break-up of their parents. Many children may feel sensitive, sure, but it is not something to bat an eye at. Why is the child sensitive to feeling a certain way or to feel as if their parent doesn't want them? Even if that happened before they were born, it can still affect a child. Surely things happen in a home that can lead a child to feel unwanted. They may feel if they had done something different, mom or dad might love them more. Unfortunately, there are parents who do wish they only had a son or a daughter, and they do end up treating the child in a negative way as if it is their fault. Maybe Tyler will adore Novacaine with all his heart and regret feeling the way he did, but who is to say his daughter won't have bad feelings? And if she does, she shouldn't be made to feel she is being sensitive.

 

If my second paragraph makes no sense, I apologize. I had a very, very long and tiring day. lol

 

I agree. I do think that a father preferring to have a son over a daughter, does make a difference to the daughter's self-esteem and self-worth. I can't comment to the reverse, because I have never seen an expectant first-time father that was hoping for a girl.

 

I have to say that my father made Ryan look like an involved parent. I'm sure many of us in this thread have absentee fathers. This didn't really bother me and I don't think it has a lasting effect on me now, as an adult. I had other people in my life.

 

However, any time I meet a man that says he wants a son and not a daughter (or takes it even further than that) I have to side-eye. Its 2015! A daughter can still play catch with you in the yard. Let's try to get past these out-dated stereotypes. The gender should not matter so much IMO. Gender means nothing. My own father wanted sons (of course) and had three sons and  one daughter. Well, the three sons ended up being not traditionally masculine. And the daughter was the one that ended up having more traditionally masculine qualities. So I don't understand why today people would still buy into these stereotypes.

[Maharincess]

My daughter and son in law were both hoping for a girl with their first baby. They had their girl first and their boy 3 years later. After that my daughter had herself "spayed" and they're done.

[GreatKazu]

 

I do think that a father preferring to have a son over a daughter, does make a difference to the daughter's self-esteem and self-worth.

Right. People, like Tyler, who had preferred a son over a daughter, may not come right out and say it to their daughter, but their behavior, actions, the things they don't say, and their overall attitude towards that daughter will certainly affect her. It is one thing for a child to grow up wondering, "Did my father love me enough?" Or, "Why do I feel like my father treats me different than my brother?" It is a whole other ball of wax to have those sorts of feelings AND then to have proof via footage of one's father showing the sour-puss face  as he realizes he didn't get the son he had hoped for and to then watch him say "I guess I will get used to it" . [paraphrasing] 

 

 

However, any time I meet a man that says he wants a son and not a daughter (or takes it even further than that) I have to side-eye. Its 2015!

Agree. I think Tyler heard a lot of macho bullshit from Butch. Remember, Butch is also the same guy who thought it was a bad idea to give Carly up for adoption. As he stated, "All a child needs is love." Okay then. Does love buy diapers and formula? Does love pay for doctor visits? Butch had no love to give to his own son, how the hell did he expect that son to raise a child at the age of 15? Even now, I don't think Tyler is prepared. No. I know he is not prepared. These two soon-to-be-parents have no EDUCATION or JOBS.

[SlothLoveChunk]

 

 

Right. People, like Tyler, who had preferred a son over a daughter, may not come right out and say it to their daughter, but their behavior, actions, the things they don't say, and their overall attitude towards that daughter will certainly affect her.

 

When I got pregnant I REALLY wanted a boy and my husband had a slight preference for a girl.  We got a girl.  My dissapointment over not having a boy faded over my pregnancy and now that my little girl is almost 2 I can't imagine life without her.  I don't care at all that she's not a boy and I don't feel I treat her at all differently than I would if I had gotten my original "preferred" gender.  So while I'm no fan of Tyler, I think it's a stretch to say that he'll have an attitude towards Nova as she grows up just because she's a girl.  If he gives her attitude, it's more likely because he sucks as a person and has an attitude in general.

[SPLAIN]

Well, I had wanted only girls. Never wanted a boy. When I was pregnant with my son, and I was told I was having a boy, my mind did a 180 degree turn. I was ecstatic and couldn't wait to hold my son in my arms and see how life with a son would be like.

 

As for Tyler, I think he takes it a bit further than how I felt or how others here may have felt when expecting a baby and hoping for a specific gender. I don't even think he was on board with wanting a baby to begin with. Why would he? He sure doesn't look happy to be with Catelyn.  I actually feel as if he felt cornered. The baby will just make it harder now for him to leave her, if that is what he is feeling, and I am certain that is the case. With Tyler, I always get the sense that with him, whatever feels good at the moment, is a good idea. This baby is one of those moments. I can't get it out of my head that his thinking went along like this, "Well, Catelyn is pregnant, might as well hope it will be a boy if I am going to have to be with her and be a father."  Sometimes the looks that people give, express way more than their words do. When Tyler made that face and said the words that he did, I just wanted to slap him through my television. In fact, there have been a few times when I wish I could slap him.

 

I do think no matter what, Tyler will not be this great father that he claims he will be. The attitude, the behavior he expresses, all of that will definitely play a part in how he treats his daughter, and I don't think it will be good. It wouldn't be good no matter the sex of that child, but again, I do feel Tyler may harbor a bit of resentment at not having had a son.

Edited April 14, 2015 by SPLAIN

[FozzyBear]

Ok Gary is hugely co-dependent and does seem to get sick pleasure out of pushing Amber's buttons, but did Amber really expect the guy she fucking smacked in the head to wait for her while she served out her sentence for fucking smacking him in the head? Oh fuck her. He owns her nothing. Start getting used to the idea that wanting and earning something are not the same thing. Gonna be a long road for Amber. A long rough road.

[GreatKazu]

Ok Gary is hugely co-dependent and does seem to get sick pleasure out of pushing Amber's buttons, but did Amber really expect the guy she fucking smacked in the head to wait for her while she served out her sentence for fucking smacking him in the head? Oh fuck her. He owns her nothing. Start getting used to the idea that wanting and earning something are not the same thing. Gonna be a long road for Amber. A long rough road.

I agree in one sense. Amber was an abuser (waiting to see if she Hulks out again). The thing is, the guy who was being abused by her constantly, made a slew of bullshit promises to her while she was in prison.  As much as Gary was co-dependent on her, Amber was the same way. I believe they still are in some ways.  Gary has to be reminded by his friends that Amber was abusive to him. On last week's episode, his friend asked Gary if he needed to view old episodes of what she had done to him. Gary quickly forgets the bad times because he remembers the good times.

 

Overall, Amber needs to get over the fact that her life stops because Gary has moved on. There is still so much work that girls needs. Why she isn't in therapy, I have no clue.

[FozzyBear]

Taylor has to work early so Maci has to take Bently to kindergarten ALL BY HERSELF! What is up with these girls never wanting to be alone? Yeah it's sad that Ryan sucks too much to want to be inconvenienced by parenthood, but why is it a big deal to do it alone then? Is this a producer driven thing because it's more interesting to watch them interact with people? It's seriously starting to creep me out the way these twerps always need company, even to sit on the couch eating take-out. Can't be single. Can't be alone. Can't do anything without company. I'm honestly waiting for one of them to say "There wasn't anyone in the house so I had to take a shit by myself." Maybe I just notice it more because I'm an introvert who likes doing things alone. Do other people need people around all the time?

[Brooklynista]

Taylor has to work early so Maci has to take Bently to kindergarten ALL BY HERSELF! What is up with these girls never wanting to be alone? Yeah it's sad that Ryan sucks too much to want to be inconvenienced by parenthood, but why is it a big deal to do it alone then? Is this a producer driven thing because it's more interesting to watch them interact with people? It's seriously starting to creep me out the way these twerps always need company, even to sit on the couch eating take-out. Can't be single. Can't be alone. Can't do anything without company. I'm honestly waiting for one of them to say "There wasn't anyone in the house so I had to take a shit by myself." Maybe I just notice it more because I'm an introvert who likes doing things alone. Do other people need people around all the time?

 

 

Yes!  I'd bet a shiny quarter not one of these broads know the joy of taking yourself out to dinner.  Hell, going on a vacation solo.   Just sitting quietly with your thoughts.  ALONE!

 

Best time I ever had was when I took myself to Cancun. ALONE.  Vegas. ALONE.

 

If they can't stand to be with themselves, what the hell makes them think somebody else wants to be with them?

[fliptopbox]

I think most of it is manipulated by producers, or the crew. Taping someone doing daily errands by themselves and just going about their normal routine is really dull, so I am sure they ask leading questions or talk to them in a way that sets the tone of wishing for company. At least, I would hope so, cos the alternative is really sad.