Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[scenicbyway]

I'm guessing everyone gets cursed again but Henry and baby Robin aren't included because they weren't born in the EF?  But who cares?  What's the point of the constant curses?  Is it just to show there's no happily ever after?  I'm guessing the reset means they might tell Adult Henry's life in flashback?  So there's two Henrys?  I would think the new focus would just mean that the mains are sideline and will shoot far fewer episodes.

The thing is, if they curse them again and Hook and Emma disappear for 10 years without getting married, I won't be watching next season.  Because DUMB

[Curio]

Quote

EW can exclusively reveal that the upcoming hour will feature seven songs, including a big solo for Jennifer Morrison’s Emma Swan.

Oh, you mean like these seven songs?

1. INT: GROUP HOME BEDROOM*
2. EXT: CHARMING'S CASTLE BALCONY - FTL* ; INT: CHARMING'S BEDROOM*
3. INT: EVIL QUEEN'S LAIR* ; INT: EQ'S LAIR/HALL OF MIRRORS*
4. INT: DRAWF MINES* ; INT: HOVEL (GRANNY'S)* ; INT: PINOCCHIO'S SHOP*
5. EXT: JOLLY ROGER/DOCKS*
6. INT: ZELENA'S (WIZARD'S) CHAMBER - OZ*
7. INT: MAYOR'S OFFICE* ; EXT: GRANNY'S/MAIN STREET*

Quote

“We’ll all so excited about it,” Morrison tells EW. “It’s one of those things we’ve all thought about. Most of us have musical theater backgrounds or have had singing in our lives, or music in our lives, in some way. We’ve joked about it, thought about it. We’re all just listening to each other songs now trying to work out how the songs fit together and what the storyline is.”

It's kind of crazy that A&E refuse to give the actors any information about the musical episode's plot even though the actors have to record their singing parts weeks in advance. Shouldn't they know their characters' motivations when they're singing? 

[Rumsy4]

1 hour ago, KingOfHearts said:

Does anyone know why Adam keeps saying he's so excited about 6B? What's so different about it? He hasn't raved nearly as much about other arcs. I don't think it's just generic hype. There's probably something that's legitimately getting him giddy. IIRC, he said it was one of his favorites to write.

"over-compensation" Lbr. The ratings aren't good, and abc is not all over them right now. 

1 hour ago, Curio said:

If this was meant to be the final season, it sure didn't feel like it. I refuse to believe two Reginas dominating the screen time was A&E's ultimate plan for the final season.

This has more to do with A&E's inability to plan the season with enough foresight and their overconfidence in renewal, and very little to do with giving any sort of closure to these charatcers or fans. And FWIW, they probably do think two Reginas dominating the screen time is a wonderful way to wrap up the series.  

[Free]

3 hours ago, Curio said:

There's no feasible way to wrap up the entire show this season in a satisfying way. They've already written the standalone (if there's an EQ vs Charming sing off, then this is for sure a standalone) musical episode apparently, and they've probably already started writing the finale. There's not much room to change things if the execs pull the plug suddenly. If this was meant to be the final season, it sure didn't feel like it. I refuse to believe two Reginas dominating the screen time was A&E's ultimate plan for the final season.

There doesn't seem to be any plan whatsoever, they've been winging it for a while now and would most likely keep doing it until whenever it ends.

[retrograde]

I've never been one to get super bummed by spoilers and declare "I'm done!" but jeez, between the musical episode and "a precocious 10-year-old with a 'constant twinkle of mischief in her eye,'" I'm really struggling here.

[Curio]

3 minutes ago, retrograde said:

I've never been one to get super bummed by spoilers and declare "I'm done!" but jeez, between the musical episode and "a precocious 10-year-old with a 'constant twinkle of mischief in her eye,'" I'm really struggling here.

If these spoilers came out before Season 6 began I would agree, but an entire season of two Reginas has depleted my soul. I feel nothing now. 

[Free]

1 hour ago, retrograde said:

I've never been one to get super bummed by spoilers and declare "I'm done!" but jeez, between the musical episode and "a precocious 10-year-old with a 'constant twinkle of mischief in her eye,'" I'm really struggling here.

That description was horrible, this is supposed to be their selling point.

[Rumsy4]

6.19 is titled "The Black Fairy". She either dies in the episode--or Rumple dies. 

[Kktjones]

So after an entire half season of two Reginas, this half looks like it's shaping up to be all about the Stiltskin family. I'm starting to think Gideon will have more screen time than most of the mains. I still have yet to see one spoiler that's getting me excited about the second half. These are possibly the last few episodes of the series and it just all sounds so uninteresting. 

[Souris]

15 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

6.19 is titled "The Black Fairy". She either dies in the episode--or Rumple dies. 

Or maybe she puts her plan, whatever it is, into effect.

[Curio]

28 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

6.19 is titled "The Black Fairy". She either dies in the episode--or Rumple dies. 

I think she'll make it until the finale at least. If anyone is going to die, it's going to be in the two-part finale.

11 minutes ago, Souris said:

Or maybe she puts her plan, whatever it is, into effect.

6x19 is called "The Black Fairy" ... 6x20 is the musical episode. The Black Fairy's big evil plan is forcing everyone to sing!

[KingOfHearts]

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The Black Fairy's big evil plan is forcing everyone to sing!

She's going to force everyone to sing Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious until their ears bleed. 

[KAOS Agent]

I just don't understand how in what is definitely the final season of most of the main characters (Dungey straight up said S6 will tie a bow around the main story and S7 if it happens will be a reboot), this show is spending its back half focusing on Not!Robin, a character about whom in the past they could not care less, Gideon, a completely new character that no one cares about, and the Black Fairy, along with a very late season Zelena-centric. Add in a throwaway musical episode and I don't see how anyone's story is going to be done any justice. I guess I could be wrong and this might be the best half season ever, but this whole thing sounds like a hot mess. And a boring mess at that.

[sharky]

And you forgot we still have Aladdin and Jasmine in that mix too. 

[maryle]

Well, so Emma in maybe her last hours on the show won't even have a real centric.

The BF  could still be done in this episode and the final be finally about the mythology of the savior( featuring heavily Aladin, Jasmine) 

It is my last hope if not Emma if it is her last season will have a farewell worse than Will and Robin. She was supposed to be the protagonist! 

Edited February 18, 2017 by maryle

[Curio]

10 hours ago, KAOS Agent said:

I just don't understand how in what is definitely the final season of most of the main characters (Dungey straight up said S6 will tie a bow around the main story and S7 if it happens will be a reboot), this show is spending its back half focusing on Not!Robin, a character about whom in the past they could not care less, Gideon, a completely new character that no one cares about, and the Black Fairy, along with a very late season Zelena-centric. Add in a throwaway musical episode and I don't see how anyone's story is going to be done any justice.

 

 

That's kind of what I was getting at before—Season 6 doesn't feel at all like a final season. The fact that they're spending so much of 6B telling stories about Robin 2.0 (who A&E said might as well be a new character), Gideon (a new character), the Black Fairy (a new character), and Zelena apparently has a centric (the one regular character who has less screen time than Aladdin and Jasmine), and it seems like Season 7 has to happen. If it doesn't, this show might go down as one of the worst case examples of showrunners acting too cocky about renewal as they butcher the series ending.

I interpreted Dungey's comment about the bow as her saying the Season 6 finale will be wrapping up Season 6's plots. Emma's Savior shakes will be wrapped up, Regina's dual personality will be wrapped up, Aladdin and Jasmine will be wrapped up, and the Gideon/Belle/Rumple drama will be wrapped up. Those storylines can be wrapped up in a nice bow while still leaving room for A&E to give proper endings to the entire series in Season 7. Emma's happy ending and her relationship with Hook can be given proper closure in Season 7, Snow and Charming can be given proper closure, and hopefully a bunch of other dropped threads can be given proper closure (i.e., Mulan's search for love, Lily's dad, Emma finding out Regina killed Graham, whatever happened to Will, actually seeing more than 10 seconds of Hook and Emma living together, etc.) If the show resets and jumps forward a few years in Season 7, it can still give closure to those stories if the Season 6 finale doesn't get to them. (Which it won't.)

Edited February 18, 2017 by Curio

[Shanna Marie]

1 hour ago, Curio said:

hopefully a bunch of other dropped threads can be given proper closure (i.e., Mulan's search for love, Lily's dad, Emma finding out Regina killed Graham, whatever happened to Will, actually seeing more than 10 seconds of Hook and Emma living together, etc.

I suspect that we could get ten more seasons without them ever getting to any of these things because they don't care about those stories or think they're already resolved.

[Mathius]

On 2/18/2017 at 10:46 AM, Curio said:

Those storylines can be wrapped up in a nice bow while still leaving room for A&E to give proper endings to the entire series in Season 7. Emma's happy ending and her relationship with Hook can be given proper closure in Season 7, Snow and Charming can be given proper closure, and hopefully a bunch of other dropped threads can be given proper closure (i.e., Mulan's search for love, Lily's dad, Emma finding out Regina killed Graham, whatever happened to Will, actually seeing more than 10 seconds of Hook and Emma living together, etc.) 

Pahahahahahaha! Do you really think A&E would do that even if they get a Season 7?  No, they have no interest in any of it.  Sorry, but TS, TW.

They will not ever provide proper closure to Emma, Hook and the Charmings because to them, they're just props to Regina and Rumple's stories.

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6.19 is titled "The Black Fairy". She either dies in the episode--or Rumple dies. 

Or both.  Both would be nice.

Quote

I think she'll make it until the finale at least. If anyone is going to die, it's going to be in the two-part finale.

No, I'm sure she ends here.  Remember, the two-part finale is usually divorced from the arc that preceded it.

Cora, Zelena, the Queens of Darkness, and Hades never made it to their season finales, neither will the Black Fairy.

Edited February 19, 2017 by Mathius

[Curio]

2 minutes ago, Mathius said:

No, I'm sure she ends here.  Remember, the two-part finale is usually divorced from the arc that preceded it.

Cora, Zelena, the Queens of Darkness, and Hades never made it to their season finales, neither will the Black Fairy.

 

Yes, but this year is different because the musical episode throws everything off. The writers sometimes like using the penultimate episode as the villain send-off, but since that's going to be a throwaway episode now, I don't see how everything is going to get wrapped up before the musical in 6x19.

[Free]

On ‎2‎/‎18‎/‎2017 at 9:46 AM, Curio said:

That's kind of what I was getting at before—Season 6 doesn't feel at all like a final season. The fact that they're spending so much of 6B telling stories about Robin 2.0 (who A&E said might as well be a new character), Gideon (a new character), the Black Fairy (a new character), and Zelena apparently has a centric (the one regular character who has less screen time than Aladdin and Jasmine), and it seems like Season 7 has to happen. If it doesn't, this show might go down as one of the worst case examples of showrunners acting too cocky about renewal as they butcher the series ending.

I interpreted Dungey's comment about the bow as her saying the Season 6 finale will be wrapping up Season 6's plots. Emma's Savior shakes will be wrapped up, Regina's dual personality will be wrapped up, Aladdin and Jasmine will be wrapped up, and the Gideon/Belle/Rumple drama will be wrapped up. Those storylines can be wrapped up in a nice bow while still leaving room for A&E to give proper endings to the entire series in Season 7. Emma's happy ending and her relationship with Hook can be given proper closure in Season 7, Snow and Charming can be given proper closure, and hopefully a bunch of other dropped threads can be given proper closure (i.e., Mulan's search for love, Lily's dad, Emma finding out Regina killed Graham, whatever happened to Will, actually seeing more than 10 seconds of Hook and Emma living together, etc.) If the show resets and jumps forward a few years in Season 7, it can still give closure to those stories if the Season 6 finale doesn't get to them. (Which it won't.)

The writers don't have any plan, they're making things up, throwing in available guest stars to bring in, throwing in a musical episode, or whatever they have to fill out the episode order.  It's more evident than ever this season, it's why things are more aimless than usual on this show.

[Mathius]

2 hours ago, Curio said:

I don't see how everything is going to get wrapped up before the musical in 6x19.

We don't even know what the Black Fairy's plan is.  For all we know, it's something that can be wrapped up in just one episode.

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Quote

6.19 is titled "The Black Fairy". She either dies in the episode--or Rumple dies. 

Or both.  Both would be nice.

What? You don't want gender-bent Pan?! ;)

Quote

The writers don't have any plan, they're making things up, throwing in available guest stars to bring in, throwing in a musical episode, or whatever they have to fill out the episode order.  It's more evident than ever this season, it's why things are more aimless than usual on this show.

S6 is the first season where I feel like the writers have no idea what they're doing. Even though stuff like 4B was terrible, A&E were still putting effort into their vision. They were going somewhere with it. In S6, they just don't care any more. Now they're just taking ideas that "fans" have wanted for a long time as a last resort. (Such as the Wish Realm, the musical episode, and Aladdin.)

[Souris]

3 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

 In S6, they just don't care any more. Now they're just taking ideas that "fans" have wanted for a long time as a last resort. (Such as the Wish Realm, the musical episode, and Aladdin.)

And doing a terrible job on them (musical yet to be determined).

3 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

 

[Free]

18 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

What? You don't want gender-bent Pan?! ;)

S6 is the first season where I feel like the writers have no idea what they're doing. Even though stuff like 4B was terrible, A&E were still putting effort into their vision. They were going somewhere with it. In S6, they just don't care any more. Now they're just taking ideas that "fans" have wanted for a long time as a last resort. (Such as the Wish Realm, the musical episode, and Aladdin.)

The previous seasons had a structure to them, with split arcs, even though they turned messy.  S6 is more evident with them throwing everything they can and seeing if things stick.

[maryle]

I don't think the BF could playing a major part in the final because.

Traditionally the final is just slightly links to the overall arc of the season.

2) we already know Jasmine(by the actress tweet)  and with her probably Aladdin too will be in at least 21.  

Don't see how they can put all these elements together without be just too much even for them.

I can't see how they can 

[Mathius]

On 2/19/2017 at 5:45 PM, KingOfHearts said:

What? You don't want gender-bent Pan?! ;)

She already is.  Rumple's parent who abandoned him, is a powerful dark magic user and child snatcher like Rumple himself grows up to be, lives in a dark realm where time flows differently, raises Rumple's son in that dark realm, is used in the present day as some way of redeeming Rumple and having him reconcile with his son...it's the same damn story.  These writers have absolutely run out of originality. 

Edited February 21, 2017 by Mathius

[Souris]

8 minutes ago, Souris said:

Apparently Zelena hits the BF with her car.

Guess Zelena doesn't die or get shipped off to Oz in her centric the ep before.

[Curio]

5 minutes ago, Souris said:

Guess Zelena doesn't die or get shipped off to Oz in her centric the ep before.

Which begs the question...what important event even happens in Zelena's centric episode if she doesn't die or move off to Oz? Unless "Where Bluebirds Fly" somehow isn't a Zelena centric?

[Souris]

2 minutes ago, Curio said:

Which begs the question...what important event even happens in Zelena's centric episode if she doesn't die or move off to Oz? Unless "Where Bluebirds Fly" somehow isn't a Zelena centric?

It is a Zelena centric -- Bex filmed every day of the ep filming. And yes, that does beg the question of why they did a Zelena centric this late in the game of what is possibly the last few eps for some regular characters.

Edited February 21, 2017 by Souris

[Curio]

Maybe Zelena's centric is all about Regina and Zelena reconciling again, which would basically be a total rehash of last season's "Sisters."

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Apparently Zelena hits the BF with her car.

And the Most Random Spoiler of the Month award goes to...

They're doing a flip from Emerald City. Instead of a Wicked Witch getting hit by a car, she's hitting someone else with a car.

Edited February 21, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Rumsy4]

1 hour ago, Souris said:

Appears to be magic fight between Regina and the Black Fairy. Video. Doubles for Charmings and Hook in the background.

No storyline is safe from Woegina. 

[RulerofallIsurvey]

41 minutes ago, Rumsy4 said:

No storyline is safe from Woegina. 

Ugh.  Seriously.  Why is Regina fighting the BF?  To save Emma?  What ever happened to the woman who could save herself?  Especially if the BF is behind Gideon trying to kill Emma, I will be very upset if Regina has anything magically to do with saving Emma, other than lending a helping hand.  That would be okay.  But a full on magic fight between the two?  No.  Should be Emma taking the BF down, not Regina.  So I can only hope that Regina doesn't win this fight.  And Emma has to finish off the BF.  

ETA: Watched and rewatched the video.  To me, it looks like their filming the stunt where Zelena hits the BF with a car, so not sure that Regina and BF get in a magic fight.  Maybe Regina was trying to talk to BF and they did start to fight and along comes Crue...er...Zelena and Wham!

Edited February 21, 2017 by RulerofallIsurvey
just more speculation

[KingOfHearts]

At least Regina is doing something that doesn't involve Robin, Emma, Zelena, Snow, or her evil twin. I hope she doesn't stand a chance against Fairy Poppins, because that would be very REC if she did.

Edited February 21, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Watt]

I'm here for Captain Swan as everyone knows but I'm just ready for this show to be over already so Colin can go have sex on an HBO show.

[Curio]

Color me shocked that Espenson isn't writing the musical episode. I thought with her Buffy experience that she'd be chosen for it. Although I tend to like Goodman and Chambliss episodes more than Espenson episodes, so maybe that's good news for the musical.

[Souris]

14 minutes ago, Curio said:

Color me shocked that Espenson isn't writing the musical episode. I thought with her Buffy experience that she'd be chosen for it. Although I tend to like Goodman and Chambliss episodes more than Espenson episodes, so maybe that's good news for the musical.

I'm surprised too. She's only co-written one ep this half. I wonder if she's working on something outside the show. 

[Curio]

1 minute ago, Souris said:

I'm surprised too. She's only co-written one ep this half. I wonder if she's working on something outside the show. 

She has co-writer status on 6x15 ("A Wondrous Place") and 6x12 ("Murder Most Foul"), but it is kind of strange that she doesn't have a solo episode credit yet. She's one of the few writers who gets to pen episodes by herself. Maybe she'll write 6x21 and A&E will write 6x22?

[Free]

5 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

No storyline is safe from Woegina. 

That and they need doubles to stand around apparently.

Edited February 22, 2017 by Free

[KAOS Agent]

I have zero interest in any of the spoilers at this point, but I am very surprised at Belle's wardrobe. Why is she wearing a pantsuit and such conservative hair? It's like she went from vintage dress styled librarian to lawyer overnight. I know this show is pretty much over for me when a full day of action with every main character filming leaves me only wondering about wardrobe choices.

[maryle]

 The only storyline that I did find at least interesting interesting was the potential of tragic rumbelle. 

I knew I will not like the very previsible reconciliation but but they already are holding hands in ep. 19  So, the reconciliation will be rush and without any substance.

Well, I do hope that Rumbelle are gone by the end of this season. 

I am a beyond desapointed by Regina implications and hope it is not the final battle because really ..

Rumple, Gideon, Emma, Belle are the most connected to this story and it should be them with the help of the others including Regina that defeat the BF.

Edited February 22, 2017 by maryle

[Curio]

7 hours ago, KAOS Agent said:

I have zero interest in any of the spoilers at this point

There really isn't much substance to 6B. A good plot should be able to be summed up in 1-2 sentences. If A&E tried to explain 6B's plot in a sentence, it would probably be huge run-on sentence that turns into a paragraph because of all the commas, semicolons, and ellipses. Sadly, I think the most interesting thing in 6B will be Hook's random C-plot adventure with Ariel, and that'll only be on screen for 5 minutes. 

[maryle]

Honestly if you're favorite is not Regina 6b look meh!

But, I was looking at fanforum like I do sometimes to others perspective and I was surprised by the change over there there a lot of complaint about the overuse of Regina.

No, it doesn't cost from C's fans but from people who used to be favorable to Regina and be more critical towards cs. 

That exactly why I say there a risk to overplay Regina who is already near to be a real Mary Sue.

Ho! Tiger Lily is supposing to be in EP.19 so maybe she is in 3ep instead of 2 or it is 17-19.

Edited February 22, 2017 by maryle

[KingOfHearts]

I saw photos of Regina standing next to Zelena's car. (Of course Zelena would drive an ugly green car.) What if Regina and BF were fighting, Regina started losing, and Zelena just ran over BF to save her sister? 

Edited February 23, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Curio]

I keep getting confused because I associate BF with 'boyfriend', so I keep thinking Zelena is running over Robin with her car.

[KingOfHearts]

4 minutes ago, Curio said:

I keep getting confused because I associate BF with 'boyfriend', so I keep thinking Zelena is running over Robin with her car.

I'd be okay with that too.

[Souris]

Natalie Abrams on Reddit said the show is "bringing the story full circle."

That seems to lend credence to the theory about SB being cursed again, with perhaps CS in the Snowing role. And aged-up Henry maybe being visited by his half-sister (?) to lead him to SB?

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Regina seeks out Robin, of course, after realizing that everyone in the Enchanted Forest seems to be better off without her. That's an interesting concept, especially considering the previous episode was about how different, and arguably worse off, Emma was in the Wish Realm, so it's a nice switch to see the benefits of the Wish Realm. I think Regina has probably come to understand the negative consequences of the choices she made as the Evil Queen during the many seasons she's spent redeeming herself, but to actually see how things would have been otherwise is another story.

LOL. Even in the universe where Regina gets everything she has ever wanted, she's still the victim. I highly doubt it will have to do with her response to how much "better" things are without the Evil Queen. In the previous episode, she was laughing at how ridiculous it all was. I'm pretty sure these reviews are drawing from a single off-handed line she says to Robin. It's all going to be about Robin angst, and nothing about Evil Queen introspection.

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Rumple and Belle have an incredibly difficult relationship and things are still contentious between them, but in this premiere they do find common ground in ways you wouldn’t expect.

Common ground like, "OMG our son wants to kill us both"?

Quote

As a whole, I found the episode lacking; with so many characters pulled in different directions, things felt unfocused and generally somewhat tedious. There's a lot of standing around and talking about hope, fate, exposition, etc. and not a lot of heart. It's clear that big things are being set up for the rest of the season, but watching ground being laid doesn't make for a very interesting episode in and of itself. There are a few highlights, and the prospect of the rest of the season is intriguing, but it's not enough to save this from being one of the weaker premieres Once has turned out.

This pretty much spells out how the show has been for a while. "There's a lot of standing around and talking about hope, fate, exposition, etc. and not a lot of heart." That sums it up perfectly. It's just the characters running around reacting to PLOT.

Quote

There's a substantial flashback that reveals some important origin information for Emma Swan.

Apprentice: "Hello, Emma."
Wee!Emma: "Wait... how do you know my name?"
Apprentice: "I have something important to tell you - some day you're going to die. Alright, gotta go! Bye!"

(I know it's actually the ugly duckling scene.)

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The Wish Realm is pretty straight-forward, but we are left with some interesting things that are not explained. Are they purposeful or are they loopholes? Only time will tell!

This is Once Upon a Time. They're loopholes.

Quote

“I believe in you, Emma.”

Can you guess who says this? You said Snow? Wrong! It's Regina.

Quote

“War is coming to Storybrooke.”

It's the promo voiceover- I mean Rumple.

I feel like I've already watched the episode. Let's just move to the rest of 6B already. This break has been way too long for events that happen immediately after the finale. It's not going to flow at all because there's really nothing to start with. It's not a new arc, there was no major cliffhanger other than Robin+Gideon (and we know how that's going to play out), and it's just a continuation of the previous episode. They released it to the press early, so there's really no mystery to it. Also, this time we don't have a major franchise to look forward to, unlike every single arc since 3A.

No one but OQ or Rumpbelle shippers have anything to be excited about. And even then, they're really not into it any more. The CS proposal is getting very little press, which makes no sense to me. A&E have taken the football away from Charlie Brown too many times to keep any shippers interested.

Edited February 23, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Rumsy4]

10 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

A&E have taken the football away from Charlie Brown too many times to keep any shippers interested.

Excellently put! I'm unable to conjure up an iota of interest or excitement for the remainder of the season. I don't trust the writers one bit. 

[RadioGirl27]

From Natalie Abrams on Reddit, more confirmation that there is no CS "epic adventure"

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From what I learned while on set, that “epic adventure” appears to still be on, but there’s definitely a twist that makes it unlike previously adventures (Snow and Emma in Enchanted Forest, Emma and Regina in Wish Realm) we’ve seen.

Edited February 23, 2017 by RadioGirl27