Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Mari]

Did they actually find David's dad's body?  I don't remember, and the thought of tracking down the episode and watching it again is . . . not something I want to contemplate.  

If they didn't, he could've ended up in the untold stories land.  (Or did they spoiler that already?  I read stuff, but have been avoiding the sneak-peeks and a few of the interviews.)

[MaiLuna]

8 minutes ago, Mari said:

Sorry.  That fell under the REC.  

Anything Hook did was just wrong, and should be taken seriously.  

:)

I don't know what REC means. And I would love for it to be taken seriously, but some crimes (this one would be murder but Snow and Charming transfering darkness to what they thought was a dragon) have gotten more flack than others. Some happened onscreen and haven't been found out yet, but now they're gonna add new ones instead of dealing with those. Killian killing his own father is worse IMO but that wasn't dealt with. 

[Mari]

Just now, MaiLuna said:

I don't know what REC means. 

Regina Exception Clause.

For those times when Regina's done something, and no one's allowed to react naturally to it--not even Regina.  

[Mathius]

Another example of the REC at play...Snow kills Cora to save everyone, and that's terrible.  Emma kills Cruella to save Henry, and that's terrible.  Regina kills Edmond to save Snow and Charming, and "it's not your fault, you did what you had to do, don't blame yourself!"  

(Also, the REC extends to when heroes kill others to save Regina.  See Charming slaying Percival.)

Edited October 3, 2016 by Mathius

[RadioGirl27]

3 hours ago, MaiLuna said:

So now I'm convinced Hook killed David's father. But if he forgave Regina, he can forgive Hook easily too, right? -__- 

Lol, no. He would not forgive him and neither would Snow and Henry. With Emma, I'm still on the verge. 

[KAOS Agent]

At least from Colin's interviews it sounded like Emma couldn't care less about what Hook did in the past, so she's in his corner with regards to David/Hook issues. 

[Hookian]

They got to go through all this drama with Hook and his future in laws before they can get CS engaged it's so obvious.

 

It's also so obvious that after this episode the person in the hood is Emma.

[Serena]

7 hours ago, KAOS Agent said:

At least from Colin's interviews it sounded like Emma couldn't care less about what Hook did in the past, so she's in his corner with regards to David/Hook issues. 

If Snowing can forgive Regina for ruining their daughter's childhood, David can get over this as well.

[RedKeep]

7 hours ago, KAOS Agent said:

At least from Colin's interviews it sounded like Emma couldn't care less about what Hook did in the past, so she's in his corner with regards to David/Hook issues. 

I think that's part of what makes this pairing less and less interesting to me, though. I don't necessarily need full-blown, all season long drama, but Emma's complete lack of reaction of these things just sucks so much potential out of the dynamic and makes me wonder what the point is of giving Hook these connections to other character's backstories in the first place. And yes, obviously OUAT has a long history of making the Charmings get over other characters' misdeeds way too quickly even for tv standards, but I do think in this case it tends to be even more rushed. Because while the Charmings and Rumple or the Charmings and Regina at least have a 5 seasons worth of a flashbacks and present tense episodes to look back and there's at least a general sense of actual conflict being acknowledged, Hook's centrics almost seem even more pointless to me since you know whatever potential source of conflict they'll introduce won't be dealt with properly. Instead it's limited to one episode and Emma likely won't even be the one to care one way or another. It's all part of their general problem with writing love interests well, look at Belle and Robin, but while those two barely get/got any decent screentime to begin with that's not an issue with Hook. They just manage to make sure his screentime and his centrics just feels like a formulaic, shallow waste of potential to me, shrug. 

[Mathius]

2 hours ago, Serena said:

If Snowing can forgive Regina for ruining their daughter's childhood, David can get over this as well.

Let's not forget Snow forgiving Regina for killing HER father.  

[InsertWordHere]

Quote

Mekenna Melvin as Clorinda, Goldie Hoffman as Tisbe,

A quick google says these are the names of Cinderella's stepsisters in an Opera version of the story. So does this mean Anastasia has been erased as Ella's stepsister, or does she have more than two?

[Hookian]

And just like that I'm hyped!

[YaddaYadda]

It really looks like a CS heavy episode, with a side of Henry. Henry can go fluff Regina's aura, that's what he's good at.

[Curio]

When they say, "Emma considers taking her relationship with Hook to the next level," do they mean that she's finally ready to ask her True Love boyfriend—the one who picked out her house and the one she went to the Underworld to save—to move in with her? Whoa, pump your breaks there, kid. Don't move so fast!

[YaddaYadda]

2 minutes ago, Curio said:

When they say, "Emma considers taking her relationship with Hook to the next level," do they mean that she's finally ready to ask her True Love boyfriend—the one who picked out her house and the one she went to the Underworld to save—to move in with her? Whoa, pump your breaks there, kid. Don't move so fast!

Probably. I've been wondering if he isn't already staying with her.

I think she talks about Killian in her therapy session with Archie.

Edited October 3, 2016 by YaddaYadda

[daxx]

1 minute ago, Curio said:

When they say, "Emma considers taking her relationship with Hook to the next level," do they mean that she's finally ready to ask her True Love boyfriend—the one who picked out her house and the one she went to the Underworld to save—to move in with her? Whoa, pump your breaks there, kid. Don't move so fast!

The sarcasm is strong in this one, hmmmm.

[Shanna Marie]

14 minutes ago, Curio said:

When they say, "Emma considers taking her relationship with Hook to the next level," do they mean that she's finally ready to ask her True Love boyfriend—the one who picked out her house and the one she went to the Underworld to save—to move in with her? Whoa, pump your breaks there, kid. Don't move so fast!

Nah, the next level is probably going to be that movie night. They're going to have a stay-in date rather than going out, with Henry there. And that makes it "next level" because Hook is being incorporated into her family rather than just being a boyfriend.

Or else it'll just be that she's going to think about maybe someday telling him about her vision.

[RadioGirl27]

1 hour ago, YaddaYadda said:

I think she talks about Killian in her therapy session with Archie.

Yeah, this. I doubt the "next step", whatever it is, is going to happen during the episode. She would tell something to Archie about Hook, maybe after seeing him playing with Henry. Or maybe seeing the two boys together helps make a decision about the secret and that next step. But  I really hope she tells Hook about the vision before asking him to move in with her.

And it seems they have really made Regina a new outfit for every episode. Way to waste the budget (even if the dresses are amazing).

[Mathius]

1 hour ago, InsertWordHere said:

A quick google says these are the names of Cinderella's stepsisters in an Opera version of the story. So does this mean Anastasia has been erased as Ella's stepsister, or does she have more than two?

In Wonderland 1x05, Lady Tremaine tells Ana "Off with you, then. At least I still have your sisters."  So there's more than two.

[Shanna Marie]

5 minutes ago, RadioGirl27 said:

And it seems they have really made Regina a new outfit for every episode. Way to waste the budget (even if the dresses are amazing).

I do like that blue one in the episode pictures. But is that current Evil Queen or past Regina? The loose hair would suggest past Regina who's not yet full-on evil, but maybe Evil Queen had a fashion intervention.

Also, Colin looks like he's having way too much fun in those pictures. It's nice to see a genuine smile on Hook, for a change, without that haunted look, but it's almost out of character for him to look that happy. Cue Emma angst. She sees him looking happy after everything he's gone through and she doesn't want to ruin it by telling him about her dire fate, so she balks on telling him after having decided she was going to. Except that would require them to remember the "after everything he's gone through" part, which hasn't been mentioned at all this season (seriously, people, coming back from the dead after weeks in the Underworld and a funeral/tombstone should kind of be a big deal, shouldn't it? Did they take down the tombstone? Is it still there? Though I guess that would depend on whether there's still a body buried there, which depends on whether that body was healed, de-rotted and revived or whether the Underworld soul body was made corporeal).

[KAOS Agent]

Snow helps Jekyll find the perfect laboratory. So Snow is going through the whole 3B Zelena is the perfect midwife arc again? Jekyll is going to turn out to be evil too. He'll no doubt act totally sketchy and Snow will remain oblivious and champion him if others comment on the sketchiness.  I wish I had more faith in this show to be more creative than this, but it is what it is. Prove me wrong, writers.

[Curio]

The only reason I'm excited for Snow helping Jekyll find a new lab is the fun awkward conversations she and Dr. Whale might have.

[Mathius]

I knew Whale was in 6x04, but I didn't realize he first appears here, so that's a pleasant surprise. 

[Souris]

37 minutes ago, KAOS Agent said:

Snow helps Jekyll find the perfect laboratory. So Snow is going through the whole 3B Zelena is the perfect midwife arc again? Jekyll is going to turn out to be evil too. He'll no doubt act totally sketchy and Snow will remain oblivious and champion him if others comment on the sketchiness.  I wish I had more faith in this show to be more creative than this, but it is what it is. Prove me wrong, writers.

Will he offer her tea ominously?

[PixiePaws1]

I  cant help but think showing Regina and Henry sword fighting/learning to sword fight ...is about throwing out red herrings as to who could be the cloaked figure...especially since the cloaked figure seems to do the signature twirls that Killian is likely teaching Henry and already taught Emma (in offscreensville). this plus Emma's comment about worried Regina is the cloaked figure  plus a reminder that Snow and Charming are good with swords makes me think it is all misdirect and that whwhoever is under the cloak will be one person we haven't actually seen with a sword..or it's Emma!

[InsertWordHere]

6 hours ago, Mathius said:

In Wonderland 1x05, Lady Tremaine tells Ana "Off with you, then. At least I still have your sisters."  So there's more than two.

(Sorry I made the quote box get stuck again!) Oh, you're right! I had totally forgotten about that. It was after Ella married Thomas too. Hopefully they'll mention Anastasia. 

Edited October 4, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[Rumsy4]

I'm kinda worried about Hook's involvement in Charming's father's death. I hope he didn't straight up murder him like Regina murdered Snow's father. The writers do like to tear down Hook at regular intervals, but this would be one retcon too much for me, especially becasue everything will be swept under the rug in two episodes. Or Charming will resent Hook for the rest of the series, neither of which alternative is good. I read a theory that suggested Captain Nemo might be responsible, and Hook knew about it (w/o knowing it was David's father, of course). Maybe David will be tempted to kill Captain Nemo, and Hook will stop him, saying revenge is not the best option, etc. etc..

[YaddaYadda]

David's father story is something that could have set off Hook very easily.

1. The baby selling
2. Rumple's involvement

I am more inclined to think that whatever happened to David's father, it happened with someone who went to the Land of Untold Stories.

Regina killed the Count of Monte Cristo, Ashley is trying to get even with her step-family, there's a crazy scientists reunion in 6x04.

I'm actually hoping that maybe the drunk father is still alive and just decided to leave the Enchanted Forest.

It's interesting that we\re also going to find out more about Hook's father's side of the family as well. So maybe there's a tie in there (a non familial one that is). But this is the perfect time to change Brennan's story from 5x11 and that stupid sleeping curse story.

[Rumsy4]

8 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

David's father story is something that could have set off Hook very easily.

1. The baby selling
2. Rumple's involvement

OOh. Good point! That would naturally make him despise the man.

Quote

I'm actually hoping that maybe the drunk father is still alive and just decided to leave the Enchanted Forest.

That would be a nice twist. And yes--please let Brennan have gone there as well. 

[Mathius]

Yeah, I definitely think Hook and David's father met at the bar, and something David's father said while drunk is why Hook did what he did.

Edited October 5, 2016 by Mathius

[YaddaYadda]

1 minute ago, Mathius said:

Yeah, I definitely think Hook and David's father met at the bar, and something David's father said while drunk is why Hook did what he did.

Drink, gambling, guy says he brokered a deal with Rumple and gave him his infant son. Hook maybe has no clue that the baby has gone to King George and even if he did, he doesn't know in what capacity it is. For someone who was himself sold into indentured servitude as a child, I can easily see all of this just coming to a head.

[PixiePaws1]

perhaps Hook took all David's dad's money by cheating at liar's dice and being broke is what put Ruth and David's dad in the position that resulted in feeling they had no choice but to sell James to George....

[Curio]

When Hook was listing off his rings, he didn't mention the story behind one of them...perhaps that's David's father's story. (The show already broke their own continuity by ignoring the fact that Hook had his rings in "The Crocodile.") But I'm leaning more towards Hook being indirectly involved with the incident instead of the main culprit. Hook will probably be with him at the tavern getting drunk, and I could see Hook being the guy who cheats him at dice or pushes him to get more drunk, but I can't see him committing murder. Hook rarely kills anyone unless they're another pirate or they're in the way of his revenge against Rumple. I don't see David's father getting in the way of his revenge.

So that leaves Hook being the one who gets David's father a little too drunk, which leads to the cart in the ravine accident. Or they could make David's father more heroic and he tries to help save a drunken Hook from falling off the ravine, but that's what gets him killed. Or they could go dark and have David's dad commit suicide, and because he told Hook about the son he had back home, Hook doesn't want to make that son feel like his dad purposely abandoned him like Brennan did, so Hook pushes the cart down the ravine to make it look like an accident. There are plenty of interesting ways the writers can take this story without dragging Hook's character through the mud, so of course that's exactly what they're going to do.

[YaddaYadda]

There's a DVR description floating around that says "David tries to find his father."

Maybe he's really alive?

[Curio]

Interesting. So maybe Hook helped David's father escape to the Land of Untold Stories, and once he was gone, Hook made it look like a cart crash to push people off the trail of his real reasoning?

[InsertWordHere]

I've been thinking Papa Charming is in the LoUS as well. Maybe Emma will actually get to meet one of her grandparents. Fittingly, it will probably be the least deserving one, unless we're counting King George. Still mad none of them popped up in the Underworld. Grumble grumble. But it's probably better this way. Otherwise, Eva and Leo would have been blamed for everything bad that's ever happened to the Mills family. 

So it looks like sneak peeks will be coming out on Thursdays this season? 

ETA: The synopsis says David makes a deal with Gold for info about his father (and Regina tries to get info from Hyde this ep too; what's with everyone going to the villains and just trusting their answers this season?). Maybe it's as simple as Gold pointing him in Hook's direction, all the while knowing it's not as simple as he will make it seem to David. 

Edited October 5, 2016 by InsertWordHere

[Shanna Marie]

I thought there was supposed to be some Hook and David bromance stuff before the horrible secret comes out. So far, they've barely interacted, so it's not like a rift is going to change much of anything. Or did they consider them jointly arresting Hyde to be a bonding activity? Are they going to be devastated that this horrible secret will ruin future joint arrests?

[Rumsy4]

Quote

Maybe it's as simple as Gold pointing him in Hook's direction, all the while knowing it's not as simple as he will make it seem to David. 

David is typically quick to misjudge Hook. So, it would be natural for him jump to the conclusion that the pirate killed his father, while the truth lay elsewhere.

[Serena]

9 hours ago, InsertWordHere said:

 Maybe Emma will actually get to meet one of her grandparents.

I'm willing to bet that, if Charming's dad is alive, he will completely ignore his granddaughter. MAYBE he will acknowledge he has a grandson. MAYBE.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Serena

[YaddaYadda]

Regina needs to stop trying to feed her lasagna to people.

All this aside though, I'm guessing the EQ being one step ahead of Regina makes her smarter than Regina? Why is that cell not magic immune? I'm assuming the EQ poofed herself in and out of there. And why didn't she release Hyde? She "bribed" him with comfort, food and cigars. How easy is he? Did he not ask for his freedom in return for information?

Edited October 6, 2016 by YaddaYadda

[Mathius]

And it's another episode of the Regina/Snow/Charming pairing.  Because of course it is.  Sigh...

[YaddaYadda]

2 minutes ago, Mathius said:

And it's another episode of the Regina/Snow/Charming pairing.  Because of course it is.  Sigh...

On the plus side, Hyde is spelling it out to Regina that she and the EQ are one. That's probably the entire reason she didn't die when she crushed her heart. 

Seriously, I'm really wondering about Snow at this point and how accepting she will be of this.

[Rumsy4]

Just now, Rumsy4 said:

Sneak Peek 2: Cinderella 

I hope they explain the missing Anastasia in the episode.

 

35 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

On the plus side, Hyde is spelling it out to Regina that she and the EQ are one. That's probably the entire reason she didn't die when she crushed her heart. 

Ooh. And I bet the other way would work though. That's why Hyde tried to kill Jekyll.

[YaddaYadda]

The Cinderella flashback was a 100 times better than the flashbacks from 6x02. Not gonna lie, it got me excited for the episode.

[KingOfHearts]

I couldn't get into the sneak peek, since it was like every single Cinderella adaptation there ever was. I did, however, like Lady Tremaine's appearance. Very intimidating, but posh. 1x04 and OUATIW twisted the Cinderella tale quite a bit, so I'm hoping this episode will bring something else to the table.

When the stepsisters coined "Cinder + Ella", it was like they found a new ship name.

Quote

Regina needs to stop trying to feed her lasagna to people.

Why didn't they just ask Jekyll for information?

Edited October 6, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[Kktjones]

From the 6x03 press release: "Then there’s David (Josh Dallas) who makes a deal with Gold (Robert Carlyle)—is that ever a good idea?—and delivers a message to Belle (Emilie De Ravin) in hopes of getting new information about his father."

Since the Evil Queen gave him the coin and intimated that she knew something about his father, why wouldn't David just go to Regina and ask her? They are the same person, so she would know just as much as the EQ, right?

[YaddaYadda]

18 minutes ago, Kktjones said:

"Then there’s David (Josh Dallas) who makes a deal with Gold (Robert Carlyle)—is that ever a good idea?—and delivers a message to Belle (Emilie De Ravin) in hopes of getting new information about his father."

This spoiler bugs the hell out of me. Belle is trying to stay away from Rumple. She's trying to do what's best for herself and her baby, David delivers her a message from the guy she's trying to stay away from as part of the deal.

Nice going, douche nozzle!

[Rumsy4]

7 minutes ago, YaddaYadda said:

This spoiler bugs the hell out of me. Belle is trying to stay away from Rumple. She's trying to do what's best for herself and her baby, David delivers her a message from the guy she's trying to stay away from as part of the deal.

Nice going, douche nozzle!

Bad form, Dave! People in healthy relationships sometimes just don't get the danger of abusive ones. After this, if he starts acting like a jerk to Hook--who is currently protecting Belle--that will be height of hypocrisy. I'm not saying David shouldn't be angry, etc., but his reactions to Hook as a pirate are always so overblown for the sake of drama. That's literally the only conflict the writers can conjure up between the two--based on his royal status and Hook's pirate status. Nevermind their origins were equally humble (and worse in Killian's case). 

[KingOfHearts]

Why are people still going to Rumple for help, again? He has a consistent history of screwing them over, regardless of whether or not they fulfill the terms of the deal.

My guess is that Ella prevented one of her stepsisters from getting their happy ending somehow, and now they're out for revenge. It's interesting that both the stepsisters have dark hair like their mother. Could Anastasia be Ella's biological sister?

Edit: Nevermind. In the OUATIW flashbacks, Lady Tremaine says flat out she gave birth to her. I'm beginning to wonder if Anastasia is even Ella's sister to begin with. Continuity? What's that?

Edited October 6, 2016 by KingOfHearts

[Mathius]

It'd be ridiculous if Anastasia was from some other family with an overbearing mother where her stepsister got to marry a prince.

But as said before, in OUATIW Lady Tremaine said Anastasia has sisters, not just one sister, and this was after the whole Cinderella story, so it's possible there will be an explanation as to why she isn't present in the flashback...perhaps she already moved out and got her own place.

Edited October 6, 2016 by Mathius