tri4335 October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 This may be one of those "impossible conditions" things that come up in fairy tales -- in order to do whatever (kill the Darkness, reunite the sword, etc.), the Dark One and the holder of the sword have to have true love for each other. And that'll never happen because the person who draws Excalibur has to be a hero, and the Dark One will never really love a hero, and a hero couldn't possibly love a Dark One. They're enemies! It even seems like Arthur wants to get the Dark One just to get the dagger to complete the sword, and that can't happen without him loving the Dark One. But now we have this rare case where it can actually happen. I like this theory! I'm starting to get the sense that they are going to go with Emma always being the "Savior" of all evil sources and not just for the curse. If they go down the path of mythology, it is full of destined lovers who are driven apart by outside forces. I'm not sure that this was always planned but it is a logical path to follow now. This goes with the overarch of all these characters who seem to have different agendas (Blue, the apprentice, Merlin and help/hinder as needed) and what Emma and Killian are is the true balance of good and evil - which ties into their love of Star Wars. They both are filled with light and dark. Link to comment
mjgchick October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Emma did do dark things for the right reasons a few times. She also has a temper so I guess I can see her saying "Fuck it." and goes dark but this just seems odd to me as well. Link to comment
KingOfHearts October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) “We do address where Ruby has been all this time, and that’s part of the story.” So with whatever solution they've come up with, everyone would have to be either totally fine with her absence or had mourned over her loss offscreen for about 5 seconds. Red would have also had to have been in the Enchanted Forest this whole time since the picture shows her there and she was not present when Granny's went airborne. They're also going to have to pull another realm-jump out of a hat since Ruby did in fact come back with Curse 2. Mulan could be explained as being outside the purview of the curse. Maybe she ditched the Merry Man and went back to Ancient China to stop the Siamese Cat assassins from killing the emperor. Edited October 16, 2015 by KingOfHearts Link to comment
Rumsy4 October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) So, are they bringing back Red and Mulan for just the two-hour episode with Merida? How odd! I assumed we would see them in other episodes as well. From the Hot Seat interview Will Hook being able to take a heart be revisited this season?HOROWITZ: Yes. So, chekhov's hook is coming back into play. Maybe Merlin's heart will be removed using the hook. I'm so glad that they've confirmed Emma heart is still in her chest (phew). Is Hook’s father (Adam Croasdell) alive in present day?HOROWITZ: Can’t say.Are the symbols on Hook’s ring a clue to his past?KITSIS: Yes. Ohh.. intriguing! Those pictures floating around comparing Hook's gemstone rings to the red stone on Excalibur may have a point after all. Maybe Hook's dad did/does have a Camelot connection. No Lily or August in S5A. Edited October 16, 2015 by Rumsy4 Link to comment
OnceUponAJen October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) ^ That answer may mean my theory about Hook's father being in the underworld may be correct! Either that, or he may just appear in flashbacks. I really love the questions/answers in that EW interview! Edited October 16, 2015 by OnceUponAJen Link to comment
YaddaYadda October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 So "can't say" means "yes", right or "we haven't thought about it, but it's a good idea." 5 Link to comment
KingOfHearts October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 So, chekhov's hook is coming back into play. Maybe Merlin's heart will be removed using the hook. I'm so glad that they've confirmed Emma heart is still in her chest (phew). So they used an inconsistency to create a consistency? #OnceLogic 4 Link to comment
scenicbyway October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Hook has two big rings that he wears in addition to some smaller ones when he has his hand. I think the red gemstone ring with the little flowers around it most likely resembles Excalibur but I'm seeing on Tumblr that the other large ring with the Carnelian stone looks like Lancelot's armor in design... Link to comment
chrisvee October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 I'm assuming Merida is the one to train Gold to be the purest bravest hero ever??? Link to comment
RadioGirl27 October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) Liam is coming back, yay! (Yeah, that's the only thing I care from that interview) Edited October 16, 2015 by RadioGirl27 3 Link to comment
orza October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 So "can't say" means "yes", right or "we haven't thought about it, but it's a good idea." "Can't say" means it would be a big spoiler if we answered. 2 Link to comment
Souris October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Probably young Liam in flashback, since we're getting young Killian. So, somebody noticed that in the BTS filming pic of Killian wielding Excalibur, all his jewelry has turned totally black. Does that mean he's become the Dark One? Or is sharing the Darkness with Emma somehow? Link to comment
PixiePaws1 October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) Did Killian take out the heart that was crushed for the curse? If so was he complicit in the casting of the curse or was he compelled and, if so, by who? The curse caster has to crush the heart but do they have to have been the one to take it out because I don't think so. I am not sure that Emma wasn't compelled by the dagger or a threat to Killian's life for her part in designing the curse cos I have always been certain she didn't cast it. Not to do with the above but I am getting a vibe either Killian pulls out supposed hero-ed up Rumple heart to check if it has changed color ....or his own heart to offer it to Emma (hers anyway) to either make a point (talk her down from doing something truly evil-please no Show-don't do that to Emma) or to remake the sword. Edited October 16, 2015 by PixiePaws1 Link to comment
OnceUponAJen October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) Probably young Liam in flashback, since we're getting young Killian. So, somebody noticed that in the BTS filming pic of Killian wielding Excalibur, all his jewelry has turned totally black. Does that mean he's become the Dark One? Or is sharing the Darkness with Emma somehow? I wondered if Killian might have.taken on the darkness for Emma in some way since his name is on the sword. Rumple is fighting him (trying to kill him or take something from him?). If both their names are on Excalibur, maybe they are both now balancing each other (half light/half dark). Edited October 16, 2015 by OnceUponAJen 1 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) Yay for the return of Liam! Young or older version is fine by me. I'm just happy he's back! So at least it sounds like they aren't dropping the chekhov's hook like they did the phone call from 4a. Happy that Emma still has her heart. The answer about August cracks me up. This is why I want an episode focused on the minor characters while the mains are running around like maniacs in the background. I can just imagine August sitting at a desk sipping on his coffee and eating a bagel while his typewriter goes *click clack* as he watches King Arthur charge down mainstreet and the Dark Swan mess with the dwarves. Edited October 16, 2015 by HoodlumSheep 2 Link to comment
Mathius October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Chekhov's hook will take out his own heart and split it with Emma. Calling it now. Will we see Belle (Emilie de Ravin) confront Regina over taking her heart?KITSIS: She is unaware that it happened. ...YES, SHE FREAKING IS! Gold TOLD her when he returned the heart! She reacted and everything! Dear lord, the retconning, audience-insulting lengths these guys will go too in order to whitewash Regina.... 7 Link to comment
Shanna Marie October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 I'm so glad that they've confirmed Emma heart is still in her chest (phew). I thought the way it was phrased said Emma has *a* heart in her chest. It didn't specify that it was her own. 2 Link to comment
KingOfHearts October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) Did Cora (Barbara Hershey) lie about killing Lancelot (Sinqua Walls)?KITSIS: Yes. I think this pretty much confirms it's really Lancelot. Will we ever see Robin Hood’s (Sean Maguire) backstory and the dark side that we’ve heard so much about?KITSIS: Second half of the season, absolutely. Like how they gave us more of Will's story in 4B? Will Rumple have any kind of magic?HOROWITZ: No. I know I've already commented on this, but according to the show's magical mechanics this shouldn't be possible. While Emma is evil, will we see her interact with Lily (Agnes Bruckner) at all?KITSIS: No. Well of course not, because that would actually make freaking sense. Since David Anders is returning, can we hope to see Rose McIver back as Tink someday? KITSIS: It’ll be the second half of the season, but we’re absolutely trying. The writers love to push everything to the back-half of the season, only to say later they didn't have time to fit everything in. It's aggravating. Any chance we’ll see Barbara Hershey or Rose McGowan as Cora again this season?HOROWITZ: Again, we’d love to say, but we can’t. Okay, now my head is really spinning about 5B having the characters confronting their pasts through a sort of "hell". Will there be more death this season?KITSIS: Absolutely. People die. My current theory is Guinevere casting the curse with Lancelot as the crushed heart. Edited October 16, 2015 by KingOfHearts Link to comment
YaddaYadda October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Arthur will see the error of his ways? I'm here for this! 4 Link to comment
sharky October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 OK, crazy balls theory, but could Hook take his own heart? I know this sounds weird, but what if Hook uses his hook on himself and by removing his heart, he can pull Excalibur from the stone. There are just too many things that make me hate the idea of him sharing a heart with Emma so I really feel like something else has to be going on. Link to comment
OnceUponAJen October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 ^ Regina took her own heart before the witch fight in S3, so I don't see why not! Link to comment
PixiePaws1 October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 There's a new script tease up but I can't quote it using my phone. After reading it my over spoiled brain went somewhere crazy thinking Killian pulled out the heart of Violet's horse to crush for the curse. ..but that is just crazy talk. I have always thought it was Lancelot that sacrificed his heart willingly for the curse for the good of Camelot. Link to comment
Mathius October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 (edited) Problem is that Lancelot is in Granny's Diner next episode. He can't have been the sacrifice. Okay, now my head is really spinning about 5B having the characters confronting their pasts through a sort of "hell". If that's the case, I hope they get Stephen Lord back to be Malcolm. Edited October 16, 2015 by Mathius Link to comment
YaddaYadda October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Problem is that Lancelot is in Granny's Diner next episode. He can't have been the sacrifice. I think Lancelot is in Granny's diner in Camelot, not in Storybrooke. Snow is dressed in her Camelot get up during the confrontation with Arthur in the diner. 4 Link to comment
Mathius October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 Ooooooh yeah, I forgot that Granny's was there. You're probably right. Link to comment
mjgchick October 16, 2015 Share October 16, 2015 So we'll see Lancelot actually die this time. I can't handle another Sinqua characters death. Link to comment
Hookian October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 (edited) I cannot wait to see Papa Hook in present day and his reunion with his son. Should be all kinds of angsty. More Killian is always a good thing, as well as more CS and Emma. I think people are going to be very disappointed about Hook being a King. lol I don't think we'll see him take the throne or anything but I think it will be stated that he is the rightful ruler as he wields Excalibur. Which only belongs to the king of Camelot. So I think Hook is gonna be king but only technically not like he's gonna literally be the king of Camelot now. Edited October 17, 2015 by Hookian Link to comment
PixiePaws1 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 I have the idea that Papa Jones is subbing for Charon and comes to take Killian and Emma to the underworld. . 3 Link to comment
Hookian October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 I have the idea that Papa Jones is subbing for Charon and comes to take Killian and Emma to the underworld. . I think he's gonna be Davy Jones which is a Charon type of role. They both carry souls into the underworld and take them. Davy may be a moniker like Hook is Killians 1 Link to comment
Dianthus October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Remember how e'rybody got their knickers in a twist over the idea that Killian was a prince, and then it turned out to be a spoiler about his costume? Even if drawing the sword from the stone means he's the new king of Camelot, I don't see him ascending the throne. Especially not if Arthur comes to see the error of his ways. It does suggest that he's the one to go full hero, tho. If so, YAY! So Zelena literally turned green with envy. Seems as if Killian will literally be falling for Emma? CS True Love is literally a weapon against the Darkness? It's gonna be a blast watching heads explode in certain segments of fandom. Who's bringing the popcorn? I've got a 2ltr of Coke and half a bottle of Pyrat rum to contribute. 2 Link to comment
Shanna Marie October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 I've been wondering about the speculation about whether Hook's jewelry has any link to Excalibur, and my question is, how could that work, since he wasn't always a pirate? Did he happen to have all that stuff lying around in case he ever decided to be a pirate? Was he somehow drawn to those particular pieces when he was plundering? If it's all stuff his dad left behind, did two abandoned kids not have to resort to selling off jewelry in order to get by? Did Papa Hook tell Liam to hang on to these things because they were their heritage, and then Killian found them among Liam's things after his death and started wearing them all when he became a pirate? I can't really imagine any role that an adult Liam could play, unless his baby brother runs into him in the Underworld. There seems to be more potential story surrounding him in the past, like if he was old enough to understand more about where they came from and why their father left, and he didn't get a chance to fill Killian in on the things he'd need to know before he died. 1 Link to comment
YaddaYadda October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 So, winter finale is called "Swan Song"? Sort of slaps you in the face on your way out the door. I'm sure nothing significant will be happening, like at all! (I'm being cheeky btw) 4 Link to comment
HoodlumSheep October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 (edited) ^ cheesy, but at least A&E are owning it. Maybe Hook kept a box or a chest or nap-sack like Emma was shown to have in 4x05 that has a few things from his past. He is sentimental after all. Edited October 17, 2015 by HoodlumSheep 1 Link to comment
Rumsy4 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Swan Song? Not ominous at all! No one's gonna die, and the Dark Swan arc won't be done. ;-) 1 Link to comment
KingOfHearts October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Swan Song? Not ominous at all! No one's gonna die, and the Dark Swan arc won't be done. ;-) Maybe it'll be Dark Swan's swan song. Her reign of "tyranny" will be ending. Link to comment
BoPeeps October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Swan Song... doesn't HAVE to be ominous. In the mid season finale, Killian and Emma end up in Storybrooke's new karaoke bar "Gimme The Beat Boys" and he sings *Maybe I'm Amazed* to her. 3 Link to comment
Hookian October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 (edited) With this being the Papa Hook episode, seems clear to me the set up is there for 5B and Papa Hook is gonna play an important role in 5B as well. I suspect it's gonna be Killian that "dies" and the others lead by Emma will journey to the Underworld to save him. It will made clear by the end of the finale, that Killian is still alive in The Underworld where either his father is the big bad or his father is the one that finds him and he becomes an ally to get him out of The Underworld. It's all so exciting I can't wait. Papa Hook just confirmed his first day is Monday so yep he's in the mid season finale. Edited October 17, 2015 by Hookian 1 Link to comment
PixiePaws1 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 (edited) You know in POtC.Will had his heart cut out to be made Davy Jones replacement. ..hmm pulling a heart out with an enchanted hook would be less messy.... Just putting it out there. Read this pretty clever and angsty fic a while ago where Killian's dad was Davy Jones and he tricked Killian into freeing him by taking his place (can't remember the name if it or the author ).... My babies had better not be separated AGAIN! !! That's just cruel! Edited October 17, 2015 by PixiePaws1 Link to comment
KingOfHearts October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 My babies had better not be separated AGAIN! !! That's just cruel! I think this will be the misdirect. Hook appears to be in trouble, only to be saved with consequences. The real peril will feature something different. Link to comment
pezgirl7 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 My babies had better not be separated AGAIN! !! That's just cruel! That's what annoys me the most about this particular plot possibility. With Emma's walls, cursed lips, stolen hearts and big bads causing angst, CS hasn't had that much time where they've been together as a true couple. 4B was pretty good for them, although it ended with them being separated for an entire year inside the storybook. I'm not saying I want it to be happy happy joy joy all the time, but I'd just like for them to not be apart so soon after 5B. 4 Link to comment
YaddaYadda October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Well, at least Captain Swan is together, are having POVs and reactions to what's going on around them and with the other (this season at least is shaping up to be this way). They fight for each other, they lay it all on the line for the other, and we are seeing it. Snowing are finally starting to have something going on with their couple. Rumbelle, completely up in the air. I mean Belle has been allowed to express herself twice last season about what was happening. Rumple, not sure where he stands exactly. OQ is a trainwreck. I know everyone or most everyone is jumping on the whole Hook's father is Davy Jones (which please no), but what if he's someone else entirely? 4 Link to comment
PixiePaws1 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 It would be such a welcome relief if he turned out to be James Woods inspired type Hades... from who Hook inherited his sass....well once he let his hair down (or lopped it off)...I am a bit over the Davy Jones bit cos it's be so speculated. Link to comment
pezgirl7 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 I know I shouldn't complain. CS, and their fans, have it better than most. :) I'm not holding my breath that Hook has any kind of connection to Excalibur or Camelot, or that his father is going to be Davy Jones or even have a role in 5B. It just seems too perfect and obvious. I do like seeing all the speculation, and the fans getting excited. It's not hurting anything. Most of us can handle any kind of disappointment that might come from our theories not panning out. 3 Link to comment
mjgchick October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Am I the only one still confused why they have Gold and Killian fighting in the first place? Is this to end their 200 + year old feud or something? Link to comment
Shanna Marie October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 Rumbelle, completely up in the air. I mean Belle has been allowed to express herself twice last season about what was happening. Rumple, not sure where he stands exactly. Wasn't there a spoilery comment in an interview about how she's worried about him while he's in such bad condition, but when he's better she can be relieved and go back to being mad, that she hasn't forgiven him, but she can't stay angry while he's in a coma? She must be a nicer person than I am, because if my husband had treated me the way he treated her, with all the lying and deception, I wouldn't have been carting around a rose in a jar and worrying about him. I'd have been kicking his unconscious body, drawing all over his face with a Sharpie, and resisting the temptation to smother him with a pillow. The only reason I'd want to be there when he woke up would be to trick him into thinking he was in hell. I can't even imagine how they could have any kind of relationship going forward. Because I'm an evil bitch, I'd love to see her meet non-Dark One Rumple and go, "Oh. So this is what was under the Darkness. Um. Well, maybe I was wrong about you." If he's swordfighting Hook, unless that's part of a scheme to make him a hero (and since Hook has Excalibur at the time, I don't think so because that would suggest that the sword has been drawn and they don't need Rumple to be a hero anymore), it would seem like even as the non-Dark One he isn't such a swell guy, unless maybe drawing the sword turned Hook dark. 2 Link to comment
YaddaYadda October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 (edited) Am I the only one still confused why they have Gold and Killian fighting in the first place? Is this to end their 200 + year old feud or something? I'm confused about a lot of things in that snippet. 1. Hook change of costume, change of earring, change of rings, necklace. Though I'd rather that coat than the leather jacket if I'm being perfectly honest. 2. The hell is going on with Rumple? Maybe Emma really managed to turn Rumple into a hero. 3. There's Dark One Rumple there too. So whose ear is he whispering in? Snuffing out the light means snuffing Emma out so that the Dark One can take over. What if the darkness has split in two now? Edited October 17, 2015 by YaddaYadda Link to comment
PixiePaws1 October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 One of my first theories was that Emma would be freed from the Darkness but instead of getting rid of it, it took on its own sentient form...maybe the Hell referred to is actually Hell in SB. 3 Link to comment
Sabs October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 I think the fight with Gold is actually Emma and not Killian. But that is based on absolutely nothing but wishful thinking. 1 Link to comment
mjgchick October 17, 2015 Share October 17, 2015 I think the fight with Gold is actually Emma and not Killian. But that is based on absolutely nothing but wishful thinking. That's what I think also. As if Emma's taunting Gold with Killian's face. 1 Link to comment
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